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Forum Post: Just FYI guys...

Posted 13 years ago on Oct. 11, 2011, 3:35 p.m. EST by CleverUsername (18) from Kansas City, MO
This content is user submitted and not an official statement

These anti-OWS accounts mostly seem to be throwaway accounts that have been made only in the past week or so. It's best to ignore the flaming and trolling if you can, because they are not here to negotiate or open a dialogue with us, they are here to divide us and get us mad.

41 Comments

41 Comments


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[-] 2 points by JPHOENIX (124) 13 years ago

Here is an effective post that no angry anti-OWS posters have been able to dispute. Feel free to read and re-post.

http://occupywallst.org/forum/to-all-the-people-who-are-against-this-movement/

[-] 1 points by DirtyHippie (200) 13 years ago

Ignore them is good advice. The titles of the posts entice you to click but resist. You know there's only going to be a little poison pellet waiting for you. Nothing good. If we all just ignore them, we'll be better off. They sow confusion and dissent. They have no constructive purpose.

[-] 1 points by Publius (21) from Washington, DC 13 years ago

It is only going to get worse. As the protests get more serious and expansive, expect counter protesters. I've seen the tea party, and they are fierce, loud, and can really disrupt an event. Don't let it happen here, nor anywhere.

[-] 1 points by misunderstood101 (68) from Los Angeles, CA 13 years ago

the art of war has come to our footsteps.

[-] 1 points by gawdoftruth (3698) from Santa Barbara, CA 13 years ago

i agree, pretty much everyone but me should ignore them. I play ball, and knock them out of the ball park.


http://occupywallst.org/forum/corporate-oligarchy/

http://occupywallst.org/forum/thetruth-socialismcapitalismcommunismmarxism/

http://occupywallst.org/forum/capitalism-versus-corporatism/

http://occupywallst.org/forum/no-war/

http://occupywallst.org/forum/help-me-understand/

http://occupywallst.org/forum/capitalism-a-love-story/

http://occupywallst.org/forum/sociology/

http://occupywallst.org/forum/energy-101-solution/

http://occupywallst.org/forum/ethics/

http://occupywallst.org/forum/break-your-left-right-conditioning/

http://occupywallst.org/forum/nader-kucinich-and-paul/

http://occupywallst.org/forum/5-facts-you-should-know-about-the-wealthiest-one-p/

http://occupywallst.org/forum/i-am-homeless-joe-jp-morgan-chase-accidentally-for/

http://occupywallst.org/forum/can-we-end-the-fed/

http://occupywallst.org/forum/why-end-the-federal-reserve-and-what-do-you-replac/

http://occupywallst.org/forum/where-are-we-and-how-do-we-move-forward/

http://occupywallst.org/forum/things-wall-st-did-were-not-illegal/

http://occupywallst.org/forum/teaching-the-occupation/

http://occupywallst.org/forum/this-forum-needs-structure/

http://occupywallst.org/forum/ows-is-not-your-personal-billboard-for-your-politi/

http://occupywallst.org/forum/systems-theory-primer/

http://occupywallst.org/forum/organize-inform-take-action-effect-change/

http://occupywallst.org/forum/better-website-needed/

http://occupywallst.org/forum/stop-playing-the-devils-games/

http://occupywallst.org/forum/nonviolence-the-only-path/

http://occupywallst.org/forum/ows-not-against-capitalism/

http://occupywallst.org/forum/this-is-not-about-political-stripe-it-is-about-bas/

http://occupywallst.org/forum/national-initiative-for-democracy/

http://occupywallst.org/forum/a-third-political-party-the-movement-of-the-middle/

http://occupywallst.org/forum/300-fema-camps/

http://occupywallst.org/forum/ows-is-a-false-flag-operation/

http://occupywallst.org/forum/why-this-will-not-work/

http://occupywallst.org/forum/paradigm-shift-now/

http://occupywallst.org/forum/a-proposal-for-focus/

http://occupywallst.org/forum/stop-the-bullshit-posts-and-get-organized/

http://occupywallst.org/forum/suggested-goals/

http://occupywallst.org/forum/oct-18-gao/

http://occupywallst.org/forum/naomi-klein-climate-change-fight-is-down-to-the-99/

http://occupywallst.org/forum/only-1-demand-includes-all-others-article-v-of-the/

[-] 1 points by oceanweed (521) 13 years ago

push congress to end bush tax cuts , rebuild America bridges and roads , invest in middle class not banking class thats the occupy wall street message

[-] 1 points by schnitzlefritz (225) 13 years ago

Do you want all of the Bush tax cuts to end?

[-] 1 points by oceanweed (521) 13 years ago

just on those who make over 200,000

[-] 1 points by schnitzlefritz (225) 13 years ago

Why not end it all. All of the benefits went to the rich anyhow. Why not just restore the rates to the pre-bush levels? The president ways that everyone has to have some skin in the game. Wouldn't that be fair?

[-] 1 points by oceanweed (521) 13 years ago

so put more burden on the middle class thats not ows

[-] 1 points by schnitzlefritz (225) 13 years ago

But, how will it hurt the middle class? Since the day the Bush tax cuts were enacted, everyone said that it only benefited the rich and that the poor and middle class got screwed.

[-] 1 points by oceanweed (521) 13 years ago

you have not been paying attetionn or just choosing to ignore like the media that ows is for taxing rich and jobs bill ill put your message and mine to ows protesters and you would see how off the mark you are

[-] 1 points by schnitzlefritz (225) 13 years ago

That doesn't make the protesters right, though. My point is that there was benefit to the middle class under the Bush tax cuts, although it was denied repeatedly until it was time to end them. Suddenly, we can't end them on the middle class 'cause it will hurt people. But all we heard was how the rich got all of the benefits on the backs of the middle class and working poor, who got nothing. So, the bush tax cuts were good. In fact the end result was a shift in tax burden to the wealthier Americans. (if you don't believe me, you can research it for yourself)

It's time to throw out the entire tax system and start over with a system that flattens the rates, eliminates all deductions and prevents politicians from favoring any group through special tax breaks and deductions.

[-] 1 points by oceanweed (521) 13 years ago

your a republican

[-] 1 points by schnitzlefritz (225) 13 years ago

So what id I were? Would that invalidate the facts? I am also part of the 99%. Raising taxes on individuals making over $200K of families making over $250K Would have no effect on me and yet I still don't think it's a good idea. However, advocating that it all be eliminated would effect me, but I'm willing to pay more in exchange for real cuts in spending in order to eventually balance the budget and restore fiscal responsibility to the government. I'm for lowering the capital gains taxes because it would raise tax revenue while simultaneously stimulating the economy.

How about the spending side? What percentage cut in spending do you think is reasonable? Now, before you answer that, you need to understand the baseline budgeting process. The baseline budget grows automatically each year. Currently it stands somewhere around 7%. So, in order to remain at current spending levels, you would have to cut 7% from the baseline budget in order to have no increase, and, conversely, no decrease, in spending year over year. So, all of this talk about balancing spending cuts with tax increases is nothing more than smoke and mirrors. What looks on the outside like draconian spending cuts is, in reality, just a reduction in projected growth AND they invariably never materialize.

Too many get caught in the trap of trying to understand Washington budgeting by trying to apply the same principles that one would use in balancing your family budget. Apples and oranges.

My recommendation is to freeze spending at current levels, institute pro growth economic policies, and stop the Fed from devaluing our currency. We would very quickly grow our way out of the problem and then we could begin to increase spending based on actual revenue growth OR begin to pay down the debt. You can never balance the budget based on tax increases. Even if you tax the rich at 100%, you fall short of balancing the budget.

Of course there are those that day that debt and deficits don't matter and we can spend what ever we want indefinitely without any severe consequences. I don't happen to hold that opinion.

Yes, I am fiscally conservative, but still an American, a tax payer, a concerned citizen and part of the 99%.

[-] 1 points by oceanweed (521) 13 years ago

that is so misleading when warren buffet says we should pay more taxes and the republicans say send a check in this is the inequality the have fueled the protest ows may say their 99 and that lets republicans come in and say me too when the signs and demands have been for the middle class not banking class

[-] 1 points by schnitzlefritz (225) 13 years ago

Great non reply. I'll just assume that it went over your head.

Who cares what Warren Buffett says? Whether or not Warren Buffett thinks he is under taxed...

1) he takes advantage of every tax loophole he is entitled to when filing his taxes and will do what ever he has to do to minimize what he pays;

2) Buffett's Berkshire owes $1 billion in taxes that he is trying to get out of paying.

3) Buffet is in the 1% you are protesting.

He has no credibility with me, nor should he with you.

[-] 1 points by oceanweed (521) 13 years ago

you re ignoring the republican part ows will never support republican ideas when they call us a mob , stupid ,drug addicts when democracts have given support you are not ows you belong at the teaparty

[-] 1 points by schnitzlefritz (225) 13 years ago

Show me one post where I called either you or the OWS anything derogatory.

Once again you ignore the facts and try to paint me as a bad guy by calling me a republican or tea party member (not that either are bad). It is you that resort to name calling and ignore any and all rational discussion. If you represent the OWS in general (and I don't think your narrow minded views do) then the OWS is doomed to failure.

[-] 1 points by oceanweed (521) 13 years ago

i didnt say you but your party leaders have said these things ows are looking at both sides and are making clear choices on whose with us and whos for the tea peepers like you who are hurting the movement by dividing us on issues that are republican read the signs talk to the protesters and you will know what we believe in end bush tax cuts , rebuild America bridges and roads , invest in middle class not banking class thats the occupy wall street message

[-] 1 points by schnitzlefritz (225) 13 years ago

If I can read between the lines, it is your belief that this is a left wing movement and there in no room for fiscally conservative republicans and independents within the OWS movement. YOU want this to be a political movement that it driven by liberal/progressive ideals. I guess you may then have a hard time getting support of the masses and it will be a movement of the 33% of the 99% that follow your narrowly drawn lines. Good luck with that.

I will again state that I do not believe that your views speak for the OWS movement in general.

[-] 1 points by oceanweed (521) 13 years ago

read the signs talk to the people no republican plans period no lie

[-] 1 points by schnitzlefritz (225) 13 years ago

Can you please write in complete and grammatically correct sentences? It would make it easier to have a rational conversation. I'll try to parse this.

Read the signs and talk to the people. We will accept no republican plans, period and that's no lie.

Now assuming that I have properly parsed your message I once again that you may then have a hard time getting support of the masses and it will be a movement of the 33% of the 99% that follow your narrowly ideology.

Just for your information, a recent poll showed that 33.7% identify as as democrats. I'm not sure what percentage of those are hard left, but assuming that all are, it seems to be a bit short sighted to try to exclude the other 66% from your movement if you really want to have any chance of succeeding in reforming wall street. Believe it or not, when it comes to reform of wall street there are areas of agreement. OTOH, I don't think you have any intention of forging consensus and affecting change . Too bad.

[-] 1 points by oceanweed (521) 13 years ago

its phrased not parsed and 33.7 identify as democrats so wheres the republican percent where any where in this movement have you heard or seen republican views being stated all I've heard and seen are democratic .republican leaders have demonized the movement so how can how call for consensus when you ignore these facts.

[-] 1 points by schnitzlefritz (225) 13 years ago

Actually, I'll stick with parsed.

The republican percentage is currently at 33.9%, which is within the margin of error. That leaves about 33.5%, mostly independents. Alienating republicans and any significant majority of independents leaves the OWS a minority movement. The more you want to push away people who happen to be fiscally conservative or republican, the more you marginalize your effort.

Rather than start wars, call names, draw lines in the sand and make this a doomed effort, don't you think that it would be wise to garner majority support for a set of common sense and fairly universally accepted reforms for wall street and be an effective force for implementing change?

BTW, how old are you? Just curious. I'm currently 53 and I graduated college in 1980.

[-] 1 points by oceanweed (521) 13 years ago

im 25 and have also graduated from college in 2008 with a bas in mechanical engineering and I have a job and I do feel that the movement is bigger than the two parties but when you ignore the demands of middle class and ignore the hate that the movement has received from the right that this is a bi partisan movement read the signs talk to the people and see which party they lean towards in your case go to the tea party because you are not ows

[-] 1 points by schnitzlefritz (225) 13 years ago

I assumed that you were young. I have a BSEE. You still have away to go in learning how to clearly and unambiguously express yourself. I suppose it has a lot to do with how the younger crowd communicate via text messages. As many younger people today, you seem to believe that you have a monopoly on ideas and that only those are valid ones. (I have a daughter in college right now so I speak with some experience)

You also have a tendency to jump to conclusions. You remind me of a child that covers his ears and screams in order to not hear something you don't like. You failed to refute a single point I have made here. Instead you attempt to label me. At some point you will mature and you will begin to see the value in listening to opposing points of view and partake in consensus building. In order for the OWS movement to succeed it will need to build consensus, form goals and a plan to implement them.

You are too quick to label others as the "enemy." That is not necessarily useful if you want this to be a broad based effort to correct the ills of Wall Street.

I regret that there is probably no point in continuing this discussion as your mind is already made up and I am the enemy. I sincerely wish you the best of luck.

[-] 1 points by oceanweed (521) 13 years ago

thanks for your comments and I will try to understand both sides for the greater good of the country and improve my grammar

[-] 1 points by GeoffH (214) from Jacksonville, FL 13 years ago

Oceanweed, This is not a Political issue. It is neither Right nor Left. It is not Republican or Democrat. It is not Liberal or Conservative. It is not about Religion, or changing the Economic System. It is about saving our Government from enslavement to Corrupt Capitalist. This is a Financial Revolt against the 1% to return our Government back to the People. Don't get trapped in the Mass Media's trap of polarizing this issue and labeling it into narrowly defined categories so they can easily dismiss this. The 99% is inclusive of all of us who want a free Government.

[-] 1 points by oceanweed (521) 13 years ago

thats not true read the signs talk to ows protesters they want to tax the rich last time a checked that was democratic not republican

[-] 1 points by GeoffH (214) from Jacksonville, FL 13 years ago

The issue has nothing to do with taxation. It has to do with changing a system that enables unchecked Government Corruption by the 1% of Americans that control the lion's share of wealth. It's about returning our Government to the founding principles detail in the Constitution based on a timeless theology that We the People can govern ourselves and this republic. Don't believe what you hear on broadcast news. They are confused because this movement, this revolution, does not fit into their narrow concept of our American political landscape. They can not fathom a mass movement that is not polarized by either the Left or the Right. They don't understand that forward thinking individuals can look at a situation and cast off the usual stereotypes. Be stronger than that Oceanweed. Look past the vision of what they want to show you and see that this is a movement of the People, by the People, for the People. All 99% that are not represented by the 1% that have bought our Government.

[-] 1 points by oceanweed (521) 13 years ago

still you ignore that the republican leaders have demonized the movement so why are republicans joining our movement

[-] 1 points by GeoffH (214) from Jacksonville, FL 13 years ago

The Republican leaders are puppets of the 1% just as the Democrat leaders are. They don't want to stop the corruption. You don't bite the hand that feeds you! The 99% represents all of us. This is not a Republican nor a Democrat issue. This is a People issue. If the Republican 99% want to join the cause, the more the merrier! We can argue about our difference of opinion once we have freed the Government from the Greed and Corruption of the 1%! Until then we should look at them as allies in this Financial Revolutionary War.

[-] 1 points by oceanweed (521) 13 years ago

thats a lie ows from the start was demoratic and thats the type of comments that let the media assume tha we have no message stop trying to divide ows

[-] 1 points by GeoffH (214) from Jacksonville, FL 13 years ago

I am being inclusive not divisive. Yes, some Democrats started the movement but, this is greater now than them. This is becoming something so much greater. I am excited to see how great this country will be once the reigns of the 1% are removed from our Government and we can truly enter an era of political innovation.

[-] 1 points by oceanweed (521) 13 years ago

thats your problem now its you type people who are repucblicans that force yourselfs into our movement not one time that I have been down here down to protest have I heard support for a republican but I did see a democratic congress down at the protest

[-] 1 points by GeoffH (214) from Jacksonville, FL 13 years ago

Actually, I am a Democrat. I list myself as a libertarian but, I have voted for and do vote Democrat 99% of the time. I think that a little tolerance will go a long way toward our goals.

[-] 1 points by oceanweed (521) 13 years ago

end bush tax cuts , rebuild America bridges and roads , invest in middle class not banking class thats the occupy wall street message.

[-] -1 points by mattthecapitalist (157) 13 years ago

They are here to provide truth and understanding. They are here to motivate you, to make you find ambition to achieve. They hate seeing individuals grovel due to perceived inhibitors... they hate watching young men and women wake up to the Real World, pissed, and without understanding of how you cannot earn something for nothing. I truly care for each and everyone of you... I do not come here to offer you pity, I come here to offer you enlightenment. I will not give you money, I will give you proven ideology... which the value is far higher than if I were to cut you a check. I am here, not to make you mad-though many will be... the time I invest, will pay off. I trust that some of you will glean, even if it is only a small piece, some knowledge that will contribute to your success. You can grab this World by the horns.. don't sit as the World passes you by. You have one life. Live it. -matt