Capitalism Causes Earthquakes
Posted 10 years ago on July 12, 2013, 12:03 p.m. EST by OccupyWallSt
Tags:
fracking,
capitalism,
earthquakes
One of the biggest firms responsible for the practice of fracking has admitted that their actions caused seismic activity in England.
Fracking involves cracking or fracturing rock, containing trapped shale gas, by using pressurized liquid. Shale gas is an increasingly important energy resource though there have been claims that it is worse for the environment than coal, largely due to the fracking process.
Analysis showed that shortly after hydraulic fracturing began small earthquakes started occurring, and more than 50 were identified, of which 43 were large enough to be located. Most of these earthquakes occurred within a 24 hour period after hydraulic fracturing operations had ceased. There have been previous cases where seismologists have suggested a link between hydraulic fracturing and earthquakes, but data was limited, so drawing a definitive conclusion was not possible for these cases.
Drilling either for fossil fuels or renewable energy exploration may cause earthquakes. Both geophysicists and oilmen agree that natural-gas drilling trigger earthquakes. One oilman stated that "there is not the slightest doubt" that gas production caused the temblors."
A New York Times report confirmed drilling for oil sets off earthquakes and detailed how a drilling project near San Francisco and a similar project in Basel, Switzerland were shut down over concerns they triggered damaging earthquakes. Both diggings involved fracturing hard rock more than two miles deep.
Large earthquakes tend to originate at great depths, breaking rock that far down carries more serious risk. Seismologists have long known that human activities can trigger quakes, but they say the science is not developed enough to say for certain what will or will not set off major tremors.
The time for denial is over. So, how are we going to stop them?
"The time for denial is over. So, how are we going to stop them?"
We keep fighting...for the good...for a better way. We have no other choice.
Never Give Up!
resist they may win but you can still fucking resist.
Just finished watching Gasland Part ll - I am so heartbroken at the government/big business the United States has become. We said this "I love my country but I fear my government" in the late 60's & early 70's True then, TRUER NOW!
News:
http://www.businessweek.com/news/2012-03-30/epa-agrees-to-dismiss-well-contamination-case-against-range
Counter Intuitive???
Not in Texas.
Often engineered solutions to one problem cause unanticipated problems of their own, which then requires supplemental mitigation or change to the original solution. The concept is termed continual improvement.
What we have to keep in mind is the world economy is currently based on the use of fossil fuels any substantive transformation away from that will take decades not days. In the meantime the vast majority of current easily obtained fossil fuel reserves are in the politically and culturally volatile middle-east. The same region which brought us 9/11 and several wars.
This person's humble opinion is it is long past time for us to “get the hell out of Dodge” and if the price for that is to come up with engineered solutions created by new technology then that is what we need to do.
This just in: hydro damn cause them too. It's called reservoir induced seizmicity. Remember the big 2008 one in China? Actually they reported it in the 1970s. Ignored.
Injecting a secret mixture of chemicals and water into the earth uses enormous sums of water -- scarce water.
It's now confirmed that large earthquakes can cause other quakes around fracking wells.
Ain't fracking grand? And we still don't get gas at the dirt cheap prices it should be by now!
Large earthquakes around the world have been found to trigger tremors at US sites where wastewater from gas drilling operations is injected into the ground, a US study said Thursday.
For instance, the massive 9.0 magnitude earthquake in Japan in 2011 set off a swarm of earthquakes in the western Texas town of Snyder near the Cogdell oil field, culminating in a 4.5 magnitude quake there about six months later, said the research in the journal Science.
http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2013/07/11/fracking-linked-to-earthquakes-study-finds/
The study helps explain a surge in earthquakes in the central United States, which in recent years has seen a more than six-fold increase in earthquakes over 20th century levels.
The very same surge of earthquakes that they denied, denied, denied were occurring. I love this game.
It will turn out like global warming.
They will come up with a more or less innocuous term and claim that earthquakes are all natural and they've been going on for millennia, so how could they possibly have anything to do with it.............
After any large quake the Earth rings like a bell for a very long time.
But, they just did that. They have everything under control.
Well, at any rate, you certainly have them frightened.
I wonder if that - (what is it? four state?) - major fault will be set-off.
http://www.kjrh.com/dpp/news/state/oklahoma-earthquake-surge-reveals-previously-unknown-fault-line-state-agency-trying-to-connect-dots
I have to wonder how much they know about that fault line.
I saw a documentary a while back - I think it was on PBS - anyway it said that if that major fault ( center of fault network ) was to have a major shift - not only would it be devastating to three ( 4 ? ) states - but that the shock waves would be felt as far north as Minnesota. We just don't get tremors in Mn - not ones that can be felt - as the earth is kinda like a bell - strike it anywhere and if you have the right equipment you can here the strike from anywhere on the planet.
That's the New Madrid Fault line.
It rang church bells in Boston.
Little is known about the fault, because of the earth and rock that lay on top of it underground.
Yep that would be the one. HUH looks like seven states directly involved. They must have mapped it further. My Bad 8 states.
Check this out : Images of New Madrid Fault line
Some say yes
http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/1999/11/991105073728.htm
And some say not so much.
http://phys.org/news156169464.html
Some in the quake area are a little more concerned.
http://www.sj-r.com/features/x1658259474/New-Madrid-fault-study-to-prep-for-potential-quake
Nay-Sayers really bother me. The USA has A north south Mountain chain on the East Coast and on the West coast. These mountain ranges are caused by plate tectonics - one plate pushing into another plate. Anyway with the land in between these two mountain ranges subject to reacting to the pressure and reaction events being applied on both coasts. I do not see how any scientist of geology could say that a fault area is not active - is not a threat - especially when earth quakes have happened and are still happening ( granted small scale recently/currently ). All of the pressure that exists on those fault lines have not disappeared - one event - natural or man made could set off a major seismic event.
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True - as they have known about the major central fault for years now - but the other surrounding faults ? Not so much. But they were speculating that if just that major fault had a significant movement that it would set off a major disaster.
Between that and Yellowstone it's got bad B movie all over it.
http://www.livescience.com/30099-yellowstone-caldera-uplift-110207.html
A few years ago there was a guy that I spoke with frequently on the internet and we were watching the rise of earthquakes. He lives outside of Yellowstone. So, he (far, far more than I) was well versed in tremors and had been dealing with them for most of his life. We had hunted the internet and news noting the frequency and location of the earthquakes worldwide. We would run into the we don't have the funding or knowledge but nothing is happening unusual and we have it all under control.
I think that given where we are currently with the climate change, the actual potential for major disasters needs to be addressed. Recognized as speculation in a non Faux news way.
I was gonna mention Yellowstone - yeah if they ever popped the cork on the caldera - it would be a very bad B sci-fi movie where the planet dies - well life on the planet.
Absolutely - we are gonna have enough major weather related disasters as is - we do not need to throw in the breaking of the caldera due to fracking or anything else.
Ya, B Movie with no credits at the end.
New little issue in California on Fracking. http://www.dailykos.com/story/2013/07/11/1222785/-Fracking-in-California-must-not-be-regulated#
Well if nothing else it is good to see some State governments at least talking about fracking. San Andreas Hhmmmmm
Frack trolls out today, so this issue goes back to top.
Everyone should see this.
I agree. This needs serious consideration. Will store bought water be what our children's children will have to depend on? Will water have to be trucked or be piped overland because local sources can not be used? For farming as well as for urban use?
Destruction of a water resource, is a Crime Against All Living Things.
Yes it is. Also foolish for planning for a healthy viable future.
Agree
Good thing the public is beginning to wake up.
Yes, am seeing more and more about fracking and XL pipe line. We will continue to get the truth out there.
It is the best thing that we can be doing along with providing petitions to participate in.
Educate motivate provide opportunities.
Fracking, a crime against all living things.
Agreed!!!
New petition on Sierra Club site.
Going there now.
Earthquakes is one of many risks of fracking (injecting water, sand, brine, etc. deep underground can lubricate rock formations, and cause movement, possibly aggravating a minor/latent fault line). In fairness, it's a very low probability risk (the main risks are air pollution caused by benzine and methane emissions, and groundwater contamination).
The question is, what are they doing differently now that they were not doing 60 years ago?
The answer is more of it and much deeper.
Oklahoma, Ohio, Arkansas did not have earthquakes as they do now.
Most likely, injection of liquids and gases into wells to try and recover harder to reach fuels.
-Good Post-
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small earthquakes like when a 400 lb wadler roams walmart
Solution to this problem: Education. If enough (more than a few million) were thoroughly convinced rock fracturing causes serious problems, we could organize effective actions (strikes? boycotts? party unity? etc.) to effect change.
My question: How do we educate people?
My concern: I fear we can't educate too many of the "grown-ups" in charge. We can educate children with supportive parents, but not those whose parents are fundamentally against the "education" being offered, as they see it.
If someone can answer my question or address my concerns, we might progress towards a solution to this and other serious problems caused by some of the wealthiest 1%.
The question should be . . .' What should we be educated to DO ? Everybody getting a Liberal Arts degree would only result in more Occupiers!
We have a list of resources on this threads going here. After the 10th, I can devote more time to it. A lot of it is going to be state specific. Some of groups already out there have a plethora of information. Too, some states are fighting and winning for full public disclosure of the chemicals used in fracking. So, we do not have to reinvent the wheel. The odds are is that there is already a group forming or has been formed and you can easily contact one of them and see what is going on.
Thank you. It is encouraging we don't have to reinvent the wheel! I will contact a group to see what I can do to help.
We should never harvest any resources, breathe air, drink or bathe or swim in water, never eat anything with flavor, or otherwise take up space for our feeble bags of bones. The human is the scourge of the planet and there will never be peace and harmony until the species is eliminated.
So what? Are you checking out?
Great job there, Dingleberry.
. . . . umm . . . .
with
peace
truth
and the weight of public opinion?
Yep. Agreed.
my goodness you have been busy today.
has it helped any?
Having checked on it this morning, it looks like it has all been destroyed again.
I only had like, one comment from one of the spammers last night - maybe there is only one spammer, I don't know
but if I had to guess I would say the moral level is falling on their side. I don't think they expected this.
I'm working on some powerful scripts on my end and will start counter-attacking later tonight.
cool - but I still say the best solution is with admin access and moderation
That's obvious, but I don't have it.
The site does have vulnerabilities. We've found a few. If we work a little harder on this (not sure I really want to since I have more serious work to take care of), we might be able to gain admin access through a back door.
If we can resist the temptation of login on as admins (hard to resist - I'll have to slap myself awake if we manage to find a vulnerability permitting us to do this), we'll simply give this knowledge to the mods and admins so they can tighten up the code.
One of the spammers managed to make a ghost account yesterday. Somehow, somewhere, he found and exploited a big vulnerability.
I have multiple emails and multiple shit on the forum.
At the time yesterday that I was bumping stuff it got progressively worse the more that I did it. Same person.
hmm
I got back on line late - it looked fairly quiet, but I don't know what everyone else was doing at the same time.
It looked like we were successful for the most part.
It was for a minute.
so what's the plan?
I've heard adbusters owns the domain name? who is paying for the hosting of this forum? adbusters covering that too?
I have no idea who is paying for the hosting of this forum.
I think that if Thrasy and NEP are working on one end and some of us can work on bumping the threads and then everybody that isn't trolling can start an entirely new thread based on any one of the issues raised on the declaration. It takes 2 hours before starting a new thread. But, we would have more to bump right away.
I open up a thread in a new tab but sometimes it backfires and I have to start over which sucks if I am all the way down to 3 weeks ago. It would be great if you could put all of your threads that you started on your profile. It would be easier if everyone did that and then I could bump a lot of them easily.
What do you think?
Easier than that - here:
.
I would point out that someone does seem to be moderating in some manner - I can't post my pic anymore. That seems to indicate that the coding has changed - and that requires admin access.
That works really, really well. :D
One of the first things is to ensure the repelicans do not weaken the EPA - they've been taking some new and interesting positions lately - but I'm afraid I have forgotten the precise details.
Some of the states are also demanding full public disclosure of the chemicals that are being used.
About time someone stepped up with some sense. Who knows what they are pumping into the ground - and if they screw up the process it is going right straight into the ground water.
That information needs to be public.
I agree.
Didn't anyone learn anything
from Erin B. and PG&E?
Not enough.
They saw the movie, thought Julia Roberts was hawt and when the credits rolled figured everybody lived happily ever after.
I'll tell you what - no corporation ever wants to poison my well and get caught.
I won't wait for the dayum lawyers to figure it all out.
I can't remember how many cases of cancer were involved, but it seemed like the whole neighborhood.
This happens a lot. There are a lot of known health problems associated with dumps as well. They put those near areas known for poverty.
A Civil Action is good. I read the book but have not seen the movie. It is about a water contamination case.
I don't think I've seen that one - but the title sounds familiar.
Girl Friday,
Great job! Good Post! I agree the fracking is a big problem! We have to be vigilant and watch those who have little regard for our precious earth.
Keep up your good work!!!
Thanks.
Your welcome!!!
Yes she is.
Gather documentation on the environmental effects:
Humanize the consequences, draw on empathy.
Demonstrate the quakes that have happened:
if and where they can be tied to drilling,
correlate data from most quake prone projects -
rock type,
frac method if there are differences that correlate with quake occurance . . .
With this information and whatever else may be applicable we begin a PR campaign. Begin by
networking with the GAs,
on education and
direct action campaigns, and
protests;
dot org organizations to mobilize their core petition signers.
Hows that for a proposal?
I need bullets she says.
Well, I still seem to be laboring under the learning curve here.
Looks like bullets to me. I think it rocks. I haven't been through all of the following sites, they do list organizations and names and may have links to others. I'm in. It is probably going to take me a minute to understand the depth, rock type, frac method if there are differences that correlate with quake occurance . .
http://www.frackalert.org/index.asp?page=7
http://www.propublica.org/series/fracking http://www.theoec.org/Fracking.htm?gclid=CPuZ_pb16awCFciC5Qod8y75Nw
http://wilderness.org/content/hydraulic-fracturing-perils-does-your-state-protects-its-citizens-fracking?gclid=CIqKn6z16awCFcHe4AodLkcrMQ
http://www.frackoff.webs.com/
http://gasmain.org/weblog/
so . . .
I'm not a geologist either - and I'm on dial-up. I guess we should round up volunteers to spread the labor?
In the interest of time, I could take some of the quicker loading sites . . .
have you got them all open? or just a few?
just for the hell of it I opened this one:
http://wilderness.org/content/hydraulic-fracturing-perils-does-your-state-protects-its-citizens-fracking?gclid=CIqKn6z16awCFcHe4AodLkcrMQ
It may have suggestions I haven't come up with.
And I see you have one personal story below, I wonder if we can find scientists willing to go on the record?
Ok, I'm on dial up as well where I am at. I am over at un-naturalgas and let me poke around here and I just a hit a thing on a documentary (that I can't watch). Give me a about 20 minutes and I may have a list of names to contact or at least a direction.
dial-up sucks doesn't it?
ah well.
I have this from somewhere . . . .
the Wilderness Society
http://wilderness.org/content/hydraulic-fracturing-perils-does-your-state-protects-its-citizens-fracking?gclid=CIqKn6z16awCFcHe4AodLkcrMQ
notes:
Additionally:
so . . .
We might be able to get a package from the Wilderness Society, sounds like they have already done a lot of the work. They might be in a position to provide both direction and material - but looking at the above it seems the earthquake piece is a new angle.
I bet they have state by state breakdown of incidents combined with state efforts to regulate, require reporting of chemicals used.
The worst affected states are an obvious choice in terms of generating grass roots agitation.
Chemical summary In the 980 products identified above, there were a total of 649 chemicals. Specific chemical names and CAS numbers could not be determined for 286 (44%) of the chemicals, therefore, the health effects summary is based on the remaining 362 chemicals with CAS numbers. Figure 3 shows percentages of the 362 chemicals that were found to be associated with effects in each of the 12 health effect categories. Note that many chemicals have health effects in more than one category. Over 78% of the chemicals are associated with skin, eye or sensory organ effects, respiratory effects and gastrointestinal or liver effects. The brain and nervous system can be harmed by 55% of the chemicals. These four health effect categories (on the left side of the figure) are likely to appear immediately or soon after exposure. They include symptoms such as burning eyes, rashes, coughs, sore throats, asthma-like effects, nausea, vomiting, headaches, dizziness, tremors, and convulsions. Other effects, including cancer, organ damage, and harm to the endocrine system, may not appear for months or years later. Between 22% and 47% of the chemicals were associated with these possibly longer-term health effects. Fortyeight percent of the chemicals have health effects in the category labeled ‘Other’. The ‘Other’ category includes such effects as changes in weight, or effects on teeth or bones, for, example, but the most often cited effect in this category is the ability of the chemical to cause death. Chemicals in Natural Gas Operations Health Effects Spreadsheet and Summary http://www.endocrinedisruption.com/chemicals.multistate.php
uh..........they are all scientists at the above link
Edited: I forgot I was looking specifically for earthquakes.
uh..........they are all scientists at the above link
I can tell.
I really like the other column.
The ‘Other’ category . . . most often cited effect in this category is the ability of the chemical to cause death.
and that accounts for 48% of the chemicals out of a total of 362 identified, if I read that right.
How much do you want to bet the most dangerous chemicals are proprietary, specifically for the purpose of hiding their affects.
wanna start an office pool?
Right after you tell me what an office pool is.:D
well, given that the office in this case is located in cyberspace, I guess the reality is we get to define it.
In a traditional office it is generally a reference to a betting scheme - like who's going to win the super bowl?
I mean, I've never actually worked in an office, but that's the scuttlebutt on the street.
Why? What did you think it was?
Oh, like a football pool. I got it.
I wasn't sure. I had a flashback of a major water pipe breaking and flooding the halls and while I was sure that couldn't be it........ ;)
But, now that I know, yeah, what are we betting on?
what would a water pipe break look like in cyber space?
I wasn't really serious. I mean, that's just wrong. Our only proof would be in the form of . . . . well . . . you know . . . dead people
Here we go. http://www.journeyoftheforsaken.com/index.html
And the best explanation on the how it works http://www.journeyoftheforsaken.com/fracpage.htm
I'm going to have to save that for tomorrow.
You know, you are on to something there.
Check this out. It is an article that was published in a peer reviewed journal. http://www.endocrinedisruption.com/files/Oct2011HERA10-48forweb3-3-11.pdf
It is uncanny - but I usually am right.
. . ..
. . ..
That's only half of what I said, with another 25 % alluded to. I think we can reasonably conclude that the probability is that this is indeed well thought out behavior, and does indeed apply to some of the most dangerous chemicals.
and I say the repelican day is done.
they just don't know it yet.
we are going going to have a huge mess to clean up after . . .
the fuckers
So, what we do not have but desperately need is the complete list released.
if you can steal it from the companies whose proprietary information it is,
that is called corporate espionage
the best bet, is probably to dress like you belong to the industry, and are recruiting on behalf of another company . . .
unless you can find a disaffected employee, then there is no need to lie.
those facking fackers! is what the people in new england are saying. oh... it's northwest england...nvmd
It's a good thing that the US has significant natural gas reserves. The question is how are we going to ensure that natural gas extraction is done safely.
I am not so sure that it can be done safely.
That's a better question to figure out an answer to than 'how are we going to stop them'.
This looks stuck to me. http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/bdquery/z?d112:HR01084:
We don't. We let them continue until they have pissed off the entire global population. Our governments, big money, the wealthy, the powerful. We should actually all back up and make room. Give 1%ers enough rope...
Drilling and injecting secret chemical solutions into the earth has the potential to damage, and permanently contaminate scarce underground water aquifers that supply a good portion of our rapidly dwindling water supply.
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One day you will be questioned about spreading rumors. But
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Read all papers fully. If you do not understand or cannot read the papers, tell the officer you need an interpreter.
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Bullshit!!
everyone knows George Bush causes the earthquakes.
"The next morning Wallace-Babb was so sick she could barely move. She vomited uncontrollably and suffered explosive diarrhea. A searing pain shot up her thigh. Within days she developed burning rashes that covered her exposed skin, then lesions. As weeks passed, anytime she went outdoors, her symptoms worsened. Wallace-Babb's doctor began to suspect she had been poisoned.
"I took to wearing a respirator and swim goggles outside to tend to my animals," Wallace-Babb said. "I closed up my house and got an air conditioner that would just recycle the air and not let any fresh air in."
"In Pavillion, Wyo., where residents have complained of nerve damage and loss of sense of taste and smell, EPA superfund investigators found benzene and other hydrocarbons in well water samples, as well as methane gas, metals, and an unusual chemical variant of a compound used in hydraulic fracturing. A health survey conducted there by an environmental group in late 2010 found that 94 percent of respondents complained of health issues they thought were new or connected to the drilling, and 81 percent reported respiratory troubles. The ATSDR, in consultation with the EPA, advised at least 19 families in Pavillion not to drink their water and to ventilate bathrooms when they bathed, in part because volatile organic compounds can become airborne in a shower. But the government stopped short of saying that drilling caused the contamination or their symptoms.
In 2009, an environmental-sciences firm also found widespread air contaminants in Dish, Texas, a small town in the heart of the Barnett Shale just north of Fort Worth. Wolf Eagle Environmental, hired by the town's mayor and local residents, collected readings from seven monitoring stations and detected 16 chemicals, including benzene and other known and suspected carcinogens. Benzene exceeded Texas' exposure standards at three of the stations." http://www.propublica.org/article/science-lags-as-health-problems-emerge-near-gas-fields
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ha ha ha ha ha ha
you people got to be the biggest fucking, most gullible dumbbells on planet Earth.
Fracking causes earthquakes.
Time to spark another bowl asshole.
New York - Get Busy. Everyone who reads this post and is concerned about the environment and peoples lives - Get Busy.
We do not want to see New York depending on trucked in water because theirs is poisoned. We also do not want to see a New York "Chernobyl".
http://occupywallst.org/forum/your-voice-is-a-vote-you-dont-need-a-lot-of-money-/
Forward environmental change.
http://act.credoaction.com/campaign/keystone_sotu/?id=33678-4904244-%3Dxzka6x&t=7
NDAA = Round up the environmental Domestic Terrorists.
One good use for a tragedy signed into law.
Fracking occurs near the Yellowstone caldera:
Images of yellowstone caldera
Are these people really this insane??!!
Oh, wait . . .
Exactly - yes Yes They are.
And to think Obama's ALSO for this. Honestly, could Mittens have really been any worse??
Oh, wait . . .
LOL - Exactly - it could have been so much worse - Mr I-wanna-be-a-corp(se)...oRATION when I grow up.
Man DK, we're all seriously screwed if the American people don't WTFU quick!
Like, yesterday would be good.
I'm probably preaching to the converted, but the Yellowstone caldera erupting again would plunge the northern hemisphere into a nuclear Winter scenario, after wiping out vast regions of the US of A.
The scenario has probably been considered, in the depopulation program. Hmmm, just saying that sentence out loud seems kinda criminal.
Criminal? Well, you're a terrorist by virtue of your participation in this here forum, so what have you got to lose?
Yep, I saw an show on the tube recently about the Yellowstone caldera. Actually a couple different shows. One was on the Weather Channel on a series called "It Could Happen Tomorrow" about the implications of an eruption. The other doc showed how, over millions of years, the volcano has actually moved which is why it covers such a vast region. And St. Lou is definitely in the danger zone.
Hell, this is the second time tonight someone's comment made me think of all those 'ghost towns' being built in China. Hmmm . . . .
The southern hemisphere would not escape unscathed either. That large of a climate variation would I expect have nasty consequences - similar to what is happening all over the world now - with the unstable weather and super storms. Look at that - it didn't take all that long to establish super storms as a meme.
There's a clear division between the hemispheres when it comes to a mixing between the two. Equatorial conditions are just as effective as a fence. Not so with the pollution of the oceans, of course.
Circular formations like hurricanes spin in the opposite direction in the south. Same with water heading down a drain.
Well lets hope we "never" experience the disaster and see how it plays out in reality.
The Krakatoa eruption remained south of the equator. One of the largest eruptions in our living history. Likewise with Etna in the north. It's just the way our weather patterns work.
But yeah, if that caldera blows, stick your head between your legs and kiss your arse goodbye.
This fracking gig is completely pointless, considering the ease with which the cleanest and safest fuel oil (hemp) can be sourced.
We've done the maths, remember?
Yep - so many excellent uses for hemp - it is insane that it is illegal here.
GNM ? I couldn't agree more - yes a living wage is necessary - yes we need to take away personhood from corp(se)oRATions - yes we need to clean-up legislation - yes we have to get laws enforced on the wealthy and get them paying their fair share - but we have got to stop polluting the air land and water - and so - the need to end fossil fuel use and extraction - it's continued use will kill us and its continued extraction by drilling and fracking and mountaintop removal - mining in general. But fracking really is an exceptional polluter and earthquake hazard - and it is being done FOR FUCKING EXPORT!!!!!!!! All of these things are important but fracking may very well be the worst - in the short term.
It might be the most important in the short term. It's dizzying just trying to keep it all organized in one's head. And I remember you talking about the mountaintop removal but never saw pictures of it until shooz posted something a few night's ago that had a link with some pictures of the Appalachian region. Oh man, did that piss me the fuck off. Those beautiful, pristine old growth forests reduced to a useless moonscape. Words fail.
Yep - it is a look into hell - take a look at pictures of coal ash dumps sometime. That will also make your heart ...um... ULCER burn. It is not just the loss of wilderness but a loss with toxic consequences - for the immediate area then for the whole world as the product is used.
I haven't seen any personally but we have a couple just northeast of here, in Illinois. And I just got done looking at some pictures. Disturbing indeed.
It is funny ( NOT ) how those things have a tendency to end up right next to water. Winds are generally strong coming off the water and when it rains the toxins don't have far to travel to contaminate surface water and the life in it.
"Living at ground zero - how is it you are still breathing?"
Gotta be the DNA, heheh. And to think it's been cleaned up a lot since the early days. But it's still ranked one of the worst in the nation, I think. Check out this file photo from 1939. This is a DAYTIME photo:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Man_Lights_Cigarette_in_Daylight_-_Black_Tuesday_1939.jpg
Unreal.
Crazy wasn't it? It's nothing like that now, obviously, but it's still pretty bad around here. A recent report ranked us the 12th worst among U.S. metropolitan regions for particulate pollution and 25th for ground-level ozone. Not a good place to raise kids.
No shit.
I wonder how that compares to Salt Lakes Inversion toxic cover earlier this year.
I lost my grand-mother that day.
"I wonder how that compares to Salt Lakes Inversion toxic cover earlier this year."
That doesn't ring a bell right off. Got a link, hopefully? And check this out. It's completely unrelated, but it's something you'll find very interesting. I saved it last night for you to check out. Fascinating:
http://www.seas.harvard.edu/news/2013/06/printing-tiny-batteries
Toxic Fog Creates Health Emergency in Salt Lake City -
That's disturbing. The shape of things to come?
But what do you think about those batteries? Or are you going to wait until later to check it out?
It is interesting what can be done with 3D printing - it will be interesting to see the tech developed - the batteries - i need to take a better look - i just lightly skimmed the article so far.
Yep. And it never really dawned on me how toxic this area is until I watched that Monsanto doc a few nights ago. "In Our Backyard" or something like that. Jeez, the entire area just across the river is a slew of toxic sites, refineries (I knew about those), waste dumps, etc. All right next to the mighty MO. Had I known all this twenty years ago, I wouldn't have stayed here. I'd have got the fuck away long, long ago. Now, lack of finances has me imprisoned here for the foreseeable future, barring a miracle.
Really sucks to be trapped. People have got to really know what industry is doing to their immediate environment.
Yes it does. But I blame no one but myself 100%. I had the brains and drive to do things differently, but decided to party and fuck off instead.
St. Louis and the east side had a lot of industry and big names for the better part of the 20th century, consequently there's a whole lot of pollution around. Besides Monsanto on both sides of the river, Mobil and Shell refineries on the east side, we used to be home to Mallinkrodt Chemical (big polluter for sure), McDonnell Douglas (big involvement in WWII production) and a host of other 'dirty' (pun intended) businesses. Breweries were big polluters, as well as lead pollution from mining and paint production. It's a long list.
Living at ground zero - how is it you are still breathing?
"i need to take a better look - i just lightly skimmed the article so far."
Definitely no hurry. But I knew you'd be interested in it.
Yeah - 3D printing - so many possibilities.
"Yeah - 3D printing - so many possibilities."
That and the advancement in battery technology. That's the limiting factor in a lot of applications.
Yep - a limiting factor would be life of the battery - if the life of the battery could be increased as in no limits to how many recharges it could take - that would be huge.
Another interesting post.
damn good post - we need public hearings on the science of this.
Yes, we do.
it's insane really - because you know repelicans are the first to scream about property rights - and yet on an issue like this would do everything they can to avoid any public scrutiny what so ever.
the liars
Hell yeah
Still reading through.
Arkansas Frack Target: Fayetteville Shale Water Resources at Stake: Arkansas River, Black River, White River, Greens Ferry Lake, Dardanelle Reservoir (pulled from earthjustice.org)
Contains a collection of material on earthquake activity http://frackingarkansas.wordpress.com/
Arkansas Conservation Alliance Blog http://www.arkansasconservation.org/arkansas_conservation_all/
Ozarks Water Watch http://www.ozarkswaterwatch.org/index.php
The Arkansas Oil and Gas Commission has banned fracking disposal wells for unconventional gas drilling wastes due to earthquakes. The Commission voted unanimously to ban them, and the decision requires the immediate closure of one disposal well and prohibits the construction of new wells within a 1,150 square mile radius.
Arkansas residents insisted that there was a correlation between the increase in earthquake activity in the state and wastewater disposal wells. Imagine being on your way out one afternoon, opening your garage door, and experiencing an earthquake that you knew was being caused by gas drills. After monitoring hundreds of earthquakes, investigators have begun to conform the connection between unconventional gas-related drilling and the quakes. The Oil and Gas Commission discovered that four disposal wells were located on a fault line responsible for dozens of earthquakes. http://planetsave.com/2011/09/16/fracking-disposal-wells-linked-to-earthquakes-banned-in-arkansas/
An article on earthquakes in Arkansas http://beforeitsnews.com/story/344/370/Fracking_the_Life_Out_of_Arkansas_and_Beyond.html?currentSplittedPage=0
Ohio Frack Target: Ohio Shale/Marcellus Shale Water Resources at Stake: Ohio River, Mohawk Reservoir, Lake Erie
Ohio Environmental Council http://www.theoec.org/Fracking.htm?gclid=CISUxfCt6qwCFQWA5Qodbm2kfA
Ohio earthquake http://www.dispatch.com/content/stories/science/2011/11/13/tracking-tremors.html
and the link from earthjustice.org http://earthjustice.org/features/campaigns/fracking-across-the-united-states
And you probably believe in global warming too.
I'm not sure, but i think you may have intended this comment for me (or to bash me)? Science doesn't really give a shit about what I or anyone else believes on that matter. Methane is way cleaner burning than oil or coal, relatively lower in CO2, and there's lots of it in North America.
Also burning methane breaks up one of the worst greenhouse gases into comparatively harmless co2 :p
I'm just a little concerned.
You guy's have that nuclear reactor that is looking for a twenty year extension on it's license? Right?
And you have that fracking proposal going on right?
They just had a segment on PBS where they were talking about that reactor and its location. It is sitting on top of a fault line.
Think that could be a bad combination for a fracking nuclear catastrophe?
How many millions of people live within 40 miles of there?
"Yep - a limiting factor would be life of the battery - if the life of the battery could be increased as in no limits to how many recharges it could take - that would be huge."
I hadn't thought of that. Very good point. I'll have to reread the article and see if it mentions battery life. It's a good start, though.
Well I need to go through the article thoroughly yet. But I am thinking that it is for micro miniaturization - it would have to be damned well long life to make it worth it - I would think.
That does make sense. Or be rechargeable.
Both long life and rechargeable.
I just scanned it and one guy said this:
"The electrochemical performance is comparable to commercial batteries in terms of charge and discharge rate, cycle life and energy densities. We’re just able to achieve this on a much smaller scale."
That does sound promising. They enclose the electrodes in a tiny box and fill it with an electrolyte solution. Hmmm.
Oh no fracking and Global warming Ooooooooooooooooooh shiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiit
Take action. See samples of how below.
183,361 signatures so far for Bernie Sanders petition as of 10:15am central time 01/15/2012
http://sanders.enews.senate.gov/mail/util.cfm?mailaction=clickthru&gpiv=2100081904.557411.411&gen=1&mailing_linkid=34578
The petition to save abandoned houses has 15 signatures. We picked one up at around 9:50pm 01/13/2012. Were just rolling right along.
http://www.thepetitionsite.com/1/Savingpeople-savinghomes-payingdowntheNationaldeficit/
Here is a place where you can directly address change. Take part, it does not hurt and may very well heal/help. Forward the cause of reform and rebirth.
http://www.care2.com/go/z/e/Ag8nw/zL2Q/B18Bb
Sierra Club has some good things to take part in as well. Set-up and ready for you to take part in. http://sierraclub.org/
Here is a place where you can directly address change. Take part, it does not hurt and may very well heal/help. Forward the cause of reform and rebirth.
http://www.care2.com/go/z/e/Ag8nw/zL2Q/B18Bb
Nother link with groups from Ban Michigan which has legislation in November and a petition. http://banmichiganfracking.org/?page_id=12
Un-natural gas resources has science: http://un-naturalgas.org/resources_and_documents.htm