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Forum Post: The Repelican Party has Got To Go!

Posted 2 years ago on Nov. 18, 2011, 1:31 p.m. EST by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT
This content is user submitted and not an official statement

Hey Hey Ho Ho The Repelican Party has Got To Go!

Hey Hey HoHo

They gave us Dick Cheney and Waterboarding!

Hey Hey HoHo

They gave us Git Mo!

Hey Hey Ho Ho The Repelican Party has Got To Go!

They gave us George Bush and Weapons of Mass Distraction!

Hey Hey Ho Ho The Repelican Party has Got To Go!

They say Corporations are People Too!

Hey Hey Ho Ho The Repelican Party has Got To Go!

I say Corporations Do Not Have Tongues!!

Hey Hey Ho Ho The Repelican Party has Got To Go!

They would Privatize Social Security!

Hey Hey Ho Ho The Repelican Party has Got To Go!

.

.

Add in your own refrains!

And check out this letter I just sent to 60 Minutes!

http://occupywallst.org/forum/the-occupy-movement-and-cbs-news-coverage-n17-lett/

360 Comments

360 Comments


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[-] 10 points by SparkyJP (1646) from Westminster, MD 2 years ago

I heard congress wants to change the Pledge of Allegiance to read:

"I pledge allegiance to the CEO of the United Corporations of America and to the Fascist Republic for which it stands, one corporation, under dictated media, divisible, with less liberty and corporal punishment for all."

[-] 2 points by JimiNixen (25) 2 years ago

This made me laugh, so I'll addd to it... I might suggest 'one conglomerate' in place of 'one corporation'....

"I pledge allegiance to the CEO of the United Corporations of America and to the Fascist Republic for which it stands, one conglomerate, under dictated media, divisible, with less liberty and corporal punishment for all."

[-] 2 points by SparkyJP (1646) from Westminster, MD 2 years ago

You'll be pleased to know, that I submitted your suggestion to congress and they loved the change; and that the new wording WILL be reflected in the bill. :)

Cheers!

[-] -1 points by mee44 (71) 2 years ago

Well, we're THREE years in to the Barackster's regime and we still have Gitmo.

I hear RENDITION is still going strong too. What happened? Do tell !!!

[-] 1 points by SoldOut (150) 2 years ago

Funny!

[-] 0 points by metapolitik (1110) 2 years ago

nice

[-] -1 points by zoom6000 (430) from St Petersburg, FL 2 years ago

You should posted on the forum post!!!

[-] 7 points by lgarz (287) from New York, NY 2 years ago

How about the Republican National Anthem.

My House is under water,
my Wife has a disease. my Family has no Health Care. Cause my Job is overseas.

But I still drink the Kool-Aid, And I still buy the Tea. Cause I still love my Republican Party.

I lost my Boy in Baghdad. Then I lost my Income stream. But, when I lost the house in Aspen, I lost my American Dream.

But, I still drink the Kool-Aid, And I still buy the Tea, Cause I still love my, Republican Party!

[-] 2 points by SoldOut (150) 2 years ago

Oh come on now you are just being sarcastic LOL

[-] 2 points by lgarz (287) from New York, NY 2 years ago

And, what's wrong with that????

[-] 5 points by SoldOut (150) 2 years ago

How about the 1%'s prayer (I borrowed it)

Our elephant who art from heaven

Hallowed by thy super wealthy.

When thy kingdom comes we will be done

In America as it is in 3rd world countries.

Give us this day our daily propaganda and forgive those who try to keep our jobs here

And forgive those who freely cross the borders and forgive those who want to make them legal and cause us to make less profit

And lead us not into the temptation of thinking and questioning what you do for us.

It is good enough to know that you protect us from all sorts of fabricated evil

For thine is the kingdom of the rich and powerful forever

Just keep us safe and tell us who the evildoers are that would dethrone thee.

[-] 2 points by lgarz (287) from New York, NY 2 years ago

Very Good!

If I were religious, I'd say that prayer everynight. ;-)

[-] 1 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

LoL!

the fuckers

[-] 1 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

WOOT!!

[-] 0 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

I'm on dial-up.

Got a summary?

[-] -1 points by mikePac (52) 2 years ago

They gave us Git Mo!/////////////////////////Your little poem, skit, or whatever you want to call it. Why wasn't Gitmo closed under the Obummer admin???? that was one of his campaign promises. You and some others are fixated that the Rep are all to blame, when it is BOTH parties are to blame. Behind the scenes they are working together

[-] 2 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

yeah-ya. you're just another liar and repelican shill.

working together indeed. The repelican party is almost split in half, they are working so well together. nimrod

As for Gitmo - the President did try and get the legal process under way, then everyone began screaming about how much security would cost were the trials held in NY that the whole thing never went anywhere.

fukin scumbags

[-] -3 points by mikePac (52) 2 years ago

Obummer is just your typical nigger

[-] 3 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago


and you are a typical fucking scumbag



the repelican party is DONE

[-] 2 points by VQkag2 (16478) 2 years ago

fuck you. You racist piece of shit

[-] 4 points by forOWS (161) 2 years ago

They gave us Disaster Capitalism! The Repugnant Party Has Got To Go! They gave us Crony Capitalism! The Repugnant Party Has Got To Go! They gave us the ugliest leaders the world has ever seen...Reagan, Bush, Rove, Cheney, Cantor, Boehner, McConnell and the rest. Nightmares! The Repugnant Party Has Got To Go! They gave us the largest deficits in American history and tried to blame Obama. The Repugnant Party Has Got To Go!

[-] 1 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

*Disaster Capitalism! *

That is interesting - I like the term. What is interesting is the way repelicans held up funds for FEMA in the wake of Irene. Apparently they only like Disaster Capitalism! if the money goes to entities of their choosing.

I wonder - does anyone have a timeline correlating the rise of the Occupy Movement and that piece of the budget debate?

It might begin to illustrate that as we grow, they will bend.

Bend them till they break I say. Then trample the pieces.

[-] 2 points by forOWS (161) 2 years ago

That isn't mine. It belongs to the writer Naomi Klein. From her book, The Shock Doctrine: The Rise of Disaster Capitalism

[-] 4 points by wordworlock (18) 2 years ago

Little Righty and the circus

Once upon a time there was this circus. It had a great and powerful ringmaster. He would crack his whip and make the elephant do all kinds of tricks. He would feed the elephant very well and the elephant loved the ringmaster.

Then there were the clowns they were the main attention getters and would constantly be doing tricks and deceptions for amusement of the audience. Their job was to distract from the smell of the elephant poop. The clowns were paid quite well because everybody knows that you don’t have a circus without clowns. And the clowns loved the ringmaster.

Then there were the people that cleaned up after the circus. They were very dedicated people that believed this was the best circus ever and if they wanted the honor of cleaning up the poop they needed to protect the elephant.

When people said the elephant made a huge mess and it really stinks. They said you don’t smell elephant poop, you smell the dog and pony show. And then somebody said, “Do they pay you so much money to protect the elephant that you are going to lie to me and tell me all that poop was created by the dog and pony show.

And poor little Righty was so confused. He wasn’t sure if he was lying or really believed that the elephant poop didn’t stink. The mean man asked him. “What are you getting out of this, why do you pretend like the elephant didn’t make this big stinky mess”.

Then poor exasperated little Righty just blurted out. “I don’t get anything and I don’t expect anything. I just want to be safe from people like you. I don’t want people to ask questions or make me think or stand up for myself.

As long as the ringmaster feeds the elephants and clowns I will be safe. Do you get it now you “vile disgusting circus hater”.

[-] 3 points by wordworlock (18) 2 years ago

Forgive me Father Elephant,

For I have sinned,

I was temped by a man who said, “you just use us righties to serve a higher master the (bankers and stockbrokers).”

He said it in such a way that I believed it for a brief moment.

Then it happened ---- my own thought came into my head.

It was terrifying; I fell to the floor and begged forgiveness.

I swear I will never try to think for myself or understand why you do the things you do again.

[-] 3 points by CarlaW (67) 2 years ago

Been there done that?

BE STRONG WORKING CLASS REPUBLICANS!

Stand strong beside your Millionaire and Billionaire brothers and sisters. Make sure they get their tax cuts!

When the Tea Party Revolution takes our country back we will help big business by reducing social security benefits, getting rid of Medicare, and getting rid of the minimum wage.

We will also give control of the health care system back to the insurance companies. If a policyholder gets so sick it would eat into company profits, it only makes good business sense to drop that policyholder (and his or her family). Why can't Democrats understand that?

Real Change is Coming - Help the Rich - Vote Republican 2010

[-] 2 points by TrevorMnemonic (5827) 2 years ago

Both parties work for war. Look at history.

How many countries has Obama bombed since he's been in office? Is it a lot? I think it's a lot.

What charges have been filed against the 3 American citizens they targeted for assassination in a non-battle zone? Is it still no charges? What legal authority did they have to do that? Why is the ACLU suing the administration for this?

Who brought us the patriot act by the way? Who else supported that?

The republicans and democrats need to go.

If people had common sense this election would be between Jill Stein and Gary Johnson. Or other actual progressives and conservatives. Like Dennis Kucinich over Obama in 2008. A prime reason: Kucinich actually tried to impeach Bush and he voted no on the patriot act. But instead money in politics put Obama on top. Just like Money in politics put Romney on top for the republican side. Money in politics was more apparent ever actually... did you see the front runners in the primaries?

But instead money in politics and propaganda has gotten them to think they have to vote for Goldman Sachs or Goldman Sachs 2.0

[-] 1 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

I really don't care about three Americans killed while working with Al Qaeda. I probably should, but it really doesn't bother me a whole lot.

I care more about people like

or

and what these incidents mean for the rest of us.

I attempted to get the ACLU to assist me in getting FOI records and they refused. They could have been useful in attempting to curb the ability to commit murder using the latest tools and technologies, and they refused. I'm sure they do actually do a lot of good for the country, but I personally don't have much use for them.

I have even less concern for Americans who work with al Qaeda.

[-] -1 points by TrevorMnemonic (5827) 2 years ago

"I really don't care about three Americans killed while working with Al Qaeda. I probably should, but it really doesn't bother me a whole lot." You said even though not a single ounce of evidence has ever been presented against them. Even though charges were never filed. Even though they were assassinated in a non battle zone. These are unprecedented measures. Do you want a future Bush to have these powers? Do you know what's better than bombing a foreign country to get these 3 americans? one who was 16 by the way... Capturing them and getting information to capture others to get more information.... or to first prove guilt. We have due process for a reason. So innocent people aren't confused with others. Because it has happened A LOT throughout history. This is why we have due process.

in my state in the 1920's a bunch of racists killed a black man because he was accused of raping a white woman. They rushed in the court and took him outside and hung him. All before he was ever found guilty. We don't want to act like an unruly racist mob. At least back then that guy was charged with a crime. These 3 were never even charged with a crime.

Lol so now you're against the ACLU? You're getting desperate.

It's fine. Just say "I support the status quo and bombing foreign countries" and we can end our argument.

You can't support peace while simultaneously wishing people dead and voting for candidates that want to bomb foreign countries.

[-] 0 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

I do not dispute the value of due process. I do not claim the ACLU has no value to the citizens of this nation. I was opposed to the torture of al Qaeda members as a matter of policy long before that position became popular or OWS came into existence.

In Fact, I have previously said that the torture of al Qaeda members as a matter of policy could only have happened as a result of the growth of the SIC and the use of these tools and technologies to torture and to kill American citizens on U.S. soil.

Since most of these victims die screaming

  • they are out to get me

and since no they has been positively identified, these individuals whose lives have been taken are written off as simply mad . . .

Individuals like:

since there is or has been no concrete evidence to date, these deaths and many others go unaddressed, unavenged . . .

and any one of us may be next.

The ACLU cares nothing for these things. Therefore, while they may be useful - even invaluable - to American society, I have little use for the ACLU.

[-] 2 points by TrevorMnemonic (5827) 2 years ago

The ACLU has done a lot of great things including fighting oppression.

They are right on this issue. You cannot kill people without evidence and without charges. And you can't just bomb foreign countries because you want to.

Stop supporting warmongers who act outside of the law and work for Goldman Sachs.

[-] 1 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

I do not support warmongers - and I generally don't take to being told what to do.

And while the ACLU may have done great things, and may yet do more, they do seem to refuse to do anything about the accumulation and sale of your private data. Data which may be used to reveal your buying and spending habits, and from that, information regarding your own personal behavior . . .

  • information which may be harnessed in a process designed to kill
[-] 0 points by TrevorMnemonic (5827) 2 years ago

I think killing americans without evidence or charges is much more important than Google selling your information. I think fighting against repubs trying to limit voting and women's rights is more important too. I think trying to uncover torture evidence from the Bush era is more important than Google selling information too.

Selling your info on a site you agree to the terms on is not really illegal.

If you don't want google and facebook selling your info.... don't use google or facebook.

Also "The more we do online, the more data we leave behind. The ACLU believes it's time to pass new privacy laws. You shouldn’t have to choose between using new technology and keeping control of your private information." - http://www.aclu.org/technology-and-liberty/internet-privacy

Looks like they really are worried about this situation.... anyway you were saying how you weren't happy with the ACLU

also - You said "information which may be harnessed in a process designed to kill" - to that I say FUCKING LOL...... really? You think the gov wants to kill more US citizens? Maybe you should be concerned with what I mentioned earlier so they can't do that. Is that what you think or did I read that wrong? It's not really for marketing purposes to make even more money for corporations?

[-] 1 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

Further -

I said below

The ACLU believes it's time to pass new privacy laws. You shouldn’t have to choose between using new technology and keeping control of your private information." - http://www.aclu.org/technology-and-liberty/internet-privacy

Ah, well, that is mildly gratifying. A bit late, perhaps - I've only been screaming about it since . . . 1997 . . . .

.

And the reason why the ACLU has acted much too late on this issue is because now there is an industry, an economy, that has grown around the entire process of data harvesting. This means jobs.

There is a dependency within the social fabric upon this process, a dependency that did not exist back in 1997 . . .

Now those who profit will insist to legislators that it's about jobs, stupid

reducing the probability that anything will be done. This in turn increases the imperative - if such is even possible - for an accurate and public understanding of the true costs associated with data harvesting . . .

and that, by this point in time, may well require the complete and total collapse of civilization . . .

[-] 0 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

The ACLU believes it's time to pass new privacy laws. You shouldn’t have to choose between using new technology and keeping control of your private information." - http://www.aclu.org/technology-and-liberty/internet-privacy

Ah, well, that is mildly gratifying. A bit late, perhaps - I've only been screaming about it since . . . 1997 . . . .

also - You said "information which may be harnessed in a process designed to kill" - to that I say FUCKING LOL...... really?

Really. I could in fact show you how.

In fact, armed with nothing more than data processing tools and a credit card, we could identify single males based solely on their grocery shopping habits. A cross reference with those who purchase food for one over an extended period of time with those who also purchase items like t shirts which employ childrens themes will, a high percentage of the time, reveal likely sexual predators.

Sexual predators usually operate with a bio-rhythmic regularity - and they may be manipulated fairly easily.

I could show you how to harness information, interdict their habits, induce high levels of cognitive dissonance in such a way that their behavior may be harnessed . . .

And with a forecast of the impending event, one may engage in terrorism, and even murder, even if only as an accessory . ..

[-] 1 points by TrevorMnemonic (5827) 2 years ago

Again your complaining about the ACLU even though they're talking about an issue you deemed important.

You're really going out of your way to try and make the ACLU look bad... Why is that?

You're saying the government is planning on killing people in the united states? Eeven everyday single males who go shopping?

I think invasion of privacy is bad.... but you're going off into some strange conspiracy land... and might I add this is also happening under Obama who has done even less than the ACLU has on this issue.

Also Obama signed off on the killing of 3 Americans. If killing Americans is such a big deal to you... perhaps you should get behind the ACLU who is saying you can't just kill Americans. They have filed multiple lawsuits in regards to this issue.

[-] 0 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago
  • MKULTRA has been well documented. It's no theory. It is an established fact.

Anyone who suggests that those who quietly supported this kind of research and found it valuable simply quit upon exposure of the program is naive in the extreme.

In fact, Vance Packard insisted otherwise in his publication The People Shapers - I'm sure you can find a copy, if you are curious.

As far as using data harvesting as one component in a process designed to torture, designed to kill . . .

as I said . . .

  • I could show you how . . .
[-] 2 points by CarlaW (67) 2 years ago

You can blame the current president for the deeds of the past president as your media machine tells you.

And you may in fact be successful in demonizing Americans and Democrats to the point where you win.

Do you know what you have won?

Republican President 2.0

But’s that’s fine with you because 1.0 did no wrong and the 2.0 version is suppose to be much better

,------ but nobody can tell you how it is going to be different----

[-] 2 points by Puzzlin (2898) 2 years ago

I'll help with the stomping!!!

They are the politicians that have bent over backwards for the rich to get them perks, loopholes, and undeserved tax cuts.....

We remember you Bush!!!

[-] 0 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago


Anon - Just For Fun



the repelican party is DONE

[-] -1 points by michael4ows (224) from Mountain View, CA 2 years ago

yup, you're a confirmed shill for the other stupid party

[-] 0 points by shooz (17997) 2 years ago

I don't shill for either, but the republicans really do have to go. They're just a bunch of sociopathic stonewallers.

They can't admit the economy crashed on their pathetic watch.

[-] 2 points by VQkag2 (16478) 2 years ago

on their watch and from their actions. and just in time to shake up the election which they knew they couldn't win. And crashed in such a way that their plutocrat coconspirators could reap a huge bailout as a parting gift from Bush.

Evil genious

[-] 0 points by shooz (17997) 2 years ago

That was only true 8 months ago.

It is no longer so now. Apparently.

[-] 1 points by VQkag2 (16478) 2 years ago

oops my bad. Got sidetrackedand fell into an 8 month old hole.

[-] 1 points by shooz (17997) 2 years ago

It's a whole new truth around here now.

A decidedly libe(R)tarian interpretation of reality.

(R)epelican't election fraud is similarly ignored, as is the way of the libe(R)tarians and teabagge(R)s.

http://eclectablog.com/2012/07/michigan-gop-house-speaker-jase-bolger-new-republican-roy-schmidt-found-to-have-committed-gross-election-fraud.html

It's just business as usual.

[-] 1 points by VQkag2 (16478) 2 years ago

Well they'(R)e not foolin' me.!

damn repuglicans.

[-] 0 points by shooz (17997) 2 years ago

They're fooling plenty of others.........:)

It's the way of Karl.

The truth is for sissies.

[-] 1 points by VQkag2 (16478) 2 years ago

Many brainwashed without hope.

Karl? Marx?

[-] 0 points by shooz (17997) 2 years ago

Who needs Marx when you have Rove.

Our current king of propaganda.

[-] 2 points by VQkag2 (16478) 2 years ago

Evil genius. He'll get his.

Instant karma. (if only)

[-] 0 points by shooz (17997) 2 years ago

I do believe he's still given a platform on FLAKESnews.

That should be a giveaway to anyone.

[-] 1 points by VQkag2 (16478) 2 years ago

Agreed.

[-] 1 points by Puzzlin (2898) 2 years ago

Their MO is so easy to identify. They need more exposure and then they hopefully start melting away!!!

[-] 0 points by shooz (17997) 2 years ago

MO?

Yeah, if it doesn't continue policies that Bush started--------------just say NO.

[-] 1 points by Puzzlin (2898) 2 years ago

Bush's entire presidency was an aberration that I hope some day to have forgotten about. I'm just glad I survived, many didn't.

[-] 1 points by ComeTogetherNOW (650) 2 years ago

Two war fronts, and as history plays out, for what?

Nothing. Waste. Waste of human lives, and the suffering will contunue a lifetime for some.

When will we learn that War is NEVER Good. Rationalizing it only keeps the notion alive so others will surely die.

Come Together NOW

[-] 0 points by michael4ows (224) from Mountain View, CA 2 years ago

me neither about shilling. we have these two parties that are both failing us. there's sometimes the slim chance of a third party candidate, but its never much of a chance given the dominance of the two parties. what if another goal of OWS (in addition to "get money out of politics") was to get people to abandon their affiliation with the two parties. i suspect many people's party affiliation is merely to be affiliated with "something". being independent is too vague so people join this or that party for lack of any other option more so than out of conviction or genuine support. but if people left the two stupid parties in droves, leaders would follow :)

(please pardon my nonsense with puzzlin, he pissed me off)

[-] 1 points by shooz (17997) 2 years ago

You can blame that on Reagan.

He repealed the fairness doctrine that would have forced time for other qualified candidates, on the MSM.

Now you just get what they consider "good TV".

Don't republicans suck?

[-] 1 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

I'd like to loop a chain around the neck of that oversized chunk of bronze in the rotunda and skid it right down Pennsylvania Ave

reagan was a schmuck.

the fucker

the repelican party is DONE

[-] -1 points by michael4ows (224) from Mountain View, CA 2 years ago

What is MSM? I didn't know what you were referring to so i went here to try to learn more... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fairness_Doctrine (introduced in 1949) - The main agenda for the doctrine was to ensure that viewers were exposed to a diversity of viewpoints From what i read, i think that cable and the internet have changed the landscape since then quite a bit. A broader spectrum of views is much easier to come by these day given the newer mass media outlets. And yes, republicans suck, generally (but not always) more than democrats :)

[-] -1 points by shooz (17997) 2 years ago

You need to look someplace other than wiki for that kind of info.

It often meant equal time for political views and candidates too. It was a very broad and sweeping doctrine that also called for better public access. It also limited consolidation and foreign access to ownership of our media outlets. It was a good bill.

[-] 0 points by michael4ows (224) from Mountain View, CA 2 years ago

It was a good bill.

I believe you. It does suck that it was killed out of political expedience, party interest over public interest.

[-] -1 points by shooz (17997) 2 years ago

It was repealed because the media corporations wanted it to be.

A lot of small market and local stations went out of business, they couldn't compete with the big boys, who even now, buy each other up and get bigger.

It's why some candidates were limited in speaking time during the republican debates.

They don't have to give them equal time anymore.

[-] 0 points by Puzzlin (2898) 2 years ago

And you are a Troll

[-] 0 points by michael4ows (224) from Mountain View, CA 2 years ago

you are the one who went trolling brother in that other thread that you started, not me

[-] 0 points by Puzzlin (2898) 2 years ago

No you guys own this place. You really have almost taken it over depending on who you troll with. Some, like me, believe you already have.

You WON!!!

It yours!!!

[-] 1 points by michael4ows (224) from Mountain View, CA 2 years ago

i have no idea who you mean when you say "you guys", you've binned me in some tea bagging bucket somehow, idk? what i do know now is that you're a shill for one of the two stupid parties.

[-] 0 points by Puzzlin (2898) 2 years ago

"stupid"

How's that Micheal? Who is stupid? Everyone? But you?

Did you learn to generalize in the second or third grade?

[Removed]

[-] 1 points by wellhungjury (296) 2 years ago

Never heard of the Repelican Party??? Either that or your spell check must be broken.

[-] 1 points by VQkag2 (16478) 2 years ago

How about repuglican? evr hear that one.

repugnant republicans.

1% plutocrat tools

[-] 1 points by wellhungjury (296) 2 years ago

I prefer to call each party Republican, Democrat, Libertarian, Green you get the drill. When trying to reach a common ground one should not start out by insulting their adversary.

[-] 1 points by VQkag2 (16478) 2 years ago

yeah. your right. What common ground do you think we can find with the republicans?

[-] 1 points by wellhungjury (296) 2 years ago

For starters, I really do think that a tax cut/fair tax plan could be achieved if both sides would acknowledge that it is both that need to be accomplished. Now before you say the Republicans would never agree to such measures, the very nature of our problems is that both the left and right are so intrenched with their platforms, they both seem to be using this only for gains politically. Is this really helping us? Probably the best approach would be to work at a local level and proceed upward. A long hard road but a better approach than calling each other names all the time. It starts with one.

[-] 1 points by VQkag2 (16478) 2 years ago

Those are fine notions. But we are currently in the midst of a tax battle. without calling names I have to report to you that one party will not allow the middle class to keep their tax cut unless the wealthy 2% retain theres.

The other party wants to end the tax cut for the 2%. How do we get our preferred policy to pass. We compromised 2 years ago in order to retain middle class tax cuts and to get along/find common ground. Please don;t tell me we gotta submit to that unfairrness again.

What should we do? I agree with you, name calling is unproductive. but we can be honest and recognize who is working to help the 99%. while the other would sacrifice the 99% for the 2%.

Thats allowed isn't it. How can we convince the others that our way is right, and theres is wrong.?

[-] 1 points by wellhungjury (296) 2 years ago

One thing, that compromise that was agreed to was defaulted on by both sides. The tax cuts were extended on the agreement that we would set a budget (preferably a balanced budget) and also cut our spending. Neither of those things happened either. The blame goes both ways on this one.

To address your opinion on taxing the wealthy. I do see things slightly different and will probably be chastised for it. I think that a flat or consumption tax is the FAIR way to tax. A consumption tax will always tax illegal money and can be used to promote good habits by exempting healthy food, medical and the like. A Flat Tax with a slight modification. No exemptions except the following: Two deductions maximum for off spring dependents and an outright exemptions for those making less than 1.5 x the poverty rate. This matches the same qualification of the health care mandate. Anyone above that pays a flat rate on their income. You make $30,000 or $30,000,000 you get the same rate. That is truly fair. The only reason that put in the exemptions is because there are basic needs that people need to be able to pay for before the government starts taking. I would even accept a "slightly" higher rate on wage earners above $250,000 net for periodic review. Any thoughts?

[-] 1 points by VQkag2 (16478) 2 years ago

That sounds like a republican plan. It is certainly regressive.

I like taxing consumption but I know it is more onerous to the poor. I rather see very little tax on people making under $75k. instead of the 2 rates you suggest I think I could agree to 3 or 4. I would also eliminate deductions........ for the wealthiest.

Any income over a million dollars should be taxed at 90%. That would be one of my rates. Enough foolin around. Pay the debt down that the 1% plutocrats created. Then maybe we will cut that rate back.

Your other rates a larger one over $250k? What are the Flat tax rates you suggest? I didn't notice that.

[-] 0 points by wellhungjury (296) 2 years ago

Whether it is a Republican plan or otherwise is not my focus. Labels keep people and ideas apart. I would not call something that actually would have two rates in it regressive. Regressive implies moving backward, which is not the case for a flat rate tax. Especially one that considers a positive rate change for $250,000 and above.

Studies that I have read suggest 15% to 25% is what is necessary to pay for our budget and pay debt down. Maybe 35-45% for $250,000 and above. I could accept your extreme rate of 90% to deal with debt but then lower it back to 35-45% once we have dealt with the debt. This would only work and be fair if congress would be fiscally responsible and not try to buy everyone's votes with new programs based on new found money.

Ultimately, I have no problem with people being rich. From time to time, they are clients of mine. I would say that about 10% of them are real dickheads, but patience and nice has always gotten me through the task and they improve their nature in that time period too. Being rich is not the problem. What they do with that wealth is the problem. Some peoples method is to control them by taking it away. My approach is to let them flourish until they do do something that harms others, then squash the shit out of them, as long as the laws are in place. Something that both Democrats and Republicans have removed in the last couple of decades.

[-] 1 points by VQkag2 (16478) 2 years ago

I got no problem withrich people. I just think they broke the agreement we made with them. So we should get our money back. With interest. 29.99% Thank you very much.

The regressive tax is the consumption tax. I like it but it is regressive so it would have to somehow exclude the poorest otherwise I'm against it.

I could accept 20% over $75k, 40% over $250K 60% over $500k, 90% over a million.

And going back to your suggestion that the dems broke some agreement regarding the tax cut deal in 2010. not true. sorry. the deal repubs insisted on was extend all tax cuts (incl wealthiest) or none at all.

So your repubs at that time were just protecting the wealthy at theexpense of the rest of us. And that is what they're doin again. No mention of balanced budgets. Which the dems did in 99 and repubs blew up when they got the white house in 2000.

Remember?

And it is true that some dems voted with repubs to remove laws to control wealthy recklessness (glass steagal) but in the end the removal was a conservative policy to have less regulation.

Riiiiight?

If we're gonna be honest about it all.

[-] 0 points by wellhungjury (296) 2 years ago

I can agree with Consumption Tax being regressive. I was focusing on Flat Tax.

When did the Democrat lead congress produce a balanced budget or a budget at all? When did the President sign this? Cutting spending was absolutely part of the discussion. D's did not want to cut spending. Right or wrong, Republican philosophy is trickle down, so it is not a surprise that they will defend tax cuts for the wealthy. (This is not my stated opinion) Besides, we had a new faction in the group known as the Tea Party. I liked a few of their core beliefs but was not happy with the inability to develop a compromise. Again, D's & R's had real and needed answers to all of this. Both sides stuck to their party lines and we got nothing.

Who signed the removal of the Glass Steagal Act into law?

Anyway, enjoyed the part about discussing ideas. Not so interested in the tit for tat stuff. Both D's and R's need to own this mess before we can move forward.

[-] 2 points by VQkag2 (16478) 2 years ago

Nah. We need to identify the problems before we can resolve them.

A dem signed the repeal of Glass Steagal. So? The repeal was still a conservative policy. That is the point.

our problems are conservative policies. The solutions will be progressive policies.

Taxcuts for the wealthy.? trickle down? conservative! Doesn't work. The wealthy hoard their money. they are not creating jobs here as they claimed they would.

Middle class consumers ARE the job creators. That is who we must help. They spend money. that creates demand, and job creation.

So lets cut their taxes, and lets forgive their debt.! That'll light a fire under the ass of this economy. Banks might suffer but they pretty much screwed everything up anyway. Even now we are hearing about the new bankster scandal (LIBOR)

[-] 0 points by wellhungjury (296) 2 years ago

Identifying the problems would be a real good start. So, a Democrat signed the repeal? What about a veto? Hold them all to the fire. Look, I am a busy guy and wanted to spend a bit of time talking about solutions and ideas. You and I just disagree with who is at fault. You believe the R's are to blame I believe that they all are to blame. Both have had good and bad stances. We obviously are not doing things right. Never the less I am sure that we might have had some common ground, but it looks like we will never get there. Seems to be a great parallel to what our country is going through. I am definitely leaving this conversation with new opinions. Good luck to your future.

[-] 2 points by VQkag2 (16478) 1 year ago

Definitely gotta look at individual candidates. I agree.

My district has a WF party supported candidate who is a big OWS advocate. Other individuals I like are B Sanders in VT. and E Warren in Mass. I'm sure there are others I don't know every one.

[-] 1 points by wellhungjury (296) 1 year ago

I personally feel that this is the best way to affect change in our current systems. We always aim at higher government, but we as individuals just do not have much influence. At a local and state district level, we have a greater influence and a better chance at see results that can work their way up into the higher levels. This is not a spring, it is a marathon. Another aspect of this approach is that local government can respond to local and regional needs that are never addressed by national politics. You are in the NE and I am in the SW. Who knows more about our problems than those who are amongst us in either region?

[-] 1 points by VQkag2 (16478) 1 year ago

I think also the city council level is a good place to start the direct democracy (all citizens vote for all laws) concept we hear so much about here @OWS.

[-] 1 points by VQkag2 (16478) 2 years ago

I think Dems ARE to blame! When they vote for conservative policies that benefit the 1% plutocrats.

isn't that stating that both parties are at fault.?

Elect progressives. Lets agree to that common ground.

[-] 0 points by wellhungjury (296) 1 year ago

I can work with that. I like to focus on the individual candidate and look at their track record. I kind of wish that most of us would do the same.

[-] 1 points by wellhungjury (296) 2 years ago

I should have said any amount above the poverty rate x 1.5 is taxed. Not the whole amount.

[-] 1 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

BWA hahaha.

R.E.P.E.L.I.C.A.N.S.

It is a term of approbation,

a proof,

derogatory in nature,

intended to shame and to ridicule

those who run for high office

upon a platform of lies before the whole world

and have not the decency to blush bright crimson.

they are reprehensible.

they are repulsive.

they are repellent.

they are repelicans . . . .

[-] 1 points by wellhungjury (296) 2 years ago

Yeah? No kidding? Imagine the minds you have changed with that one.......you get what you give.

[-] 2 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

Repelicans have been lying for years. They set about Judicial Activism with their appointments to the Supreme Court back in the late '70s. Once it began to bear fruit, around 1995, slimey little newt began screaming about Judicial Activism coming from the left, which proved an effective strategy for distracting the public for well over a decade.

Global warming? It's right out in the parking lot - they still parade the lie that it isn't even real.

Their lies go back decades. DECADES! I've had enough. And before you accuse me of not having given the issue some in depth consideration, you might review:

-- Goodbye to All That: Reflections of a GOP Operative Who Left the Cult Saturday 3 September 2011 by: Mike Lofgren, Truthout | News Analysis http://www.truth-out.org/goodbye-all-reflections-gop-operative-who-left-cult/1314907779

.

He says almost exactly what I said here: -- Upon the Question of Default of Our National Debt July 6th, 2011 http://zendogblog.net/blog/

[-] 1 points by wellhungjury (296) 2 years ago

For every lie that you mention, I could note a lie given by a Democrat or the Green Party or a Libertarian. When we spend our time labeling, insulting and destroying what creation do we hope to achieve?

[-] 1 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

For every lie that you mention, I could note a lie given by a Democrat or the Green Party or a Libertarian.

So start enumerating them . . .

I have my list here -

[-] 0 points by wellhungjury (296) 2 years ago

http://townhall.com/tipsheet/guybenson/2012/05/22/debunked_three_new_democrat_lies

http://www.canadafreepress.com/index.php/article/27767

Here you go. You fact check them. I Googled these in a couple of minutes. True or not? I do not have time to fact check these at this time. I also chose the Democrats because you and Shooz are aligned with them. You should know about Democrat stuff better than anyone.

Back to what I was trying to make a point on. If you feel that you gain something by being smug, mean, derogatory adn the like, what are you really gaining besides self pleasure? Who's mind will be changed? Put yourself in their shoes. Would you respond to your type of rhetoric?

I have no party affiliation. Been a registered Independent for 26 years. I support planks in both the Republican and Democrat parties as well as ideas from a few others. I will never pull a party line and will always hold all of them accountable for what they do and say. Now when I have a moment, I will go ahead and research the links I presented as well as look over the one you sent. Later days.....

[-] 1 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

the canadafreepress has been debunked as an outlet for repelican spin.

sorry.

you are more than welcome to try again.

[-] 0 points by wellhungjury (296) 2 years ago

Just do not have time right now. I am sure that it would not matter what I picked. Your answer would always be the above regardless. You know damn well that they all can be caught in lies. You refuse to actually listen what I am saying. I would prefer to spend time doing something positive.

[-] 2 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

My point is, and this is very important, so please, do pay attention -

where corruption is found among the dems, today, the general response is one of shame and remorse.

Among repelicans this is not so, where it is seen that corruption, where it is found, is held forth as some virtue, and a matter of party policy

At a Republican State Committee meeting Turzai listed the biggest accomplishments of the Republican-led legislature1, stating:

  • "Pro-Second Amendment? The Castle Doctrine, it's done. First pro-life legislation — abortion facility regulations — in 22 years, done. Voter ID, which is gonna allow Governor Romney to win the state of Pennsylvania, done."
[-] 0 points by shooz (17997) 2 years ago

You provide links to BS and expect respect?

The original and still the biggest political liar of all time is Nixon.

Multiple acts of treason.

Now the (R)epelican'ts commit all kinds of election and voter fraud, but you conveniently ignore such things.

Here's another new one from California to go with the one from Mchigan I posted yesterday.

http://www.fairnessradio.com/2012/05/05/repbulican-voter-registration-firm-turns-in-thousands-of-fake-registration-cards-a-long-history-of-republican-registration-fraud/

Plus I'm still waiting for someone to show me the 900+ bills passed by (R)epelican'ts that are anti-womens rights.

where's that part where you hold them accountable?

I have a feeling I'll be waiting a long time for anything so anti-American from the liberals.

It's your rhetoric that's BS. It always was, or you wouldn't need propaganda mills like CFP to make any point at all..........

Plus here's what I found on the other link you pprovided proving you are not in any way shape or form independent. you are a libe(R)tarian.

http://townhall.com/columnists/johnhawkins/2012/07/20/the_20_best_quotes_from_ayn_rand

Yeah.....Ayn Rand knows best.

Go puck a rubber.

[-] -1 points by wellhungjury (296) 2 years ago

You would have called any link BS, so what is the point. I have read several of your comments from time to time and it is just your nature. You can't help yourself. Your snide comments do not sway anyone. They divide and cause more harm than good. I grow tired of you for now. Maybe on another day, we can smack each other around a bit. I gotta get back to the real world and deal with it in a real way. Later days....

[-] 0 points by shooz (17997) 2 years ago

I wouldn't have called it BS, if it wasn't BS, but it was.

Why do post BS and expect respect?

You couldn't find anything at FLAKESnews?

Limbaugh's site was down?

CATO a little too obvious?

[-] 0 points by shooz (17997) 2 years ago

I fail to see the lie in what he said.

Perhaps you would enlighten us?

[-] 0 points by wellhungjury (296) 2 years ago

I did not call him a liar. I merely pointed out that there are examples of wrongdoing within many parties and to not acknowledge that might not be the best approach. You also might have missed my point on being respectful to others in order to have a productive dialogue with them. Can you or anyone really tell me with a straight face the the Democrats are perfect and wonderful and it is only the Republicans that do wrong? Really? They all have their skeletons.

[-] 0 points by shooz (17997) 2 years ago

You just lied, because YES you did.

"For every lie that you mention"

Try and keep up with at least what you yourself say and imply.

I guess that's just another hung jury, eh?

[-] 0 points by wellhungjury (296) 2 years ago

This is what I said, "For every lie that you mention, I could note a lie given by a Democrat or the Green Party or a Libertarian." I was not referring to ZenDog being a liar. I was referring to every lie that a Republican is caught in, the other parties can be caught in just as many lies. The notion that any politician or the party that they are affiliated with is across the board honest and perfect or dishonest and flawed is an absolute fallacy. Sorry that I did not state that more clearly. I enjoy your snarky comments. You must be a real hoot at parties.

[-] 2 points by April (3196) 2 years ago

So they all do it. Thing is, the Repubs are real pros at it. And have managed to build a Party foundation on it. It is the foundation of their economic policies. 'The wealthy are the job creators'. Pure bullshit. Some of us can see bullshit for what it is. It's the ignorant ones we need to worry about.

It's Republican Sociopathy that's the root of the problem. The lies are just one symptom of the Sociopathic Behavior that is the Republican Party. Along with self-loathing. Because you can't be Republican without a certain amount of self-loathing. They just hate the government. Even though they're 50% of it. I love it when Republican's claim 'government is the problem'. They're half right about that. They are the problem.

[-] 0 points by shooz (17997) 2 years ago

I'm not going to play semantics with you.

How many lies will you really quote from the libe(R)tarians?

Go "right" ahead. I'll be waiting to hear them.

It figures all you're worried about is the party.

Real party boy, eh?

You must be drunk a lot. I don't drink at all.

[-] 1 points by bklynsboy (834) 2 years ago

Hey Hey Ho Ho

Obama and Democrats keep Bush's policies going.

[-] 1 points by VQkag2 (16478) 2 years ago

Dems have started the slow process of changing direction.

It will take years to take back control from the most powerful, evil force (1% plutocrats) we have ever faced.

Its our fault it got this far gone. We've been asleep. If we attack the only people making an effort to change things we will be serving the 1% plutocrats.

instead of complaining that Pres Obama hasn't magically changed everything in 3 years. Lets take an active role in protesting/pressuring all pols to pass the progressive solutions we need to end the republican supported conservative policies that serve the 1% plutocrats.

There is no switch Pres Obama can hit to undo the damage our apathy created. The plutocrats through their republic tools have delayed/obstructed/filibustered all efforts at improving the lives of the 99%

It's up to the people to recognize who is on our side. and who is working for the plutocrats.

Elect progressives, Vote out pro plutocrat republicans.

[-] 1 points by bklynsboy (834) 2 years ago

Unfortunately Obama is establishment: voted for tax breaks for rich. Eased pollution rules. Escalated Bush and new wars. Said nothing about gun control due to NRA fear. Same republican agenda, different wrapper.

[-] 1 points by VQkag2 (16478) 2 years ago

Nah. Used the EPA for the 1st time to classify and put limits on carbon (had to do it that way cause repubs in congress blocked real progress)

Ended Bushs illegal oil war in Iraq, Is ending the Afghan war, Hasn't invaded any other countries, Has resisted right wing war wongerers pressure to invade Iran. And has used our Military in a limited transparent way.

Slow progress away from the conservative policies that screwed everything up.

More progress would have been possible if the people (All of us) were not asleep or lazy, and protested for a progressive agenda.

There is no magic switch the Pres could hit. The 1% plutocrats aren't giving up power without a fight. The repubs who serve the 1% have obstructed, watered down, and delayed all efforts at change.

[-] 1 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

that is a cheap over simplification and distortion of reality.

But I understand.

yer onea carl with a K's boyz

hit it

[-] 1 points by bklynsboy (834) 2 years ago

Obama: continues Guantanamo continues tax breaks to rich continues rollback of Wall St. oversight continues global wars continues rollback of pollution regulations continues cutback of social security, medicare, medicaid: all Bush objectives

shall I continue?

[-] 1 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

You can if you like.

I posted this here

I couldn't get you're link to load over dial-up - so I went

Where it becomes clear why the President appointed this guy. Two reasons this article points to:

  • He wrote an article articulating the cost of not raising the debt ceiling

  • "Senate Republicans have blocked many of Obama’s top nominees, including MIT professor and Nobel laureate Peter Diamond, who was a nominee for the Fed and ultimately withdrew, and Richard Cordray, the nominee to oversee the Consumer Financial Protection Bureau."

  • cited from the article by Zachary A. Goldfarb

Get the fucking repelicans out of there and we'll see what happens then.

duh

It's another example of how repelicans with their intransigence take hostages and force their will despite being a minority in the Senate. The process makes everyone look bad, and it doesn't help our national policy making apparatus in any of its forms.

What I am saying is that every example you cite above is the result of repelican shenanigans, intransigence,

  • and sedition
[-] 2 points by bklynsboy (834) 2 years ago

Yes, the repelicans are scum but Obama should stand up to them and not cave in on core Democratic ideals and platforms that he has done many times..

[-] 1 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

I tend to agree - but I would point out that what is happening is that the Art of War is playing out on Capitol Hill.

One example:

  • "Senate Republicans have blocked many of Obama’s top nominees, including MIT professor and Nobel laureate Peter Diamond, who was a nominee for the Fed and ultimately withdrew, and Richard Cordray, the nominee to oversee the Consumer Financial Protection Bureau."

[-] -1 points by hchc (3297) from Tampa, FL 2 years ago

"nominee for the Fed"....ya, more Wall St guys, fuckin great.

Glad to see you are raising your old, uneducated posts from the past.

Stay classy as usual.

[-] 1 points by hchc (3297) from Tampa, FL 2 years ago

Clinton and the Dems repeal Glass-Steagall in 1999, setting up the flood of money.

9/11 happens.

Bush Announces Ownership Society- an initiative to get more people into housing.

Markets crash, debts soar, etc.. Obama comes in, promising massive change (I know, I helped get him in htere), and we get more corruption and more war.

Until people start creating their own paries, with people htat actually want to help the common man, there is no point in discussing anything on this site, because we are leaving the major decisions to the fascists.

But that would take a lot of work, and the public clearly isnt interested. Im guessing voter turnout doesnt reach 50% in 2012. It usually doesnt. And re-election rates of incumbents will be over 85%, again, like is always is.

[-] 1 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

Clinton and the Dems repeal Glass-Steagall in 1999, setting up the flood of money.

9/11 happens.

Yeah-ya. And as book ends we were hit twice by al qaida - and the repelican response was any response by the President is simply a distraction from that issue upon a blue dress

The fuckers take hostages.

I'm not taking any hostages.

[-] 1 points by hchc (3297) from Tampa, FL 2 years ago

Democrats shit all over Unions in Federal policies:

Clinton signed NAFTA, opened the doors to the globalists. Thanks Bill.

OWS starts, and what does Obama do? Signs three free trade agreements, screwing the Unions. Thank Obama.

Both parties should be done, but the people are too scared to pull it off.

[-] 1 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

these issues are likely the result of repelican hostage taking

the repelican party is DONE



You can Raul if You Want To

Anon - Just For Fun



the repelican party is DONE

[-] 1 points by hchc (3297) from Tampa, FL 2 years ago

If you are too weak to stand up for yourself, you cannot lead. Fire them all, put people like me and you in there, normal people. People who dont anyone anything. You cant ask for representaiton from people who dont want to associate with you in real life.

[-] 1 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

what's your point - I don't have any friends?

who cares?

[-] 1 points by hchc (3297) from Tampa, FL 2 years ago

My point is if they are being "taken hostage" then they clearly dont have the balls to lead, and like it or not, its an ugly game, and balls wins alot.

Im saying put some damn normal people in there, people who dont like politicians, to raise hell. Tell em, "We are working 70 hrs this week, see you then".

[-] 1 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

taken hostage

Thats taking, with an ING. Twisting arms?

And I think the tea party attempted to tell the rest of Congress what was up - and they were intent on slashing more gov'mint spending. Where isn't clear, but my bet is Medicare and Social Security.

[-] 1 points by hchc (3297) from Tampa, FL 2 years ago

Soicialist policies under Bush:

No Child Left Behind Medicare Part D- free pills/meds Ownership Society- subprime bonanza

Fascist Policies under Obama: Bank Bailouts Special Bailouts for Certain Corporations Forcing peeps to purchase HC from private corporations

They both love the wars. Bush started Afghan, Obama double the troops. Bush started Iraq, Obama brings home most of the troops, but leaves over 17,000 contractors there. Obama bombs 5 other countries and building 4 more bases in Africa.

They are also in love with the Fed inflating our debt aways, so they can continue these wars.

[-] 1 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

We are in a State of Nature thanks to rampant repelicanism



You can Raul if You Want To

Anon - Just For Fun



the repelican party is DONE

[-] 1 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

the fucking scumbags are DONE

[-] 1 points by bigbangbilly (594) 2 years ago

Having only one party is not a good idea but still nobody is the good guy, just many shades of gray.

[-] 1 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

We started out with a single party. How about no party?

how about we settle such matters once the repelican party is DONE

[-] 1 points by bigbangbilly (594) 2 years ago

Just make sure that power vacuums are sealed and choices are still open.

[-] 1 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

power vacuums . . .

interesting.

The creation of power vacuums embodies the possibility of documentation of the process of corruption where such void may be filled toward that end.

elimination of first tier candidates of corruption, coupled with subversion of second tier candidates of corruption, might allow for complete documentation of the process, and with such documentation in hand, provide for the means to sow confusion, disarray among the enemy camp, making them unable to respond while we cut off their legs . .. .

[-] 1 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

hm? What?

[-] 1 points by shooz (17997) 2 years ago

Can we speed this up?

Teabaggers first.

Wisconsin looks to be getting a good start.

[-] 2 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

hey ho

hey ho

the tea bag's torn

it has a hole

hey ho

hey ho

the tea bag party's

gotta go

hey ho

hey ho

[-] 1 points by shooz (17997) 2 years ago

Merry Christmas, Happy Holidays and everything else Zen......:)

Now, if only we could move the trolls forwards a notch.

[-] 1 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

aah

bah humbug

trolls . . . . moving forward . . ..

what did you have in mind?

[-] 1 points by shooz (17997) 2 years ago

Since internet cattle prods are a ways in the future:

I can recall certain chat rooms that utilized a kind of jail, for room rules misbehavior.

I wonder if something like that could be written into the forums programing?

It's not an outright ban, but a kind of separate troll room.

A kind of time out, discipline.

Hey, just a happy thought. I could get tossed in from time to time too.

I really don't like any flavor of republican.

[-] 1 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

a troll room!

I like it.

[-] 1 points by commonsense11 (195) 2 years ago

While we're at it let's get rid of the moronic Democrat party too!

[-] 1 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

patience - one at a time

[-] 1 points by Ravinous (38) 2 years ago

Both Parties need to go, well spare a few here and there. Both are corrupt beyond saving and frankly are nothing more than one party playing the citizens with meaningless arguments to divide us.

[-] 0 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

I think you have to look at how they actually vote.

[-] 1 points by Ravinous (38) 2 years ago

I do along with who supports them with payments both "legitimate" and indirect. Not saying everyone in government is rotten. Paul, despite what people here may think, is doing the best job he can. Cantwell, Sanders, Roemer, etc. Do I agree 100% with all of them? No, but I can honestly say they are trying there god damn hardest to actually DO their job.

The problem and core of the issue is, that they are exceptions, not the rule. Most play to your heart strings and issues during election time but play to the fiddle that pays when it's time to work. The rest is just playing politics.

Many of the issues we argue over shouldn't even be brought up by the federal level or has already been resolved long ago. They just keep bringing them up because they are hot button issues that divide and distract us.

When something seriously bad or changing to the nation actually passes or comes to light, we are usually played up with distractions, like when Paul and Sanders finally audited the reserve we were too busy talking about Congress "shutting down" and it barely got a peep about the 16 Trillion in unreported transfer/bailouts that were found.

We were scared and threatened into the Patriot Act, and were to busy with "impeachment" and the .com boom/collapse to worry about the bipartisan (Made by the (R)'s past by Clinton) repeal of Glass Steagall which eventually lead to the economic woes we have today.

[-] 0 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

The impeachment issue is a clear instance of how one party will use scandal to distract the public while behind the scenes they twist arms to get their own way.

the repelican party is DONE

[-] 0 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

the scumbags are DONE

[-] 1 points by Brandon37 (372) 2 years ago

Aren't you a Canadian?

[-] 0 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

Me? Nope.

Live next door to Canada though.

I'm a Vermonter, through and through.

[-] 1 points by Brandon37 (372) 2 years ago

Good maple syrup. New England is a nice part of the country. Not as pretty as the South IMO, but really enjoyed the area. I have family that lives in Maine.

[-] 0 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

Lived here all my life. I've even helped with boiling sap.

[-] 1 points by Brandon37 (372) 2 years ago

Good stuff.

[-] 1 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

yes it is

[-] 1 points by GoldmanSex (9) from New York City, NY 2 years ago

fish

[-] 0 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

fish

wtf does that mean?

  • fish

go fish?

fish on?

bass fish

bass?

fish?

bass

music?

wtf

you fish

not red fish, not blue fish . . ..

  • you fish
[-] 1 points by smedl (2) 2 years ago

Don't you mean the reptilican party, the party of psychopaths?

[-] 1 points by smedl (2) 2 years ago

Don't you mean the reptilican party, the party of psychopaths?

[-] 0 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

they are sociopaths and psychos -

on that we certainly do agree

[-] 1 points by Calypsophia (74) 2 years ago

Both parties have their own agendas. Political parties are the bane of the nation.

[-] 0 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

Let us utterly crush the one, and then consider the end of all party politics. Let us consider election on the basis not of party affiliation, but on issues.

[-] 1 points by EndTheFed214 (113) 2 years ago

I say Ron Paul 12 because he can use the republican machine aginst them and at the same time help the country. it would also be cool if there was a 3rd party

[-] 1 points by WFCapitalist07 (24) 2 years ago

On my way in here tonight I bruised my nose hugging a tree. I was late ‘cause I had to stop by on my way in San Quentin to set a criminal free. And I ran out on seven-grain bee-pollen macrobiotic organic sustainable medical marijuana for my jerky knee.

Do you know how hard it is to be a liberal? Well, do ya?

I had to learn to speak French, Spanish, Hindi, and dolphin just so I could relate. I’m exhausted from taxing and spending, and controlling the media, and hiding my agenda, and ruling San Francisco as a separatist nation-state. And in yoga today, I got bent out of shape ‘cause the guy doing bow-pulling pulls in front of me was intolerant which I hate!

Do you know how hard it is to be a liberal? Well, do ya?

Constantly feeding the hungry and bleeding my heart and exceeding my budget and needing approval and reading The Nation and leading a sing-along — EVERYBODY! (No wait, that was just an impulse. Sorry.)

I was shootin’ hoops with some brothas when I sprained my ba-donka-donk and ya know that ain’t chill. I saved an endangered snail-darter from being eaten by an endangered spotted owl which I saved from being eaten by an endangered snow-leopard which I saved from being shot by a poacher who I had to kill — (with kindness. It took a while.) And I hit a speed bump and I spilled my chi-latte all over the hemp-covered seats of my Prius and the speed-bump turned out to be a homeless Native American so I apologized and gave him some land, I stomped out his cigarette and took away his gun and shot myself in the nuts on my way to my frivolous lawsuit for sexual harassment where I was suing myself ‘cause I masturbated — against my will! Do you know how hard it is to be me? Do you know how hard it is just to be a knee-jerk liberal? What I wouldn’t give to be a circle-jerk conservative!

Roy Zimmerman's "To Be a Liberal"

[-] 1 points by TechJunkie (3029) from Miami Beach, FL 2 years ago

Repel the Repelicans!

What is a replican anyway? Is that the sequel to a pelican? A pelican re-run?

[-] -1 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

LoL!

[-] 1 points by zoom6000 (430) from St Petersburg, FL 2 years ago

Have you notice how they like to backup there BS with paid POLLs

[-] 1 points by NintyNiner (93) 2 years ago

Dude get off your right/left krap, because they the same when it comes to screwin up the balance of society! You must have balance and now its unbalanced and tippin! Social unrest has begun and if not balanced people will die! We have a National Security problem and thats the power lobbyists have over our Politicians! Our Politicians have become corrupted!!!

[-] 1 points by metapolitik (1110) 2 years ago

Agreed!

Politics in 'Amerika' has devolved into a red/blue shell game with Republicans playing 'good cop' and Democrats playing 'bad cop'. Both parties are owned and both parties will fuck you in the end.

Unless we all vote Green, Socialist or Communist... Democracy is dead.

[-] -1 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

I do not believe they are the same, not at all.

President Obama invested the U.S. government in General Motors. Never would a repelican have considered such a thing.

He replaced the CEO of GM - who had previously asserted there was no global warming, no need for green cars because there was no market.

Close examination of the two parties demonstrates that one of them is more malleable to the public will.

Only one claims there is no global warming.

Only one claims corporations are people too

Only one party stands even now upon lies so great, so clearly and obviously false, that they must fall.

Drag them into the mud. Make their name a mockery before the people.

Let them be heard from no more.

selah

z

[-] -1 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

then erect a monument over the unmarked grave of all that once was, and let it boldly proclaim in polished stone:

a house divided cannot stand.

z

[-] 1 points by stuartchase (861) 2 years ago

You gotta check this shit out! I want you to speak truth to power!. Say it once, say it twice. Say it loud. Say it proud. I'm down with the KTC. The Revolution starts here!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rGaRtqrlGy8&feature=related

http://occupywallst.org/forum/make-a-stand-join-the-clan/

The Revolution starts here! No one can silence the Revolution!

[-] 1 points by JadedCitizen (4277) 2 years ago

Does this guy ever say anything different? Bet he wears the same shirt everyday too.

[-] 1 points by stuartchase (861) 2 years ago

Hey, we have people bitching about Walmart everyday. We have people bitching about Ron Lawl. Toshiba is my 1%er of choice.

[-] 1 points by ShaggyLaRevolution (7) from Loveland, CO 2 years ago

ummm. . . I just have to ask - what the hell is a repelican?

[-] -1 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

oh, common!

bushite!

repelicans are full of bushite!

You know, Carl with a k rove? Slimy dick Cheney, all of their friends and allies who do all in their power to shore up that party of lies?

[-] 1 points by Joyce (375) 2 years ago

Water boarding is pedestrian.... comparable to modern day fraternal hazing.....at best....

[-] -1 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

Modern Day Fraternal Hazing . . . .

Yes . . . where some have indulged in the use of peer pressure to get new pledges to drink massive quantities of water - a seemingly harmless exercise - until the pledge drops dead of water intoxication.

And while I might personally prefer to spend one, or even one hundred and eighty days before the water board as opposed to what seems an eternity in pocket, never the less . . .

We cannot take the rules of the back alley and make of them a matter of public policy to be implemented in the public square. To do so is to make the entire public square no more than an extension of the back alley. If polite society wanted to live their lives by back alley rules, they would, I am confident, have moved there long ago. As it is they flee to the burbs clutching their children, and with all of the haste their dignity will allow . . .

Now.

Cloth please?

who sent you . . .

; D

[-] 1 points by Joyce (375) 2 years ago

Lol..that was cute...so much effort versus the payout....cute...

[-] -1 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

Effort?

I don't recall having broken a sweat . . . .

[-] 1 points by Joyce (375) 2 years ago

Rather obvious.....glad to know my tax dollars fund your community college education.....

[-] -1 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

better me than you -

obviously you can't do your homework.

[-] 1 points by Joyce (375) 2 years ago

Not gonna do it, wouldn't be prudent.........

[-] 1 points by EndTheFed214 (113) 2 years ago

We need Ron Lawl! he is only using the republican mechaine to make it to the white house! all you lebarls and commies should know that Obama gets more money from wall street than any other modern president

[-] -1 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

he wants to eliminate fema?

can you be serious?

[Removed]

[-] 1 points by HeavyTZM (4) 2 years ago

Political paradigm idiot

[-] 1 points by aahpat (1407) 2 years ago

Replace "Republican Party" with 'political parties'.

[-] -1 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

I will leave that for the people to decide. As for the repelicans - they are caught in a cycle of their own creation, it is in my view, unstoppable.

With all of the sincerity I possess, I insist, it is a joy to do whatever I may, to hasten the inevitable.

[-] 1 points by RedJazz43 (2757) 2 years ago

Have you noticed that the President and most of the mayors who are smashing the Occupy movement are Democrats?

[-] -1 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

No I had not noticed that - but let me suggest that if it is true, and I do not say that it is - but if it is true, then be assured, they do us this favor -

for it will only make us stronger.

[-] 1 points by RedJazz43 (2757) 2 years ago

But why then single out the Republicans when the Democrats are not only equally at fault but a much, much greater danger to OWS than are the Republicans. There is, after all, virtually no danger that the Republican Party will, "take over" OWS, whereas, the fact is, the Democratic Party has been the grave yard of every single popular mass movement this nation has seen since the days of the Populists in the 1890s.

[-] -1 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

Why?

Is it not obvious they are the weakest link in our political system?

The fruit of their own lips:

"There is no global warming"

"Iraq has WMD"

"We should invade Georgia" [former soviet satellite]

"We will implement torture as a matter of state policy"

You examine the lies told by either party, and then you answer for me two questions:

Who has told the biggest lies, and is therefore ripest for plunder at our hands?

Who has, indeed, presented the greatest danger to the American People?

I am confident that there may be no end of the dirty laundry men like Carl with a K rove will cling as they attempt to salvage themselves while we hold them before the bright light of day.

I say it may even be entertaining to watch how many of them succumb to heart attack, or car accidents, as they turn on each other in a frantic effort to keep their collective ship afloat.

RedJazz - do not tell me you are afraid of change? Do not tell me you are

repelican

[-] 1 points by RedJazz43 (2757) 2 years ago

The Democratic Party is even more dangerous than the Republican Party because while (some) Democrats mouth the right slogans, as an institution it is as reactionary (or moreso than are the Republicans) especially because it has been such a trap for mass movements. Have you noticed that the American emplire still stretches around the world even with a Democratic Commander and Chief? Have you noticed that that Commander in Chief has American citizens assassinated and keeps whistle blowers in solitary confinment without a charge? Have you noticed how that President got more money from Wall Street than any Republican? Have you noticed how that President turns his back on the environmental crisis in the interest of Big Oil? Fuck the Democratic Party. It's going to kill our movement and lead the charge to real facism.

[-] -1 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

Would you attack the entire system as a whole? Or target its weakest points?

I support your right to advocate as you will - but consider - we can not know how much time is given us to accomplish what we will. Toward that end we must act with efficiency and deliberation.

Who can say which politicians may come groveling before us as they see plainly the lies crumble. Let them grovel, beneath whichever banner they hold. Then let us usher them gently off the public stage to a life lived in quiet desperation, secure in the knowledge the the whole world has witnessed their personal shame -

Think like the wolf - induce the herd to run, take down the weakest among them.

Act like the hunter - drive the herd into a dead end, saddle those that are fit, and scatter the rest to the wind . . . .

[-] 2 points by RedJazz43 (2757) 2 years ago

It will take years, perhaps decades to rebuild a real movement of opposition, much less be a serious threat to the status quo. In the mean time it is the Democratic Party, not the Republican Party that is the greatest threat to the survival and growth of our movement.

[-] -1 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

We disagree - I believe that movement of real opposition is here, today. I believe we saw it in the streets not just of New York, but all around the country.

You have a healthy skepticism of the system as a whole. That is good, it is necessary.

Aim for the weakness.

[-] 1 points by RedJazz43 (2757) 2 years ago

Perhaps. Before OWS the number of organized oppositionists in the US could be numbered optimistically in the 10s of thousands. Since OWS that number has leaped, optimistically, perhaps to the 100s of thousands, still a tiny, tiny minority and hardly a mass movement in a nation of nearly 300 million. I'm not talking about people who passively support OWS when polled. I'm talking about real activists, even part time activists, which is what it will take to change things. When we have 30 or 40 million people in the streets, then we can talk about a real movement of opposition, but even then that will only be the beginning, though perhaps the end of the beginning. The weakness of our movement is much more critical than the weakness of the system as at its strongest, still, at this point, our movement is much, much weaker than any weak link in the system. Even if successful at getting rid of a so-called weak link, all that would do at this point is make a reactionary system even more efficient. The real danger is our weakness and the greatest weakness of our movement is its succeptablity to being effectively captured by the Democratic Party.

[-] -1 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

It will be difficult to co-opt a movement without a leader.

And I can tell you from personal experience that even one person, standing alone, can effect change.

Consider Tienanmen Square. That movement was crushed - and yet symbols arose that will never be forgotten, and those symbols continue to prod those in power.

We live in a different social construct - one where we cannot be crushed in the same way. Only our own behavior has the power to stop us.

We will not let that happen. And as we highlight what has gone terribly wrong in our democracy, other people will be drawn to us - this is historic, and that in itself is attractive.

We have been lied to for a long time. Confronting those lies is irresistible.

We cannot help but to grow.

[-] 2 points by RedJazz43 (2757) 2 years ago

I agree that is is more difficult to co-opt a movement with not identifiable leadership. MoveOn is certainly having difficulty in that regard, try though they might. Difficult, but not impossible, which is my point. It is most important not to be complacent about historically what has happened to mass movements in the US or to simply assume that leaderlessness is a sufficient antidote. In a sense, after all, the Democratic Party is leaderless. By law it's not even a membership organization. I disagree with those opponents of the Democratic Party who tend to see it as some kind of European Leninist formation. It is really quite the opposite and its very amorphous character is precisely an important factor in what makes it so dangerous. A wolf in sheep's clothing. It's greatest danger is the fact that it looks so harmless superficially. One of the biggest lies we have been told is that the Democratic Party is the party of progress.

[-] 1 points by screwtheman (122) 2 years ago

Didn't your precious Obama promise to close Git-mo? Yet that still hasn't happened yet.

[-] 1 points by PandoraK (1678) 2 years ago

There have been attempts to close 'Git-mo', some of those people we can't just release, some are questionable as to intent, and some it seems no one wants.

There was a proposal for them to be moved to a facility in IL, IL didn't want it.

The above is just what I have read in various publications.

[-] 1 points by Mowat (164) 2 years ago

@OWSisawaste

Your are in Tel-Aviv?

[-] 0 points by shooz (17997) 2 years ago

True 8 months ago and still true today.

Throw them all out if you want, but start with these guys and their teabagge(R) and libe(R)tarian brethren.

[Removed]

[-] 0 points by slammersworldisback (-217) 2 years ago

Actually the idea of corporations deserving the same rights as people was first argued, and acknowledged in the decision of the SCOTUS in the case of, Santa Clara County v. Southern Pacific Railroad Company, 118 U.S. 394 (1886).....and that was under a Democratic House with a Democratic President (Grover Cleveland)

You might want to check the facts before you post nonsense....just sayin"

[-] 0 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

It's common knowledge that the dem party until the middle of the last century was infested with racists and former rebel scum

[-] 0 points by GirlFriday (17440) 2 years ago

Yes they do!!!

[-] 0 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

them fucking scumbags -

are they gonna pass the bill extending the tax break or not?

[-] 0 points by NonParticipant (151) 2 years ago

What is your suggestion for what should happen to 1/2 of the country? Go where? Death? Exile? Slavery? Please tell us what you would do with half of the citizens of the United States of America.

[-] 0 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

ahhh

re-eduation to bring them to the light of zen

. . . purge all those who resist . . .

[-] 0 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

hey ho!

hey ho!

[-] 0 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

Hey Ho!

[-] 0 points by bensdad (8977) 2 years ago

Of course the republican party has to go -
you do too - when you are full of sh_t

[-] -1 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

In that case prepare to get rid of me at least every other day.

Don't worry.

I'm used to it.

[-] 0 points by doctorlove (-10) 2 years ago

You are a bunch of liberal, jobless, loser hippie assholes who have no momentum. It was just proven all over the country in the last couple of weeks. First zucotti and now everywhere. Your plan to occupy, tent, spread disease, defecate in parks, do drugs, not work (welfare content) and destroy big government failed miserably. You fucking losers are broken and will Never be put back together. Go fudge pack and spread disease with all your liberal fucking queer buddies and wilt away.

[-] -1 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

we're gonna fudge pack alright. bend over.

[-] 0 points by GirlFriday (17440) 2 years ago

Hahahaha.

[-] 0 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

somehow I think dr.luv is enjoying the idea . . .

he's looking forward to a group party on his back side . . ..

<brr>

[-] 0 points by GirlFriday (17440) 2 years ago

Hmmmm.........that is an interesting visual and a very sad realization.

EWWW

[-] 0 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

ewww indeed.

to each their own I guess . . ..

I mean, I do try not to stand in judgment . .

[-] 0 points by GirlFriday (17440) 2 years ago

I don't either. I just thought that no amount of scrubbing would make me feel clean again.

[-] 0 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

LoL!

You may have a point.

<blechk>

[-] 1 points by GirlFriday (17440) 2 years ago

doctorlove just kind of sounds like one of those cheesy porn flicks of the 70's.

Bow chicka bow bow.

[-] 0 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

And that's another thing! Why can't we get a decent porn movie in America?

It's them dayum repelicans that's why! Always slappin' their women around! It aint right I tell ya.


I started calling him dr.strange after the movie with Dr. Strangelove - can't recall the title -

but it could easily relate to repelican porn

hehe

[-] 1 points by GirlFriday (17440) 2 years ago

Oooh. You had it! Dr. Strangelove or How I Learned How to Stop Worrying and Love the Bomb.

[-] 0 points by GirlFriday (17440) 2 years ago

yep.

[-] 0 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

. . . dr. strange . . ..

LoL

I think he left - haven't seen him in a while. Not that he's missed any . . .

[-] 0 points by GirlFriday (17440) 2 years ago

Yeah, lets not wake the beast.

[-] 2 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

it's true though - it's just a cyber identity - one that in this case actually reflects who I am and what I believe outside of cyberville, so while it may not fit the strict definition of sock puppet in some sense it isn't that far off.

Ah - of course - you meant DrStrange being mine never occurred to you. It is a strategy some people have used - I never have though. As we can see, there is hardly any need.

LoL!

I have to go visiting . . .

Merr-

um

bah humbug!

; )

[-] 0 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

Hey, he wasn't my puppet

ZenDog is the only puppet I got. ; )

[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (34870) from Coon Rapids, MN 2 years ago

I do like your Presidential platform.

And I'm not sure it's been awhile since I've seen the movie, but I think Dr. Strangelove was the title.

[-] 0 points by GirlFriday (17440) 2 years ago

The thought never entered my mind.

[-] 0 points by EndTheFed214 (113) 2 years ago

I say Ron Paul 12 because he can use the republican machine aginst them and at the same time help the country. it would also be cool if there was a 3rd party

[-] 0 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

I think it would be cool if there were no repelican party, and perhaps no party at all . . .

[-] 0 points by Carnegie (9) 2 years ago

Here's my refrain:

Hey Ho, Back to Mommy's basement OWS has got to go...

[-] 0 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

bwa hahahaha

[-] 0 points by fjolsvit (957) from Washington, DC 2 years ago

Now this is timely(sic) reporting:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ltP2t9nq9fI

An astounding video uncovered from the archives today shows the BBC reporting on the collapse of WTC Building 7 over twenty minutes before it fell at 5:20pm on the afternoon of more 9/11. The incredible footage shows BBC reporter Jane Standley talking about the collapse of the Salomon Brothers Building while it remains standing in the live shot behind her head. How did the BBC know that it was going to collapse? And why did they report the collapse when it is clearly standing in the background?

[Removed]

[-] 0 points by Idaltu (662) 2 years ago

Given the republican selection of candidates for President I suspect the party of Just Say No will disappear.

[-] 0 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

Their options for President are but floppy rag dolls to be shredded by public opinion.

It is Congress, the belief systems that support the red/blue polarity, the money trail of influence and corruption, the lies that may quickly be demonstrated as false; those interests that have been so instrumental in producing our economic collapse - this is where we should focus.

[-] 0 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

Some want to eliminate everything and start over.

Others propose a third - or even a fifth - party.

I think the most effective means is to eliminate the repelicans using the fruit of their own lips, and then let the people exert their will over what remains.

To say that both parties share equally is the same myth the media has been spreading for years. Guilty, yes. Equally so? Absolutely not.

[-] 0 points by metapolitik (1110) 2 years ago

I disagree.

Example:

Obama is a corporate whore and should not be trusted. With Goldman Sachs being his second largest campaign contributor and a complete lack of willingness to do what he promised, it's a fair bet that he's in Wall Street's pocket.

Politics in 'Amerika' has devolved into a red/blue shell game with Republicans playing 'good cop' and Democrats playing 'bad cop'. Both parties are owned and both parties will fuck you in the end.

Unless we all vote Green, Socialist or Communist... Democracy is dead.

[-] 0 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

I thought I saw a chart indicating that the President had received between 70 and 80 percent of his total contributions from average citizens contributing under $200.

Can you claim with certainty that contributions from Goldman and the like are not demonstrations of desperation - an attempt to influence both the man as well as the cynicism so prevalent among the voting public?

I see that in your case the tactic has been very successful.

z

[-] 1 points by metapolitik (1110) 2 years ago

Well I don't know what you've been reading but... You read wrong:

Barack Obama (D) Top Contributors

University of California $1,648,685

Goldman Sachs $1,013,091

Harvard University $878,164

Microsoft Corp $852,167

Google Inc $814,540

JPMorgan Chase & Co $808,799

Citigroup Inc $736,771

Time Warner $624,618

Sidley Austin LLP $600,298

Stanford University $595,716

National Amusements Inc $563,798

WilmerHale LLP $550,668

Columbia University $547,852

Skadden, Arps et al $543,539

UBS AG $532,674

IBM Corp $532,372

General Electric $529,855

US Government $513,308

Morgan Stanley $512,232

Latham & Watkins $503,295

http://www.opensecrets.org/pres08/contrib.php?cid=N00009638

[-] 1 points by metapolitik (1110) 2 years ago

As for asking me to "claim with certainty" the 'intent' of said contributions...

That's a ludicrous request.

They gave him the money and he took it.

Judging from the fact that he hasn't re-instated Habeus Corpus (and about a thousand other examples of in-action on Obama's part), it's become abundantly clear that his loyalties are not with the American people.

[-] -1 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

Off the top of my head the math here looks like it may account for about 16 million dollars?

Call it $20,000,000 just for the sake of it.

And how much did he collect in total?

Something near or above a half billion?

That looks like a lot of $200 contributions or less to me.

[-] 1 points by metapolitik (1110) 2 years ago

That's a bold claim to make without citing a link or some kind of supporting material. Also, it's total conjecture and 'guesstimation' on your part.

The point here is that his legislative policies reflect a disturbing degree of friendliness toward Wall St.

If he had gotten into office and done what he said he was going to do, we would not even be having this discussion.

[-] -1 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

You are correct it is - and I can't recall if the numbers I saw were from the last election or not - and I tend to think the only way to gauge it accurately is to look at the total to date - it seems fund raising is a constant activity in politics these days.

Matters affecting Wall Street are complex. We have seen for example, repelicans holding the entire U.S. economy hostage in favor of sweeping tax cuts. This year Congress has failed to reach budget agreement twice. The first time, back in August, saw job numbers dwindle in the six weeks running up to the deadline.

On both occasions, repelican brinkmanship resulted in market downturns.

On both occasions, repelicans vote against the will of the people - polls indicate a remarkable consistency among public opinion where over 70 percent support ending Bushite tax cuts.

They refuse.

It is impossible to say that there are not other methods imposed by the private sector that serve to hold our economy hostage, and thus exert influence over the President or Congress.

I would note, as just one example, the President did release oil from the strategic oil reserve - to the tune of some 30,000,000 barrels. Repelicans howled.

The effect was to chill market speculation on the future price of oil.

This was a direct slap at Wall Street.

z

[-] 1 points by metapolitik (1110) 2 years ago

Too little... Too late.

The Democratic Party is just going through the motions. They let the Republicans get away with anything they want and then occasionally do something vaguely progressive every once in awhile for the purposes of looking good.

Republicans and Democrats are both in-on the same collisions.

Don't let the occasional "slap at Wall Street" fool you. It's not effectual and it's not intended to be.

[-] -1 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

He doesn't write the laws. Congress does.

[-] 1 points by metapolitik (1110) 2 years ago

Non sequiter... Nice try.

[-] -1 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

It isn't illogical - it's true. He does not write the laws. Congress does. He only signs them. Failure to sign them antagonizes Congress - which can make other legislative priorities more difficult to pursue.

[-] 1 points by metapolitik (1110) 2 years ago

Who are you arguing with?

Also, have you never heard of an "executive order"?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Executive_order

[-] -1 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

silly boy

tricks are for kids!

; D


.

Since you seem to have gotten the last word - permit me this edit to my previous post.

You previously asked who I was arguing with - I wasn't arguing, I was stating, a combination of fact and my conclusions based on those facts. Your query came in responce to my assertion that indeed, what I had previously posted was not a non sequiter at all. Your reply was a lame attempt at obfuscation - which I did and do not mind since I have found it useful.

In reply to my humor you suggest perhaps I am mad, as if you would hold the DSM IV over my head.

newsflash

I am mad.

l even have paperwork . . . .

The whole world has gone mad, driven into madness by the madness that is M.A.D.

YES I am mad.

z

and yes, I have indeed heard of Presidential Signings . . . . A tactic the President has most recently begun to avail himself of . . .. unless I am mistaken I cited one such example above . . .

[-] 1 points by metapolitik (1110) 2 years ago

Apropos of what, exactly?

Also, I remember that stupid commercial and if I recall correctly, it wasn't a "boy", but a rabbit.

Are you schizophrenic or do you just have a short attention span?

[-] 0 points by w9illiam (97) 2 years ago

It is worth noting that in reality all our current politicians are misrepresenting their party. You see most if not all members of both parties are not actually in tune with the principals of those parties. The democrats are more like socialists and the republicans are more like democrats. This short documentary should help you better understand my reasoning. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m_boAGNPmNQ&list=LL6euVIYI9kllZfwTYZsAj7w&index=17&feature=plpp_video

[-] -2 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

People like you make me glad to know I'm on dial-up and can't you-tube.

I mean seriously - repelicans? More like dems?

Of the Civil War era maybe . . .

here:

-- Goodbye to All That: Reflections of a GOP Operative Who Left the Cult Saturday 3 September 2011 by: Mike Lofgren, Truthout | News Analysis http://www.truth-out.org/goodbye-all-reflections-gop-operative-who-left-cult/1314907779

z

[-] 1 points by metapolitik (1110) 2 years ago

Dialup!!!(?)

We're over a decade into the 21st Century!

I am an ex-pat living on a remote quasi-3rd-world island in the middle of nowhere and even I have high-speed.

Unless you're somewhere in the Klondike, you have no excuse for not being better connected.

[-] -1 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

It's called economics

[-] 1 points by metapolitik (1110) 2 years ago

Ah!

Well I would never fault a brother for having the misfortune of being broke.

Here's hoping your luck improves.

[-] -2 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

and what's the annual cost of high speed again?

$700 - $1200 and up? Is that right?

[-] 1 points by metapolitik (1110) 2 years ago

It depends on where you are, how many local providers there are and what rates they offer.

These days you can typically get a decent 'DSL' connection for $35-$45 a month. Less if you package it with your land-line or cable-TV.

I pay $40 a month ($480/yr)

Which might sound like a lot, until you consider that I don't have cable-TV, a cellphone, a Netflix account, a video-store membership, or any of the other crap that people typically spend money on. Nor do I own a car, buy gasoline, eat at restaurants, drink in bars, etc...

Of course - with high-speed internet - I don't need any of that stuff.

[-] -2 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

Fairpoint bought Verizon land lines and fucked up the phone network. We're on comcast, phone and cable tv - with the switch to digital it's the only way to get the news.

I estimate the whole bill is $20-30 overpriced, and does not include hi-speed internet, which would tack on another $40 . . . every single month.

[-] 1 points by metapolitik (1110) 2 years ago

Television is a cybernetic brainwashing tool.

There are only about 5 or 6 major media corporations that control almost everything that U.S. citizens see, hear and read.

Which is why almost all televised news is pro-corporate/pro-Wall-St. bias.

If you canceled your cable-TV and got high-speed internet instead, you would spend the same amount of money while gaining access to a MUCH higher quality of news with a much lower exposure to advertising and crap.

[-] -2 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

That may be true - but I think it useful to see what the mainstream is saying, they do reach a lot of people.

Sometimes I find opportunities to call them on their nonsense, and when successful I get to help change the media's contribution to the public dialog.

Here's an example of the effort - the results thus far are unclear:

-- The Occupy Movement and CBS News Coverage, N17 - Letter to 60 Minutes . . . . Nov. 18, 2011

http://occupywallst.org/forum/the-occupy-movement-and-cbs-news-coverage-n17-lett/

.

z

[-] 1 points by metapolitik (1110) 2 years ago

60 Minutes is available on the CBS website for free. Same goes for almost any "mainstream" news program.

[-] -2 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

If you read that open letter carefully you would discover that I had written to 60 Minutes in response to coverage from their regular newscast where Pelley is anchor.

This may seem confusing - but I have not found the email for the CBS anchor position, I assumed reaching his desk might be possible through his other position at CBS.

[-] 0 points by ComeTogetherNOW (650) 2 years ago

The republicans ultimately want to end Social Security. Total Abolishment. But they know Americans will push back hard, so now their new tactic is to gut it first. Let it bleed out. Then in it's death throes, finish it off.

The republicans cater to the rich and it's them they want to protect. The rich have bought the republican party, they got them in their hip pocket.

[-] -2 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

I believe what they are interested in is in ending regulation of corps. they are deregulationists. Social Security is just one apple, ripe for picking as they see it.

"Get that money in consumer hands and we'll soon have it!*

They don't bother to consider what happens next.

What really amazes me is how blatant it is. That I really don't understand. But their zombies have taken up the mantra there is no global warming - so.

[-] 0 points by ComeTogetherNOW (650) 2 years ago

Your right. When their method is always to obscure, ignore, and twist the truth it permeates everything.

The only problem is ignoring the truth is may not only hurt you, it can kill you.

Personally I have an overriding appreciation for the truth. I may not always like it but it's what I want in every detail of my life. My life is real, not a fantasy.

Good Post!

[-] -2 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

Ah, truth . . . I seemed to have been mildly overcome with little zen haikus on that topic yesterday, it was extremely frustrating since I was in the middle of working on my snow plow and discovered how truly intrusive and inconvenient daily life can be - especially since history is even now breaking out all around us. I'm afraid some of them have been lost, somewhere in the eddy and swirl of creativity that occasionally bursts like a gusher from the depths of my cranium . . .

May I?

.

Credibility

is only a matter of perception.

Truth

speaks for itself.

.

Seek what is true,

bind it to you

it is both sword and shield.

.

What greater gift can one man give

in a golden age of confusion

but that which is true . . .

.

This is true -

corruption exposed

will often expose more corruption

.

Bind truth upon truth,

it is a weapon;

it is the only true weapon.

.

See what is true

and speak with one voice;

it will dismay your opponents.

.

© D. Winter

February 2, 2008

© ZenDog

November 22, 2011

z

.

I've posted it elsewhere, no one seemed to notice. Perhaps you might appreciate it. If so, then that is all that matters.

[-] 0 points by airplaneradio (50) 2 years ago

Of course. That way we can have a one party system. Might as well have a dictator party.

[-] -2 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

If you are afraid then form your own party.

But a suggestion, if I may:

Lies are like quicksand -

ready to swallow those whole

who would preach to the masses

from the surface of those bottomless depths.

And so my suggestion:

As you form a new party, do not seek to stand upon the foundation of former lies, better it is to seek new ones, and hope against hope to go unnoticed by the rising tide of public opinion.

[Removed]

[Removed]

[-] 0 points by mandodod (144) 2 years ago

Look, the Republican party is needed! If we did not have them and only had a one party system with just the Dems, then we would have ultra gun control, open borders, a social government, and probably a dictator. We would be just like Europe. And then later, China but without all the stuff they make.

[-] -1 points by shooz (17997) 2 years ago

Huh????

[-] -2 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

It is my conviction that the people of the United States have no more need of the repelican party than they have need of one more lie.

And as for gun control, I'll be keeping mine, if that's alright with you.

And if not . . .

too bad.

[-] 0 points by MVSN (768) from Stockton, CA 2 years ago

Yep, here is the answer. One party rule! The Democrat Party are so different from the republicans that if they just had the chance we would have Utopia! Keep it up liberals! You'll save us yet!

[-] -2 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

They are different. And in fact we did have one party rule up until . . . 1820?

In any case, as I said just a few comments above:

by focusing on one party it has two principle advantages: It allows us to concentrate our attention; and two: as we generate heat, the pot will blow off steam, as in, generating attempts to deflect our attention by pointing out corruption seen on the other side of the aisle.

If we are truly effective, we may even see many on both right and left, where corruption is plainly evident, succumb to car accidents and heart attacks - some of which may be brought on simply due to natural causes and /or stress. By alleging otherwise, we can drive home a very sharp point of fear among the corrupt of either party.

I assume you do remember Ken Lay?

I would also point out that when a pack of wolves attacks a herd, they get it to run. Then the weak are singled out.

Repelicans are weak by virtue of the breadth and depth of their lies.

There is no global warming

Corporations are people too

Torture is acceptable American policy for detainees in our custody

WMDs

The list goes on

Full disclosure: sure, I'll vote for the President. And I'll vote for the current slate of representatives to Congress from Vermont. Vermont has some excellent representation. But there are many in the country who view Congress as a whole unfavorably. And they do so with good reason.

What I propose has every potential of exposing the prosecutorially corrupt from either party.

[-] -2 points by MVSN (768) from Stockton, CA 2 years ago

So you support one party rule. Okay. So how do you differ from a Nazi? They had one party rule too. I would use communism but I'm sure you would follow Stalin anywhere.

[-] 1 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

I did not say I necessarily support one party rule. I don't even know if utter destruction of the repelican party is to the advantage of the public. I have said, elsewhere, that that is not a current focus of mine.

I'm just sick of the lies.

[-] 0 points by iconoclast (27) 2 years ago

We need direct democracy to bypass the politicians, the banks and Wall Street. "When the government fears the people there is liberty. When the people fear the government there is tyranny."

The National Initiative empowers us to check and balance representatives, similar to ballot initiatives in 24 States, but at all levels from local to national and with major improvements. It gives us a "Plan B" whenever representatives don't represent us. Torture, perpetual wars and debt, domestic spying and bailouts for the rich do not represent us. People tried to get this power from Congress, both in 1907 and 1977, with no success. Rather than beg the existing 13 Legislatures to ratify the Constitution, the Founders had delegates of The People ratify the Constitution at the Constitutional Conventions. James Madison said "The people were in fact, the fountain of all power, and by resorting to them, all difficulties were got over." Please spread the word: http://vote.org/

[-] 0 points by Joyce (375) 2 years ago

God bless the GOP.

[-] 0 points by OWSisawaste (133) 2 years ago

Git mo holds prisoners of war and criminals that are trying to destroy the US....and corporations are made of people that made a business out of nothing and made them successful.....rePUBLICANs are not eveil....you people are just too senile to listen.

[-] -1 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

Git mo holds prisoners of war and criminals

And the underwear bomber demonstrates that terrorists can be tried in U.S. courts, and that terrorism is an appropriate subject of law enforcement - But I guess you haven't figured out yet that it is a much more efficient allocation of resources to combat terrorism with law enforcement than it is with M1 Abrams Tanks.

I would suggest that you step back, and reexamine the process of conflict, and the proper conduct of war. Perhaps you might begin at the beginning.

I would suggest

Sun Tzu . . .

[-] 1 points by OWSisawaste (133) 2 years ago

If one is at war then one must fight it as a war...using troops as "police" is not the way they they were intended to be used. Soldiers and Marines are made to combat enemies of the US and destroy them........that includes terrorists.

[-] -2 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

You are trapped by an old belief system and lack an understanding of the principles of asymmetrical warfare. You don't fight that on a particular field of battle - or rather, a large portion of that field begins in the mind.

Fortunately for America, there are those within defense who understand that.

[-] 1 points by OWSisawaste (133) 2 years ago

I understand warfare much better hat most....including you most likely..... and asymmetrical warfare works....and they are using it against us....we have to go in and show them that we are not pussy footing around and that we mean business

[-] -2 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

If you've fired a weapon in combat then that most certainly is experience I do not have.

But you can't use an F-16 to combat terrorists entrenched in a civilian population.

Sun Tzu makes that quite clear - and that in itself is an interesting fact, given that they did not even exist during his time.

[-] 1 points by OWSisawaste (133) 2 years ago

by using the F-16s or the tanks or the Marines on the ground then it will show the civilian population that we are there to destroy the terrorists....and that is what we should DO.....we are trying to nation build and fight at the same time.....that doesnt work.....neither does "negotiation" with them....

[-] -3 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

You can't win that way. Not unless your intent is to engage in genocide.

You really should read Sun Tzu - it's called The Art of War.

[-] 1 points by OWSisawaste (133) 2 years ago

It is not genocide....it was war....by fighting an enemy that that waged war on us is called WAR.....genocide is if we just carpet bombed the entire country..........people die in war that how it works

[-] 0 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

my point was that you cannot fight an insurgency with tanks. They may have limited use, but by and large you need to use other means.

my point was that you cannot bomb a civilian population into submission. Certainly not one that is already living in conditions that approximate those of the stone age.

[-] -1 points by KahnII (170) 2 years ago

What's so sad is that so many of you are too fucking stupid, dense and ideologically blinded to see that the Demorats have done the exact same shit that you blame the Republitards for.....

[-] -1 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

Actually, if you pay attention, you can discern quite a bit of difference between the parties. They are actually quite divided.

We can exploit those divisions that exist, and we can, with a bit of friction, create new ones.

[-] 0 points by KahnII (170) 2 years ago

They both spin different sides of the same issues only to do the bidding of the exact same masters so the end result is always tne same. As long as they keep the populace divided they win and maintain power.

[-] -2 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

Actually that's not true, though it may appear that way at times. There are many different hoops, and many different masters, and not everyone is leaping at the same time.

What this movement proposes to do, and has the distinct possibility of accomplishing, is in providing a brand new hoop, one all of Congress will jump through, thus making us the master - and in so doing, return our republic to the hands of the people.

[-] -1 points by KahnII (170) 2 years ago

Who is their ultimate master? A: Money

Who has the money? A: wall st bankers

2 parties, same master, just different dog and pony shows.

[-] -2 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

this is a grotesque over simplification of the legislative process.

Were you correct, this nation would still be embarked on a plan to base 50,000 U.S. troops in Bagdad for at least the next 50 years.

[-] 0 points by KahnII (170) 2 years ago

and 150 trillion + in debt.

It only seems oversimplified because the answer is really that easy.

[-] 0 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

No it isn't. Congress is made up of nearly 700 individuals, few of whom agree on anything. Some of them are surely bought and paid for, no doubt. Not all. And sometimes even the ones who are try and to the right thing - even if only to maintain appearances.

[-] -1 points by mandodod (144) 2 years ago

Will be hard to get rif of them. Half of the US is republican.

[-] 0 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

Actually it won't be hard at all. Once everyone realizes global warming is in fact real, and the repelican party has been consistently lying about it, to our harm, they will walk away in disgust.

[-] 0 points by mandodod (144) 2 years ago

Global warming is not real. Have you seen the new "Climategate"? It is all fake to start green jobs. Like Solyndra. Yup, that sure went well. Will be one of the many things that sink Obama and give credit to the GOP. More green new startups will fail soon. It is an American joke.

[-] -1 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

you ever heard of permafrost?

Your grandkids will only hear of it as a distant memory . . .

[-] 0 points by mandodod (144) 2 years ago

Rush, the leader of the GOP, says that it is fake.

[-] -1 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

Now there's a source!

BWA hahaha!

[-] 0 points by mandodod (144) 2 years ago

Come on, just having fun. But really, They call it "Greenland" for a reason! This all happened 600 years ago. And many times brefore that. Way before airplanes!

[-] -1 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

Unfortunately the rate of carbon emissions is rising faster than the IPCC predicted - many thought they were optimistic in their assessment.

If we can't get a handle on it the human species may not survive.

[-] 1 points by mandodod (144) 2 years ago

The porblem is not the US. We are doing a pretty good job . It is China and India that we have to worry about. Those places are just now getting the car in large numbers because of their new wealth. They are huge and have no rules. Have you heard about the huge underground fires in China? There is no way on earth to put them out!

[-] -1 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

We have to make an honest effort to do our own part.

We went to the moon. Surely with that kind of focus we can arrive at solutions - or perhaps I should say, we could have, since we should have begun 20 years ago . . . .

[-] 1 points by mandodod (144) 2 years ago

I think an honest effort on our part wil not help. China and India are huge! There will be billions of cars running there in just a few short years. They want to drive BMW and Porsche too!

[-] -1 points by MVSN (768) from Stockton, CA 2 years ago

I totally agree! With the democrats in charge as the one and only party of power this country will be just and caring.

[-] -1 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

Only if we make it so

or better yet - no party - election based on what you believe and are committed to, as opposed to party affiliation

no more red team, blue team and the dynamic of conflict

[-] -1 points by KahnII (170) 2 years ago

That's funny the democrat controlled congress authorized all the bail outs.....

[-] -2 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

Bush signed the first one. And it wasn't the bailouts that were the problem. It is everything that led up to them, and then the subsequent behavior of the banking industry re: their loans.

All they had to do was roll back the a.r.m. to its original interest rate, and most of the borrowers would have been able to make their payments.

It should have been a condition of the bailouts.

In anycase, the repelicans gave us the lie: there is no global warming

not to mention water boarding, indefinite detention, and the proposal to privatize social security.

They stand before the precipice, we will push them.

[-] 0 points by KahnII (170) 2 years ago

October 3, 2008 bush signed TARP. Last I checked the Demorats controlled BOTH the House and Senate. So the Demorats would have HAD to approve it before he had the change to sign it. DUH!

What kind of fucking moron takes out a ARM or interest only mortgage in the first place? Only the type of people who can't afford the house that they're living in if they had to make real mortgage payments do that crap. They're guilty of the same greed as the corporations, so fuck 'em, they get what they deserve.

BTW there is no global warming. Climate is dynamic, the earth heats up the earth cools down, it's been going on for eons. "Global warming" was made up to push a political agenda of more control over the people by government. (and heavily pushed by that disgusting hypocrite Al Bore so he can profit from it)

Waterboarding people who want to kill me? Fucking go for it! Douse them in water and hook a arch welder up to their nuts as far as I care.

indefinite detention? Bush and Obummer are just as guilty there.

[-] -1 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

Ya know, people like you almost make me wish we hadn't bailed the markets out. You know what I mean -

smart ass, supremely indifference, precisely because they have theirs, so fuck you

I'd like to waterboard your scumbag ass just because it'd be fun!

now get back to your brokerage thievery - you don't belong. Scat! Scram!

piss off

[-] 0 points by KahnII (170) 2 years ago

I don't live in a house that I can't afford, I live in 1/2 the amount of house that I can afford. (and it's not much but enough to be comfy) Why? It's b/c I give less then two shits about "Keeping up with the Jones." I don't put on a false front unlike the majority of people. You either like me or you don't, if you don' I don't give a fuck. Why? It's called being a real person, being frugal, taking care of your family and yourself and not giving the banks any more money than I have too, so fuck you if you were one of those dipshits that bought more house than you could afford by using a loan only a fucking idiot would sign on to and ended up bringing down my property value b/c you're greedy, self centered materialistic dumb fucking asshole.

Now days only a dumb shit would by a house that requires the income of BOTH people who live there to make the mortgage payment. I got laid off thanks to the corrupt and the criminal bankers, but we still have our house and do ok b/c my wife and I took into consideration that life is uncertain and didn't jump for the McMansion that we could have afforded with both of our incomes b/c we both knew that if something were to happen we'd be facing foreclosure.

[-] -1 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

I'm not one of those folks - but since you mention your own property value, consider this -

how would you feel if you knew that I wrote a loan to someone, whom I knew would not be able to meet the rest of the interest rate in five years, yet to their questions I had a ready smile and responses designed to mollify their nervousness - after all, I represent the banks interest, right? And I'm not gonna let the bank lose money? Right?

So at the end of the day, after ten or twenty signatures, I bundled all of these contracts with all of the other contracts my winning smile had generated, and sold them on the international market . . .

how would you feel about me then?

[-] 0 points by KahnII (170) 2 years ago

Then fuck you and the idiot who signed the loan they couldn't afford, they're BOTH the problem.

You don't get it, you're just as much of a problem as they are. Your participation enables them.

My mortgage is with he local credit union, unlike most of you I have actually seen the physical deed to my house. (attached to their lien)

[-] -1 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

it is my intent to be a part of the solution. not by standing around doing nothing in a state of paralysis inspired by the false state of conditioned helplessness.

I plan to do my part to change the way business is done, and to hold those who have engaged in fraud and corruption to account.

[-] 0 points by KahnII (170) 2 years ago

then buy a gun, the way things are headed you're gonna need it. Protesting in the street will just make you a target. Euro breakup is around the corner, and if you think 2008 was bad just wait.

[-] -1 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

I already have - more than one.

I also have lots of ammo - since the berry farm went in next door I haven't been target shooting out on the back lawn.

Hopefully it won't get that extreme, but you know. I'm ready for most anything.

[-] -1 points by MVSN (768) from Stockton, CA 2 years ago

And with your masters in the democrat sewer in charge all will become sweetness and light! God below you are a fool.

[-] 0 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

.

BWA hahaha

; D

[-] -1 points by Karl99 (63) 2 years ago

ZenDog you are estupido. Pelican party? At least the republicans don't have Pelosi, Obama , Maxine Waters on their team.

[-] -2 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

Yeah-ya.

that's RE-pelican party.

It isn't my fault if you cannot tell a hawk from a hand saw . . .

The repelican party is done. Not just because of Norquist Tax Pledges, or attempts to privatize social security - although that blatant attempt to place billions of tax payer dollars in the hands of speculation is no small marvel in and of itself -

Global warming is here - and it has been and is still a subject of deep denial among the party faithful - yet the evidence is outside every window pane in America - it becomes clearer with each passing day.

A natural process is at work - the repelicans have sown the seeds of their own demise.

It is simply my intent to fan the flames of public discontent such that this most natural and just process is hastened to whatever degree possible.

I think you will find once the people realize the depths of the lies they have been sold, there can be no other possible outcome.

By-by, reeeepelicans . .. .

[-] 0 points by Karl99 (63) 2 years ago

O....K.....you are not estupido, you are mentally unhinged . Please get some help.

[-] -2 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

I see you've been stuck too long in your cave. You should step outside, and stick your nose in the wind . . .

Karl with a K . . .

[-] 0 points by Karl99 (63) 2 years ago

In reference to your above response, i dare not use my nose for anything near an occupy person, the stench. Glad you recognized the first letter of my name, and have gotten some help. That's a good 1st step back to reality!

[-] -1 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

carl with ah k . . .

[-] -1 points by seaglass (671) from Brigantine, NJ 2 years ago

I call them the RETARDICAN Party.

[-] 0 points by ComeTogetherNOW (650) 2 years ago

Repugnant sticks on them very well.

[-] -1 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

It does not matter what we call them - so long as we hold them up as an object of shame and ridicule.

Any term that serves that end will most certainly do.

[-] -1 points by pinker (586) 2 years ago

Re-pelican - I thought that was what we were trying to make happen along the Gulf of Mexico after the BP oil spill. Why you hatin' on pelicans?

[-] -2 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

I don't hate pelicans. I love pelicans. They are in their own way, a majestic bird.

Not so with REpelicans. They are odious, consummate liars and thieves.

Because of their lies they are weak, and ripe for plunder. We will reach up, and tear their fruit from the vine, and crush it beneath the heel of public opinion, and we will do so upon the national stage, that they may reap the full measure of shame and disgrace.

Carl with a K Rove has been mic-checked.

Michele Bachman has been mic-checked.

Pinpricks in the edifice of lies that have been erected. We have only just begun.

[-] 0 points by MVSN (768) from Stockton, CA 2 years ago

But the democrat party are the party of sweetness and light!

[-] -1 points by brettdecker (68) 2 years ago

You should probably refrain from posting as you suck at it completely.

[-] -1 points by Rico (3027) 2 years ago

Yes, We don't need people taking us back to the days of the Pelican ;o)

On the other hand, what has Obama done for us ? He bailed out the auto companies, failed to close Guantanamo Bay, only pulled us from Iraq because the Iraqis boot us out, send us into Libya, has not passed immigration reform, passed a health care bill so flawed it's now in the Supreme Court, and accepts tons of money from the bankers and lawyers ( see http://www.opensecrets.org/pres08/bundlers.php?id=N00009638 ). He and the Democrats had COMPLETE control over the government for his first two years... what did we GET ?

I don't see anyone BETTER than Obama, but I'll be damned if I'm going to vote for him AGAIN. If nothing else, we need these politicians to know that we DO notice when they break their promises !

[-] 1 points by dantes443322 (148) 2 years ago

Don't forget the deaths of Federal agents and an untold number of Mexicans.

[-] -1 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

I support your right to cast your vote how you like.

My perception is that much of what you have said stems from repelican solidarity, and weakness of the left in standing up to them. Many of the dems who were in Congress in 2009 were afraid of losing their seats and so party unity was never achieved - hence the lack of success while they were in control.

And as it happened, their fears were apparently justified.

[-] 2 points by Rico (3027) 2 years ago

You take an odd stance in defending the Democratic majority we elected by saying their inaction is acceptable given their fears for their own reelection. We didn't ELECT them so they could get reelected, we elected them to CHANGE things. They didn't.

[-] -1 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

I did not say it was acceptable. I'm simply attempting to understand what happened.

And what I believe has been happening is that the weight of repelican corruption has been dragging the entire political, economic, justice, systems into a deep dark pit.

[-] 2 points by Rico (3027) 2 years ago

Well, all I can say is that's pretty darned partisan of you. BOTH parties have got us into this mess. You DO know, for example, the repeal of the Glass-Steagall limitations on the formation of super-banks was signed by President Clinton, right ? See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gramm–Leach–Bliley_Act .

Blind allegiance to ANY party is, well, BLIND. People need to open their EYES.

[-] 0 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

I understand that - I also understand that Clinton was under tremendous pressure from K-Star. I would also point out that the signing process was simply the last step. Had he not signed it, he would have been opposing the will of Congress.

Further - by focusing on one party it has two principle advantages: It allows us to concentrate our attention; and two: as we generate heat, the pot will blow off steam, as in, generating attempts to deflect our attention by pointing out corruption seen on the other side of the aisle.

If we are truly effective, we may even see many on both right and left, where corruption is plainly evident, succumb to car accidents and heart attacks - some of which may be brought on simply due to natural causes and /or stress. By alleging otherwise, we can drive home a very sharp point of fear among the corrupt of either party.

I assume you do remember Ken Lay?

I would also point out that when a pack of wolves attacks a herd, they get it to run. Then the weak are singled out.

Repelicans are weak by virtue of the breadth and depth of their lies.

There is no global warming

Corporations are people too

Torture is acceptable American policy for detainees in our custody

WMDs

The list goes on

[-] 1 points by Rico (3027) 2 years ago

Just a clarification on "Corporations are people too." Justice Stevens, who read a scathing 90 page dissent in the Citizens United v. Federal Election Commission case acknowledged that “we have long since held that corporations are covered by the First Amendment.” (reference http://www.nytimes.com/2010/01/22/us/politics/22scotus.html ).

The Citizens United case is not the origin of the "corporations are people" argument.

[-] 1 points by PandoraK (1678) 2 years ago

Nope but it sure confirmed it (legally speaking)

[-] -1 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

Thanks for the clarification. Regardless of its origins, repelicans have been most vocal on this issue today. It is one issue that serves to illustrate in stark detail the vast differences in party ideology.

[-] 2 points by Rico (3027) 2 years ago

Me, I'm torn. I don't LIKE the outcome, but the fact is we DO let corporations talk all day about candidates. Consider Fox and MSNBC for example. Why can THEY editorialize but not some other corporation ? I wish we could get rid of ALL of it, but I have no idea how we would do that and still provide "equal protection under the law."

I suspect many share my feeling that NEITHER party offers and acceptable solution. Unfortunately, when we vote for a third party, we typically only ensure the success of whatever party is closer to our beliefs. For OWS, that would be the Democrats, but they haven't delivered. I suspect many will stay home.

My worst case scenario is that people vote for the RonPaul/Ayn Rand party. It hurts my head to even think about it.

[Removed]

[-] -2 points by shooz (17997) 2 years ago

Sounds like republican pablum to me.

[-] 2 points by Rico (3027) 2 years ago

BOTH parties have got us into this mess. You DO know, for example, the repeal of the Glass-Steagall limitations on the formation of super-banks was signed by President Clinton, right ? See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gramm–Leach–Bliley_Act .

Blind allegiance to ANY party is, well, BLIND. People need to open their EYES.

[-] 0 points by shooz (17997) 2 years ago

It's the libertarian infection.

All those policies passed by Clinton are neoliberal.

The infection is much worse in the republican party.

It's why they won't let the Dems change anything.

Throw 'em all out, but start with the republicans. Teabaggers first!

[-] -2 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

Twitter Buttons!!

< ~~~~ on the left!

[-] 2 points by hchc (3297) from Tampa, FL 2 years ago

Glad to see you're still a blind partisan hack....

OWS is still the same- if you are a pro Obama/Romney troll, take your shit to your local campaign office.

[-] -1 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

no blindness here - repelicans have been lying about global warming for years. They should check out in the parking lot. It's here.

I'm sure that can only mean they are toast . .

[-] 0 points by DKAtoday (34870) from Coon Rapids, MN 2 years ago

Yep - what ever post you are on - if you feel it is worthy to share out - now you can twitter it direct.

OH & no more collapsing of comments by down voting.

[-] -2 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

hey ho!

Hey Ho!!

[-] -2 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

Hey hey

Ho Ho!

Hahaha!

[-] -2 points by dantes443322 (148) 2 years ago

Hey Hey Ho Ho The Repelican Party has Got To Go!

They asked me if I wanted a job and I shouted Hell NO!

Hey Hey Ho Ho The Repelican Party has Got To Go!

Even though he is a failure I'm still voting for 'O'

Hey Hey Ho Ho The Repelican Party has Got To Go!

I want a President that doesn't care about doing blow

[-] -2 points by ZenDog (13676) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

You're getting it.

End the War on Drugs!

HeyHey Ho Ho!

The Repelican Party has Got To Go!