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No War, Not Now, Not Ever

Posted 5 years ago on Aug. 31, 2013, 1:14 p.m. EST by OccupyWallSt
Tags: obama, syria, assad, war

The “No War With Syria” movement denounces the complete disregard of the government of the United States for the will of the American people as reflected in the government's decision to start yet another war. The movement in no way support the actions of the Assad regime, but we recognize that US intervention will instigate more violence and suffering in Syria. As the U.S. is already hurting from a recession and perpetual wars, becoming involved in Syria will only create further destabilization in the Middle East and strip the people of the United States of desperately needed resources. The “No War With Syria” movement recognizes that the only the American people can stop U.S. intrusion in the Middle East, just as only the people of the Middle East can stop their own internal struggles.

We call on everyone to join us in saying no to yet another U.S. invasion. We recognize that peace cannot be reached through bombs, drone attacks, and murder; peace is created through compassion and forgiveness, which must come from within. Please join us as we gather across the country to begin a campaign to stop the United States government from invading Syria.

146 Comments

146 Comments


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[-] 10 points by Nevada1 (5843) 5 years ago

Thank You OWS. Big success in Parliament------We must do the same in Congress.

[-] 5 points by shadz66 (19985) 5 years ago

''Is Attacking Syria Necessary For US National Security ?'', by Glenn Greenwald :

fiat lux ...

[Removed]

[-] 2 points by MattLHolck (16833) from San Diego, CA 5 years ago

make sure you don't kill his grand daughter by collateral like we did with Gaddafi

[-] 0 points by DKAtoday (33638) from Coon Rapids, MN 5 years ago

Gawd - poor thing - I hope she looks like her mom..........just sayin....

[-] 1 points by MattLHolck (16833) from San Diego, CA 5 years ago

Terms

Obama's posterior coverage: Congressional approval for Syria strike

Read more: http://communities.washingtontimes.com/neighborhood/emea-watch/2013/aug/31/obama-will-seek-input-congress-going-war-syria/#ixzz2dg3cKdiO Follow us: @wtcommunities on Twitter

There is not much faith in congress

they voted near anonymously, I mean unanimously for the iraq war

One Tin Soldier - The Legend of Billy Jack

[-] 5 points by DKAtoday (33638) from Coon Rapids, MN 5 years ago

TWEET

DKAtoday ‏@DKAtoday

NoWarWithSyria see also http://democracyforamerica.com/pages/857-dfa-membership-survey-syria?akid=3863.2041858._mFx6n&rd=1&source=ND2&t=1

Wage Peace

Don't perpetuate war

Consider

Share

re-tweet

sound off 4 Peace

[-] 3 points by Narley (272) 5 years ago

Peace is the only way. We must stop the war mongers this time. I have called and emailed my congressman. This is surreal, how can anyone think attacking Syria will turn out good.

[-] 1 points by TropicalDepression (-45) 5 years ago

The same way they thought the last 7 nations... out of sight, out of mind.

[-] 4 points by shadz66 (19985) 5 years ago

For a fictional exposition of the facts to follow your interesting aside, please consider :

Where are we at ?!!! How'd we get here ?!! Why is more war considered a good thing ?!

et cui bono ?

[-] 0 points by 99nproud (2697) 4 years ago

The language of PEACE should be adopted when interacting on the issues of war around the world (Syria, middle east, Ukraine, etc )

We can not resolve war by joining in the verbal violence that currently dominates international dialogue.

We can identify the war mongers/verbal violence purveyors, but should focus our energies on pushing PEACE.

Cease fires, Diplomacy, Negotiation, compromise, international tribunals, disarmament,

These elements of de-escalation should be reflected in our conversation.

The Occupy movement certainly illustrates the power of simply changing the dialogue of an issue.

"All we are sayin' is Give PEACE a Chance"

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jGJqck5y91o

[-] -1 points by buliau (-29) 5 years ago

I don't care for Tweets, but I'll be sharing this at the next protest on September 17th. We need to fight this Obamination of a war idea.

[-] 3 points by beautifulworld (22956) 5 years ago

"We recognize that peace cannot be reached through bombs, drone attacks, and murder; peace is created through compassion and forgiveness, which must come from within."

That pretty much says it all. Thank you.

[-] 3 points by shadz66 (19985) 5 years ago

'Who Are You To Decide That You Will Launch A War ?" - George Galloway in UK Parliament :

fiat pax ...

[-] 4 points by beautifulworld (22956) 5 years ago

"...The question is are they mad enough to do it? To launch a chemical weapons attack in Damascus on the very day that a UN chemical weapons inspection team arrives in Damascus must be a new definition of madness."

Thank you George Galloway. Truth there. See 2:03 of the video.

[-] 3 points by shadz66 (19985) 5 years ago

Yep, can't get enough of George and his passionate advocacy for fairness and peace & also fyi :

fiat lux ...

[-] 5 points by beautifulworld (22956) 5 years ago

47% of taxpayer money goes to the military, past and present. Interesting. They need a lot of belligerence to justify that. Thanks for the pie chart.

[-] 3 points by shadz66 (19985) 5 years ago

Turns out that its 57% of discretionary spending, as per some charts and stats you appended on another thread and I reply (as I may have there, lol) with this short but really very arresting video :

fiat pax ...

[-] 3 points by beautifulworld (22956) 5 years ago

A great history lesson in 9 minutes. Well worth watching, thanks.

What stands out to me is that the military pays for 234 golf courses with our money. Freaking outrageous! Pretty much says it all.

[-] 3 points by shadz66 (19985) 5 years ago

Wars wouldn't happen if Banksters didn't see profit and/or Imperialists and Oligarchs didn't see and salivate at the prospect of ever more power and resources & ergo, as a humorous aside, I append :

verum ex absurdo ...

[-] 4 points by beautifulworld (22956) 5 years ago

I like the "Dance Break." LOL. Now, if only we could get more Americans to sing those sentiments. Class struggle seems to be more embedded in the UK and Europe in general, but we Americans are slowly awakening.

[-] 3 points by shadz66 (19985) 5 years ago

Americans are taught to forget their past of collective organisation and struggle by The Corporate MSM & (mis)education system even as Modern High-Finance ; Low Ethics Crapitalism (ie. Modern Corporate Banksterism / 'Hoover-Up Kaputalism' ) is so clearly seen as a busted flush and any honest person, in possession of the most rudimentary ethical compass can clearly see that. Solidarity and here's hoping that Americans can reconnect with their own history :

respice, adspice, prospice ...

[-] 4 points by beautifulworld (22956) 5 years ago

This is why I was so happy when OWS first took off. It was simply amazing to see Americans begin to wake up to class consciousness. I never thought it would happen in my lifetime.

[-] 4 points by shadz66 (19985) 5 years ago

mmmPHATic ditto et dum spiro spero ...

The Revolution Continues Worldwide ..

pax et lux ; nunc et semper ... .. .

[-] 4 points by beautifulworld (22956) 5 years ago

Hey, yeah, this is a revolutionary movement, lest we forget. That means big change, a new system altogether.

Do you know this one? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eHwcPgQ-q6o

[-] 4 points by shadz66 (19985) 5 years ago

Very nice tune indeed & yes bw I do & so mS2u ~

bonne nuit ..

[-] 4 points by beautifulworld (22956) 5 years ago

:) Sweet. Mine to you, too. 'Night.

[-] 2 points by LeoYo (5909) 5 years ago

Chris Hedges on Obama's Decision to Attack Syria and "Give Congress a Voice"

Sunday, 01 September 2013 13:28 By Paul Jay, The Real News Network | Video Interview

http://truth-out.org/news/item/18533-chris-hedges-on-obama-decision-to-attack-syria-and-give-congress-a-voice


The Lie of "Limited War" in Syria

Monday, 02 September 2013 14:36 By Shamus Cooke, The Workers Action | Op-Ed

http://truth-out.org/opinion/item/18548-the-lie-of-limited-war-in-syria


Possible Consequences of a US military attack on Syria—Remembering the Marine Barracks destruction in Beirut, 1983

Monday, 02 September 2013 14:47 By Ann Wright, War Is a Crime | News Analysis

http://truth-out.org/news/item/18549-possible-consequences-of-a-us-military-attack-on-syria-remembering-the-marine-barracks-destruction-in-beirut-1983


The "Honest Broker" is Crooked

Monday, 02 September 2013 09:50 By Noam Chomsky, Truthout | News Analysis

http://truth-out.org/news/item/18535-the-honest-broker-is-crooked

[-] 2 points by Phanya2011 (908) from Tucson, AZ 5 years ago

Photography by hamde abu rahma - Kerry showed a picture implying the rows and rows of shrouded bodies over which a boy is skipping (I don't know how to post it from Facebook) when in fact it had nothing to do with it. .

IMPORTANT TO KNOW ! So, Secretary of State John Kerry referenced this photograph when making his speech today, trying to drive home how awful the Syrian chemical attack was as he tried to convince us why we should go to war. One problem. The picture isn't even from Syria. It's from Iraq in 2003. The photographer, Marco di Lauro, said he nearly "fell off his chair" when he saw it was being used to promote a war in Syria. It's getting pretty disturbing to see how far our politicians, both Republican and Democrat, are willing to go to drum up support for a war nobody wants.

[-] 2 points by MattLHolck (16833) from San Diego, CA 5 years ago

I didn't join the navy to drop bombs on Iraq #NoWarWithSyria

[-] -2 points by IceAge (-1) 5 years ago

Did you join to work on your suntan?

[-] 2 points by MattLHolck (16833) from San Diego, CA 5 years ago

lasers are done in the dark

[-] 2 points by MattLHolck (16833) from San Diego, CA 5 years ago

I don't believe the circumstance suggest the chemical attack by the government. The US is just trying to make excuses to kill with bombs. The US has lied in the recent past to invade Iraq The US has no credibility and will further damage that by destroying more countries and lives

the president sounds like a rules layer looking for an excuse

further, I find the US of bombs no different than chemical attacks

dead is dead

mass destruct is mass destruction

[-] 2 points by GirlFriday (17435) 5 years ago

Yep.

[-] 2 points by DKAtoday (33638) from Coon Rapids, MN 5 years ago

Tweet

DKAtoday ‏@DKAtoday

No War, Not Now, Not Ever | http://OccupyWallSt.org : http://occupywallst.org/article/no-war-not-now-not-ever/#.UiInMS69ueo.twitter

Campaign to wage peace instead.

Pls

Consider

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[-] 1 points by 99nproud (2697) 4 years ago

Diplomacy, Cease fire, negotiations, compromise.

Path to Peace

[-] 1 points by Garibaldi (0) 5 years ago

Our congress no longer represents the American people. They instead represent oil barons seeking to take advantage of Syrian oil fields which we will no doubt be made custodians of once we have completely reduced the Syrian nation to rubble. It belongs to the death peddlers like Lockheed Marin who will no doubt generously arm the forces of death we send to Syria. These individuals fund the campaigns of men such as Robert Mendez who today granted his support for Iraq 2.0. If Congress is not shown that there will be consequences for such abject betrayal of the people they are meant to support, then it will be the voices of death peddlers and oil kings that are heard over the cries of parents not wishing to see their children shipped off to their deaths. Our cause has found success in Britain and can find success in the Nation which originated it.

[-] 1 points by Revolutionary (311) 5 years ago

USA resorts to war because it has been emboldened by the selfishness of Pakistan who lack humane values and who use second hand intelligence which lacks subjectiveness but possesses only objectivity/superficiality.

[-] 1 points by IndigoRed (87) 5 years ago

Everyone, I will not compel you into making a decision, but I come to you simply with evidence of what I am about to say: This potential war with Syria is a precursor - following the war with Iraq - for plans of a conspiracy designed and driven by the money masters of the western world, AKA the oligarchs of the New World Order. These human beings have so much wealth that they are able to place themselves outside of human life and experience that the rest of us are so accustomed to that they live as if they are in another dimension - comparable to gods looming over entire civilizations from the skies. All human events around the world are a constant stream of events (imagine never dreaming, hoping or thinking of another world/life - all physical human actions are confined to a bubble limited by the size of the planet that began ages ago and plays out analogous to a chemical reaction, the outcome of which is predictable) planned for, predicted by, and due to these elites, like the Iraq war. If America goes to war with Syria or is responsible for the destruction of its current government, these masterminds will be one step closer to having their one world government and this will cause suffering for the majority of mankind on a scale only comparable to the world wars. I present video evidence of what I speak of and simply state that if we show sympathy to the Syrian people like the elite expect of us and go to war, we will have fallen into their trap and allow ourselves to be one step closer to this new form of slavery: a slave of the global elite. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yB17j0a-R34

The most sure-fire way to have an enduring and convincing effect on your congressional representative is to have prophetic abilities and I will instruct you how. You must first understand that what is unraveling in the middle east is not about Syria but a broader strategy for eliminating threats that could potentially oppose the western powers around the world. Syria is just a stepping stone - more is yet to come and soon it will seem as if the entire middle east has exploded into war.

Here is your script for what to tell your representative: The United States will shortly go to war with Libya if it goes to war with Syria. As a taxpaying U.S. citizen, I do not give permission for my tax dollars to be used to fund a war with Libya. You will not have my vote in the next congressional elections if you allow my tax dollars to fund a war with Libya. Represent me as my elected congressman/woman of the state of insert your state here in the congressional vote to use my tax dollars for military intervention outside of American territory.

Spread it around, folks, godspeed.

[-] -1 points by zacharilogan (-54) 5 years ago

All human events around the world are a constant stream of events (imagine never dreaming, hoping or thinking of another world/life - all physical human actions are confined to a bubble limited by the size of the planet that began ages ago and plays out analogous to a chemical reaction, the outcome of which is predictable) planned for, predicted by, and due to these elites, like the Iraq war.

If these so called elites have been in control since the beginning of humanity, they are not very effective. It's taking them quite a long time to achieve their nefarious dream of a one world government.

Here is your script for what to tell your representative...

If you believe a secret shadowy force nicknamed the elite is plotting to take over the world, why would you trust a representative. Better you adopt Occupy's principle of anarchy. The people have the power to change the world by themselves. No need for representatives. They are all corrupted by your so-called elites.

[-] 1 points by IndigoRed (87) 5 years ago

It is the most efficient way to cause change without resorting to destruction. Societies of human beings need order, and thousands of years of experimentation with developing systems to create order among men has shown that our way of representational government creates the most stable and therefore prosperous civilizations in history. Anarchy solves nothing and leads to the decay of nations then provinces/states, then cities, then communities and finally on an individual level. It is corrosive to the human mind and spirit to live without order.

These representatives still think like you and me at some level though, even if their livelihoods are dependent on these elites. Trust in the system. Trust in mankind. We are destined for a greater future - all of us, together.

[Removed]

[-] 1 points by IndigoRed (87) 5 years ago

And I disagree that a 'world' with one country would have no competition. If you remember your reading of US history from your high school text books, the United States was an isolationist country up until WW1 and it thrived during the industrial age simply with intranational business and industry.

[-] 1 points by IndigoRed (87) 5 years ago

We must trust the system that is known to all and in writing (the constitution) and is not clandestine, secretive or manipulate using covet means. You're mincing words and not understanding that these elites act outside of any laws or influence: they are the ones who influence, using their vast wealth obtained through their royal families for centuries. They do not have control of the system but influence it and have incredible influential power.

If you're confused that political power is just as great as monetary power, understand that when entire countries (Iraq, Afghanistan, Syria, Iran, the French Empire, England, etc.) fall or their governments fall, the people AND THEREFORE businesses lose confidence in the place they live and investments, bank savings, stocks, contracts and every business transaction that relies on trust go up in the wind.

I don't know what the elites want with a one world government but I'm certain they realize it will make hundreds of millions homeless and suffer. Perhaps they are planning to systematically depopulate the Earth by starving out the masses so they may have a larger share of this beautiful, blue planet we live on. I understand the importance of competition but I'm not talking about capitalism here, I'm talking about secretive elite groups seeking to overthrow governments in the middle east as the next step to their plans for a one world government. I'm not even sure these people think about international trade anymore.

OH and could you tell me what it is that they do exactly? I've known of their existence for years now and still have no idea what the extremely wealthy do. I'd love to know. Please enlighten everyone reading this conversation.

[-] 1 points by itsmyblood (10) 5 years ago

NO MORE WAR!

Eddie Vedder - No More http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qqPzS8Y27Ks

[-] 5 points by shadz66 (19985) 5 years ago

''Who Blocked Syrian Peace Talks ?'', by Robert Parry :

''The War on Iran Begins In Syria'', by Eric Draitser :

''The Broader Stakes of Syrian Crisis'', by Ray McGovern :

''U.S. Neocon Hawks Take Flight Over Syria'', by Jim Lobe :

''The Real Target of These Attacks is Not Syria'', by Robert Fisk :

Finally, please consider : ''What is the West’s real agenda ? This is the unasked and unanswered question. Clearly, the US, UK, and French governments, which have displayed continuously their support for dictatorial regimes that serve their purposes, are not the least disturbed by dictatorships. They brand Assad a dictator as a means of demonizing him for the ill-informed Western masses. But Washington, UK, and France support any number of dictatorial regimes, such as the ones in Bahrain, Saudi Arabia, and now the military dictatorship in Egypt that is ruthlessly killing Egyptians without any Western government speaking of invading Egypt for “killing its own people.” from :

Btw, re. your link above, I always dug 'Pearl Jam' & it beats the ass off Mylie's 'twerking' so thanx & fyi :

e tenebris, lux ...

[-] 1 points by ImNotMe (1488) 5 months ago

''Showing They Learned Nothing From Iraq, Corporate Media Help Beat War Drums for Trump Attack on Syria'', by Jake Johnson:

fiat lux et pax ...

[-] 2 points by beautifulworld (22956) 5 months ago

All the Syrian refugees left to rot by the USA, UK & France. Let's not forget them. It's total hypocrisy for these governments to claim they care about the Syrian people.

They make that claim purely for the benefit of the Military Industrial Complex and War "Mission Accomplished" to line their pockets with money.

I'm waiting for the "Humanity Mission." I guess I'll be waiting a while.

https://www.npr.org/sections/parallels/2018/04/12/602022877/the-u-s-has-welcomed-only-11-syrian-refugees-this-year

Here's how much the UK gov't cares about Syrian children:

https://www.npr.org/sections/parallels/2018/04/12/602022877/the-u-s-has-welcomed-only-11-syrian-refugees-this-year

[-] 1 points by ImNotMe (1488) 5 months ago

USA took in ELEVEN Syrian refugees in 2018 but claims that it gives a shit about Syrian casualties in a war that it has fueled & financed!!! F/UK/US' 1% do not give a flying fk about Syria's people, as it is ALL about Regime Change and Hydrocarbons & Hegemony!! Have U any idea, what your other respondent is on about?! Maybe U could ask him what Russia and China did to reduce Syria to rubble, and why he wears U$A's Oligarchy's ass as a hat? Maybe he should consider some/all of this...

fiat lux ...

[-] 1 points by beautifulworld (22956) 5 months ago

"How the US fuelled the rise of Isis in Syria and Iraq"

by Seamus Milne, The Guardian

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2015/jun/03/us-isis-syria-iraq

"The sectarian terror group won’t be defeated by the western states that incubated it in the first place"

Hmmmm. "On Monday the trial in London of a Swedish man, Bherlin Gildo, accused of terrorism in Syria, collapsed after it became clear British intelligence had been arming the same rebel groups the defendant was charged with supporting."

"US and western policy in the conflagration that is now the Middle East is in the classic mould of imperial divide-and-rule. American forces bomb one set of rebels while backing another in Syria, and mount what are effectively joint military operations with Iran against Isis in Iraq while supporting Saudi Arabia’s military campaign against Iranian-backed Houthi forces in Yemen. However confused US policy may often be, a weak, partitioned Iraq and Syria fit such an approach perfectly.

What’s clear is that Isis and its monstrosities won’t be defeated by the same powers that brought it to Iraq and Syria in the first place, or whose open and covert war-making has fostered it in the years since. Endless western military interventions in the Middle East have brought only destruction and division. It’s the people of the region who can cure this disease – not those who incubated the virus."

[-] 1 points by ImNotMe (1488) 5 months ago

Prof. Jeffrey D. Sachs on Syria ...

Above is a rare moment of truth on TV & thanx for that excellent excerpt from that Seamus Milne article.

Nearly three years old & so predictive of what has happened in Syria. U can see why Seamus is one of

Jeremy Corbyn's closest advisers. Syria is not a ''mistake or misjudgment'', it's a total F/UK/US CRIME!

Note that your other interlocutor here, has failed to respond to the same vid.in reply to his screed below.

veritas vos liberabit ...

[-] -1 points by grapes (5184) 5 months ago

Rus China's attitude regarding refugees was: http://www.newsweek.com/china-will-not-accept-syria-refugees-return-home-629499

How many Syrian refugees did Rus China accept? Guess.

Normally, the U.S. takes in many refugees year after year but just look at what we've gotten in our White House now. I don't know whether Rustia has cracked our 2016 Election because Mueller's investigation continues. However, Cambridge Analytica certainly had a hand in helping to put the bullshit there. I think that Rustia somehow funded Cambridge Analytica. The way our bullshit bends to favor Rustia undercutting his far more professional staffers is a very strong indication that Rustia probably holds a leash on the bullshit. Hillary would probably have admitted more refugees into the U.S. than bullshit because she had proposed a no-fly zone in northern Syria. However, Rustia's airforce was already there. Having U.S. fighter jets there bossing around in the sky could easily provoke a dogfight with the Rustian aircraft. It seems that clashes between the U.S. and Rustia are unavoidable in Syria because they are allied on opposing sides there.

I cheered when Pootin went into Syria bigtime and gave him the title "Pootin the Great." All he had done since then was wreaking havoc and creating human waves of misery sloshing towards Europe. ( Why not Africa, Rustia, or Rus China? Isn't it obvious? ) I understood gradually that he and Assad were aerial-bombing the Syrian civilians to turn them into refugees ( or endless anti-regime freedom fighters including ISIL which has Assad as its chief recruiter, and Syria into rubble ) for destabilizing the E.U. which he succeeded by causing Brexit. The U.K. allowed refugees to bring their families over later ( rather rare in the E.U. but it's more humane ) and it was doing well economically with jobs and good pay and benefits. Pootin was Not trying to stabilize the situation in Syria at all. I was wrong about his intentions and duly disappointed.

The U.K. was handling the refugees better by interviewing them in the refugee camps rather than having them take the very perilous voyage to get to the U.K. themselves. Germany was very generous and mostly welcoming to the refugees so I certainly appreciate Germany's stepping up to help although I would have preferred better screening and interviewing onsite, more similar to what the U.K. had done. Germany was a novice at taking in so many refugees at once so it should generally be excused for any bumbling.

Aerial-bombings by Assad and Pootin replenished with many aggrieved civilians the many groups of anti-regime/anti-coalition fighters. Just read how many different groups are involved here in the U.S./Rustia clash. Wars are just burning fires. We know how to control and prevent or extinguish fires: fuels, oxidants, and ignitions. Automobile engineers got the control of fire down to a fine art using fuel pumps, oxygen sensors, spark plugs, electronic fuel injection, ceramic-coated aluminum engines, etc. We can learn from them. Get people well-fed well-fucked ( but NOT producing a population explosion! All well-off countries don't suffer from population explosion so yeah, necessary are the contraceptive pills, barrier and rhythm methods, cunnilingus, fellatio, intercrural, pornography, masturbation, sex dolls serving Homo/Robo (gynoids/androids) Integration, or gay { Spartan warriors whom so many Fascists aspire to were probably gay similar to the carbon atoms in diamonds each forming up to and mostly FOUR! extremely strong bonds in the gayest mineral of all } and lesbian sex in the more individualistic and imaginative countries or draconian birth control methods such as forced abortions, genital mutilations, honored killings, stonings, or infanticides in the more fascist countries ) and wars die down. Biologists phrase it as food and sex, just a bit more politely than I.

Machiavelli wrote "The Prince" targeted for Lorenzo to use but Lorenzo earned "il magnifico" for his title without adhering to Machiavellian methods. It showed that fascist-style control is NOT absolutely necessary to achieving the desirable ends. "Firm on purpose; pliant on means," suffices. Lorenzo can rightfully be named as the Godfather of the Renaissance which catapulted the brutish infighting very divided and superstitious Medieval Europe to global wealth, dominance, and power. At Reykjavik, Reagan and Gorbachev together "shot down thousands of nuclear-tipped ICBMs" (the firm purpose) without later deploying the Star-Wars Defense (a pliant means). Alzheimer's earnest grand vision came true without going through a devastating nuclear war. It wasn't a dream. It's peace in our time.

Libya, Yemen, and Syria were all ignited by ( anthropogenic in my take ) climate change and exhaustion of oil revenue in Yemen's case. The attack on U.S.S. Cole pre-saged 9/11 attacks by nearly a year while Bush-it was campaigning on the U.S. leaving the troublesome countries to their own device. The total klutzes of the Bush-it regime created much suffering for many countries for decades already. One cannot withdraw unilaterally ever without having something else replacing the U.S. support. We NEVER do that to any building unless we are tearing it down. Yeah, I still remember our withdrawing support from Afghanistan only to have Al-Qaeda coming back out with a vengeance on 9/11/2001. Invading Iraq and firing its army personnel made the U.S. "penile Chainies" rich with Iraqi oil beyond our wildest dreams! We also told our enemies there when we would be drawing down our troops and be completely out of Iraq, smart weren't we?

None of these decades-long wars in Afghanistan and Iraq would have occurred were the U.S. earnest in building the Amero-Eurasian Empire and occupied the new accretions. The U.S. occupations of Germany and Japan had gone very well so it could be done with U.S. knowhow. Our problem was not being colonial or imperialistic enough so everyone criticizes us for the disastrous aftermaths. Withdrawal of troops after winning a war has been a rare practice amongst other nations. If the regional powers cannot or would not stabilize the war-torn aftermaths, the U.S. should just occupy them indefinitely by ourselves for the welfare of our posterity.

Gentlemen, we've done it before, in Japan -- we can rebuild him. We have the technology. We can make his bigger, stronger, faster...

Yeah, we should start a "well-fed well-fucked" Party to save the World from wars!

We only live once.

[-] 1 points by ImNotMe (1488) 5 months ago

Prof. Jeffrey D. Sachs on Syria ...

I have not read your excessively long screed above, as I am too busy and just haven't the time to spare

BUT I will do so and reply accordingly IF U will put 5m36s of of your time in and watch the video above.

e tenebris, lux?

[-] 1 points by grapes (5184) 5 months ago

How many Syrian refugees did the two "Eastern-culture" permanent members of the U.N. Security Council, Rus China and Russian Federation, take in? And why?

Most of Russia's political and economic weights are Western but it had consistently tried to define itself as the Opposition so as to stand with Rus China to be Eastern instead. This is why the Western parts of Russia may join the E.U. without too much difficulty but the Eastern parts may experience far more significant shocks. Even Germany still has significant problems "digesting" DDR even after decades of unification efforts.

Russia's leadership suffers from a superiority complex in that it still feels that it should be superior to the other European states because it used to lord it over many of them. It also suffers from an inferiority complex in that it knows that just one or two of the major economies of the E.U. may already dwarf Russia's economy easily. It still has a lot of sabers that may work or not work due to the lack of maintenance but they are scary things so Russia became the teacher's pest, pulling a girl's hair here, stomping on that boy's toe there, flashing a rusty spring-loaded knife here and there, just to see where the limits are and feed its ego. One fix is to send Russia into a fully padded room for a long timeout, support it to have some self-centered constructive activity to do, and heap on praises to soothe its ego.

Many failing economies blame the U.S. for their being left behind but there is such a thing as being on the wrong economic path imposing structural constraints until something like Deng's "Socialism with Chinese characteristics" happens, making the hitherto illegals, "it's glorious to be rich!" Whatever!《清真寺里卖猪肉》As if coming from a dope dealer, they sound rather ridiculous to me but the covers apparently worked well.

A far more important question is -- what have they done for the innocent people in Syria to resolve the conflict? What's the Eastern-culture's peace plan for Syria? The Amero-Euroasian Empire will realize China's dream of returning all refugees to their homeland in the empire which the U.S. can build for them.

Things can rapidly get out of control between the Russian Federation and the U.S.A. in Syria.

[-] 1 points by beautifulworld (22956) 5 months ago

Why is it so hard to imagine that other countries have relationships with other countries that have nothing to do with America?

Russia and Syria have a long standing friendship/alliance. And, China, well, they're the longest running continuous civilization on earth so they can basically be friends with who they want, also, without getting permission from the U.S.

[-] 1 points by grapes (5184) 5 months ago

I know that they can have relationships independent of the U.S. and that's fine. I object to Russia's not living up to its promise to keep Syria from using chemical weapons. I remembered that the U.S. Congress had already voted for attacking Syria for violating the international prohibition of using chemical weapons. Russia intervened on behalf of Syria so droopy geoduck refrained from spurting Syria. Russia not controlling Assad so that he does not use chemical weapons means that the spurting-Syria order from the U.S. Congress takes effect. It's perfectly logical. The U.N. has been dysfunctional in resolving the Syrian conflicts so it makes sense that the U.S. steps up to impose some humanity even in warfare. We didn't come to banning chemical weapons easily. We learnt how debilitating chemical weapon attacks could be even years after they had happened. The survivors suffered greatly long thereafter.

Russia also flew aircraft into neighboring countries with their transponders switched off. That's both illegal and dangerous to civilian aviation. For these reasons, Russia needs to be put into an isolated and fully padded room to calm down.

"Can you believe that,with all of the problems and difficulties facing the U.S., geoduck spent the day playing Gulf.Worse than Cancer" The U.S. and Saudi Arabia's blood-and-oil special relationship went back a long way to the FDR days. Stabilized oil prices underpinned the prosperity of the postwar World for the U.S., Germany, Japan, and now China, too.

The 1970's had the two terrible oil shocks when Saudi Arabia and Iran (though not Arab) led the Arab Oil Embargo due to the U.S. backing of Israel and Ayatollah Khomeini replaced the Shah of Iran with Shia Islamic rule. My family ate the shit! I didn't know better then, "What's the Big Deal about having no gasoline and/or long lines of cars at the gas stations? New York City has an extensive subway system. It runs on electricity."

Saudi Arabia is the most important ally of the U.S. in the Middle East.

[-] 1 points by beautifulworld (22956) 5 months ago

U.S. could move to renewable energy pretty quickly if it wanted to. It just means changing policies and putting money into renewables instead of, oh, right, war. No fun for the oligarchs who get rich off of those wars.

https://www.ucsusa.org/clean_energy/smart-energy-solutions/increase-renewables/renewable-energy-80-percent-us-electricity.html

And, Saudi Arabia is only "important" while we march on using fossil fuels and creating wars to do so, but I'd use different words, such as "useful" to the oligarchs and "deleterious" the the masses.

[-] 1 points by grapes (5184) 5 months ago

Bullshit's dipenile-transcendent plan over Bush-it for M.A.G.A. is to get it pregnant again via Earth Pollution Agency on Earth Day.

Corporatocracy America's credo's, "they're going to use that last drop of oil, and they're going to use that last piece of metal, to make that last dollar of profit."

That attitude almost killed off the U.S. automobile industry due to its capturing the U.S. government so that the gas-mileage-increase mandates were repeatedly relaxed and delayed, rendering the U.S. automobile industry more profitable in the short term by slashing R&D but fatal in the long term were it not for the repeated bailouts by the government. The inaction on R&D in order to make and sell higher gas-mileage automobiles contributed greatly to shipping most of the automobile industry jobs overseas to Japan and landed the great city of Detroit (the arsenal of democracy) in its current dire state of few jobs being available, de-population, rampant crimes, abandoned properties, gang violence, lack of tax revenue to maintain infrastructure, etc. Detroit was slated to die by the failure to regulate the automobile industry to meet the higher realistic expectations. The first requirement for any success is the clear articulation of an attainable goal and the high expectations to go with it.

As for switching the U.S. over to renewable energy, even if we had succeeded domestically, we would still be entangled in oil wars, contemplate this equation of analogy: electricity-run New York City subway system : still oil-dependent U.S.A. = renewable-energy-run U.S.A. : still oil-dependent World.

Even if the U.S. were 100% using renewable energy, our myriad linkages to the oil-dependent World would still hit us hard due to yet another oil shock. I thought New York City was doing just fine because I was riding the amazing subway ( making irrelevant the surface traffic jams and quite unnoticeable my living on a faulted island with Carl Schurz's statue located at the top of a fault being approached @11:15 after a steep and tiring climb up to Morningside Heights ) but how wrong I was!

Inflation took off. My Mom griped about rapidly rising grocery prices. Fresh orange juice at our Sunday family brunches gave way to Tang and shortly afterwards there were no more such brunches. My brother's and my own Christmas song recordings could never be played again because a burglar or burglars ransacked our apartment and stole the 8-track-magnetic-tape player/recorder and much else but I cared much more about the irreplaceable mementos, far more than the pocket-protecting cash-is-trash loose-change collection or my Dad's can of 35-cent subway tokens my parents used, each punched with a Y-shaped hole in the middle.

The aircraft carrier USS America which sprang into action after Israel had attacked USS Liberty in 1967, returned from the Vietnam Conflict. It was ultimately used for target and sunk in May of 2005. Regardless of whether Bush-it @2:08 or Bullshit, castrated or regrown with the dipenile transcendence, "Mission Accomplished" forebodes its Destiny as the New Atlantis for Waterworld.

My father lost his job, probably due to the ensuing recession after the oil embargo. In order to be away from the by-then-ridden-with-crimes racially integrated neighborhood and to cut down on housing cost, we moved away to a lily-white neighborhood where the residents were reputed to have guns, and lots of them. Yeah, that's where I learnt my appreciation of the guns used for security purposes so now I certainly support our Second Amendment, "the (stealthy soft) Sound of Freedom." The burglars came no more or they had just found it too bothersome to get to so far away. The daily commutes took much longer. Our new residence was also much smaller. I was glad that I had shortly gone away to college to live in dormitories near/on campus. I worked my smarty pants off to pay for it but a dorm-room was for me a "classe affaire" upgrade!

It was all from oil, corporations, government, Jews, and Arabs (also OPEC Aryans)--oily, greedy, bloody, quarrelsome and murderous "Chosen Semites," with anxient cultures and uncompromising customs from millennia ago BEFORE diverse peoples were mushed together. In the twentieth century, we saw medieval cultures gaining modern industrial-scale muscles suddenly thrust into a crowded modernity by rapacious imperialistic customs creating the bloodiest century in all time. Zombies with chainsaws!

Shouldn't hospital infectious-disease isolation wards be called tribalism wards? And disinfectants/acrobatic-gymnasts be called mass-germ-murdering weapons?

[-] 1 points by ImNotMe (1488) 5 months ago

"Military Cancer" ...

pacem in terris ...

[-] 1 points by grapes (5184) 5 months ago

Human rights is unfortunately a mostly Western concept. I say we do what we believe in, without any reservations or qualms. Cemetery quiet is what "animal Assad" is striving for, so be it, after our proper determination of the facts on the ground, with "due diligence," of course. There's no need to forewarn Russia as it had already attacked U.S. troops recently in Syria and a lot of Russians had been killed. Russia already knows what the U.S. stands for.

Should the investigative effort be obstructed, do a Hussein II, as Hussein's international agreement has been violated. It will be a godsend to unite the U.S. behind the to-be-impeached (after 60 days after starting a nuclear war, of course, according to the U.S. Congress, if there's still a quorum left) Commander-in-Chief. Nuclear war will likely be over within just two hours. No more Mueller's Russia probe is necessary as allegiance is proven beyond any doubt.

They will certainly get it loud and clear when it comes. Vengeance is ours, at the time of our choosing.

[-] 1 points by ImNotMe (1488) 5 months ago

Re. "Vengeance is ours, at the time of our choosing" .. just who the flying fk d'U think U are grapes & whoTF is this "we", that U are so in league with?!!! NO "Human rights is" NOT "unfortunately a mostly Western concept" .. U Euro-centric dingbat & there are innumerable texts, in numerous languages, in many cultures - which allude to rights & responsibilities in society!! WhatTF are "U.S. troops" doing in Syria and who invited them there and, d'U really think U$A's MIC gives a fk about Syrian casualties?!

Anyway just on the chance that U are simply being sarcastic or satirical or strangely supercilious, here are some links about Syria - for later digestion and assimilation, so that U can answer those questions for yourself ...

e tenebris, lux?

[-] 1 points by grapes (5184) 5 months ago

A small contingent of U.S. Special Operations acting primarily as advisors are in Syria to help exterminate ISIL (which crosses into Iraq with impunity so the U.S. must help secure Northeast Syria to halt the infiltration of ISIL into Iraq). "Jihadi John," an ISIL "Beatle," beheaded James Foley, a U.S. photojournalist, violating our First Amendment right of the Freedom of the Press. As a consequence intended by our Founding Fathers under Divine Providence, our Second Amendment kicked in. I certainly support our Second Amendment as well as the advisors' right to self defense, yes, even against the Russians ( bumbling idiots [as they're unlikely to be suicidally crazy] killed/injured in probing the truthiness of our fickle Terrible-lizard's tweets?) who have been neutralized in the hundred(s) when they attacked the U.S. personnel. Quality starts with the fundamentals, such as our Bill of Rights. Allahu akbar!

[-] 1 points by grapes (5184) 5 months ago

It's good that you know human rights is not a uniquely Western concept but it is mostly a Western practice, though ( e.g., Brexit didn't hamper united Western actions against the Novichok attack; I wonder whether there were any united Eastern actions; what did Turkey, Syria, Israel, Egypt, Iraq, Kuwait, Oman, Qatar, UAE, Iran, Pakistan, India, China, Vietnam, etc. do?) We speak truth to power because children's squabble had enlightened me -- "your god is made of clay; your god is made of the bloodied wood; by kneeling down in front of these, both of you have committed idolatory, now let me chisel both of them away to honor [AND dishonor] the Almighty." Who is the One True God? The U.S. is pagan in its founding. Just look at the pentagram emblems on our aircraft. As the first act of prayer to the Christian God, the colonial representatives booted out sectarianism and compromised, no less by the extremists in their midst! As Benjamin Franklin, a Quaker devoted to peaceful principles, had purportedly expressed something like, "we either hang together or we should be hanged separately."

Imminent death clears the mind extremely well so as to realize what is truly important: the brethren colonies in armed revolt against tyranny, despite their being Quakers, Episcopalians, Presbyterians, Baptists, and on and on. God made it clear. Peace is to be instituted amongst all brothers and sisters by first kicking out the sectarian God. Do we still revere God, having kicked out the sectarian part? Damn well, we still do. It's still being honored right there on every single U.S. coin and bill: "In God We Trust. E pluribus unum (out of many, one.)" We have in fact become the MOST religious Western country -- just ignore which particular God, gods, goddesses, or no god or goddess, we pray or not pray to. Separating Church from State was what had made the United States of America possible AND great. It's enshrined in the First Amendment, backed up by the Second Amendment at gunpoints. The U.S. has the rightful claim to enforce universal human rights (also in the U.N. Declarations) at gunpoints if necessary, ordained by the Almighty at the founding of our country. We haunt.

[-] 1 points by grapes (5184) 5 months ago

Show me Russian troops backing up an international team of investigators from the U.N. Show me Chinese troops doing the same. There are none whatsoever. There are texts, speeches, languages galore alright in Eastern cultures but they are just so much suffocating carbon dioxide due to hypocrisy.

Okay, let me make up some faux news, too. China has just rescued drowning sailors in the South China Sea using its newly reclaimed-from-the-sea immovable aircraft carrier as the search-and-rescue base. Russia rushed in to Douma to catch the perpetrators of the chemical attack, to no avail naturally, and messing up the criminal evidence, of course. Oh yeah, Iran has just upheld its long and glorious tradition of stipulating laws and human rights in Persian poetry, of course. "Nuclear bombs are 《un-Islamic》 so we enrich uranium with tens of thousands of centrifuges and operate nuclear reactor to make radio-isotopes ( oh, we couldn't help but make plutonium by Mother Nature's way, could we? Allahu Akbar! Trust us, through rocketry and nuclear bombs, we realize our religion of [cemetery]Peace! ) for national nuclear-medicine independence for cancer treatments." Aren't we humane and caring? Meanwhile, chop, chop, "we have no homosexuals in Iran. We execute them." We want obedient sexpots, not un-reproductive homosexuals, as if population pressure is not high enough already to exceed the carrying capacity for that part of the miserable World. What livelihood do these massive numbers of young people get? Crickets... Ahhh, in the East, we build bonfires of [in]humanity!

Whatever! Black is white and white is black or vice versa -- it's the contrast Islam is aiming for, dude!

I could see the contrast, the reversal of fortunes alright, in the previously divided Germany, on the Korean Peninsula, Hispaniola, and

in China before and after the 1979 post-Mao Deng Xiaoping opening ( Mao had to die, for China to rise; Deng normalized relations with the U.S., legitimized, and glorified the illegal-under-Communism entrepreneurial activities of some peasants, turning socialist shit into peasant gold.)

Russia has recently been given a similar opportunity at its premiere national laboratory with its scientists doing Bitcoin mining in secrecy, absolutely ingenious people taking advantage of Russia's great strengths --

some of the best human (AI has already surpassed ALL humans, including Russians, in chess-playing decades ago) brains in the whole world [ titanium-like-awesome in Math and Science! Coming from a Remnant of the last century like me with the long-wayback memories { I remember the Détente after the KGB? had eavesdropped the rapprochement of Nixon and Mao using the mysterious white 》Grundlage der Entspannung?《 object close to Mao in the foreground of the photograph; it was a neighborhood girl, not a witch, who had sat upon it blushing and being embarrassed which effectively ended @2:55 two preschoolers' "mad scientific" quest -- saving an inquisitive kid's budding biomedical and doctoring career means avoiding Novichok -- Never ever get near to that pootinium? still-unidentified? grounding object! } traceable to its beginning and even some of the nineteenth century through oral history, it's a bit like the respect of Bill Gates for Steve Jobs in saving Apple, Inc. from bankruptcy, after a Harvard MBA from the sugarwater company Pepsico { sugar is as addictive as cocaine in human pleasure-seeking-and-addiction-circuitry studies; Warren Buffett's BRK owns many companies selling sweet de-facto-doped products for excellent profits -- it's legalized dope dealings in a sense } had sucked Apple for profits dry as a prune by putting out terrible-quality products and then bailing himself out, leaving Apple in shambles while the E.U. and the U.S. D.O.J. were gunning for monopolistic practices of Bill's Microsoft so Bill got a kickass motivation to save Microsoft's former competitor; Apple became the most profitable company ever and still exists today probably due to the antitrust laws and regulations; the U.S. gets killed by Russia in the chess-playing and elsewhere, too, especially in the current cracked bullshit ],

terrible coldness for high thermodynamic efficiency,

and

vast deposits of natural gas to generate electricity, ranking it close to the leading favorite Iceland where Mother Nature sings in peace the Song of Fire and Ice -- I wonder whether these Russian scientist entrepreneurs had ended up in jail due to the idiotic and blind fossilized Pootin being in charge; Deng would have glorified these heroes of Mother Rustia nationally!

Europe has emerged from its horrid past in human rights. I surmise that it was because it had gone through extremely terrible human rights violations on its soil. Despite its despicably ingenious inventions of Medieval torture devices, Germany has essentially been emasculated by wars. I know what human rights violation feels like. Although I haven't experienced human rights abuses firsthand myself, my determined and courageous Mom had told me of stories such as how an elderly widow was stripped of her livelihood and killed herself by drinking the poisonous bitter electrolyte-balance-disrupting solution that had seeped from the seasalt after its having absorbed moisture from the air. The most beautiful flower can grow from the biggest stinkiest lump of rusty bullshit given the universal solvent of human teardrops.

All great powers have emerged after terrible revolutions. Have you ever wondered why? I know why, for I am the lotus seed of the Land of the Departed Souls, the Remnant which has sprouted from this bullshit. It may be a SAM but we're the Untouchables. Allahu akbar!

[-] 1 points by ImNotMe (1488) 5 months ago

So, WTF is ''Op.Timber Sycamore''?!

I haven't read your 10+ paragraphs written over 3 days above & may not do so, as I've a distinct feeling

that I'd get very fkn angry indeed IF I subjected myself to your expansive yet myopic Merca-centric b-s!

Does ANYTHING that U say above touch on this https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-vwKk4pADCw ?!!

If not, why not d'U think? Is it possible that being mired in U$A's MSM has now rendered U imbecilic?!!!

respice, adspice, prospice ...

[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (33638) from Coon Rapids, MN 5 years ago

Also - In compliment:

I wanted to make sure that you saw Jim's email yesterday asking for your opinion on how the US should proceed in Syria. This is a complex situation, and as a member driven organization, we want to hear your thoughts on how you think the US and DFA should move forward.

Please take a moment to let our team know your views on Syria.

Thanks for being part of DFA,

Charles

Charles Chamberlain, Executive Director Democracy for America


FW: Where do you stand on Syria? Sender: Jim Dean, Democracy For America

The civil war in Syria has claimed over 100,000 lives. And last Wednesday, the situation got even worse: at least 350 people died and over 3,600 were hospitalized after a suspected chemical attack.

Increasingly, it looks like the US may be planning a military response.

This situation is complicated, and Democracy For America members are expressing a variety of views on how we should proceed. We need to hear from you to find out where you stand.

Please take a moment to express your views on Syria here.

If you aren't sure where you stand right now, even that information is helpful. As a membership driven organization, it is vital that we hear from you. So don't hold back. Let us know what you think right now.

Thanks for all you do to move America and DFA forward,

Jim

Jim Dean, Chair Democracy for America

Donate today

Paid for by Democracy for America, http://www.democracyforamerica.com/?t=3&akid=3863.2041858._mFx6n and not authorized by any candidate. Contributions to Democracy for America are not deductible for federal income tax purposes.


Based on the current situation, do you support U.S. military intervention in Syria?:

NO

Please take a moment to tell us why or explain your position.:

If we get involved at this point in time - it should be to air drop medical and food supplies to the civilians in the cities as well as send food and medical supplies to all of the refugee camps and every ( lawful ? ) country in the world should do the same.

The Middle East can be considered as largely lawless ( 10,000,000 Arabs.Muslims killed by each other in how many years? ). Considering this - arms are the last thing anyone should be sending into the region.

America and every ( lawful ? ) country in the world - should withhold on sending any armaments to anyone. Peace will not break out at the end of a gun. Now while every lawful country withholds pouring fuel onto the fire - they should also be pressuring for a cease in all hostilities ( helpful if they follow through on stopping arms shipments ).

Any military action really should be carried out by the UN not NOT the USA. This military action "should" for one thing - STOP the Shelling and Bombing of the cities/civilians - that would mean declaring the whole area a no fly zone and immediately enforcing it. US military take note - stop using drone war fare in civilized areas = villages towns cities. Take out ( destroy ) all of the machines of war that are being used on and in the cities.

Do you have any other thoughts on Syria you'd like to share? :

On Syria and the middle east and Africa - stop sending in arms. Sane approach to peace health and prosperity throughout the region is better achieved - NOT by sending MONEY or ARMS - BUT by sending equipment that will provide the area with clean/green energy = solar farms wind farms even Thorium Reactors and Liquid Metal Batteries ( for storage and distribution - things we should be doing here at home as well ). Also water purification equipment. REMOVE THE REASONS FOR - THE CAUSES OF - STRIFE. This also includes breaking the fossil fuel necessity ( we need to do this for the environment anyway ).

A lot cheaper approach then to perpetuate war - kinder to ALL life.

[-] 5 points by JohnWa (513) 5 years ago

The Middle East has been a focus of Western opportunism, particularly since WWI. Syria today is a result of past US intervention.

We are increasing our abilities to earn enemies with invasions, drones, bombing, occupation and the mining of assets and resources across this strife ridden home of civilization.

I believe our record of past interventions includes a new round of bombing each 40 months on average.

No peace initiative is won by invasion but peace is not the target the bankers are after. There is too much money to be made from war and the tax payer and public here suffer.

The only terrorists easily recognizable sit either within US administration or closely behind them driving the slaughter. Psychopaths reign without restraint.

Protest and pacifism are but two of the tools we have against the war criminals.

[-] 4 points by Nevada1 (5843) 5 years ago

Well Said.

[-] 1 points by 99nproud (2697) 4 years ago

Agreed! NO WAR!

Syria, Iraq, Ukraine, Isreal are all eventually resource wars. Stop buying oil as an anti war protest.

Many peaceful protests and boycotts is the best approach.

[-] -1 points by JosephB (26) 5 years ago

Syria is another false flag event.

The lies we are fed make the nation sick - er.

[-] 3 points by Builder (4202) 5 years ago

Bombing the Syrians back into the stone age will actually backfire in a number of ways to the detriment of the criminal overlords.

People are not just starting to doubt everything in the press, they are cuckolding it as well. The boy has cried wolf too many times now. Barry Sotoro has about as much credibility as a WMD crier after Iraq.

[Removed]

[-] 1 points by Nevada1 (5843) 5 years ago

Everyone needs to see this.

[-] 0 points by 99nproud (2697) 4 years ago

Love is the answer

[-] 0 points by HeckleJekyll (-2) 5 years ago

Where was the USA's drive for moral intervention to stop the genocide in the Congo, Darfur, Rwanda. Millions have been killed there, yet nothing was done, because the USA favored those regimes.

The U.S. looked the other way when then allied Saddam gased the kurds in the early 80's. Nothing was done because he was doing our bidding by fighting Iran.

The USA ignored massacres in Bahrain, because we favour their regime.

What nation is the world's biggest exporter of terrorism? What nation is responsible for the deaths of hundreds of thousands of innocent civilians in Iraq, Afghanistan, Pakistan and Libya? What nation has ignored the sovereign borders of many other nations?

Govt sponsored terrorism, is terrorism all the same.

[-] 0 points by DKAtoday (33638) from Coon Rapids, MN 5 years ago

A true statement - just because a government "does it" - it does not mean that it is not criminal or terroristic. But the USA is not the only country with an indifferent government - indifferent to the killings and strife in other countries - nor is it the only country that is aggressive militarily in going after what it wants.

Currently - guerrilla insurgents from across the border are raising hell in Syria. Though this started after Assad started a military program of Democide on his people. The guerrillas could well be armed with serin and using it for their own reasons. Still that does not absolve Assad of his program of Democide.

Been going on for a couple of years now - look at all of the indifference of all the nations in the UN. Look at the big three that are looking after their own interests in the area - USA, Russia, China. There are others plenty of others with an interest in the area. And look at what has been done over the decades to settle things down in the area - Arms Shipments and such.

There is plenty of blame to go around. Around the world.

[-] 1 points by MattLHolck (16833) from San Diego, CA 5 years ago

democide ?

Democide is a term revived and redefined by the political scientist R. J. Rummel as "the murder of any person or people by a government, including genocide, politicide and mass murder.

There is plenty of blame to go around. Around the world.

fair enough but that doesn't give the US a free pass to practice that

[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (33638) from Coon Rapids, MN 5 years ago
[-] 1 points by MattLHolck (16833) from San Diego, CA 5 years ago

got it

[-] 0 points by GirlFriday (17435) 5 years ago

pat pat pat

There wasn't any room below.

[Removed]

[-] 0 points by DKAtoday (33638) from Coon Rapids, MN 5 years ago

Translation - US and Obama aren't that bad.

Translation = U have a specific agenda which does not recognize all of the other involvements/causes.

[Removed]

[-] 0 points by DKAtoday (33638) from Coon Rapids, MN 5 years ago

Greed is the #1 cause of Disease Death & Destruction in the World.

Democide - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Based on the current situation, do you support U.S. military intervention in Syria?:

NO

Please take a moment to tell us why or explain your position.:

If we get involved at this point in time - it should be to air drop medical and food supplies to the civilians in the cities as well as send food and medical supplies to all of the refugee camps and every ( lawful ? ) country in the world should do the same.

The Middle East can be considered as largely lawless ( 10,000,000 Arabs.Muslims killed by each other in how many years? ). Considering this - arms are the last thing anyone should be sending into the region.

America and every ( lawful ? ) country in the world - should withhold on sending any armaments to anyone. Peace will not break out at the end of a gun. Now while every lawful country withholds pouring fuel onto the fire - they should also be pressuring for a cease in all hostilities ( helpful if they follow through on stopping arms shipments ).

Any military action really should be carried out by the UN not NOT the USA. This military action "should" for one thing - STOP the Shelling and Bombing of the cities/civilians - that would mean declaring the whole area a no fly zone and immediately enforcing it. US military take note - stop using drone war fare in civilized areas = villages towns cities. Take out ( destroy ) all of the machines of war that are being used on and in the cities.

Do you have any other thoughts on Syria you'd like to share? :

On Syria and the middle east and Africa - stop sending in arms. Sane approach to peace health and prosperity throughout the region is better achieved - NOT by sending MONEY or ARMS - BUT by sending equipment that will provide the area with clean/green energy = solar farms wind farms even Thorium Reactors and Liquid Metal Batteries ( for storage and distribution - things we should be doing here at home as well ). Also water purification equipment. REMOVE THE REASONS FOR - THE CAUSES OF - STRIFE. This also includes breaking the fossil fuel necessity ( we need to do this for the environment anyway ).

A lot cheaper approach then to perpetuate war - kinder to ALL life.

[Removed]

[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (33638) from Coon Rapids, MN 5 years ago

But you ignore the corp(se)oRAT influence on government as well as corp(se)oRATist politicians in office ( state & Fed ) that forward these military resource oriented agendas. It is NOT one individual's doing - All of the crap of our dying democracy and our dying planet.

[Removed]

[-] 0 points by shoozTroll (17632) 5 years ago

Who are these others?

[Removed]

[-] 0 points by shoozTroll (17632) 5 years ago

Names please.

Generics aren't very useful.

And what State are you in?

[-] -2 points by zacharilogan (-54) 5 years ago

I'm in New-York. Get the names of all the politicians for the Democrats and the Republicans. Add to that all the names of Evangelists with power. Then all the rich people who use their power over others. The list is in the thousands and thousands of people.

But really, I'm not interested in particular actors. Obama is important for this posting since this news article by Occupy is about the government Obama is leading, but what really interests me is the system. Even if you change the actors, the system will simply corrupt the new ones. The problem is the system. It's capitalism which creates monetary power over others, and political hierarchy which creates political power over others.

You seem almost angry that I would be against Obama's way of presiding the country. Perhaps I'm reading you wrong? It's hard to tell what people are thinking sometimes on these forums.

[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (33638) from Coon Rapids, MN 5 years ago

-] -1 points by zacharilogan (-37) 11 minutes ago

And you're shooz's web bodyguard? You guys lovers or something? Why are you both stalking me?

↥twinkle ↧stinkle permalink

My My My - U sound suspiciously like a certain trash-can - U guys network?

[-] -1 points by MattLHolck (16833) from San Diego, CA 5 years ago

I was thinking girl friday

[Removed]

[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (33638) from Coon Rapids, MN 5 years ago

[-] -1 points by zacharilogan (-15) 1 minute ago

Sounds like you're paid to be Obama's web bodyguard.

↥twinkle ↧stinkle permalink

It "seems" as though U and Ur's do not know the difference between -

DEMOCRACY

&

DEMOCRAT

Not surprising.

[Removed]

[-] 1 points by shoozTroll (17632) 5 years ago

Yet you only repeat the name of a single "actor". Several times in fact, while ignoring all others..

Do you get paid by the number?

[-] 2 points by MattLHolck (16833) from San Diego, CA 5 years ago

i keep giving this points but the points they do nothing

[Removed]

[-] 0 points by shoozTroll (17632) 5 years ago

What I was looking for was the names of the CEOs of the defense contractors and their attendant lobbyists. in New York, as well as their major controlling share holders.

Actual names, not political rhetoric..

[Removed]

[Removed]

[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (33638) from Coon Rapids, MN 5 years ago

Well - now the strident republicon supporter sounds-off. SURPRISE - NOT.

Hey little sock - did you get reinstated? Ummm - by the site - I mean. Not by your Hot air-idness self.

[-] 1 points by MattLHolck (16833) from San Diego, CA 5 years ago

thanks

i do my best

[Removed]

[-] -2 points by HeckleJekyll (-2) 5 years ago

You are correct.

President Barry, Oblahblah, Obomber is a con man. So are any others who support our corrupt money oriented political system. What has Obomber done to get money out of politics? To prosecute the criminals on Wall st? To stop the MIC? To end Neoliberalism policies that are destroying the Middle class? Clearly Barry is a puppet of the 1%.

The speech giver in chief. Monsanto protector, TPP promoter, war crimes, peace prize winner.

Why is this 1% puppet being vehemently defended on the Occupy forum?

[-] 0 points by DKAtoday (33638) from Coon Rapids, MN 5 years ago

obummer ? vehemently defended ? aAHHAHAHAhahaha

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[-] 2 points by DKAtoday (33638) from Coon Rapids, MN 5 years ago

Responding here - "I" am pretty sure who U R - and I guess "U" remain the same ( no surprise ) - it is only OK 4 U 2 B insulting - Hey? U run around trying 2 put words in peoples mouths - and wonder why U might get slapped. This is an open forum - in that - posts and comments made R open 2 all 2 respond 2 - butt - "U" already know that.

BTW - it is not my fault that U R a Mental midget.

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[-] 2 points by DKAtoday (33638) from Coon Rapids, MN 5 years ago

And the beat goes on - and the beat goes on - drums keep pounding dementia into it's Brain - la de da de de - la de da de da - and the beat goes on - and the beat goes on on on on

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[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (33638) from Coon Rapids, MN 5 years ago

[-] -2 points by zacharilogan (-37) 55 minutes ago

Do I know you? What's your real name. I use mine here. Here's my site: http://www.zacharilogan.com/

Like I said, I'm not here to play trolling games. Could you please stop stalking me?

↥twinkle ↧stinkle permalink

If U R not trying to impersonate this guy? U sound pretty much self-involved anyway. huh another reason U sound like a certain trash-can.

Zachari Logan | KALTBLUT MAGAZINE www.kaltblut-magazine.com/zachari-logan

„To express masculine bravado and superiority“ What a man, what a man. What a mighty good man. Yes! That is Zachari Logon. The Canadian is one of the stars of the ...

[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (33638) from Coon Rapids, MN 5 years ago

Responding here - U R the 1 keeping the conversation going ( want to stop going back and forth? - don't reply. )

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[-] 2 points by DKAtoday (33638) from Coon Rapids, MN 5 years ago

Hey - shill boy - your song - drums keep pounding dementia into it's Brain - la de da de de - la de da de da - and the beat goes on - and the beat goes on on on on

One upped ? Sorry U feel that way. Not my fault if U R slow.

This place isn't healthy.

If so - U & yours made it that way.

[-] 1 points by MattLHolck (16833) from San Diego, CA 5 years ago

i am typhoid mary

[-] 0 points by DKAtoday (33638) from Coon Rapids, MN 5 years ago

Beat your drum idiot - beat your drum. It's all obummers fault folks - listen to the voice of zack - it is all the fault of obummer.

What ( the people ask ) what is all the fault of obummer?

Why everything ( zack replies ) everything.

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[-] -2 points by zacharilogan (-54) 5 years ago

Nope, I didn't say it was all Obama's fault. Read my messages again. I said he's part of the problem, just like all the other 1%ers. But, because he's President of US, he's a 1% with a lot of power these days. If you read the Monsanto Protection Act, you'll find his signature.

We should go after all the 1%ers. No exceptions.

[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (33638) from Coon Rapids, MN 5 years ago

Well then - I would suggest you do a lot of work on how you present things. As - for right now - you - look to be - obsessed with obummer.

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[-] -1 points by buliau (-29) 5 years ago

Why would a user be considered a troll if a lot of people read his posts?

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[-] 0 points by DKAtoday (33638) from Coon Rapids, MN 5 years ago

[-] -1 points by zacharilogan (-6) 3 minutes ago

We are denouncing the complete disregard from the government of the United States which is led by Obama. You don't think he has a big responsibility to play in this? If not, that's fine. Include everyone else you want. Don't exclude Obama though. He's part of the 1%. I'm not sure why you got all uptight that I mentioned his name. Is it a taboo here or something? I noticed this other guy, shooz, seems upset as well.

↥twinkle ↧stinkle permalink

OH GO SPANK YOUR MEAT you little strident ass.

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[-] 0 points by DKAtoday (33638) from Coon Rapids, MN 5 years ago

Who is defending obummer?

"The “No War With Syria” movement denounces the complete disregard of the government of the United States for the will of the American people as reflected in the government's decision to start yet another war."

The again - who is singling obummer out? Not the no war with Syria movement as your comment shows.

Here - for Ur enjoyment:

http://occupywallst.org/forum/mr-president-with-all-due-respect-fuck-you/

[-] -3 points by zacharilogan (-54) 5 years ago

We are denouncing the complete disregard from the government of the United States which is led by Obama. You don't think he has a big responsibility to play in this? If not, that's fine. Include everyone else you want. Don't exclude Obama though. He's part of the 1%. I'm not sure why you got all uptight that I mentioned his name. Is it a taboo here or something? I noticed this other guy, shooz, seems upset as well.

[-] 0 points by DKAtoday (33638) from Coon Rapids, MN 5 years ago

Who tied - presented and tied that legislation as a rider? A rider that would stop the legislation it was tied to? UMmmmmmmmmmm let me think ....

[-] 1 points by MattLHolck (16833) from San Diego, CA 5 years ago

blood money compensation for all those blown to shlag by US arms

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[-] -1 points by buliau (-29) 5 years ago

Obama is a horrible president who's been leading America in the wrong direction since he's been elected. His idea of going to war is wrong and dangerous. We should occupy with vehemence and integrity to stop this war from happening. There are other ways America can intervene if it wants to be the world's savior.

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[-] 1 points by MattLHolck (16833) from San Diego, CA 5 years ago

except every other section of the world has other plans

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[-] -1 points by buliau (-29) 5 years ago

Sarcasm doesn't really work on the InternetI guess.

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[-] -2 points by buliau (-29) 5 years ago

Obama joining Occupy to fund and create a huge world protest for peace would be amazing! That could change the world! I'd give him another Nobel Peace Prize for it.

Sadly, it won't happen. Obama is part of the 1%. He doesn't really care about peace even though he has a Nobel Peace Prize. You know the 1% are making a mockery of the world when they give the Nobel Peace prize to someone like Obama. I feel like they spat in my face.

[-] -2 points by zacharilogan (-54) 5 years ago

Ya, you're right. We need a president with integrity, honesty, and real will to help his people. But how? I don't think it's possible in the current system. Someone would have to be corrupted and malicious like Obama to even have a chance to make it to the top.

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[-] -1 points by factsrfun (8359) from Phoenix, AZ 5 years ago

We should stop trading with Russia and stop trading with any country that trades with Russia, until Russia tells Syria to stop this crap, but that would cost a lot of money and the American people will most likely decide to spend the lives of working class children instead.

[-] -2 points by zoealif (-3) 5 years ago

"Peace is created through compassion and forgiveness, which must come from within."???? Especially when you opponent is using chemical weapons. OMG - the US left intelligensia :/

Read some actual news from Syrians who have been protesting and opposing the Assad regime.

http://tahriricn.wordpress.com/ http://darthnader.net/ https://www.facebook.com/ActivistsNewsAssociation