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Forum Post: "Weapons of Mass Distraction", by Dennis Kucinich

Posted 9 years ago on Oct. 10, 2012, 5:13 p.m. EST by shadz66 (19985)
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"Weapons of Mass Distraction"

by Dennis Kucinich.

October 10, 2012 "Information Clearing House" [ http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/ ]

Ten years ago, on October 10, 2002, the United States House of Representatives made one of the most calamitous mistakes of a generation. Congress, with wilful blindness, voted to attack, invade and occupy a sovereign, oil-rich nation in the Middle East that did not attack us and did not pose a threat to the American people.

The war in Iraq will ultimately cost the United States five trillion dollars. Four thousand, four hundred, eighty eight Americans were killed. Tens of thousands of Americans were injured. At least one million innocent Iraqis were killed. Iraq has become a home to Al Qaida which it certainly was not before our intervention. Resentment against the United States has made pursuing peace more difficult. And we still have thousands of armed contractors in Iraq -- paid for by U.S. taxpayers.

Many are trying to rewrite the history of the Iraq war. The people who led us into a war based on lies want us to believe that the intelligence community was duped. They don't want us to ask questions, because they don't want to be held accountable. Those repeating the myth that America was duped are perpetuating one of the biggest lies in American history.

Iraq did not pose a threat to the United States. Iraq had no Weapons of Mass Destruction. Iraq had absolutely nothing to do with 9/11. We were not duped. We were not fooled. It was obvious at the time. The evidence was in publicly available reports for anyone who cared to look. I personally distributed this memo to Members of Congress. In it I address the false justifications for war, point-by-point and establish the truth. I made the case in an hour-long presentation on the House floor. 133 Members of Congress were not duped; they voted against going to war with Iraq. The Bush Administration lied to the Congress and the American people to sell its war. The intelligence community wasn't duped, The American people were duped and we are still paying the price.

Why did they lie ? After ten years, we have never held anyone accountable for the lies. Perhaps it would be useful to look at who benefited from the war. The Neoconservatives in the Bush Administration wanted to show the world American power by destroying an enemy. They thought that American power and American bombs could redraw the maps and ensure American hegemony and American access to cheap oil for a new century. Certainly the bomb makers and war profiteers have gained from a decade of war. The elite chattering class of State Department sponsored spokespersons from so-called "independent" think tanks have also benefited. This professional chattering class receives funding and attention by hyping threats and war. Who else benefited from the war ?

America needs a period of truth and reconciliation. How can we avoid future wars if we don't understand how consent was manufactured for a war against Iraq ?


respice, adspice, prospice...


Dennis Kucinich is Congressman from Ohio.

[Item copied verbatim under 'Fair Use' from : http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article32706.htm ]



Read the Rules
[-] 7 points by beautifulworld (23616) 6 years ago

Trenchant piece on Paris attacks courtesy Counterpunch:

"The Age of Despair: Reaping the Whirlwind of Western Support for Extremist Violence" by Chris Floyd


We, the West, overthrew Saddam by violence. We overthrew Gaddafi by violence. We are trying to overthrow Assad by violence. Harsh regimes all — but far less draconian than our Saudi allies, and other tyrannies around the world. What has been the result of these interventions? A hell on earth, one that grows wider and more virulent year after year.

Without the American crime of aggressive war against Iraq — which, by the measurements used by Western governments themselves, left more than a million innocent people dead — there would be no ISIS, no “Al Qaeda in Iraq.” Without the Saudi and Western funding and arming of an amalgam of extremist Sunni groups across the Middle East, used as proxies to strike at Iran and its allies, there would be no ISIS. Let’s go back further. Without the direct, extensive and deliberate creation by the United States and its Saudi ally of a world-wide movement of armed Sunni extremists during the Carter and Reagan administrations, there would have been no “War on Terror” — and no terrorist attacks in Paris tonight.

Again, let’s be as clear as possible: the hellish world we live in today is the result of deliberate policies and actions undertaken by the United States and its allies over the past decades. It was Washington that led and/or supported the quashing of secular political resistance across the Middle East, in order to bring recalcitrant leaders like Nasser to heel and to back corrupt and brutal dictators who would advance the US agenda of political domination and resource exploitation.

The open history of the last half-century is very clear in this regard. Going all the way back to the overthrow of the democratic government of Iran in 1953, the United States has deliberately and consciously pushed the most extreme sectarian groups in order to undermine a broader-based secular resistance to its domination agenda.

Why bring up this “ancient history” when fresh blood is running in the streets of Paris? Because that blood would not be running if not for this ancient history; and because the reaction to this latest reverberations of Washington’s decades-long, bipartisan cultivation of religious extremism will certainly be more bloodshed, more repression and more violent intervention. Which will, in turn, inevitably, produce yet more atrocities and upheaval as we are seeing in Paris tonight.

I write in despair. Despair of course at the depravity displayed by the murderers of innocents in Paris tonight; but an even deeper despair at the depravity of the egregious murderers who have brought us to this ghastly place in human history: those gilded figures who have strode the halls of power for decades in the high chambers of the West, killing innocent people by the hundreds of thousands, crushing secular opposition to their favored dictators — and again, again and again — supporting, funding and arming some of the most virulent sectarians on earth.

And one further cause of despair: that although this historical record is there in the open, readily available from the most mainstream sources, it is and will continue to be completely ignored, both by the power-gamers and by the public. The latter will continue to support the former as they replicate and regurgitate the same old policies of intervention, the same old agendas of domination and greed, over and over and over again — creating ever-more fresh hells for us all to live in, and poisoning the lives of our children, and of all those who come after us.

[-] 5 points by ImNotMe (1488) 6 years ago

Alas ... ''A massacre in central Paris would be unthinkable today.'' - from the second link below:

The news is full of '"worst massacre in France since WW2" but that's only true for those ignorant of the above. From your rather astoundingly clear-headed, open-minded and heart-centred link .. especially at this difficult time that can lead so many to reflexive anger and psychological paralysis - I will quote this:

  • ''The open history of the last half-century is very clear in this regard. Going all the way back to the overthrow of the democratic government of Iran in 1953, the United States has deliberately and consciously pushed the most extreme sectarian groups in order to undermine a broader-based secular resistance to its domination agenda.'' and ...

  • ''Why bring up this “ancient history” when fresh blood is running in the streets of Paris? 'Cause that blood would not be running if not for this ancient history; and because the reaction to this latest reverberations of Washington’s decadeslong bipartisan cultivation of religious extremism will certainly be more bloodshed, more repression and more violent intervention. Which will, in turn, inevitably, produce yet more atrocities and upheaval as we are seeing in Paris tonight.''

These days, the mere exposition of sequential cause and effect is heresy in times of horror, terror and cultivated, reactionary apoplexy. France is deeply implicated in the destruction of regimes & countries such as Afghanistan, Iraq, Syria,Libya & others but people in France & elsewhere, want to believe that horrors visited upon people for political ends elsewhere, will somehow - NOT come back to haunt them.

This is just rather delusional, irrational and propagandistic. BUT as George Orwell said .. "In a time of universal deceit - telling the truth is a revolutionary act". Solidarity to the innocent dead ... everywhere, as we endeavour to resist self-righteous hubris and strategic amnesia - and join history's dots instead! Yes of course ISIS/ISIL/Da'esh are monsters but French, Saudi & 'USUK' hands are NOT clean either!

respice; adspice; prospice ...

[-] 4 points by beautifulworld (23616) 6 years ago

The colonial history of the West haunts it today:

"Exactly 51 years after one of the murkiest episodes in recent French history, French President François Hollande recognised on Wednesday the "bloody repression" of Algerian protesters by French police that took place in the heart of Paris on October 17, 1961.

On that fateful day, French police – under the leadership of Paris prefect Maurice Papon – brutally crushed peaceful demonstrations of Algerian anti-war protesters who had gathered in and around the French capital to protest against a French security crackdown in Algeria.

The incident occurred at the height of the Algerian war of independence, when the French colonial administration was locked in a bitter battle with the Algerian National Liberation Front (FLN) – the Algerian party fighting for the North African nation’s liberation from France.

More than half-a-century later, the details surrounding the October 17 massacre – including the casualty figures – remain murky. A day after the demonstrations, the left-leaning French newspaper Libération reported the official toll as two dead, several wounded and 7,500 arrests. The death toll, however, was disputed by the FLN, which claimed that dozens were killed. Many of the bodies were found floating in the River Seine."

From: http://www.france24.com/en/20121017-paris-massacre-algeria-october-17-1961-51-years-anniversary-historian-einaudi

[-] 4 points by ImNotMe (1488) 6 years ago

Conventional, 'establishmentarian' history is oft written by ''the victors''; propagandists & amnesiacs, as your excellent excerpt and 'Counterpunch' link above shows and, as the following link also attests to ...

The Paris attacks of Friday 13th Nov., 2015 though were claimed by those suicidal/homicidal terrorists, to be in revenge for French State actions in Syria but they were NOT conducted by anyone attached to the Assad regime, which tho' vilified by 'The West'; Israel; Turkey & the Arab Despots - is still The Only Multi-Confessional Show in town ... this side of Independently Invigilated Free & Fair Elections in future.

The perps were ISIS/ISIL/Da'esh and these RWNJ fanatics, have been facilitated by 'USUK', The Saudis and other Arab oligarchs and despots & every NATO & regional ally in the area since the original, multi-confessional, popular secular uprising for greater individual liberty and civil-rights in Syria ... was totally usurped by RWNJ ''Islamist'' elements and ... a Foreign Legion of Saudi/'USUK' enabled Jihadi fighters.

The purpose of that Frankenstein's Monster was to be an agent of the Balkanization of Syria & probably Iraq too, as well as to draw out and destroy Hizbollah in Lebanon and so help isolate Iran even further in the longer run. However, Russia's active help of the Internationally Recognized Legal Govt. of Syria & to an extent the ''Iran Deal'' too, has now revealed the West/NATO/Arab Despots to be the real bad actors.

Now that the regional; diplomatic; strategic; battlefield & propaganda tables have been turned around in Syria, perfidious France & 'USUK' are left exposed & in dire need to now beat the dog that they've been feeding all along!!! Alas The Doggy does NOT like this and so it bites back!! Are we surprised?! Also fyi:

Consider that Herman Goering once explained how easy it is to get people to go along with “the bidding of the leaders … All you have to do is tell them they are being attacked and - denounce the pacifists for lack of patriotism and exposing the country to danger. It works the same in any country,” he said. Sigh.

solitudinem faciunt et pacem appellant ...

(they make it a desert & call it peace) ...

[-] 3 points by beautifulworld (23616) 6 years ago

A Cha-Ching moment is what I fear the Paris Attacks will become for the Military Industrial Complex to continue it's parade of drone strikes, bombings, oppression and imperialism as it "brings" democracy to the rest of the world.

"The latest attack will lead to a greater backlash and greater levels of Islamophobia. But it is not Muslims who are the problem but the foreign policies that have helped create terrorism."

Yep, pretty much that's what we're gonna get. No one is going to seek the roots of this violence and try to fix what is wrong. They will simply produce more weapons and spend more money "protecting" us all. And, then......they'll run to the banks with the profits.

[-] 1 points by ImNotMe (1488) 6 years ago

So - ''What Preceded The Islamic State Attacks In France?'':

Solidarity and compassion to all the victims of terrorism everywhere - including those who have fallen victim to the terrorism sponsored in all our names by 'FUKUS' (Fr.,UK, USA) & their NATO allies, for allegedly ''strategic purposes'' but actually for geo-political resource wars, hegemony & naked power!

Innocent Afghans had nothing to do with 9/!! & Iraq, Libya and Syria were secular states - tho' of course oppressive and totalitarian. It was For Those Populations to transform and evolve their societies ... NOT for FUKUS/NATO to go gift them 'democracy'! Indeed I'd argue that secular democratic Arab states with Nationalised Oil Industries and Nationalised Central Banks - are The Last Thing that Western Corporate and Banking interests want and the same goes for the Despotic & Monarchic Oilygarchic Arab regimes, in case such countries actually democratise their societies & economies! This is intolerable to the 1%!!!

''UK, France and US are all experiencing the legacy of their sordid pasts, both distant and near in time'' & we can't bomb people into peace or terrorise them into submission! We are entitled to every emotion we can muster re. Paris .. but we are not entitled to ignorance or amnesia but most of all - we are NOT entitled to ''surprise.'' Further fyi, consider:

veritas vos liberabit ...

[-] 3 points by beautifulworld (23616) 6 years ago

John Pilger on ISIS and Khmer Rouge, a comparison:


"What Nixon and Kissinger began, Pol Pot, their beneficiary, completed. Under their bombs, the Khmer Rouge grew to a formidable army of 200,000."

"ISIS has a similar past and present. By most scholarly measure, Bush and Blair’s invasion of Iraq in 2003 led to the deaths of at least 700,000 people – in a country that had no history of jihadism."

"ISIS is the progeny of those in Washington, London and Paris who, in conspiring to destroy Iraq, Syria and Libya, committed an epic crime against humanity. Like Pol Pot and the Khmer Rouge, ISIS are the mutations of a western state terror dispensed by a venal imperial elite undeterred by the consequences of actions taken at great remove in distance and culture. Their culpability is unmentionable in “our” societies, making accomplices of those who suppress this critical truth."

"A truce – however difficult to negotiate and achieve – is the only way out of this maze; otherwise, the atrocities in Paris and Beirut will be repeated. Together with a truce, the leading perpetrators and overseers of violence in the Middle East — the Americans and Europeans – must themselves “de-radicalise” and demonstrate a good faith to alienated Muslim communities everywhere, including those at home. There should be an immediate cessation of all shipments of war materials to Israel and recognition of the State of Palestine. The issue of Palestine is the region’s most festering open wound, and the oft-stated justification for the rise of Islamic extremism. Osama bin Laden made that clear. Palestine also offers hope. Give justice to the Palestinians and you begin to change the world around them."

Another brilliant piece from Counterpunch.

And, from your HuffPo piece on Wahhabism:

"Saudi Arabia's internal discord and tensions over ISIS can only be understood by grasping the inherent (and persisting) duality that lies at the core of the Kingdom's doctrinal makeup and its historical origins." "...Wahhabism was forcefully changed from a movement of revolutionary jihad and theological takfiri purification, to a movement of conservative social, political, theological, and religious da'wa (Islamic call) and to justifying the institution that upholds loyalty to the royal Saudi family and the King's absolute power."

"On the one hand, ISIS is deeply Wahhabist. On the other hand, it is ultra radical in a different way. It could be seen essentially as a corrective movement to contemporary Wahhabism."

"Why should we be surprised then, that from Prince Bandar's Saudi-Western mandate to manage the insurgency in Syria against President Assad should have emerged a neo-Ikhwan type of violent, fear-inducing vanguard movement: ISIS? And why should we be surprised -- knowing a little about Wahhabism -- that "moderate" insurgents in Syria would become rarer than a mythical unicorn? Why should we have imagined that radical Wahhabism would create moderates? Or why could we imagine that a doctrine of "One leader, One authority, One mosque: submit to it, or be killed" could ever ultimately lead to moderation or tolerance?"

[-] 5 points by MattHolck0 (3867) 6 years ago

There should be an immediate cessation of all shipments of war materials.

[-] 5 points by ImNotMe (1488) 6 years ago

I'd argue that Secular Democratic Arab States - with Nationalised Oil Industries and Nationalised Central Banks ... are The Last Thing that Western Corporate and Banking interests want and the same goes for the Venal, Despotic & Monarchic/Oilygarchic Arab regimes - just in case such countries should actually democratise their societies & economies!! This is intolerable to the 0.01%! -- (Repeated almost verbatim from Para 2 in my prior reply above) + I do believe that that is an approximation of a probable deep truth.

Thank you for an absolutely great article from the ever irrepressible John Pilger - whose work I have been following for over 30 years. However, he made one major omission - the malign influence of The Wahhabi Dictatorship that is The K.S.A. - but you stitched Alistair Crooke's piece here very neatly & necessarily!!

The Sunni Islamic Body-Politic has actually been infected by a puritanical ideology - born of the 250+ year alliance of the arch-reactionary Saudi Royal Family {Racket!} with a super-conservative Wahhabi Ulema [a council of religious elders & right-wing cabal!]- that does not question The Absolute Right of Kings! Until we wake up to the deep alliance of Neocon; 'FUKUS'/NATO Neo-colonialism & Neoliberal Economic Imperialism with The Saudi Wahhabi Tyranny & its satellite despots .. then we are going to remain terrorised and manipulated in the dark,as we get played by one horror after another; here, over there or somewhere and anywhere! I'll stop now, take a breath and sincerely recommend the following:

an important read that Max Blumenthal ends with: ''For the handful of ideologues guiding the forever war, those personal and political benefits justified the price of failure. After the latest assault on Paris, it’s not surprising to see them clamoring for more force, more surveillance, more silence from progressives and - more airtime for themselves. As they occupy the political center, the grayzone fades to black.'' Finally...

''So much rhetoric about terrorism; so many calls to act. Yet (our) foreign policy demonstrates just how empty such words are. Our allies are up to their necks in complicity with terrorism, but as long as there is money to be made & weapons to sell, our rulers’lips will remain stubbornly sealed.'' I end with a video:


cave - bellum se ipsum alet ...

(beware - war that feeds itself)

[-] 4 points by beautifulworld (23616) 6 years ago

"Millions of human lives lost in the Middle East, tens of millions of men, women and children murdered by imperialism in Africa? Who cares? Who bloody cares? Westerner eats, copulates, sometimes works and then he either tries to enjoy his life, or he fights for much better benefits... for himself, or for herself. Rest of the world is there to provide or to subsidize such benefits; that is all."

From the telesurvtv link. A bit dramatic but all true isn't it? The state of affairs IS dramatic isn't it? The fact that so much empathy is given to Paris but not to Beirut is dramatic isn't it? The West needs to change a. the way it treats other parts of the world and b. the way it treats it's own 99% because those two matters are forever connected.

[-] 3 points by ImNotMe (1488) 6 years ago

''John Pilger on Paris, ISIS and Media Propaganda'' --- (A Video Interview)

Only if we subscribe to Universal Human Rights for all ... is progress possible.

Thanx for the excerpt & ''cris de coeur''. A Better World is possible. Solidarity.

ad iudicium ...

[-] 4 points by beautifulworld (23616) 6 years ago

"A Day in the Life of Palestine" all being ignored with one Israeli crime after the other." Pilger

"So much money has been made out of the suffering of the people in the Middle East."

And, now, here in the U.S., the leading Republican candidate, Donald Trump, says the U.S. should simply ban all Muslims from coming into this nation. So, basically, bringing full on fascism to the U.S.

Bringing all of this fanaticism and fear and hatred to an end is the challenge of the time, but I'd say you have to start with loving hearts, without that, you've got nothing.

[-] 2 points by ImNotMe (1488) 6 years ago

IF you all vote Trump in .. there will be A Hell Toupee!!! However - we shall Overcomb someday!! The Trump (GOP Brainfarter Extraodinaire) is a Demagogue and as a potential PotUS, deeply alarming!

IF a Two State Solution is to be tenable for those who still believe in its possibility, then we really need to listen to Prof. Norman Finkelstein (who speaks with utter clarity here in debate) & then honestly ask:

Love; Light and Logic - all the way. For those who believe in a Two State Solution (as most of the world seems to do) - Finkelstein shows the way and the clarity of his analysis - gives Zionism, a last chance!

respice; adspice; prospice ...

[-] 4 points by beautifulworld (23616) 6 years ago

Fascist Trump is getting called out for his disgusting, racist, jingoistic remarks. He does not represent this nation but a segment of sickos that have hate in their hearts.

"A Note on Trump: We are No Longer Entertained"


[-] 2 points by ImNotMe (1488) 6 years ago

''At a rally on board an aircraft carrier, the true character of Donald Trump’s presidential campaign is apparent – fascism with a cartoon face.'' - by Laurie Penny, from:

From your great article by Arianna Huffington ... ''As we've seen in the Republican race so far, Trump's worst comments don't occur in a vacuum --- or land without repercussions. They affect the tenor of the conversation, frequently moving the line between what is considered mainstream & what is considered unabashedly extreme and unacceptable.''

multum in parvo ...

[-] 2 points by beautifulworld (23616) 6 years ago

Honor means nothing to Trump. But winning does. And, who is a better choice for beating his racist, xenophobic, greedy, hateful, ignorant ass? Bernie Sanders is.

"Bernie Sanders destroys Trump by 13 points, 6 more than Clinton: Here's Why"


[-] 1 points by MattHolck0 (3867) 6 years ago

want no republican mutt & democrat jeff show

[-] 2 points by beautifulworld (23616) 6 years ago

Finkelstein quotes Gandhi "All compromise is based on give and take. But there can be no give and take on fundamentals. Any compromise on fundamentals is a surrender for it is all give and no take. The time for compromise can only come when both sides are of one mind on fundamentals."

What are the basic principles upon which a settlement of the conflict should be built? What are the fundamentals that no one has a right to tell Palestinians they must compromise or make concessions on?

Finkelstein says those fundamentals are:

Principles of International law

Principles of Human rights

These principles offer some relief for oppressed peoples and commands a broad legitimacy. They also are in agreement about the Israel/Palestine issue.

Supposedly, the peace process is so complicated at it's ending stage that we cannot complete the peace. But, those final status issues are: settlements, East Jerusalem, the right of the refugees, borders.

Where do borders belong? What are the rights of settlers? What are the rights of refugees expelled in 1948 & 1967? And to whom does East Jerusalem belong?

Finkelstein breaks down the Israel/Palestine conflict and looks at it in a detached non-emotional yet legally based and human rights based way. What is legal? What follows international laws an internationally accepted human rights?

It's not really as complicated as some involved would like us to think. Just follow the law....According to international law and the highest court on earth:

Israel has no title to any of the West Bank or any of Gaza. They are occupied Palestinian territories.

Israel has no title to East Jerusalem. East Jerusalem is occupied Palestinian territory.

The 500,000 Jewish settlers in the occupied Palestinian territories: It is illegal to transfer the population from an occupier country to an occupied country. All the Israeli settlements are illegal under international law.

Thank you for the link to that great video of Norman Finkelstein.

[-] 4 points by ImNotMe (1488) 6 years ago

''Number of Palestinian Children in Israeli Prisons Doubles'' by Charlotte Silver:

Thanx for your excellent critique of Norman Finkelstein's utterly clear analysis &, I just can't recommend that video lecture/debate enough.I believe that it will reward ALL interested & engaged readers/watchers!

multum in parvo ...

[-] 2 points by beautifulworld (23616) 6 years ago

"Lawyers from human rights groups, including the Public Committee Against Torture in Israel, Addameer and Defense for Children International–Palestine, have all collected testimonies from children, who report being beaten, denied adequate food and held in moldy and frigid jail cells.

Children told Addameer's lawyer during a 3 December visit that they suffer from nightmares, sleep disorders and are subjected to beatings, threats and sleep deprivation."

That's happening in Israel.

Not much different, here, our police shoot and kill innocent children and get away with it.


Human rights violations, in my opinion.

[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (33802) from Coon Rapids, MN 6 years ago

Ted Crud does not know if sand can glow in the dark - but he wants to find out. Nuclear threat Ted?

Still - no one discussing how to wage peace health and prosperity - everyone still locked on to waging violence as the way to peace.

F'n idiots.

[-] -2 points by grapes (5232) 6 years ago

What? Non-westerners do not eat and copulate? I wish that it were true. My parents copulated, so did their parents, and their parents, and theirs, and so on, from time immemorial. Parthenogenesis did not run in MY family. Did it run elsewhere in the non-western world?

The Catholic Church claimed parthenogenesis (perhaps karyotype of 45X) of Jesus but his FIRST miracle(John 2) was to turn water into wine (why would Islam prohibit the drinking of alcohol if Muslims revere Jesus (Prophet Isa) who created wine, according to the Bible? Before his crucifixion, Jesus had asked his disciples to drink wine [as his blood] in remembrance of him) to celebrate a pending copulation (a.k.a. a wedding). WTF! Well, at least I have not heard from the Church promising 72 virgins in paradise yet.

[-] -2 points by grapes (5232) 6 years ago

Don't EVER compare Paris with Beirut in terms of U.S. empathy. Blood runs deep. Purportedly, Iran and Hezbollah murdered hundreds of U.S. and French servicemen in the 1983 Beirut Barracks Bombing while they were participating in the U.N. peacekeeping mission there.

Anyone who was politically conscious got the message, loud and clear, that the Middle East including Iran and the Islamic beyond is a cesspool. Je me souviens but not the mega-wiener drunkard (the empty suit who used the culturally abrasive term, "crusade," and took Musharraf as a democratically-come-to-power President when said empty suit was questioned during candidacy) who commanded the U.S. back to suck turd there. I absolutely believe that said drunkard was non-Islamic due to alcoholic consumption.

If Hezbollah had joined the U.S. to fight the Taliban harboring Osama bin Laden after 9/11 attack, it would have improved relations but no, we were again bleeding with the French there in a seemingly interminable blood knot of brotherhood. Blood's deep.

[-] 2 points by MattHolck0 (3867) 6 years ago

Eiffel tower lights down while the rest of the world lights up



[-] 2 points by ImNotMe (1488) 6 years ago

Re. Paris, how can we explain our identification with French suffering ... but our apparent indifference to Lebanese suffering last week? Or more to the point - how do we explain our indifference to the suffering of people we perceive as different .. be they Lebanese, African, Arab, Asian, Muslim ... Or Other Brown people? Do the humans now under our NATO bombs OR, those we sold to our various Arab allies, also want safety & stability; peace & prospects, for their kids? Are they too terrorised by drones & bombs?! What are our Saudi allies doing in Yemen right now? What's been happening in Bahrain? Do we care?!! Or are we victims of ''Weapons of Mass Distraction'' to such an extent .. that only White Lives Matter?!!!

fiat justitia et fiat pax ...

[-] 1 points by grapes (5232) 6 years ago

The message from the Middle East and the Islamic world has been, "Stay out of our business!" The golden (balmy vacation) city of old, Beirut, of Lebanon, had long been subsumed by civil wars with many international players manipulating it. It is not indifference but a very wise and protective form of compassion fatigue for that part of the world.

For me at least, skin color is NOT the issue. Brown, black, yellow, white, or whatever does not matter but the coherent dedication to Liberty and the willingness to defend it at all costs do. By all costs, I literally mean the willingness to feed oneself, spouse, children, grandchildren, possessions, and all else into the "meat grinder" if need be in defense of Liberty.

I sympathize with all those suffering from drones (non-ground combat tools) and bombs but it is really their choice to stay there. I therefore support the resettlement of refugees and if you think that I am just a stupid francophile, I condemn the mistreatment of refugees at Calais, France.

All lives matter but man's got to know his limitations.

"Render unto Islamic world what's Islamic world's and render unto America what's America's," with America denoting 20°W to 160°E longitudes.

[-] 3 points by ImNotMe (1488) 6 years ago

A "coherent dedication to Liberty'' - sounds like hubris & a contrived national mythos/ethos to me but its primary defense needs to be of & by .. The 99%, against the constant predations of The 0.01% Parasite Class Oligarchs and their 1% hired-help! IF you have to feed youself and your loved ones ''into the ''meat grinder'' in defense of Liberty'' - then you really have to ask yourself ... ''Just How Free Are You?!'' Do we think that Johnny Foreigner loves his family & has his view of what ''free'' is & may not want it from us?!!!

As for: ''I sympathize with all those suffering from drones (non-ground combat tools) and bombs but it is really their choice to stay there'' .. well that is just bullshit & suppose ''Terrorists'' were to take that view of our alleged democracies and say - ''Y'all are guilty of X,Y or Z because YOUR democratically elected governments came all the way to destroy .. Afghanistan, Iraq, Libya, Syria, Yemen et al ... for their own nefarious ends but you choose to live there!'' -Would that then be any possible justification (as opposed to 'reasons') for wanton murder & mayhem in our societies? I think not! Yet you just did the same, imo!!

The USA is an Empire but Americans have been in generational denial about that because it just does not fit with their (mis)education and sense of self. Then reality bites .. and people end up in a cognitive dissonance and become ripe for falling prey to the MSMManipulators of fear & loathing - ready for war!

fiat lux ...

[-] 4 points by Viking (417) 6 years ago

I agree. When we promote violence on a large scale, we should not be surprised when the same comes back to haunt us.

[-] 3 points by beautifulworld (23616) 6 years ago

Iraq War Casualties:


And, that's just the recent war. Looking back farther to the 19th and 20th centuries we realize that you can't colonize and enslave people and then expect them to be your great friends, especially if you continue to discriminate against them and oppress them once they are "free."

The UK, France and the US are all experiencing the legacy of their sordid pasts, both distant and near in time.

[-] 4 points by Viking (417) 6 years ago

I agree with Senator Lindsey Graham when he says that the recent attack on French citizens in Paris ".. is an attack on human decency.." The same was true after 9/11. My question is, 'why aren't the maiming and deaths of hundreds of thousands of women, children and other innocents in Palestine and Iraq viewed in the same manner?' Is there something more wholesome or acceptable being victimized by drone attacks, cluster, white phosphorous or depleted uranium bombs?

The implicit, xenophobic message that is being propagated by the West is, their lives don't matter, and that we are of a higher moral character.. I can't see it.

Non-French War Deaths Matter - [Not In Today's World, Do They]


[-] 5 points by ImNotMe (1488) 6 years ago

What came first: cause or effect; action or reaction; a chicken or an egg?!

Bombing Johnny Dark Skinned Foreigner, from 20k feet is okay because..

They are used to dying & don't love their lives & kids like us, in The West!

My oh my how memories are lost when minds are managed by the MSM!

“It is the job of thinking people, not to be on the side of the executioners,” - said Albert Camus. Please go back to thinking, France. We do love you and wish you well and are deeply sorry for U.S. influence against your better tendencies'' de liberté, égalité et fraternité! - Solidarité à vous et à toutes les victimes sous nos bombes aussi - hier, aujourd'hui et demain!! Désolé et pardon.

& http://www.alternet.org/world/krugman-right-wingers-dont-get-paris-terrorists-want-provoke-france-war

Further consider http://www.alternet.org/media/context-free-coverage-terror-helps-perpetuate-its-causes


Finally, a li'l video to break & heal the human heart: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UwBcYMaz0Jg

amor vincit omnia ...

[-] 3 points by beautifulworld (23616) 6 years ago

"..why aren't the maiming and deaths of hundreds of thousands of women, children and other innocents in Palestine and Iraq viewed in the same manner?'"

Therein lies the most important question because in the answer to that question is where we find the solution.

[-] 1 points by grapes (5232) 6 years ago

Let me try at some answers: Palestine and Iraq are NOT members of N.A.T.O. France and the U.S. are both members of the mutual defense pact so yeah, I am certainly riveted to watch if France invokes Article 5 which the U.S. did after 9/11/2001 for Afghanistan.

Additionally, France and the U.S.A. go back a long long way, to before there was even a U.S.A. The Founding Fathers counted amongst themselves quite a few francophiles. Without French gunpowder, Rochambeau, Lafayette, soldiers, or fleet, there might well just be a bunch of subjugated and dejected British colonies here.

Without Napoleon selling the vast Mississippi Valley territory to the U.S. in the Louisiana Purchase, the U.S. would have never become a continental superpower which became capable of seizing France back from the Nazis at hefty costs of American lives and returned it to the French people. There would have neither been Statute of Liberty in New York's harbor nor Lafayette Park right in the heart of Washington D.C.

Yes, the U.S.A. owes France much so it goes mutually (Liberté, Égalité, Fraternité). Blood runs deep.

[-] 4 points by Viking (417) 6 years ago

So because of our long, shared history with France, we should not view the lives or the deaths of Middle Easterners in the same way that we view French lives? That way of thinking seems parochially immoral to me, and it contradicts who we are, or pretend to be anyway. One reason we most likely don't value the lives, or choose not to understand the despair of people of a different color, or culture, and/or who are victims of our war and aggression, is because France is an ally in our in our neocolonial pursuits similar to the way it was with colonialism. The other reason unfortunately is because xenophobia and bigotry still 'rules' today with the help of a corporate owned media that has befuddled our senses, and a corrupt economic system that thrives on inequality, and the degradation of our planet, while ignoring our most pressing plight, inarguably Climate Change.

We see some of the same injustices that people endure here in this country too, and now it's us white dudes who are experiencing it! Damn! Think, "Black Lives Matter," and Occupy Wall Street.

France and other allied, Western countries along with multi national corporations will all have a place setting at the table, not you, me or the majority of us who will become the obedient proletariat if they were to succeed.

We both have a long history of colonialism. It's no different now, well except we are now the perpetrators of Empire, not the victims of it.. In our Revolution, our radical ancestors were proudly thought of as 'Revolutionaries,' or patriots. And why the hell did they rebel anyway... just because of 'taxation without representation?!' It's not like the Brits exploited our resources to the same degree that we do now, throughout the World too, and have done for well over 100 years in the Middle East... while installing despotic leaders who worked with us to the severe detriment of their people.

Today, anyone in far off lands who fights back against subjugation, or injustice is considered a radical or a 'terrorist.' Many people, including the corrupt elite now, are terrified, and consider us the 'radicals' for wanting to upset the apple cart that they worked so hard to install,* and for us wanting a more equitable and peaceful World. Imagine that!

More ground attacks, aerial bombings, and terrorist attacks is not a solution, but it does please everyone immensely in the MIC. Pursuing that principle is not appeasement,' rather it is moral and it is the only thing that will work, for either of us.

Only light extinguishes darkness.

[-] 3 points by MattHolck0 (3867) 6 years ago

"radical" means root and is not a bad word

[-] 4 points by Viking (417) 6 years ago

Just about any term that can be put on people who threaten the corrupt status quo, and promotes a more just society will be conflated with negative connotations.

[-] -1 points by grapes (5232) 6 years ago

Every country has a neighborhood so do Iraq and Palestine. Where is the Middle East Treaty Organization similar to N.A.T.O. to protect them?

If I recall correctly, Iraq asked the U.S. to pay for rebuilding the damaged oil facilities after our excision of Saddam Hussein from power. The U.S. left lots of weapons with Iraq to defend itself but the Iraqi security forces surrendered most of them to ISIL at Mosul. I could not possibly imagine how such numerical manpower and weapon superiority of the Iraqis over ISIL could count for so little. Where was the bravery for a free people?

Palestinians rejoiced in the streets upon hearing the news of 9/11/2001 attack. Don't they know that such acts on ANY human victims are obscene? As I recall even the people who kept on chanting "Death to America!" condemned such acts.

Let's see how U.S. involvements turned out: Iraq - full-bore invasion, Libya - intelligence and logistics support, Syria - nearly nothing (aside from humanitarian aids in nearby countries). None turned out well regardless of the level of the involvement. France warned the U.S. about invading Iraq but our mega-wiener administration was still captured by Cold War nation-state ideology and damned the fermenting wine-and-cheese country's advice. Oh, yeah, I remember the "freedom fries." As it had turned out, real friends don't let ideologues drive blind.

[-] 4 points by Viking (417) 6 years ago

It kinda sounds like you think we invaded Iraq with good intentions, and people who opposed us should not be so angry, or regal when we experience a comparative smidgen of barbarity. Do you think that it has been our goal to spread democracy and peace throughout the World? lol When the British and American intelligence agencies collaborated and deposed a democratically elected Prime Minister in Iran... who took his place? And what about Chile and the assistance we gave in the coup which overthrew another popularly elected leader, Salvador Allende? Do you reckon that the brutal dictator, Pinochet who replaced him, and our true friend, was an improvement? I reckon that a lot of the Chileans that might disagree with you are no longer able to speak.

The West has a long history of promoting strife, mostly in the form of sectarianism, and supporting brutal regimes that are friendly to us, and our interests in the Middle East. That's because it makes it far easier for us to extricate their resources as it becomes less likely that Sunnis and Shiites will collaborate to install something better. In that light, it should not be surprising to you that a region that has been suppressed for generations does not have the institutions needed that would, or could make a difference for the better. The distractive methods of maintaining control that are used there are in place here too, just different players. Haven't you noticed?

[-] -1 points by grapes (5232) 6 years ago

After Operation Desert Shield/Storm, there was NO U.S. march to Baghdad but Saddam Hussein kept on playing games violating the terms of the ceasefire. The U.S. was at least partly fooled by Iraqi exiles into undertaking Operation Iraqi Freedom. Some exiles gained power in Iraq.

Being democratically elected does NOT entitle anyone to confiscate private properties. That was the strife the U.S. had with Iran (Mossadegh), Cuba (Castro), and Venezuela (Chavez). Seizure of ill-gotten properties by the state must proceed through a legal channel under the supervision of an independent judiciary. That is what we mean by a Nation of Law. Democracy can be fickle as Socrates' drinking hemlock showed. One moment, they sentenced him to death and another moment they regretted that he had committed suicide as commanded. The arbitrariness of the disposition of private properties underlies much of the strife of our world.

[-] 5 points by ImNotMe (1488) 6 years ago

Private Property & Profit Rights do NOT trump wider political, social and economic rights and that is just the kind of Corporate Pro-Business, at any and all costs dogma - that the Neocons and Neoliberals, like Trump and HRC & nearly all Corporate Donkeys & Elephants spew. It is the dark doctrine at the heart of 'The Powell Memo', THE most pervasive & insidious anti-99% document in history, I'd argue + fyi see:

Further, re. ''Being democratically elected does NOT entitle anyone to confiscate private properties.That was the strife the U.S. had with Iran (Mossadegh) ...'' etc., that logic was rejected by the Iranian people who wanted and still want their extensive hydro-carbon and mineral resources to be utilised for the good of wider society & not primarily for private profit. Ergo re.Iran, some true facts may help bring some light:

The problem with ''democracy'', is that it is underdeveloped and almost irrespective of where we live, we all have Democracy Deficits to differing degrees. Eg.USA's Duopoly & UK's 24% Voted Tory Govt. now, both claim to be paragons of democracy but clearly they are NOT - especially after 2008 Bank Bailouts, when most people'd have let Crapitalism take its Darwinian course - NOT Socialism For Banks instead!

People Over Profit! Resistance Is Fertile!! As “Despair Is Not An Option”, by Senator Bernie Sanders; from a speech he gave in Wisconsin on Sept.17/2011,the very day OWS kicked off!''We have the people behind us. They have the money. And at the end of the day, the people will be stronger than the money''

''Our job is to simply bring to fruition, what the overwhelming majority of the American people want. They want an economy that works for the middle class and working families and not just for the rich. - They want everybody in this country to have health care as a right. - They want to protect Social Security, Medicare and Medicaid. And they want to move away from these gross inequalities in income and wealth.''

respice; adspice; prospice ...

[-] 1 points by grapes (5232) 6 years ago

Universal inalienable rights from our Declaration of Independence include: Life, Liberty, and the Pursuit of Happiness.

Thomas Jefferson substituted the Pursuit of Happiness for Properties to give wider political, social, and economic rights a real crack at superseding Properties, done primarily because of the festering issue of slavery. The Pursuit of Happiness is sufficiently slippery to bolster the argument for collecting taxes to promote the common welfare. However, respecting properties underlies the foundations of all civilized societies. Whilst I certainly clamor for reining in the profit motive (too much of it makes Capitalism crash persistently), I support a modicum of moderation about properties because I had seen why Communism and Fascism had failed - they lacked respect of properties.

[-] 3 points by ImNotMe (1488) 6 years ago

When Corporations arrogate the Rights of Real Humans (a' la the ''Citizens United'' horse-shit!) - should we then also let their (specious and contrived) ''property rights'' .. Trump (pun intended!) everyone else's Human, Civil, Social, Economic & Political - Rights?! I don't think so & I do NOT agree that ''respecting properties underlies the foundations of all civilized societies.'' - At All!! The Corporate MSM has got you all vexed in case The 99% Masses come for your shit, right grapes? I've News For You (unless you are a 0.01% Parasite Class member!) but you and your stuff are safe ... so STOP dancing to your Masters' Tunes & DON'T be a Turkey Voting For Thanksgiving, ffs!!! Also as I wish you a Happy Thanxgiving - fyi:

What do you think Thomas Jefferson would've made of today's ''Citizens United'' & US Corporatocracy?! As the founding fathers had a healthy scepticism & disdain for Bankers ... what would they think now?!! Where's the ''modicum of moderation'' - being exercised by the Kochs, Waltons & other US Oligarchs?!!!

radix omnium malorum est cupiditas ...

[-] 1 points by grapes (5232) 6 years ago

Venezuela is in very hot water now despite its owning the world's greatest proven reserve of oil. Not only can Communism and Fascism fail due to the disrespect of properties, so can Socialism and Internationalism. Without the proper technology and sufficient infrastructure to convert oil to electricity, Venezuela gets frequent blackouts, every Friday off for people, and two weeks of two-day workweek for public sector workers. Resources staying in the ground not made usable to the people do them no good.

How did it get into such a mess? Disrespect of properties by Hugo Chavez!

P.S. People used bigger leaves before there was tissue paper and Venezuela being so well endowed with fertile land, forests, etc. should have some leaves suitable for that. Desperate times call for desperate measures.

[-] 1 points by ImNotMe (1488) 6 years ago

Yes, Venezuela is in dire straights & difficulties assail The 99% there - but ''the world's greatest proven reserve of oil" are still in the earth - and frankly ones hopes in the light of AGW, that that is where they stay BUT ... just who, do you propose such "properties", belong to? The 1% or 0.01% Oligarchs?! The International Hydro-Carbon Corporations?!! NO, The 99% I say as did Hugo Chavez .. who changed the lives of the vast majority of that country,for the better!!! But I do agree that the solutions to Venezuela's problems lay with The Venezuelan 99% & they must be honest & democratically come to decisions to turn things around but rest assured grapes - all the resources of the US & International Capital are now ranged against them. Also consider this article, which I think you'll find both interesting and relevant ...

multum in parvo ...

[-] -1 points by grapes (5232) 6 years ago

The sanctions on Iran have been VERY effective in protecting the hydrocarbon and mineral resources for the future welfare of the Iranian people. Keep the sanctions up to help the people of Iran. What is wrong with this argument?

Norway has been exploiting its North Sea hydrocarbon resources detracting from the future welfare of the Norwegian people so sanctions on Norway must be imposed! We must NEVER tolerate the exploitation of the wealth of any people.

[-] 5 points by ImNotMe (1488) 6 years ago

Re. Iran - ''what is wrong with'' your argument is that it is not any kind of argument at all! At best, it is an attempt at some kind of post factum specious justification for actions taken a'priori and at worst it's Pro-Corporate War Mongering Nonsense. The USG and its MIC don't give a fuck about The Iranian 99% & to suggest that they could or would is slimey & disingenuous, in the extreme. So - ''Keep the sanctions up to help the people of Iran'' is Utter Bullshit! Norway's Sovereign Wealth Fund will be a thing of wonder for its people in future. Iran and Libya had those too - before sanctions and outright wars were unleashed & given that we're now Post-''Iran-Deal'', for what purpose do you propose maintaining sanctions for?! + fyi:

The last question I have left now of your specious; Corporate talk with forked tongued; double speak, is:

cui bono?!

[-] 1 points by grapes (5232) 6 years ago

"The West has a long history of promoting strife, mostly in the form of sectarianism, and supporting brutal regimes that are friendly to us, and our interests in the Middle East. That's because it makes it far easier for us to extricate their resources as it becomes less likely that Sunnis and Shiites will collaborate to install something better."

When did the Sunnis and the Shiites start hating each other? The West at that time was mostly barbarians, wouldn't you agree? They had enough of each other to kill and slaughter than to mess with creating the strifes between the Sunnis and Shiites.

I consider Iran to be a brutal regime still, on the human rights front. Do you condemn the Iran nuclear deal? I certainly don't. Lifting sanctions to let Iran sell more oil on the world market is detrimental to the oil industries of North America. There have already been many lost jobs and suicides but it is a price of the deal. I hate people calling letting Iran sell oil as further exploitation of Iran by the West. The fact is that even after the sanctions have been lifted, Iran can still choose not to have its resources be exploited and sell not a single drop of its oil.

Iran in my mind is schizophrenic, with an overbearing theocracy riding on top of a restless young-people's democracy. From a responsible parent's standpoint, the religious leaders' admonishing the young makes some sense but according to western standards some measures are way overboard.

I used to subscribe to the Old Testament's damnation of homosexual marriages. I no longer do because I see that having stronger social bonds is good for society. In the olden days, the overt flaunting of homosexuality and obsessive hiding were overboard but that has become rather blasé, a non-issue now.

Does Iran have to execute homosexuals? Does Iran have to stone adulteresses? They seem so medieval. These issues are for Sunnis, too, not just for Iran alone, because Sunnis are even more barbaric in some ways.

[-] 1 points by ImNotMe (1488) 6 years ago

Though the Shia/Sunni split goes back to the very earliest days of Islam, both denominations have been living with each other since then in relative peace. The real problem arrives in the mid-eighteenth century with the creation of the first Saudi state and the doctrinal linkage to Wahhabism - itself li'l more than the Saudi Family Royal Cult!! That ultra-anti-Shia doctrine has now been spread its insidious tentacles right across the Sunni Muslim World, lubricated by Saudi Oil Money & a divide et impera world view! Also fyi:

Iran for all its faults is a much more functional country and culture than the RWNJ Saudis. Their biggest crime in the eyes of The Empire - is Independence. I do NOT condemn the ''Iran Deal'' - and indeed I am very happy that it happened.You make valid points & criticisms however there's much more to Iran, than meets the MSM-Mind-Managed ''Western'' Eye so maybe consider my more substantive reply to u here

You say that you, ''used to subscribe to the Old Testament's damnation of homosexual marriages.'' & I appreciate your candour in that regard. Therefore, just like you evolved your thinking and attitudes, then so can Iran in due course. However prejudice and bigotry is NOT restricted to Iran alone by any means! Finally barbarism is as ''barbaric'' does & we'd do well never to forget our own complicity in illegal wars!!

respice; adspice; prospice ...

[-] 1 points by MattHolck0 (3867) 6 years ago

Palestinians rejoiced in the streets upon hearing the news of 9/11/2001 attack. Don't they know that such acts on ANY human victims are obscene? As I recall even the people who kept on chanting "Death to America!" condemned such acts.

as 911, Palestinian footage of people celebrating Paris Attack unlikely

Livewire running "coded communication" tells guberment "investigators" she's ISIS claims paris shooting credit unbelievable

[-] 1 points by grapes (5232) 6 years ago

No comprendo.

[-] 2 points by MattHolck0 (3867) 6 years ago

a syrian passport was found at the paris attacks

this has been what #NPR kept suggesting as a connection

[-] 2 points by grapes (5232) 6 years ago

That was a distraction alright. Syrian refugees must NOT be stigmatized because of that. EU needs better and more uniform border control for all its constituent states.

[-] 6 points by jtland (30) 9 years ago

He nailed it! great work Dennis.

[-] 1 points by shadz66 (19985) 9 years ago

Emphatic Ditto & re. 'DK' : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lv0smG7ptcM [6m].

Thanx for : http://vote-pedia.com/ from : http://occupywallst.org/forum/central-banks-create-money-and-commercial-banks-cr/ and please keep us posted here.

pax et lux ...

[-] 3 points by MattHolck0 (3867) 6 years ago

Beautiful World ‏@4beautifulworld 36m36 minutes ago

Don't forget #HillaryClinton was #SecretaryofState while #ISIS was forming. #DemDebate #BernieSanders #FeelTheBern #Bernie2016 0 retweets 1 like Matt Holck ‏@Matt_Holck 2m2 minutes ago

.@4beautifulworld #ISIS is the new fictional boogy man stop retweeting identi8fy the region we bomb as terrorist now

[-] 3 points by GirlFriday (17435) 9 years ago


I'm just going to set this right here and walk away.

[-] 2 points by DKAtoday (33802) from Coon Rapids, MN 9 years ago

Thx - book marked and tweeted = http://www.fair.org/index.php?page=3062

[-] 2 points by shadz66 (19985) 9 years ago

Kucinich : "Fact Checking the Media" : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o6k1VTmOPyE & sad sigh.

e tenebris, lux ...

[-] 1 points by GirlFriday (17435) 9 years ago

Thanks. Shadz, I am sharing this at this very moment.

[-] 1 points by shadz66 (19985) 9 years ago

"All we are saying is" : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RkZC7sqImaM & thanx 'GF'.

fiat pax ...

[-] 3 points by DKAtoday (33802) from Coon Rapids, MN 9 years ago

Is GIVE PEACE A CHANCE. Good one shadz.

[-] 1 points by shadz66 (19985) 9 years ago

"And now for something completely different" : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lv0smG7ptcM !!!

'Now THAT'S what we are talking about' !!

fiat lux ...

[-] 2 points by DKAtoday (33802) from Coon Rapids, MN 9 years ago

Thx - this is the kind of talk that Americans need to hear on a daily basis.

[-] 1 points by shadz66 (19985) 9 years ago

BIG Emphatic Ditto !!! Amen to that !! And again : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lv0smG7ptcM !

fiat justitia ...

[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (33802) from Coon Rapids, MN 9 years ago


[-] 1 points by shadz66 (19985) 9 years ago

"Dennis Kucinich and Chris Hedges on the 99 Percent" (Audio) :

A year old but still incisive.

verb. sat. sap. ...

[-] 1 points by shadz66 (19985) 9 years ago

Holy SH!T !!! Omg 'GF' !! This will have to be saved to favourites so that I can have a very private apoplectic fit later on so thanx - kinda !

respice, adspice, prospice ...

[-] 2 points by MattLHolck (16833) from San Diego, CA 9 years ago

the UN said there were no weapons of mass destruction and the press reported that

[-] 0 points by shadz66 (19985) 9 years ago

we are still living in the neo-con nightmare

[-] 3 points by MattLHolck (16833) from San Diego, CA 9 years ago

now the 2-Party candidates are selling off the 9/11/12 protest attack in Libya as a terrorist attack

[-] 0 points by shadz66 (19985) 9 years ago

Well it just might have been exactly that Matt - a targeted killing and the important question may be who really wanted this excellent diplomat ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/J._Christopher_Stevens ) and very knowledgeable 'Arabic Speaking Career Arabist' dead ?

Requiescat In Pace, CS.

[-] 3 points by MattLHolck (16833) from San Diego, CA 9 years ago

as long as we can dress the

Assignment of responsibility for the bombing and murders of 28 June is highly controversial because the attack led to the outbreak of World War I one month later.


we ain't fallen for that again

[-] 4 points by shadz66 (19985) 9 years ago

I hear you and know that history re. 'ADFoA' but of course this time, the war was over and Bengazi was the first city in Libya to 'rebel' and from where the entire 'rebellion' was coordinated from. The whole city was awash with 'US:UK:French' spooks and there's lots to 'fall' for in this game of 'smoke and mirrors', as it's all really about Libya's 'light, sweet crude' and Vast Underground Water and Gold Reserves !!!

Re. Libya, also please see :

verb. sat. sap. ...

[-] 2 points by DKAtoday (33802) from Coon Rapids, MN 9 years ago

"Weapons of Mass Distraction"

Like the health care debacle?

[-] 2 points by shadz66 (19985) 9 years ago

Re. US Health 'Care' : "Why I Voted NO", by Dennis Kucinich :

"We have been led to believe that we must make our health care choices only within the current structure of a predatory, for-profit insurance system which makes money not providing health care. We cannot fault the insurance companies for being what they are. But we can fault legislation in which the government incentivizes the perpetuation, indeed the strengthening, of the for-profit health insurance industry, the very source of the problem. When health insurance companies deny care or raise premiums, co-pays and deductibles they are simply trying to make a profit. That is our system."

qui tacet consentire ...

[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (33802) from Coon Rapids, MN 9 years ago

The whole construct of what is in place now is sad to say the least - but it is also - believe it or not a step in the correct direction. It is just that it was not as major a priority to immediately address as is the economy and the crime that crashed it. In fact both issues could have been addressed at the same time - but getting aid to the victims ( actual people ) should have been done 1st - and still has not been addressed.

[-] 2 points by beautifulworld (23616) 9 years ago

He was right back then and he is right now. Thanks for posting this and thanks for all the work you do here. :)

[-] -1 points by shadz66 (19985) 9 years ago

W. M. D. & 'Peace On Earth'


Words Matter Deeply so

We Must Define them.


"Weapons of Mass Destruction"

We May Define as

'Words of Mass Deception'.


We Must Denounce those

Workers of Mesmeric Delusion &

We Must Deny their

Words of Mass Distraction.


Wordsmiths for Mass Deception use

Words of Mania and Depression, to

Wield Mendacity and Duplicity and

Wreak Murderous Demons ...

Whilst Mothers Despair.


We May Declare but

We Must Decide and

Women Must Decry

What Men Defile, as

What 'Mankind' Discerns is



'Pacem In Terris' ...


Thanx 'bw' for your grace, wisdom and kind words & also ...

"Kucinich : US 'sanction warfare" : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SjSGFQYZAm0 .

multum in parvo ...

[-] 3 points by beautifulworld (23616) 9 years ago

Very nice! As William Wordsworth said "Poetry is the breath and finer spirit of all knowledge."

Love, not fear. Truth, not lies. Your poem says it all.

And, “We need to stop this vainglorious notion that somehow we can settle our differences with Iran through war.” Dennis Kucinich could not be more right.

[-] -1 points by shadz66 (19985) 9 years ago

"Dennis Kucinich : “Wake Up America !” : http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article20631.htm

"Former presidential candidate Rep. Dennis Kucinich delivered one of the most passionate addresses. “Wake up, America. We went into Iraq for oil. The oil companies want more,” Kucinich said. “War against Iran will mean $10-a-gallon gasoline. The oil administration wants to drill more, into your wallet. Wake up, America. Weapons contractors want more. An Iran war will cost 5 to 10 trillion dollars.”

Tnx 'bw' & 4u with 'The Grameen Bank' in mind too : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q7iLPnDCQ1g &

Re. 'The Grameen Bank' : http://occupywallst.org/forum/save-this-peoples-bank-votes-needed/ ~*~

pax, amor et lux ...

[-] 3 points by beautifulworld (23616) 9 years ago

Beautiful version of a beautiful song. Thanks. And, a bank for the poor. We shouldn't need it, but it is awesome.

[-] -1 points by shadz66 (19985) 9 years ago

Thankyou & amended link to 'DK : WUA' : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lv0smG7ptcM [6m].

Very Powerful Stuff & as you so succinctly said : "He was right back then and he is right now." :)

veritas vos liberabit ...

[-] 4 points by beautifulworld (23616) 9 years ago

Great freaking speech! Wake up America! It is a shame Americans don't listen to sensible people like Kucinich. Thanks for that. I'd forgotten what a good speaker he is.

[-] 4 points by beautifulworld (23616) 9 years ago

Thanks. Going sleepy now.

[-] 0 points by shadz66 (19985) 9 years ago

Sweet. Good Night 'bw' :) & later on, please do try to see 2nd link at 6:23 re 'Peace'.

@ 6:45, 'DK' : "IF Violence is a learnt response socially, why then can't Peace be .."

pax, amor et lux ..

[-] 4 points by beautifulworld (23616) 9 years ago

I'm glad to see that he thinks that losing will empower him to speak out even more. That is great.

Also, I love that idea of creating permanent structures in the government to focus on working against all kinds of violence at all levels to "rework the social compact" to teach other ways to respond to conflict such as peace giving, mutuality, viewing others as an aspect of yourself, etc. All very profound ideas from Kucinich.

He also talks about everything we could have done with the money we've spent on the wars such as education, universal healthcare, housing for all etc. He says "We could have the shining city on the hill instead of a country going to hell." That pretty much says it all.

[-] 1 points by shadz66 (19985) 9 years ago

Dennis Kucinich is head and shoulders above the rest of US Politicians from a 99% perspective and this is precisely why he has had his Congressional seat boundaries 'gerrymandered' to oust him. Thanx for your thought provocation & for further evidence of the man's integrity : 'The Truth', by Dennis Kucinich :

ad iudicium ...

[-] 4 points by beautifulworld (23616) 9 years ago

Wow. That's a great little video. He asks all the right questions. "Is this the Congress of the United States of America or the board of Goldman Sachs?" Hmmm.

[-] 0 points by shadz66 (19985) 9 years ago

That was a very short but very strong video & yep, your point is sound tho' the reactionaries are out early today (7am EST, Oct.14, '12 for the standing record for posterity, lol) as I had to 'twinkle' your comment because apparently what you said was so threatening that it required 'stinkling', lolol.

Re. Dennis Kucinich, I append some basic information :

As you so succinctly point out with your "Hmmm" as re. The US Congress, DK's -"Is this the Congress of the United States of America or the board of Goldman Sachs ?" - absolutely does say it all really.

ad iudicium ...

[-] 4 points by beautifulworld (23616) 9 years ago

He was a real thorn in the side of just about everyone in Congress as he spoke truth to power on a daily basis. They had to gerrymander him out which is a very sad sign of how poorly our democracy works. Let's hope he can be even more effective outside of office.

And, thanks for the links.

[-] 1 points by VQkag2 (16478) 9 years ago

The republicans have benefited most of all.

They exploited the 9/11 attacks to create an atmosphere of fear.

that they used to increase Military spending. Defense contractors that are their constituents and mainly in red states.

They used the fear to combine huge fed agencies into homeland security and attacked collective bargaining/strike rights based on national security. Thereby hurting democratic constituents.

They have used Iraq/Afghan as a piggy bank for all their corp crony constituents, Not just oil, construction, medical,tele comm, big pharma etc.

And more.

Repubs have benefited the most by far. And in many ways they still do.

We MUST 1st end the atmosphere of fear they created when they exploited the 9/11 attacks. It is the lynchpin of the whole scheme.

[-] 3 points by shadz66 (19985) 9 years ago

"How War Is Used To Redistribute Wealth", by Dennis Kucinich

"War Takes Money From The American People & Gives It To War Profiteers !" and again :

"D. Kucinich : US 'sanction warfare''" : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SjSGFQYZAm0 .

Your Democrap loyalties are taken as read but only Kucinich cuts the mustard these days.

multum in parvo ...

[-] 2 points by VQkag2 (16478) 9 years ago

I support Kucinich, I supported his membership in the progressive caucus (no repubs) I agree with Kucinich's 90% voting with Dem record.

Kucinich is an excellent progressive. Sorry to see him go (redistricted out by repubs!)

We need more like him.

[-] 1 points by shadz66 (19985) 9 years ago

Yes to more like Kucinich, Stein, Sanders, McKinney, Nader & even Paul, Johnson & Anderson .. in fact - ANYTHING other than the venal, corrupt, War-Loving, Human Hating Scum in Congress now !!!

Perhaps Kucinich can be persuaded to front a 'OWS Cadidacy' to get back to where his voice is so sorely needed !! Shit - more 'Electroralism' ! Wtf am I thinking ?

minima maxima sunt ...

[-] 2 points by VQkag2 (16478) 9 years ago

Our election/political system is corrupt & broken, until the new system is available we must:

replace pro 1% conservatives w/ pro 99% progressives & protest for change that will benefit the 99% and lay the ground work for political change.

[+] -5 points by alva (-442) 9 years ago

little denny kucinich is a member of the congressional SOCIALIST caucus. dont cover up socialist with " progressive, call it what it is. no republican members because the republicans are not socialists.

[-] 1 points by shadz66 (19985) 9 years ago

So, Mr.(..x..)Hat ! WTF d'you think you know about "socialist" or 'socialism' ?!! Your chronically selfish psycho-pathology, 'heart centre' blockage and acute lack of imagination is as sad as it is shocking !!!

Reflect that your Karma will run over your dogma eventually and inevitably !!

momento mori ....

[-] -3 points by alva (-442) 9 years ago

you and kaggie need to get together, the both of you are foaming over. its hilarious.

[-] 0 points by VQkag2 (16478) 9 years ago

You don't speak for them & they have named it the progressive caucus. I wouldn't be surprised if they supported socialist policies but that is ok. I do to.

And repubs ain't part of it because they don't care about other people.

Progressives believe we're all in this together, Repubs believe you're on your own!

Greedy, selfish, heartless bastards? Yes?

[+] -4 points by alva (-442) 9 years ago

they call it what they want, they arent fooling anyone. its the socialist caucus. the only thing the dems/lefty/progressives/socilaists care about is controlling you and taking your money. they dont give a crap about you as a person.

[-] 2 points by VQkag2 (16478) 9 years ago

You don't speak for them, and your opinion is obviously partisan pro republican, so we can dismiss your right wing wackiness outright.

[-] -3 points by alva (-442) 9 years ago

"we"? is that the royal "we"? you're still a coward.

[-] 2 points by VQkag2 (16478) 9 years ago

I have no fear. Why should I? I have the truth at my side, and honor has my back.

YOU should fear for you are without a conscience for your fellow citizen.

YOU have no honor.

[-] 1 points by BetsyRoss (-744) 9 years ago


You wouldn't recognize truth and honor if they fell out of the sky and crushed you like a bug on the sidewalk! And someday.....they are going to. Be VERY afraid.

[-] 2 points by VQkag2 (16478) 9 years ago

Is that a threat.?

Something very sad about threats made in an anonymous internet forum.

I don't threaten people, & I don't resort to childish name calling and the schoolyard bullying tactics of your candidate Romney.

So maybe you just don't understand truth & honor.

[-] 1 points by BetsyRoss (-744) 9 years ago

Of course...because everyone KNOWS that "truth and honor" are known killers who are often hired by schoolyard bullies to fall out of the sky and crush innocent liberal/Democrats.....get a grip.

Now where did I put my black book with Karma's phone number in it.....

[-] 2 points by VQkag2 (16478) 9 years ago

you ain't makin sense.

Is there a point to your comments? Please refrain from personal attacks, & threats against me .

You wanna discuss real issues we can. but only if you are able to do so in a civil, respectful way.

We disagree on politics. No prob.

I honor the diplomats who sacrificed their lives to work towards a moderate Libyan govt. You appear to be willing to use them as a political bat against the Pres like your republican war mongering, cowards running for office& in congress.

Let's keep our comments limited to those subjects. Or perhaps your position is so weak you must resort to childishness? If so just don't respond. I ain't interested.

[-] -3 points by alva (-442) 9 years ago

blather and foam all you want, you're still a coward.

[-] 3 points by VQkag2 (16478) 9 years ago

Name calling. Your resort to the childish schoolyard bullying tactics of your candidate Romney.


[-] -3 points by alva (-442) 9 years ago

i gave you the information that you " dared" me to give . have you called my doctors? didnt think so. you're a coward.

[-] 2 points by VQkag2 (16478) 9 years ago

You should take back your inaccurate accusation that I threatened you.

Then I will deal with your phony DR's.

[-] 0 points by alva (-442) 9 years ago

you said that if i gave you the info you would contact my doctors and ask if what i said was true. i gave you the info. and you didnt call, in fact, you lied about calling ( "I found your Dr's to be phoney") . you tried to bluff , i called you on it by giving the info. you're still a phoney, liar, coward and a fraud. that isnt name calling , its a character assessment. YOU have no honor.

[-] 2 points by VQkag2 (16478) 9 years ago

Your Dr info was phoney.

[-] 0 points by alva (-442) 9 years ago

i gave you my doctors real names ( DR RUDD 609-242-7733 ,DR DRUDY 609-597-8087). you are both a liar and a coward and a phoney. i know this because you didnt call them. if you had , you would have gotten their offices. what a pathetic little creature you are.

[-] 2 points by VQkag2 (16478) 9 years ago

Please, Everything you said about the Dr's and the ACA was untrue.

You are clearly just an anti dem partisan who supports the 1% who continue to prey on our families.

You are a traitor to your class.

You have no honor!

[-] -1 points by alva (-442) 9 years ago

o.k you didnt theaten me. why do you say that my doctors are " phoney"? you havent called them. now you can call them and verify what i said.

[-] 2 points by VQkag2 (16478) 9 years ago

I found your Dr's to be phony!

[-] -2 points by alva (-442) 9 years ago

still havent called my doctors? coward

[-] -2 points by alva (-442) 9 years ago

you didnt call the numbers i gave you, if you did you would know that the phone numbers and names are real. coward.

[-] 2 points by VQkag2 (16478) 9 years ago

Anti Obama partisan plant!

[-] -3 points by alva (-442) 9 years ago

untrue? call the doctors. not only are you a liar , a coward and phoney, you're a fraud.

[-] 2 points by VQkag2 (16478) 9 years ago


Childish name calling.

We disagree dude. I stand with the people who need/want affordable healthcare. You stand with the corp 1%.

You have no honor.

[-] -3 points by dennisthedwarf (-16) 9 years ago

Quoting Dennis Kucinich on foreign policy??? That's the same guy who paid TWO visits to his murdering pal Bashar al Assad of Syria, and said this about him ....“President al-Assad is highly loved and appreciated by the Syrians,”

He did this while REFUSING to visit the troops in Iraq and Afghanistan, many from his own district...because he didn't support the war.

Kucinich is a fucking idiot! Ask him how that Syrian thing is working out for his Pal Assadd

[-] 3 points by shadz66 (19985) 9 years ago

Thanx for a thought fart 'ranger rick' & I'll take the bump. Good luck with finding a brain!

Finally : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lv0smG7ptcM & can you do the whole 6m?

fiat lux ...

[+] -4 points by dennisthedwarf (-16) 9 years ago

Dennis...thrown out of Cleveland as Mayor...thrown out as congressman...but ignorant OWS morons thinks he's a messiah. Good..let the socialist dwarf lead you...to ruin