Forum Post: THERE IS HOPE! More evidence that OWS message on income inequality is seeping into the national consciousness
Posted 12 years ago on Jan. 13, 2012, 5:40 p.m. EST by TIOUAISE
(2526)
This content is user submitted and not an official statement
First, a note from TIOUAISE: As you can see below, FOURTEEN (14) of my comments have been "mysteriously" collapsed... Or perhaps not so mysteriously, as Thrasymaque/Cephalus/Socrate had issued a public threat on this forum to unleash his bots against me, just as he had done to ModestCapitalist only days before : "Last warning. One more reply, and it's bot time." http://occupywallst.org/forum/there-is-now-an-organized-andor-obsessed-effort-to/#comment-577873
GypsyKing has confirmed that he too was attacked by Thrasy's bot, as evidenced here: http://occupywallst.org/forum/lets-get-to-the-bottom-of-this-crap-about-conspiri/#comment-586437
And BlueRose confirmed that he was also attacked in the same way. He adds : "Thrasymaque/Glaucon/Adeimantus flooded my box and also claimed he added "script". How the hell is this site allowing this?" So that makes FOUR attacks over the last week by our temperamental little troll, "Thrasy-la-Terreur". LOL He was denounced as a troll by our Moderator: "you're not particularly helping with your trolling", and he replied by challenging her to ban him! http://occupywallst.org/forum/WOW-statement/#comment-546018
Yep, folks, it's now official: the Troll-Fuehrer himself has just confirmed below that he IS in fact behind the bot attacks : "Your assumption is correct. I warned you on several occasions to stop stalking me but you didn't. I have a bot that shadows you from time to time and down votes all your comments to -9. Iv'e always been honest."
Well isn't it nice to come across an honest Nazi.... HEIL THRASY!!!UPDATE: Thrasymaque strikes again, against a FIFTH user, "believeingod", because, writes Thrasy, "I'm a hardcore atheist-ignostic and anti-religious (...) Your comments are off topic. (...) I'll collapse your comments with a bot." The other user was non-threatening, but Thrasy-la-Terreur collapsed ALL NINE (9) of his comments. http://occupywallst.org/forum/why-and-how-ows-must-change-or-onto-anarcho-syndic/
So, it would appear that religion is the latest no-no for Thrasy/Cephalus... LOL We already knew that ANYTHING he dislikes he labels a "conspiracy theory". Several users have expressed indignation that he considers any criticism of NDAA "conspiracy theory"...
Jan 29: I just got a message from a SIXTH USER, Renaye, informing me that Thrasy had collapsed most of her post below: http://occupywallst.org/forum/svali-elite-mind-control-programmer-rare-interview/ A SEVENTH user, arturo, has just sent me a PM stating that he too has had his comments collapsed by Thrasy on the same thread.
As for the bot attacks against myself, guess what? They continue unabated. I have now lost close to 2,500 POINTS (known as "karma points") since Dennis the Menace - I mean Thrasy-la-Terreur - began his vendetta against me AND AGAINST FREEDOM OF SPEECH ON THIS FORUM. Who is next on his hit list?
Jan 30: GOOD NEWS from jart: " I actually found the bots that were targeting you this time because he was actually using them today. So I deleted them and restored 1100 points of your karma. I'm also deleting every vote his main accounts ever gave you which will be another 1000 or so. BTW I also global network banned every subnet Thrasy ever used to connect to this site so let's hope he doesn't come back this time."
• January 31: Unfortunately, Thrasy is already back with a new collection of sockpuppets, including "florian", "Jjons", "RoadWarrior", etc.
He also threatened an EIGHTH user, GirlFriday, with his bot : "I need someone to test my bots on. I was planning on attacking the conspiracy theorists, but if you keep stalking me I'll use you. Please realize, this means you won't be able to use the forum any longer. This is a friendly warning. You shed first blood. Stop stalking me and I won't do anything." http://occupywallst.org/forum/one-demand-to-create-a-cascade-of-change/#comment-620761
Feb. 2 UPDATE: Thrasy-la-Terreur-Dennis-the-Menace explains with total arrogance and effrontery to GirlFriday, the Mod Team and the rest of us how he operates and CHALLENGES us to stop him: "I wasn't sure my kadaboom bot team was working properly. I'll update the script with 50 more users later on tonight. FYI - You don't have a chance. Your attacks are useless because I can just change users at anytime. You can never keep up. And, it doesn't take any effort on my part to run my bots. I use another computer for that. The whole attack is automated. While one computer counter-attacks your stalking behavior, I use the other computer to write in the forum with a name you haven't figured out yet. When you figure it out, I'll just change it up again. Good luck." http://occupywallst.org/forum/one-demand-to-create-a-cascade-of-change/#comment-620761 As for myself, the real TIOUAISE (Oct. 6), I get shadow banned - by whom? - without a word of explanation.
FEB. 8 UPDATE: Thrasymaque/Hiroshi threatens a NINTH user, ZenDog, with his bot AND a ban from the forum for a repost on COINTELLPRO. http://occupywallst.org/forum/repost-cointelpro-techniques-for-dilution-misdirec/#comment-631507
• FEB. 8: Thrasymaque/RoadWarrior threatens a TENTH user, FreeDiscussion2, with murder, asking jart for his IP address : "[-] 1 puntos by RoadWarrior (61) 3 minutos antes You must be killed. Figuratively on this forum, and literally in life. Jart, give us this guys IP address and his ISP provider." http://occupywallst.org/forum/why-do-forum-moderators-jart-and-most-other-americ/#comment-630971 He advocates torture and murder of homophobes: "[-] -1 puntos by RoadWarrior (61) 29 minutos antes Yes, I advocate the torture and killing of all homophobes who go around spreading hateful Christian based lies designed to target minority groups such as people in the gay community." http://occupywallst.org/forum/question-for-advocates-of-gay-marriage/#comment-630988:
And now, finally, THE ARTICLE that gives us reason to hope:
"SURVEY FINDS RISING PERCEPTION OF CLASS TENSION"
By SABRINA TAVERNISE, New York Times, January 11, 2012
Conflict between rich and poor now eclipses racial strain and friction between immigrants and the native-born as the greatest source of tension in American society, according to a survey released Wednesday.
Pew Survey: Pubic Perceptions of Conflict Between Rich and Poor (pewsocialtrends.org)
About two-thirds of Americans now believe there are “strong conflicts” between rich and poor in the United States, a survey by the Pew Research Center found, a sign that the message of income inequality brandished by the Occupy Wall Street movement and pressed by Democrats may be seeping into the national consciousness.
The share was the largest since 1992, and represented about a 50 percent increase from the 2009 survey, when immigration was seen as the greatest source of tension. In that survey, 47 percent of those polled said there were strong conflicts between classes.
“Income inequality is no longer just for economists,” said Richard Morin, a senior editor at Pew Social & Demographic Trends, which conducted the latest survey. “It has moved off the business pages into the front page.”
The survey, which polled 2,048 adults from Dec. 6 to 19, found that perception of class conflict surged the most among white people, middle-income earners and independent voters. But it also increased substantially among Republicans, to 55 percent of those polled, up from 38 percent in 2009, even as the party leadership has railed against the concept of class divisions.
The change in perception is the result of a confluence of factors, Mr. Morin said, probably including the Occupy Wall Street movement, which put the issue of undeserved wealth and fairness in American society at the top of the news throughout most of the fall.
Traditionally, class has been less a part of the American political debate than it has been in Europe. Still, the concept has long existed for ordinary Americans.
“Americans have always acknowledged that there are Rockefellers and the lunch-bucket guy,” said Tom W. Smith, director of the General Social Survey at the National Opinion Research Center, based at the University of Chicago. “But they believe it is not a permanent caste, but a transitory condition. The real game-changer would be if they give up on that.”
Going by the survey’s results, they have not. Forty-three percent of those surveyed said the rich became wealthy “mainly because of their own hard work, ambition or education,” a number unchanged since 2008.
The survey’s main question — “In America, how much conflict is there between poor people and rich people?” — was based on language used by Mr. Smith’s center at the University of Chicago, Mr. Morin said. Mr. Smith said the question was often understood to mean, “Do the rich and the poor get along?” and “Do they have the same objectives?”
The issue has also become a prominent part of the political debate. President Obama has pressed the case that income inequality is rising as election season has gotten under way.
It has even crept into the Republican presidential primary race. At a debate in New Hampshire last Saturday, Rick Santorum criticized Mitt Romney for using the phrase “middle class,” dismissing the words as Democratic weapons to divide society. And conservatives have been wringing their hands over Newt Gingrich’s recent attacks on Mr. Romney’s past in private equity, saying they are a misguided assault on free-market capitalism.
Independents, whose votes will be fought over by both parties, showed the single largest increase in perceptions of conflicts between rich and poor, up 23 percentage points, to 68 percent, compared with an 18-point rise among Democrats and a 17-point rise for Republicans. Sixty-eight percent of independents believe there are strong class conflicts, just below the 73 percent of Democrats who do. (The survey’s margin of sampling error is plus or minus three percentage points for results based on the total sample.)
This is why all the trolls are here. They are worried that Americans are beginning to wake up to the truth.
Damn right. Its also why so many syndicated talk show hosts (Limbaugh, Hanity, Beck, Levin, Harley, McNamera, ect) have been ripping on us. What they don't understand is that this movement can not die as long as so many people worldwide feel stepped on. You can't just wish away human nature. There is only one way to stop this movement.
Resolve the issues.
Another way to kill OWS would be to propose another protest or movement to deal with the same issues, but offer different solutions. It might very well be the case that some Americans would prefer a movement that favors working with the current system instead of trying to dismantle it.
Right on!
The more nervous the 1% get, the more trolls they hire to swamp this forum and drown out the message of hope and liberation.
Right on!
The more nervous the 1% get, the more trolls they hire to swamp this forum and drown out the message of hope and liberation.
It won't work. We're not going away. We're also going to get the message out that you can't simply get ahead through "hard work, ambition and education" either.
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I'm all for America waking up to the truth. I WANT them to see the truth. Why do you think I keep trying to get YOU and MC to actually represent THE TRUTH?
All they'll see here is OWS like you "voting down" every post that contains the TRUTH.
LOL
Just take a look at THIS VERY thread you are on right now...
As you can see, 8 of my comments have been "mysteriously" collapsed... Or perhaps not so mysteriously, as THRASYMAQUE had issued a public threat on this forum to unleash his bots against me, as he had done to ModestCapitalist just days before : "Last warning. One more reply, and it's bot time."
Thrasymaque replies below:
"Your assumption is correct. I warned you on several occasions to stop stalking me but you didn't. I have a bot that shadows you from time to time and down votes all your comments to -9. Iv'e always been honest."
I was responding to beautifulworld specifically and OWS generally. Your running squabble with Thrasymaque and your posts in this thread are amusing but irrelevant to what I was talking about.
It's NOT a personal "squabble" or "feud" between T and me. He just did the same thing to ModestCapitalist and GypsyKing thinks he's been systematically voting him down too.
Who will be his next victims?
Again. Not relevant to what I said to beautifulworld. Thrasy (as far as I can tell) isn't voting you or MC or GK down because your posts contain the truth. Seems like he/she just finds you all extremely annoying.
Thrasy himself said below that he uses "bots" to vote us down!!!!
And he's very cynical about the whole thing, inviting me to create my own bot... LMAO - That would be stooping to HIS level, something I will never do.
"Your assumption is correct. I warned you on several occasions to stop stalking me but you didn't. I have a bot that shadows you from time to time and down votes all your comments to -9. Iv'e always been honest. I have nothing to hide. I'm sorry, but I consider aggressive stalking as being a form of harassment and trolling. You could have simply notified the moderators if you didn't agree with my behavior, instead you decided to act like a child. I suggest you create a bot to up vote your comments, or change usernames. Otherwise, you'll have a hard time getting heard."
Yes. YES. I get it. You apparently don't.
Are you condoning the use of bots for members to attack one another's postings? Is THAT your idea of a discussion forum??? To me, the use of bots on this site is tantamount to intellectual terrorism. It is on Thrasy's part, an attempt to SILENCE ALL DISSENT.
Oh YES...sure. Because I'm not jumping up and down screaming like a child, of COURSE the ONLY thing it could possibly mean is that I condone the use of bots!!!
I don't condone those members who attack another's postings WITHOUT bots either. (Like you keep doing to me) It certainly doesn't present you as any kind of intellectual. Which in my book means that whatever Thrasy is doing to you cannot possibly be defined as "intellectual terrorism".
You're not playing by the unspoken rules. Before you ask us to sell out, you first have to offer us boatloads of money to tell the corporate establishment's version of TRUTH. I'm not saying I would accept, but it is insulting that you didn't even offer.
IIf the rules are unspoken....how does anyone know what they are?
The rest of your reply to me I find too insulting to respond to.
We are social creatures, we pick up unspoken clues and read between the lines everyday. What does a wink mean? Depends on the situation and learning to read that particular individual's unspoken meaning. I'm surprised you don't know this. Hell, even my dog knows the unspoken rules of my house. LOL.
Your dog LIVES with you, and all your dog knows is that if he behaves in a certain manner-it gets a certain response from you.
You DON'T live with me nor do you interact with me in any situation in which you can read my "non verbal" clues because the ONLY interaction you have with me IS VERBAL. I'm surprised you don't know this.
I used a broad metaphor about how people sell out to corporations for money. I didn't expect it to go over your head. So I tried to use a literal example. I also did not expect that to go over your head. Next time, I will get you a coloring book to help you get the picture, since that seems to be about your speed.
And you applied those metaphors to ME and implied that I either sold out myself, or was asking you to sell out. That's insulting and unwarranted.
Yes, I did compare you to a corporate lapdog. If you don't want such insults then stop warranting them. OWS is pointing out the TRUTH about corporate power in our society.
Then you won't mind being compared to the lapdogs of anarchists and anti-Americans. We're good then.
If being called an anarchist and anti-American is the result of telling the TRUTH, then I will gladly bear that burden. Have a nice day, corporate lapdog.
If you were actually telling the truth, we'd be in agreement with each other. The burden you bear is one of gullibility and surrender to rhetoric. There's no cure for that except education.
It's hard for a corporate lapdog to hear the TRUTH when their head is buried so far up the corporate asshole. I trust you can analyze the cure for that problem without any help on my part.
Making these kind of statements must make you feel really good. Gives you a false sense of usefulness, as if you are actually doing something important. Does it not?
Nah. I come here to make you feel good, smartcapitalist. To tell you how smart and right you are.
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Newsflash: The Cold War is over you fearful reactionary.
Thank you for this post. I believe we have only seen the tip of the iceberg.
Please read the note I added at the top of my post AND Thrasymaque's response below. Thanks.
Yes, I know he's been doing this to you, and I don't think he just started. He's certainly doing it to my posts - just have a look at my post regarding "conspiracy theory." My question is why has this been allowed to go on for so long. Much of what he has posted here has been blantantly offensive and threatening. Why is this allowed. EVERYBODY knows what he's up to here.
I received as many as SEVEN (7) public, documented threats from him... I think he's "losing it"... I had warned him that he was at risk, but he refused to even read my personal messages.
If he continues to use a bot against you, please let us know and save the whole post in a .pdf file as evidence. Thanks.
I'm sorry T. I'm from the generation that still used paper and ink, so I can't help on the tech side. I can see however when a thread is being intentionally voted down by a minority. Wow, does that make me a "conspiacy theorist?"
I'm from the same generation... :) You see, on his own admission, he uses a BOT that automatically vote down my comments to minus 9 in a matter of SECONDS. So this in not the work of some minority, but of a machine...
Well, we will have to contact moderation. Perhaps,if that doesn't bring results we could contact jart; although I realize he has much to deal with at the moment. I have always considered keeping this forum viable as truely important to this movement. If there's anyway I can assist please let me know:)
Thanks. Some of us have already messaged jart about this and we are awaiting her response.
P.S.: I just found it ! I mean your thread where Thrasymaque used a bot against you. So that makes AT LEAST three of us who have been attacked in the last week alone. Who will be the next victims?
http://occupywallst.org/forum/lets-get-to-the-bottom-of-this-crap-about-conspiri/#comment-586437
I didn't do that to you GypsyKing. Someone else has a robot on this site. I only down voted turak and TIOUAISE because they attacked me on many occasions and I had warned them on several occasions to stop but they didn't. I have no reason to down vote your posts.
LIAR!!!
Thanks.
Did you notice that Thrasy collapsed my comment and yours disappeared as well? I'm reposting your comment below as I find it important:
"Yes, I know he's been doing this to you, and I don't think he just started. He's certainly doing it to my posts - just have a look at my post regarding "conspiracy theory." My question is why has this been allowed to go on for so long. Much of what he has posted here has been blantantly offensive and threatening. Why is this allowed. EVERYBODY knows what he's up to here."
Thanks.
Did you notice that Thrasy collapsed my comment and yours disappeared as well? I'm reposting your comment below as I find it important:
"Yes, I know he's been doing this to you, and I don't think he just started. He's certainly doing it to my posts - just have a look at my post regarding "conspiracy theory." My question is why has this been allowed to go on for so long. Much of what he has posted here has been blantantly offensive and threatening. Why is this allowed. EVERYBODY knows what he's up to here."
Thanks.
Did you notice that Thrasy collapsed my comment and yours disappeared as well? I'm reposting your comment below as I find it important:
"Yes, I know he's been doing this to you, and I don't think he just started. He's certainly doing it to my posts - just have a look at my post regarding "conspiracy theory." My question is why has this been allowed to go on for so long. Much of what he has posted here has been blantantly offensive and threatening. Why is this allowed. EVERYBODY knows what he's up to here."
It's very important. Poverty is bad. I'm convinced more now than ever that closing our souther border makes sense.
it's only a matter of time before the american people wake up and see what special interest groups have done to the country. outside america people have been shaking their heads in disbelief for quite a while. the corporate controlled media has been misinforming americans for a very long time.
You better believe it! Some of us in America have been screaming this at people for 40 years or more, just voices in the wilderness. I had actually given up on Americans ever being able to understand this. Sorry, but it's true.
i left the states in the mid 80's because i couldn't bear to live under a second reagan term. sadly, i understand what you mean.
AGREE.
BTW, would you please read the note I added at the top of my post AND Thrasymaque's response below. Members of this forum must realize what is happening here. Thanks.
Looks like you "woke them up" to the fact that there is a conflict, but that didn't affect their belief that the rich earned their wealth mainly through "hard work, education and ambition".
we still have time to change this attitude as well, wait and see.
Only going to change it with actual proof that things were otherwise. Guesses, postulations, probabilities, generalities, fabrications etc aren't going to cut it.
wait and see what just the facts will do. since september ows has had a very surprising impact globally and that has been a little more than 3 months. it's no coincidence that this website is so heavily trolled, people in power are paying to have it stopped. they don't like what they see and how fast it has grown.
justhefacts will do what she always has-ask for evidence so she can make up her own mind about what the truth actually is.
Is it also "no coincidence" that this website has never provided ANY actual evidence that "people in power" are paying and that others are accepting those payments to "troll" here?
Since OWS requires no membership-and thus has no official count-how do you determine that it's growing at all?
As far as "impact" goes: the PEW survey's main question — “In America, how much conflict is there between poor people and rich people?” — was based on language used by Mr. Smith’s center at the University of Chicago, Mr. Morin said. Mr. Smith said the question was often understood to mean, “Do the rich and the poor get along?” and “Do they have the same objectives?”
Impact of OWS according to the survey-increased number of people who believe there are "strong conflicts" between the rich and the poor.
proof would be hard to find but there are an amazing number of trolls attacking this site. and i also think that not recognizing this as a fact is a bit suspicious. i don't think it's an accident or spontaneous, do you?
Whether people are payed to be dissenters or are truly at odds with the message this forum is articulating, I'd say it is probably more to the latter. I'm lead to this decision because of the fact that most of the people who appose the messages on this forum have low English skills and their dissents are cliche. Also, others who dissent make wonderful counter arguments that lead me to believe are society is not as homogeneous in thought as television pundits would have us believe. The idea that there is a market for forum dissent seems a little unbelievable.
Especially for a forum that only has about 30 or so regular users.
There may be millions of trolls attacking this site. I have no idea. I am not one.
That said, your propensity to freely and unrepentantly categorize entire groups of people based on what YOU think or feel about them, for examples-"all the rich are evil" and "everyone who does not agree with MY opinion is a troll" is something YOU don't seem to recognize as a bit suspicious at all......go figure.
please don't assume that i have said things that i haven't. i've never said or implied that all the rich are evil and i've never said or implied that all that don't agree with me are trolls. i know many rich people who are very nice and you can spot the trolls by their foul language and their efforts to divert threads from serious discussions.
What's the point of recognizing this fact? What does it matter? People who attack this site can only post comments. You can either counter-argue their claims if they made any, or ignore them. Saying that some users are trolls or "agents" leads to nowhere. Even if some are, it is a logical fallacy to attack the proposer of an argument with ad hominem or appeal to motive instead of attacking the arguments themselves.
To tell you the truth, I think users who talk about outing "agents" are wasting everyone's time. They constantly repeat this idea without providing evidence. This is a road to nowhere and an annoying distraction. Instead, they should stick to discussing things that matter. If you think a user is an "agent", just ignore him or counter-argue his claims with proper methods of discourse. These "agents" are not aliens with supernatural powers. They won't melt your brain. They can only pose arguments that you can counter argue. Do that. Stay logical. Don't let them distract you, because you then end up distracting everybody else by endlessly talking about them which, really, just means they have attained their goal.
For those who simply refuse to acknowledge the facts of gross wealth/income disparity in our country and world, there is no arguing with you. You have to accept the numbers. No amount of name-calling, exclamation points, swear words, etc., will change those numbers. Those of us who live in a data-driven world will continue to refer to those numbers whether you like it or not.
The catering of money to the rich by our government has driven the economy into a ditch, causing lost wages and taxes. Some say it's a total wreck, but after a civil suit for damages, the vehicle can be repaired, and an anti-intoxication key switch installed, to keep it from being driven under the influence.
It is obvious it has. Even the mainstream media is using words and phrases never before heard of like 1% and class warfare. Look at the elections this season compared to the last one. They (the media) are talking about things that have never been brought to attention before like campaign contributions and lobbying. If OWS did anything good it brought attention to issues no one ever had the balls to speak of before. I personally believe that OWS is past its prime. (NO insult intended) Most people as in the every day American kind of have a bad taste for OWS mostly because of 2 reasons, 1 the faceless leadership- this is scary to regular people, 2 Media smear campaign. Even if they never return to support OWS there is still a lot of pissed off people out there and they will return to the streets just wait. OWS did nothing more than shine a light on lots of issues that needed to be addressed and like I said even if they never support OWS again more and more of their opinions have been molded into shape by OWS wether they realize it or not. I talk to people everyday about OWS related issues no one seems to really like OWS these days, but damn they sure do feel the same as most of us. The OWS forums are the backbone of this idea of a better world and they should be kept alive with debate and discussion. I would spend alot more time on here if I didnt own a vending business and work a second job. Not all business owners are against OWS. We know better than you how the system works. I could write a book on my frustrations with the silly regulations I have to abide by and things that should be regulated but are not. The big companies are always lobbying the politicians to pass laws that make it harder for me to stay afloat so they can move in and fill the void after My business fails.
Hi TIOUAISE, Good post. Best Regards, Nevada
Thanks, Nevada, I appreciate that.
You may find this comment "collapsing" within minutes... like the other 14 on this thread that were attacked by Thrasymaque's charming bots... :)
Thanks, Nevada, I appreciate that.
You may find this comment "collapsing" within minutes... like the other 6 that were attacked by Thrasymaque's charming bots... :)
Hi TIOUAISE, Viewed your reply by clicking on [-]. Best Regards, Nevada
An astute observation. More here: http://occupywallst.org/forum/there-is-hope-more-evidence-that-ows-message-on-in/#comment-586349
He's attacked my posts and comments as well and quite openly boasts about it. I am not computer savvy so I don't know for certain if this is with the connivance or approval of the moderators. Thrassymaque is an opponent of the ideas of Occupy Wall Street. How he gets this power to decide what appears on this website would be interesting to learn.
WHERE and HOW does Thrasymaque/Cephalus get "HIS POWERS" - as he himself calls them - to systematically CENSOR what is posted on this forum? As GypsyKing cried out last week: "WHY IS THIS ALLOWED TO HAPPEN?"
Here are a few "thrasymaquisms" for you collection: "Wealth inequality isn't a problem (...) OWS is missing the mark by focusing so much energy on this false problem." (Troll Thrasymaque, January 13, 2012) http://occupywallst.org/forum/there-is-hope-more-evidence-that-ows-message-on-in/#comment-586292
"I have to be honest, I'm really sad this forum has become infested with mentally ill paranoid schizophrenics." (Troll Thrasymaque, January 6, 2012) Note from TIOUAISE: Infested? Really? That must be why in our last discussion he wanted to put all forum members who disagree with you ON MEDS...LOL http://occupywallst.org/forum/there-is-now-an-organized-andor-obsessed-effort-to/#comment-577868
"I have a bot that shadows you from time to time and down votes all your comments to -9." (Troll Thrasymaque, January 8, 2012) Note from TIOUAISE: That must be why I lost 1,200 points over the last two weeks! LOL http://occupywallst.org/forum/there-is-now-an-organized-andor-obsessed-effort-to/#comment-577868
WHERE and HOW does Thrasy get "HIS POWERS" - as he himself calls them - to systematically CENSOR what is posted on this forum? As GypsyKing cried out last week: "WHY IS THIS ALLOWED TO HAPPEN?"
Here are a few "thrasymaquisms" for you collection: "Wealth inequality isn't a problem (...) OWS is missing the mark by focusing so much energy on this false problem." (Troll Thrasymaque, January 13, 2012) http://occupywallst.org/forum/there-is-hope-more-evidence-that-ows-message-on-in/#comment-586292
"I have to be honest, I'm really sad this forum has become infested with mentally ill paranoid schizophrenics." (Troll Thrasymaque, January 6, 2012) Note from TIOUAISE: Infested? Really? That must be why in our last discussion he wanted to put all forum members who disagree with you ON MEDS...LOL http://occupywallst.org/forum/there-is-now-an-organized-andor-obsessed-effort-to/#comment-577868
"I have a bot that shadows you from time to time and down votes all your comments to -9." (Troll Thrasymaque, January 8, 2012) Note from TIOUAISE: That must be why I lost 1,200 points over the last two weeks! LOL http://occupywallst.org/forum/there-is-now-an-organized-andor-obsessed-effort-to/#comment-577868
WHERE and HOW does Thrasy get "HIS POWERS" - as he himself calls them - to systematically CENSOR what is posted on this forum? As GypsyKing cried out last week: "WHY IS THIS ALLOWED TO HAPPEN?"
Here are a few "thrasymaquisms" for you collection: "Wealth inequality isn't a problem (...) OWS is missing the mark by focusing so much energy on this false problem." (Troll Thrasymaque, January 13, 2012) http://occupywallst.org/forum/there-is-hope-more-evidence-that-ows-message-on-in/#comment-586292
"I have to be honest, I'm really sad this forum has become infested with mentally ill paranoid schizophrenics." (Troll Thrasymaque, January 6, 2012) Note from TIOUAISE: Infested? Really? That must be why in our last discussion he wanted to put all forum members who disagree with you ON MEDS...LOL http://occupywallst.org/forum/there-is-now-an-organized-andor-obsessed-effort-to/#comment-577868
"I have a bot that shadows you from time to time and down votes all your comments to -9." (Troll Thrasymaque, January 8, 2012) Note from TIOUAISE: That must be why I lost 1,200 points over the last two weeks! LOL http://occupywallst.org/forum/there-is-now-an-organized-andor-obsessed-effort-to/#comment-577868
Picked up by NPR as well: http://www.npr.org/2012/01/14/145213421/the-income-gap-unfair-or-are-we-just-jealous
Nice one, I enjoyed reading your post. Thank for the great post.
http://www.onlinegamebox.com
Young People More Likely To Favor Socialism Than Capitalism: Pew
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/12/29/young-people-socialism_n_1175218.html
Income inequality, 2%
http://www.gallup.com/poll/152009/Americans-Economic-Worries-Jobs-Debt-Politicians.aspx
Time to expose the cartel ...
http://occupywallst.org/forum/be-sure-to-spread-this-far-and-wide/
Great article! Glad people are starting to wake up. The Class War has been going on for some 30+ years and although we've taken heavy casualties, most, if any, return fire has been at our 99% selves. LOOK UP everybody, our class war enemies are above in the 1%.
So THERE ARE RW BOTS HERE, TOO???!!!???
I thought that was a CL thing??!!
Is OWS doing anything?? MORE INFO PLEASE!!!
Billionaire businessman Warren Buffet said on CNBC about a year ago already: “There's CLASS WARFARE, all right, but it's my class, the rich class, that's making war, and we're winning.”
On CNN, he later stated : "Actually, there’s been class warfare going on for the last 20 years, and my class has won. We’re the ones that have gotten our tax rates reduced dramatically. If you look at the 400 highest taxpayers in the United States in 1992, the first year for figures, they averaged about $40 million of [income] per person. In the most recent year, they were $227 million per person — five for one. During that period, their taxes went down from 29 percent to 21 percent of income. So, if there’s class warfare, the rich class has won."
Yes, I saw that.
It's public awareness I'm concerned with, that's where the key to change lies!
Now about the bots??
What the fuck are you talking about. BLAH blah blah. More drivel from ignorant OWS assholes
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Thrasy doesn't have a bot. Want proof? Delete every post he votes down. He has to sign in and out for every additional vote, how long will he do that if the reply just gets deleted.
Thrasy DOES have a bot, admits to having one and has demonstrated it by ATTACKING 3 legitimate users just over the past week : ModestCapitalist, GypsyKing and myself. WHY? Simply because they dared to disagree with him. Who will be next on the Troll-Fuehrer's hit list?
So don't pay any attention to Thrasy's SPIN below... This is NOT some kind of personal "feud" between Thrasy and me. It is a much more serious thing: an attempt to SILENCE the voices that this self-professed "government mole" finds a little too threatening to the Status Quo.
Thrasy is attempting to take over this OWS forum and so far, he is succeeding, because nobody is stopping him. As GypsyKing cried out yesterday: "WHY IS THIS ALLOWED TO HAPPEN?"
I have been dealing with dip shits since I came on this forum. But I also challenged thrasy to some questions as I am actually a developer and have been writing code since 1992. I am a certified computer technician and experienced ATM tech. I won't bore you with the details but believe me when I tell you, thrasy is not a programmer and has no idea what he is talking about. What he does know is how to play with your mind.
LOL
I have lost over FIVE HUNDRED (500) so called "karma points" on this forum over the last few days, thanks to Thrasy's thuggish attacks... Do you call that just "playing with my mind"?
How fast can a computer crunch numbers? If he had a bot you would be losing hundreds or thousands of points, not just 10s at a time. I deleted about a dozen of my replies and told him why, I got no more down votes, magic!
Damn! How did you know I wasn't really a programmer. What gave it away?
I don't attack you because you disagree with me, I attack you because you've been calling me a troll and a paid agent for over 2 months now, because you stalked me for over a week and didn't stop when I asked you to message the moderators instead, and because you compare me to a nazi (Troll-Fuehrer). Until you apologize publicly and stop these actions, I will continue to bring you down.
And, again, I never down voted GypsyKing. Stop making so many assumptions, that's what got you in trouble in the first place.
Thrasy DOES have a bot, admits to having one and has demonstrated it by ATTACKING 3 legitimate users just over the past week : ModestCapitalist, GypsyKing and myself. WHY? Simply because they dared to disagree with him. Personally, I have so far lost 1200 - that's right, TWELVE HUNDRED - "karma points". Who will be next on the Troll-Fuehrer's hit list?
So don't pay any attention to Thrasy's SPIN below... This is NOT some kind of personal "feud" between Thrasy and me. It is a much more serious thing: an attempt to SILENCE the voices that this self-professed "government mole" finds a little too threatening to the Status Quo. . Thrasy is attempting to take over this OWS forum and so far, he is succeeding, because nobody is stopping him. As GypsyKing cried out yesterday: "WHY IS THIS ALLOWED TO HAPPEN?"
People see more conflict because it's being talked about. No doubt about it that news reports and comments about OWS have something to do with that. They don't see income inequality as a problem or concern in their life though. Most still think the rich became wealthy through hard work. In an open ended Gallop question only 2% said they were worried about the divide between rich and poor.
The dynastic rich had always been there with their special privileges but they have always been discreet. Perhaps it was the rise of the nouveau riche with their ostentatious perquisites that had really stirred up the pot when almost EVERYONE was hurt financially in the Great Recession. I surmise that in rough waves the lunkers can lurk without being speared but in low tide there is no place to hide with the barracuda jumping all around.
"They don't see income inequality as a problem or concern in their life though."
And if they DID, I'm sure you would do everything you can to spin it...
I believe I trust the "New York Times" more than JB950...
No need to spin anything I'm one person, and in a minority position on here. The fact that people are aware of conflict between rich and poor, may be because there is conflict and it may also be because conflict is being talked about a lot. Just as people are concerned about crime, even in locations where crime is down, because it is in the news so much. If people see inequality as a problem and if they vote with that in mind you'll see more political action in response.
Exactly. This survey does NOT prove that the central message of OWS-about income inequality-is getting through.
DENIAL is not just a river in Egypt... LOL
It shows awareness of the conflict, not necessarily support or opposition. Just media noise, when they have nothing to report a pole it taken or picked up and then reported as though it were news.
So then OWS message is "class tension/conflict"-because more people are aware of class tension/conflict than ever before.
“Americans have always acknowledged that there are Rockefellers and the lunch-bucket guy,” said Tom W. Smith, director of the General Social Survey at the National Opinion Research Center, based at the University of Chicago. “But they believe it is not a permanent caste, but a transitory condition. The real game-changer would be if they give up on that.”
"Going by the survey’s results, they have not. Forty-three percent of those surveyed said the rich became wealthy “mainly because of their own hard work, ambition or education,” a number unchanged since 2008."
OWS has not changed people's minds about how "the rich" became wealthy even one percentage point from what they believed PRE-OWS.
You know what they say, anythingbutthefacts....
DENIAL is not just a river in Egypt!
So why are you DENYING what the survey proved?
"About two-thirds of Americans now believe there are “strong conflicts” between rich and poor in the United States, a survey by the Pew Research Center found, a sign that the message of income inequality brandished by the Occupy Wall Street movement and pressed by Democrats may be seeping into the national consciousness."
THERE IS HOPE FOR AMERICA and you trolls simply can't accept that, can you?
Sabrina Tavernise-a reporter for the New York Times-said that. NOT the survey. She also said "a sign that the message.......MAY....be...SEEPING....into" Her opinion regarding what the survey itself said.
The survey did not ASK about income equality. The survey asked about "tension between the rich and the poor". PERIOD.
You just simply cannot accept that can you?
"About two-thirds of Americans now believe there are “strong conflicts” between rich and poor in the United States, a survey by the Pew Research Center found, a sign that the message of income inequality brandished by the Occupy Wall Street movement and pressed by Democrats may be seeping into the national consciousness."
THERE IS HOPE FOR AMERICA and you trolls simply can't accept that, can you?
"About two-thirds of Americans now believe there are “strong conflicts” between rich and poor in the United States, a survey by the Pew Research Center found, a sign that the message of income inequality brandished by the Occupy Wall Street movement and pressed by Democrats may be seeping into the national consciousness."
THERE IS HOPE FOR AMERICA and you trolls simply can't accept that, can you?
You know what they say, anythingbutthefacts... . DENIAL is not just a river in Egypt! LOL
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What's the matter Tiouaise? Had to repeat it because others voted it down so far? Good. Here's my replies to you which also disappeared due to yours being voted down.
"So why are you DENYING what the survey proved?"
And after you quoted the article....: "Sabrina Tavernise-a reporter for the New York Times-said that. NOT the survey. She also said "a sign that the message.......MAY....be...SEEPING....into" Her opinion regarding what the survey itself said."
"The survey did not ASK about income equality. The survey asked about "tension between the rich and the poor". PERIOD.
You just simply cannot accept that can you?"
Your assumption is correct. I warned you on several occasions to stop stalking me but you didn't. I have a bot that shadows you from time to time and down votes all your comments to -9. Iv'e always been honest. I have nothing to hide. I'm sorry, but I consider aggressive stalking as being a form of harassment and trolling. You could have simply notified the moderators if you didn't agree with my behavior, instead you decided to act like a child. I suggest you create a bot to up vote your comments, or change usernames. Otherwise, you'll have a hard time getting heard.
Both sides - please cease fire. There are rules and there are ALSO self-imposed UNSPOKEN rules that all responsible adults should know. Let your ideas speak for themselves and avoid the same crime perpetrated on the American people. We shall ALL be better off!
I'll be happy to stop when TIOUAISE apologizes for having stalked me during several days even after I repeatedly asked him to contact the moderators instead of attacking me, for spreading his assumption and lie that I am some sort of paid "agent provocateur", and for comparing me to a nazi. I'm sorry, but certain actions are unacceptable. I have no patience for mentally ill conspiracy theorists who waste everybody's time with illogical ramblings. I use direct action to zap them out of existence.
Do you know for sure that TIOUAISE knows how to contact the moderators to settle the dispute? If you can summarize the procedure and the moderators here, I will forward the procedure and your comment above to TIOUAISE and the moderators. This forum may have moderators but I for one do not know who they are or how to contact them. They rightfully have jurisdiction on this forum so sending the dispute to them makes sense. Will you please take the first bold step to resolve the dispute? Thanks.
At the bottom of each and every comment box, there is a link that reads "Read the Rules". Follow it. This will bring you to a page with the forum rules. Note: you should have read this page before making your first publication on this site. Read it now, and you will find the appropriate method to report abuse to the moderators.
Your reply makes it obvious you have no knowledge of my dispute with TITOUAISE.
If you did, you would know that TITOUAISE has already discussed the matter publicly with jart, the forum's lead programmer. You would also know that I asked him on many occasions to stop stalking me and instead contact the forum moderators. He refuses to do so. In addition, you would know that other forum users have also asked him to stop. More importantly, you would know that TITOUAISE is an illogical who repeatedly brings up the same assumptions and tries to pass them of as truths. He's a pseudoscientist nonpareil who's just flooding the forum with his repetitious nonsense.
Why don't you entertain yourself by reading the ramblings he posted last week. They are similar to the ones he posted today, nevertheless, for some strange reason, his drivel is always a blast to read. Of course, you'll have to uncollapse his comments ;-)
http://occupywallst.org/forum/new-forum-features/
Note: To is credit, his babbling is not all repetitious. This week, his narrative was rendered slightly more complex by the addition of the nazi comparison which is a funny use of reductio ad hitlerum.
Yes, I plead ignorance of the dispute so I'll take some time to understand it before opening up again. I apologize for barging in without proper knowledge but maybe I can remedy that. I hope that you and TIOUAISE can come to some gentlemen's(or ladies') agreement eventually.
It depends on him. He's the one stalking me, calling me an "agent" without proof, and now comparing me with nazis. It seems to me he has a major problem. Serious adults who come here for proper debate don't compare other users to nazis. There's nothing to talk about. He can either stop his nonsense, or accept that my bot will be down voting him every day.
I understand your position. Thanks.
Any news from TIOUAISE? Do you think he's going to stop stalking me one day?
I received nothing from TIOUAISE. Thrasymaque privately messaged me regarding the same issue -- he no longer seemed to be stalked by TIOUAISE so he suspected that TIOUAISE might have been banned.
I am Thrasymaque. And, yes, I am still being stalked by TIOUAISE.
How did TIOUAISE know that Cephalus is Thrasymaque? How do you know that it is TIOUAISE who is stalking you? Could it be someone else?
I know that TIOUAISE is stalking me by reading the messages posted under that username.
He knows that I'm also Cephalus because Iv'e always said I was. I have all the users from Plato's Republic. Thrasymaque, Glaucon, Cephalus, Adeimantus, Polermarchus, Socrate. I'm using Cephalus to espace TIOUAISES nonsense. I'll probably have to change to another user soon.
I have to say, as the self-professed judge who is supposed to intervene between us and stop this nonsense, you're not doing a very good job.
There is NO stopping two warring parties until they come to their senses or realize their best interests. If TIOUAISE did not respond to me and continue to stalk you, it is his prerogative just as it is your prerogative to change to another username. Why are you so keen on fighting the "conspiracy theorists"? Some people are simply never trained or do not believe in the scientific method even though they may seemingly tilt their hats to science but that is just life, isn't it? Very few people in the populace read The Republic by Plato so they do not know about the parable of The Cave but you can surely relate to the feeling of re-entering the Cave, can you not?
Another thing is if you want a username to stay secret, never talk about it being related to Thrasymaque, etc. Information diffuses -- ultimate law of the universe.
I believe they are one of the biggest dangers in the modern world. I fear them more than greedy bankers because they assault logical, critical, and scientific thought.
I don't hide. People know what users I have. Iv'e never wanted my usernames to be secret.
What it means is that people are buying into the notion that MONEY = HAPPINESS. They feel that they are missing out because they aren't rich. People worry more about having a new iphone , car , yacht. The assume that if they only had a bit more money they could be happy, if the rich would just pay more taxes they would be happy. It's bullshit. But go ahead and keep thinking that Rich VS Poor is the important conversation.
Yaaawn!
TROLL B.S. never fails to put me to sleep...
zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz
"TROLL B.S." : recommended by more doctors than any other sleeping aid!!!
WARNING: Do not drive or operate heavy machinery while taking TROLL B.S.
So anyone who disagrees with ya is a troll. Nice work Hitler. Maybe you can lead the next purge
GODWIN!!!
Say "Guten Tag" to the Troll-Fuehrer for me, will ya? LOL
"The human race has only one really effective weapon, and that is laughter. The moment it arises, all your irritations and resentments slip away and the sunny spirit takes their place." Mark Twain
Agreed, wealth inequality isn't a problem. It really doesn't matter if some people are rich as long as everybody has enough to live a decent life.
OWS is missing the mark by focusing so much energy on this false problem. It should re-adjust the aim of its cannons towards problems like improper money seeping into and corrupting politics.
It annoys them when you point out what this survey just proved-OWS has not changed people's minds about how "the rich" became wealthy even one percentage point from what they believed PRE-OWS.
Say "Guten Tag" to the Troll-Fuehrer for me, will ya? LOL
"The human race has only one really effective weapon, and that is laughter. The moment it arises, all your irritations and resentments slip away and the sunny spirit takes their place." Mark Twain
Yaaawn!
TROLL B.S. never fails to put me to sleep...
zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz
"TROLL B.S." : recommended by more doctors than any other sleeping aid!!!
WARNING: Do not drive or operate heavy machinery while taking TROLL B.S.