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Forum Post: Is this exclusively a liberal forum?

Posted 1 year ago on Sept. 9, 2012, 4:38 p.m. EST by MrHyde (-24)
This content is user submitted and not an official statement

Is this a liberal forum that merely tolerates people of other political affiliations?

We are all being told, over and over, by DKAtoday and Vkag2 that this is a liberal forum. The argument is being justified to alienate non-liberal supporters. Is this what the forum find acceptable? If so, we all deserve to know.

Has Occupy given up? Is this it? Giving in to political parties?

222 Comments

222 Comments


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[-] 3 points by jph (2652) 1 year ago

This forum, like most net forums, is a mess of ideas from the individuals who participate. It represents little more than that,. it never has been an "official" Occupy anything, and should not be taken to be such.

What does liberal mean? socially liberal, fiscally liberal, politically what now?

The terms are mostly meaningless, and are just used by the two dominate camps to sht on each other these days,. with little actual context or meaning. If you are from the right, "liberal" is a nasty word for wrong minded folks, and if you are identifying with the left, then "conservative" means crazy right-winger nut job., but what does any of that really mean? The political spectrum is not a line it is more of a circle, if you go far enough to one extreme, you may find yourself closer to the extremists on the the other 'end',. .

I am an egalitarian taoist, an anarcho-socialist, a permaculterualist, an artist, and many other things,. some of my views are capitalist, some communist, some conservative, others radical, if that helps.

[-] -2 points by ZenDog (13312) from South Burlington, VT 1 year ago

I am an egalitarian taoist, an anarcho-socialist, a permaculterualist, an artist, and many other things,.

.

so what can you tell us about the influence of Buddhism on Confucian thinking and tradition during the Waring States Period . . . .

[-] 1 points by jph (2652) 1 year ago

Can you tell us ZenPuppy, why a heavy quark spins towards infinity? or the do you think Spinoza ripped off Vadanta, and the Upanishads??

[-] -2 points by ZenDog (13312) from South Burlington, VT 1 year ago

why a heavy quark spins towards infinity?

are you absolutely certain this result isn't simply a matter of chance?

[-] 1 points by jph (2652) 1 year ago

yup.

[-] -2 points by ZenDog (13312) from South Burlington, VT 1 year ago

I think you should roll again

and you are completely aware that the influence of Spinoza on Taoist thought and tradition was modest at best . . .

[-] -2 points by MrHyde (-24) 1 year ago

As you eloquently state, political labels are used as insult in contemporary political discourse. That is exactly the case being made here. That this has become the accepted norm for the forum with a hard left turn and obstruction of dissent That is indeed the issue being raised.

[-] 2 points by jph (2652) 1 year ago

Where is this "obstruction of descent" ? I see many varied positions represented,. my gripe is the dip-sht party wonks, pushing people to vote in the silly election of the PR front man of the single military-corporate-fascist 1% control structure.

[-] 1 points by notaneoliberal (2269) 1 year ago

dissent

[-] -1 points by MrHyde (-24) 1 year ago

lol. Yeah, nothing like make a high minded point and using the wrong spelling of a word :D (Dunce)

[-] 1 points by notaneoliberal (2269) 1 year ago

It happens to the best of us.

[-] 1 points by Cocreator (306) 1 year ago

Peoples Party..We are All Elected..No more Elections! We can vote and coordinate General Assemblies online and in person..We can do the jobs,we elect these people to do..We can work one day a month,and cut the overhead drastically,Pay the People half of the salary we are currently giving these bureaucrats,and we would be thrilled.. We must follow the example of Iceland, and arrest all these bankers and politicians enabling them.Seize their assets and give it to the People..Everyone could at least get $100,000, then we will stimulate the economy..Iceland is growing 2.6% annually now they have eliminated these parasites..We can do the same as Iceland..

[-] -2 points by DrJekyll (-143) 1 year ago

I was having a thought about the people's party this morning actually. Not a party that works on elections with the exception of problematic times such as this and any in the future. I was thinking more like a transformation of the GAs to a long term community organization that meets on a regular schedule to create an environment of public discussion on proposed legislation and to draw up legislation crafted by the public for presentation to local, state, and federal government. The horizontal structure of the GAs makes them perfectly suited to carry out such a task. don't know. Just a thought I was having over morning coffee.

[-] 4 points by shadz66 (18139) 1 year ago

Good thoughts to be fair and honest for the long term.

"Morning coffee" @ http://www.bard.edu/hannaharendtcenter/ peut-etre ?!

NB : OWS must be aware of attempts at 'guidance' and co-option & would be co-opters from 'all sides'.

fiat lux ...

[-] 1 points by brightonsage (4494) 1 year ago

Naw, they were just copying the anarchists. But you and your buddy are welcome to look as stupid as you want. Go ahead! Live it up. Say something neoliberal. No, really, go ahead.

Tell me, how did those witch trials turn out?

[-] 1 points by TrevorMnemonic (5827) 1 year ago

no user on this forum exclusively speaks on behalf of OWS

[-] 1 points by Forrester (13) 1 year ago

No this movement is not a liberal one, rather it is a movement about 'justice'. Hence it transcends political parties.

[-] 1 points by hchc (3297) from Tampa, FL 1 year ago

Not if you dont mind getting punched in the face

[-] -1 points by MrHyde (-24) 1 year ago

Now see, that sounds familiar. Have you ever been called an anti-dem? a troll? a shill? ??? That is what I have been getting for my disagreement.

[-] 2 points by MattLHolck (16833) from San Diego, CA 1 year ago

everyone is supposed to support the troops

they died for a freedom

do you believe that?

[-] -1 points by MrHyde (-24) 1 year ago

No. I do not appreciate invading another country under the ruse of self defense.

[-] 4 points by shadz66 (18139) 1 year ago

Not logging in as "neutrino" today ? As "electron" is all washed up, have you considered "lepton" ?!

nosce te ipsum ...

[-] -3 points by MrHyde (-24) 1 year ago

No idea who is using "neutrino". Your guesses aren't even based on any research. Just stabs in the dark.

[-] 4 points by shadz66 (18139) 1 year ago

Consider : There is the 'specific' ; there is the 'generic' ; then there is 'TrashTrollTeamBoT' and thus co-opted involuntarily or otherwise, they may now stand or fall together !!!

ad iudicium ...

[-] 1 points by ZenDog (13312) from South Burlington, VT 1 year ago

and now we are at 68 comments in a single hour . . . .

plus one

[+] -4 points by DrJekyll (-143) 1 year ago

Obviously some users agree that this is an issue.

[-] 1 points by ZenDog (13312) from South Burlington, VT 1 year ago

Has Occupy given up? Is this it? Giving in to political parties?

no, I say, no. IT is obviously not so.

Given that the forum was, for much of the afternoon, confined to a mere one comment every two minutes or so, and given that these comments were spread over multiple threads;

and

given that we now see this thread has recieved over 43 comments in under 43 minutes,

  • Posted 43 minutes ago on Sept. 9, 2012; 43 Comments

we must conclude that

  • no, - no. IT is obviously not so

that rather this forum does indeed welcome bots, trolls, and assorted sockpuppets of all kinds, sizes and stripes, and we see beneath your banner an entire army of them, all engaged in self deception, self deceit, even in self talk.

You must really enjoy conversing with yourself . . .

[+] -4 points by MrHyde (-24) 1 year ago

Social Stigmas.

[-] 1 points by beautifulworld (21421) 1 year ago

We represent the interests of the 99% here, call it what you may, join us if you like.

Keep in mind that we are not a monolith and many interests, ideas and theories are represented by the posters here.

[-] 3 points by MattLHolck (16833) from San Diego, CA 1 year ago

liberal is not a word that's well defined

[-] -2 points by slizzo (-96) 1 year ago

liberals always say that.

[-] 1 points by slizzo (-96) 1 year ago

I'm sure that response makes sense to someone who thinks that nitwit is substantive

[-] 1 points by MattLHolck (16833) from San Diego, CA 1 year ago

britney's a good dancer

[-] -2 points by beautifulworld (21421) 1 year ago

true

[-] -2 points by DrJekyll (-143) 1 year ago

Yes, not a monolith, exactly.

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[-] 0 points by Neuwurldodr (744) 1 year ago

lib·er·al (lbr-l, lbrl) adj. 1. a. Not limited to or by established, traditional, orthodox, or authoritarian attitudes, views, or dogmas; free from bigotry. b. Favoring proposals for reform, open to new ideas for progress, and tolerant of the ideas and behavior of others; broad-minded. c. Of, relating to, or characteristic of liberalism. d. Liberal Of, designating, or characteristic of a political party founded on or associated with principles of social and political liberalism, especially in Great Britain, Canada, and the United States.

As the thoughts of man are influenced, so are his ideologies.

When someone calls themselves a liberal now, I, personally see warning signs going up.

The existence of liberalism now a days is founded on the old adage that certain individuals have inalienable rights, whereas "certain others" do not. But, my question is, who actually has the right to decide this fact? And if they do, why aren't they educating "certain others" so as they too may enjoy these inalienable rights?

Once again, if everyone is created equal, why does so much inequality continue to exist?.

Labels are man made crock!

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[-] 0 points by yobstreet (-575) 1 year ago

Yea, without a doubt - this is definitely a liberal forum. The question becomes, well, who exactly ARE the liberals? Are they African American? Well, no. Are they Hispanics? Well, nooo. Are they Irish, Italian, or German Roman Catholics, or - God forbid - even Christian evangelists? Well, no, definitely not.

So who the hell are they? Who are these people? I mean, in my entire life, I would have to say that I have honestly never met one - an enigma, the liberal mystique... and yet it would seem, that in a country of 310 million OWS has indeed found one. Or two. Three? Nah... nah... I don't think so.

[-] -1 points by shooz (17792) 1 year ago

Nope. All kinds of folks come through here.

The "left" leaners just last a lot longer.

Hell, I even found a John Bircher posting here.

[-] -1 points by shooz (17792) 1 year ago

You're here, aren't you? So, no it isn't.

Hell, they even let sock puppets in.

[-] -2 points by DrJekyll (-143) 1 year ago

More social stigma from the "on message" campaigners.

[-] -1 points by shooz (17792) 1 year ago

Excuse me??

Are you being obtuse?

Or just lying through your teeth?

[-] -2 points by DrJekyll (-143) 1 year ago

Unlike shadz who at least thinks for himself, I hold no hope of you being capable of moving beyond your benign and nauseatingly repetitious pattern of thought. So if you don't mind, you need to present a topic to discuss. Mind or word games with you would be like regressing to toddler toys.

[-] -2 points by shooz (17792) 1 year ago

OK I get it.

Lying through your teeth.

You came here to attack people. Don't expect to be around much longer.

[-] -3 points by DrJekyll (-143) 1 year ago

I am actually on the defending side, right where you placed me


[-] 1 points by shooz (12428) 17 minutes ago

You're here, aren't you? So, no it isn't. Hell, they even let sock puppets in.

↥twinkle ↧stinkle reply permalink


And this is the pattern we have been discussing on this thread. You start shit, piss people off, make them flip out, then label them a trouble maker so DK has grounds to ban. It's a pattern you can see over and over for at least the past 3 month.

So, please, feel free to continue your charade. It is you who will not be around much longer.

[-] 1 points by podman73 (-652) 1 year ago

I'm actually supprised I haven't got your not welcome memo yet. *slowly opens the mailbox and peers in

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[-] 0 points by shooz (17792) 1 year ago

So then, you have temper problems?

If that's the case, why start such divisive threads in the first place?

Why run sock puppets?

They piss everybody off.

They are tyranny

[-] -2 points by DrJekyll (-143) 1 year ago

tyranny? OMGLOL, wow. Very dramatic. So you talk smack, I call you out for it, now I'm tyrannical. What kind of mind fuck is that!?!

[-] -1 points by shooz (17792) 1 year ago

Sock puppets and bots are a form of tyranny.

This whole thread was an attempt at a mind fuck so stop playing coy.

Sonny.

[+] -4 points by DrJekyll (-143) 1 year ago

Of the two types of men, the builders and destroyers, I am a builder. I make things, I fix things, I create things. If I had a Bot, I would have a hell of a lot more votes. If I were here to "shill" I would be dropping at least some text indicating agenda. I am complaining about a pattern of exclusion as I have so thoroughly spoken about on this thread.

Sock puppets and bots are a form of tyranny.

Social Stigma.

[-] 0 points by shooz (17792) 1 year ago

You're no builder.

You like to stir up partisanship, so you can bitch about it.

That's why you put this thread up in the first place.

There was no other reason.

That would actually make you a ...............................fill in the blank

[-] 1 points by MattLHolck (16833) from San Diego, CA 1 year ago

complaints about the repub and demo alleged bickering is greater than the bickering itself

[-] 0 points by shooz (17792) 1 year ago

It has become the bigger of the distractions.

[-] -3 points by DrJekyll (-143) 1 year ago

You engage in the partisanship on this forum, so to you it is a distraction.

[-] 0 points by shooz (17792) 1 year ago

As we are all political, so are we all partisan.

I will see about getting these distracting threads taken down.

It's not like you have anything else to say around here.

Not one comment in fracking threads.

One hear hear in the teachers strike thread....tokenism.

You do remind me of an asshole that used to come here and take up thread after thread bitching about lizard people.

Nothing but pointless distraction.

[-] -1 points by DrJekyll (-143) 1 year ago

No. In reality it has concentrated the argument and issue into one thread where it is highly visible. So it only seems bigger, but it's been this big for a while now.

[-] 1 points by MattLHolck (16833) from San Diego, CA 1 year ago

what are those issues ?

[-] 1 points by MattLHolck (16833) from San Diego, CA 1 year ago

been here nearly a year now

read lots of posts

still don't know the contested issues between demos and repubs

[-] 0 points by DrJekyll (-143) 1 year ago

Read the OP, read some of the conversations on this thread. That would provide more answers than I could in a single reply.

[-] -2 points by DrJekyll (-143) 1 year ago

I did mention earlier that you have a one track mind. You should now take notes since you've not broken message one time in over an hour of commenting.

[-] 0 points by shooz (17792) 1 year ago

You have something against conceptual continuity?

I think it's you who needs to take notes as you're having trouble keeping up with a simple concept.

You came here for one reason and one reason only........To stir up partisanship, so you could bitch about it.

That's the bottom line truth, as that's pretty much all you have done in your current iteration.

Are you going to fill in the blank now?

[-] -3 points by DrJekyll (-143) 1 year ago

Quite interesting how this thread is pointing out the hard line being drawn by the left on this forum, yet you insist this thread is partisan.


Noun: A strong supporter of a party, cause, or person.

Adjective: Prejudiced in favor of a particular cause.

Synonyms: noun. follower - adherent - supporter - guerrilla - partizan adjective. partial


I am actually looking for relief from partisanship on this forum.

[-] 0 points by shooz (17792) 1 year ago

HA ha ha ha ha ha ha.

Bullshit!

That's all you're pushing.

This thread should probably be taken down.

I'm so sick and tired of you coming in here and playing the coy innocent.

Over and over and over.

You are partisanship personified!

[-] -1 points by shooz (17792) 1 year ago

I think you meant to say librul.

You must really miss Mr. P.

And as always.......Who's the "we" you keep bringing up?

The secret society of sock puppets?

[-] -1 points by bensdad (8977) 1 year ago

In stead of kvetching, explain who you support.
I would support any electable candidate who will be a better alternative to their opponent.
I do not support parties or theories - I support the PEOPLE who support the 99%
Three examples: Elizabeth Warren, Alan Grayson, Bernie Sanders
Do you think they support the 99% ?
How about michelle bachmann or paul ryan or louis gomert or steve king ?
Do you think they support the 99% ?

[-] -2 points by MrHyde (-24) 1 year ago

I support Occupy

[-] -1 points by Mooks (1985) 1 year ago

The forum is fairly liberal. The posters you mention though are not merely liberal, but are lap dogs of the Democratic party. Being a liberal and a lap dog for the Democrats are 2 totally different things. I think most people here would agree that the Democrats are in the pockets of the 1% just as the GOP is.

Ultimately though, Occupy claims to represent the interests of and know what is best for the 99% but the certainly don't represent the values of the 99% and until they do, their support will be very limited. Most people who don't follow it closely view it as a far left fringe movement, and some of the posters here will support that view.

Most Americans (the 99%) will agree with Occupy that money and the influence of money needs to be removed from politics. I doubt the 99% will agree on much more because America has such diverse values.

[-] 2 points by MattLHolck (16833) from San Diego, CA 1 year ago

most people need to drop the left right political paradigm

[-] -1 points by VQkag2 (16478) 1 year ago

"lap dogs"? That's just an offensive lie. I don't have to resort to insults to make my points.

Most people believe that the "influence of money needs to be removed from Occupy" ? do you mean removed from politics. because otherwise you clearly don't know what you're talkin about.

Please refrain from the schoolyard insults. We haven't had any exchanges that I recall so I guess you are speaking for someone else.

[-] 1 points by Mooks (1985) 1 year ago

Yes, that is what I meant. Thanks, I corrected it.

As for the rest, I just call it like I see it. I am sure others would agree, and I surely do not mean it as an insult. If I wanted to insult you, you would know it haha. And we have had plenty of exchanges on here.

[-] -2 points by VQkag2 (16478) 1 year ago

Really all you have are meaningless insults. No evidence, No substance. You come here to tear down. You have no interest in OWS. You come here to insult people from the safety of your moms basement.

You add nothing of value. Because you have no value. You are a coward, and a fool.

[-] -2 points by DrJekyll (-143) 1 year ago

No substance. I know where you got that. ;)

[-] 1 points by ogoj11 (263) 1 year ago

yip yip yip

[-] 0 points by VQkag2 (16478) 1 year ago

Stop being a child.

[-] -1 points by VQkag2 (16478) 1 year ago

Which party is OWS giving up to?.

I know DK & I didn't say that. Are you purposely twisting words to suite this divisive accusation?

I think we've only given our opinion regarding the principles OWS supports, pushes, endorses (progressive/liberal).

You disagree? Then what principles do you think OWS is about?

[-] -1 points by brudlo (-454) 1 year ago

liberal/marxist forum

[-] 0 points by gsw (2877) 1 year ago

Sometimes it seems " a 99 incarnations of Thrassy" Forum.

Unite your self--That was good enough for Mark Twain.

Then unite together.

[-] -2 points by slizzo (-96) 1 year ago

Yes. About 2-3 weeks ago I posted a similar thing I'd noticed. These forums have been thoroughly astroturfed by the useful idiots of the DNC. From now Neil election day, this is another arm of the regime's propaganda apparatus.

[-] -2 points by neutrino (-197) 1 year ago

For now this forum promotes a pro-Obama stance. The moderators ban users who promote a non-partisan stance. They also ban users like Odin who protest for Occupy and come here to discuss their experience. Users like VQkag2 and zendog who insult the republicans are encouraged. So are users like DKAtoday and shooz who promote a vote for Obama and writing letters to the president.

This forum no longer represents OWS, but I believe it can be changed.

[-] 0 points by shooz (17792) 1 year ago

Look son. If you are going to make a lying accusation about me, You are going to prove it.

So prove it. Liar.

[-] -2 points by April (3196) 1 year ago

Maybe the anarchists aren't so into anarchy anymore.

[+] -5 points by neutrino (-197) 1 year ago

They certainly aren't. Jart and zoe have become softer than melted butter. It's almost as if they are being spread over Obama's toast as we speak.

[-] -1 points by April (3196) 1 year ago

Well someone changed the description on the News page. It used to say 'we don't need politicians', 'we want to see a general assembly in every backyard' (something to that effect), 'we are a Direct Action group'. That's all gone.

[-] -3 points by neutrino (-197) 1 year ago

Ya, I know. Like I said, Obama ate the anarchists for breakfast.

[+] -4 points by April (3196) 1 year ago

I wonder why the changes. It's all good to protest the government for change now? That used to be a big no-no. The government was supposed to be illegitimate. Maybe it's not illegitimate anymore.

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[-] -2 points by April (3196) 1 year ago

That's funny but I was being serious. It's weird how the description was changed. Like melted butter.

[+] -4 points by neutrino (-197) 1 year ago

It's weird. Unfortunately, I don't know why. It's been like that for a few months now. What I find even stranger is that some people still ban stuff on this site. How weird is that? I mean, imagine that for a sec. There are these people who moderate this site but who never contribute a word. And, by golly, they watch like hawks. They are almost always here. They tend to their duties like nuns. And, for what? Honestly! They don't even promote anarchist thought. This is the first forum where I find moderators who don't contribute to the discussion except for banning material. Having that job is almost as obsessive as VQkag2's job.

[-] 2 points by gsw (2877) 1 year ago

Neutrino

Persists

Making commentary and criticisms, creatively, insightfuly,

true

the anarchists

have gone somewhere else,

so it appears,

and the debate has become more liberal-mainstreamed to the market audience?

what is there to occupy, when those for whom you occupy, do not see, (or see it's value) because the media do not show, unless there is violence, which confirms the messages they want to project.

If the tree falls in the forest and nobody witnessed it, did it really fall?

The attention of the people is short, and not focused.

May be we need to occupy what would get attention,

occupy the election, by backing Rocky Anderson, as the most vocal proponent of the positions of occupy.

modify your tactics to changing circumstance.

then after elections, refocus efforts on messaging, and sorry to say it, gearing up with state candidates, petitions, etc.

because the people can tolerate a lot, and do not seem to want any major changes to their world as they know it.

[-] -2 points by neutrino (-197) 1 year ago

These ideas completely contradict what OWS is all about. Instead of trying to co-opt OWS with your partisan politics, why don't you start a movement of your own to back up the candidates you feel should be backed up. OWS is about fighting the system, not loving politicians.

[-] 0 points by gsw (2877) 1 year ago

Neutrino-- see, I make few friends as well in my position.

Again, I agree with you in principal and spirit. (I apologize for those who disagree with Neutrino, but he wants to keep this the Occupy site, as it should be. Now, when it comes down to death by Obama, or death by Romney, Obama may give my grandchildren a few more years on earth than the other side of the coin. I know Obama has largely sold out our causes. He wanted to, and did compromise, himself, and some of his integrity, his first term. He should not have let the freakin lyin bank robbers in the Fed, and in his administration, among other crimes.)

Occupy must occupy on one front. The major front, should be to be in the streets, as you remind us, and I support that 100 percent.

I will only advocate for pro OWS candidate on the forum.

Romulan and Obama who occupy the white house have plenty of attention, plenty of press, on the news, and looking at car's bumpers.

I just think we should also try to play in the real world, and run some candidates who like OWS, such as Justice Party.

I know you are not looking for allies or friends, but I admire your positions sticking to OWS principles, so we are clear as to what they are, and should be. I do support your positions, and even most tactics, that I have observed, firsthand.

However, I have discovered from listening to some realists on this form, who operate not just in theoretical philosophies, but like to see some real world applications and proof, that occupy must occupy also in the political fronts, run candidates and take some positions, in order to be seen as viable. Americans don't want a revolution, at the moment.

If unemployment went to 30 percent, then they could be more open to hope and change. Now, they seem to just want to party like its 1999.

I do not want to coopt the OWS forum. It is just maybe if a candidate supports your positions, you may want to support them, at least for a little while. Help grow the Justice Party, who can then run other state, and national candidates, which is there intention. You should look into running. You got a lot of great ideas, creativity, and fight.

If mainstream media will not play my OWS supporting candidate, then this is like an alternative press. http://www.justicepartyusa.net/

Things may not change through the elections, but why not back one who backs OWS, as does Rocky Anderson.

http://www.opednews.com/Quicklink/Rocky-Anderson--Should-Be-in-Best_Web_OpEds-120828-76.html

Rocky Anderson: "Should Be" President of the United States

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[-] -2 points by Gluon (-19) 1 year ago

I bought a ratchet once that doubled as a hammer, and tripled as a screwdriver. It could do all three things, but did none of them well. After a few months, I threw it out and bought a ratchet, a hammer, and a screwdriver.

OWS cannot play into the political game. Not only because of theory, but also because of practice. An anti-government and capitalist protest is weakened when part of that protest starts being the things it is protesting against; namely, candidates in the capitalist governmental regime. It's an illusion to think that some candidates push OWS ideas because it's an impossibility. OWS is about pushing the government from the outside so that it constantly receives pressure. The system is broke, and even honest and wonderful candidates will get corrupted. As Lord Acton said - "All power corrupts, and absolute power corrupts absolutely."

What I don't understand is why some people want OWS to become political instead of forming another group dedicated to that. It's like if I joined a democrat convention and asked it to become anarchist, or a joined a Roman Catholic Church and tried to transform it into a Zeus worshiping outfit.

I think people are jealous of the success of OWS and want to tap into it instead of starting their own groups to do what they believe in. It's strange when you think about it. Obviously, those who want to turn OWS towards politics either don't understand OWS or do not think it is working as is. And, the fact that they want to use it as a shell for different ideas instead of creating their own group seems to point to the fact that they are not confident in their political ideals. If they were, they wouldn't need to rest on the shoulders of an anarchist group that has nothing to do with them.

Leave OWS as it is. A grass roots protest and activist campaign which fights the government from the outside. Start another group to fight from the inside. It will be much more powerful to have two groups each with a clear mandate, than to have one Swiss Army knife trying to take care of everything. We have GreenPeace, Sea Shepherd, David Suzuki, Al Gore, etc... for a reason. They all fight for Global Warming in their respective ways. It's stronger like that.

What you want to do is akin to washing things down. To making them so general that they lose all meaning. OWS has already spread its wings much too broadly by protesting against a huge variety of things that aren't about Wall Street. Instead of spreading more, it needs to go back to its roots and focus.

[-] 1 points by gsw (2877) 1 year ago

Again, you provide a very lucid argument which I agree in conscience with completely.

OWS did start as protest against corrupt political and economic factions, against Wall Street, abuses,and neglect by government. And with truth and justice as it's cause, has spread widely geographically.

But the depth of the impact, while important on many individuals, has not been significant on the whole of society.

OWS should stay true to its original ideals.

On the other hand, if OWS represents the 99 percent, (who should also ideally be protesting, and who are not, for varied reasons, and these should be explored further) the 99 percent will at some point wander upon OWS, maybe even this site.

Your voice and your truth is quite valid.

Others, with not such evolved world-views, maybe persons who fundamentally believe, because of past learning, that our system has some means to self-correct, something short of revolution, that the system can be saved through ballot and due vigilance of the populace,

Americans are an optimistic breed http://www.time.com/time/magazine/article/0,9171,2123800,00.html as in this article The Heirs of Reagan's Optimism By Fareed Zakaria

Read more: http://www.time.com/time/magazine/article/0,9171,2123800,00.html#ixzz2686yWKdG

We want to believe things can be better, that people and the world can learn.

We too may want OWS to succeed and we yearn for the same goals, and we find voice in this forum. And you may be correct, but I would not have heard that view if I was not on this site.

So I will try once again to refrain from my partisan tendancies, as I do value the OWS original and continued purpose, and that should be the priority.

To reach more people, many with diverse views, including political views, and economic views, some political discussion, and economic discussion, will probably have to occur from time to time, which may be somewhat partisan, at time.

When OWS has a final policy platform, then I will seek a candidate, as flawed as that system is, who speaks to those issues.

So although I do see your viewpoint and agree with quite a bit of the reasoning, I have a variation--that politics is going to be dragged into the discussions.

Now is that jealousy? No. I like the thinking, questioning, divergent thought, and viewpoints here.

Do I want to start up a homogenous group of same-minded people, sounds like a lot of work to a futile cause.

But I do believe your pro OWS-activist views should be a big focus of all people, especially here, and there should be more work here, on this forum, on ways to make effective messaging to break through the cloud of haze in which the corporate duoppoly, neoliberal globalization think tanks.

I mean, could we all just show up again on Wall Street and reoccupy.

However, I still feel a compulsion show up at work, and hold on to the relatively good job I have, as I need some way to support my dependents.

[-] -1 points by CarlAndrews (-113) 1 year ago

But the depth of the impact, while important on many individuals, has not been significant on the whole of society.

I think the impact of OWS was felt quite strongly. Sometimes it's not so clear, but the impact trickles down and touches people indirectly if not directly. One must be patient with these types of things. Change doesn't occur overnight. Past fights took a long time. In the end, truth will prevail. We must be patient and believe.

On the other hand, if OWS represents the 99 percent,

This is a slogan. Don't take it so literally. OWS represents what the 99% should want, but, most people need to see everything changed before they can accept it.

To reach more people, many with diverse views, including political views, and economic views, some political discussion, and economic discussion, will probably have to occur from time to time, which may be somewhat partisan, at time.

This must be reached with various vehicles much like Global Warming is being fought against by many vehicles: scientists doing research, activists like GreenPeace, writers like David Suzuki, etc... Trying to use one umbrella to fit all the possible approaches creates rifts because these approaches can and often do contradict themselves.

However, I still feel a compulsion show up at work, and hold on to the relatively good job I have, as I need some way to support my dependents.

Of course, you don't have to give up life for OWS. Protesting can be part time.

I mean, could we all just show up again on Wall Street and reoccupy.

That has been done. Adbusters as recently called for flash occupations. Occupations that change places and only last a few hours to a few days. Occupying Zuccotti Park was important at the beginning to make an impact, but we must now spread around and pass on the message. Re-occupying what we once had only to re-occupy it is a step back to the past, a step in the wrong direction. We must go forward without losing our primary goals and message.


Note: I'm not against creating third parties and playing the political game, but this should not be done with OWS. OWS is the only anarchist protest of important size in America. It must remain unique. Others can use other tactics under a different banner. That would be good. Waiting for OWS to play into politics is a mistake. It won't happen. You must strive forward with your tactics and find the people who agree with you then form a group of your own to push them.

[-] 0 points by Forrester (13) 1 year ago

Yes I agree with that.

[+] -12 points by DKAtoday (34976) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 year ago

Trashy - new moniker? Same old BS though. No matter how much your name changes - you do not.

BTW - instead of coming here and bitching about what you don't like about this forum - why don't you start your own forum?

You obviously have enough money - bouncing from Canada to your Island Home and then - What - now to NY?

So start your own forum and run it how you want - take your new buddies with you.

Be Bold - stop being OLD.

An Old Pest that is.

Go out and live your dream.

But mainly - just go out.

[-] -3 points by Gluon (-19) 1 year ago

ad hominem. no arguments. as per usual.

You're the old one grandpa. I can tell by your conservative ideas. You're scared to take the OWS plunge and escape the duopoly. You'll vote Obama like you always did. You write letters to the president like they used to do in the 1960's. Have some guts, be progressive, be OWS for once in your life.

[-] -2 points by April (3196) 1 year ago

You mean like how richard's post got deleted recently? But somehow VQ attacks people ad nauseum. And thats ok. So quick to label and divide people up between Democrat and Republican. As if everyone is either all or nothing. Plus his nauseatingly annoying bumper sticker posts. Not to mention Odin. That was total crap.

http://occupywallst.org/forum/this-is-not-your-campaign-headquarters-take-your-p/#comment-828402

What happened to the anarchists/anarchy I do not know. I mean that was working so well.

[-] -3 points by neutrino (-197) 1 year ago

The anarchist model doesn't make sense to run a country, but it does make a lot of sense to run a protest. I just find it weird when people moderate a forum without using it, especially if they are not paid. Who would waste their time coming here every day to filter out some crap from the rest of the crap? That's strange to me. It's obvious jart doesn't believe in this forum, else she would use it too.

[-] 0 points by gsw (2877) 1 year ago

"The anarchist model doesn't make sense to run a country, but it does make a lot of sense to run a protest."

You have held this view consistently. Thank you Neutrino

"I just find it weird when people moderate a forum without using it, especially if they are not paid. Who would waste their time coming here every day to filter out some crap from the rest of the crap? That's strange to me. It's obvious jart doesn't believe in this forum, else she would use it too."

Or else she believes that truth will prevail of its own accord.

And letting it run its course, is that not the epitome of anarchy? (I don't generally see anarchists advocating limiting speech)

Anyway, I have seen her here from time to time. She just maybe doesn't want a heavy hand or greater voice here, possibly, just speculating.

Anyway, there are limits. Some of my crummy ideas were vanished, I can hope.

[-] -2 points by CarlAndrews (-113) 1 year ago

(I don't generally see anarchists advocating limiting speech)

Unfortunately, I do. I'm banned from this site everyday! My experience with anarchists show me that they are often vary different in theory and in practice. They are some of the most hard headed people you will ever meet, at times showing cult like tendencies. It's good to believe in your ideas, but you have to be able to defend against the opinions of others instead of banning them out of sight.

If this website truly embraced the concepts of anarchy there would not be any points which are nothing but a hierarchic system. There could be banning, but it would not be the banning of ideas, it would be the banning of spamming and insulting posts that are based on logical fallacies instead of providing arguments for ideas.

[-] 2 points by gsw (2877) 1 year ago

so this is a "meritocracy", sort of, by virtue of -who makes the most inane comments, or blabbers on, may gain "credits" or points, in some cases, if people are not consistent in negating points.

So, don't give points more personal value than they have. they mean nothing except Maybe points are there so we can at least determine, who has been around for a while, who we could go to to answer a question or seek a knowledge based idea.

some ideas are banned mostly--"politcally incorrect" comments and a few posts, somehow, get by for a bit, but they draw much scrutiny.

spamming seems to be mostly banned now, fortunately!

"logical fallacies" are usually called out by participants.

You are banned every day? That must be rough, to be banned, here so often.

Maybe try to lighten a bit in tone, when discussing anything with those with their heart, obviously, on their sleeve, bearing thin skin. You spot them, in about 5 seconds, don't engage them.

[-] -2 points by CarlAndrews (-113) 1 year ago

You are banned every day? That must be rough, to be banned, here so often.

No. It's not bothersome. It takes 30 seconds to create a new user and I like the idea of changing users as it removes points and cleans the slate.

[-] -1 points by Forrester (13) 1 year ago

"You're "banned from this site every day!" ?? You gotta quit being an "independent thinker,' and fall in line. ;-)

Odin

[-] -1 points by shooz (17792) 1 year ago

Everyday??

You get banned everyday?

Well gee, Why don't you give us a list of a months worth of your usernames, and let us be the judge of your "ideas".

If they are so good, you should be more than willing to provide all that info for our perusal.

Without it? All your bitching about being banned is a bit of a logical fallacy.too. Or maybe just a fallacy.

[-] 1 points by MattLHolck (16833) from San Diego, CA 1 year ago

here's how to search thread topics by username

Search Thread by User Name

It's in my forum profile if anyone needs to know path

CarlAndrews has started no threads

[-] -2 points by CarlAndrews (-113) 1 year ago

You can read about my ideas without having to know all my usernames. I don't keep track of them. If you wish, be my guess and keep notes. Usernames don't bother me. Only ideas count.

If usernames are so important to you, then I suggest you ask jart to lay low on the censorship. That way I would always have the same name. She's doing the same thing to Odin.

[+] -12 points by DKAtoday (34976) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 year ago

You don't believe that pap and neither does anyone else.

[+] -4 points by beautifulworld (21421) 1 year ago

What's the matter? You missed this thread?

http://occupywallst.org/forum/chicago-occupyobama/

[+] -12 points by DKAtoday (34976) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 year ago

You think the site could be evolving over time instead of being static?

You think the movements could be evolving as time goes by instead of being static?

[-] -2 points by April (3196) 1 year ago

Golly gee no DK that never occurred to me. Why don't you tell me all about how the movement is evolving.

[+] -12 points by DKAtoday (34976) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 year ago

Never mind victoria.

[-] -2 points by April (3196) 1 year ago

I don't want to nevermind. Tell me tell me! Tell me all about how the movement is evolving. What do you think? How come we don't not need politicians anymore. How come we shouldn't have GA's in every backyard anymore.

[-] -1 points by DrJekyll (-143) 1 year ago

I am interested in the changes myself.

[+] -11 points by DKAtoday (34976) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 year ago

Why don't you read the updated forum material?

[-] -1 points by DrJekyll (-143) 1 year ago

I have read the updated About page. You don't provide links or direction, just redirection. Go play on google, go chase some vague thread that I won't name directly. Why so evasive?

[+] -9 points by DKAtoday (34976) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 year ago

Still chasing your tail with a non-argument. R U just waiting to see how long the mods will let U play(?) - as if U went to admin U might be gone at that same moment?


[-] 0 points by DrJekyll (13) 3 minutes ago

Social Stigma. Still not answering the question. Still redirecting. ↥twinkle ↧stinkle permalink

[+] -4 points by DrJekyll (-143) 1 year ago

I have not cussed at you or gotten nasty with you. I am only responding to you on this topic in this thread, I'm not chasing anyone around. It is a question and the question is the topic. I am on topic.

You could just as easily decline the question but at this point I am assuming you have refused to acknowledge the question. Tanks anyway.

[+] -13 points by DKAtoday (34976) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 year ago

Talk to my hand or talk to the forum admin as I am done bumping this post. BuBye.


[-] 0 points by DrJekyll (15) 3 minutes ago

Ah, a little social pressure without the stigma. You are downplaying again. But we knew you weren't going to change course. You will still allow Obama pushers to harass anyone that isn't here to support Obama, troll shill and anti-dem will still be used and widely accepted. You will continue to insist a little oppression of dissent is not big deal because hey, you do it too.

The question is no less absent or important than it was before your reply. Nothing has changed, not even your refusal to acknowledge to issue. ↥twinkle ↧stinkle permalink

[-] -2 points by DrJekyll (-143) 1 year ago

So, what you are saying is that this forum is not here to push the Obama platform and VQkag2 is not encouraged to, nor will you engage in, ostracizing users that disagree with Obama or the democratic party positions?

[+] -13 points by DKAtoday (34976) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 year ago

Like I say why ask me? You have an obvious problem with VQ myself - what(?) shooz and shadz and who else?

Take your complaint to admin if you think that you are being treated unfairly. Or go to your room for a good frustrated little shill crying jag.


[-] 0 points by DrJekyll (26) 1 minute ago

Social Stigma

Acknowledgement of it does justify the continuing of the practice. Yes, you talked to VQ, ok. Good job. So why has it continued even on this very thread? He has used the "anti dem" line at least twice on this thread, that is about him doing it to begin with.

So because everyone can see that he is still doing it, I want censorship? Social stigma. ↥twinkle ↧stinkle permalink

[-] -2 points by DrJekyll (-143) 1 year ago

Social Stigma. Still not answering the question. Still redirecting.

[+] -13 points by DKAtoday (34976) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 year ago

You are a basic insult(?) is that what the 1st part of your comment means? As I would tend to agree.

I have had talks with VQ - he can verify that - some of the comments were made on the open forum. You seem to be against censorship but you seem all hot and bothered about VQ.

The last part of your comment ( lazy ) yes I would tend to think that you are.

You have a problem talk to the admin - but you don't want to do that as you do not want them aware of you. Hey Boot Boy?


[-] 0 points by DrJekyll (26) 1 minute ago

Basic Insult

Everyone on this forum can see that Vkag2 is chasing people with the Obama platform and anyone who dares disagree gets labeled an anti-dem partisan shill troll, including by you. We all know you see at least VQkag2 doing it. You have been asked by several people several times about it yet you refuse to denounce it, you don't even acknowledge the question. What you offer instead is redirection of the conversation, vague implications that go unanswered when called on it. Nothing. You are obviously giving sway to not just "progressive" but directly to Obama pushers. So sure. I'm lazy. ↥twinkle ↧stinkle

[-] 0 points by DrJekyll (-143) 1 year ago

Social Stigma

Acknowledgement of it doesn't justify the continuing of the practice. Yes, you talked to VQ, ok. Good job. So why has it continued even on this very thread? He has used the "anti dem" line at least twice on this thread, that is about him doing it to begin with.

So because everyone can see that he is still doing it, I want censorship? Social stigma.

[+] -13 points by DKAtoday (34976) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 year ago

I am not evasive at all - why are you so lazy?

[-] -1 points by DrJekyll (-143) 1 year ago

Basic Insult

Everyone on this forum can see that Vkag2 is chasing people with the Obama platform and anyone who dares disagree gets labeled an anti-dem partisan shill troll, including by you. We all know you see at least VQkag2 doing it. You have been asked by several people several times about it yet you refuse to denounce it, you don't even acknowledge the question. What you offer instead is redirection of the conversation, vague implications that go unanswered when called on it. Nothing. You are obviously giving sway to not just "progressive" but directly to Obama pushers. So sure. I'm lazy.

[+] -14 points by DKAtoday (34976) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 year ago

So - what(?) you want me to spank him now and tell him that he has been a bad boy - should I then ask him to go sit in a corner?

I think the mods can handle it.

The last time I pushed an issue of behavioral problems and tried to work out a peaceful sollution(?) - Odin went ballistic and got himself booted. He begged his way back on for another chance - Zen posted his request - he came back went back onto the attack and got booted again. Now he is back again. Lets see if we can all get along. ( um not you - just a saying ) I don't expect you will ever be amenable to this site or it's contributors - But I could be mistaken you have been here all day now.

[-] 0 points by DrJekyll (-143) 1 year ago

Ah, a little social pressure without the stigma. You are downplaying again. But we knew you weren't going to change course. You will still allow Obama pushers to harass anyone that isn't here to support Obama, troll shill and anti-dem will still be used and widely accepted. You will continue to insist a little oppression of dissent is not a big deal because hey, you do it too.

The question is no less absent or important than it was before your reply. Nothing has changed, not even your refusal to acknowledge the issue.

[+] -14 points by DKAtoday (34976) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 year ago

Like I said - I already answered the question - A couple of hours ago. Now feel free to go play in traffic.

[-] -3 points by DKAtoday (17482) from Coon Rapids, MN 2 hours ago

I said left leaning and I said progressive. Why don't you put your question to jart and the admin instead of the open forum as like you say this is their site not yours. ↥twinkle ↧stinkle reply edit delete permalink


[-] -1 points by DrJekyll (13) 3 minutes ago

I have not cussed at you or gotten nasty with you. I am only responding to you on this topic in this thread, I'm not chasing anyone around. It is a question and the question is the topic. I am on topic.

You could just as easily decline the question but at this point I am assuming you have refused to acknowledge the question. Tanks anyway. ↥twinkle ↧stinkle permalink

[-] 0 points by DrJekyll (-143) 1 year ago

You have not answered the question. You say you talked to him but the nature of your comments and the nature of comments from VQkag2 were no different today while I was watching, than they were a week ago.

[+] -13 points by DKAtoday (34976) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 year ago

Is that what you think? Why don't you read the updated forum material? Don't take my word for anything. Find truth for yourself.

[-] -3 points by DrJekyll (-143) 1 year ago

The About page has changed as well. The phone number doesn't work either. I tried a little while ago.

[-] 0 points by VQkag2 (16478) 1 year ago

Aaaah Ha Ha Ha!

[+] -4 points by DrJekyll (-143) 1 year ago

Baiting? Really? Aaaah Ha Ha Ha!

[-] -2 points by MrHyde (-24) 1 year ago

Yes, it can be, it should be.

[-] -3 points by beautifulworld (21421) 1 year ago

No. They ban people who try to divide the forum like yourself, Thrasymaque. I can name you many other posters who call for non-partisan politics here and they don't get banned. In fact, if you were truly interested in non-partisan politics you would bump up some of their excellent posts. But, I never see you on those posts,Thrasymaque, you are always too busy with putting up your own divisive posts that teach us nothing and get us nowhere.

[-] -3 points by neutrino (-197) 1 year ago

This is not my posting. Take it to MrHyde. I'm far from being the only one saddened by the fact that this forum has been co-opted by Obama lovers.

[-] -2 points by beautifulworld (21421) 1 year ago

Okay, neutrino, look in a mirror and say "MrHyde, read what beautifulworld wrote." Works for me.

[+] -14 points by DKAtoday (34976) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 year ago

trashy you have done nothing but try to interfere with this forum and the people who actually come here to support OWS and all occupy movements. If you do not like how jart and her admin run this place - then easy peasy - JUST LEAVE.

[+] -4 points by neutrino (-197) 1 year ago

I don't think you support OWS in any way shape or form.

[+] -13 points by DKAtoday (34976) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 year ago

Coming from you everyone should take that as a ringing endorsement of my work supporting OWS and all Occupy movements. Only your sockpuppets and fellow shills would disagree.

[+] -5 points by neutrino (-197) 1 year ago

It's a simple truth that everyone who understands OWS can see with utmost clarity. For your information, I did not start this thread. I am the only Thrasymaque here. You fail to believe this because you fail to see the truth. Perhaps asking Jart for a quick IP check would sharpen your senses.

[+] -13 points by DKAtoday (34976) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 year ago

Don't really matter to me - you another sockpuppet of your's or one of your henchpeople another shill or sockpuppet user. You are all the same.

[+] -5 points by DrJekyll (-143) 1 year ago

Social Stigmas.

[+] -12 points by DKAtoday (34976) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 year ago

ZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZ

[+] -4 points by GirlFriday (17435) 1 year ago

Lawd have mercy, give it a rest.

[-] 0 points by DrJekyll (-143) 1 year ago

it's either the 99%, Occupy not -co-opted, or it isn't. If it's going to be the liberal opposition to the tea party, I think someone should say so instead of hiding motive behind a vale of populism, we have enough of that already.

[-] -3 points by GirlFriday (17435) 1 year ago

Just fess up and tell us whom you work for? Fair is fair. This is your bread and butter, baby, isn't it?

[-] -3 points by DrJekyll (-143) 1 year ago

Social Stigma. You didn't answer the question.

[+] -4 points by GirlFriday (17435) 1 year ago

Just the truth, baby. Take that stigma and wear it like a badge.

I don't think that Occupy has been co-opted-it hasn't been for the lack of trying though. Everybody and their second cousin has/is trying to co-opt it. The issues presented and the solutions are liberal. It's why the little Tea Party peeps get nailed every time they come on the board. Just the ones that are paid to post and on specific issues like privatizing social security etc.

It is the Democrats that have lost more than the American Taliban so far. Simply because it has become a put up or shut up thing. It is the Democrats that have come down with a hammer on the protesters.

That doesn't mean that all liberals agree. We don't on many things.

[-] -1 points by slizzo (-96) 1 year ago

Wait...you really believe people are paid to post here? are you serious?

are you a 9/11 truther? If not, you'd be very good at it. Paranoid, comfortable with cognitive dissonance, gullible, scattered. I'd be shocked if you weren't a 9/11 truther.

[-] -3 points by Gluon (-19) 1 year ago

Open your eyes. DrJekyll and Thrasymaque stand for what OWS is. They don't want to co-opt it, it's the opposite. Those trying to turn it into a political playing group are trying to corrupt it. OWS has always been about anarchy, about refusing to make demands, about creating pressure from the outside. How can you say that someone standing up for those principles wants to corrupt OWS? It makes no sense.

And, I'm pretty sure no one is paid to post here. It's a small forum with a tiny readership. Check the web stats, they are really low. There's only a dozen regular writers. There are thousands upon thousands of forums out there with a heavier readership. And, nothing here translates to street protesting. If there are some people paid to infiltrate OWS, they would do it on the sites where anarchists discuss their next tactics. That's not here. If they are good infiltrators, they would do it in the street, not on the web.

I agree with slizzo below. You seem like a conspiracy theory lover. I guess you bite into the fear propaganda of the US government. Do you think there's always a camera watching you, and Men in Black waiting to take you to a FEMA concentration camp? Get a gripe, this forum is not part of Mission Impossible.

[-] 1 points by brightonsage (4494) 1 year ago

It would seem to me that what OWS stands for would have to be derived from some democratic process. I am unaware that any such process is routinely followed to determine what OWS "stands for" at a specific moment in time. What is that process? There are many people who have been on this site from all over the country and around the globe? Why is it invisible? What have the results been? How has it changed over the last year? Have I ever been invited to participate? What was my answer? Who is in? Who is out? Why??

[-] 1 points by shooz (17792) 1 year ago

Thrashy stood for nothing but tyranny.

It was all he practiced.

All he ever did here.

[-] -3 points by Gluon (-19) 1 year ago

Why are you using the past tense, and the fact remains, you have never understood Thrasymaque. He means more to OWS than you ever will. Thrasymaque uses arguments to further discourse, unlike you who hides behind ad hominem.

[-] 1 points by shooz (17792) 1 year ago

So you're saying that OWS stands for lies and tyranny?

That IS what thrashy stood for, and likely still stands for.

I understand him well. Far better than I ever wanted to.

[Removed]

[-] -3 points by CarlAndrews (-113) 1 year ago

Thrasymaque as always stood for OWS truth.

The fact is, you are not able to provide clear evidence for your accusations. It's easy to attack a particular user with ad hominem all day long. It's another matter altogether to pick up his arguments and discuss them like a fully grown adult.

Perhaps if you picked up one of his comments and clearly point out the flaws in his arguments with proper discourse you would get somewhere. This is something I haven't seen you do.

[-] 1 points by shooz (17792) 1 year ago

I'm sorry thrashy ALWAYS lied.

It's just what he did/does.

He's not in any way an honest person.

The proof is all over the forum, although hard to find because he uses sock puppets. ( Another form of lying).

He lied about almost everything

[-] -2 points by CarlAndrews (-113) 1 year ago

I read many of his comments and most seem quite sound. He always takes time to provide arguments. Do you have any arguments, or just empty accusations. Why not show where he lies?

[-] 1 points by shooz (17792) 1 year ago

That must be because you too, believe in lizard people.

I'm sorry. I don't bookmark everything, everywhere, just to satisfy the incredulous.

His biggest lies were about himself, his attitude and this web site.

He's very slick in his lies....politician slick. Carefully hedging most everything he ever said/says.

If you didn't know the truth, you didn't know he was lying.

[-] -2 points by CarlAndrews (-113) 1 year ago

Why would I bother to catalog the crap put out by a known liar?

Because, as you said below, only if you copy all the names he used then you know thrasy. This is your argument, not mine. Since you don't have all his names, then you can't know him as per your logic, which means you don't know if he's a liar or not.

[-] 1 points by shooz (17792) 1 year ago

I sure do know he lied!

He lied to me and the whole forum.

He lied and lied and lied.

Just like the kids who harassed Happy Jack!

Oh yes.......thrashy's a liar alright.

Why do YOU defend a liar?

Do you too love sock puppetry?

Do like to lie?

[-] -2 points by CarlAndrews (-113) 1 year ago

That is just one of his big lies. Sock puppets are a form of lying, did you know that?

I don't think so. It's a logical fallacy to attack the proposer instead of the argument.

Similarly, your arguments are not more powerful or right because you keep the same user and have high points.

Usernames just don't matter.

[-] 2 points by shooz (17792) 1 year ago

How are sock puppets not lying?

They are indeed a full on lie, indicative of a lack in self confidence and an attempt to make up for it through egoism.

He would go crazy trying to defend that HUGE lie.

Will you do the same?

[-] -3 points by CarlAndrews (-113) 1 year ago

Did you copy down all the names thrashy used?

If you didn't, then you don't know thrashy.

He's an extraordinary liar.

It's his best talent.

So, if we use your logic then it means that if you don't have the complete list of Thrasymaque's characters you can't judge him correctly because you don't know him.

Could we see the list please?

[-] 1 points by shooz (17792) 1 year ago

Why would I bother to catalog the crap put out by a known liar?

That's an exercise in frustration.

You, on the other hand are making tall, yet vague claims of his veracity.

Where's you list? You're the fan boy, not me.

He often defended tyranny. He didn't like it when I would point that out.

Will you too, defend tyranny?

He also defended his lies. Lies told about other posters he would harass with bots and sock puppets........

He's liar. A very good one, but a liar just the same.

[+] -11 points by DKAtoday (34976) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 year ago

Cmon trashy - we know that U have kept a complete list of your sockpuppets - U R so proud of your sly little self. Present your own list - your long list of shame.

[+] -4 points by CarlAndrews (-113) 1 year ago

How are sock puppets not lying?

They are indeed a full on lie, indicative of a lack in self confidence and an attempt to make up for it through egoism.

He would go crazy trying to defend that HUGE lie.

Will you do the same?

I don't see why sock puppets are lying. They are just forum characters. Lies will depend on what he writes. From what I've read of Thrasymaque, he seems like a well educated and very smart man. His comments are usually on the mark and backed up with rigorous arguments. He's fun to read!

[-] 2 points by shooz (17792) 1 year ago

If you don't see how sock puppets (banned in the rules), are lying then you are functionally blind.

Are you an egoist too?

Do you like to hide lies behind various sock puppets?

Like astro turf sites, sock puppets are a form of lying.....like it or not.

Did you copy down all the names thrashy used?

If you didn't, then you don't know thrashy.

He's an extraordinary liar.

It's his best talent.

[+] -12 points by DKAtoday (34976) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 year ago

U R 2 funny - campaigning 4 yourself. Let your self love shine trashy. LOL

[+] -4 points by CarlAndrews (-113) 1 year ago

I'm sorry. I don't bookmark everything, everywhere, just to satisfy the incredulous.

If you can't provide evidence or if you're too lazy to, then you should not accuse someone. It just makes you look weak and ridiculous.

We'll have to disagree. I read many of his postings and comments and he's one of my favorite writers here.

[-] 1 points by shooz (17792) 1 year ago

I also didn't bookmark the names of all of his sock puppets.

That is just one of his big lies. Sock puppets are a form of lying, did you know that?

[+] -10 points by DKAtoday (34976) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 year ago

trashy campaigning 4 trashy 2 funny. carltrashy is it fun 4 U ?

[+] -13 points by DKAtoday (34976) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 year ago

I said left leaning and I said progressive. Why don't you put your question to jart and the admin instead of the open forum as like you say this is their site not yours.

[-] -2 points by DrJekyll (-143) 1 year ago

So you haven't been reminding people of that all day? You haven't been taking that position to the extreme and using it to give Occupy the appearance of a liberal movement? Context is everything.

[+] -12 points by DKAtoday (34976) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 year ago

I take my stance as I have always taken my stance - you can call it what you want ( you will anyway ). If you want confirmation from the administration from jart the owner operator of this site - that this is a left leaning progressive site - well then that is who you should be asking - trashy.

[-] -3 points by DrJekyll (-143) 1 year ago

You really don't know who I am?

I will not willingly allow you to continue the co-opting of this forum for the democratic party.

[+] -13 points by DKAtoday (34976) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 year ago

You are a sockpuppet user - at this point in time I believe that you are the trashy puppeteer.

You show me and the rest of the forum where I have been co-opting for the democratic party. I have a fairly good body of work that is easily accessible.

YOU ? not so much.

[-] -3 points by DrJekyll (-143) 1 year ago

Social Stigma. I am protesting your continued alienation of users that are not hear to listen to the democratic party platform.

[-] -1 points by VQkag2 (16478) 1 year ago

No one mentioned the dem party or their platform but you.!

[-] -1 points by DrJekyll (-143) 1 year ago

Finding examples of your relentless efforts takes only to view your comments. Every now and then you tone it down when you get called out. Like now.

[-] -1 points by VQkag2 (16478) 1 year ago

You provide no evidence because you have none.

You are clearly only concerned with an anti dem partisan political campaign.

You have no other purpose than to stop anyone voting for liberal politicians.

It is all you ever do. That is why you are disregarded. You are clearly working against OWS and and liberal efforts.

[+] -13 points by DKAtoday (34976) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 year ago

You are an ankle biter a nuisance. And a long time troll. Nothing more.

[-] -2 points by DrJekyll (-143) 1 year ago

What is your participation? What exactly do you do outside this forum for Occupy? So then banning people that flip their lid because VQkag2 is chasing them around with the democratic party platform is pretty much it.

[-] -1 points by VQkag2 (16478) 1 year ago

I never chase anyone with the dem party platform. That is a lie.

You are clearly only concerned with an anti dem partisan political campaign.

Nothing positive, nothing of substance. Only negative, unfounded personal attacks

[-] -1 points by DrJekyll (-143) 1 year ago

Thank you for proving the point.

anti dem

Please, continue showing your interest. Being non-partisan does not mean giving the democratic party a free pass.


[-] 1 points by VQkag2 (9723) 1 minute ago

I never chase anyone with the dem party platform. That is a lie. You are clearly only concerned with an anti dem partisan political campaign. Nothing positive, nothing of substance. Only negative, unfounded personal attacks

↥twinkle ↧stinkle reply permalink

[-] -1 points by VQkag2 (16478) 1 year ago

You never do anything positive. All your efforts are focused on preventing any votes for left wing politicians.

You are anti dem partisan.

[-] -1 points by DrJekyll (-143) 1 year ago

Proving it again.

[-] -1 points by MrHyde (-24) 1 year ago

I have said nothing to defend either party. You have no grounds for an assumption of my party affiliation or preference. This is your predetermined motive for being on this forum. You are here to make criticism of the democratic party to be socially unacceptable.


[-] 1 points by VQkag2 (9723) 0 minutes ago

You never do anything positive. All your efforts are focused on preventing any votes for left wing politicians.

You are anti dem partisan.

↥twinkle ↧stinkle reply permalink

[-] -1 points by VQkag2 (16478) 1 year ago

You come here to campaign against one particular party. Never anything positive.

[-] -2 points by MrHyde (-24) 1 year ago

Please post a permalink for any comment I have made supporting a party.

 Failed redirect of the conversation
[+] -13 points by DKAtoday (34976) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 year ago

I talk to people when I am out and about taking care of personal business - I also take part in supporting other groups. I do as much as my health allows. Thank God for the internet.

[-] -2 points by DrJekyll (-143) 1 year ago

All that time on the web, at home. Yet you only engage on this forum to support Occupy. Seems odd to say the least.

[+] -12 points by DKAtoday (34976) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 year ago

I do as my health allows as you should be more then aware by now. So yes another strangeness or oddity in you. Well no not really as you are a troll who is intent on screwing with this forum and all of the GOOD people who come here.

[+] -4 points by DrJekyll (-143) 1 year ago

Social Stigma. A troll? As in a topic that you are not comfortable with? Or do you still think every troll is thrasy? Everyone who doesn't agree with you or VQ is a troll? A shill? A sock puppet?

Anything but addressing the issue because you can't.

[+] -11 points by DKAtoday (34976) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 year ago

Like I say I have an open and accessible body of work here that anyone can look at.

You? not so much.

So stop with your lies and innuendo.

[-] -3 points by DrJekyll (-143) 1 year ago

Letters that are never sent. Impressive.

[+] -11 points by DKAtoday (34976) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 year ago

They are sent - I even receive lip service response letters from time to time - but mostly requests for money. You can check twitter and see that I have shared them out to the public.

[+] -4 points by DrJekyll (-143) 1 year ago

Your twitter account is protected. Links?


[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (17444) from Coon Rapids, MN 8 minutes ago

They are sent - I even receive lip service response letters from time to time - but mostly requests for money. You can check twitter and see that I have shared them out to the public.

↥twinkle ↧stinkle permalink

[+] -10 points by DKAtoday (34976) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 year ago

Google my username along with attacks that some have made you can see what I have posted.

[+] -5 points by DrJekyll (-143) 1 year ago

That isn't a link. I said, your twitter is protected. And that's fine, security first and that's no joke. But I asked for a link. I don't want to go on a fishing trip.


[-] 2 points by DKAtoday (17444) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 minute ago

Google my username along with attacks that some have made you can see what I have posted.

↥twinkle ↧stinkle permalink

[+] -9 points by DKAtoday (34976) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 year ago

Not much of a trip to make - all the way up to your search window.

[+] -4 points by neutrino (-197) 1 year ago

The "I Love Obama" stance.

[+] -11 points by DKAtoday (34976) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 year ago
[+] -4 points by neutrino (-197) 1 year ago

Give it up Obama lover. OWS is NOT about legitimizing the government by sending letters to Obama, OWS is about fighting the broken system from the OUTSIDE in the streets where it counts. It's about anarchy. It's about grass roots activism. It's about believing that WE, the people, can change the world WITHOUT waiting for politicians to do it for us.

[-] 1 points by VQkag2 (16478) 1 year ago

If you believed that you would be doing it. Instead of attacking the people here.

So I guess you are not interested in the positive actions of working outside the system. I guess you just want to stop anyone who might vote for a left wing politician.

Anti dem partisan campaign much?

[-] -3 points by neutrino (-197) 1 year ago

I didn't start this thread. I am not anti dem. I am anti partisanship under the OWS format.

[-] 0 points by VQkag2 (16478) 1 year ago

You are clearly anti dem partisan. You offer nothing but negativity, No substance. You come here to tear down, to personally attack.

[-] -3 points by DrJekyll (-143) 1 year ago

Proving the point again. You chose to use the word "anti dem" as an insult. Your intentions are clear. 99% does not mean everyone who doesn't criticize the democratic party.


[-] 1 points by VQkag2 (9723) 0 minutes ago

You are clearly anti dem partisan. You offer nothing but negativity, No substance. You come here to tear down, to personally attack.

↥twinkle ↧stinkle reply permalink

[-] 1 points by VQkag2 (16478) 1 year ago

I'm not using it as an insult. Simply trying to show what you are. Simply showing that you are campaigning on this site when you know full well that is against the rules.

[-] -3 points by DrJekyll (-143) 1 year ago

What political figure or party am I pushing for?

 Failed redirection of conversation.
[-] -3 points by neutrino (-197) 1 year ago

I tear those who are not in the spirit of OWS. Obama lovers have no place here. People like Odin do.

[-] 0 points by VQkag2 (16478) 1 year ago

You don't get to choose who "has no place here" Sorry. If your goal is to find certain opinions and silence, or chase them off, then you are a partisan, and fascist!

All opinions should be welcomed here. Perhaps your opinions are not strong enough to stand up to others but that isn't a reason to silence the others.

Thats a reason for you to stop. or find better arguments. not to insult, or bully but attempt to pursued with intelligent points.

I don't love Obama and I wouldn't chase away your Romney lovin ass either.

It's all good.

[-] -2 points by neutrino (-197) 1 year ago

You are a simpleton. You think attacking Obama lovers means supporting Romney. Life is not black and white, it only is in your duopoly fantasy.

[+] -8 points by DKAtoday (34976) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 year ago

Go back to sleep - but whatever else you may do - go away.

You have no leg to stand on to back up your BS.

Hey - this might piss you off even more - I have it on good authority that every time you get banned? All of your voting goes right out the window next time the system updates.

Ain't that just the shits - not only can you not collapse comments anymore but your useless down vote attacks mean even less then before.

aAHhahahahahahahaheheeheeehhehehehoohoohoohoohoo.......funny.

[+] -4 points by neutrino (-197) 1 year ago

I don't vote. Not on this site, not for Obama. I stopped voting when comment collapsing was removed. I don't care about points. They are of no importance. You have no most points here but you don't even understand what OWS is all about.

[+] -9 points by DKAtoday (34976) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 year ago

So "U" say - others do not agree with U - only other shills agree with U.

[-] -3 points by DrJekyll (-143) 1 year ago

Another Social stigma.

Occupy agrees that Occupy does not support either party.


[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (17448) from Coon Rapids, MN 2 minutes ago

So "U" say - others do not agree with U - only other shills agree with U.

↥twinkle ↧stinkle reply permalink

[+] -9 points by DKAtoday (34976) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 year ago

Is OWS or Occupy supporting anything of the sort here? I do not believe so - not in any official capacity as that is not what OWS or Occupy does at this point in time - but they do not forbid forum supporters or street protesters from being political - in fact OWS and Occupy are all for Direct Democracy.

That would be why you don't see people getting booted for talking politics or political actions.

[-] -3 points by DrJekyll (-143) 1 year ago

Playing it down doesn't do much to convince the type of people that Occupy appeals to. The demographic that buys into over simplified and downplayed answers are watching CNN, Fox, or MSNBC right now.

[+] -10 points by DKAtoday (34976) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 year ago

Who is down playing anything(?) - there is just you your other sockpuppets your hench shills and their sockpuppets who are trying to feed disinformation and otherwise screw with this forum.

[-] -3 points by DrJekyll (-143) 1 year ago

Social Stigmas. You are not addressing the question of this thread.

[+] -10 points by DKAtoday (34976) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 year ago

I already answered the question on this thread - It is you who continues to chase your tail.