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We kick the ass of the ruling class

Occupy Wall Street Marks One Month

Posted 2 years ago on Oct. 17, 2011, 8:20 a.m. EST by OccupyWallSt

Occupations Spread to Over 100 US Cities

Movement For Economic Justice Gains Global Momentum

Liberty Square, New York, NY — One month ago today about 2,000 people rallied in Lower Manhattan and marched up Broadway. Stopping at Zuccotti Park an estimated 150 stayed the night and began an encampment. Renaming the space “Liberty Square,” we kicked off a protest against bank bailouts, corporate greed, and the unchecked power of Wall Street in Washington. In the last month, the message of “We are the 99%” has won the hearts and minds of over half of Americans (according to a recent Time survey) and is gaining ground globally, with 1500 protests in 82 countries this past Saturday (October 15).

“I am here to celebrate the 30th day of this protest against corporate power,” said Karanja Gacuca from Liberty Square, a former Wall Street analyst who now organizes with Occupy Wall Street. “Concerned about the egregious Wall Street bonuses — particularly after the industry accepted a tax-payer bailout and the middle class continues to be squeezed — I believe it's time for a fairer system that provides health care, education, and opportunity for all, and rejects corporate influence over government.”

Inspired by the uprisings across the Arab world, and fueled by the feelings of anger and helplessness of everyday Americans, in the past month Occupy Wall Street has:

  • Gone Global: On October 15th, protests were held from North and South America to Asia, Africa and Europe, with over 1,500 events in 82 countries, as part of a global day of action.

  • Flourished with Diversity: Occupiers of different ages, races, walks of life, and political beliefs have joined the movement. The mix grew quickly to include students, elderly people, families with children, construction workers on their lunch breaks, unemployed Wall Street executives, Iraq & Afghanistan veterans, moms, and many others.

  • Gained Support in the Heartland: Occupy actions are happening all across middle America, from Kethcum, ID to Kalamazoo, MI, from Orlando to Anchorage. Every day financial contributions arrive along with clothes, food, and notes of support from all across the country. A couple from West Virginia who have been sending supplies to Liberty Square occupiers writes: “We are so grateful for all of you involved in this defense of America. We firmly believe this is ‘it.’ If we can't grab this democracy this time, we'll sink and it will be a long time before we will have this opportunity again. Thank you for taking time from your busy life to be there.”

  • Changed the Conversation: The people-powered force of shared anger at a broken system that profits the top 1% at the expense of the rest of us has shifted our national dialogue. The Occupy Wall Street protest has become a cultural phenomenon, mentioned everywhere from jokes on Saturday Night Live to the solemn dedication the national memorial to Dr. Martin Luther King, Jr. by President Obama Sunday. We, the occupiers, have shown our country how to come together and respect differences while working together to build a movement for change.

What a month, and we are only getting started!

Occupy Wall Street is a people-powered movement that began on September 17, 2011 in Liberty Square in Manhattan’s Financial District, and has spread to over 100 cities in the United States and actions in over 1,500 cities globally. #OWS is fighting back against the corrosive power of major banks and multinational corporations over the democratic process, and the role of Wall Street in creating an economic collapse that has caused the greatest recession in generations. The movement is inspired by popular uprisings in Egypt and Tunisia, and aims to expose how the richest 1% of people are writing the rules of an unfair global economy that is foreclosing on our future.


765 Comments

765 Comments


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[-] 7 points by Benny14 (101) 2 years ago

1 month more and conquer the world. Stay focused don't get co-opted by politic parties.

Fight for freedom, Justice and democracy. Get the bribes out of politics, wall street needs to go and be brought to justice for fraud.

[-] 2 points by Flsupport (578) 2 years ago

I appreciate the post. It would be nice if it were just one month but no movement ends when we think it could. There are powerful forces at work here and they wont let go in one month.

[-] 1 points by Benny14 (101) 2 years ago

Doesn't matter how long it takes. Days, weeks, Months, Years if that's the price we have to pay to get freedom, justice and democracy, so be it.

[-] 1 points by Flsupport (578) 2 years ago

Good to hear that! That's the spirit!

[-] 1 points by Fluffles (18) 2 years ago

You can't get the bribery out of politics without bringing down the federal government and writing a new constitution.

But you can destroy the companies that are doing the bribery.

Buying silver en masse would destroy JP Morgan. They rely year after year on your not knowing that simple fact.

[-] 1 points by LaoTzu (169) 2 years ago

Yes and most importantly don't get Co-opted by individuals within your own group who are trying to be "Leaders" in a leaderless movement.

[-] 1 points by TheDude (18) 2 years ago

NOW HEAR THIS: Corporate Tall by VOLTFACE - a song about Wall Street Greed. Wonderfully appropriate! Its the Anthem we needed!

Listen for FREE on BANDCAMP:

http://voltface.bandcamp.com/track/corporate-tall

Available on iTunes as well...

[-] 1 points by ray4444 (69) 2 years ago

as old saying when money stop felowing on main street blood will be on street they can choose how they like it.

[-] 1 points by goeib1 (163) 2 years ago

The greatest heroes in our history have fought and died for your freedom to do the inane things you all do... don't call THIS fighting for freedom. What IS your justice? THIS is democracy? Get real.... because your little MOB running around in parks SAY they are the 99% of the population does NOT make it so. You are the 1% and in a "democracy" you are a flea.

Get bribes out of politics? Yet I hear NOTHING about removing Obama and his cronies vis-a-vis Solyndra, SunCorp, etc. For some reason, the TAKERS of the bribes get a free pass in this group but the givers, enabled by the taker politicians, are demonized as the evil.

What exactly do you MEAN when you say "wall street needs to go"? Have you even put a second of thought into the things you spew or is it just the "right" thing to say if you are part of this 1%

[-] 1 points by Benny14 (101) 2 years ago

What freedom? When the entire political system has been bought and sold to the highest bidder. that's not freedom that's slavery.

You say we should blame Obama? We say it doesn't matter if you blame the democrats or the republicans. They are all corrupt. Why go after wall street employees in congress and in government? We go after there boss. The fat cats sitting in there big bank office and are playing chess with the country and the world.

They think they can continue to sacrifice pawns in order to make a profit.

People want there country back

[-] 0 points by goeib1 (163) 2 years ago

You all keep throwing around these same old platitudes... getting REAL old.

You say you have no freedom and YOU are a slave (to SOMETHING, who knows what). Instead of throwing this same old shit out into the world, why don't you TELL me how you are actually in slavery to anybody in YOUR life right now. TRY IT! You make me ill when we have had and continue to have young people DYING for your freedom... YES FREEDOM.

You go on with this "fat cat" and "pawn" shit but have NO idea the consequences of what you are wishing for... unreal. Yes, the 99% want THEIR country back but not the way you 1% er's want to go about it.

BTW, please learn to spell to make your argument a little more palatable

[-] 1 points by tn40412 (4) 2 years ago

what about the fraud behind people making untruthful disclosures on their income when applying for credit?

[-] 1 points by LloydJHart (190) from Vineyard Haven, MA 2 years ago

Occupy Toronto Block Traffic Snarling Down Town Rush Hour Today! http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/toronto/story/2011/10/17/occupy-canada-monday.html

[-] 1 points by FreeMarkets (272) 2 years ago

Wall Street was the biggest contributor - by far - the current Obama regime, and Obama and his cronies are neck deep in the sewage of their own creation. Wall Street is just one of the conduits for this sludge - not the source. Reduce the size and scope of government and this kind of thing cannot happen!

[-] 1 points by MadAsHellInTX (598) from Shepherd, TX 2 years ago

For once we agree on something. :)

[-] 1 points by awesomeness (3) 2 years ago

amen lol

[-] 0 points by MiMi1026 (937) from Springfield, VA 2 years ago

I totally Agree!

[-] 0 points by struggleforfreedom80 (6584) 2 years ago

Agreed. We will win this sooner or later. The system we have today is not sustainable, so the question isnt IF were gonna end capitalism, it`s a question of WHEN. Keep on fighting, keep on growing.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MN2Q6sdh6Bg

http://struggleforfreedom.blogg.no/

[-] 5 points by Goodday (8) 2 years ago

Today was a great day for Occupy Wall Street. During a hearing on "US Economic Outlook and Monetarty Policy" in Washington, Mr. Hinchey of New York asked Bernanke about Occupy Wall Street. He brought up financial disparity, along with the Volcker Rule and Glass Steagall Act. Can be seen on C-Span library. YOU OWS ARE MAKING PEOPLE AWARE AND CAUSING THEM TO HAVE A SERIOUS DISCUSSION. Great Job!!

[-] 2 points by Fluffles (18) 2 years ago

Bernanke is actively trying to destroy the US dollar, so no, you are not changing anything. Only offensive financial attacks will work.

OWS people don't get it: The banks are at war with you. They want worldwide feudalism imposed.

[-] 1 points by Steve15 (385) 2 years ago

Do you have a link to this vid?

[-] 1 points by sewen (154) 2 years ago

Hi, I have created "Video Journals" (websites):

http://www.goldmanbanksters.com

http://www.Just-gov.com

http://www.Change-gov.com

All the sites stem from the concerns that I have about our crumbling economy and what was/is REALLY happening. People need to know what is happening behind the curtain.

I have tried to ORGANIZE ALL the great documentaries into topics that can help tell a story.

I found great documentaries on YouTube, but it was always hard to get back to them or point them out to friends. Now I just say, "Go to: http://goldmanbanksters.com/heroes/matt-taibbi/ " and watch the great interviews with Matt Taibbi (Rolling Stones) and read all his great articles on how "Goldman Sachs OWNs the World".

So if you want to learn about our financial fiasco try these. Note: I would love feedback and also additional topics/categories you want to see.

[-] 1 points by Brauer (8) 2 years ago

End capitalism? The most ultimate form of freedom? Seems contradictory

[-] 1 points by jryfrmjrsy (17) 2 years ago

this country was built on capitalism, the government was to keep things in order, but the problem we have now is a corrupt, power hungry government. the FDA? a government organization corrupted as most others. http://nationaljuggernaut.blogspot.com/2009/09/this-cartoon-seemed-far-fetched-in-1948.html

[-] 1 points by jryfrmjrsy (17) 2 years ago

what exactly are you going to win? Exactly??? jst curious

[-] 1 points by jryfrmjrsy (17) 2 years ago

what exactly are you going to win? Exactly??? jst curious

[-] 1 points by jryfrmjrsy (17) 2 years ago

hopefully, this means that Obama will not be elected again. because some of the money he received when running in 2008, which was more than mccain, came from some of the big business companies he bailed out. http://www.opensecrets.org/pres08/contrib.php?cid=N00009638

[-] 1 points by cmt (1195) from Tolland, CT 2 years ago

If you mean TARP, Bush signed it into law before Obama was elected.

If the big money loved Obama, they wouldn't have given 5 million to Romney already.

[-] 1 points by SwissMiss (2435) from Ann Arbor Charter Township, MI 2 years ago

True, but Republicans and Tea Party politicians receive WAY MORE money from big business than the left does..... so if you are honest, you will mention that and will call out both sides for it and not just the side you don't like.

[-] 1 points by jryfrmjrsy (17) 2 years ago

not sure what part of the Top Contributors to barack website you are arguing, the numbers are right there. Maybe this link will prove my point, of obama receiving more money, so no need to "call out both sides."

[-] 1 points by SwissMiss (2435) from Ann Arbor Charter Township, MI 2 years ago

It's NOT about winning. It's about CHANGING.

[-] 1 points by quercus (93) 2 years ago

thank you very much. it is not about winning or keeping score, it is about long - term; it is about CHANGING. it is about no u-turn, no going back.

[-] 1 points by SwissMiss (2435) from Ann Arbor Charter Township, MI 2 years ago

Yep!! It's NOT a game.

[-] 1 points by jryfrmjrsy (17) 2 years ago

and the funny part is Obama was promising "Change"

[-] 2 points by SwissMiss (2435) from Ann Arbor Charter Township, MI 2 years ago

And this isn't Obama's movement, so what's your point? Some things have changed for the better under Obama.... just not enough. And I'm not happy at all with him for pandering to the criminals.

[-] 1 points by jryfrmjrsy (17) 2 years ago

My point is we need obama out, he's just as corrupt if not more. Too many deals were made to create this horrible market and look who benefited, a man who knows how to organize and raise money. And here we are w/ the same people who voted him in are protesting big businesses. These people should be blaming themselves, obama, and the whole lib crew in power including those tax cheats and housing mrkt liars in their party. Personally, I don't think those big bus should've been bailed out, even if that meant we need to start from scratch and pull up or boot straps.

[-] 1 points by SwissMiss (2435) from Ann Arbor Charter Township, MI 2 years ago

We already had this horrible market before Obama became president. Have you forgotten about George Jr. and the 8 years he posed as president??? HE created this horrible market. Blaming Obama for creating it is asinine and is ignoring the truth. Jobs were lost under Bush. Under Obama, they've actually increased. Look at the numbers.

Um.... the right wing represents big business WAY MORE than anyone on the left does.... even more than Obama.

You seem to have very skewed views of what really happened.

[-] 1 points by quercus (93) 2 years ago

thank you, this is not Obama's movement. i voted for him; in voting near 40 years now, he was the first candidate i wanted before there was a primary, the candidate in the general, that i did not think the choice was not between bad and worse.

recently, he made a comment / answer on why the wallstreet1% had not been charged with criminal behavior, his answer was while immoral and/or unethical their actions (the wallstreet1%) was legal!!!

my question to him, and to all the U.S. Reps., how do legislate laws that are immoral / unethical???

this is a question i do not expect him or them to answer.

WE have to answer, and it will not be done in the next election.

[-] 1 points by SwissMiss (2435) from Ann Arbor Charter Township, MI 2 years ago

I agree. But if one of us was to steal a little money or a few goods from a store or from another person, we'd be sitting in jail for a while. It's such crap.

[-] 1 points by jryfrmjrsy (17) 2 years ago

as much as i like your point here, i must say that the only way to make a statement is to those who are immoral / unethical, is not to give them business. a monopoly is supposed to be illegal, enforce that, and when a business is corrupt the people should stop doing business with them. which brings me to another, and if you ask me, more corrupt arena is the media. if they told the truth, without taking sides or telling us what the owner of the company wants us to hear (because that owner has their own agenda), we would know the truth about these companies. and that goes for politicians too. for example, if franks didn't lie about the housing market being "fine" then maybe that situation would've been handled differently.

[-] 1 points by SwissMiss (2435) from Ann Arbor Charter Township, MI 2 years ago

I agree to a certain point, but when the government is letting business create monopolies and to do bad business, then they are equally as guilty as the businesses.... and all sides involved need to be changed. I agree that people should stop doing business with those who are corrupt, but ALL of it shouldn't fall on the consumers'/citizens' shoulders, either. Both businesses and the government have responsibilities, and if they aren't upholding their end of them, then it's time for them to take the heat.

[-] 1 points by jryfrmjrsy (17) 2 years ago

i agree, the banks should've crashed and burned, this president should not have bailed them out, but because he's corrupt, he owed them.

[-] 1 points by SwissMiss (2435) from Ann Arbor Charter Township, MI 2 years ago

First of all, it was Bush who bailed the banks out.... not Obama.... if you meant Obama. Obama bailed GM out.

[-] 1 points by SwissMiss (2435) from Ann Arbor Charter Township, MI 2 years ago

And Bush is the President who signed the bill, NOT Obama. Bush was President when it happened, so you cannot say that Obama bailed the banks out, even though he voted for it. That suggests that he was in charge when it happened, and he wasn't.

[-] 1 points by jryfrmjrsy (17) 2 years ago

Bush suggested the bailout, Obama voted for it, along with others obviously. That's why the tea party did their part in voting out the republicans they voted out.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Emergency_Economic_Stabilization_Act_of_2008

[-] 1 points by quercus (93) 2 years ago

i am sorry i do not get your point.

live in a wilderness, jeramiah johnson, good luck. autonomy does not, and dare i say can not live a void.

[-] 1 points by jryfrmjrsy (17) 2 years ago

i was asking struggleforfreedom80

[-] 1 points by SwissMiss (2435) from Ann Arbor Charter Township, MI 2 years ago

OK, it's about winning change then.

[-] 1 points by JustDaDamaja (43) 2 years ago

Can anyone make a strong debate against ending PLUTOCRACY....?

Nope...I didnt think so either....

Capitalism with regulations and reform to ensure fairness, a fair job market, and the ability for everyone to have access to clean air, clean water, a decent education which includes a good FINANCIAL education, a good health-care system, a good transportation system, for ALL...not just for the rich...

[-] 1 points by gnomunny (5783) from St Louis, MO 2 years ago

I'm sure there's plenty of people over here that can make a good argument against a government "of the rich, by the rich, and for the rich" but probably didn't want to waste the time answering such a dumbass question.

[-] 1 points by JustDaDamaja (43) 2 years ago

What one thing would 99 % of the people sign up for...

making it about left vs. right....rich vs. poor...socialism vs. capitalism...only would keep a divide among the 99%......

the carrot being waved in front of the poor and middle-class is that they too can one day be financially successful, and to a degree that is true. Socialism implies that due to being taxed so high...there is a limit placed on a person's earning potential...the debate on that will last GENERATIONS and long outlive any of us..

making this a case of PLUTOCRACY vs. DEMOCRACY would UNITE EVERYONE among the 99%...

the question was rhetorical. Please remain respectful. We are on the same side and I think I can safely assume we both have best intentions here.

[-] 1 points by RillyKewl (218) 2 years ago

Repeal Gramm-Leach-Bliley!

[-] 1 points by gnomunny (5783) from St Louis, MO 2 years ago

My apologies, my sarcasm does get the better of me at times. And true, there does seem to be a bit of a divide among the people. In wartime, which this is, divide and conquer is an extremely effective tactic, and this government has it down to a science. Hell, they've even been successful at dividing neighbor against neighbor, black against black, as evidenced by the media glorification of the "thug lifestyle." If people don't get their shit together soon and realize we have a common and very defined enemy, it'll be too late. Let's hope it's not already.

[-] 1 points by JustDaDamaja (43) 2 years ago

plutocrats = the enemy

[-] 1 points by gnomunny (5783) from St Louis, MO 2 years ago

Plutocrats and their pawns.

[-] 1 points by Adam20751 (58) from New York, NY 2 years ago

It seems to be that democracy is not a specific enough platform. It's conceivable to be for democracy and also be a libertarian, but this group seems strongly against libertarianism. Admittedly, it's something the group is still working out, but I for one am not against plutocracy and capitalism because they're antidemocratic (though that's part of it), I'm against them because they're not effective. They don't foster caring, sustainable, creative thinking and living.

[-] 1 points by JustDaDamaja (43) 2 years ago

ok...we can have different reasons for being against plutocracy....and i agree with all of yours by the way....

I just think that unless plutocracy is solved...corruption in our government will continue to infect our lives...

Quotes on Federal Regulations:

We can do nothing of good in the way of regulating and supervising these corporations until we fix clearly in our minds that we are not attacking the corporations, but endeavoring to do away with any evil in them. We are not hostile to them; we are merely determined that they shall be so handled as to subserve the public good. We draw the line against misconduct, not against wealth. - Teddy Roosevelt

[-] 1 points by meskk (17) from Miami, FL 2 years ago

Not sure why there is a need to END capitalism? It worked fine before all this mess.. just needs to be FIXED... perhaps a more revised or improved version of capitalism to be more compatible with globalization and 21st century technology.

[-] 3 points by Vickyc810 (14) 2 years ago

From truthout: "In 1970, Milton Friedman, father of modern free-market capitalism, wrote in The New York Times, "The social responsibility of business is to increase its profits." That is, corporate CEO's are essentially managers of other people's money (the shareholders) and are only allowed to invest it in policies and activities that will yield the greatest returns for those investors. This means buying off Congressmen (a ready available option in the US) for legislation that amplifies corporate wealth much more greatly than the investment in de facto bribery depletes it. It means defrauding vulnerable Americans by exploiting the widespread financial ignorance the banking sector has fostered - the likelihood that banks will be held accountable for their crimes by public servants who owe their careers to Wall Street campaign funding is not nearly great enough to threaten, on the balance, the windfall profits banks stand to make off of crooked practices."

[-] 2 points by robajz (6) 2 years ago

Yes, FIXED :) We need to realize it is not about the system, but rather about the people. Take capitalism out and you're still left with the same rubbish ignorant apathetic 99% people in one hand and 1% of freakin assholes in the other. Communism didn't work either. Its the same old story.

It's great to see all this happening, to see that USA is finally waking up from it's numb agony, but if you want to go far and beyond, you have to take patience on your side. Revolutions shake things up, but it is what comes after, that decides the future. You need long term measures for long term results:

Demand absolute transparency - no "confidential" government documents, every decision has to be logged and available for review at an instant to everyone. We have the technology to support it so why not?

Educate the little to love and care for each other, invent a whole new culture where co-operation is cool and competition is awkward. Don't expect immediate results, just be persistent.

Educate people to be responsible for their neighborhood and the whole society. Create an environment where taking part is fun.

... you continue... there's no point tearing something down if you don't have a replacement. Cut the crap of illusions and ideologies...

[-] 3 points by meskk (17) from Miami, FL 2 years ago

OWS will need support not only from police and government but from some of the 1% as well... and the way things are going, not specifically with OWS' success itself, but rather the recent behavior of big bank executives, and large corps, shareholders are starting to steam at meetings.. the chances look really good that they might jump the fence to OWS as well!!

[-] 1 points by robajz (6) 2 years ago

haha, let's see some steam and fences torn down!

[-] 2 points by TedRall (52) from New York, NY 2 years ago

Capitalism was always based on the unjust concept that we are not equal, that some people deserve to earn more than others. It never worked well except for the white, the males and the well-educated and well-connected. (I'm 3 out of 4, and I think it sucks.)

[-] 4 points by struggleforfreedom80 (6584) 2 years ago

Besides, capitalism has to grow all the time, and that is logically not sustainable. It leads to exploitation, concentration of wealth, the dsutruction of the environment, and last but not least, its UNDEMOCRATIC ( http://occupywallst.org/forum/replace-capitalism-with-democracy/ )

yours s. http://struggleforfreedom.blogg.no/

[-] 1 points by Brauer (8) 2 years ago

Wrong. The only sustainable economic model is one that is always growing. Because our population is always growing. Does that make sense? Strive for equality of opportunity. But equality of outcome? That can never be guaranteed. Or we will lose the ultimate goal -- freedom -- that this movement is striving for.

[-] 1 points by eidos (285) 2 years ago

Does it? That's one of the underlying assumptions that needs to be questioned now. That expansion model has got to stop. It is tragic. I think it is an assumption that capitalist system must accompany empire building. It can be turned to prosperity at home and cooperation with other nations. Isn't this expansion axiom one of the problems?

[-] 1 points by Brauer (8) 2 years ago

No. The expansion model is exactly why capitalism works. Think of it as a pie model -- would you rather have everyone splitting an equal portion of a pie that stays the same? The pie has to grow, so even the smallest piece continues to grow. Why do you think lower income people in the U.S. still enjoy products they weren't able to 100 years ago? I.e. air conditioning, cars, cell phones, etc....

[-] 1 points by eidos (285) 2 years ago

What about hemming in growth:

Let's say Lehman Bros didn't buy up mortgages and securitize them, they wouldn't have been growing as greatly as they could. Say they chose other investments and continued to prosper but not make the killing they thought that was going to represent. Hemming in growth, what happens?

I still really want to look at the assumption of ever increasing frontiers though. I really want to tear the assumption apart to see if it really is necessary. Why for instance do we have the notion of the slices of pie growing ever smaller? Can we use an scenario that would illustrate it? Thanks

[-] 1 points by JustDaDamaja (43) 2 years ago

Democracy vs Plutocracy

Making this about Capitalism will ensure that we remain divided among the 99%...

If you have ever been to Cuba...you know that even in a land where there is socialism...there can be exploitation....

If you have ever been to DR ( the complete opposite of Cuba )...you see that in an extreme capitalistic society....people still suffer from exploitation...

a mixed style of economics is best...and we have that....the problem is PLUTOCRACY infecting our government...

[-] 1 points by struggleforfreedom80 (6584) 2 years ago

Im advocating Libertarian Socialism, or at least a more Libertarian Socialist-like society. That has nothing to do with Cuba. There are more alternatives than capitalism and leninism. If you like the idea of democracy you should expand it to workplaces and communities as well http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YDHBvQRyOr0

[-] 1 points by Adam20751 (58) from New York, NY 2 years ago

I agree that retaining the anti-capitalist direction of the movement makes us unrepresentative of many people's current ambitions, but it seems possible to me that we could educate enough people to the point they'd see the problems with capitalism. Such education will be time-consuming and derisive, but also extremely important and liberating.

I like Cuba's system, but they're not a good example of the potential of leftist politics in many ways because of negative American pressures on their (comparatively) small economy.

[-] 1 points by SwissMiss (2435) from Ann Arbor Charter Township, MI 2 years ago

Educating people is the key. Capitalism is pounded into our heads from the day we're born, so most people can't imagine having some other system.

[-] 1 points by JustDaDamaja (43) 2 years ago

we already have adopted leftist politics for almost 100 years...our capitalistic system needs reform and our political system needs corruption weeded out to ensure it.

[-] 1 points by MiMi1026 (937) from Springfield, VA 2 years ago

What!! adopted leftist politics for the past 100 yrs? You got any facts that this country laws are based on "leftist politics"?

[-] 1 points by JustDaDamaja (43) 2 years ago

we have had PUBLICLY FUNDED school systems we have had PUBLICLY FUNDED health care systems for elderly folks we have had PUBLICLY FUNDED retirement packages we have had PUBLICLY FUNDED programs for handicapped folks

so and so forth.....leave it up to a libertarian/conservative and none of these programs would exist

[-] 1 points by SwissMiss (2435) from Ann Arbor Charter Township, MI 2 years ago

agreed

[-] 1 points by SwissMiss (2435) from Ann Arbor Charter Township, MI 2 years ago

"we already have adopted leftist politics for almost 100 years... "

What do you mean by that? Right wing politics sure in the hell haven't solved ANYTHING and do way more harm than left wing politics do.

[-] 1 points by JustDaDamaja (43) 2 years ago

what i am saying is that we have had a mix of both socialistic and capitalistic economic policy in America...

leaning more towards fairness is what we need...some call it "left", I just call it fair...

corporations can make a "reasonable" profit...AND still pay their workers well and ensure they work in a habitable environment.

[-] 1 points by jryfrmjrsy (17) 2 years ago

i hear you, justda, corps should make a reasonable profit, a cap if you will. there's no reason why there can't be 1000 different Googles, Apples, etc corps making the same amount capped off, with shareholders making money on each. but then again, everyone is greedy, everyone wants everything for nothing, and no one wants to work for anything anymore. so when we all end up making the same product and someone says that's good enough, then no one will be able to better that product because that would be (dare I say) competition. it's not a perfect world and by our country screwing our economic system by creating to many laws and regs because too many people are too stupid and/or lazy to do something for themselves we will be taken over by some other country or way of life because we will be caught lying around picking flowers, and hugging trees. i'm beginning to think about the time machine, now.

[-] 1 points by Brauer (8) 2 years ago

Caps don't work. They create shortages. Remember the gas lines in the 1980s?

[-] 1 points by JustDaDamaja (43) 2 years ago

hmmm...i dont know so much about the term "cap"....thats an extremely hard sell...

i just think that bringing jobs to the US in both the service industry and manufacturing industry would decrease profits for some companies...but not to the point where they cant make a good living...unfortunately...companies are more beholden to their stock-holders than they are their country

[-] 1 points by JustDaDamaja (43) 2 years ago

what country has the perfect mix ?

is there a model that we can look at ?

[-] 1 points by Brauer (8) 2 years ago

Uh...the United States?

[-] 1 points by JustDaDamaja (43) 2 years ago

minus the plutocrats, i think you might be on point...

but we'll never know til our system is cleaned up

[-] 1 points by SwissMiss (2435) from Ann Arbor Charter Township, MI 2 years ago

Iceland has a very good system as well and has almost no poverty or crime. They did have a financial collapse about the same time we did, due to same reasons, but I think they may have recovered from it or mostly have. They really didn't have poverty until their economic collapse.

[-] 1 points by SwissMiss (2435) from Ann Arbor Charter Township, MI 2 years ago

Sweden, Norway, Finland.... just to name a few

I don't know if any country has a "perfect" system.... but there are systems that are a hell of a lot better than that of the USA, where greed rules.

[-] 1 points by Votesmarternexttime (2) from Morristown, NJ 2 years ago

Those countries are small and have fairly tight immigration controls so they are "taking care of their own/each other," so to speak. Everyone contributes something because virtually no one is illegal/without proper citizenship or able to circumvent complex welfare laws. So it works there because it is easier to regulate when the population is so small. I don't see that system working here.

[-] 1 points by Adam20751 (58) from New York, NY 2 years ago

I disagree with this line mostly because I see it as having been generated and advocated by precisely the folks that benefit from the current wealth and power inequality here. Seems to me that most folks contribute less and sap more than most of the illegals I know.

[-] 1 points by SwissMiss (2435) from Ann Arbor Charter Township, MI 2 years ago

Not trying at all doesn't mean it doesn't or can't work.

[-] 1 points by SwissMiss (2435) from Ann Arbor Charter Township, MI 2 years ago

I disagree that it can't work here. Also, they don't have an enormous military and defense budget. We could do a LOT if we would tone down our military empire.

[-] 1 points by JustDaDamaja (43) 2 years ago

ok...im not that aware of how their system works...I have heard good things about Germany...

I do have a friend from Sweden that says the standard of living is really high there...the only folks who have issues with the system there are those who feel that you cant be rich... Actually Sweden has the smallest disparity between rich and poor...

Im not sure if their system would work here...it is worth looking into...

do u have details ?

[-] 1 points by cmt (1195) from Tolland, CT 2 years ago

They do an amazing job of educating their children in Scandinavia, as well as protecting the kids from poverty. There is universal health care, with very low rates of teenage pregnancy. Their taxes are high but their life is good.

[-] 1 points by Brauer (8) 2 years ago

You also can't get a job.

[-] 1 points by SwissMiss (2435) from Ann Arbor Charter Township, MI 2 years ago

I imagine they have very low crime as well.

[-] 1 points by MadAsHellInTX (598) from Shepherd, TX 2 years ago

I think it's more a kleptocracy. They're robbing us blind, while paying the politicians to let them get away with it - and they control the mainstream media channels, so they can lie, distract and brainwash, hoping that the "sheeple" wouldn't catch on.

Too late, we have. The more we spill the beans and expose the bullshit for what it is, the more momentum we get.

Wall street's icon is a bull. HEH! Very apt.

[-] 1 points by MiMi1026 (937) from Springfield, VA 2 years ago

Heh,heh..Agreed!

[-] 1 points by JustDaDamaja (43) 2 years ago

having politicians that are immune to that is the key...

of course we all saw what happened to Andrew Jackson...Teddy Roosevelt...Abe Lincoln...JFK....etc...

any politician that gets in the way either gets their life taken or several attempts are made on their life...

look up JFK Executive Order 11110

[-] 1 points by MadAsHellInTX (598) from Shepherd, TX 2 years ago

Rep Gifford, too. Though in that case, they tried to paint the would-be assassin as some sort of extremist nutjob. They failed to kill her, so is she still under threat of another "extremist nutjob" hitman?

[-] 1 points by JustDaDamaja (43) 2 years ago

Quotes on Political System:

Instead of instruments to promote the general welfare they have become the tools of corrupt interests, which use them impartially to serve their selfish purposes. Behind the ostensible government sits enthroned an invisible government owing no allegiance and acknowledging no responsibility to the people. To destroy this invisible government, to dissolve the unholy alliance between corrupt business and corrupt politics, is the first task of the statesmanship of the day.

  • Teddy Roosevelt June 1912 Republican National Convention

P.S.

An assassin attempted to kill Roosevelt 4 months later...the assassin was never convicted of any criminal act...was placed into a mental hospital when he said the ghost of McKinley told him to shoot Roosevelt...

[-] 1 points by FreeMarkets (272) 2 years ago

Malthus beat you to this logical error by a couple of centuries, but who's counting . . ?

[-] 1 points by MadAsHellInTX (598) from Shepherd, TX 2 years ago

You call yourself "FreeMarkets", and probably believe there is such a thing.

News Flash: There isn't. They lied to you, man. It's a fantasy, a farce, a joke, and absolute bullshit. Would you believe in pink unicorns and leprechauns if Citi Corp told you to?

Sheesh! Have a fresh mug of wakeup.

[-] 1 points by MiMi1026 (937) from Springfield, VA 2 years ago

:~D

[-] 1 points by gnomunny (5783) from St Louis, MO 2 years ago

Hey, man! Some of my best friends are leprechauns! Why all the hate?

[-] 1 points by MadAsHellInTX (598) from Shepherd, TX 2 years ago

Really? Ask 'em for a pot of gold bud, we can use the funding. ;)

[-] 1 points by MiMi1026 (937) from Springfield, VA 2 years ago

luv the humor. heh heh !

[-] 1 points by Brauer (8) 2 years ago

Wrong. Capitalism is based on the equality of opportunity by protecting life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness. What it doesn't guarantee, is equality of outcome. Because we are all unique, and while we should strive for everyone to have equal rights, that is not the same as forced equality. It's a fine line.

[-] 1 points by TedRall (52) from New York, NY 2 years ago

Where is the equality of opportunity for people born poor, in the slums? Their schools are terrible, their infrastructure sucks, their libraries are closed. Equality of opportunity is a ridiculous joke.

[-] 1 points by MiMi1026 (937) from Springfield, VA 2 years ago

Exactly!

[-] 1 points by legalassistant (164) from New York, NY 2 years ago

hi Ted! Good to see you here (long time FOR)

Equal pay for all is a powerful idea. There is no idea I get more shit for than that one. People are deeply offended by it.

[-] 2 points by TedRall (52) from New York, NY 2 years ago

Likewise, good to see you too.

I don't know why equal pay is so hard for people to see, especially when they understand the greed of the 1%. How did the 1% get to be the 1%? It wasn't because they "deserve" it.

[-] 1 points by legalassistant (164) from New York, NY 2 years ago

And we are getting more and more mainstream voices calling attention to the fact that banks are lending us our own money and charging us interest on it.

[-] 1 points by taysic (87) from Tiburon, CA 2 years ago

I think we can think of something better than capitalism.

[-] 1 points by Uspatriot5000 (128) 2 years ago

REALLY!! What's wroing if I work twice as hard as someone else, me not making more money and a better life for my family. People who are willing to take risk, invest time and money, work their tail off, should make more than someone just sitting around just doing enought to keep their job. No, I am not rich. I don't have a 4-year degree, or an Ivy league education, but I do do well by working 50-70hrs a week.

[-] 1 points by TedRall (52) from New York, NY 2 years ago

No one should stop you from working hard if you want to. But it doesn't entitle you to live better than people who choose to spend time with their families.

[-] 1 points by EAD69 (8) 2 years ago

Common, Ted. That's just too much. You are saying that a guy who works 70 hours a week is not entitled to more than a similar guy working 40 hours and then chilling with kids? Seriously? A guy who spends time with family does so at an opportunity cost of working. And perhaps that is time well spent because his kids will inherit the values and work ethic that would help them in life more than the extra buck that a harder working guy brings home. But this is a fair trade off and there is nothing wrong with it. I never worked 40 hour weeks, I'd be too bored to come home at 5:30pm. I like what I do and could spend 12 hours + per day doing it. And I want to get paid more than the next guy for doing so. Btw those young guys who work in finance and whose path to work OWS folks are blocking, they put in 90+ hour weeks and have no vacations, and work weekends. And yes they make $200k at 25 years old but they made a choice to work harder then most and sacrifice time with friends and family. Who are you to judge them?

[-] 1 points by TedRall (52) from New York, NY 2 years ago

We all have the right to judge, and we all do judge.

The fact is, working hard is its own reward for those who care about their personal reputation as a hard worker, and those who simply like to work. Lots of people work hard with low salaries--artists, workers, actors, etc. The point is, we are all entitled to the good things in life simply because we are lucky enough to live in a wealthy nation.

[-] 2 points by Uspatriot5000 (128) 2 years ago

I do spend time with my children. I have 4. I take one to karate and Scouts, another to dance. Two are pretty much grown. I have been a young widower and a single father. I worked during the day, then did more after my children went to bed. I even worked on a 4 year degree! My wife taught all day and worked on her Master's in Education while pregnant. It can and is done all the time, some people are just willing to do it. Others, just want to do what they have to, then have everything else given to them. Those of us, in the middle class, who bust our butts should live better. People need to learn to live within their needs. These people who buy a 16 or 18 year old a $40k car is ridiculous. Heck, I haven't bought a new car in over 10 years. Nothing better, or more cost effective, than a good, low mileage used car. We also own a 1800sq ft house. No need for some mansion size house. What kills me is people who live pay check to pay check, yet have 2-3 new cars, 2-3 huge flat screens, pay for houses that are hundreds of thousands of dollars. Then when the #$%^ hits the fan, they are unprepared, and expect their fellow tax payers to bail them out!!!

[-] 1 points by TedRall (52) from New York, NY 2 years ago

No doubt, human beings make bad decisions. That's why the entire capitalist economy collapsed in 2008—because humans made stupid decisions.

Why shouldn't individuals be helped after they screw up? Corporations and CEOs get plenty of help.

People who smoke get lung cancer. I don't want them to die in the street—I want them to get medical treatment. Even though I hate smoking. People who eat poorly get heart attacks. They still need help.

I bet you've made mistakes too. And I bet you've gotten breaks for them. We all have. It's called compassion and decency, something that's been missing from politics for a long time.

[-] 1 points by Uspatriot5000 (128) 2 years ago

Yes, I have made bad decisions in my life, and I lived with them. I didn't ask anyone for help. I have been laid off 3 times, still managed to take care of my family. I have never been on any kind of government program. I was laid off in the middle of 11/08 and started a new job 4 weeks later. So, NO I never got or asked for any breaks!!

[-] 1 points by EAD69 (8) 2 years ago

You know what's been missing from politics and life in general lately? Some good old natural selection. Natural selection that applies to corporations, individuals, and everything else. An obese individual sitting at McDonalds wants my compassion? Guys on Medicaid standing around chain smoking want my compassion? These actions are equivalent of walking in front of a train. My response would be the same that Rooster Cogburn from True Grit gave: "I can't do nothing for you son". They are eating and smoking away my tax dollars. They are stealing from me by slowly killing themselves. They are a burden, a ballast of society, and need to go. You would say what about those reckless financiers who created complex synthetic securities, levered up, and then ran into a wall. And I would agree with you. That also should have been punished. But unfortunately it's not as simple to punish an entity that props up a large portion of our financial system as oppose to punish an individual. The "punishment contagion" from letting a financial institution go under does not stop with its assets or executives, it would hit everyone, including you and I. That's why these "corporations" got bailed out and you didn't. Get it now? In reality you got bailed out too along with the corporations. Is it fair? No probably not. But life is not always fair. Sh%t happens. Evil happens. The right response though is to pick up the pieces and work even harder and do even better. Let me suggest an example - the Jews. Persecuted and treated unfairly for centuries, and what do they do in response? They work harder and study harder than most, and in the end they succeed and now excel in arts, finance, science, public life. A contrast would be the Civil Rights movement. In response to unfair treatment they made posters and took to the streets, the marched and chanted, and screamed about victimization. And now what? 40 years later they are still holding their posters and marching. Point is, life is unfair. Suck it up, go back, and beat "them" by being 100x better than the rest. Good luck.

[-] 1 points by TedRall (52) from New York, NY 2 years ago

Um, no. I would have been MUCH better off had the big corporations NOT been bailed out.

If every American who lost her home or his job got an even share of the bailout, that would have meant a check for $160,000 each. Personally, I could use the $160,000 more than the existence of Citigroup.

[-] 1 points by EAD69 (8) 2 years ago
  1. Good artists make more than most of us, so do great actors. But when you go into a field like that one must understand that to make a living you must be in the top 5% versus a field like dentistry where you can be average and make a good living. Again all known rules. The reason being is that society doesn't need 50,000 actors but everyone has teeth. That's supply/demand.
  2. No one is entitled to anything aside from the opportunity of making something of themselves given the rules of the game supported by the system of laws and executive power, and protected by the military. That's what a nation is. And what wealthy nation are you taking about? Last time I checked US is nearly bankrupt so I'm not sure what you want to be entitled to...perhaps a share of that debt? GDP does not belong to the nation (aka government), value production belongs to the companies that create it. Then they pay taxes that are used by the government to provide social services and protect the system and citizens. You say "we are all entitled to the good things in life" as if this is UAE and we all have a share of an oil well. Guess what? We don't have a national oil well, there are too many of us, and many of us are also incompetent and lazy. So you cannot build a mini-Sweden or mini-Norway here. Yes those are socialist countries with 40%+ tax rates and free medicine and education. The diffence is that they have 5-10 million of educated hardworking motivated people that are more alike than different in their values and lifestyle. And here you have 300+ million of well...us. So no dice for your Marxist paradise.
[-] 1 points by legalassistant (164) from New York, NY 2 years ago

Norway

[-] 1 points by TedRall (52) from New York, NY 2 years ago

The government is broke. The nation is wealthy. The problem is income and wealth disparity.

I, for one, am tired of living in some microeconomic dystopia. To hell with supply and demand! We can invent a new world.

[-] 2 points by Uspatriot5000 (128) 2 years ago

Personally, I think there are more of us hard-working, middle-class people who think just the opposite of you. They try to make your numbers look large, but they aren't. As someone posted earlier, they drove by and the group looked much smaller. If these people put this much effort into finding a job, then they may have one. All that liberal, Marxist Obama has done is drive this country further into debt by all of his failed "stimulus" programs, and now he wants to keep up what isn't working. Marxism always fails!

[-] 2 points by Uspatriot5000 (128) 2 years ago

Then move to a different country that is more suited to your wants\needs. If you don't like it, then LEAVE!! If you think it is better in other countries.

[-] 1 points by TedRall (52) from New York, NY 2 years ago

That is a fascist attitude.

We need to build a country that accommodates the needs of all Americans, not just the 1% of the 1% who are stealing everything.

[-] 1 points by Uspatriot5000 (128) 2 years ago

This country worked just fine until all of the social programs the liberals came up with starting in the 1960's. Heck, even FDR originally made Social Security voluntary. There was less single mother's and broke families. As I said on here one other time. My mother worked as a pediatric nurse. On many occasions, she overheard single mothers discussing how they needed to have more babies to get more money from the government. I bet they wouldn't think that way if they had to bust their tail to support those babies.

[-] 1 points by EAD69 (8) 2 years ago

Ted,

All the slogans, the rhetoric, and quoting of Chomsky and Engels aside, what exactly is the goal of the movement? You are a well educated reasonable person and probably have a well thought out perspective. What is a realistic objective here? To force campaign finance and lobbying reform? Most people will support that cause. Nationalize healthcare - fewer people would be on board but still if done right, could be a net positive. Reform educational system to make it more affordable while improving quality and access - all in. But when you and some other voices on these message boards say vague things like End of Capitalism, or Corporations only care about themselves (as if they are these creatures), or lets establish a Marxist State, you lose people. Reasonable people who would otherwise support the cause has it not been for the anarchist/Marxist/no-clear-messagist element of the movement. The same problem the Tea Party has: the message of ending government corruption and lack of accountability resonates with most but when it's mixed with Christian fundamentalism and a touch of Jim Crowe, the overall message gets lost.

[-] 1 points by TedRall (52) from New York, NY 2 years ago

Granted, not all of the Occupy movement can travel all the way down the road to revolution together. However, most of us can go most of the way. We should start doing that and worry about the rest later.

[-] 1 points by JustDaDamaja (43) 2 years ago

The "start" has occurred...at what point do we start getting involved in the details?

[-] 1 points by gnomunny (5783) from St Louis, MO 2 years ago

Yeah, that "well-connected" one makes all the difference (heh heh).

[-] 1 points by FreeMarkets (272) 2 years ago

. . . he opined, as he entered his thoughts into the massive infrastructure of the internet . . . . powered by massive amounts of energy from capitalists, fed by massive amounts of disease-free, nutritious food from capitalists . . .

fail

[-] 1 points by ARealNewYorker (227) from Brooklyn, NY 2 years ago

The internet was developed by the NSF, genius - it's a GOVERNMENT program. Even the companies (who all by their lonesome with no help from anyone because they're run by real men and not you fruity hippies!) that worked on developing it were massively funded by the US government. But feel free to repeat some more libertarian mantras you overheard from someone else who actually read Hayek and Rothbard.

[-] 0 points by FreeMarkets (272) 2 years ago

Some of the innovation in the internet came from government programs. So what. Capitalists paid for those programs - as government has no money of it's own, genius.

Just because we have a federal highway system for Walmart to roll its trucks on does not make the genius and innovation of Walmart a government program.

[-] 1 points by ARealNewYorker (227) from Brooklyn, NY 2 years ago

Everybody paid for those programs because they were funded by tax money, which everyone pays. You often sound like you're saying "capitalists" are solely responsible for everything that happens (except the bad stuff), and the rest of us just sit around receiving it without having done anything, which is patently untrue.

[-] 0 points by EAD69 (8) 2 years ago

We are not equal. That's the whole point. Some are just born better (smarter, stronger), others work harder (in school, at their jobs). And yes they deserve more than everyone else. That's how it should be. Otherwise what's the incentive? Why should anyone then reach for that 4.0 GPA and prestigious job if the reward is the same?

[-] 3 points by TedRall (52) from New York, NY 2 years ago

For the right to work in their chosen field. For the glory. I am a cartoonist. I love what I do and would continue to do it regardless of the money which, in fact, has become substantially worse due to the meltdown of the media. And yes, we ARE equal. That's the point.

[-] 2 points by AreUSerious (20) 2 years ago

Im sure the cartoonists for southpark, Family guy, garfield did or are doing just fine. The best farmers probably yield more crops out of their land. The best construction workers become foreman, or start their own contracting company. The smartest candidates for the medical field make it through their programs and become successful. Those who aren't at that caliber make ends meat, or don't survive in that field.

Are There exceptions to this? Yes, you have talented toolmakers and others in Manufacturing who lose their jobs because consumers like cheaper products over domestic products and they create a market for cheap goods.

Capitalist economies work. A family friend told me that when he came to the US, he came because he heard it was the land of opportunity. He looked around, took a job in a factory and realized that opportunity didn't fall on his lap, life is what you make it.

[-] 2 points by JustDaDamaja (43) 2 years ago

the chance for FINANCIAL EDUCATION should equal.

Yes some are born smarter...stronger...and work harder....

the fact that FINANCIAL EDUCATION is kept away from the 99% is a MAJOR part of the reason why 99% are broke...

EQUAL FINANCIAL EDUCATION starts in the elementary school system...

If it means an extra hour in class then so be it...it is THAT IMPORTANT

[-] 1 points by EAD69 (8) 2 years ago

Solid idea. Not sure if it would change much though. Knowledge is a part of it but system of values and parentin is more important. An example would be much higher rates of say smoking and obesity in minority communities. They know that smoking and overeating is bad for you but their value system and lack of proper parenting still lead them on the wrong path. So if they are now told that investing is better than spending and that maxing out 4 credit cards to tint car windows or buy iPhones is not savvy, it would not preclude them from doing the same. All I'm saying is that Financial education should be a part of a larger solution and not the solution.

[-] 1 points by JustDaDamaja (43) 2 years ago

of course...its not the end all/be all...but a critical component

[-] 2 points by kuuura (19) 2 years ago

I'm a white female (privilege of my race, though not gender) who graduated with a 4.0 and has more than 10 completely different skill-sets that could lend me a job. I've been looking for a job in my field for more than 6 months. I'm underemployed and barely making it.

The reality of the situation is this: even people like me, who worked hard for all the awards and academic praise they've received, are still not able to pull their heads above water in our economic crisis. The system is broken. We should praise hard ETHICAL work, not hard work that breaks the backs of the middle to lower class. The point of America is to rise above hardships. And the occupiers are trying to do just that. America should not be built on inequality, it should be built on overall equality and merit based on work and importance of work. Thats it. Teachers should be paid more than cashiers, but cashiers should be paid enough to survive. Common sense.

[-] 1 points by Uspatriot5000 (128) 2 years ago

Could it be your career choice? I work as an Information Technology professional. I do not have a 4 year degree, yet make a very good living. My wife has been a teacher for over 20 years, with a Masters and other certifications. I make more than her. Laid off and found another job in this recession. In fact, my company, a manufacturer with all of their locations in the US. Everything is made in America. Privately owned and have never laid off a single person in all of this mess. Cut some hours back, yes, but kept everyone employed. In fact, they have increased my salary significantly in the last 2.5 years. Sometimes people choose a bad profession. My wife regrets selecting teaching, but she only has 7 years to retirement, so a little late to change.

[-] 1 points by notaneoliberal (2269) 2 years ago

That is one of the sanest comments I've read here.

[-] 2 points by Thinkdeer (250) 2 years ago

The incentive for creative efforts is always and has always been the product, and the social reward of the product. This is how it should be, after all our bodies natural response to solving a problem or creating a thing we like is to release dopamine and endorphins into the body which sooth and make us happy. When we supplement our bodies natural reward system with an external reward system like, gaining disproportionate ability to consume, we move the reward from internal to external. This means that we increasingly place value on these external rewards which may or may not be responsive to our own personal creative endeavors. Sometimes even leading to creating things that make ourselves obsolete.

We do this, find external rewards, in many ways; We over eat, We over exercise, we consume plant based or artificially produced endorphin and dopamine mimickers, and we seek out other rewards like "grades" and "pay raises." The thing all these addictions have in common is that they take award out of being internal and immediate social circles, and make them external. Once reward is external we can be lead by the nose of those who can dispense the reward.

The incentive for creative efforts is always and has always been the product, and the social reward of the product. This is how it should be, after all our bodies natural response to solving a problem or creating a thing we like is to release dopamine and endorphins into the body which sooth and make us happy. When we supplement our bodies natural reward system with an external reward system like, gaining disproportionate ability to consume, we move the reward from internal to external. This means that we increasingly place value on these external rewards which may or may not be responsive to our own personal creative endeavors. Sometimes even leading to creating things that make ourselves obsolete.

We do this, find external rewards, in many ways; We over eat, We over exercise, we consume plant based or artificially produced endorphin and dopamine mimickers, and we seek out other rewards like "grades" and "pay raises." The thing all these addictions have in common is that they take award out of being internal and immediate social circles, and make them external. Once reward is external we can be lead by the nose of those who can dispense the reward.

So no, the creative and the hard worker and the genius should not be externally rewarded more. They should be loved and adored for their work, perhaps attract potential mates for the work rather than the ability to hold onto external rewards. And most of all they should not worry about providing for those who are not smart enough, not creative enough or lazy. After all, those others can not take away the internal and immediate social rewards of working hard and being creative.

[-] 1 points by struggleforfreedom80 (6584) 2 years ago

We`re all different, but the way we build a good society is by creating an egalitarian and more democratic way of organizing our relations. Read more here:

http://occupywallst.org/forum/the-free-lunch/

http://occupywallst.org/forum/replace-capitalism-with-democracy/

[-] 0 points by struggleforfreedom80 (6584) 2 years ago

"Otherwise what's the incentive?" Humans are creative by nature: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WveI_vgmPz8

[-] 0 points by Flsupport (578) 2 years ago

The concept is not entirely unjust, but it is out of control. That someone makes more or less depending on what they do is only natural. The day laborer will never make more than the doctor, nor should they. On the other hand the teacher makes a wage hardly better than a day laborer and a day laborer cannot afford to eat. And THAT, I would say, is what needs to change.

[-] 2 points by TedRall (52) from New York, NY 2 years ago

Why shouldn't the day laborer earn as much as the doctor? Both work for a living. Neither is more important. If anything, I would rather work as a doctor earning less than the day laborer since the work is easier.

[-] 2 points by FreeMarkets (272) 2 years ago

Why should people get hurt when they fall down? Let's protest gravity while we are at it! It is mean.

[-] 1 points by ARealNewYorker (227) from Brooklyn, NY 2 years ago

That's patently not the same question as whether someone should receive compensation that's practically punitive just because they weren't born with the skills to become a doctor. I'm not going along with people who say everyone should receive equal compensation for what they do. It's obviously true that doctors have to undergo a far more extensive education and invest far more money in it than day laborers. But that's not to say that they should reap rewards that are sometimes thousands of times greater than the day laborer. There's no way at all to prove a correspondence between compensation and the amount of work you do without begging the whole question that's being asked in the first place. Just because someone received a certain amount of money for something doesn't mean they "deserved" it. There's a million external factors that determine why someone got a certain amount of money, and they're just not always due to the efforts of the person him or herself (and when they are, they're not always just - i.e. a CEO who determines his own compensation because he's a large shareholder and it's his f-ing job to allocate capital within the company). I think I speak for the greater majority of people in this movement when I say we're asking that anyone who performs essential labor (and being a janitor, for example, is essential - which you all admitted when you whined about how the park was messy!) should at least receive enough compensation (however it's distributed) that they can live a decent life. We ARE capable of delivering that compensation; we just don't because the wealthy rig the system and people like you apologize for it.

[-] 1 points by JustDaDamaja (43) 2 years ago

decent life = ability to pay for HEALTHY food...adequate clothing ( not Gucci or Prada )...and shelter in the area where the person lives...

along with transportation

anything else is on that person...( entertainment, porn, etc )

so maybe min. wage should be a composite of how much it would take for a person to survive and still live well enough in that area to save money too...

[-] 1 points by MiMi1026 (937) from Springfield, VA 2 years ago

You got the BIG picture now!

[-] 1 points by ARealNewYorker (227) from Brooklyn, NY 2 years ago

Hell yes.

[-] 0 points by FreeMarkets (272) 2 years ago

How do you "receive compensation"? Can we withdraw it from your bank account AReal? You say that "we are capable of delivering enough compensation", but I don't see you writing checks. You, like most liberals, want to wrap yourself in the piety of spending other people's money.

Your comment on a CEO determining their own compensation because they are a large shareholder (rare, by the way) is asked and answered: It is the SHAREHOLDERS money, it is not YOUR money, and they can spend it however they want to. CEOs are not public servants. Sheesh.

[-] 1 points by ARealNewYorker (227) from Brooklyn, NY 2 years ago

Are you asking me how you receive a paycheck?

And we're all aware that CEOs aren't public servants. But you're just back where you started - assuming it's "their" money because they're the current possessors. The question wasn't "do they currently have money," it was "did they acquire it justly?" You can't prove the second just by asserting the first.

[-] 0 points by FreeMarkets (272) 2 years ago

Wealth (money, food, property) is not "acquired", it is CREATED. And it is not "received", it is EARNED. Money that is created belongs to the creator: It IS their money. You seem to think of money as some kind of fixed pie that is pushed and pulled into various corners, whereas you would spread it around more evenly.

When a neolithic man found some copper ore, melted it down, and traded the ingot for food he CREATED more wealth, just as did the farmer who traded the food to him. Both mixed their intelligence, creativity and energy with raw material and created an increase in the overall wealth. THAT is how capitalism works: It is good for everyone.

[-] 1 points by ARealNewYorker (227) from Brooklyn, NY 2 years ago

Thanks for the info! I can't believe I've gone my whole life (being 35, getting a PhD, teaching political theory) without knowing that. I wish my parents would have told me all of the libertarian fairy tales.

[-] 1 points by tn40412 (4) 2 years ago

How much education does a doctor require versus a day laborer? I think you overly simplify what training a doctor has to undergo and the amount of money and time the doctor had to invest to become a doctor.

[-] 1 points by legalassistant (164) from New York, NY 2 years ago

their education could be free. Now what?

[-] 1 points by redgar (55) 2 years ago

I agree! At the same time there are many procedures that could be accomplished with people with less training (and pay) than doctors. Yet government tends to over regulate the medical profession and not allow for alternative treatment options. This gives the doctors a monopoly and increases the costs.

[-] 0 points by JustDaDamaja (43) 2 years ago

how about the government ( of the people ) regulating the cost.

The doctor can make his money...and the people dont have to be charged an arm and a leg ?

[-] 1 points by TechJunkie (3029) from Miami Beach, FL 2 years ago

Thank you for contributing some really good material for my new web site.

[-] 1 points by StemCellSoup (1) 2 years ago

I am not saying a doctor should earn more, but I don't agree the doctor's work is easier. The doctor has to spend a lot of time getting trained and the personal responsibility on the doctor's shoulder is a lot more than that of one day laborer. But, on the other hand the physical hardship of a laborer is way more than that of a doctor.

How can you compare two different aspects to justify their comparative pay? In my opinion, if the pay is same then "people" would choose the job which "they" feel makes their life easy and meaningful.

[-] 1 points by MiMi1026 (937) from Springfield, VA 2 years ago

Due to the high cost of medical education,most students have opt to become nurses or physcians assistants.Really it is the nurses who do the massive job of care giving to patients. Doctors jobs are to diagnose,administer treatment and or surgery.

However,nurse practioners can also diagnose and treat many illness as well as a doctor. Many nurse prationers are the only source of healthcare in poor rural towns and on resevations through out this country.

[-] -1 points by Rightwinger (-1) from Hoboken, NJ 2 years ago

How much pot do you guys smoke? Of course a doctor's skills are more valuable than a day laborer. With a totalitarain system you impose (at the point of a gun I might add) where everybody makes the same amount of money you'll get day laborers prescribing drugs and doing operations..you guys are funny..braindead, but funny

[-] 1 points by legalassistant (164) from New York, NY 2 years ago

A job either is necessary, or it is not.

If your position is necessary, you deserve the same living as anyone else who's position is necessary.

So what do we do with the people who's jobs become unnecessary?
Do what Sweden does. Fire them, so that they don't debauch the economy, and put them on unemployment so that they can still stimulate the economy while adapting to the ever-changing landscape.

What is your proposal?

[-] 1 points by aarias1 (1) 2 years ago

Well it depends on whether your sick or not! Actually one occupation can be more important than the other, there is a reason why in most countries the daylaborer/doctor proportion is so unequal. It's probably not the education system since that is true almost everywhere. I mean this is not to say that they both don't have the same human value, but the occupation of 1 Doctor is more valuable to society than the occupation of 1 Day Laborer for it takes a lot of time to prepare a Doctor compared to a Day Laborer. This does not imply that the Doctor himself is more valuable than the Day Laborer they are equal in human terms.

[-] 1 points by getajobdumbass (-2) 2 years ago

You're being sarcastic, right? A Dr. spends at least 11 years getting educated for the job after high school. The cost of this education is well into six figures. You are either joking or REALLY stupid.

[-] 1 points by KidCanada (1) 2 years ago

easy with the really stupid. If your counter point is strong enough it dosen't need such crude commentary to back it up. A man is entitled to his/her opinon. Lets not lose focus. LOVE

[-] 1 points by TedRall (52) from New York, NY 2 years ago

Under the capitalist system, medical students are the victims of for-profit medical schools. If everyone earned the same income, medical schools could not and would not charge extortionist tuition—essentially a form of indentured servitude in which the children of the poor and middle class must forfeit a substantial share of their future income in order to get the education they need to work in their chosen field. After the Revolution, medical schools will be state-owned.

[-] 1 points by MiMi1026 (937) from Springfield, VA 2 years ago

The way medical education always should be. At one time most the medical colleges were state-owned or run by hospitals.

[-] -1 points by struggleforfreedom80 (6584) 2 years ago

But education should be free (like in most european countries). Problem solved :)

[-] 1 points by JustDaDamaja (43) 2 years ago

public education in the CUNY system WAS FREE up until 1975 and had a great reputation as one of the most prestigious systems in America...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/City_University_of_New_York#Open_admissions_and_remedial_education

[-] 0 points by Fifty3er (30) from Washington, DC 2 years ago

Let's make everything free. I once heard money grows on trees. Once everything is free, we can all become fat, dump, and lazy and wait for the aliens from Area 51 take over.

Seriously, if everything is "free", then how do you fund it?

You people are nuts!

[-] 0 points by AreUSerious (20) 2 years ago

What would then motivate a doctor to become the best doctor he/she could be if they can make equally as much as a mediocre doctor, ir a day laborer? His house is still going to be the same. Should we also bull doze all the homes in america and rebuild ranches with equal square footage? Only allow citizens to buy standard build chevy Volts?

Seems like you would like us to become a socialist nation.

[-] 2 points by JustDaDamaja (43) 2 years ago

and this is my argument as well...

the 99% should be about ending PLUTOCRACY...

if we make this about socialism vs. capitalism, we'll never unite the 99%...there is a debate for either side that can last decades...and in truth...an extreme of either end usually results in corruption and exploitation.

[-] 1 points by legalassistant (164) from New York, NY 2 years ago

Money is not what motivates people. In fact, there are numerous studies that show it can actually hurt motivation. These studies (some of which were carried out by London School of Economics, mind you) have been replicated time and again. The result is always the same.

Everyone needs to eat. Everyone needs shelter. Beyond that, money does not motivate.

[-] 1 points by AreUSerious (20) 2 years ago

I am a person and I disagree. Was the study performed on a sample of socialists? There are people out there who aren't motivated by money, but -BMW, bentley (luxury cars in general) -the demand for McMansions that saw the extinction of many starter homes. - most hip-hop songs, -the diamond district

Are strong evidence against that study.

[-] 1 points by legalassistant (164) from New York, NY 2 years ago

just because people end up with so much money that they don't know what to do with it is not proof they worked for it.

Sorry, but, it kinda seems like you are going out of your way to prop up a dead idea that makes everyone miserable.

[-] 1 points by cmt (1195) from Tolland, CT 2 years ago

No, it was a good sample of ordinary folks. Money works as a motivator for some things, but other things can be even stronger.

Personal example: I chose a profession I was interested in, not the one that might have made me the most money. For my own reasons, I wanted to help people with disabilities. Obviously I could not have done it for free, but money was not the main/only factor.

[-] 1 points by ARealNewYorker (227) from Brooklyn, NY 2 years ago

How about what motivated people to become doctors for the previous several thousand years? Neither the ancient nor the modern Hippocratic Oaths demand that doctors do it for the money.

[-] 1 points by TedRall (52) from New York, NY 2 years ago

Um, yes. I would.

[-] 0 points by struggleforfreedom80 (6584) 2 years ago

Agreed. The way we organize our highly advanced technological society is to make it more egalitarian and more democratic:

http://occupywallst.org/forum/the-free-lunch/

http://occupywallst.org/forum/replace-capitalism-with-democracy/

yours s http://struggleforfreedom.blogg.no/

[-] 0 points by Flsupport (578) 2 years ago

One requires more expertise. I would also argue that one is more important. I also don't want to see this movement swallowed by utopian theories. It has made too much progress to allow that. Also, the broadest possible coalition of people are going to be turned off by the idea of equal pay for all and that alone is reason enough to give this kind of thing a rest. We need to settle for more equal right now....we can discuss the rest later.

[-] 1 points by JustDaDamaja (43) 2 years ago

"I also don't want to see this movement swallowed by utopian theories"

I agree...thats why i feel the focus should be on ending plutocracy....not ending capitalism ( which would only divide the 99% )

on the 99% side no one in their right mind would defend plutocracy ...it is the COMPLETE opposite of democracy

[-] 1 points by Flsupport (578) 2 years ago

Correct.....There is just not the support for some kind of communist revolution and truly, there is a question of whether anyone really wants one. I am pretty much open to anything but I also understand the need to make this as much about the 99% as possible.

[-] 1 points by JustDaDamaja (43) 2 years ago

right...this is why to me...the issue of removing lobbyists and weeding out the plutocrats is the one issue that any citizen can support...the financial industry gave 2.5 BILLION dollars to the government and received 700 + BILLION dollars in bailouts ....WITH OUR MONEY.....

the same mechanism used to make that happen...is the same one that allows Tyson, Perdue off the hook when food sanitary issues get in the way of them using the most effective ( but profit reducing ) ways of giving us pure food...

the same mechanism that allows HALLIBURTON to get a no-bid multi-billion dollar contract...

PLUTOCRACY is the 1 common root of all these problems

[-] 1 points by Flsupport (578) 2 years ago

I never said the movement should not try to remake society into something better. I said that the movement will be unsuccessful in any changes if it puts communism out as its main focus......it really is a question of whether change is what you want or whether you just want to be on the fringe forever with no change because people are afraid of what you advocate.

[-] -1 points by TedRall (52) from New York, NY 2 years ago

Yes, God forbid the movement should submit to the desire to remake society into something better!

There is no such thing as "more equal." The tendency of gangster capitalism is for the rich and powerful to consistently aggregate wealth into fewer and fewer hands. We have seen this consistently since Marx and Engels wrote about it in 1848. There is only "equal" and "not equal."

How is "not equal" working for you?

[-] 1 points by JustDaDamaja (43) 2 years ago

...lets ask the folks in cuba risking their lives and leaving "equal" to come to "not-equal"..

again...if we make this about socialism vs. capitalism, our great-grandkids will be finishing that argument...

capitalism does not have to = plutocracy.

[-] 1 points by TedRall (52) from New York, NY 2 years ago

Actually, it does. There has never been a fair system based on capitalism.

Also, the fact that there were errors following the Cuban Revolution no more makes socialism a bad system than the many errors under capitalism makes capitalism a bad system. What makes capitalism bad is its inherent unfairness and injustice, beginning with the fact that children of the rich enjoy a head start.

[-] 2 points by JustDaDamaja (43) 2 years ago

the head start as i explained before...is largely because financial education is kept from the masses....

u can have capitalism and have justice...if the folks you elect and the laws we have are NOT based on money...

[-] -2 points by EAD69 (8) 2 years ago

Why? Because of the selection process that a medical education system puts candidates through before they become doctors. Because these doctors did better in school than all of their peers who drank beer and watched TV. That's why. The work of a doctor maybe physically less straining but intellectually is much more challenging.

[-] 2 points by TedRall (52) from New York, NY 2 years ago

Socialist nations have selection systems based on ability too. The difference here is that your credit rating helps more than your GPA. Also, you didn't answer my point that the work created by a doctor is no more important than the work created by, say, a farmer.

[-] 1 points by EAD69 (8) 2 years ago

I don't get your argument. The fact that doctors make more than an average farmer is not a hidden secret from a young person making a decision to try and become one or the other. So to go and become a farmer or a carpenter and then bitch that you don't get paid as much as a doctor is ridiculous. You knew the rules from the beginning of the game and towards the end you are trying to complain about them. Please... As to that credit rating comment that's just beyond me. No one forced anyone to borrow money and then fail to repay the debt on time. You would say what about college loans? - go to a state school! Mortgage? Do the math before buying a home! Account for a chance that you may lose your job for some time. Also people buy homes based on emotional need that they feel it is time or they think that's what they are supposed to do at their age, and not based whether they can afford it. And then you have consumer loans and credit card debt. That's just flat out personal irresponsibility, gluttony, and consumerism. Look around you. Do you see how many people are driving BMWs? 80% can't really afford one but they all must have one. And then they complain when they lose their jobs that the credit agency is evil. Give me a break. Here is the recipe: do well in school, save money, invest with care, don't buy stuff you don't need and cant afford.

[-] 1 points by TedRall (52) from New York, NY 2 years ago

Your argument relies on a fallacy: Not everyone starts with the same chances in life under capitalism.

A white male with a rich dad can easily afford medical school. A black female in South Central L.A., not so much. She can borrow a lot to go, maybe, if she doesn't have lousy credit.

[-] 1 points by CrazyMax (2) 2 years ago

Yes, there WAS such system, with free education (students even usually can recieve small donation, about 65 dollars a month, which in begining of 80th was enough for food. Most succesful can earn more, and some worked at nights or at vacations, earning 300 or more a month - it was lot of money!). But now in Russia this system ruined by f***n" public enemies residing in Cremlin.

[-] 1 points by ARealNewYorker (227) from Brooklyn, NY 2 years ago

That's a disingenuous comparison. Someone who becomes a doctor goes through only about twice as many years of training as someone who becomes a school teacher (and let's just assume for the sake of comparison that both are good at what they do), but doctors can sometimes make up to ten times what a school teacher makes. So there's no way to prove the justice of a doctor's compensation by reference to the amount of their training. Again (see my post above), I'm not saying that doctors shouldn't receive a higher degree of compensation, just that there's no objective way to determine what would constitute a just degree. Which means that we should look beyond the question entirely - maybe it's not a question of the proportion between the compensation of two entirely different jobs, but the bottom line question of whether the person with less training, etc., should on that basis receive a compensation that's practically punitive.

Considering they can't afford medical care, decent housing, and in some cases, food, a day laborer's compensation is punitive). And, on the side of the teacher, compensation in a wealthy community is not drastically different than compensation in a poorer community, but the compensation of the teacher in the wealthy community more often than not forbids their living in that community - which means added commuting time (sometimes it's drastic) and their inability to send their kids to the school system they work in (which, in wealthy communities, is almost always better because the tax base is far higher).

[-] 0 points by meskk (17) from Miami, FL 2 years ago

I totally understand and agree, however, knowing how these folks in government operate, something better for the people always seems to never make any sense... On that same token anything good for corporations and the 1% always seems to conveniently make sense.... It does suck.. but it what it is.. Typically I am never under-optimistic, however, I doubt they'd get rid of capitalism....

Regardless of what I think... the movement has been very strong and successful so far...

Victory awaits!!!

[-] 2 points by JustDaDamaja (43) 2 years ago

DEMOCRACY vs. PLUTOCRACY

not socialism vs. capitalism

[-] 1 points by meskk (17) from Miami, FL 2 years ago

Exactly.. point taken.. In fact... in order to really get some points.. OWS will need support not only from police and government but from some of the 1% as well... and the way things are going, not specifically with OWS' success itself, but rather the recent behavior of big bank executives, and large corps, shareholders are starting to steam at meetings.. the chances look really good that they might jump the fence to OWS as well!!

[-] 0 points by struggleforfreedom80 (6584) 2 years ago

Capitalism has to grow all the time, and that is logically not sustainable. It leads to exploitation, concentration of wealth, the dsutruction of the environment, and last but not least, its UNDEMOCRATIC. This is unacceptable.

Posts on your forum by struggleforfreedom:

http://occupywallst.org/forum/the-free-lunch/

http://occupywallst.org/forum/replace-capitalism-with-democracy/

yours s. http://struggleforfreedom.blogg.no/

[-] 0 points by Fifty3er (30) from Washington, DC 2 years ago

Win what? Are you Charlie Sheen?

[-] -3 points by getajobdumbass (-2) 2 years ago

I would join the fight but I have a job, a family and a life to attend to.

[-] 3 points by Vickyc810 (14) 2 years ago

From truthout: In 1970, Milton Friedman, father of modern free-market capitalism, wrote in The New York Times, "The social responsibility of business is to increase its profits." That is, corporate CEO's are essentially managers of other people's money (the shareholders) and are only allowed to invest it in policies and activities that will yield the greatest returns for those investors. This means buying off Congressmen (a ready available option in the US) for legislation that amplifies corporate wealth much more greatly than the investment in de facto bribery depletes it. It means defrauding vulnerable Americans by exploiting the widespread financial ignorance the banking sector has fostered - the likelihood that banks will be held accountable for their crimes by public servants who owe their careers to Wall Street campaign funding is not nearly great enough to threaten, on the balance, the windfall profits banks stand to make off of crooked practices." If things are not changed your children will be victims of war and poverty caused by unregulated capitalism!

[-] 4 points by tsdevi (307) 2 years ago

Why must We the People succumb to this notion that we must have a simple and digestible set of demands? If this movement is about admitting the inevitable changes that are taking place around the globe, then clearly it is far more complex and nuanced than a need for simple concessions between government and the people. This reveals the ultimate corruption in a Democratic government, as government is supposed to be "of the people, by the people and for the people." Clearly it is not. We the People should not be seeking simple handouts in the form of jobs designed by people in government or industry. We the People should define the work that needs to be done to preserve civil society and the cooperative example that is being set by OWS is key for its symbolism and its practice. Imagine if We the People across the globe could bypass the poisonous influence of our broken government in order to meet our needs, NOT to work and make money to satisfy the bottom line of governments and industry, NOT to fight in their wholly unethical and ill conceived wars, but to offer a quality of life that surpasses anything that we have seen in the human experience thus far. Imagine if we had access to the resources of time and materials to travel, to participate in ecological restoration and exploration. Imagine what changes need to be made and then what work would need to be done to implement them. The corporatization of the global economy has caused us to think in monocultural terms. Monocultures are not sustainable, not in nature and not in human organization. Everyone should not be doing the same thing, or mimicking the same thing and calling it work or life, whether it be producing, consuming, destroying or talking, or doing. We must take a step back and question what we are doing and why we are doing it and cause others to pause and perform the same exercise. We do not need to placate the narrow minded, but we do need to work to empower ourselves to provide for the changes the We the People need and want, not to serve the dubious hierarchy, or the dubious and dysfunctional economy, but to change the way we serve each other and ourselves.

[-] 1 points by davethedave (9) 2 years ago

If you want to travel round the world and not work and do ecological restoration then go ahead, there is nothing stopping you. The question is, why do you feel that other people, who have made other choices, should pay for you to do the things you want to do rather than paying for them yourself?

[-] 2 points by tsdevi (307) 2 years ago

Why should I payfor other people to do things for themselves rather than for me? What about my opportunity cost? Not to mention how ecological restoration is not a pic nic, but a worthy occupation that more people should be involved in as to preserve any quality of life on earth at this stage (read the UN millenium ecosystem report). More notably, what are these "other choices" that you speak of? If you are implying that there are those "hard workers" who are plugging away doing what have you, while those "slackers" who are working to preserve natural resources like water, land, air, sea, etc., then I would have to say that it is YOUR choice that is a burden to others. The economic choices we are free to make are not limitless and yes, people should pay for the real services that contribute to society. Would you tell a teacher, a doctor, a nurse, a lawyer "you can go bu such and such, just don't expect anyone to pay for your services"..nonsense.I cannot pretend to not be spoiled by the conveniences of first world living, but real change cannot happen until people begin to be honest about their true contribution, that is, the difference between what they take and what they give. Ecologists are hardly taking more than they give:). I think it was the former Prime Minister of Israel who said it plainly, that people living and working in a capitalist society are led to believe that they are contributing far more than they do and therefore believe also that they deserve far more output than they do, for their efforts. Two thirds of the eco-systems are dead or dying...THAT is the real bottom line, if there is such a thing. When you talk about "paying" for things, you assume that we must live in a world where wealth is defined by our paper currency, where money is made in the quasi capitalist system, and where resources are used for the production-consumption model. The ultimate point of my posts are always to encourage a broader imagination, as changing the way we think is key to changing the way we behave. You can say nay all you like, but make your critiques more interesting, please:).

[-] 1 points by davethedave (9) 2 years ago

You're making a lot of assumptions about my choices. Since none of the things you imagine that I must be thinking are things that I actually think there is nothing to reply to in your rambling follow-up.

The original question remains however. If you want to do the things you say you want to do in your original post why do you not go ahead and do them? If you want to do some work helping the environment then what is stopping you?

[-] 1 points by tsdevi (307) 2 years ago

What makes you think anyone is stopping me? Why not be frank about what you are thinking? In case you are not aware, these mounting demonstrations are about wealth distribution. My thesis is that wealth distribution by means of the production-consumption model is outdated and untenable. Therefore, we need to create new occupations and a new value system. Insofar as my "rambling," you might take the time to read what I wrote and ask questions instead of dismissing ideas.

[-] 1 points by davethedave (9) 2 years ago

"What makes you think anyone is stopping me?"

Well, for example when you say a few sentences later "we need to create new occupations and a new value system". If you are already able to do it, why do you need to need to create new occupations and a new value system in order to do it?

[-] 1 points by tsdevi (307) 2 years ago

Why? Are you aware of the current practice of mountain top removal? Are you familiar with the latest oil spill in the Gulf? Are you familiar with the current energy crisis we are facing, coupled with the current unemployment? Are you aware of what foreign "aid" to developing countries forces farmers to do with their land, in order to make it more "profitable'? There is a burgeoning movement of people, Amory Lovins, Lester Brown, Vandana Shiva....forgive me for saying so, dear sir, but you keep harping on the same narrow context and your questions offer a petty kind of argumentative quality that reveals a level of obliviousness about current events and human organizations. One person can be the change they want to see and many people can also be the change they want to see. At this point, it is imperative that we change the way we work and the kind of work that we do. On a simple note, one does not have to travel too far to witness environmental degradation, but, tell me, why not offer an economic incentive to preserve resources, instead of deplete them? How the money is made is key. It seems that you aim to be accusative, though your accusation is not clear. To put it simply, if I am frustrated with fuel consumption and air pollution, I can stop driving a car, but this does not preclude others from driving and polluting the we breath. The "choices" that we make are so deeply effected by the choices that have been made for the people, instead of by the people. None of what I am saying is novel, but you may want to ask yourself, not I, what makes you contrary to what I propose.

[-] 1 points by SwissMiss (2435) from Ann Arbor Charter Township, MI 2 years ago

The talking heads mainly are the ones saying that.... because they eat off the spoons of the ones out there who want this movement to fail.

[-] 3 points by FreeOregon (3) from Lake Oswego, OR 2 years ago

If I govern myself, and you govern yourself, what need have we for any other government to tell us what to do?

Let OWS invent its own systems, its own currencies. Then ignore the present system, the one that has lost all credibility.

Were everyone to march to a precinct and ask to be arrested the police would refuse because we would overwhelm the system.

The existing system functions only as long as most people comply voluntarily.

All the present system does is apply force. Force for some and against the rest of us. When allied with the bankers it applies force for the bankers.

Any system that uses force is ipso facto illegitimate. The Ancient Greeks knew that persuasion is far more effective than the use or threat of force.

We are the 99%. Now, instead of asking the present government to change or do something for us, it's time for us to govern ourselves, take care of each other, and eliminate this useless, costly parasite from our lives. The best way to eliminate it is to stop cooperating with it, to stop supporting it, and to stop asking it to do anything at all. It cannot fulfill its promises. So ask nothing. Expect nothing. Set up our own parallel systems.

Incidentally, Elinor Ostrom received the Nobel Prize last year for showing that, left alone, people solve their own challenges better than they do when they ask government to get involved.

[-] 1 points by tsdevi (307) 2 years ago

Yes, I am reading her work that she shared the Nobel Prize for in 2009. The burden is in the proof and the key is making the resources that government so readily provides to industry available to the people, in terms of land, grants, etc. I think it was Ben Franklin who said "happy people do not need government," this is true and it will take time for people to be in the habit of creating for themselves. In terms of money, what would you use in parallel? I am being earnest.

[-] 3 points by bdubatdi (11) 2 years ago

Keep it up! You have more supporters than some think!

[-] 3 points by TedRall (52) from New York, NY 2 years ago

I've been waiting for the Occupy movement my whole life. (I'm 48.) Congratulations, and let's keep building and growing!

I spent a week at Stop the Machine / Occupy DC. It totally changed my opinion about the question of demands. Currently, the point of the movement is to grow, and to give voices to the voiceless. Demands will come.

There is, however, some urgency concerning logistics. Winter is coming. In the northern United States, people can't camp out in February. Occupations should begin moving indoors to stores and houses that have been abandoned, closed and foreclosed.

There is also the big question of whether the system is redeemable and/or reformable, or whether revolution is preferable. Personally, I favor the latter, but this is a question the movement as a whole is going to need to address sooner rather than later; otherwise, framing issues will be plagued by confusion and indecision.

Occupy the World!

[-] 1 points by JustDaDamaja (43) 2 years ago

"I've been waiting for the Occupy movement my whole life.Congratulations, and let's keep building and growing!"

Ditto...

and i was down in liberty plaza 2 nights ago thinking the very same thing...once the cold weather comes...how are folks going to keep themselves warm...

we need to have a semblence of a next step and a plan in 12 weeks or else

[-] 1 points by TedRall (52) from New York, NY 2 years ago

Yes, weather is a real issue. Occupy Minneapolis is already confronting this issue. It stands to reason that all the northern Occupations will need to occupy indoor space. This creates new challenges: the seizure of private space is a bigger confrontation with the authorities. Using space by permission will suck the air out of the movement (that's what is happening at Stop the Machine in DC, after the cops granted a 4 month permit people started to drift away). But the good thing is that years of economic collapse have left lots of vacant homes and businesses that should be used for good purposes. Another challenge is that indoor space tends to be less visible.

[-] 1 points by JustDaDamaja (43) 2 years ago

hmmm...maybe "occupying" foreclosed homes = next move...

[-] 1 points by TedRall (52) from New York, NY 2 years ago

Yes! There are grassroots activists who move people evicted from foreclosed houses back into THEIR homes, and then help protect them to make sure they stay there.

[-] 1 points by tsdevi (307) 2 years ago

The curious thing about revolution is how it has a way of bringing us right back where we started. It seems more sober to address the total lack of transparency in government, the waste and the corruption that our sitting President vowed to work against but is barely holding on; with regard to health care, the wars, etc.

[-] 1 points by wade231 (9) 2 years ago

You cant camp out in February? Try "camping" in the mountains of Afghanistan sometime, I am sure you will not think it is so bad then!

[-] 1 points by tsdevi (307) 2 years ago

I gather you are a former soldier? True, we need to muster more grit, but the mountains of Afghanistan are not necessarily more brutal than nyc winter.

[-] 1 points by SwissMiss (2435) from Ann Arbor Charter Township, MI 2 years ago

Maybe there are some organizations/people who'd donate indoor space.

[-] 3 points by Vickyc810 (14) 2 years ago

Thank you so much for all you are doing! If everyone would start telling their congressman that they support the OWS movement and if they do not start voting on making changes such as tax the wealthy by taking away all their tax breaks, provide public universal healthcare with a private option, free education through the bachelor's degree, corporate profit sharing with employees prior to share holders, etc. Do things to provide opportunity. Money to repair ghettos, etc. All of them should read Howard Zinn's book, "A people's history of the United States." I so wish he could be here to see this... Blessings and more blessings to you all and what you are doing... when I can I'll send more pizza! (Best I can do! Vicky

[-] 3 points by zarathustra (18) from Orrington, ME 2 years ago

I do as well... He was a truly great man with more insight than most. He would be undoubtedly proud - especially for the number of students participating and spreading the truth.

[-] 2 points by igobyalexis (5) 2 years ago

The reason why the Occupy Wall Street movement is already a success is simple. If you can look beyond the big to-do being made about the movement’s lack of direction and leadership, and instead consider the action of the movement as a whole, it becomes quite obvious that they have already accomplished their number one goal: to begin the discussion about the elephant in the room... continue reading at: http://www.arlife.us/1/post/2011/10/why-the-occupy-movement-is-a-success.html

[-] 2 points by MiMi1026 (937) from Springfield, VA 2 years ago

This is simply the best show of democracy in all my 50 yrs on this earth. May the movement against wallstreet and the greedy robberbarons proceed until their cancer is cut from this country.

[-] 2 points by SamNM (4) 2 years ago

People say "Get a job!" to the protesters. I say why would you want a dead-end job where you sell-out to corporate American and become a brainwashed drone until a sickly and impoverished retirement without health care or social security. Fight for a new future where everybody matters, education is affordable and we take care of each other.

[-] 2 points by stevemiller (1062) 2 years ago

It is ridiculous to suggest bribe reform.

For 3 decades they keep claiming to do this and all you people can't catch on to the bribes.

Only public funding with no ads from anybody (an obvious bribe) will prevent bribes.

The OWS ignoring bribery proves they are in the same deep trance as the rest of Americans.

[-] 1 points by BinaryFu (20) 2 years ago

Public funding w/ no corporate sponsored ads is only scraping the tip of the iceberg.

Lobbyists must be forbidden to offer ANYTHING AT ALL to a government employee.

Making it illegal for someone to step out of office and into a private sector position that has anything to do with what they just governed in office needs to be done.

Legal ramifications for violations of these laws need to be enforced where it hurts - loss of all benefits. If I take a $10m bribe from you, knowing that if I get caught, I'll lose every penny of it as well as my office, I'm going to think twice. What would you, as a lobbyist do to compensate that? "Hey, if you get caught, we'll give you more after you're kicked out of office!" Yeah, that's gonna fly. They'll just offer that next $10m to your replacement.

[-] 1 points by stevemiller (1062) 2 years ago

We agree.

[-] 2 points by Bigo (4) 2 years ago

Occupy the Fed (OTF) must be another goal for OWS for a simple reason: the Fed is the mastermind of all this mess in Wall Street and therefore we are all victims of its financial decisions particularly its bailout for the bankers..OCCUPY THE FED

[-] 2 points by 44mag (28) from Coventry, RI 2 years ago

Any people anywhere, being inclined and having the power, have the right to rise up, and shake off the existing government, and form a new one that suits them better. This is a most valuable - a most sacred right - a right, which we hope and believe, is to liberate the world.

Abraham Lincoln

[-] 2 points by DJDATL (2) from Atlanta, GA 2 years ago

Take action by closing all your accounts with the major banksters that took bail out money. Switch to credit unions! This they will feel.

[-] 1 points by wade231 (9) 2 years ago

While I am not a supporter of your cause, this is what capitalism is about! If someone doesn't provide a good product, or you don't agree with them for whatever reason, don't do business with them. It's that simple! If millions of people had not put their money in these banks or did business with them by purchasing loans from them, then this would be a moot issue

[-] 1 points by tsdevi (307) 2 years ago

These banks failed to provide adequate services and ripped off millions of people because of their failure...and they got bailed out! We no longer operate in the realm of a capitalist ideal, not that we ever did, as laissez faire is a myth. A moot issue indeed, especially when people who are lining up to withdraw their money from B of A in St. Louis and are barred from doing so by the police SWAT team. Not to mention how, because of the increase in mergers and acquisitions, boycotting one brand name precludes one from boycotting an industry or a company. What of the credit unions? They have to make loans too, what will they be loaning out money for? We have come up against a wall, economically. This is why banks got tired of the making money from industry and started making money from nothing and calling it industry. The problems are so grand that everyone cannot pretend to not be effected.

[-] 2 points by foxrepublican (18) 2 years ago

the best thing going right now it that there are no demands for Wall Street to agree to or not to agree to. They simply don't know how to deal with no-deals. Rest assure that they are talking about you in their board meetings and will come up with some offers. If it' because of a free market that they exist, then why isn't the free market producing jobs. It's that how capitolism should work? As the old saying goes, it's nice to see, it's nice to hold, but it you break it, you own it.....and they broke it. Time for them to fix it. If they are so smart let them come up with how the economy can be fixed.

[-] 2 points by skinny (44) 2 years ago

we need some Flash mobs to deal with specific issues and go viral, in support of the larger efforts: http://notetoanon.wordpress.com/2011/10/16/flash-occupancy/

[-] 2 points by Tamber (3) 2 years ago

Why not have the general meeting work on language for a constitutional ammendment or a law for congress which would overturn Citizen's United.

[-] 2 points by RobertNDavis (133) 2 years ago

There has been a lot of outrage in the heartland lately. It's where most of the foreclosures and layoffs are happening. Many people there jumped on the Tea Party boat, but are starting to realize what a mistake they made. For example, it was revealed (yesterday?) that Herman Cain's 9-9-9 plan will actually raise taxes on the poor and on the middle class while cutting taxes for the rich. Again. He has been pushing it as a "tax-cutting measure", but the fact is that it includes tax increases for the 99% and huge tax cuts for the 1% (for a "net cut"). How can people with bad mortgages, unstable (if any) jobs, and no health care (they might have insurance, but the insurance companies will work hard not to cover them) - despite paying more than their fair share in taxes - NOT SEE that the Tea Party are working against their interests? I think all of them that can read are second-guessing their political choices right about now. And when people protest the "plutonomy" (Citibank's own description of the corporate control of the country) in favor of renewed democracy, how can the heartlanders hate the only people actually fighting in the name of their interests? It makes sense that they are starting to figure out what's really going on and join us. It would be crazy not to.

[-] 1 points by tsdevi (307) 2 years ago

Mr. Black Walnut is a joke, a small minded business man who wants to glorify himself. I think the Tea Party has a small element of quasi rational people who are drowned out by the angry mob that the Koch brother's money paid for. If what you say is true, thank goodness! When you say heartland, which states are you referring to?

[-] 1 points by RobertNDavis (133) 2 years ago

I can safely say Iowa for one...

[-] 1 points by SwissMiss (2435) from Ann Arbor Charter Township, MI 2 years ago

They are reactionary people who don't delve into thought about issues. They just react to what someone says, and they believe it.

[-] 0 points by wade231 (9) 2 years ago

The heartland? Really? I am from oklahoma where our unemployment is only around 7% and the housing market didn't take much of a hit at all, I in fact purchased a home just last year. If people hadn't signed variable rate mortgages we wouldn't be in this mess to begin with. If people paid there house payments on time, or if they did lose a job, then man up and take two or three part time jobs. If I lose my job That is what I will do. I dint care if it's delivering pizzas or picking up trash or whatever! The jobs are there, you just have to be willing to do them!

[-] 1 points by RobertNDavis (133) 2 years ago

You're making a big assumption about finding another job if 7% of the populous is already unemployed and actively seeking employment. Official unemployment statistics look a lot nicer than the actual figures (which are closer to 24% nationwide). Odds are you'd not be able to find a job, refinance your mortgage for whatever you could get to stay above water, and then lose your home and live on the street. My cousin is a cop in Oklahoma - he has seen this a lot. Or, goodness forbid, you get hurt at your job, your insurance company finds a way to weasel out of paying for your medical care and you find yourself on SSI, unable to pay your mortgage. That happens a lot, too.

As for the mortgage comment, you are flat wrong. The FBI has stated, on three separate occasions, that the mortgage crisis is at least 80% the fault of the lenders engaging in predatory, and often illegal, lending practices. Bush and Obama both protected the lending companies - and the men responsible - from punishment. This is a fact. Look it up.

[-] 1 points by JustDaDamaja (43) 2 years ago

how many jobs has the US lost to outsourcing in the past 15 years ?

[-] 1 points by tsdevi (307) 2 years ago

Not accurate. Watch the award winning documentary American Casino, which reveals how over 60 percent of the people who took sub prime mortgages were eligible for a traditional mortgage. Have you ever delivered pizzas? Simply because a job is low wage does not make it readily available or simple. They pay random people to pick up trash in Oklahoma? Do they pay people to do "whatever"? On the contrary, there are not enough jobs, as this is the nature of the industrial, mechanized economy. This is why finance is the new best thing. More over, for those jobs that are low wage and difficult, U.S. citizens are passed over for illegal immigrants, so that they will not have to pay livable wages and offer benefits to people who can unionize legally. Only seven percent? That is not low considering the population of OK.

[-] 0 points by Fifty3er (30) from Washington, DC 2 years ago

Wade231 - don't try reasoning with these lunatics and trust fund kids. They do not understand hard work and thrift. They'd rather hang out all day playing bongos and hacky sack.

[-] 2 points by GarnetMoon (424) 2 years ago

I want to thank all at OWS. I was there in Zucotti park for 2 nights(Oct. 12-14)with rain, lack of sleep and "unified chaos"! I was treated with such kindness, respect and concern and this is what the MSM largely misses. I plan on returning in 2 weeks. What a beautiful manifestation of unity, love, courage and determination... This, is terrifying to the 1%.

[-] 2 points by retrolicious (2) 2 years ago

I just wanted to let everyone know Craigslist is censoring posts about occupy wall street. I posted a simple thank you to everyone who marched on Saturday in the appropriate "rants and raves" section and received an email this morning that it was flagged and removed.

[-] 2 points by guyfolks (3) from North Bergen, NJ 2 years ago

Remember, remember, the 17th of September. Greed, treason and plot We see no reason Why Raging Bull treason Should ever be forgot...!

[-] 2 points by CountryGranny (3) from Ithaca, NY 2 years ago

Changing the conversation is huge. My gratitude to all those who have done the hard work to occupy, and also to those of us (myself included) who are spreading the demonstrations around the country and around the world.

[-] 2 points by acew (2) 2 years ago

With 15 October 2011, a global movement has finally began. Congratulations brothers and sisters, this marks a very important step for our humanity as we move from a primitive society to a civilized society. 15 October 2011 will be a day of remembrance.

[-] 1 points by escorte (1) 2 years ago

what about the fraud behind people making untruthful disclosures on their income when applying for credit? http://www.privatescort.ro

[-] 1 points by mhteg (1) 2 years ago

Americans blame the federal government more for the nation's economic plight than they do the primary target of the Occupy Wall Street protests --- big financial institutions. If you don't know why people are protesting on wall street, this article gives a very good explanation on it.

http://explainlikeakid.blogspot.com/2011/10/why-people-are-protesting-on-wall.html

[-] 1 points by Prodmod (1) 2 years ago

Might I just draw everyone's attention to their ubiquitous access to the Internet, a luxury good, likely countless smartphones, laptops, and other luxury electronic items posting all of these messages. Go to Jena, LA and talk to the black community pushed into a literal housing ghetto, or anywhere in Mississippi, or north Georgia, Upstate New York. The conversation here is among people who can get by - and need to flex their imagination and community spirit to create their own industry - the best way to usurp power from the powerful is to not participate and create your own success. I am the self made 53%. I want universal healthcare insurance, like Australia, and a fair wage, and reasonable government an industry controls, and tr opportunity to forge my own success. I am 23, my parents kicked me out for being gay at 16, and I have been able to travel and fund overseas education on my own due to my own merit and hard work.

Get it together guys. I believe in the spirit of this message, but lobbying against corporate greed at the steps of your oppressors wont help. Go and become the captain of your own industry and create real reform.

[-] 1 points by FLsupporter (3) from Orlando, FL 2 years ago

How about the Congress Reform Act 2011 (see below for the proposed act)? Use the following link to sign the petition on the White House website - http://wh.gov/gpQ

We petition the obama administration to: Congress Reform Act 2011

No Tenure/No Pension. A Congressperson will collect a salary while in office and receive no pay when they leave office. Congress participates in Social Security. All funds in the Congressional retirement fund to be frozen/terminated immediately. Congress purchases own retirement plan, just as all Americans do. Congress will no longer vote themselves a pay raise. They will submit a report to their constituents. Upon citizen approval pay will rise by the lower of CPI or 3% maximum. Congress participates in same healthcare system as the people. Congress must abide same laws as the people. *Only two terms allowed. Serving in Congress is an honor not a career.

[-] 1 points by PetraeusPresident (9) 2 years ago

David Howell Petraeusoffically annonced as Occupy Wall street Presidental Canidate.

[-] 1 points by occupywhat (5) 2 years ago

First and foremost I am all about standing up for what you believe in. What i do like about this is that people are afforded the opportunity to speak their mind whether or not others agree with it.. which is what I am about to do. I saw the protestors earlier this week in NYC and all I can say is it is absolutely ridiculous what this has turned into. I guarantee if you went out there and offered everyone in the crowd a decent job, 98% of them would turn it down. Again, I am all about standing up for what you believe in but this apparently has beeen lost. Signs like "I love cops who smoke weed".... seriously. Then the union, that is a whole other thing. In fact, people should start picketing against the unions. You want to talk about greed. Look at the states that have a heavy union presence; those are the ones that have a heavy union union presence; those are the ones that have the most economical issues in the country. See the trend? Unions have previoulsy and continue to destory this country. We wonder why businesses are taking their productions overseas. We wonder why our export to import ratio sucks. Companies with people trying to make a living can not even work in the union areas because the wages are ridiculous and the majority of the workers are lazy and all they care about is when thier next break is or if they are being treated unfairly. I did not say all by the way. If you try to get rid of a lazy worker off your job they file a greivance and cost the company money which makes the company less successful, which results in companies shutting their doors, which results in increased unemployment. Fairly simple concept. Everyone wants a hand out from the rich. By the way I am not rich in the way of money. Everyone wants a handout from the government. Granted some do need handouts because they can not go to work and we should help those in need through the churches and humanitarian groups. Good economics does not start from the bottom and trickle up. America has gotten lazy and greedy. Kids are lazyand do not expect to have to work hard for a living or "get their hands dirty". 10 to 20 years down the road is what we should be the most concerned about because we will not have anyone but illegal aliens to do the hard work. All of those who should be working will be picketing about having to work and how life is unfair. This will be tragic and the signs are there. Not everyone should go to college. I do believe everyone should have the opportunity through scholarships, loans, etc but again, this does not mean that everyone should go. Some should stay back and be the mechanics and work in the fields and fast food restaraunts, etc. You know, all the jobs that are out there but we American's are too good for? I bet there are some jobs in NYC right now that some of those picketers could go find... The problem is that people think it is only fair that if one person has something then they should have it too regardless of how hard the other person worked to get it. If I don't have something Donald Trump has, I do not think it is unfair. If I wanted it, I would try to figure out an honest way to get it. The power is truly with the people but what is going on here is not recognizing the things that truly are causing the issue. Yes, definitely agree the government is greedy and politics is absolutely to blame for a lot of things that are happening but I also believe the media is to blame for a large portion of the problem and the judiciary branch (which ties into the politics and their agendas) and, I know noone wants to hear this, the American people. We are part of the problem. We control so much by what we do and how we act but most of the time, we only see the situation we are in now and look for someone else to blame. No one wants to blame themselves and when solving problems, we have to look at us first.

[-] 1 points by occupywhat (5) 2 years ago

First and foremost I am all about standing up for what you believe in. What i do like about this is that people are afforded the opportunity to speak their mind whether or not others agree with it.. which is what I am about to do. I saw the protestors earlier this week in NYC and all I can say is it is absolutely ridiculous what this has turned into. I guarantee if you went out there and offered everyone in the crowd a decent job, 98% of them would turn it down. Again, I am all about standing up for what you believe in but this apparently has beeen lost. Signs like "I love cops who smoke weed".... seriously. Then the union, that is a whole other thing. In fact, people should start picketing against the unions. You want to talk about greed. Look at the states that have a heavy union presence; those are the ones that have a heavy union union presence; those are the ones that have the most economical issues in the country. See the trend? Unions have previoulsy and continue to destory this country. We wonder why businesses are taking their productions overseas. We wonder why our export to import ratio sucks. Companies with people trying to make a living can not even work in the union areas because the wages are ridiculous and the majority of the workers are lazy and all they care about is when thier next break is or if they are being treated unfairly. I did not say all by the way. If you try to get rid of a lazy worker off your job they file a greivance and cost the company money which makes the company less successful, which results in companies shutting their doors, which results in increased unemployment. Fairly simple concept. Everyone wants a hand out from the rich. By the way I am not rich in the way of money. Everyone wants a handout from the government. Granted some do need handouts because they can not go to work and we should help those in need through the churches and humanitarian groups. Good economics does not start from the bottom and trickle up. America has gotten lazy and greedy. Kids are lazyand do not expect to have to work hard for a living or "get their hands dirty". 10 to 20 years down the road is what we should be the most concerned about because we will not have anyone but illegal aliens to do the hard work. All of those who should be working will be picketing about having to work and how life is unfair. This will be tragic and the signs are there. Not everyone should go to college. I do believe everyone should have the opportunity through scholarships, loans, etc but again, this does not mean that everyone should go. Some should stay back and be the mechanics and work in the fields and fast food restaraunts, etc. You know, all the jobs that are out there but we American's are too good for? I bet there are some jobs in NYC right now that some of those picketers could go find... The problem is that people think it is only fair that if one person has something then they should have it too regardless of how hard the other person worked to get it. If I don't have something Donald Trump has, I do not think it is unfair. If I wanted it, I would try to figure out an honest way to get it. The power is truly with the people but what is going on here is not recognizing the things that truly are causing the issue. Yes, definitely agree the government is greedy and politics is absolutely to blame for a lot of things that are happening but I also believe the media is to blame for a large portion of the problem and the judiciary branch (which ties into the politics and their agendas) and, I know noone wants to hear this, the American people. We are part of the problem. We control so much by what we do and how we act but most of the time, we only see the situation we are in now and look for someone else to blame. No one wants to blame themselves and when solving problems, we have to look at us first.

[-] 1 points by yossairian (2) 2 years ago

Simple messages for a simple media: We want political (and social) equality A level playing field A fair and dignified society

[-] 1 points by yossairian (2) 2 years ago

Simple messages for a simple media: We want political (and social) equality A level playing field A fair and dignified society

[-] 1 points by patG (1) 2 years ago

I'm a swiss citizen (not a swiss banker, not quite the same thing) linked with Venezuela and Cameroon and i'ts been a long time that I was hoping such as OWS movement . A former opponent against Irak war I walked in the streets of Berna with 15'000 in 2004. But still thinking that only an american people movement can initiate a change in fact. The same is happend today for Wall Street and the american people. And people of all the countries have to reclaim real democracy to control all the business made for production of more than the minimal money to live. No ideology but the reality of the 99% ! OWS forever ! Pat

[-] 1 points by saientist (2) 2 years ago

Desde España os apoyamos a muerte, no permitais que sucios medios os quiten toda atencion que mereceis...Ayer mismo, salio en las noticias aqui, un Marine plantando cara a 20 policias que estaban pegando a la gente, y los maricones se callaron la bocaza y ni miraban al soldado, estaban cagados de miedo haha....Como bien decia este marine, "No hay honor, ya no hay honor en esta mierda".....

Keep it up! Cheers

[-] 1 points by oldredneck (1) from Pachuta, MS 2 years ago

This is a nation born of violence for control of their money used to support their families, not a government. To return this to a country supporting their rights to have their money, not a system of supporting those taking their money with the blessing of OUR government, it must be reborn without violence using the peaceful measures our Founders gave us. They weren't stupid, it's the money worshipers who are. Hang tough and God Bless. The Constitution is own our side, not the government.

[-] 1 points by jryfrmjrsy (17) 2 years ago

Housing market crashed because Dems lied which Bush didnt "ignore" so he didn't ignore any truths. Look at any of these vid clips: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_MGT_cSi7Rs&feature=grec_index If you want to blame bush for obamas horrible unemployment rate then look at the charts (and the source of those charts) on the next link. look how long it took bush to get out of clinton's mess, and how quickly the table turned under obama after bush, after the housing LIE. sounds like a set up to me...http://reflectionsofarationalrepublican.com/2011/06/03/bush-vs-obama-unemployment-may-2011-jobs-data/

[-] 1 points by davidscameracraft (12) 2 years ago

A blog Post about my conversation with Noam Chomsky regarding Occupy Wall Street - http://davidscameracraft.blogspot.com/2011/10/noam-chomsky-and-occupy-wall-street.html

[-] 1 points by Alex22452 (15) 2 years ago

It is true that this connected to Egypt! A Major activist who worked and helped in egypt is now helping occupy wall street

http://theintelhub.com/2011/10/18/us-state-department-funded-agitator-in-dc-advising-occupy-wall-street-crowds/

[-] 1 points by AnOpinion (3) 2 years ago

Why are you afraid of the word PLEBISCITE, OWS? Is it because you have been bought out by the same people you are suppose to be against? Why not create a petition to do exactly what you are fighting for: TAX the RICH signifigantly?

STOP the WARS NOW?

PUT a cap on GAS PRICES?

Or are you just going to remove this comment like you did my other?

[-] 1 points by AnOpinion (3) 2 years ago

Why are you afraid of the word PLEBISCITE, OWS? Is it because you have been bought out by the same people you are suppose to be against? Why not create a petition to do exactly what you are fighting for: TAX the RICH signifigantly?

STOP the WARS NOW?

PUT a cap on GAS PRICES?

Or are you just going to remove this comment like you did my other?

[-] 1 points by outsourcedagain (3) 2 years ago

A Call to Boycott American Express
They have outsourced so many american jobs over the last several years, the company should now be called Indian Express.

[-] 1 points by outsourcedagain (3) 2 years ago

A Call to Boycott American Express
They have outsourced so many american jobs over the last several years, the company should now be called Indian Express.

[-] 1 points by joybasu (23) 2 years ago

only taking away the resource of the bribe money will prevent bribes. take away the wealth of 1%, they will never bribe again. a society without private ownership over production system will leave the politicians eager for bribe money out of the political system. there will be no motive and logic for corporate bribing, no givers and takers of bribe. except that, any legalization or 'illegalization' of certain actions only cannot prevent the men at the top of financial power and the men at the top of state power, that is corporates and politicians, from giving and taking bribe. make as many laws you can, they will always find a quasi-legal or illegal way of bribing. and even if they caught red-handed, who will stop the judges from taking bribe and exonerating the victims? big money is not used for personal comforts, it was, is and will be used for power over other people.

[-] 1 points by bellaraven (2) from Leesville, SC 2 years ago

I support individual rights until they infringe on others or my individual rights. I am a thirty year old disabled female and I am literally 50 dollars short of qualifying for welfare. I have read page after page of comments, witnessed name calling on this site and I have witnessed others abusing comments to "break down their opponent". Using phrases like stupid rightwinger or disillusioned liberal are not the way to become united. I am going to have to go against the grain here too. Despite being poor and disabled, I am still convinced that corporations and businesses are the ones that provide jobs. I also agree that success should not be penalized. If by some miracle I ever became gloriously rich, I do not feel that it is my duty to support some one who is not holy connected to me. I also do not believe the government can fix our national problems. Actually I believe that we should have way less government. I agree that the FED should be audited and/or done completely away with. "Federal Reserve Bank claims not to be private as their website claims, they clearly operate under terms that no other "government institution" operates by." Read more: http://wiki.answers.com/Q/Who_controls_the_Federal_Reserve#ixzz1bFysluFT End income tax, end property tax, end corporate gains tax, and end capital gains tax... this will help all Americans immediately and will bring jobs back to the United States quickly (in my opinion).

[-] 1 points by ubano11 (6) 2 years ago

Watching from some other part of the world, was wondering will the American people wake up from their great dream...never thought it will ever happen. Now realized that oppressed people are the same all over, they'll fight back when they've got nothing to lose. More so for the Americans as you're all used to so much more. OTOH as the most sophisticated people on the planet, would be interesting to see how you all would see this one through. The rest of the world are less sophisticated and much simpler, and their approaches reflects that. They can't teach you anything, but maybe you could learn something from here and there. Anyway, salute to you patriots.

[-] 1 points by frayedcat (2) 2 years ago

I think OWS has impacted legislative debate in PA-yesterday: “…but they seem to forget that this is not Wall Street and they're not selling televisions or cameras or iPads; they're providing vital health care for our community,…" - Rep. Dan Frankel, D-Squirrel Hill http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/11292/1183116-455-2.stm#ixzz1bFJQI2tm

[-] 1 points by madeinusa (393) 2 years ago

The USPS carries an extraordinary financial burden that no other government agency or company bears, the ad notes. A 2006 law, the Postal Accountability and Enhancement Act, requires the Postal Service to pre-fund the healthcare benefits of future retirees. It forces the agency to pre-fund a 75-year liability in just 10 years, and costs the USPS more than $5.5 billion annually. This mandate is the reason the Postal Service is threatening to close thousands of post offices, eliminate hundreds of mail processing facilities, end Saturday mail delivery, and lay off 120,000 workers. In addition, the Postal Service is required to overpay billions more into federal accounts.

“Congress created this problem, and Congress can fix it,” the ad concludes

[-] 1 points by madeinusa (393) 2 years ago

Despite Protests, Cuomo Says He Will Not Extend a Tax Surcharge on Top Earners

http://www.nytimes.com/2011/10/18/nyregion/cuomo-says-he-will-not-renew-millionaires-tax.html

[-] 1 points by blackindian (2) 2 years ago

i find that those who are jittery at the prospect of the people's attention turning to how they have earned their billions are now desperately seeking allies, by portraying OWS as antisemitic, anti-business, etc:

http://www.forbes.com/sites/prospernow/2011/10/09/small-business-occupy-wall-street-is-aimed-at-you/

http://wolfblog.dailymail.co.uk/2011/10/the-jewish-community-should-be-wary-of-the-anti-semitic-occupy-wall-st-mob.html

http://www.alternet.org/occupywallst/152782/10_craziest_things_said_about_occupy_wall_street_/

[-] 1 points by tsdevi (307) 2 years ago

These wars have been about arousing social chaos through deprivation of the populous. Naomi Klein calls it Disaster Capitalism and it is indeed a disaster. The loss of human potential this past decade, of human life, of human history is beyond deplorable, it is unconscionable and the purveyors of warfare will be taken to task. It is laudable how OWS is coming together and promoting a message of equality and emphasizing the commonalities instead of the differences, as differences are great, but exploitation of differences and turning those differences into inequalities is not.

[-] 1 points by tsdevi (307) 2 years ago

Yes, campaign finance reform, end the wars, dismantle the relationship between the military and wall street, dismantle the bogus finance industry that is not even as integral as a casino, implement single payer health care and an emphasis on preventive care instead of sick care, thereby putting bogus "health" insurance companies out of business, build INNER city transportation systems that minimize the use of cars within cities (they are MEANT for long distance travel), offer substantial investment in retrofitting homes to be zero energy homes (no more mountain top removal), stop giving money to Israel unless they stop participating in the terrorism of Palestinians, stop spending more than everyone combined on military, end agricultural subsidies to unhealthy foods, TRUST BUSTING....and that's the short list of "demands."

[-] 1 points by sufinaga (513) 2 years ago

why did Bodhidharma come to China?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nq2Ml-fsVdY

videos to inspire our peaceful protest

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rUjwMKX3W-Y

Wichita Lineman satori

[-] 1 points by notaneoliberal (2269) 2 years ago

43,000 Factories have closed in America and gone you know where. An estimated 1.5 to 2 million jobs have gone been siphoned out of our Industry/Manufacturing sector and have gone to wage slaves.

Where are the jobs? Now you know. It's just that simple.

[-] 1 points by TheKing (93) 2 years ago

Things you OWSers should occupy:

  • An basic economics classroom
  • A library; read the Constitution
  • Rehab: get off the drugs and pot
  • A Brooks Brothers outlet: you can't get a job unless you cover your tats, piercings, etc. with a nice interview suit
  • A shower stall; you stink. I was down there. Yech!
[-] 1 points by TheKing (93) 2 years ago

Things you OWSers should occupy:

  • An basic economics classroom
  • A library; read the Constitution
  • Rehab: get off the drugs and pot
  • A Brooks Brothers outlet: you can't get a job unless you cover your tats, piercings, etc. with a nice interview suit
  • A shower stall; you stink. I was down there. Yech!
[-] 1 points by notaneoliberal (2269) 2 years ago

What a Month we've had.

````````ANYONE MAKING LESS MONEY NOW?`````````` or worse yet...no money? no job?

Well, simply and briefly in the U.S -AND- world wide; we've lost our jobs to "Neo-liberalism" and More specifically, to ""Free-Trade"". Succintly and to the point American Manufacturing - and the PEOPLE it employed and paid has transferred to wage slave nations --primarily China. Now please don't have the impulsive reaction of anger towards China or Chinese people. Your anger should be thoughtfully directed towards 3 groups: 1. American Politicians who have set up policy to outsource our labor to slave nations. 2. Some corporate executives who do the outsourcing. 3. Those in power in those wage slave nations.

An outline of the above: ""Free-trade"" takes Manufacturing and true ""Industry""labor from Middle Class; decently paid Americans and puts it in the hands of ---!! $2.00/ D A Y--- workers in countries across the Pacific. Now we have less people working in America -- thus less spending -- thus the economy goes bad.

True wealth is turning metal and plastic into consumer products. And growing food. It's N O T moving numbers or emails around on a computer screen.

[-] 1 points by notaneoliberal (2269) 2 years ago

What a Month we've had.

````````ANYONE MAKING LESS MONEY NOW?`````````` or worse yet...no money? no job?

Well, simply and briefly in the U.S -AND- world wide; we've lost our jobs to "Neo-liberalism" and More specifically, to ""Free-Trade"". Succintly and to the point American Manufacturing - and the PEOPLE it employed and paid has transferred to wage slave nations --primarily China. Now please don't have the impulsive reaction of anger towards China or Chineese people. Your anger should be thoughtfully directed towards 3 groups: 1. American Politicians who have set up policy to outsource our labor to slave nations. 2. Some corporate executives who do the outsourcing. 3. Those in power in those wage slave nations.

An outline of the above: ""Free-trade"" takes Manufacturing and true ""Industry""labor from Middle Class; decently paid Americans and puts it in the hands of ---!! $2.00/ D A Y--- workers in countries across the Pacific. Now we have less people working in America -- thus less spending -- thus the economy goes bad.

True wealth is turning metal and plastic into consumer products. And growing food. It's N O T moving numbers or emails around on a computer screen.

[-] 1 points by lastday1 (1) 2 years ago

I am a 50 yr old women, with a masters degree. I am on unemployment. I cannot pay my bills and eat so I am forced to live on my savings to survive. Employers feel that I must pay for their bad behavior by taking a paycheck of less than half what I was making. I am desperate and would take a job making less but they have told me you will leave when the economy gets better. The first group that has EVER spoken for me is the Occupy Wall St protesters. The media and politicians say you will get tired and give up and go away. PLEASE DO NOT GIVE UP AMERICA NEEDS YOU!!!!!!

[-] 1 points by metalman1979 (1) 2 years ago

i totally support the movement and love it i,m from and live in a small west texas town and i was glad to see people in dallas and houston having protest too , hopefully banks will change how they operate , how they approve loans etc , i,m tired of seeing rich people get loans and i,ve been with the same job and bank for over 3 years , made my credit better and still can,t get a loan , i just want to thank everyone in new york who got this all started and i hope it becomes a major topic in the 2012 pres elections and in elections worldwide , KEEP IT UP!!! , and keep posting new videos on youtube of the latest thats going on

[-] 1 points by Fluffles (18) 2 years ago

How about putting pressure on the Southern Poverty Law Center, which ostensibly monitors hate groups, to declare the NYPD a hate group?

No one can do what they have done without an authoritarian ideology in place to dispel feelings of guilt. These thug cops are no better than Skinheads.

[-] 1 points by browningbearr (1) 2 years ago

Yess... People a month or two longer. I can just smell the nwo and those rich 1% shittin their pants right now. They were hoping this fight would never come.

[-] 1 points by Votesmarternexttime (2) from Morristown, NJ 2 years ago

America is too big and too diverse for socialism. Capitalism is not evil. People in power can be evil. We need better people in office. A clean sweep. You are protesting the wrong people. Protest the power-hungry idiots in office who create legislation that walks America to its edge because policy makers have NO idea what they are talking about. Government needs to restart at the local level. The presidency was never intended to be as big as we have made it in the last century.

You are still immensely better off than the rest of the world. Yes, things in America need to change. But you don't know true poverty or hopelessness.

And I don't think 99% is an accurate monniker. There are LOTS of us who disagree with you.

[-] 1 points by Moein (18) from Tehran, Tehran 2 years ago

Horses and camels in Cairo and New York streets ! What are differences?

http://americandigest.org/mt-archives/critical_mass/camels_camels.php

http://gu.com/p/32ybe

[-] 1 points by Granpa (1) 2 years ago

Since the USA went off the gold standard, and the Fed just prints paper notes that have no value or backing, all debt, after we went off the gold standard, does not really exist. Our houses, sweat and toil are real and should not be subject to foreclosure due to the fact that no US Dollars were ever received by us. However, since we are in this worldwide monopoly game, until we can sort things out and establish some sort of barter system, let's petition the Fed to issue $100,000 of this play money to each US Citizen, to keep the game going ,until we get it right. SO: All debt forgiven; since it is based on worthless notes...and, 2 The Fed prints and distributes $100,000 to each US Citizen to boost the game/economy. Nothing would change except we would be free from the imposed servitude. Imagine that...

[-] 1 points by Sendgo (1) 2 years ago

Sendgo.blogspot.com Go there and comment. I need help formulating ideas about how to move us toward new ideas of governance. OWS is a great start

[-] 1 points by jryfrmjrsy (17) 2 years ago

what pisses me off is that 99% of the people protesting have no job bc they dnt wnt to work and have no fam bc they are too selfish and they are trying to ruin things for the rest of the Americans who are living the American dream that they believed in and worked hard for.

[-] 1 points by jryfrmjrsy (17) 2 years ago

what pisses me off is that 99% of the people protesting have no job bc they dnt wnt to work and have no fam bc they are too selfish and they are trying to ruin things for the rest of the Americans who are living the American dream that they believed in and worked hard for.

[-] 1 points by SamNM (4) 2 years ago

I just made a donation to OWS. I'm sure its a much better investment than my 401K has been the last few years!

[-] 1 points by Trumpeter (24) 2 years ago

When corrupt representatives are bought by special interests, that is not Democracy! We need to get the influence of dirty money OUT of government. We need to change what a politician is. We need politicians that can actually be trusted!

Why not make it illegal if a representative doesn't vote on behalf of its constituents? For example, the people being represented can challenge any vote made by a representative. The state would conduct a for-or-against poll concerning the matter. If the results do not match the representative's actions, then they must change their vote and may be replaced by an immediate re-election.

We need to hold these guys on a short leash!

[-] 1 points by Hadenough (1) 2 years ago

The message that we should be sending to the world and especially to our own government is that America is based on a society of law and order. Our government is " for the people, by the people and of the people". Somewhere alone the line, our government have become self serving and living off the back of the common people. The government has forgotten that they actually work for us, "The People". We need accountability for each and every member of the government and their cohorts. Punishment for those who have committed crimes. Most of all, have clear and concise legislation which governs all and not exclude the few. Wall street is thriving only because the government gave money to them..our tax dollars. Members of Senates and Congress commits fraud and accept bribery should be punished. Their counter parts in the lobby industry should also be punished. Most of all...NO GOLDEN PARACHUTES after everyone served their terms. I am not going to pay for their retirement or their health benefits that we cannot have! That's not what my tax dollars should be paying for! For those of you who don't know this, I just read that they are raising 1 cent on the stamp price. The post office was claiming bankruptcy if they don't. Guess what? All postal workers received a raise! Almost 900 dollars each and the administrator got even more. I'm not against people making wages but who would be doing a wage increase when their company is crying bankruptcy?? This should outrage you. If it doesn't then you don't see what the real problem is. It is the way we accept how our government is run....wasteful and careless..worst of all, self serving. Definitely not for the people, by the people or of the people. Thanks for reading. Find the right focus to protest and I will join along.

[-] 1 points by dealdoctor (148) 2 years ago

Justice is the resistance to the abuse of power from any source. Martin Luther King, Jr. marched through my county on his way from Selma to Montgomery when I was a small boy and our white population simply could not see that Mother Justice was marching right by us. Today fifty years later people there see clearly what they missed then. Imagine bullies on the school ground stealing lunch money from the weaker kids and then paying the teachers and principal to ignore the abuse. There was too much freedom on the school grounds. Liberty without justice destroys the liberty. The school ground becomes a place of tyranny like a torture chamber. Liberty is not safe without Mother Justice as its spouse. That is WHY we say at the end of the pledge "with liberty AND justice for ALL". God bless each one of you patriots helping to preserve my liberty with your sacrifices for justice. Mother Justice is marching on Wall Street just as she did through my rural Alabama county long ago. I see her now. I know her voice and see her righteous robes. March on Liberty dies if justice dies. Its our playground and the Bankers and rich bullies must be stopped along with the" teachers", poliiticians taking their bribes. Let's do it!

[-] 1 points by idontsupport12 (1) 2 years ago

So yeah i have a question what exactly do you want i mean is this like asking for every rich person in the world to just like start handing out money or what because i don't really get it i mean it may not be that great with the whole rich to poor ratio but have you ever tried to make a difference like how about working at a soup kitchen or donating to a charity or is that not as cool as "standing up to the man" and i know i know your probably reading this and being like oh man this guy just doesn't understand he just is trying to kill the movement man but i not i just want you to know that instead of this hippy bullshit you could actually do something join the peace corp become a lawyer join the military i don't know but do something important because protesting wall street really isn't no matter what how many dumb ass celebrities or teens say its cool

[-] 1 points by cLAckcLAckston (1) 2 years ago

Hello Everyone!

My name is cLAckcLAckston, the name originates from a rape group named Strong Arm Steady who likes to say "clack, clack, clack" to represent the blasting sound a gun makes when it is shot. So, I found the name appropriate for my cause, I believe change may only occur when people are ready to fight for what they believe. I do not indorse violence and the comparison is only symbolic at this point. I capitalized the LA in my name to represent where I come from. My views are positively aligned with that of OWS and I believe that I can be of much help to the movement. I am excited to see people getting together to fight the system that is destroying America. I patriot, but I do not support our current government. The people have lost their power and its time we get it back!

[-] 1 points by Onto (22) 2 years ago

It's unfortunate that 99% of the protesters have no idea what they should be protesting of know what a derivative is. So in the interest of helping to give you some focus on something REAL to protest, protest this!!!

If you guys want something REAL to protest, protest this.

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/bank-america-forces-depositors-backstop-its-53-trillion-derivative-book-prevent-few-clients-dep

[-] 1 points by MadProfit (312) 2 years ago

I have a question that perhaps greater minds here than my own can answer. Perhaps I need to study economics more thoroughly, but how exactly does one assign value to something? I mean, we used to have a barter system where one person and another person mutually agree that the exchange for one thing is of equal value to something else. This seems arbitrary. If we were to base it on something rare, like gold - how do standards committees determine how much it is "worth"? This also seems arbitrary. In fact, in capitalism, it seems like whatever something is "worth" is completely arbitrary because it's whatever you can get somebody to pay for something. Now, of course, Nixon took us off the gold standard, so money is virtual. However, there seems to be a basic connection between the goods and services resources (which are?) that expands (somehow?) the economic bubble. So, you can only grow so many trees and cut them down within a certain amount of time and these kind of renewable resources should be the natural cap on economic growth. But an economic model which rises and rises and rises (endless profit) which would seem to work, ignores the need for the time-period for remewable resources and so ends up doing more damage than good to the world.

So perhaps there is some new kind of token-of-exchange than can replace what we currently think of as money? Some kind of exchange of human energies or creativity? Perhaps the difficult part is accounting for it all? People say that without large corporations and a profit motive that there would be no great scientific advances in the medical field and I find the idea of death vs. Profit a bit absurd. Why wouldn't people want to improve themselves and the world for the sake of it? Is it obvious that no one wants to give something for nothing in return or is that an assumption? Some might give freely forever if only they had the resources to give. And that gets into ownership. Of course I don't want any old person walking into my house and taking my things - a carpenter needs tools to ply his trade.Where would he be if they were owned by a group and not there when he needed them? But the idea behind owning land and what we did to the Native Americans is kind of reprehensible to me. So I am in a middle-ground between individual and group ownership. Which seems to be what our economy is - mixed capitalism and socialism, and each is supposed to have the power to keep the other in check? Is that right?

If another (new) system were to replace the one we have - there would have to be a path - A Method - by which the transition from the current state of affairs to this hypothetical new one would take place with the minimal amount of upset. Otherwise it seems that introducing new watchers and trackers to the different points along the chains of transactions would be one way to minimise or eradicate corruption and corporate greed. (Except that you get the infinite syndrome of who watches the watchers) Or some kind of basic change in the way we value, make, distribute, and use money.

[-] 1 points by acarefreeman (27) 2 years ago

The American Revolution: Its background, the goals, and a strategy to achieve these goals. In this post I want to share some of my ideas with you about the Occupy Wall Street movement, and basically it helps to address the following three questions: 1. Why is it important to clearly understand what has got this country into this mess and how the political system has allowed, or even facilitated, this to happen? 2. Why is it crucial to remove the root causes of all problems in this country, not just the symptoms? 3. Why is it important to develop a clear strategy to achieve these goals, and what should this strategy be? A five-point strategy to achieve the goals of the Occupy Wall Street movement: (A) Clearly understand both the symptoms and the root causes of all problems in this country. (B) Keep educating and being educated about the fundamental flaws in the current financial and political systems of this country. (C) Prioritize the goals of this movement and stay focused and uncompromising. (D) Form a unifying front that is as broad and powerful as possible. (E) Be prepared for a long-term struggle.

(Details to be supplemented)

[-] 1 points by acarefreeman (27) 2 years ago

A Five-Point Strategy (continued) (A) Clearly understand both the symptoms and the root causes of all problems in this country. Some people may say that they have lost their homes due to foreclosures, others may claim that they have lost their jobs, still others may assert that they are having more and more trouble in keeping their ends meet, but please remember, these are only the symptoms of the problem, not the root cause or causes, and as a consequence, while resolving these symptoms is important, so that people’s urgent or short-term needs can be taken care of, it is more important to remove the root cause or causes so that the broader and long-term interest of this country be served. So, what is the root cause of all problems? If we have noticed that wealth will not simply disappear, and it can only be transferred from one place to another, or from one person to another, and that the American people as a whole are a diligent, intelligent, and hard-working people, we quickly realize that it is the way how wealth is distributed has gone wrong. To understand why and how it has seriously gone wrong, we don’t even need to examine the complex financial, economic, or political systems of this country, one simple example, or fact, is enough: Suppose that currently this country has a total of 1 trillion dollars of wealth, either in real estate or goods or in other forms whatsoever, and suppose further that exactly the same amount of paper money, that is, 1 trillion dollars, is circulating throughout the country and that this amount is relatively evenly distributed among all the people, we then know that all people would enjoy roughly the same standard of living. But suppose now that the Federal Reserve, for whatever reason or excuse, suddenly decides to print another 1 trillion dollars of paper money and succeeds in putting this amount into circulation throughout the country, so what would happen as a result? It is simple: Two dollars of money is now corresponding to one dollar of wealth and that the dollar’s buying power has now been reduced by half; but the more wicked truth is, half the wealth of this country is no longer belonging to the people any more, and it now simply belongs to the Federal Reserve, which is a privately-owned organization that enjoys an utmost freedom by trampling the freedoms of all other people in this country-including the freedom of having financial, economic, and social justice, and the freedom of not being robbed and cheated. The alarming truth: The US dollar has lost more than 96% of its value since 1913, and it will continue to do so in the foreseeable future unless dramatic change is made to stop it; and now you understand what the real problem is and where most of the country’s wealth has gone! It is then not hard to realize that other injustices come simply as a consequence of financial injustice and robbery. On the other hand, to see how this country has politically gone wrong, let us look at the following simple facts: Fact 1: A foreign leader, I mean the Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu, have easily got more applause and support from Congress every time he visited the US since 2009 than your own president, President Barack Obama, does. Fact 2: All the republican presidential candidates for 2012, except Ron Paul, have so far first shown their allegiance and loyalty to the Government of Israel before they make a commitment to their own country and own people. Fact 3: When a man of high intelligence, skill, and integrity, I mean former ambassador Charles Freeman, was nominated to an advanced position in the National Intelligence Council in 2009, he was immediately attacked by those who were more loyal to a foreign country than to the united States of America and, as a result, ambassador Freeman eventually had to withdrew his nomination. So, what has been gone wrong with the political system of this country? Isn’t it because money has too heavy a role in it? A simple study will tell you all.

[-] 1 points by KaidreaMitsukai (1) 2 years ago

We really should consider integrating spirituality into the protests, not religion, spirituality. Underneath all the political aspects of these protests is the spiritual facet. These occupations are the beginning of the beginning of a new world for us 99% and it would benefit us ALL significantly if we incorporated God into this as well. I am SO proud of humanity, keep up the awesomness my great Brothers and Sisters. Much, much Love & Light.

[-] 1 points by CforChanges (1) from Minneapolis, MN 2 years ago

I think this movement needs to have straight demands, it seems every group under the sun is joining and the message seems to be take from the rich and give to the poor. I am extremely poor, I live on social security if that gives you any idea. I think this movement has great ideas but there should be simple demands and leadership to address issues. I think in my humble opinion A.) A flat tax for all U.S. citizens say 15 percent for rich and poor that way all are putting in the same percentage wether you make 800 a month or 8million and in that 15 percent is universal healthcare for everyone. We would reduce the size of government because the company you work for would take out the 15 percent so there would be no need for you to file any complicated tax forms your company did it for you. Since the middle class already pays up to 30 percent of their income in taxes this would lower the amount taken away and billionairs would be paying their fair share also and would make up for the reduced middle class taxes. Side note no deductions either for anyone that also means for the fat cats who can write off everything under the sun. B.) Outlaw any type of contibutions to polititions make it illegal for them to have any special interests, their only interest should be for what they were voted for to represent we the people. My two cents.

[-] 1 points by tbuhl (3) 2 years ago

Occupy Wall Street - Care to comment on the fact that your NY-based union bank is under a FDIC enforcement action? http://www.teribuhl.com/2011/10/17/occupy-wall-streets-new-bank-under-fdic-enforcement-action/

[-] 1 points by tbuhl (3) 2 years ago

Occupy Wall Street - Care to comment on the fact that your NY-based union bank is under a FDIC enforcement action? http://www.teribuhl.com/2011/10/17/occupy-wall-streets-new-bank-under-fdic-enforcement-action/

[-] 1 points by robertchampion (1) 2 years ago

Keep on speaking out.

Check out www.livestream.com/occupychitown

Full coverage and entertainment from the ground!

[-] 1 points by jsn (1) 2 years ago

A simple demand that if met would bring down "Wall Street" in it's present form: "mark to market". In 2009 when Lehman failed the US Govt allowed the banks to abandon "mark to market" accounting rules. This allowed banks to create the fiction they were solvent. Mark to market accounting would show that the banks remain insolvent and only exist because of Govt support, that managements are criminally incompetent and that both Democratic and Republican administrations have been completely captured and have systematically failed to enforce laws against fraud, indeed have enabled fraud on an unprecidented scale.

[-] 1 points by dubby (1) from Ashburnham, MA 2 years ago

The people are finding their voice again. Thank you OWS. Those higher up need to understand that people are actually paying attention and not sleeping!!!!

[-] 1 points by EAD69 (8) 2 years ago

Here is some food for thought: the longer this movement exists and grows the more attention it will gather worldwide. This attention by the government and financial markets would result in further instability. Case in point is Greece. The protests reached such a point there that the country is pretty much stalled and as a result the global markets are swinging daily creating further instability and depression of asset values. Guess who is getting hurt in the process? The middle class whose 401Ks are dropping in value, whose house values can't recover due to this uncertainty, who are being hit by additional fees as the banks are trying to hold on to profitability. Now guess who is benefitting from this scenario? Yep, the folks with capital. They are buying up real estate at auctions for pennies on the dollar, buying securities at lowered valuations, etc. So the longer this uncertainty continues, the wider the wealth gap grows. So keep up the good work...I guess.

[-] 1 points by Iranian (4) 2 years ago

Several months ago, when I wrote this: (http://forthetimebeing.persianblog.ir/post/17) we Iranians were expecting such protests to happen. And now, we are telling you: your main problem is the zionists. (You can get it now or you will perceive it in the future. Be Sure...). As Supreme Leader of Iran says: "the day that Western nations realize the Zionist influence, the flames of their wrath will scorch the arrogant [powers'] capitalism and turn it to ash."

[-] 1 points by Mavericstud9 (1) 2 years ago

America began as a protest,that became a revolution,that turned into a war,that built a new country.

[-] 1 points by SamNM (4) 2 years ago

Meaningful reform in mega-corporations and government will be very difficult to achieve. But at least there is a chance now, where none existed before. More power to OWS, you have my eternal gratitude and unwavering support!

[-] 1 points by liltommytom (4) 2 years ago

30 Days! You are the voice of those of us who are disabled and cannot physically be there to join the fight. Know in your hearts we are with you! This is our time. Thank you for making our voices heard. Keep the faith and never give up. We love what you are doing. Please feel our appreciation and love. Stay calm, stand together, be strong for those of us who cannot.

[-] 1 points by lemonadegrandma (4) 2 years ago

Who is John Galt?

[-] 1 points by liltommytom (4) 2 years ago

30 Days!!! You are the voice the disabled and we cannot physically be there to join the fight. We are with each one of you. This is our time. Thank you for making our voices heard. Keep the faith and never give up. We love what you are doing for us and the our country. We stand with you. Stay calm; stay strong.

[-] 1 points by DonHawkins (37) 2 years ago

There is music in the cafes at night and revolution in the air. The change over a little ruff as watching the Senate stuck on stupid no easy way to sat that.

[-] 1 points by ancientpiney (2) 2 years ago

Share the Corporate Wealth But: Don't increase the billionaire's taxes. Don't give the money to the gov to spend on a few of their favorite things. Don't keep the workers begging for gov charity. Do this: Take1 billion of Mr. CEO's annual profit income (a small %, no doubt). Use it to increase the pay of 100 thousand workers by $10,000 (a large %). Let the people use their significant pay increases to pay off their crushing debts and purchase more products and services that they know they need. Improve the economy and increase jobs by letting the better-paid people buy more products and hire more small contractors to repair and expand their homes and lifestyles. Reduce the size of gov by letting the people have the money and decreasing their dependency on hand-out programs. Repeat the above steps by having more Mr. CEO's give part of their obscene personal profits to their workforces. They can still remain ridiculously rich while millions of workers see a great boost to their livings. Just an ancient piney secret - take it or leave it.

[-] 1 points by ancientpiney (2) 2 years ago

Share the Corporate Wealth But: Don't increase the billionaire's taxes. Don't give the money to the gov to spend on a few of their favorite things. Don't keep the workers begging for gov charity. Do this: Take1 billion of Mr. CEO's annual profit income (a small %, no doubt). Use it to increase the pay of 100 thousand workers by $10,000 (a large %). Let the people use their significant pay increases to pay off their crushing debts and purchase more products and services that they know they need. Improve the economy and increase jobs by letting the better-paid people buy more products and hire more small contractors to repair and expand their homes and lifestyles. Reduce the size of gov by letting the people have the money and decreasing their dependency on hand-out programs. Repeat the above steps by having more Mr. CEO's give part of their obscene personal profits to their workforces. They can still remain ridiculously rich while millions of workers see a great boost to their livings. Just an ancient piney secret - take it or leave it.

[-] 1 points by BinaryFu (20) 2 years ago

I think you may be a little mistaken on how much CEOs make.

Warren Buffet, considered one of the wealthiest and most powerful men on Wall Street, pulls in around $4.6b profit per year. On which he pays 21% tax. On which he would prefer to be paying around 36% tax. Now, given the fact that he makes more than god...and you're talking about taking $1b from Mr. CEO's annual profit, you're referring to approximately 20% of his GROSS profit. Which becomes around 25% of his net profit.

Now, in the world that I live in, taking 25% of someone's income is not exactly a small percentage. It's actually 1/4th. To put that into perspective, that would be me asking you to take out $10k from your $40k per year salary, to help 100 Chinese increase their annual salary by $100/year. Now granted, they only make about $250/300 a year, so that's a pretty substantial increase. But is it fair or reasonable to ask you to give up $10k of your hard earned money to do so?

I mean, we're talking about 1 person sacrificing to help out 100 people. That's pretty reasonable - until that person is you. And if you DO feel it's justifiable, then go donate $10k to your local poor. Walk around, pick out 100 people at random, hell...just 10 people, make a bigger dent in a smaller group - give them all $1,000 of your money.

Don't get to know them, don't ask what they're going to do with it, it's not your money anymore. Just give it to them and walk away.

Doesn't sound very reasonable anymore, does it? That CEO is getting results for that company. They are doing their jobs, motivating others down the chain to do their jobs as well. They're doing them well enough that the companies in question GIVE them large bonuses (Not multi-billions like you might imagine, but hey, $20 mil isn't unheard of) BECAUSE they're making the company a LOT more than that.

The issue isn't who makes more money. The issue is what they've been doing WITH the money - in our government. Using it to corrupt the lawmakers and enforcers.

Don't be a stooge for thinking socialism is the answer. We're still the best country in the world, we're still the greatest power - we just have some in-house cleaning to do.

[-] 1 points by jet16 (22) 2 years ago

This message is to the people all around the world. For too long corporations have been given all the power. The Corporations( Multinational Corporations) have been able to sell their products in a country without paying any taxes. There are corporations like ( General Electric) who don't pay any taxes to the country they have their home base located at. Most of the oil Companies including (Exxon Mobile) and other large corporations like (General Electric) were given billions of dollars each to create more jobs in America something they did not do, but they kept the billions of dollars that was given to them. Instead of thees corporation creating new jobs in America they are creating new job in countries like ( China and India) where workers salaries are very low. America and many European countries pay their citizens very high wages compared to other countries. The large corporations are fighting thees countries by not building their products in thees counties, but is willing to sell their products or services to thees countries for a large amount of money. The Corporations are trying to force most of the countries to implement slave labor to their citizens. This means the citizens are paid so little for their work that they would barely have enough money to live on. That means the large corporations are trying to destroy the middle class for citizens all around the world. The corporations are being the bullies and won't be satisfied until 99% population will be paid slave wages. This means people all around the world must fight the large corporations.

Ladies and gentlemen to power the corporations have over the all of the citizens around the world is the money they have. This means if we take away a lot of their money we would decrease the power they have over ordinary people and the power they have over countries all around the world. The first step we should do is to take all of our money out of Wall Street at the same time. Investors are we as our tally regular people to invest. The reason is that more ordinary people invested in Wall Street the more money the wealthiest people gain. We all see a advertisements to encouraged us to invest in Wall Street. Now we need to the opposite. People all over all the world we need to stop investing in Wall Street. We all need to take out all of our money from Wall Street as soon as possible. It is timely to their that we take the power back from the corporations. One way we can do that is to take their money away from them. I can guarantee you if we take our money out of Wall Street we will hurt them more than we will get hurt. If we do not take action now ladies and gentlemen the corporation bullies will take over the world. Then we will be their slaves. While they'll be relaxing in their yachts at mansions. Most people as world will be working too many hours a week for pennies. Until people from the world start fighting the corporations they will keep on taking from ordinary people and for our own countries.

People from all over the world. I hope peaceful protests will bring what people want and that is choices how to control their own country. The problem is until people can find a true way to stop corrupt politicians, dictators, corporations, billionaires, millionaires, lobbyists and propagandist we have to search. Even though a peaceful protest is the ideal way to go we have to look at other options so we can take away the money the the corporations have stolen from the people around the world. One thing I have learned When a bully tries to bully you. If you stand up and push the bully back they will back away. Now if you allow the bully to get away with anything they want they will make your life worse and worse. This is why we must fight back now peacefully or in other ways just as long as we show the corrupt politicians, dictators, corporations, billionaires, millionaires, lobbyists and propagandist that we are not going to take it and we will fight back until people from around the world are given true freedom.

The American Citizens' Vote

Billy Jetland CEO

James Jetland

Website: http://theamericancitizensvote.com

Skype: theamericancitizensvote

Email: thecitizensvote@ymail.com

Phone Number: 702-445-4782

Email: Jetlandjimmy@yahoo.com

Email: Jetlandbill@yahoo.com

[-] 1 points by jet16 (22) 2 years ago

This message is to the people all around the world. For too long corporations have been given all the power. The Corporations( Multinational Corporations) have been able to sell their products in a country without paying any taxes. There are corporations like ( General Electric) who don't pay any taxes to the country they have their home base located at. Most of the oil Companies including (Exxon Mobile) and other large corporations like (General Electric) were given billions of dollars each to create more jobs in America something they did not do, but they kept the billions of dollars that was given to them. Instead of thees corporation creating new jobs in America they are creating new job in countries like ( China and India) where workers salaries are very low. America and many European countries pay their citizens very high wages compared to other countries. The large corporations are fighting thees countries by not building their products in thees counties, but is willing to sell their products or services to thees countries for a large amount of money. The Corporations are trying to force most of the countries to implement slave labor to their citizens. This means the citizens are paid so little for their work that they would barely have enough money to live on. That means the large corporations are trying to destroy the middle class for citizens all around the world. The corporations are being the bullies and won't be satisfied until 99% population will be paid slave wages. This means people all around the world must fight the large corporations.

Ladies and gentlemen to power the corporations have over the all of the citizens around the world is the money they have. This means if we take away a lot of their money we would decrease the power they have over ordinary people and the power they have over countries all around the world. The first step we should do is to take all of our money out of Wall Street at the same time. Investors are we as our tally regular people to invest. The reason is that more ordinary people invested in Wall Street the more money the wealthiest people gain. We all see a advertisements to encouraged us to invest in Wall Street. Now we need to the opposite. People all over all the world we need to stop investing in Wall Street. We all need to take out all of our money from Wall Street as soon as possible. It is timely to their that we take the power back from the corporations. One way we can do that is to take their money away from them. I can guarantee you if we take our money out of Wall Street we will hurt them more than we will get hurt. If we do not take action now ladies and gentlemen the corporation bullies will take over the world. Then we will be their slaves. While they'll be relaxing in their yachts at mansions. Most people as world will be working too many hours a week for pennies. Until people from the world start fighting the corporations they will keep on taking from ordinary people and for our own countries.

People from all over the world. I hope peaceful protests will bring what people want and that is choices how to control their own country. The problem is until people can find a true way to stop corrupt politicians, dictators, corporations, billionaires, millionaires, lobbyists and propagandist we have to search. Even though a peaceful protest is the ideal way to go we have to look at other options so we can take away the money the the corporations have stolen from the people around the world. One thing I have learned When a bully tries to bully you. If you stand up and push the bully back they will back away. Now if you allow the bully to get away with anything they want they will make your life worse and worse. This is why we must fight back now peacefully or in other ways just as long as we show the corrupt politicians, dictators, corporations, billionaires, millionaires, lobbyists and propagandist that we are not going to take it and we will fight back until people from around the world are given true freedom.

The American Citizens' Vote

Billy Jetland CEO

James Jetland

Website: http://theamericancitizensvote.com

Skype: theamericancitizensvote

Email: thecitizensvote@ymail.com

Phone Number: 702-445-4782

Email: Jetlandjimmy@yahoo.com

Email: Jetlandbill@yahoo.com

[-] 1 points by BinaryFu (20) 2 years ago

I'd like to point out a few things. First, the issue is corruption at the level of the government. Corporations are doing what they are supposed to do - make money in the most efficient way possible. The government on the other hand, is not doing its job - protecting the best interests of THE PEOPLE.

Now, when looked at from this angle, it is rather obvious where our system has failed. It's not the companies, it's the government. Now what exactly is the issue? Bribery in the form of lobbyists being able to LEGALLY gift give, donate to campaigns, treat people out to dinners, vacations, etc.

So logically, if we made such things illegal, made it impossible for someone working for the government to step into a private sector job within the same scope of industry they governed while in office, then career politicians will no longer have an interest in the offices.

Logically speaking, the next generation of politicians would be those with a personal interest in making a difference - and wowing the people enough to stay in office.

Capitalism works and it works very well - the problem here is a corrupt government being bought out by the corporations - because it was simply cheaper to do that than it was to make right by the people, or work a little harder/smarter than their competition.

As for political parties, I think we all need to set aside those false groups and look at reality. For that, I quote a very wise man:

"Political tags - such as royalist, communist, democrat, populist, fascist, liberal, conservative, and so forth - are never basic criteria. The human race divides politically into those who want people to be controlled and those who have no such desire. " -Robert A. Heinlein

[-] 1 points by benin (6) 2 years ago

On ne revendiquera rien, on ne demandera rien. On prendra, on occupera. (We will beg for nothing. We will ask for nothing. We will take, we will occupy.) ..... A sense of the millenarian and rebellious spirit, tempered with a good deal of verbal wit, of the May 1968 Paris Student Protesters.

[-] 1 points by benin (6) 2 years ago

On ne revendiquera rien, on ne demandera rien. On prendra, on occupera. (We will beg for nothing. We will ask for nothing. We will take, we will occupy.) ..... A sense of the millenarian and rebellious spirit, tempered with a good deal of verbal wit, of the May 1968 Paris Student Protesters.

[-] 1 points by benin (6) 2 years ago

On ne revendiquera rien, on ne demandera rien. On prendra, on occupera. (We will beg for nothing. We will ask for nothing. We will take, we will occupy.) ..... A sense of the millenarian and rebellious spirit, tempered with a good deal of verbal wit, of the May 1968 Paris Student Protesters.

[-] 1 points by nas4731 (3) 2 years ago

If anyone is looking to carpool to any occupy events visit www.RickyRides.com and each major city is already set-up

[-] 1 points by benin (6) 2 years ago

On ne revendiquera rien, on ne demandera rien. On prendra, on occupera. (We will beg for nothing. We will ask for nothing. We will take, we will occupy.) ..... A sense of the millenarian and rebellious spirit, tempered with a good deal of verbal wit, of the May 1968 Paris Student Protesters.

[-] 1 points by nas4731 (3) 2 years ago

If anyone is looking to carpool to any occupy events visit www.RickyRides.com and each major city is already set-up

[-] 1 points by nas4731 (3) 2 years ago

If anyone is looking to carpool to any occupy events visit www.RickyRides.com and each major city is already set-up

[-] 1 points by eidos (285) 2 years ago

Link to Ben Bernanke CSpan Video, Oct. 4. "Report Video Issue http://www.c-spanvideo.org/program/301883-1

U.S. Economic Outlook and Monetary Policy Oct 4, 2011

Joint Committee Joint Economic "Ben Bernanke testified on the U.S. economic outlook. Among his comments he said the economic recovery was close to faltering. He said the Federal Reserve was prepared to take additional steps to help, and urged Congress to act .. Read More"

They act like the whole thing is china's fault. Don't get me wrong. Got nothing against addressing particular problems and clearing issues to create more jobs, but no one is looking at limits on imperialism

I am an hour into listening to this committee hearing video. I just can't believe it. Bernanke is a "lead button" Peer Gynt. He loves keeping his job more than doing his job.

Finally, Sen Bernie Sanders, at around 40 min. asking some relevant questions

Rep Burgess, Tx, asks him about the protesters at just after the one-hour mark.

Hinchey comes on right after Burgess.

To address Hinchey's concern about the lack of jobs and middle class, Bernanke's answer is only this: Fix Education, teach people how to save money, not spend it frivolously and therefore make themselves poor, and get our free trade desires met so we can make more money.

Asked about the impact of jobs sent overseas, Bernanke dodged. Pinned down on it, he said we want to encourage policies that maintain good jobs in the US. but he would not come out against tax breaks to companies that ship jobs overseas.

Bernanke is Wall Street. He said he sympathized with OWS but acts as if the growing disparity of wealth in the US does not come under his purview in any way shape or form.

[-] 1 points by Joey789 (34) 2 years ago

And its time for a focus demand that will unite both left and right together, the true 99%

http://occupywallst.org/forum/our-1st-demand-needs-to-be/

[-] 1 points by eidos (285) 2 years ago

There is a lot of hand wringing over whether occupiers have chosen the right target and are in the right place.

The Fed Reserve is the problem and this movement is hijacked, some say.

No Banks aren't the problem, fat cat CEOs are others say.

Please everyone, put your worries to rest. Protesting WS is not letting the Fed off the hook. Protesting WS is not letting the "real culprits" get away.

We are 99 percent because of our economy, its foundations and assumptions, its administration and its institutions, it's politics, foreign and domestic and a protest of WS is a protest of that.

[-] 1 points by eidos (285) 2 years ago

200 years of economic imperialistic expansion have run their course. It is time for America to come home and manage its resources for its well-being in cooperation with other nations. To fail to examine the assumptions of our foreign and domestic economic policies now would be beyond tragic.

So I hope bernanke and geithner are listening to that. they definitely know what I am talking about. It is time to think Big Picture.

[-] 1 points by TheResistance (2) 2 years ago

A question: who amongst the "Occupiers" voted in the election in 2008 and 2010 that put in place our current Members of Congress, the Senate and the Presidency?

Only 41.5% of eligilble voters cast their ballots in 2010...did you? If you didn't, you surrendered without a fight. Now, you want to complain? Complain at the ballot box, like the 41.5% did in 2010. Or are you too busy with your iPhones and iPads and iClasses and iCarly?

[-] 1 points by eidos (285) 2 years ago

I am also exercising some dollar diplomacy in your honor. I am removing my money from my big bad bank to a nice community bank that reinvests here.

Vote on election day, vote with dollars, vote by protesting. I vote every single day. Every occupier is voting. They have voted day and night for a month now. That's hard work.

[-] 1 points by eidos (285) 2 years ago

Hi, well, do you mean despite the fact that an aristocratic elite controls labor and money in this country no matter what I do with my vote? Yes I voted. I am one of the 41 percent. I always vote.

I also know my history and know therefore that you need to read some. Please, go do some homework before you lambaste intelligent fed up people

[-] 1 points by jeffrey66 (4) from Newman, CA 2 years ago

take your money out of your bank ........if 99% did that there will be change

[-] 1 points by jeffrey66 (4) from Newman, CA 2 years ago

take your money out of your bank ........if 99% did that there will be change

[Removed]

[-] 1 points by verita87 (140) 2 years ago

Yeah, don't get co-opted, this goes beyond political parties!!!

[-] 1 points by TheDude (18) 2 years ago

NOW HEAR THIS: Corporate Tall by VOLTFACE - a song about Wall Street. Wonderfully appropriate! Its the Anthem we needed!

Listen for FREE on BANDCAMP:

http://voltface.bandcamp.com/track/corporate-tall

Available on iTunes as well...

[-] 1 points by SwissMiss (2435) from Ann Arbor Charter Township, MI 2 years ago

I just sent my applications to a local credit union to switch my checking accounts over to them. I will refinance my mortgage with them ASAP, and when I'm ready to buy a new car, I will be getting the loan from them. Down with the greedy banks that bankrupted the country, caused financial hardship in other countries, and that got FREE loans from US taxpayers without being punished..... while giving their top dogs millions and millions in bonuses.

[-] 1 points by eidos (285) 2 years ago

In a week or so, I am going to call some of the associations of credit unions to find out what the numbers have been, significant increase in new accounts? That would be cool.

[-] 1 points by SwissMiss (2435) from Ann Arbor Charter Township, MI 2 years ago

It would be cool to find out. I know some other people who are switching. I heard BOA is worried.... but that might be heresay.

[-] 1 points by eidos (285) 2 years ago

Might be hearsay, and BofA might think it is heresy. Great typo!

Can't understand why we never thought of this earlier. I do it on my own, always avoid the big banks, but its potential in mass movement never occurred to me.

[-] 1 points by SwissMiss (2435) from Ann Arbor Charter Township, MI 2 years ago

I wish I would've thought of it MUCH earlier. Damn it!!! My current big bank put me through hell to get my mortgage.... even though I make more than enough money, have good credit and a good credit score, etc. Bastards!!!!

[-] 1 points by eidos (285) 2 years ago

You'd think in Michigan they would be thrilled to underwrite such a mortgage these days. You're probably one of the few left with a good credit score.

I have no patience with big banks. I like saying hi to the bank president when I visit and I like to see my bank's name deep in the community, everywhere. I'd be that way even if global banks were on track. But I definitely can't tolerate our failed economic philosophy at all and large banks, and the rest of the corporate community, lobby for, advise on, get, execute and grow fat on those policies.

[-] 1 points by SwissMiss (2435) from Ann Arbor Charter Township, MI 2 years ago

Yeah, I was pre-approved within 5 minutes for the mortgage and was officially approved about a week later. I guess the problem is that the underwriter actually is in Pennsylvania. And there were a lot of issues with getting the mortgage to go through by a certain date (issues with the psychotic seller, who wanted to pull the deal at the last minute). I had to hire a lawyer to fight her and to get the bank to move its ass. The bank DOES NOT impress me one bit, and I told them how that was probably the worst experience I had ever been through.... the whole process, which took 3 months after my offer on the house was accepted.

My boss refinanced his mortgage through BoA (who originally did his mortgage), and they played games with him, making him re-submit the same info and papers several times. It took him 3 months total as well.... when they were the original mortgage holder.

I agree about banks (at least the big ones). I'm done with them. The only local, small bank I know of in my area that still exists is Ann Arbor State Bank. The rest are big banks. All the other small banks got gobbled up.

[-] 1 points by eidos (285) 2 years ago

They always do get gobbled up. I ended up at a big bank when my community bank was gobbled up, then gobbled up again by an even bigger one. That's the only way I ended up at a big bank because I always avoid them.

The worst part of it for me is they had no institutional memory of me. I had taken my student loan out in the same building over 20 years before. They wouldn 't even be able to look that up if they wanted to. Those papers would be gone, lost or destroyed.

Anyway, I've been listening to Ben Bernanke hearing on c span for over an hour and for a guy mandated to address unemployment he sure hasn't given it much thought beyond propping up the banks and keeping interest low.

Oh and there is obsession with China, opening the Chinese market. I guess some in Congress and Bernanke believe that's going to save the economy.

Bernie Sanders asked Bernanke if 30-percent interest on credit cards is usury and Bernanke doesn't see the problem with it. Credit Unions are not allowed to charge more than 15-percent on credit cards under law.

Sanders blasting Bernanke on not making emergency loans to small businesses. Bernanke doesn't want to touch it. The only time he lights up is when a committee member asks him some technical question.

[-] 1 points by SwissMiss (2435) from Ann Arbor Charter Township, MI 2 years ago

It's was the same for me.... my community bank getting gobbled up by bigger banks.

Bernanke is such a tool, as are many others. Well, Eric Cantor, another tool, is recognizing the OWS movement and how big and important it is. Now, he's going to act like he actually CARES about the average citizen!!!!

[-] 0 points by Fifty3er (30) from Washington, DC 2 years ago

Wait a minute..... first, the complaint was it was too easy to get a mortgage in the mid-2000s.... now you are complaining it is too difficult. Guess you want your cake and eat it too?

[-] 1 points by SwissMiss (2435) from Ann Arbor Charter Township, MI 2 years ago

YES.... my complaint is that the banks are the ones that caused their own demise and caused the housing crisis. And because of it, they now are going too far the other way in an extreme way. I make PLENTY of money to buy my house and have really good credit and credit score and can verify EVERYTHING they needed to know. And they still made it very difficult.... the whole process.... being anal about stupid little things and making people spend more money to fix petty items to get their mortgages.... because of the banks' fuck ups in the recent past.

If you can't see that, then you need to open your eyes.

[-] 0 points by Fifty3er (30) from Washington, DC 2 years ago

While the mortgage banks and lenders were certainly no saints, where is the outrage directed against Fannie, Freddie, and the Federal Government? It was Fannie and Freddie that started pushing the sub-prime loans in the late 1990s, thanks to Dodd and Frank. Since Fannie and Freddie were backed (and owned) by the Feds, they had a implicit guarantee. The private lenders were at a competitive disadvantage against these two identities. As a result, they were all but forced to lower their lending standards, in order to compete for mortgages. Therefore, the root cause of this crisis was poor lending standards established by the Clinton Administration in the late 1990s.

In fact, Dubya tried to rein in Fannie and Freddie in 2003, and was chastised for it by Barney Frank.

''These two entities -- Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac -- are not facing any kind of financial crisis,'' said Representative Barney Frank of Massachusetts, the ranking Democrat on the Financial Services Committee. ''The more people exaggerate these problems, the more pressure there is on these companies, the less we will see in terms of affordable housing.''

See this NY Times article, http://www.nytimes.com/2003/09/11/business/new-agency-proposed-to-oversee-freddie-mac-and-fannie-mae.html?pagewanted=all&src=pm

[-] 1 points by TheDude (18) 2 years ago

NOW HEAR THIS: Corporate Tall by VOLTFACE - a song about Wall Street. Wonderfully appropriate! Its the Anthem we needed!

Listen for FREE on BANDCAMP:

http://voltface.bandcamp.com/track/corporate-tall

Available on iTunes as well...

[-] 1 points by Dublin99 (65) 2 years ago

The only thing the 1% have is control of the flow of money and the charging of interest.

The more people find ways of using less money and saving instead of borrowing, the weaker the 1% become and the stronger the 99% become. Eventually the two start to grow closer to each other in terms of power and wealth.

The real issue is the cost of borrowing money. The 1% know this and that's how they increase the value of theirs.

So borrow less and save for the things you need. Always put money away in a credit union account so when you need a new fridge or a car, you already have the money for it.

Spend money on education, food and your well being before you spend on luxury items. You'll be happier, healthier and more secure overall.

[-] 1 points by ZakSmith (2) 2 years ago

1 month, power to the people: http://bit.ly/ntItBL

[-] 1 points by AbbasGoya (3) 2 years ago

Populism is deadly to Occupy movement. Pay attention to this:

"Flourished with Diversity: Occupiers of different political beliefs have joined the movement."

Flourished?? Different political beliefs existed in the Occupy movement from DAY ONE. No one can stop different political beliefs to join the movement. But when you highlight it as an "achievement" coupled with the absence of movement's demands, the movement will be burried by taking "an average of different political beliefs". This is another name for Populism. The function of populism is to eventually lead this movement to Mr Obama's office begging for a penny of two.

This movement needs to STAY POPULAR but IMMUNE FROM POPULISM

[-] 1 points by ltank (1) from Sandy Springs, GA 2 years ago

CNN is calling us "Anarchists". Perhaps the name “Anarchist” is appropriate here. Because if the meaning of the word is one who opposes government, “as the political philosophy which holds the state to be immoral, or alternatively as opposing authority in the conduct of human relations”, then YES we are in opposition of the indecencies laid out on the 99%! YES we are in opposition to the government giving BILLIONS in bailouts to corporations who walk all over the 99%. YES we are standing up against you, 1%, as anyone should stand up to a bully. How can you live your materialistic life, greedy for power and money while millions are unemployed or underemployed??? OVEREDUCATED, UNDEREMPLOYED. FOR THE PEOPLE MY ASS. WITH LIBERTY AND JUSTICE FOR ALL MY ASS. FREE SPEECH MY ASS. Even the protestors are being walked over as they exercise their rights as human beings. Arrested for closing a bank account…WHAT WORLD, WHAT COUNTRY, WHAT GOVERNMENT DID WE ALLOW HAPPEN TO US??? I am not some “college grad with a bulls**t major and tons of debt”. I am not asking anyone I know for pity, for money. I am a highly educated graduate of Georgia Institute of Technology. The #7 school in the NATION. I paid my way through school, with lies fed to me all the way that I would be in high demand as a fresh graduate….I CANT FIND WORK ANYWHERE THAT LETS ME EXERCISE THAT $20,000 DEGREE!! I’m having to move back with my parents and get any work I can find, even if it means flipping burgers. Now, instead of using my degree that I worked my ass off for, I get to go back and try to support my family any way I can. I DON’T WANT PITY, I WANT FAIRNESS.

I am angry, and I AM THE 99%.

[-] 1 points by BinaryFu (20) 2 years ago

I'd like to say first of all, I feel your suffering. What's going on in our country is a disgrace. But we need to clarify something here that's pretty important...

Anarchy is absence of government. An Anarchist wants just that - no law, no order, no government.

I don't think that's what you want for your family, is it? CNN says, "Anarchists" because it's the most inaccurate, hateful and negative term they can use. Those in the media who have used such harsh words should have their words taken away from them - have the protesters blatantly ignore anyone from CNN. Refuse interviews with them until they publish retractions for their inaccurate terminology.

How dare they accuse us of desiring NO GOVERNMENT when what we desire is the repair of our government? Calling us Anarchists is as offensive as the patriots during the Revolutionary War being called traitors.

Occupy* has no room for Anarchy. I'd dare say they're desiring more order, more organization, more law and more justice than those not involved.

I love my country. I fear my government - because it's become corrupted. We need to fix the corruption to fix our future - abandoning our government would be like abandoning our future. Our founding fathers set it up right from the word go - the problem is, we haven't had any hot-heads who knew how to organize a good stand-in against the government in a long time to keep them honest.

We became lazy and complacent. We KNEW politicians were in bed with corporations before we elected them and yet we said, "Hey, they're in our party - they're better than those OTHER guys..." and we welcomed the corrupt into our government. We let the corporations negotiate and haggle and shrugged and said, "eh, what can you do?"

These occupations are giving the world the answer to that question. Let's show them just what an American CAN do.

[-] 1 points by lavendersoap (31) 2 years ago

PLEASE keep this website going. We are making history! I am the 99% and I proudly stand behind my brothers and sisters no matter where you live in the world. This is a revolution of consciousness. People are finally waking up to the 1%'s dirty little secrets. Remember what we are fighting for - A BETTER WORLD FOR OURSELVES AND OUR CHILDREN. A WORLD WHICH WAS STOLEN FROM US BY THE 1% FOR GREED, POWER, AND CONTROL. Be strong. Don't back down. Remain peaceful. Our beautiful planet is so worth fighting for. Semper fi. I love all of you and god bless!

[-] 1 points by lavendersoap (31) 2 years ago

PLEASE keep this website going! We are making history! This is a revolution of consciousness. People worldwide are finally waking up to the 1%'s dirty little secrets. I am the 99% and I love our planet and all of my brothers and sisters no matter where you live in the world. Stand strong. Don't back down. Remain peaceful. And remember what we're fighting for - A BETTER WORLD FOR OURSELVES AND OUR CHILDREN. A WORLD WHICH WAS STOLEN FROM US AT THE EXPENSE OF OTHER PEOPLE'S NEED FOR GREED, POWER AND CONTROL. Semper fi and god bless each of you!

[-] 1 points by BigSpender (1) from Camden, NJ 2 years ago

We stand with you! http://debtbroke.com

[-] 1 points by NatoThompson (1) 2 years ago

Personally I think the entire political machine is corrupt and I am sympathetic to many people who feel discouraged by participating in it. Democrats and Republicans have long left serving working class people. Clearly an entire new electoral system needs to be produced that gets big money out of politics and that allows for a multiplicity of political voices. The two party system is a contest between dumb and dumber and that certainly can't be what democracy looks like. But how to get to this point? I think the national election is just too big and broken to take on. Third parties don't work and I feel that Obama is just too in the pocket of big money. The Republicans have long been backed by corporate power so they are pointless. But on the scale of Representatives and Senators, I think this movement could really push to have politicians that possess vision and a commitment to overturning the rule of power over the weak. Here are some thoughts on things I think would be effective: 1. produce campaign finance reform removing big money from the electoral process. 2. amend the constitution so that corporations are no longer considered people. 3. Put a 65% tax on those that make 250k or more and put all that money toward free education and health care for all. 4. Move 50% of miltary spending toward infrastructure projects so that military person ell work on building up this country and the places in the world that need infrastructural assistance 5. Reduce the prison population and give prisoners and guards jobs fixing their communities 6. Change the political system to a parliamentary system so that third parties let alone 4th and 5th parties have a chance at being heard 7. Convene a global summit where all profits from natural resources belong to the people of the entire earth (oil, gas, coal, diamonds) and that the actual conservation of the earth is considered an international priority. Those are some thoughts! Oh and by the way, you can't fix capitalism. It is by nature corrupt. That is its operating ethos. Duh.

[-] 1 points by BC430 (1) 2 years ago

Stay focused! Making people aware and potentially causing change in America...KUDOS!!!!

[-] 1 points by TarigAnter (33) from Khartoum, Khartoum 2 years ago

From my long experience in dealing with governments in more than a dozen of them I assure you that if you slash more than half of government officials or the so-called public dis-service and throw them to the streets you will definitely get better, effective and efficient administrations.

I am sure they are the source of corruption and corporate greed support. I have never seen in my long life any government department or an office functioning properly. They are excesses, idles, and the antithesis of innovation, ethics and productivity.

People must have regular and uninterrupted access to monitor what are going on in any government office, low or high, including the judiciary, the police, the security, and the military.

When you deal personally with a successful private business you feel your power as a valued customer even if it was unethical business. But when I personally deal with any government office I feel their arrogance and wickedness; I wish I could spit on their faces.

The public service anywhere in the world is ten times it’s optimal size, and they are very good in employing the failures and the dishonest for life.

To Occupy Wall Street and bring social, political, and economic justice people must axe useless officials first.

[-] 1 points by sufinaga (513) 2 years ago

youtube dutchsinse is predicting TORNADOES in NEW YORK!!! in 48 hours.

[-] 1 points by fish0009 (2) 2 years ago

60yrs old Mason from Mi.no american dream,no change from obama or washington,same old crap,dump all of the American Traitors.100% behind OWS bless everyone oy you.

[-] 1 points by fish0009 (2) 2 years ago

60yrs old Mason from Mi.no american dream,no change from obama or washington,same old crap,dump all of the American Traitors.100% behind OWS bless everyone oy you.

[-] 1 points by GrayGhost (1) 2 years ago

If the 99% don't remove the life line from the blood thirsty bitches, that being money to the auction of Congress and Supreme Court to the pious pimps of power by a constitutional amendment .

Here is Lawrence Lessig's DRAFT of the amendment. As always we would like your comments for debate.

"No non-citizen shall contribute money, directly or indirectly, to any candidate for Federal office. United States citizens shall be free to contribute no more than the equivalent of $100 to any federal candidate during any election cycle. Notwithstanding the limits construed to be part of the First Amendment, Congress shall have the power to limit, but not ban, independent political expenditures, so long as such limits are content and viewpoint neutral. Congress shall set forth a federal holiday for the purposes of voting for candidates for Federal office."

[-] 1 points by brooklyn4life (18) 2 years ago

Get your Cash Back - Get Arrested.

http://i52.tinypic.com/2yzj2tu.jpg

[-] 1 points by Thisisthetime (200) from Kahlotus, WA 2 years ago

Keep up the Good Work. Fair-ness. This is much bigger than democrat or republican parties.

[-] 1 points by Misenka141957 (61) 2 years ago

Any other suggestions?

[-] 1 points by Misenka141957 (61) 2 years ago

For starters we need to: Modify at will employment legislation in favor of the 99% Substantially limit and regulate executive compensation to get it in line with 99% Bring democracy to the work place by total ALL employee participation Substantially increase taxes to the big corporations and millionairs to 90% Pass legislations to protect animal rights Pass legislation to promote science for betterment of humanity, life on earth and our planet.

[-] 1 points by Misenka141957 (61) 2 years ago

Balance and dignity to humanity...

[-] 1 points by Misenka141957 (61) 2 years ago

As Obama said:: change takes long and requires persistance. But thars exactly what we've got. Time is on our side and this cause will be the mission of our lives for our children and beyond! Never, ever give up. This is just a beginning. A new world order is beginning that will bring centuries of balane to humanity.

[-] 1 points by jstone0923 (2) from Tompkinsville, KY 2 years ago

The following are concpets that the OWS should begin to incorporate in their message so that a harmonious tapestry begins to be developed for the betterment of all.

  1. Our government is to be held responsible to create jobs, since it allowed our manufacturing jobs to be moved out of our country.

  2. Our government is to develop a system where Americans Vote Directly on designated issues since those who are elected to represent our views can only function if their particular club directs them to. We will by pass the club rules and make decisions that will become the rule.

  3. Trickle down economics is no longer to be considered a valid option.

  4. Truly affordable health insurance and/or medicare for all over 18 is to be implemented.

  5. A tax system is to be developed where for those persons and corporations who benefit from certain tax adjustments are to be mandated to reveal how they manage their profits and that a % of their profits, if they meet a certain level, are to go directly to sponsoring increasing employment either within that corporation or to be placed in a pool for those who need continued unemployment assistance .

jimtina0923@yahoo.com

[-] 1 points by agrzempa (1) from Cornersville, TN 2 years ago

Ideas for the #OWS movement

Wall Street, stocks and the banks are not the problem. The problem is that we have politicians that are more influenced by large campaign contributors than they are by the good of the people. The unscrupulous who wish to influence our laws give large contributions and then send lobbyists to remind the elected officials where the money comes from. The politicians then pass laws that give special treatment to those whom have bought them by paying for them to get elected. There are two changes that would stop this now legal sellout: Limit campaign contributions and outlaw lobbyists.

Limit campaign contributions, outlaw contributions by corporations and limit individual contributions to $100.00 per individual. This may not stop the flow of influence money but it would at least drive it under the table.

Outlaw lobbyists, the idea of a person being paid because they can influence our laws to the benefit of their employer is a subversion of representative democracy. This may require an increase in the paid staff, as the elected officials could not rely on the lobbyists to write the laws for them.

Two of the most damaging practices that this influence has allowed are “short” sales of securities and ultra short term speculative trading.

In a short sale a person is allowed to sell something that they do not have in hopes that the price will go down and they can buy it later. If a person has enough money to bet, this becomes a self fulfilling prophecy. The law of supply and demand states that when the supply of a thing for sale goes up relative to the demand, then the price will go down. The short sale results in an artificial increase in the supply. Profits from this short sale come directly out of the pockets of those who have invested based on traditional values. It should be against the law to sell something that you do not own.

The original idea of shares of stock was for a group of individuals to pool their resources to fund a productive enterprise. The value of those shares was based on the sustainable success or failure of that enterprise. In the present environment of significant blocks of stock being bought or sold by individuals or computers in milliseconds, the price of the shares is determined by those trading those large blocks of stock. In other words if you have enough money you can influence the short term market to your advantage. It is not reasonable to outlaw the buying or selling of something that is owned by an individual but it is reasonable to tax short term profits at a much higher rate than earned income. One number that has been suggested is an 80% tax on profits from the sale of assets held less than 24 hours.

The thoughts expressed above should be reasonable to anyone who believes in a fair and just society.

[-] 1 points by jstone0923 (2) from Tompkinsville, KY 2 years ago

The following are concpets that the OWS should begin to incorporate in their message so that a harmonious tapestry begins to be developed for the betterment of all.

  1. Our government is to be held responsible to create jobs, since it allowed our manufacturing jobs to be moved out of our country.

  2. Our government is to develop a system where Americans Vote Directly on designated issues since those who are elected to represent our views can only function if their particular club directs them to. We will by pass the club rules and make decisions that will become the rule.

  3. Trickle down economics is no longer to be considered a valid option.

  4. Truly affordable health insurance and/or medicare for all over 18 is to be implemented.

  5. A tax system is to be developed where for those persons and corporations who benefit from certain tax adjustments are to be mandated to reveal how they manage their profits and that a % of their profits, if they meet a certain level, are to go directly to sponsoring increasing employment either within that corporation or to be placed in a pool for those who need continued unemployment assistance .

I am a 52 year old counselor, husband, father who is a part of the 99% Jimtina0923@yahoo.com

[-] 1 points by liberty1 (5) 2 years ago

Responsible individualism where one strives for their own success is the way the whole is pushed forward. Those who think there should be no reward for hard work and excellence are living in a dream world. Blood sweat and tears go into success. The movers of society will not perform without reward as a result the whole will muddle into a decline and not be challenged to make strives forward. Liberty loving folks will not be suppressed by the totalitarian communist thugs.

[-] 1 points by Rituparno (1) 2 years ago

Last night, NYC Mayor Michael Bloomberg was captured on video making an appearance at the protest site, reportedly to inform protesters that the area was due for a cleaning. This is one of the videos of his visit - http://liveoncampus.com/wire/show/3114840?user=occupy-wall-street&utm_source=Blogs&utm_medium=Seeding&utm_campaign=Ritu

[-] 1 points by robajz (6) 2 years ago

I hope you're having fun while at it. This song quite resembles the happening for me http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g1JiH8ByVx8

Wish I was there, Rob

[-] 1 points by GBAP (2) from Tehran, Tehran 2 years ago

if the american dream exists, its what we are seeing today... god bless awaken american people... god bless all who fight for justice...

[-] 1 points by GBAP (2) from Tehran, Tehran 2 years ago

if the american dream exists, its what we are seeing today... god bless awaken american people... god bless all who fight for justice...

[-] 1 points by michaelbravo (222) 2 years ago

HOPE Humans On Planet Earth.....http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4QrDLwSgg24

[-] 1 points by CrazyMax (2) 2 years ago

Well, I was wrong criticising your movement. But.. what's further? Will fat shitty rats ever give out?

[-] 1 points by archander (1) 2 years ago

I'm proud of you. This protest movement has the Fat Controllers running scared and really could change everything for the better.

[-] 1 points by joannastjohn (5) 2 years ago

I work down on Wall St. and I am in awe at what you've accomplished. You make all of us remember that the government is of the people, by the people and for the people. If your message gets through, we will have a new world order, one that I never imagined could be true. I'm thinking Nobel Peace Prize for these incredibly brave young people.You've made Wall St. a part of the every day conversations of waitresses and desk clerks, of bank tellers and food vendors. The conversation has arrived. The awareness has dawned. Now comes the best way to harness this energy.

[-] 1 points by joannastjohn (5) 2 years ago

I work down on Wall St. and I am in awe at what you've accomplished. You make all of us remember that the government is of the people, by the people and for the people. If your message gets through, we will have a new world order, one that I never imagined could be true. I'm thinking Nobel Peace Prize for these incredibly brave young people.You've made Wall St. a part of the every day conversations of waitresses and desk clerks, of bank tellers and food vendors. The conversation has arrived. The awareness has dawned. Now comes the best way to harness this energy.

[-] 1 points by George1234 (82) 2 years ago

ONE POINT PROGRAM for OWS *** Tax reform.

(1). All Taxes should be abolished (2). We ask for a single simple tax collection process. Tax all bank transactions by 2%. (3). Revenue required for Government program can be easily collected by taxing all bank transactions by 2%. There is no need for multiple taxes, e.g income tax, sales tax etc, etc. (4). This process will eliminate all record keeping for individuals, businesses and organizations. No preparation and filing of tax forms. No audits (5). This will make life easy, and more enjoyable.***

We must FOCUS on one point program. Multi-point program get diluted. One Point Program is more likely to succeed.

[-] 1 points by NbTexas (3) 2 years ago

Get a damn job you bums. Life isn't perfect and there's always going to be a short end of the stick. Quit crying for handouts and go shovel some damn dirt if you have too. Seems too me everyone these days is looking for handout or shortcut. Life isn't fair so go and make your own. I understand the whole wall street bailout mess but hey what r u gonna do about it now. Here's an idea get a degree in finance rather than fine arts. It's hard to take anyone serious especially this Crowd who obviously doesnt have any skin in the game and are not productive contributors to society. So like I said shovel some dirt, relocate, fin a job that u don't like but will pay the bills.

[-] 1 points by jcraze85 (1) 2 years ago

EVERYONE CHECK THIS OUT! 30 cops vs. a marine during saturdays protest at time square.

http://www.worldstarhiphop.com/videos/video.php?v=wshh7475FAFF0g9E91d2

[-] 1 points by RillyKewl (218) 2 years ago

Here's something to be proud about, the new New Yorker cover art:
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/10/17/the-new-yorker-cover_n_1015280.html?ir=New%20York

[-] 1 points by MadProfit (312) 2 years ago

Saying that one is out to end capitalism will only make the politidiots worried and possibly violent. As I understand it, OWS is not out to "rid" the world of capitalism (much harder and less realistic than reform, but I'm not ruling out the possiblilty), but to change the system that supports it and it's detrimental excesses. Whether this will be done through existing legal channels or some other demand-process seems yet to be determined. It is wonderful that everyone puts in their theories and plans to change the world, and a smart OWSer should gather up all of these "solutions" and, perhaps, make a syncretism of them until a pattern appears that satisfies as many needs as possible. But because a direct democracy is a time-eating process, the demands for a specific set of demands (as in a specific set of solutions for everything) will be slow in coming. In the meanwhile, people will point fingers at Obama, and the Fed, and demand the end of capitalism, and all sorts of other things. Note these things, but do not become hasty because of them. The fascinating thing about this movement is how it seems to be based on the decentralised idea of the internet. Once the movement gained the awareness of the general public, they were still few in number - a few people cannot make a bunch of demands and then present them - who would care? But educating people on the complicated ways of just how they have been ripped off all these years is the way to have the true message spread. Once that message is understood (including why Wall Street IS the place to start) , the 99% should become aware of themselves AS the 99% and that they do not have to remain silent - this is a bloodless non-violent revolution, and the 99% OUTNUMBER THE SLAVE MASTERS!!! At THAT point, when the confusion about what the problem actually IS has retreated, then things will begin to change very rapidly. Until then, shrug off all attacks by competing ideologies. OWS is leaderless - you can attack a person, but it's harder to attack an idea. Make your voice heard loudly when needed, and educate the masses and your opponents with the patience of Job. never tire of explaining what the problem is. They will try to wear you down. They will try to lie. They will try to ignore you. What the OWS stands for is a force that NEEDS expression - and when channeling that force it's easy to become overconfident from successes, or break out into violent behaviour, or many things inimical to getting the message through. Channel your rightfulness calmly and lucidly. Let Love and Egalitarianism rule. Thank you for standing up for your rights while Wall Street and others try to hide behind theirs. Thank you for standing up for me and mine.

[-] 1 points by TTTTT (66) 2 years ago

My small town television stations give a more fair and balanced report of whats going on than any of the big mass media reports. CBS, ABC, etc, still try to paint it as a bunch of rebels without a cause. The government and their owners know very well what this is about, while the mouthpieces of their propaganda machines look into the camera and start the spin with, What do they want? Do they know what they want? Who are they? I say take a look and you'll see, It's college students, it's the small furniture store owner down the street, it's the neighbor 2 houses down, it's citizens grandmothers and grandfathers, It's the butcher, the baker and the candlestick maker, IT'S MAIN STREET AMERICA. Washington, you better not miscue on this fact. You try beating this movement down with billy clubs and you've got the recipe for a revolution.

[-] 1 points by TTTTT (66) 2 years ago

My small town television stations give a more fair and balanced report of whats going on than any of the big mass media reports. CBS, ABC, etc, still try to paint it as a bunch of rebels without a cause. The government and their owners know very well what this is about, while the mouthpieces of their propaganda machines look into the camera and start the spin with, What do they want? Do they know what they want? Who are they? I say take a look and you'll see, It's college students, it's the small furniture store owner down the street, it's the neighbor 2 houses down, it's citizens grandmothers and grandfathers, It's the butcher, the baker and the candlestick maker, IT'S MAIN STREET AMERICA. Washington, you better not miscue on this fact. You try beating this movement down with billy clubs and you've got the recipe for a revolution.

[-] 1 points by ZenProle (1) 2 years ago

I've seen and heard support for OWS in seemingly-unusual places, a church-going Boy Scout troop leader among them. This is only the beginning.

[-] 1 points by arousta (3) 2 years ago

right on. this is such a clear and concise statement. I am so proud to be part of this, and to call myself American (over this past month more so than any other time in my 37 years of life)!

as you said, it's only the beginning. the fight will be long and hard, but Truth is on our side. #OWS, I'm all in.

[-] 1 points by GreenRevolution (15) 2 years ago

Today capitalism - the old system, communism - the dream. You must build a system #3 - a real system of direct democracy.

[-] 1 points by sabokitty (6) 2 years ago

I still hate calling myself an occupier, having lived in a country under US occupation, and barrios under police occupation. I was in Spain, so I'll stick with indignado perhaps.

Also, on the cute note, you know you missed some continents in there, right? What, ya didn't see the photo of Occupy Antarctica and the other one of Occupy the Tundra in the Arctic? This thing is so global my head's spinning.

[-] 1 points by diogenesthe99 (7) 2 years ago

List of Federal Reserve locations and phone numbers for protesting locations along with people who might be personally interested in the grievances of the 99%

diogenesthe99.blogspot.com

There will be more

Diogenes The 99

ows

[-] 1 points by aes66 (1) 2 years ago

One of the culprits of this is undoubtedly the Swiss Banks which keep billions of 'illegally' siphoned funds of various nations of various industrialists and politicians - mostly earned in dubious ways - and hiding those facts....These Swiss banks should be asked to release the data of all foreign account holders to know the extent the rot has seeped in....

[-] 1 points by chango (26) 2 years ago

what about the jackboot thugs the 1% parasites are using against unarmed Americans? These thugs are itching for blood, when will the pushback happen? Until the next step is taken the 1% parasites only see OWS as peasants and slaves just venting.

[-] 1 points by marcxstar (167) from Los Angeles, CA 2 years ago

What a month!

[-] 1 points by chango (26) 2 years ago

what about the jackboot thugs the 1% parasites are using against unarmed Americans? These thugs are itching for blood, when will the pushback happen? Until the next step is taken the 1% parasites only see OWS as peasants and slaves just venting.

[-] 1 points by Uspatriot5000 (128) 2 years ago

Do any of you have any idea how the whole stock market even works?? A lot of these companies are answering to stock holders. The stock holders are the ones who really call the shots in many large companies. Any guesses on who some of the largest stock holders are????? So, if you are a state employee, union member, etc. There is a good chance that policies made in these companies are somewhat controlled by your pension plans: http://www.reuters.com/article/2011/01/04/us-pensionfunds-idUSTRE7034Z120110104

Now, trouble in the stock market lately has caused some issues, but if you crush the stock market, or if these actions make it worse, you may very well be affecting your own retirement plans! Here is an example: http://www.knoxnews.com/news/2011/oct/17/recent-years-rough-for-pension-investments-say/

[-] 1 points by Mcc (542) 2 years ago

Is greed really good? 

Doctor discovers cure and prevention of AIDS. Sells discovery for $5,000,000,000,000. Same doctor discovers cure and prevention of heart disease. Sells discovery for another $5,000,000,000,000. Same doctor discovers cure and prevention of Alzheimer. Sells discovery for another $1,000,000,000,000. Breast cancer. Brain cancer. Skin cancer. Bone cancer. Colon cancer. Pancreatic cancer. Cervical cancer. Ovarian cancer. Testicular cancer. Banks cover all related investments by the health care industry. Nobody stops to consider that the lower 99 percent combined could never afford such expensive cures. The richest one percent agree to purchase the bulk of material assets along with millions of unsold homes for ten percent of market value. After a two year spike in revenue, the health care industry tanks. The vast majority have gone bankrupt in a desperate attempt to cover those incredibly expensive cures. The profits made in the first two years were nowhere near enough to cover the $20,000,000,000,000 doctor payoff. The largest debts in world history go unpaid. All major banks fail miserably. Followed by every major industry. Unemployment spikes to 90 percent in all of the G20. The global economy tanks. Chaos breaks out worldwide. Meanwhile, the richest man in the world by far, buys an island and hires a small army to protect his $20,000,000,000,000 fortune. 5000 jobs are created. More as the richest one percent worldwide hire additional security. Unemployment drops to 80 percent across the developed world. Widespread chaos remains. Entire cities burn to the ground. The masses finally converge on the richest one percent in every corner of the world. As the bodies pile up, disease breaks out worldwide. When the dust settles, and the bodies rot away, only a few hundred million remain worldwide. Those few hundred million survivors must find a way to get along and rebuild. Hopefully, with a more reliable and ethical system of economics.       

The answer is hell no. Greed kills..

[-] 1 points by tn40412 (4) 2 years ago

There are plenty of excesses in our society. The excesses that we've all strived for have led us to where we are today. A nation that is consumption led and over leveraged.

While Wall Street is the current focus, what about the excesses that have led consumers to buy things they really couldn't afford such as a large house. How about occupy subprime? Or occupy credit cards? Or occupy I own too many houses? Or better yet, occupy Capitol Hill?

It's great to see the solidarity and the common focus. I read above that there are people who camped outside as a part of this effort. When has anyone camped outside for a job that they really want?

There are structural changes that need to take place in this country to make it better as a whole. Perhaps the excesses of Wall Street may be one of them. But, let's not lose sight of what really needs to change - the spending habits of this country starting from the government down to the consumer.

[-] 1 points by Uspatriot5000 (128) 2 years ago

AMEN! People were unprepared for this becaus the the "me" factor. There are people who have 2-3 flat screen TV's. Make $50k a year, but buy a $300K house. Want everything their neighbors have and then some. Charge, charge, charge. Then, when they loose their job, have trouble finding one, it is someone or some company, or organizations fault.

[-] 1 points by Chupacabra (55) from Houston, TX 2 years ago

Keep it up my friends! In solidarity we stand!

[-] 1 points by tn40412 (4) 2 years ago

There are plenty of excesses in our society. The excesses that we've all strived for have led us to where we are today. A nation that is consumption led and over leveraged.

While Wall Street is the current focus, what about the excesses that have led consumers to buy things they really couldn't afford such as a large house. How about occupy subprime? Or occupy credit cards? Or occupy I own too many houses? Or better yet, occupy Capitol Hill?

It's great to see the solidarity and the common focus. I read above that there are people who camped outside as a part of this effort. When has anyone camped outside for a job that they really want?

There are structural changes that need to take place in this country to make it better as a whole. Perhaps the excesses of Wall Street may be one of them. But, let's not lose sight of what really needs to change - the spending habits of this country starting from the government down to the consumer.

[-] 1 points by coolnyc (216) from Stone Ridge, NY 2 years ago

In my life, that spans now more than 50 years, I have never felt the call to defend this democracy more loudly than I do at this moment. It's been a long while since we last had to rise to protect the legacy we inherited from those who fought and struggled to found and perfect this great country. Thank you all for pointing out so clearly where we have fallen off the path. Thank you all for working so hard to get us back on that path. There is a cynical view that the people of this country are sheep that don't know and don't care. You are reminding them who is really in charge.

[-] 1 points by Speeder (3) 2 years ago

This is all one big joke, right? If not, then none of you realize that the problems you're all complaining about do NOT revolve around business...they are caused in Washington DC, not Wall St.

Wall Street simply purchases the votes that create the crony capitalism you people are so against (and rightfully so).

Get your complaint straight. It's Washington DC, not Wall Street. Fix it? Start with: VOTING EVERYONE OUT IN 2012 AND 2016. The lobbyists in DC wouldn't be able to keep up with that kind of change you're all demanding.

[-] 1 points by Speeder (3) 2 years ago

This is all one big joke, right? If not, then none of you realize that the problems you're all complaining about do NOT revolve around business...they are caused in Washington DC, not Wall St.

Wall Street simply purchases the votes that create the crony capitalism you people are so against (and rightfully so).

Get your complaint straight. It's Washington DC, not Wall Street. Fix it? Start with: VOTING EVERYONE OUT IN 2012 AND 2016. The lobbyists in DC wouldn't be able to keep up with that kind of change you're all demanding.

[-] 1 points by Foss (1) 2 years ago

Your progress is noted. Keep fighting.

[-] 1 points by dbohnenk (2) 2 years ago

Impeach Obama the biggest Wall Street patsy puppet ever!

[-] 1 points by dbohnenk (2) 2 years ago

Impeach Obama the biggest Wall Street patsy puppet ever!

[-] 1 points by chefjames60 (3) 2 years ago

I support some of the tenants of what the WSP are trying to do, however, the movement is misguided and has no cohesive message. In the first ten days, I didn't hear ONE person say the the same thing other than Wall Street people BAD! We are GOOD! This is such a mindless, infantile, notion that the movement will never create anything positive. In addition, there are so many different factions and ideas represented and many are so extreme (like communists) that you WILL NEVER gain the support of the majority of American people. In other words, intentions may be good, but the execution is horrible. One thing I have heard from the WSP is that business leaders on Wall Street have too much influence on politicians. Agreed. So do the labor unions, PACs, and a myriad of other special interest groups. There are positive solutions to this problem. One would be to promote legislation that would make all meetings between lobbiests and politicians public. There is a movement started called Shine the Light intended to do just that. If you really want to effect change, why are occupying Wall Street instead of the Capitol in DC? Obama's whole cabinet is made up of Wall Street people. DC is where the solutions lie. You can't take other people's money by force unless you really do want a communist revolution. You CAN force the crooked polticians to change their ways, by brining attention to their ties with special interest and voting them out of office. You guys need to choose which it is going to be: 1. A communist take over 2. A peaceful revolution that once and for all severs the ties between special interest and government. If you choose number 1, it will never happen. The populace outside of the major metropolitan areas are armed to the teeth. You would get your butts blown away. This country does not want to be communist. If you choose number 2, you MIGHT be able to make some positive changes in our system, but only if you begin to protest Washington with the same fervor and passion that you have shown in New York.

[-] 1 points by Speeder (3) 2 years ago

This is all one big joke, right? If not, then none of you realize that the problems you're all complaining about do NOT revolve around business...they are caused in Washington DC, not Wall St.

Wall Street simply purchases the votes that create the crony capitalism you people are so against (and rightfully so).

Get your complaint straight. It's Washington DC, not Wall Street. Fix it? Start with: VOTING EVERYONE OUT IN 2012 AND 2016. The lobbyists in DC wouldn't be able to keep up with that kind of change you're all demanding.

[-] 1 points by MadAsHellInTX (598) from Shepherd, TX 2 years ago

Today, the OWS dragon stares down the wall street bull. Tomorrow, the dragon feasts on steaks and hamburgers! :)

Fan damn tastic going guys! Keep it up!

[-] 1 points by chefjames60 (3) 2 years ago

I read struggleforfreedoms80s "essay". So his point is to remove the evil power brokers and replace them with "the people" making our society more Democratic. Here is what he says, "In my opinion the people must take the power back from the non-elected elites so they can take control over their own lives by creating a more democratic society. In other words, more direct democracy and direct participation. That means democratic control of communities, democratic control of workplaces and so on; a society where people participate in the decision-making and cooperate in building a society where we focus on people´s needs, not billionaire´s short term profit."

The problem with this scenario is the using the word, "Democracy" in this way is a sham. Taking over private companies so that the "people" can run them is called COMMUNISM, not Democracy. Quit being such a pussy, Struggle, and USE THE GODDAMN WORD! You are the most spineless coward I have seen. If you believe that communism is a fair replacement for capitalism, THEN SAY SO! Quit bastardizing a word, "Democracy" that actually means something. If anyone reading this, doesn't believe me, look up the definition for "Democracy" and "Communism".

[-] 1 points by Monda (2) from Austin, TX 2 years ago

Keep on keeping on! FYI:

My recently deceased wife, Dr. Candice Lloyd, literally wrote the book - or rather her 2003 Ph.D. dissertation - on the history of capitalism and the abusive practices of corporations. The entire document - including a bibliography of more than 100 books she read cover to cover - can be viewed or printed for FREE at Hand-me-down.org.

In it, she clearly documents the almost accidental and possibly corrupt Supreme Court "decision" in 1886 - Santa Clara County v. Southern Pacific Railroad - that started this ridiculous garbage about corporate "personhood," which was the precedent that led our current, totally corrupt conservative Supremes to foist Citizens United v. Federal Election Commission on the body politic of this country. ~TGd'Avila

[-] 1 points by Monda (2) from Austin, TX 2 years ago

Keep on keeping on! FYI:

My recently deceased wife, Dr. Candice Lloyd, literally wrote the book - or rather her 2003 Ph.D. dissertation - on the history of capitalism and the abusive practices of corporations. The entire document - including a bibliography of more than 100 books she read cover to cover - can be viewed or printed for FREE at Hand-me-down.org.

In it, she clearly documents the almost accidental and possibly corrupt Supreme Court "decision" in 1886 - Santa Clara County v. Southern Pacific Railroad - that started this ridiculous garbage about corporate "personhood," which was the precedent that led our current, totally corrupt conservative Supremes to foist Citizens United v. Federal Election Commission on the body politic of this country. ~TGd'Avila

[-] 1 points by golddust (1) 2 years ago

Occupy Wall Street needs to grow out of the cities and into the towns of America and the world. Call for a day of protest on local main streets of every small town - "Occupy Wall Street - Rebuild Main Street"

[-] 1 points by chefjames60 (3) 2 years ago

If "doing away with capitalism" is the goal, what is the plan for replacing it?

[-] 1 points by notriviaplease (2) 2 years ago

Check the link below to see how it looked like in Lisbon/Portugal

http://www.tvi24.iol.pt/videos/video/13501614

[-] 1 points by notriviaplease (2) 2 years ago

Mates, you´re doing a great job... But the 15 of October - Global Protest was called by the spanish Indignados/15M (15 of May) movement, somewhere around june/july. Sorry, but saying that your movement sparked the last saturday global action is not correct! Please, do some research and get that info straight. Nonetheless, keep up the good work!

[-] 1 points by everything4lessstore (12) 2 years ago

VERY IMPORTANT is to get involved on your local level. The tea party financed by the Koch empire is in full swing getting candidates on the ballot. We need to get the guys on the ballot who will support what the movement is all about. Get active, stay strong and stay the course. Be vigilant and moderate and respectful. Peace.

[-] 1 points by everything4lessstore (12) 2 years ago

Before you can have any of these ideas to be even discussed you need to change the basic structure of our elections and term limits etc.

We have already created the Congress and Senate Reform Act 2012 which will set us on the path to true representative government. This is what needs to change FIRST. Take the money out of elections and politics. You can read all the details of this act at http://www.everything4lessstore.com/congressreformact.htm

This is Phase 1 and this is what everyones message should be about getting enacted. All these other groups getting involved seem to have their own agenda and is getting away from the one true issue and that is we the 99% have not and are not being represented. Our government and politicians are being controlled by the rich 1% and this needs to end. Please pass this info along and get word to the media that this is our initial demand for change otherwise all these other issues will just get lost in the banter and maybe that is what the media wants. Keep the message simple and straight forward as our act proposes. Peace.

[-] 1 points by jet16 (22) 2 years ago

I am in Las Vegas now. I have been seeing many rich people who are well connected with the Republican party. They were yelling fuck the white trash (99%) we will do what we want. Then the funny part was we saw the high class hookers heading straight to them. A memo to all Republicans Jesus wanted to help poor people. Jesus was also a socialists and the Republicans hate socialists. Does that mean if Jesus was alive right now they would hate him too. That must mean the Republicans that say they worship Jesus must be telling lies because they only want to help the wealthy people. That must mean the Republican politicians must worship the devil. Hopefully the corrupt Republican politicians and the wealthiest board member of the top corporations all can burn in hell together. Then finally thees people will get punished for taking away innocent Americans : money, homes, food, medical insurance, Social Security, Medicare, dignity, and lives. The American Citizens' Vote

Website: http://theamericancitizensvote.com

Skype: theamericancitizensvote

Email: thecitizensvote@ymail.com

[-] 1 points by jet16 (22) 2 years ago

I am in Las Vegas now. I have been seeing many rich people who are well connected with the Republican party. They were yelling fuck the white trash (99%) we will do what we want. Then the funny part was we saw the high class hookers heading straight to them. A memo to all Republicans Jesus wanted to help poor people. Jesus was also a socialists and the Republicans hate socialists. Does that mean if Jesus was alive right now they would hate him too. That must mean the Republicans that say they worship Jesus must be telling lies because they only want to help the wealthy people. That must mean the Republican politicians must worship the devil. Hopefully the corrupt Republican politicians and the wealthiest board member of the top corporations all can burn in hell together. Then finally thees people will get punished for taking away innocent Americans : money, homes, food, medical insurance, Social Security, Medicare, dignity, and lives. The American Citizens' Vote

Website: http://theamericancitizensvote.com

Skype: theamericancitizensvote

Email: thecitizensvote@ymail.com

[-] 1 points by LetsBeSerious (18) 2 years ago

you people blame everything on those more fortunate. Take a look at yourselves before going after someone else. Everyone makes their living somehow and who are you to say their families shouldn't benefit from the work they are doing. You can't blame your hardcomings on the people at the top. A company does not decide to lay off people, they are forced to or else the entire company would go down and all of the workers with it. Protestors fight for unity between corporate giants and small town people when you are really singling out that 1% and their families. Don't bite the hand that feeds you.

[-] 1 points by lemonadegrandma (4) 2 years ago

This is how it will be in YOUR new system.....NO FREEDOM OF SPEECH, just scrub their comments off, Glen is right, you are communist.

[-] 1 points by oldwhiteguy (9) 2 years ago

Happy Birthday!

[-] 1 points by FreeMarkets (272) 2 years ago

People who create new wealth do not do so at the expense of others. That is the magic of free markets - the overall wealth of the planet constantly increases due to human innovation. The average person on earth is FAR better off than their grandparents, and this trend has been going on for a long, long time.

[-] 1 points by lemonadegrandma (4) 2 years ago

So you aren't smart enough to answer Glen Beck questions?

[-] 1 points by kroberts01999 (18) 2 years ago

I haven't heard anyone say they are willing to spend the winter occupying Wall Street. Outdoors, in Liberty Square, in tents with warm sleeping bags and hot food, all through January and February, into Spring, then Summer. Everybody stays. The longer we occupy the more people we attract, and the more we endure, the stronger our focus gets, and the more we change the world. We do not leave this space, period. You wanna be like the Egyptian protestors or do you want to be like the Tea Party?

[-] 1 points by Omniscience (1) 2 years ago

Over the past 60 years progressives have worked tirelessly to strip this country of any of its long-honored Western traditions, be it altering the country’s demographics, curtailing Western mores, rewriting history from a perspective of social oppression, making mothers into docile workers, chastising religion, destroying the family, promoting the idea that wealth is a man’s worth, catering culture to the lowest common denominator, disavowing patriotism, devaluing college by making it compulsory, exporting jobs, promoting ethnic favoritism, etc. etc.

Progressives have replaced a once Western and proud American culture with a pseudo-culture of materialism, rationalism, hedonism, nihilism, liberalism, and universalism, and yet they feign shock and dismay when a man bred to a culture which values nothing, develops no values himself?!

The very progressives marching against “corporate greed” are the very people who created a culture of corporate greed; they are the very individuals who defined a man’s worth by his material possessions; they are the very people who promoted a lifestyle of unending pleasure and self-indulgence; they are the people who said that “God is dead,” that the world has no value, and that a man’s deeds are inconsequential; they are the people who blindly pursue equality despite its impossibility, leaving a trail of destruction in their wake. Instead of allowing a man to come to grips with his limitations and his place in society they repeat the lie that “anybody can be anything” embittering and setting the masses up for failure, and allowing elites to have no civic responsibility.

Progressives control all the institutions of this country, including Wall Street. It’s through the lobbying efforts of corporate America, their dupes in the intelligentsia, their shills in the media that America has become the meaningless proposition nation that it is today. America is dead; progressives have destroyed it, only a fool would think progressives could save it.

[-] 1 points by ElizaLately (1) 2 years ago

The squeaky wheel gets the grease! And I found a LA-based company willing to help...a company called, www.brandedsocialprofiles.com is showing their support with "Occupy Our Wall". If your unemployed or need some help waving your resume around, they'll help. Just LIKE their Facebook page and get a chance to be promoted, by them, for a day.

The people they promote will be entered into a contest to receive a FREE Basic Business Package: http://brandedsocialprofiles.com/businesses-and-corporations/

[-] 1 points by carold (1) from Fort Lauderdale, FL 2 years ago

I am so glad to see this movement going on. People need to send a clear message to politicians that business as usual is over and the people that count are the 99%. I worked for corporate America for 20 years and then was laid off. I vented my frustration on "deaf corporate ears" as I tried to get a decent raise and asked for a cost of living raise. I was practically laughed out the door and, at the same time, the company I worked for was rolling in the profits. Each year my paycheck shrunk as the corporate fat pockets kept getting fatter. I am sick and tired of corporate America and the politicians that support them and their greed!

[-] 1 points by lemonadegrandma (4) 2 years ago

Have you thought of what comes after you collapse the economic system? Glen Beck has challenged you to answer some important questions.....Can you answer them?

[-] 1 points by germany2011almostbanrupt (1) 2 years ago

Hello guys we interested to change the finance system then we need to change energy from oil to zero emission. A small canadian http://www.Hydrogenics.com firm is entering the market but it needs support and a better adoption!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9EwM2YUVIxg

[-] 1 points by patch007 (2) from Milano, Lombardia 2 years ago

this is the plan: banks close or save their budget people fired by banks must be insured in other job position the health system must be public and self running by taxes the instruction from baby to university must be paid in % of your own possibilities the price of the houses and the speculation must be controlled and it should be no economic bubble in any economic sector the petrol must be not used anymore and all the money spent in war and wheapons must go to search and development of new energy power 100% not polluting and helping poor countries all over the world the politicians must not be business man or being part of any lobby the politicians must drop any benefit as well any baker anyone deserve a decent life on a base of 40 hours per week work and a pension after 30 years of working

we are in a very advance period of our civilization, we are still ruled by the same people that was ruling rome 3000 years ago, corrupted politicians and greedy bankers, wake up world, we are the 2000 generation we are all connected and we are fast let's show them that the end is closer, game over!

[-] 1 points by powerless99percent (2) 2 years ago

The target should be the "derivatives instruments" ban derivatives!!!

[-] 1 points by skipper (9) 2 years ago

One theme this movement should emphasize is no more socializing losses on the backs of taxpayers, wallstreet's moto - we will keep the profits, but large losses are to be beared by the taxpayer. I believe there is no such thing as too big to fail. If an entity fails the government should nationalize the financial entity, safekeeping the accounts and loans, but the bond holders and stockholders have to take a loss( or be wiped out). The management and board should be fired and replaced. The nationalized company can later be sold into new hands. Fair is fair, if a wallstreet bank makes bad bets, it is the bank that should take the losses, not the taxpayer.

[-] 1 points by skipper (9) 2 years ago

One theme this movement should emphasize is no more socializing losses on the backs of taxpayers, wallstreet's moto - we will keep the profits, but large losses are to be beared by the taxpayer. I believe there is no such thing as too big to fail. If an entity fails the government should nationalize the financial entity, safekeeping the accounts and loans, but the bond holders and stockholders have to take a loss( or be wiped out). The management and board should be fired and replaced. The nationalized company can later be sold into new hands. Fair is fair, if a wallstreet bank makes bad bets, it is the bank that should take the losses, not the taxpayer.

[-] 1 points by deefau (3) from Eagle Lake, ON 2 years ago

As we are the majority, we shall prevail. Even the for fathers who wrote the declaration of independence felt that every generation must have a revolution to keep things on the right track. We have lost that track and must prevail to make this happen.

[-] 1 points by RobD (1) 2 years ago

I'm a TEA Partier; and so, expecting waves of deigration, I won't be back. But I have to say that I agree with much of what you want. You're just going about it all wrong. Advancing Socialism and more freebies aren't the answer. Obama owes more to the wall Street bankers than any other president in history. 1/3 of donations to his campaign warchest in 2011, alone, came from the evil, greedy W.S. tycoons. Who's paying for all this? Doesn't that make you wonder?

[-] 1 points by joybasu (23) 2 years ago

all power must be with 99%! but why it is no so in the first place? because most of the wealth of this earth is being accumulated by the 1% and all the power with it. take back the wealth from 1% and the power will be with 99%. this is certainly not about changing a couple of laws, this is about changing the law structure itself. this is not about any country or nation, it is about whole world and entire humanity. this can not be done in any country, this have to be done all over the world. soviet union failed for that very reason that it tried to 'implement' it in a single country, which finally gave birth to autocracy and a very mean war machinery, which is against all the basic principles of socialism in general and marxism in specific. that very notion of 'implementing' socialism in a single country makes china a 'slave labor land'' though all of it started with very good and high intentions. in effect soviet union, china, cuba etc. are models of state controlled capitalism, not of socialism. socialism can not be 'implemented' from above, it can only be made possible from the grass roots, as marx said for time and again. however, with marx or without marx, the social control over all the wealth (not private property like your PC or dining table) of the world is the key to the central problems of the present day world financial crisis, which is threatening to take apart the civilization. private control over wealth can try to survive a crisis only by destroying already achieved productivity, that is by reducing workers and laying off factories, and thus further aggravating the crisis and deteriorating the living standard of the workers. this is in effect takes the humanity on a backward route. social control over wealth only can face the problem of under production, that is the demand being higher than the supply, which it must try to overcome by escalating the production. this is in sharp contrast with the crisis of over production of the present day capitalist system, where supply is more than the demand( in this system 'demand' means purchasing power only, not the real demand). social control over wealth is the way to the ever growing production system, whereas private control over wealth is bound to destroy it's own productivity from time to time for the crisis of over production. realization of this single demand will make the total spectrum of the demands by 99% solvable. otherwise all the demands of us will be just that, demands. no law will make corporates less greedy, or politician leaders less manipulable, ever. however, to achieve this we must protest globally in content but against each of our governments and capitalists nationally in form. don't make it an agitation against US 'imperialism', we must make it a revolution against world capitalism. ( am not good in english, this is not my mother tongue, so please ignore my grammatical mistakes... oh, on the second thought, don't ignore them, let me know the mistakes of mine, in language and in content.)... from kolkata, india.

[-] 1 points by joybasu (23) 2 years ago

all power must be with 99%! but why it is no so in the first place? because most of the wealth of this earth is being accumulated by the 1% and all the power with it. take back the wealth from 1% and the power will be with 99%. this is certainly not about changing a couple of laws, this is about changing the law structure itself. this is not about any country or nation, it is about whole world and entire humanity. this can not be done in any country, this have to be done all over the world. soviet union failed for that very reason that it tried to 'implement' it in a single country, which finally gave birth to autocracy and a very mean war machinery, which is against all the basic principles of socialism in general and marxism in specific. that very notion of 'implementing' socialism in a single country makes china a 'slave labor land'' though all of it started with very good and high intentions. in effect soviet union, china, cuba etc. are models of state controlled capitalism, not of socialism. socialism can not be 'implemented' from above, it can only be made possible from the grass roots, as marx said for time and again. however, with marx or without marx, the social control over all the wealth (not private property like your PC or dining table) of the world is the key to the central problems of the present day world financial crisis, which is threatening to take apart the civilization. private control over wealth can try to survive a crisis only by destroying already achieved productivity, that is by reducing workers and laying off factories, and thus further aggravating the crisis and deteriorating the living standard of the workers. this is in effect takes the humanity on a backward route. social control over wealth only can face the problem of under production, that is the demand being higher than the supply, which it must try to overcome by escalating the production. this is in sharp contrast with the crisis of over production of the present day capitalist system, where supply is more than the demand( in this system 'demand' means purchasing power only, not the real demand). social control over wealth is the way to the ever growing production system, whereas private control over wealth is bound to destroy it's own productivity from time to time for the crisis of over production. realization of this single demand will make the total spectrum of the demands by 99% solvable. otherwise all the demands of us will be just that, demands. no law will make corporates less greedy, or politician leaders less manipulable, ever. however, to achieve this we must protest globally in content but against each of our governments and capitalists nationally in form. don't make it an agitation against US 'imperialism', we must make it a revolution against world capitalism. ( am not good in english, this is not my mother tongue, so please ignore my grammatical mistakes... oh, on the second thought, don't ignore them, let me know the mistakes of mine, in language and in content.)... from kolkata, india.

[-] 0 points by awesomeness (3) 2 years ago

woah you just need to calm down!

[-] 1 points by joybasu (23) 2 years ago

so this is the time to calm down? that is your advice to the world?

[-] 1 points by Pandora (9) 2 years ago

First off, CONGRATULATIONS on the first month!!! Persistence is key!! A few concerns....

**** What will happen to us when the weather grows too cold to remain outdoors? The protests are a great beginning, but all the 1% has to do is play the waiting game...since their lives are not really being inconvenienced by the protests, and it certainly isn't hitting them where it hurts...their wallets!

*** If we want to remain peaceful, we MUST have outcomes to work towards. Without it, won't frustration and anger ultimately take over?

[-] 1 points by BinaryFu (20) 2 years ago

Who says they'll stop when the weather turns cold? Did not Washington and his men freeze at Valley Forge for their country? Have not other great men suffered far greater hardships in the face of adversity?

We have modern technology on our side - we can survive a long harsh winter.

Can those in power?

[-] 1 points by Pandora (9) 2 years ago

Sure they can remain in power-as long as their lives are not really being disrupted. Let's assume the protests last all winter-then what? How will things be different from today?

[-] 1 points by BinaryFu (20) 2 years ago

Their lives have already been disrupted. More and more politicians who are against the very things being protested are speaking up. This group has already shaken things up and gotten a lot of powerful people to take notice. Such change as is desired takes time and more-so, it takes dedication by those who stand up and represent the masses.

For every man woman and child out there in those protests, there are tens if not hundreds of Americans who would happily join in, if they could. I sincerely hope they organize themselves enough to agree on the main demands and speak them plainly.

Right now they already have people asking, "Well, what do you want, what would fix this?" In a few months, perhaps even as long as a year, they will have people on their knees begging to know what they can do to fix this issue. Because the masses will come. The numbers will grow and swell.

Those who can't be there will call their representatives and ask a simple question: "Are you part of the solution, or part of the problem?"

[-] 1 points by MiMi1026 (937) from Springfield, VA 2 years ago

Press On! Stay The Course! Stay Focused!

[-] 1 points by Justice4all (133) 2 years ago

The pressure must continue on these corrupt and morally deficient for lack of a better word I guess lets call them human--although I dont believe them to be. Let the prosecutions of all begin! Watch how quickly the system changes if they are threatened with life imprisonment for what they have done!! Never stop--never quit!! Justice has its foothold, and is coming for them!

[-] 1 points by MrReform (10) 2 years ago

This is what our founders think about all this corruption. We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable rights, that among these are life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness. That to secure these rights, governments are instituted among men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed. That whenever any form of government becomes destructive to these ends, it is the right of the people to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new government, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their safety and happiness. But when a long train of abuses and usurpations, pursuing invariably the same object evinces a design to reduce them under absolute “Corruption”, it is their right, it is their duty, to throw off such government, and to provide new guards for their future security. --Such has been the patient sufferance of “The American People”; and such is now the necessity which constrains them to alter their former systems of government • It’s time to reform our governance to remove the influence of money and power, so it can represent the people properly. This being one of the many governance reforms that are necessary for the continued success of The American People in the future. It’s time to evolve our governance system into a state of the art 21st century system that can be a model for mankind to consider.

[-] 1 points by MrReform (10) 2 years ago

This is what our founders think about all this corruption. We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable rights, that among these are life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness. That to secure these rights, governments are instituted among men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed. That whenever any form of government becomes destructive to these ends, it is the right of the people to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new government, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their safety and happiness. But when a long train of abuses and usurpations, pursuing invariably the same object evinces a design to reduce them under absolute “Corruption”, it is their right, it is their duty, to throw off such government, and to provide new guards for their future security. --Such has been the patient sufferance of “The American People”; and such is now the necessity which constrains them to alter their former systems of government • It’s time to reform our governance to remove the influence of money and power, so it can represent the people properly. This being one of the many governance reforms that are necessary for the continued success of The American People in the future. It’s time to evolve our governance system into a state of the art 21st century system that can be a model for mankind to consider.

[-] 1 points by taru (1) from Dhaka, Dhaka Division 2 years ago

Our 3rd world's countries leaders are dumping their black money to 1st world. Aren't you morally sick or ethically crack?

[-] 1 points by Stoppingby (3) 2 years ago

Take a ganders at this. Federal Reserve Audit by the US General Accounting Office.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vLLMnY-2d08

http://sanders.senate.gov/imo/media/doc/GAO%20Fed%20Investigation.pdf

[-] 1 points by DSams (-71) 2 years ago

An Open Letter to Occupy Wall Street Protesters

Congratulations! You are successfully focusing public attention on the root cause of our political ills. Moreover, you are doing so with dignity and grace -- qualities which will not only influence more people, but make it far harder for the Establishment and their political agents to employ their normal repressive methods. You occupy the moral high ground; do not give it up no matter the provocation.

But, as surely you must know, this act is only the first in a long drama. The system you protest is robust and designed to withstand challenge. The banks and corporations from whom you wish to wrest power are well organized and have, over many long years, fully institutionalized their political and social controls. Our adversaries have waged class war for well over a century, have much invested, and everything to lose -- a long and difficult struggle lies ahead.

With this in mind, now is the time to consider and shape a second act, even as the first continues to unfold. To be successful, this act must not only engender widespread protest but also dramatically enumerate that discontent. Or else, as is happening already, your efforts will simply be dismissed as theatric, but essentially meaningless, commentary by an insignificant fringe of malcontents.

And therein lies the essential contradiction -- the only undeniable measure of and outlet for public discontent is the ballot box. Yet elite control of both political parties makes this a futile exercise. Past well-organized and powerful protest movements were defused and broken by an electoral process dominated by party candidates. Third parties have, historically, been marginalized and had little practical effect. Moreover, time is short -- the next election is barely a year away.

But what might happen if you inject some unpredictability into this well ordered system? If you explicitly reject both party's candidates? What will their media report on election night if millions of us join your protest by writing in "None of the Above" on our ballots?

What might happen indeed...

[-] 1 points by sqrltyler (207) 2 years ago

Outright lies from the media in regards to OWS:

http://news.yahoo.com/one-month-protests-yet-topple-capitalism-152659317.html

Let's put some pressure on Caroline May, her editors, The Daily Caller, and Yahoo! "News" for slandering our movement.

http://dailycaller.com/

[-] 1 points by morriden (128) from Burton, MI 2 years ago

This is a very very long fight that will not end for a even longer time. In the end those in power will try tactics like marital law and attempt a second civil war.

So keep up the protests.. and make change.. Good luck

[-] 1 points by Goodday (8) 2 years ago

Today is a good day for Occupy Wall Street. At a meeting/hearing with Bernanke today in Washington; "US Economic Out look and Monetary Policy" which can be viewed on C-Span library. Bernanke was questioned by Mr. Hinchey. Mr. Hinchey asked him what he thought about OWS. Mr. Hinchey talked about financial disparity. He discussed Volcker Rule and Glass Steagall Act. You (OWS) are making people aware and causing them to have a serious discussion. Great job!

[-] 1 points by Goodday (8) 2 years ago

Today is a good day for Occupy Wall Street. At a meeting/hearing with Bernanke today in Washington; "US Economic Out look and Monetary Policy" which can be viewed on C-Span liabrary. Bernanke was questioned by Mr. Hinchey. Mr. Hinchey asked him what he thought about OWS. Mr. Hinchey talked about financial disparity. He discussed Volcker Rule and Glass Steagall Act. You (OWS) are making people aware and causing them to have a serious discussion. Great job!

[-] 1 points by Goodday (8) 2 years ago

Today is a good day for Occupy Wall Street. At a meeting/hearing with Bernanke today in Washington; "US Economic Out look and Monetary Policy" which can be viewed on C-Span liabrary. Bernanke was questioned by Mr. Hinchey. Mr. Hinchey asked him what he thought about OWS. Mr. Hinchey talked about financial disparity. He discussed Volcker Rule and Glass Steagall Act. You (OWS) are making people aware and causing them to have a serious discussion. Great job!

[-] 1 points by bobby (58) from Quincy, CA 2 years ago

THE USA PARLIAMENT VOTE COUNTING MINISTRY, announces voter registration where independents, all parties, voters and non voters can coordinate for the good of the all.

A political party is a word by a candidate's name so that when the voter walks into the voting booth a free speech word can be read by the voter for more information about the name(s).

When a two-party system guarantees both parties a 50/50 chance of winning, alternative ideas are not fairly and properly reported. Since one winner takes all in a single-winner district, the voter knows little about the alternatives because of the "split vote", lessor of two evils and other voting system mechanics problems.

Check out the All Party System (and independents) where 100 to 1000 possible party names (and independents) are elected simultaneously in 100 to 1000-member districts, with 100 to 1000 possible parties/categories names/categories are permitted/protected for democratic creativity.

Your name (or someone else's name to represent you) #1, as a team of 100 to 1000 (super-state or national) democratically legitimately elected equal units, votes cast and kept as proof for your verification.

Posted by Vote Counting Minister James O. Ogle [Free Parliamentary]

http://usparliament.org/votecountingministry.php

"Why do you THINK they called it Google in October of '97?"

Join the Frees, Opposite gender #1!

Go BarrOOgle 2012

[-] 1 points by e000 (371) 2 years ago

You forgot Australia. I'm pretty sure I saw Melbourne in that list...

[-] 1 points by Tamber (3) 2 years ago

Why not have the general meeting work on language for a constitutional ammendment or a law for congress which would overturn Citizen's United.

[Removed]

[-] 1 points by sande49 (2) 2 years ago

This all seems like a bunch of cry baby do nothings who follow misguided and questionable leaders (are there any leaders). Has socialism ever worked out anywhere? It worked good for the Soviets, right? Why not get a degree in a field that is looking for people, and there are lots of them and, GET A JOB. That's how the rest of us got health care, pay our bills, and manage to save for the futurre. Our consititution guarentees the PURSUIT of happiness, not FREE happiness.

[-] 2 points by SwissMiss (2435) from Ann Arbor Charter Township, MI 2 years ago

Socialism actually works very well in many Western European countries. You should research them. Using the Soviet Union as an example to try and claim socialism doesn't work doesn't make sense. The Soviet Unions hardly practiced socialism. The Soviet Union is a great example of how a highly centralized government doesn't work.

"Our consititution guarentees the PURSUIT of happiness, not FREE happiness." It doesn't mean that the Constitution is followed.

[-] 2 points by RobertNDavis (133) 2 years ago

The Soviets practiced a totalitarian form of Communism. They only practiced Socialism at the lowest local level. That's not Socialism at all.

A form of Democratic Socialism is practiced, to varying degrees, in Sweden, France, Germany, Norway, Denmark, and Japan. What do these countries have in common? They are kicking our asses in quality of life for their citizens, income disparity, household income, education, literacy, research and development, health care, democratic participation rates, and pretty much everything else positive that you can imagine. The United States isn't a top 15 country at anything positive. nothing. Percentage-wise, we are precariously close to third world status. In fact, there are third world countries kicking our asses in some areas. El Salvador, for example, has a lower infant mortality rate than we do. Ours is the second-worst in the developed world. Ours is the worst in the first world (as is our income disparity, unemployment, quality of life, and rate of homelessness). The only reason we are considered "first world" is because of our military might, which can only collapse since we cannot afford to maintain our military complex.

For the record, I work, have health insurance, and have a residence that I pay for. Instead of being a lazy, trolling, ignoramus, you should do some research and listen (or read) before talking (or typing). Your view is dead wrong and it's obvious to anyone who actually reads or lives in the real world.

[-] 3 points by SwissMiss (2435) from Ann Arbor Charter Township, MI 2 years ago

I also have a career, have health insurance (that I only have in case of an emergency and to not go into debt from it).... I pay for my own health care out of my pocket (chiropractic, massage therapy, etc.), a house I'm buying, I travel around the world, etc. I'm sick and tired of ignorant and blinded people accusing the protesters and their supporters of being lazy mooches and saying that socialism doesn't work.

[-] 1 points by wade231 (9) 2 years ago

If you think we are truly close to a third world country, then you have never seen actual poverty. If any of the thousands of afghans I have seen saw the way an American that lives in "poverty" theywould trade places with them in an instant! The definition of poverty level in the unites states is a joke!

[-] 1 points by RobertNDavis (133) 2 years ago

You're talking about a quasi-occupied war zone. That's an apples vs oranges comment.

Before you make assumptions, know that I have been to Central America. I have been to rural Mexico. I have been to various places in Europe and Asia. Haven't done South America yet, but I've got buddies down there. You don't know what you're talking about. Period.

And don't even try to talk military to me, bubba. I know that hayride.

[-] 1 points by sande49 (2) 2 years ago

This all seems like a bunch of cry baby do nothings who follow misguided and questionable leaders (are there any leaders). Has socialism ever worked out anywhere? It worked good for the Soviets, right? Why not get a degree in a field that is looking for people, and there are lots of them and, GET A JOB. That's how the rest of us got health care, pay our bills, and manage to save for the futurre. Our consititution guarentees the PURSUIT of happiness, not FREE happiness.

[-] 1 points by lavendersoap (31) 2 years ago

For those of you out there who think the 'occupation' is lacking in focus and isn't making a difference...THINK AGAIN! - http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/44908122/ns/us_news-life/

Also, The big banks are scared shitless of people closing out their accounts. They know that they will be shut down in a heartbeat if enough Americans close out their accounts. You can make a difference by doing this. But if you don't want to, then switch to a credit union. The NYPD is on the BigBank payroll like JP Morgan, Citibank, and Chase. Read it and weep - http://coupmedia.org/occupy-wall-street/nypd-now-on-big-bank-payroll-1010

The 1% are running scared and will crumble under the weight of their own corruption.

[-] 1 points by SwissMiss (2435) from Ann Arbor Charter Township, MI 2 years ago

I'm switching to a local credit union.

[-] 1 points by mattymatt (88) from New York, NY 2 years ago
[-] 1 points by tjb123 (1) 2 years ago

you have no clear direction but blame the top one percent who didnt make the current problems we have today. You made the problems by not standing up years ago and telling your elected officials they were wrong and not voting them out of office... Get a job flipping burgers or helping out without pay and contribute. YOU ARE DIS-ORGANIZED WITH NO REAL SENSE OF DIRECTION

[-] 1 points by RobertNDavis (133) 2 years ago

Actually, according to the FBI, the top 1% DID cause the problems. It's well-documented and the proof is irrefutable. Instead of trolling like an ignoramus, you should do some research. A little bit of reading and a little less self-delusion will bring you around. The question is, do you have the guts to study the real issues or are you just going to be a willfully ignorant internet coward?

In our system, the lobbyists write the bills and groom (as well as fund) the politicians that they (the corporations) will allow the media to support enough to have any chance of winning. The entire system is tightly controlled by the 1%. A grand highlight is this: Bush received nearly a million dollars from Goldman Sachs. Obama received slightly more than a million dollars from Goldman Sachs. Both presidents pushed legislation that benefited G.S. and actively gutted some of their competition (such as Lehman Brothers). Goldman Sachs executives work at the Treasury and man the SEC. You cannot vote these people out of office, because the system is set up to only allow people like them to run. But you can change the system that puts them in office. It's a long, difficult process, but one that's way overdue - largely because ignorant people have refused to see such an obvious truth for too long.

Being lazy and willfully ignorant won't fix things. Organizing, protesting, and demanding structural change - the point of this movement, with it's focus on the practice of Democracy through it's General Assembly - is the only option left that has a chance of working. The "tough sell" is that people have to get off their asses and participate instead of sitting around at home (if you're lucky enough to have one) bitching or hoping that there will some day be someone worth voting for in a meaningful election (you can bet that the 1% that controls the system will not just magically allow that to happen; though there is an occasional congressperson who leaks through, there won't be a majority without radical action by the people). The democratic Republic as we have practiced it is supposed to be "of the people, by the people, and for the people", not just for 1% of them.

[-] 1 points by SwissMiss (2435) from Ann Arbor Charter Township, MI 2 years ago

Very well spoken!

[-] 1 points by tsdevi (307) 2 years ago

One simple, solid demand that would actually bring about the needed transfer of prosperity and wealth is to let the next bailout be handed to the people. I am absolutely sincere about this. Curiously, when government gives money to industry, it is called investment, when it gives money to people, it is called a handout. The pump has never been primed sufficiently enough to make it viable and trickle down economics is an insult to those upon whom it is supposed to "trickle." In the lifetime of the average worker, about 2 million dollars will be earned. This average is, however, based upon the aggregate of all wages, which means that the average lifetime earnings is far less (look up wages of workers in 2010 and get the government stats for reference...thank goodness for bureaucrats). Put that in the context of the billions and trillions of dollars that are being spent in the name of people whose lifetime earnings are a dreadful pittance as compared to the debts that our government has sunk us into. It is mind boggling, the opportunity cost of the trillions of dollars that have been SQUANDERED by the ineptitude of the U.S. military and lack of oversight by the U.S. government. The money is not going to schools, to teachers, to roads, to hospitals (not that it should go to private hospitals, private roads, or private schools, if private means only exclusive based upon ones inability to pay), to better transportation infrastructure, it is going to bail out failed industries that do little to nothing to make us healthy, intelligent, and prosperous. Real prosperity, people scale prosperity is not measured in the billions or trillions, or even millions. It is measured by how many local businesses can thrive and the economic diversity in cities and towns and small communities. 20,000,000,000,000...and counting, and what do we have to show for it?

[-] 1 points by subhendu (1) 2 years ago

Money is the root cause of all problems.

Who prints the money? The central bank. In USA it is the Federal Reserve Bank.

The Fed is a private bank, not accountable to any one. It can print money any time and give to any body. Money is free for the Fed. The Bloomberg news claims in a law suit against the Fed that the Fed spent $12.8 trillion as the bailout money. The GDP of USA during 2008 was $14.2 trillion. The Fed is refusing to acknowledge the validity of the number on the grounds of privacy.

Eliminate money. Remove the Fed. It will solve all problems. The Nobel Laureate in economics, Milton Friedman, said: “One unsolved economic problem of the day is how to get rid of the Federal Reserve”.

We can run the same economy, exactly the same way, without the money. Check the blog site for https://createmoneylesseconomy.wordpress.com/ Write your questions and I will answer them. Please visit. I am with you for the occupy revolution.

[-] 1 points by publicus1 (125) 2 years ago

We are with you! Our working group is editing and preparing a list of sample demands for a broader National General Assembly to deliver a list of grievances to the politicians BEFORE the 2012 election. If you want to make change, we need to let our consensus of demands be known from an elected body so that no one can say these demands came from one person or a small group of people. Go to https://sites.google.com/site/the99percentdeclaration/ and see what we are working on and then join our working group.

[-] 1 points by MattLHolck (16833) from San Diego, CA 2 years ago
[-] 1 points by johannaclearfield (7) 2 years ago

happy month-day!!! Please include our friends, the animals in your cry for justice and liberation. They do not have a voice. We can give it to them. sign the petition sponsored by tgevAnimal Legal Defense Fund http://www.aldf.org/article.php?id=1640&gclid=CMXI6Z_776sCFYxx5Qod3l1fGw

[-] 1 points by acarefreeman (27) 2 years ago

Greetings from Canada!

Just like any movement or revolution, in order for the OWS to succeed, clear goals need to be laid out, and equally important, a clear strategy needs to be developed to achieve these goals. On the other hand, we need also to understand who are resisting or against this movement, and what they are thinking, what they will do to resist any change, and what we need to do counter that. I will say more on this topic later.

~acarefreeman

[-] 3 points by kathieb (65) 2 years ago

acarefreeman - I believe at this point OWS is trying to unite Americans to wanting to change the inequality that exists. Then with strength in numbers, hammer out the "changes" in a democratic way. I fill in at the info desk at OWS NYC (57 years young, veteran, employed, nice apt, and voted Republican almost my entire life). I grew up in an era when America's capitalism worked and don't want to change the system. I want to see it restored to not being a bought by greedy corporations commodity through politicians assisting them. I can tell you with certainty that many ideas are being discussed, people come by and offer their opinions, it is not a rag tag bunch of dirty hippies and lazy people. There is much more organization than the press (mostly controlled by the corporations and government) will ever tell you.

[-] 1 points by notaneoliberal (2269) 2 years ago

I want to know more about the position the movement will take on the issue of so called "free trade". In statements on this site I've read reference to opposing neoliberalism. If ows has the courage to address this issue I can support it. It must go beyond simply talking about currency manipulation as in point 15. Wage disparity will not be solved by a mere 40% adjustment to the renmimbi. Please tell us what the consensus is on this issue.

[-] 1 points by acarefreeman (27) 2 years ago

I am glad to learn this, kathieb; and I will share more ideas with all of you later. Thank you for your informative reply. ~acarefreeman

[-] 1 points by SwissMiss (2435) from Ann Arbor Charter Township, MI 2 years ago

"clear goals need to be laid out".... I'm so sick of hearing this. It's not hard to figure out what The People want.

[-] 1 points by acarefreeman (27) 2 years ago

SwissMiss, I agree with you that "it's not hard to figure out what the people want", but when getting to specifics, however, I believe different people may name different goals, that's fine, but the more difficult questions are: Are we to achieve all of these goals? If not, what are our priorities? And most importantly, at what stage of the movement, in terms of goal-reaching, shall we stop? To go further, suppose now the government or legislature promises some changes, are we to trust them? And, as you may have known, President Obama had spoken against the Wall Street greed over and over, but when it came to passing a legislative bill to supervise it, it simply did not work out well, why?. These reflections should be sufficient to remind us that setting up goals and having them reached may not be easy as it first appears. ~acarefreeman

[-] 1 points by BreadLandPeace (359) 2 years ago

STOP THE EVICTIONS! STOP THE FORECLOSURES! You are doing a FANTASTIC JOB! I'm listing the above demand again, which I thought of a couple days ago, which would take the protests to the next level without sacrificing any of our other demands: STOP THE EVICTIONS! STOP THE FORECLOSURES! Although the banks are only one part of the crisis of capitalism, this is a demand NONE of the rulers, none of the politicians can meet, and they'll be exposed. All we have to do is go to the foreclosure websites, identify whose houses are in foreclosure, demonstrate and bring on the media. MILLIONS OF PEOPLE will support us, which will isolate the politicians. It there's money for war, there's money to keep workers in their homes--and the banks are starting to talk about razing the houses they've taken over rather than let them stand empty. If that doesn't tell you something's wrong with the system!

Also, "We are the 99%" is brilliant. The Bolsheviks in Russia used the same psychology when they took that name, which I understand translates as the "majority-ites." In fact, at that time they actually were a minority, but the "minority-ites", the Mensheviks, didn't understand mass psychology and allowed the Bolsheviks to say they were the majority. But we ARE the majority, and it's brilliant to use that formulation. Great job!

Also, threatening to clog the courts using the civil right to a trial is another brilliant demand that helps to educate people. And it's legal. It's exactly right to continue to use peaceful, nonviolent methods, because people who have families and jobs and who can't afford to get arrested can then join in protests. I also remember from when I was in the Trotskyist group, the Socialist Workers Party, hearing that Lenin stayed up all night reading through books of the czar's laws to find a law that would allow them to hold a strike legally. In other words, so the government couldn't stop them. (There are some excellent analyses of the crisis of capitalism in the current issue of the Militant, at www.themilitant.com.)

I also remember from the socialist movement that in order to have a revolution, you also have to convince the rulers themselves that the system is bankrupt. And you're doing a great job of that, too, as more and more politicians are supporting OWS (even if it's only an attempt to maintain their credibility).

In solidarity, and thanks profoundly for all you're doing. I hope to see you downtown very soon.

[-] 1 points by johannaclearfield (7) 2 years ago

Yes. The basic human rights of food/clothing/shelter. SHELTER. Landlords continue to buy off politicians in NYC & everywhere else, changing regulations, changing rent stabilization so that "change" = NO PROTECTIONS. The constant issue of "homelessness" never seems to be connected to the dotted line of rogue and predatory rental landLORDS. Stop the evictions (for renters as well as home owners)!!!!

[-] 1 points by changeisfact (3) 2 years ago

the developments are so encouraging we need to get it more and more to the working class the 99% speacially to the trade unions and make them ready to go for a general stike through out the USA. putting their demands forward like right off of all the families, students and workers loans that make up to $ 30000 and the full assurence of providing jobs to the jobless people and no social cuts. These all demands must be full fill in the specific period after that period the movement can be drived for the nationalization of all the industries, services sectors and lands around such issues and demands the OWS can attract more and more of the 99%. The active demonstrators must give the movement a direction before the people start feeling tired. Their energy should be pistonised before it evaporates in the air uselessly. When it is possible to bailout the 1% criminals by the 99% taxes, so it is much more possible to get back few of our money (the 99% taxes and stolen money) back from the thieves through the suggested programmes. LONG LIVE OWS

[-] 1 points by kathieb (65) 2 years ago

changeisfact - Appreciate the OWS support and most of your ideas. However, I feel if you took a loan - you owe a loan. BUT!! The problem is these kids are coming out of school with degrees and can't even get a job at McDonald's (overqualified) and are unable to pay them back. We don't want handouts - we want our jobs back!! We want to be able to work for our American Dream but they've robbed us of that through their greed and corruption.

[-] 1 points by BettyG4ce (3) 2 years ago

You, who stand out in the cold to shed a light on the stench in the banking industry, are the Hero's. The invisible 1 per cent who control governments and set global agendas need to have a light shed on their activities, both past & present. Multinational corporations have become the behemoths of the one percent who feverishly consume, control and eat all and any in it's way to satiate it's greedy thirst for power and control. The force will be with you as the masses become informed.

[-] 1 points by BrianHolmes (1) 2 years ago

I am 100% with this movement but let's remember one small thing: if 1500 protests happened around the world on the 15th, it's ALSO because our friends in Spain and Greece and elsewhere have been organizing them and calling for them for YEARS now. The date of October 15 was, I believe, initially a call by the Spanish movements (http://bcnhubmeeting.wordpress.com). The really big demos with hundreds of thousands of people were in Spain, Italy, Portugal and Chile. Of course we also owe all respect and inspiration to the North Africans. The problems of capitalism are global and the 99% is bigger than you think!

[-] 1 points by SwissMiss (2435) from Ann Arbor Charter Township, MI 2 years ago

True.... but Occupy Wall St. also has inspired protests in other areas where there may not have been any.... like Italy.

[-] 1 points by BrianHolmes (1) 2 years ago

Everybody inspires everybody else and that's great. I am just saying, let's remember who we are and who our friends are. Protests in the US are tremendously significant because the center of the problem is here. But compared to other places, protests here are still pretty small. We can learn a lot from others and it's good to respect their accomplishments.

[-] 1 points by SwissMiss (2435) from Ann Arbor Charter Township, MI 2 years ago

I agree. We all can help each other.

[-] 1 points by sufinaga (513) 2 years ago

organise some braziers fire baskets its going to get really cold!

[-] 1 points by bcv166 (18) from Edisto Beach, SC 2 years ago

The states have to call for a Constitutional Convention to reform our electoral system. Eliminate the Electoral College, "Get The Money Out" of politics, eliminate gerrymandering, etc., etc. This may sound quite impossible, but its really the only orderly way to save the country.

[-] 1 points by RobertNDavis (133) 2 years ago

I agree. I believe that the time should come soon where we start to affect elections at the local and state levels. Everyone says that this isn't a political movement, but I think we should show that the General Assembly model can work on a larger scale and starting with local elections is, I think, the best way to begin. Then we will have enough power to start restructuring the system.

[-] 1 points by bcv166 (18) from Edisto Beach, SC 2 years ago

Yes, that's the way to go.

[-] 1 points by RReagan (1) from Washington, DC 2 years ago

The Message needs to be clear and united. We first have to seperate the money from politics.The only way do that is to vote only for those who take no corporate money. (That includes billionares using their own) Regardless of party and regardless of who this benefits in the short term. When the day comes that a President, Senator, Congressman, Governor, Mayor is again beholden to private citizens, is the time when the interests/rights of citizens will prevail.

[-] 1 points by tsdevi (307) 2 years ago

On second thought, I would surely like it if the next bail out went directly into the pockets of each person...don't think they ever tried this before, priming the pump for real. How about all the people who have next to nothing, or who are indebted, get 100 grand (at least) to use and spend as they see fit in their own communities, in their businesses, to start a business. This surely will cost less than the 16 trillion dollars the GAO estimates that the housing crisis has caused U.S. and less than the trillions already spent on these awful wars, and likely less than we spend each month on the war in Afghanistan. Or, perhaps we could utilize and old theme and build upon it, democratization, decentralization and demilitarization, The Marshall Plan that was implemented in Japan (and Germany?) post WWII. It is commonly referred to as the Global Marshall Plan. This is a good theme to abide by.

[-] 1 points by tsdevi (307) 2 years ago

Why must We the People succumb to this notion that we must have a simple and digestible set of demands? If this movement is about admitting the inevitable changes that are taking place around the globe, then clearly it is far more complex and nuanced than a need for simple concessions between government and the people. This reveals the ultimate corruption in a Democratic government, as government is supposed to be "of the people, by the people and for the people." Clearly it is not. We the People should not be seeking simple handouts in the form of jobs designed by people in government or industry. We the People should define the work that needs to be done to preserve civil society and the cooperative example that is being set by OWS is key for its symbolism and its practice. Imagine if We the People across the globe could bypass the poisonous influence of our broken government in order to meet our needs, NOT to work and make money to satisfy the bottom line of governments and industry, NOT to fight in their wholly unethical and ill conceived wars, but to offer a quality of life that surpasses anything that we have seen in the human experience thus far. Imagine if we had access to the resources of time and materials to travel, to participate in ecological restoration and exploration. Imagine what changes need to be made and then what work would need to be done to implement them. The corporatization of the global economy has caused us to think in monocultural terms. Monocultures are not sustainable, not in nature and not in human organization. Everyone should not be doing the same thing, or mimicking the same thing and calling it work or life, whether it be producing, consuming, destroying or talking, or doing. We must take a step back and question what we are doing and why we are doing it and cause others to pause and perform the same exercise. We do not need to placate the narrow minded, but we do need to work to empower ourselves to provide for the changes the We the People need and want, not to serve the dubious hierarchy, or the dubious and dysfunctional economy, but to change the way we serve each other and ourselves.

[-] 1 points by BettyG4ce (3) 2 years ago

Well said, Sounds like Plato's Utopia. I'd sign up but am not hopeful. History has shown that Man's greed and avarice wins out. However I am willing to live by it. Funny, but a man suggested this "purity of life" over 2000 years ago and organized religions used & abused it.

[-] 1 points by anonbloom (55) 2 years ago

self-interest is most freely realized in a community of equals.

[-] 1 points by bacon (2) 2 years ago
[-] 1 points by bobby (58) from Quincy, CA 2 years ago

THE USA PARLIAMENT VOTE COUNTING MINISTRY, seeks activists who want to coordinate voter registration in all twelve population balanced super-state parliaments as elected teams of 100, each team being elected under pure proportional representation (PR), ranked choice ballots kept as proof.

For more information, please visit the Vote Counting Ministry:

http://usparliament.org/votecountingministry.php

[-] 1 points by STGal5608 (2) 2 years ago

"aims to expose how the richest 1% of people are writing the rules of an unfair global economy that is foreclosing on our future."

Hmmm. Looks like somebody hasn't check the Forbes 400 for 2010 against the Top Charitable donors for 2010. You know, to be apples to apples. Funny how many of those names appear on BOTH those lists.

You're focusing on the wrong people. You aren't going to stop the influence of business over government until you end the political contributions and ability of lobbyists to financially sway politicians on both sides.

MSNBC had a very intersting article on their website about the top 25 CEO bonuses and how many of them are actually ON Wall Street. Turns out, none of those greedy bankers even cracked the top ten! But that Ralph Lauren, he sure turned a sweet dime!

I get that none of the above will register with some of those in this movement who are so consumed with hating the rich, and big business, and Wall Street, and that's your right.

But when you persist on pitting Americans against each other, and villifying that 1% (many of whom make HUGE charitable donations every single year, along with all the corporations who do as well) while also demanding that they part with money they've so greedily kept to themselves, I can only assume the goal is not to change the gap in inequality towards the upper end and bring UP those Americans who are suffering, but to cripple our economy to the point that we are ALL suffering.

My two cents - you need to OccupyCongress. Now. Before you get co-opted by whichever candidate wants to run on a platform that will ultimately create and even worse jobs, housing, and financial situation than we are currently in.

Shouldn't now be the time that we come together? Shouldn't now be the time that we look at what IS working, that we focus on those in the 1% who DO contribute in many areas of society?

Or do we continue to bully and degrade people to shame them into something that many of them are already doing?

I'm all for closing tax loopholes for those earning at least $750,000 to $1 million dollars a year and above. But don't cut all the breaks - especially those on charitable contributions. Increase those. Make it even MORE attractive to donate more of your wealth.

But don't think that bullying the business and people who run them will get you what you want. Start at the root. Start with Congressional leadership and eliminate their ability to be swayed by their own greed to increase the inequality in this nation. I see a lot of blame and finger pointing at the businesses, but almost none pointed at those elected officials who ACCEPT the money and promises of jobs and campaign contributions and re-election bids to pass legislation that benefits business.

Also, checking out the Giving Pledge: http://givingpledge.org/

Turns out, a couple of those 1% already THOUGHT they should go ahead and give away a lot of their wealth. So, maybe not ALL of them are the villians they are made out to be. I hadn't seen this mentioned anywhere.

[-] 1 points by ARealNewYorker (227) from Brooklyn, NY 2 years ago
  1. Huge charitable donations are a write-off, as you noted. I wouldn't cut the breaks people get from them - but you can keep the breaks while simultaneously re-regulating.

  2. They're usually substantially less than the profits gained from reorganizing financial regulations - SUBSTANTIALLY LESS. They're cosmetic. I'm not spitting on philanthropy, I'm just saying that it's often the case that it serves a purely cosmetic function.

The thing is, if we cut them slack simply because they're donating to good causes, it's just going to retrench the idea that we're all just looking for a handout. The vast majority of us want to work, period. That's the issue: the game is rigged so able-bodied people have no real control over their employment options, and because the outsourcing of jobs is also destructive to the communities that receive them.

[-] 1 points by RobertNDavis (133) 2 years ago

ARealNewYorker, I really like reading your posts on here. You're spot on about the role of philanthropy. I'm curious; what do you think about cooperative/worker-owned business models? I've been thinking that we should phase out corporations altogether and completely replace them with cooperatives and non-profits. What do you think?

[-] 1 points by ARealNewYorker (227) from Brooklyn, NY 2 years ago

I don't really have a problem with the idea of an incorporated business entity as such. They functioned fairly well before it became the predominant model for business organizations. I'm kind of out of my depth here, but my general sense is pretty much everyone else's:

  1. They get too large and so they have enormous leverage and prohibit any real competition (to disastrous proportions nowadays; I can't believe there's anybody who can honestly look at, say, WalMart and not see a problem there - their whole business model is just corruptive, to the last detail).

  2. Their management organization has led to disaster. I mean, where do I start? How about CEOs determining their own pay and then saying it was a "free contract," and that the corporation's peons were entering the same kind of "free" contract. What a fucking joke! Well, I'd laugh if I wasn't crying...

  3. Then there are all of the "externalities" - there's no direct correlation between the corporate model and environmental destruction, but there's such a frequent coincidence that you'd have to say, at least, that the model facilitates that kind of sociopathic behavior (maybe we should even say genopathic behavior...).

But I also don't see that they're going to be phased out. The best we can hope for is control of their adverse effects, and it's easy to see what that would look like; it'd be the usual list: end the personhood doctrine, raise corporate and capital gains taxes, prohibit certain industries from being privatized (especially health insurance), and I'm going to go on record here as advocating positively draconian environmental laws. I mean it - if the mass (slow) murder of environmental terrorism isn't worth the death penalty, then nothing is.

But as for the model of cooperative owned businesses - I have to say, I'm part of one of them (let's hear it for the Park Slope Food Coop!) and it works. I'm not sure if it's practicable to institute this as a general model. Besides the fact that it's not going to happen universally, it's also actually pretty time-consuming. Without some instituted representation system, it requires a lot of personal investment of time. In addition to whatever work needs to be done, you have to spend time meeting to discuss business plans, and that takes up a lot. You can neutralize some of the effects by having a well-controlled management, but still... Anyway, maybe I'm changing my POV half-way through this post, but if there's anything that could come along and replace the current corporate model, it would be that. One of the things that often gets lost with the constant invocations of socialism is that capitalism does offer some things people like, that aren't entirely bad unless they reach certain levels - mainly a sense of fuller control over the production of the specific resources you make. Coop models provide that as well.

[-] 1 points by RobertNDavis (133) 2 years ago

If there are incentives (even in the form of extra-special tax breaks) for cooperative and worker-owned businesses, they will certainly become more of the norm. Civil Rights legislation worked, even though, at the time, it seemed counter-intuitive to legislate ethical behavior. It's a "if you build it, they will come" sort of thing. With some worker-owned business models, the only extra time spent is in administrative meetings where workers decide the strategy and goals of the company. But there are a lot of different ideas out there and they each have their pros, cons, and ramifications.

As for Socialism (and I'm going to riff a little here as I've given this a lot of thought and done crazy amounts of research), it would appear that things only get messy when government tries to do things it wasn't designed to do (just as capitalism gets messy when government duties are left to free markets). "Common good" services, like Police, Firefighting, Prisons, Hospitals, Public Schools, etc should never be privatized while non-vital consumer goods shouldn't be socialized (unless they pose a threat to the well-being of the society and have to be temporarily socialized - if a company is too big to fail, it should be socialized, slowly dismantled, and replaced with a new privatized model). While vital goods (food, medicine, etc) are probably best served in some sort of hybrid system. In a system "of the people, by the people, and for the people... with liberty and justice for all" the government should be a subservient arm of the people anyway, right?

[-] 1 points by ARealNewYorker (227) from Brooklyn, NY 2 years ago

That's all pretty true. Certainly about coops and worker-owned businesses. Of course, you'd be hard-pressed to get the government to go along with tax breaks in the absence of coops already existing that would lobby for them, but that's a practical problem that has nothing to do with their organizational superiority.

On the subject of "socialism," I just think it really depends on what you mean. I try to avoid terms like socialism and capitalism since there have been so many attempts to frame what they are, and they really seem to contradict each other; alongside of that, you naturally never end up getting a real instantiation of any particular theoretical model. In conversations I tend to use the term "socialism" mainly as a moral ideal (as in, in any case where we have to choose between a privately beneficial option and a publicly beneficial one, choose the public even if it means someone's upset that they didn't get what they want), and usually I have to wait for someone to lodge an objection before articulating what I would mean in any given case. I usually end up agreeing with you: non-vital consumer goods are pretty much the only thing I think shouldn't receive any serious public attention. But that's harder said than done. With something like food, there's an easy solution in a place like the US, where there's a huge amount of arable land not being used at any given time; you just institute a program like food stamps, and problem solved. The real difficulties lie in how you'd determine wages, since, if you're not going to have government hands in production and allocation (which is usually where socialist systems mess up), you have to compensate for the fact that you end up leaving compensation up to the companies the government leaves to themselves. Taxing for the purposes of redistribution is a weak answer, since it leaves unaddressed the basic problem that people aren't being paid what they should be up front. It's like saying you know what the problem is and how to bandage it up but you don't want to go the extra mile and just fix it. On the other hand, at least to some extent it enables a greater number of people to have greater freedom of action, so I'm not sure I'd scrap it.

There was some good research on this in the 1930s that really changed the terms of the debates over the merits of capitalism and socialism. After Hayek and von Mises launched their attacks on the efficiency of socialist economies, Oskar Lange and Fred Taylor (and later, ironically, Schumpeter) came to their defense with the idea of market socialism. A lot of the problems reconciling freedom of action with government organized production and allocation were solved then, and the result was that later arguments in favor of capitalism started focusing more on the ethical dilemmas of planned economies (it's when everyone started shouting "but- but-- freedom!" They've never quite gotten over it...). Anyway, there was new ammunition when the Soviet bloc collapsed, but, ironically, I think it's actually made it trickier to find ways to say that socialism is inherently inefficient. There's a good case to be made that the Soviet economies couldn't sustain themselves because they had to increase production beyond what was actually needed by the members of the society in order to compete with the US (which had the advantage of like zero competition for manufactured goods for almost 25 years, and so could grow enormously). (just for anyone reading this - I'm not saying that Soviet style government planning was a good thing by any stretch of the imagination, just that its collapse doesn't prove that socialism is inherently inefficient) As far as I'm concerned, the total and obvious disaster that is neoliberalism says a lot about how efficient capitalism is...

[-] 1 points by STGal5608 (2) 2 years ago

"aims to expose how the richest 1% of people are writing the rules of an unfair global economy that is foreclosing on our future."

Hmmm. Looks like somebody hasn't check the Forbes 400 for 2010 against the Top Charitable donors for 2010. You know, to be apples to apples. Funny how many of those names appear on BOTH those lists.

You're focusing on the wrong people. You aren't going to stop the influence of business over government until you end the political contributions and ability of lobbyists to financially sway politicians on both sides.

MSNBC had a very intersting article on their website about the top 25 CEO bonuses and how many of them are actually ON Wall Street. Turns out, none of those greedy bankers even cracked the top ten! But that Ralph Lauren, he sure turned a sweet dime!

I get that none of the above will register with some of those in this movement who are so consumed with hating the rich, and big business, and Wall Street, and that's your right.

But when you persist on pitting Americans against each other, and villifying that 1% (many of whom make HUGE charitable donations every single year, along with all the corporations who do as well) while also demanding that they part with money they've so greedily kept to themselves, I can only assume the goal is not to change the gap in inequality towards the upper end and bring UP those Americans who are suffering, but to cripple our economy to the point that we are ALL suffering.

My two cents - you need to OccupyCongress. Now. Before you get co-opted by whichever candidate wants to run on a platform that will ultimately create and even worse jobs, housing, and financial situation than we are currently in.

Shouldn't now be the time that we come together? Shouldn't now be the time that we look at what IS working, that we focus on those in the 1% who DO contribute in many areas of society?

Or do we continue to bully and degrade people to shame them into something that many of them are already doing?

I'm all for closing tax loopholes for those earning at least $750,000 to $1 million dollars a year and above. But don't cut all the breaks - especially those on charitable contributions. Increase those. Make it even MORE attractive to donate more of your wealth.

But don't think that bullying the business and people who run them will get you what you want. Start at the root. Start with Congressional leadership and eliminate their ability to be swayed by their own greed to increase the inequality in this nation. I see a lot of blame and finger pointing at the businesses, but almost none pointed at those elected officials who ACCEPT the money and promises of jobs and campaign contributions and re-election bids to pass legislation that benefits business.

Also, checking out the Giving Pledge: http://givingpledge.org/

Turns out, a couple of those 1% already THOUGHT they should go ahead and give away a lot of their wealth. So, maybe not ALL of them are the villians they are made out to be. I hadn't seen this mentioned anywhere.

[-] 1 points by planetlove (31) 2 years ago

Do we need a unifying platform? There is so much richness in comments here that gets "lost" by being buried as the running blog responses thread so long and then its on to the next "news" link with its comments space. It might be more for the internet nerds like me who are following this remotely, but could whoever is developing this website think of a "criagslist" type of Occupy page which could serve as a central page for comments by sections like "next steps", "facts and data", etc and perhaps links to all the other cites (US and international). With such an inherently diffuse population (going global baby!) some central portal for thought leadership and repository of great ideas could channelize passion and actions productively. As many note below, we will soon be, if not already, at a point where coalescing actions to sustain momentum will be key, especially as the winter months come. I know the movement is still in formation stage and getting more numbers is crucial, requiring salient messages that resonate, but there may be many on the side lines that aren't sure what to get behind or can't be physically present but we are the 99% and we support you! Thanks again to all those on the front lines and behind the scenes making even this page possible!

[-] 1 points by Moein (18) from Tehran, Tehran 2 years ago

Nice! Occupy Wall Street Gained Support in the Heartland! in our globe

[-] 1 points by GodLovesYOU (2) 2 years ago

Welcome to Obamaville

[-] 1 points by HarryCrew07 (433) 2 years ago

We need a Mod on the Live Stream? Anyone?

[-] 1 points by dankpoet (425) 2 years ago

I've been upset that mods were not proactive enough for sometime. If you're recruiting, I'm your man.

[-] 1 points by nexussailor (1) 2 years ago

Watch this to see how the rich are gaming the financial system! http://www.cbsnews.com/video/watch/?id=6945451n

[-] 1 points by johnjmccarthy (1) 2 years ago

Top 1 % of Americans control Wall Street wealth. Top 000001% control the US Intelligence (?) Community. http://reocities.com/larryjodaniel/21.html and /22.html Here are once top secret US State Department documents, released in 2000, which show blatant disregard for Presidential Directives issued during National Security Council meetings, during wartime. http://johnmccarthy90066.tripod.com/id258.html Is the modus operandi still the same re continuing preemptive wars (war crimes) in Afghanistan and Iraq? Will Iran be soon added to the mix of occupying South Asia? vpocvs@gmail.com

[-] 1 points by mexicael (23) 2 years ago

Good vibe for you from Montreal http://youtu.be/_DiKP5pxPlU

[-] 1 points by walipro1 (2) 2 years ago

The people must stop voting for the same ones in government. If you are one of the people that say it's not the one I'm voting for doing it, your wrong. It's time for term limits. Some of them have been in office for years and have become very rich supposedly representing you. All the way down to the state level.

[-] 1 points by walipro1 (2) 2 years ago

The people must stop voting for the same ones in government. If you are one of the people that say it's not the one I'm voting for doing it, your wrong. It's time for term limits. Some of them have been in office for years and have become very rich supposedly representing you. All the way down to the state level.

[-] 1 points by anonalien (77) 2 years ago

i think you'd have an even more powerful impact if you had "EDUCATE" or "FACTS" sub-page that features articles and stats and links to other pages that provide info/updates or those that lecture about our current economic situation. such as that of Prof. Richard Wolff or "The Economic Collapse". I am tired of having to explain to ppl over and over what is wrong with their country.

[-] 1 points by kathieb (65) 2 years ago

anonalien - I agree and I sit in at the OWS info desk (evenings since I work!). I use facts to back up my belief this is long overdue. I also don't want to change the system - I want to clean it up!!! ;-)

[-] 1 points by EndTheFedNow (692) 2 years ago

Well done fellow humans and thanks to the peeps who got this ball rolling.

YAY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[-] 1 points by sufinaga (513) 2 years ago

one exciting month. but the winter snows will soon be upon us. solidarity with Syria and the deaths at police hands. who is controlling our police, who is training and ordering their brutal violence? who is in democratic control of the police? let those who control the police come and talk to us about our PEACEFUL PROTEST.

[-] 1 points by sdcheung (76) 2 years ago

New York sucks at the snow thing...we only get snow in january and february

[-] 1 points by sufinaga (513) 2 years ago

forecast early winter. heavy snow jan feb.

[Removed]

[-] 0 points by Antropos (0) from City of Zagreb, City of Zagreb 2 years ago

What will happen is that the establishment will let you exhaust by protesting and wait until the whole thing starts to dissipate. It's what happened earlier this year in Croatia. The government just ignored the thousands of people on the streets that just - protested. They're not going to let the whole unjust system go down by their own free will persuaded by people protesting. That's one thing that is certain.

[-] 0 points by egbegb (0) 2 years ago

OWS interviewees on Fox,ABC,CBS,NBC,MoveOn,AlterNet,MMFA,DailyKos express ignorance on why housing bubble happened. Why don't any of them have a clue?

If any is intelligent and does have a clue, please enlighten me.

[-] 0 points by quercus (93) 2 years ago

i'm confused how is this site organised? the time is 2255pdt 18/10/11 what are the algorithyms ? the common denominators? the greatest divisors? see below somewhere beneath Benny14 15 points 1 day ago

4

[-] 0 points by voiceoffreedom (0) 2 years ago

A) Congress won't like this, but we must ceaselessly, peacefully and in solidarity, call for the overturning of the unconstitutional law which gave corporations the voice equal to that of an individual. Corporate power and bribes = endless power and governing for special interests, the cornerstone of our current woes and the downfall of our Constitution.

B) The police-empowering Patriot Act must be overturned and we need to call for that. http://www.aclu.org/reform-patriot-act see also this to get local community resolutions passed to stop it (and needless police crackdowns on peaceful protestors) http://www.aclu.org/national-security/how-pass-community-resolution

C) ACLU Slams Classified FBI Memorandum Directing Law Enforcement to Engage in Protest Suppression Tactics http://www.aclu.org/national-security/aclu-slams-classified-fbi-memorandum-directing-law-enforcement-engage-protest-supp

This has to be stopped. Please see these links and pass them around. Thank you.

[-] 0 points by voiceoffreedom (0) 2 years ago

A) Congress won't like this, but we must ceaselessly, peacefully and in solidarity, call for the overturning of the unconstitutional law which gave corporations the voice equal to that of an individual. Corporate power and bribes = endless power and governing for special interests, the cornerstone of our current woes and the downfall of our Constitution.

B) The police-empowering Patriot Act must be overturned and we need to call for that. http://www.aclu.org/reform-patriot-act see also this to get local community resolutions passed to stop it (and needless police crackdowns on peaceful protestors) http://www.aclu.org/national-security/how-pass-community-resolution

C) ACLU Slams Classified FBI Memorandum Directing Law Enforcement to Engage in Protest Suppression Tactics http://www.aclu.org/national-security/aclu-slams-classified-fbi-memorandum-directing-law-enforcement-engage-protest-supp

This has to be stopped. Please see these links and pass them around. Thank you.

[-] 0 points by JustDaDamaja (43) 2 years ago

1 Tangible demand- campaign finance reform

[-] 0 points by quercus (93) 2 years ago

i am confused how is this site organised ? what is the algorithym? the lowest common denominator? the common devisor? this is the third time i have ask this question, and seen it buried in the nether zone of Benny14 15 points 1 day ago

[-] 0 points by robertackerlind (0) 2 years ago

justice will happen through peaceful resistance

[-] 0 points by orias12 (24) 2 years ago

Who can ensure morality? How can you be sure those you trust to protect us wont be bought out? What change can we make that wont be marginalized, and then further regulated to prevent significant impact.

What is needed is a completely altruistic change that will redefine our corporations, the fundamental purpose behind businesses, and the role of our government. This chamge will require unity among all americans. It cannot be done without the support of those in power, but those in power are corrupt. This movement will onoy see success though a revolution. I dont believe the American people have the will to fight against the status quo. we, the 99%, are subdued already. Only balking at the weight of our shackles. This movement will not last.

[-] 0 points by quercus (93) 2 years ago

i am confused, how is this site organised? what is the algorthym? the lowest commom denominatator? the common devisior?

[-] 0 points by onepercent (1) 2 years ago

A Tea (and Pizza) Party

Five college students are sitting around on a Friday and decide to order a pizza. The first four get their money together and realize they have only $3.60, which is not enough, as pizzas are $10. “No problem,” says the fifth, “I’ll pay the rest of it.”

The first college student (a math major) thinks about this for a moment and says, “But that’s not fair – you’re only 20% of the group, but you’re paying for 64% of the pizza.”

“No worries,” says the fifth, “My dad literally makes more money than all of your parents combined. It’s really no problem for me. I have tons of disposable income.”

The first four students are in no position to disagree, so they order the $10 pizza.

Half an hour later, when the pizza arrives, the driver takes the $10, pulls out the two smallest pieces of pizza, puts them down in front of the first four students, and then hands the box with the remaining 8 large pieces to the fifth student.

“Wait a minute,” says the first student, “You only paid 64% of the pizza, but you now have 80 or 85% of it!”

“Of course I do,” says the fifth student, “My dad owns the restaurant…”

[-] 0 points by Econundertow (2) 2 years ago

The modern world = crime organizations and frauds:

http://www.economic-undertow.com/2011/10/18/enter-mr-conduit/

How do student loans relate to Greece's bankruptcy? Is Social Security a Ponzi scheme?

[-] 0 points by quercus (93) 2 years ago

i am confused: how is this site organised?

what's the algorithm? the common denominator? the greastest common devisor?

[-] 0 points by Joey11021 (0) 2 years ago

Why are we not outside the White House protesting! That is where it all started! Occupy White House!

[-] 0 points by cLAckcLAckston (1) 2 years ago

Hello Everyone!

My name is cLAckcLAckston, the name originates from a rape group named Strong Arm Steady who likes to say "clack, clack, clack" to represent the blasting sound a gun makes when it is shot. So, I found the name appropriate for my cause, I believe change may only occur when people are ready to fight for what they believe. I do not indorse violence and the comparison is only symbolic at this point. I capitalized the LA in my name to represent where I come from. My views are positively aligned with that of OWS and I believe that I can be of much help to the movement. I am excited to see people getting together to fight the system that is destroying America. I patriot, but I do not support our current government. The people have lost their power and its time we get it back!

[-] 0 points by jhenig (0) 2 years ago

I can't help it!!!!

OWS mission (taken from their website) is to protest against bank bailouts, corporate greed, and the unchecked power of Wall Street in Washington.

1.) The banks paid back bailout funding IN FULL WITH INTEREST. Did GM? Chrysler? Fannie? Freddie? Nope. 2.) Everyone wants more. The fact that these folks are even protesting makes a statement that they too want more for themselves and less for executives or businesses or seniors or their neighbors or anybody else that has 'greener grass' on their lawns. 3.) Unchecked power of Wall St. in D.C. Agreed!

Now pick up your fannies and go OCCUPY D.C.!! They write the laws that control every industry from the mountains to the prairies to the oceans white with foam! Protest against PACs (Political Action Committees a.k.a. - guns for hire). PACs are who control the politicians who get elected and the laws that the politicians write and pass.

[-] 1 points by legalassistant (164) from New York, NY 2 years ago

Sure the banks paid us back With Our Own Money

  • Taxpayers continue to subsidize the banks in implicit and explicit ways.
  • they are still implicitly covered in the event of another failure (protip: Geithner has said "we may have to do exceptional things again")
  • When the Fed lowers interest rates (they have been zero since 2009), banks immediately increase profit on loans, and the rise in the price of their shares
  • We guarantee their derivatives market. No one in their right mind would actually do that. Needless to say, they make tons of money off that.

Read for god sake! http://dealbook.nytimes.com/2011/06/29/in-u-s-monetary-policy-a-boon-to-banks/

[-] 0 points by bobby (58) from Quincy, CA 2 years ago

Scolos Narbarson's casts eballot for planks on platform

http://usparliament.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=54&t=489

[-] 0 points by bobby (58) from Quincy, CA 2 years ago

8th USA Parliament Day to Day Update:

http://usparliament.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=472&sid=de6a6111c7de4a08337a29e845264d62

NEWS FLASH!

Environmental Minister Dea Riley [Independent], candidate for Lt. Governor of Kentucky in fourteen days on November 1st, 2011, was elected as full minister today.

http://usparliament.org/cab-1.php

I just talked to her on the phone, she said "...please send money".

Her phone number and email address is driley@gatewood.com, 502-395-3159

http://www.gatewood.com/site/?Dea_Riley

She is the only woman candidate in the election, and is running on the Gatewood Galbraith [Independent] ticket.

Vote Counting Minister,

James O. Ogle [Free Parliamentary]

Go BarrOOgle 2012

"Join the Frees, Opposite gender #1!"

[-] 0 points by federico (0) 2 years ago

Greetings from madrid, I am a member of the Economy commission. After 5 months assembleing I can say it clear. M-15 is a FALSE FLAG and I woul bet my moustache that O-15 as well. The administrator of the web "Take the Square" is A MOLE!". We have cought many moles here!! You have the same stupid gestures with hands to applause, deny or to pass to other matter that we learnt here from nobody knows who. Arab springs are also FALSE FLAGS. There is being a massing killing in Lybia by nato troops and the islamistic "rebels". I can give further info to anybody interested at frlobera@hotmail.com, but meanwhile, please do the next. 1- Focus on a very few demands 2- Include a National Bank able to print and issue money instead of the FED swindle. 3- Be aware of what moles are doing a) they will slower any process that leds to an imprtant decision, for example, they call consensus when they mean unanimity. It is not the same! Do not fall into that trap. It is enough 60 or 70% of agreement of the Assambley to approve proposals. b)Its goal is to make noise but not to state important demands that may arise c) Set ONLY one website for people to declare their political proposals, otherwise you won´t be able to count them, keep their email to make future callings. d)Moles will be in charge now of logistics, spokeperson, web administrators 3) Make groups separate from the assembly, work appart and present your proposals among some of you Good luck

[-] 0 points by lemonadegrandma (4) 2 years ago

Well, I see that you people scrub opposing views.

[-] 0 points by nocapitalism (1) 2 years ago

We can use the revolutionary islamic Spring tactic to achieve our ends

[-] 0 points by nocapitalism (1) 2 years ago

obama will down soon!

[-] 0 points by RobD (1) 2 years ago

I'm a TEA Partier; and so, expecting waves of deigration, I won't be back. But I have to say that I agree with much of what you want. You're just going about it all wrong. Advancing Socialism and more freebies aren't the answer. Obama owes more to the wall Street bankers than any other president in history. 1/3 of donations to his campaign warchest in 2011, alone, came from the evil, greedy W.S. tycoons. Who's paying for all this? Doesn't that make you wonder?

[-] 1 points by frayedcat (2) 2 years ago

I believe the premise that OWS is advancing socialism and freebies is incorrect - nor does OWS appear to oppose socialism or freebies.

Asking who pays to circulate information or misinformation in order to influence government is a legitimate question. People should always look into that - it would apply to the sources of financing for TEA Party funds and advocacy groups as well

[-] 1 points by joybasu (23) 2 years ago

i don't think this is about obama or dems-pubs conflict. tea party is about lobbying to get some of the republican candidacy. this movement is not about dems at all, it is about a radical change, about paradigm shift, about REVOLUTION. all can come to this, be you a pub or dem, be you an american or not. only you must support the cause of 99% and against 1%.

[-] 0 points by wrlipscomb (0) 2 years ago

The movement needs to come up with a simple common sense message that can be embraced by a majority of the country both liberal and conservative that will act as a catalyst for further change. My recommendation is that we push for a law to be passed that politicians can only accept donations from register voters that can actually vote for them. These donations should be limited so that no one person or group has undue influence on the politicians. It would be illegal for politicians to accept contributions from corporations, unions, or individuals outside of the region they represent. I think that this would result in politicians being more responsive to their constituents.

[-] 0 points by wrlipscomb (0) 2 years ago

The movement needs to come up with a simple common sense message that can be embraced by a majority of the country both liberal and conservative that will act as a catalyst for further change. My recommendation is that we push for a law to be passed that politicians can only accept donations from register voters that can actually vote for them. These donations should be limited so that no one person or group has undue influence on the politicians. It would be illegal for politicians to accept contributions from corporations, unions, or individuals outside of the region they represent. I think that this would result in politicians being more responsive to their constituents.

[-] 0 points by HarryCrew07 (433) 2 years ago

Does Occupy Wall Street Continue to Stand for Non-Violence?? The Live Feed Would Suggest Otherwise...

[-] 0 points by jet16 (22) 2 years ago

The Message 99% Are Trying To Tell The Public

My political party The American Citizens' Vote has a clear message How to fix Americas problems. This message is very similar to what the 99% want. The 99% wants most of the American citizens to be represented when bills and laws are voted on. The American Citizens' Vote wants the American public to vote on every bill, law, policy and procedure. This way the American public will truly be represented and finally the people in America will be given true Democracy and not the fake Democracy our politicians say we have right now.

The American Citizens' Vote political party The American Citizen’s Vote is different then any other political party because our political candidates do not make their own choices on the bills, laws, and procedures they create or vote for or against. The American citizens chooses the laws, bills, policies, and procedures that our political candidates create or vote for or against. The political candidate running under the American Citizens' Vote party must vote or create policies, laws, procedures, and bills the way majority of the American citizens them him or her to do by their votes to them. The American citizens control our political candidates votes on bills and laws by having American citizens voting on the bills, or laws that represent them the best. Our political party demands that our political candidates follow the opinion of the American citizens even if our political candidates disagree. Finally The American citizens can vote for or against, laws, bills, and policies that affect their daily life. American public Are given the decision to vote on a bill or law and decide if they want to vote for or against the bill or law The American public would have a decision to create and vote for what of bills or laws should be introduced into the House of Representatives The American Citizens Vote political representative will make all of his or her decisions on bills and laws from the votes from the people that live in the state he or she represents The citizens in America will be able to vote on every bill or law concerning America The citizens in America will be able to create their own bills or laws and have them voted on in the House of Representatives Every 4 months American citizens will be able to vote on all types of issues and these votes are given to their The American Citizens Vote political representative The American Citizens' Vote political party will be controlled by the votes of the American public The American people would be able to create and pass bills or laws that stops free trade and outsourcing jobs. That will provide many more new jobs in our country. This will also keep many of the present jobs in our country to stay in America and not to go overseas where workers are paid less. The American Citizens' Vote main purpose is to give the American people a chance to vote and to decide how American politicians run the American government. Our political party is trying to give the American people a chance to control their own government with their own votes for bills, policies, and laws that effects how America government is ran. Our political party is different than other political parties because we want the American peoples' vote to tell our political representative how they should vote for a bill, policy, or law. The American Citizens' Vote is in the process of registering our political party in all 50 states in America. The American Citizens' Vote

Billy Jetland CEO

James Jetland

Website: http://theamericancitizensvote.com

Skype: theamericancitizensvote

Email: thecitizensvote@ymail.com

Phone Number: 702-445-4782

Email: Jetlandjimmy@yahoo.com

Email: Jetlandbill@yahoo.com

[-] 0 points by ConservaLib (8) 2 years ago

Hit them where it hurts. Close your bank accounts and open new accounts in your local Credit Unions. Start a run on the banks. We can bring them to their knees along with the Executive and Legislative Branch and command their attention more than any vote will.

"What Uncle Sam giveth, We the People can TAKETH AWAY!"

[-] 0 points by 1Thinker (0) 2 years ago

ok. so what you are saying is kick obama out since he is paying the owner of the park a bribe for his wind power company to allow the ignorant protestors to stay in a public park. and kick out bloomburg since his whore sits on the board of the company that owns the wind power company and he allows the ignorant to be in the park without permits. yes corruption and bribes are occurring. get real and act like grownups.

[-] 0 points by Justice4all (133) 2 years ago

Guess in a way maybe a sign to us should have been when the bankers instituted their mine, mine, mine plan.

[-] 0 points by Dimitry (10) 2 years ago

Dear friends! It's simple. The Federal Reserve prints dollars. The dollar has replaced gold, and in 1971 became a place of gold in international trade. In ancient times, alchemists tried to make gold in a cup of cheap metal. Modern alchemists print dollars on paper. That's it! U.S. debt is rising faster than spending on health care and education. Why? Cause they print money with the status of gold! If you make a fraudulent $ 100, you will be arrested. But the oligarchs are legally produced and dollars all over the world exchanging them for goods and labor. The extra dollars are exchanged for U.S. government bonds. And bonds are exchanged for new bonds. This is financial pyramid! Sometimes used military force to make another state dependent on U.S. aid. To puppets took credits from the oligarchs Wall Street. Now you all understand? Yes, there's Congress, there is a limit of debt, but it's just words. See the main cause of Wall Street greed! Look! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3TPLLstFfbk

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HOZlUQ2g2EQ&feature=related

[-] 0 points by Architect (5) 2 years ago
  1. Demand that Banks, invest in Every American: Real estate, this would actually create a shortage of homes and demand for construction again which would create jobs #2. Investment to each American to start a small business with the guidance of professionals or for investment’s guided by advisers. 158 Billion from Bush right before he left office-787 billion in the Stimulus from Obama and another purposed 400 billion for the Jobs bill. The people do not see any of the$ benefits because corruption intervenes and organizations, banks,utility companies, oil companies, fake green training, non profit and corporations grabbed the money before it reached the American public. That would save our government more than 360 billion , and if we would have acted on this before the stimulus and Bush bail outs were put into place we would have saved over a trillion dollars.
[-] 2 points by HappyHemper (3) 2 years ago

your math is WAYYYY off here. If there are 310 million people in the usa and you are calling for 1 million each, that's 31 with THIRTEEN zeroes. Count them..... $310,000,000,000,000, 310 TRILLION dollars. I dont know about you, but my back pocket aint that big... where we supposed to get that from?? I used a calculator, what did you use to get your figure? You're citing the billions in payoffs.... yet you're talking about a quick and easy fix that is astronomically high-priced. Unless you truly intended for each american to pay for a home, start a business and pay for 20 years health insurance with one stinkin' dollar.... which i doubt. And I know we have more than 310 people...... Check yer stuff, dude!! If OWS is already having credibility issues, why the HECK would anyone want to spread your post? You'd make them all look like uneducated jackasses!! Which they are most certainly NOT. I appreciate the thought, but you really shoulda thought MORE about it before posting it here.

[-] 1 points by Architect (5) 2 years ago

According to the U.S. Census Bureau, the resident population of the United States, projected to 10/17/11 at 22:01 UTC (EST+5) is 312,441,895 I revised my other numbers,sorry I thought this was an un-official open forum, sorry I offended you,my mistake made out of frustration.

[-] 1 points by HappyHemper (3) 2 years ago

it sounded great till you multiply the 1 million bucks by 310 million people. and 310 trillion, in this case now $312,441,894,000,000... i just dont see it as a viable option. i was a little frustrated too, and took it out on ya, sorry bout that. and it IS an open forum. you didnt offend, you caught me off-guard....

[-] 0 points by leeperry (0) 2 years ago

You have a great number of supporters here in St. James Park, Toronto, Canada. We're full of admiration for what you've started & what you've accomplished so far. Astonishingly intelligent activism at work, word. Here is some more exasperating news that simply confirms what many of us have suspected & been saying all along:

http://dealbook.nytimes.com/2011/10/17/citigroup-earnings-rise-74-to-3-8-billion/?hp

[-] 0 points by jet16 (22) 2 years ago

One thing the American people don't know about Fox News and Rush Limbaugh was supporting Brock Obama to beat Hilary Clinton because they new he was a secret republican. After Brock Obama won the Iowa caucus the republicans on fox new said yes we won. Why would the say that? Bill O'reilly even asked why were all the conservatives angry at Brock Obama. Look what Brock Obama did when he bailed out the banks. He made a health care plan the the republicans wanted in 1998 and Bill Clinton vetoed it. When Brock Obama was president the Democrats had the majority in the Senate and the House of Representatives. While he had the power to make bills and laws to help the middle class and poor live a better life he never tried to. He also never tried to create bills or laws that would decrease the power the wealthiest Americans have over innocent American citizens. He never tried to raise the wealthiest Americans and corporations taxes when he had the power to. Then when the Republican party owned the majority of House of Representatives, Brock Obama allowed them to control the entire government. The Republicans used bulling methods to attack our government, but Bock Obama turned into his old self and became a conman. When the Republicans wanted to Bush’s tax cut and to get rid of the death tax for the wealthy American. Brock Obama said he did not want to give in, but he did it for American citizens. Then when the Republican party want to cut more taxes from the wealthy and cut public programs from the poor and middle class. President Obama said he did not want to give in, but he did it for American citizens. At the end of the day he is a great Republican conman. Now when The republican want their own candidature back into the White House they get help from American Elect. The first question you must ask about America Elect Why do they only want their candidates to run for President of American and not other political offices? Then if you look at one of the leaders in Americas Elect and find out the he was an Aide for Mitt Romney and other Republican politicians then the truth comes out. American Elect does not want to give the public more choices, but they want to take away the votes the democrats would receive from the young people when the presidential elections happen. This way Mitt Romney a Republican candidate would have the best chance of becoming the President of the Untied States of America. Now look at MSNBC they were a conservative news station before they started supporting Brock Obama. Then all of a sudden they became a liberal news station. All they have done was praised Brock Obama and Blamed the Republicans for him not being able to help the middle class and poor people something he promised he would do if he was elected as President of the United states of America. Then President Obama gave billions of dollars to General Electric for creating jobs in America. Instead General Electric created more jobs in China because their workers are paid much less then American workers. Then if you do the research and find out General Electric owns a part of MSNBC. Then it all makes sense. MSNBC will say great things about Brock Obama as long as he provides billions of dollars to General Electric.The American Citizens' Vote

Billy Jetland CEO

James Jetland

Website: http://theamericancitizensvote.com

Skype: theamericancitizensvote

Email: thecitizensvote@ymail.com

Phone Number: 702-445-4782

Email: Jetlandjimmy@yahoo.com

Email: Jetlandbill@yahoo.com

[-] 0 points by jet16 (22) 2 years ago

One thing the American people don't know about Fox News and Rush Limbaugh was supporting Brock Obama to beat Hilary Clinton because they new he was a secret republican. After Brock Obama won the Iowa caucus the republicans on fox new said yes we won. Why would the say that? Bill O'reilly even asked why were all the conservatives angry at Brock Obama. Look what Brock Obama did when he bailed out the banks. He made a health care plan the the republicans wanted in 1998 and Bill Clinton vetoed it. When Brock Obama was president the Democrats had the majority in the Senate and the House of Representatives. While he had the power to make bills and laws to help the middle class and poor live a better life he never tried to. He also never tried to create bills or laws that would decrease the power the wealthiest Americans have over innocent American citizens. He never tried to raise the wealthiest Americans and corporations taxes when he had the power to. Then when the Republican party owned the majority of House of Representatives, Brock Obama allowed them to control the entire government. The Republicans used bulling methods to attack our government, but Bock Obama turned into his old self and became a conman. When the Republicans wanted to Bush’s tax cut and to get rid of the death tax for the wealthy American. Brock Obama said he did not want to give in, but he did it for American citizens. Then when the Republican party want to cut more taxes from the wealthy and cut public programs from the poor and middle class. President Obama said he did not want to give in, but he did it for American citizens. At the end of the day he is a great Republican conman. Now when The republican want their own candidature back into the White House they get help from American Elect. The first question you must ask about America Elect Why do they only want their candidates to run for President of American and not other political offices? Then if you look at one of the leaders in Americas Elect and find out the he was an Aide for Mitt Romney and other Republican politicians then the truth comes out. American Elect does not want to give the public more choices, but they want to take away the votes the democrats would receive from the young people when the presidential elections happen. This way Mitt Romney a Republican candidate would have the best chance of becoming the President of the Untied States of America. Now look at MSNBC they were a conservative news station before they started supporting Brock Obama. Then all of a sudden they became a liberal news station. All they have done was praised Brock Obama and Blamed the Republicans for him not being able to help the middle class and poor people something he promised he would do if he was elected as President of the United states of America. Then President Obama gave billions of dollars to General Electric for creating jobs in America. Instead General Electric created more jobs in China because their workers are paid much less then American workers. Then if you do the research and find out General Electric owns a part of MSNBC. Then it all makes sense. MSNBC will say great things about Brock Obama as long as he provides billions of dollars to General Electric.The American Citizens' Vote

Billy Jetland CEO

James Jetland

Website: http://theamericancitizensvote.com

Skype: theamericancitizensvote

Email: thecitizensvote@ymail.com

Phone Number: 702-445-4782

Email: Jetlandjimmy@yahoo.com

Email: Jetlandbill@yahoo.com

[-] 0 points by gdcleanfun (0) 2 years ago

When did Wall Street move to Washington?

[-] 1 points by TedRall (52) from New York, NY 2 years ago

Two weeks ago.

[-] 0 points by outsider1 (0) 2 years ago

Someone needs to call Elizaboth Warren and gauge her interest as she would seem like an ideal person to help give this movement "ligitimate" support. If there is anyone the 1% are afraid of, she is the one.

http://www.vanityfair.com/politics/features/2011/11/elizabeth-warren-201111

[-] 1 points by SwissMiss (2435) from Ann Arbor Charter Township, MI 2 years ago

I think the numbers in NYC and around the world make this legit.

[-] -1 points by Fifty3er (30) from Washington, DC 2 years ago

Riddle me this.... if everything becomes free, then who will produce the free stuff I want or need? If there is no upside reward for taking risk, then who will innovate?

[-] -1 points by Harlan (-1) 2 years ago

The 99percent needs it's own party So we can get the power back. Let's Vote out the dems and GOP. We need Our own candidates ASAP. Move over The two party system. We obviously need A third party. Neither of the current parties Will change things .

[-] -1 points by LloydJHart (190) from Vineyard Haven, MA 2 years ago

OWS Must Engage In Non-violent Civil Disobedient Traffic Blocking Now!

By Lloyd Hart

If OWS does not up the stakes to Non-violent Civil Disobedient Traffic Blocking every week day during the working hours the 1% will simply turn their backs and go about their business of reducing America to a zero benefit, minimum wage economy where the cost of living is kept artificially high by a completely corrupt commodities exchange on Wall St.

It can be seen that OWS has been gathering support to build the confidence to take the next natural step to actually challenge the system to share the nation's wealth more democratically but what will that next step be? Will it be organizing more marches that do nothing other than provide group therapy for the nation's economic victims or will it be a real challenge that the oligarch's truly have to deal with?

To date OWS has been nothing but a cheer leader but now must become a player much like the workers movements of the teens, twenties and thirties of the 20th. century that literally fought to the death to get union locals organized, to create the living wage and the middle class that a lot of the OWS activists were brought into life on.

The only thing OWS has to fear is the fear I see emanating from OWS. The only way you can actually make a difference in this country is to shut down the means of production until the bosses come to the table and engage in meaningful negotiations to restructure the economy to distribute it's profits more democratically. Barack Obama has proven this, that elections in America do nothing but maintain oligarch power. So the actual force of change must come from working people in the streets all across America.

With close 50 million living below the poverty line and close 50 million resorting to food banks, OWS should not wait to long to make this decision as OWS will be swept aside by a much larger, much angrier workers movement that will have no patience for OWS's learning curve.

OWS Must Engage In Non-violent Civil Disobedient Traffic Blocking Now! http://occupywallst.org/forum/ows-must-engage-non-violent-civil-disobedient-traf/

All my love and support is yours. Lloyd J Hart 508-687-9153

Guidelines For Non-violent Civil Disobedient Traffic Blocking.

Never plan where and at what time you will do an action. Create groups of ten to twenty or more activists and have each group elect a coordinator who will pick a time and location for an action and only announce the action moments before it occurs. While waiting for the coordinator to declare an action the group can choose a flash mob approach and receive a text of the time and location allowing the group to disperse locally before the action or the group can just picket on the side walk with the coordinator before the action is called. This approach prevents undercover police from knowing exactly where and when the action will take place. Once the action begins it will also take time for the police to arrive and get organized for the arrests allowing for the greatest impact on the traffic. The more time your are sitting on the pavement the more the traffic will be snarled.

Do not lock arms or go limp when the police begin the arrests. When police reach down to make the physical arrest give them your arms and let them help you up and walk with them to the paddy wagon. This approach allows less injuries to occur to the activists and the police. It is also important that the coordinator does not participate in the action so that he or she can let the police commander on the scene of the action know how the activists are physically prepared to be arrested. This will put the police at ease knowing they will not have risk injury in the arrests.

When doing an action do not step out into speeding traffic. Wait for a lull in the flow of traffic in the street and then walkout remaining in a standing position until the most immediate cars are halted by your action. Once the traffic has clearly stopped because of your blockage then and only the will the coordinator give the ok to sit down. Safety is of the utmost importance in all these type of actions.

Only activists that know and understand that they may be brought up on actual charges and may have to spend some time in jail should take part in these actions. Always give your name to the police so the legal team that will represent you can find you in the system after the arrest

When doing these actions always keep a smile on your face and good cheer in your heart so the police can see your not angry at them. Your traffic blocking is the general symbol of our collective anger but that does not have to translate to anger between you and the police.

[-] -2 points by USACapitalist (-8) 2 years ago

Truth hurts

[-] -2 points by USACapitalist (-8) 2 years ago

liberals won't discuss this. Just keep erasing my posts

[-] -2 points by USACapitalist (-8) 2 years ago

Why was my post erased I that this was a free country

[-] -2 points by USACapitalist (-8) 2 years ago

I pray that the socialists at OWS go out and get jobs, so they can really contribute something to the greatest country in the world by paying their fair share of taxes.

[-] -2 points by Juggerblot (4) 2 years ago

The Federal Reserve and central banking is the problem!!!!!!! Occupy the Federal Reserve!!!!!!!!!!!

I really think this movement has been hijacked and its quite sad.

The Federal Reserve and central banking is the problem!!!!!!! Occupy the Federal Reserve!!!!!!!!!!!

I really think this movement has been hijacked and its quite sad.

The Federal Reserve and central banking is the problem!!!!!!! Occupy the Federal Reserve!!!!!!!!!!!

I really think this movement has been hijacked and its quite sad.

The Federal Reserve and central banking is the problem!!!!!!! Occupy the Federal Reserve!!!!!!!!!!!

I really think this movement has been hijacked and its quite sad.

The Federal Reserve and central banking is the problem!!!!!!! Occupy the Federal Reserve!!!!!!!!!!!

I really think this movement has been hijacked and its quite sad.

The Federal Reserve and central banking is the problem!!!!!!! Occupy the Federal Reserve!!!!!!!!!!!

I really think this movement has been hijacked and its quite sad.

The Federal Reserve and central banking is the problem!!!!!!! Occupy the Federal Reserve!!!!!!!!!!!

I really think this movement has been hijacked and its quite sad.

The Federal Reserve and central banking is the problem!!!!!!! Occupy the Federal Reserve!!!!!!!!!!!

I really think this movement has been hijacked and its quite sad.

The Federal Reserve and central banking is the problem!!!!!!! Occupy the Federal Reserve!!!!!!!!!!!

I really think this movement has been hijacked and its quite sad.

The Federal Reserve and central banking is the problem!!!!!!! Occupy the Federal Reserve!!!!!!!!!!!

I really think this movement has been hijacked and its quite sad.

The Federal Reserve and central banking is the problem!!!!!!! Occupy the Federal Reserve!!!!!!!!!!!

I really think this movement has been hijacked and its quite sad.

The Federal Reserve and central banking is the problem!!!!!!! Occupy the Federal Reserve!!!!!!!!!!!

I really think this movement has been hijacked and its quite sad.

The Federal Reserve and central banking is the problem!!!!!!! Occupy the Federal Reserve!!!!!!!!!!!

I really think this movement has been hijacked and its quite sad.

The Federal Reserve and central banking is the problem!!!!!!! Occupy the Federal Reserve!!!!!!!!!!!

I really think this movement has been hijacked and its quite sad.

[-] 1 points by dankpoet (425) 2 years ago

Hijacked by trolls you can't simply state their point but have to write annoying repetitive posts like this one.

[-] 1 points by EducImm (11) 2 years ago

Hijacked by whom? It founders who wanted to focus on wall street? If you want to occupy the fed that's fine and I may make an argument to support your point, but to say the movement is hijacked because they're not focusing solely on what YOU think is the fundamental problem is not really fair..don't you think?

[-] 0 points by SwissMiss (2435) from Ann Arbor Charter Township, MI 2 years ago

agreed

[-] 0 points by SwissMiss (2435) from Ann Arbor Charter Township, MI 2 years ago

Doesn't the government have to cut ties with the Fed before we can get rid of it?

[-] -3 points by daverao (124) 2 years ago

It seems to be good news to hear. Did we accomplish any thing positive?. We do not have one solid demand. Sitting at wall street does not accomplish any thing. Last week wall street had good gains. 1% got more and also most of the other 99%. I am always saying that we should concentrate on congress and focus on DC. Things can change if we pressure current govt. Obama promised us the change and I believe he can do it if we knock his door. We are wasting time. We wasted 30 days and lot of resources.

[-] 2 points by zarathustra (18) from Orrington, ME 2 years ago

Demands are for politicians - OWS shows Washington, Wall Street, and the world that the American public is sick and tired of being a commodity and are willing to stand together to be recognized as people. The "demands" will come as it naturally progresses. Stay strong, we are the next generation and it's our time to reclaim our precious country.

[-] 2 points by tsdevi (307) 2 years ago

thus spoke zarathustra

[-] 1 points by zarathustra (18) from Orrington, ME 2 years ago

=)

that he did

[-] 0 points by daverao (124) 2 years ago

In this era, people do not have patience and the time lost never come back. Once the wall street goes up, we 99% will also become greedy. I do not want this movement to fail. The world already makes fun of USA, China India are already skimming us and we sit and do nothing, they will suck us bone dry. Then this protest will be inrelavent.

[-] 0 points by EducImm (11) 2 years ago

The convo is no longer about deficit redux which is an ideological battle that the right has made its purpose. Although a fiscally sound nation is preferred, putting people to work and make sure we all get what we work for is way more fundamental. You can fiscally sound and have injustice and you will end up with what we have today..revolution

[-] 0 points by GarnetMoon (424) 2 years ago

There IS a solid demand... End the rule of the global financial criminal class. It was there from day one.

Are you serious about "knocking on his door"? "Pressure the govt"? This guy is the recipient of the most Wall st money... It's a good thing that slaves took things into their own hands and demanded their emancipation. It is also good that women took things into their own hands in order to gain the right to vote. It is good that workers rose up in the early part of the twentieth century to demand better working conditions and higher wages, etc. It is also good that African Americans took things into their own hands to demand civil rights. as well as all the people that demonstrated for and end to the Vietnam war.

Real change has never come from the top down or from "pressure"

We are on the right side of history.

[-] 0 points by CoalHousePoiccard (2) 2 years ago

Hey everyone! Here is a reflection of a guy named Peter Gelderloss entitled: "Reflections for the US Occupy Movement". There are some powerful insights on this text, based on the Barcelona's "Indignados" experience (althought I suppose that you have already discussed many of the issues present there). It covers important issues such as neighborhood organization (and its articulation), how to minimize co-optation, and other important stuff. Maybe those insights will be useful for your own practice in NY and other cities in the U.S. Here is the link: http://www.counterpunch.org/2011/10/14/reflections-for-the-us-occupy-movement/

p.d. I would love to join you there, but I'm a little far away. Here, in Colombia we are in the middle of manifestations to defend public education, raided by neoliberal policy. Greetings and support from there...(and excuse me for my text-book-like english).

[-] 0 points by anonbloom (55) 2 years ago

Gelderloos always nails it. You should check out his book "Anarchy Works" which dives into some of the most frequent objections to anarchism with real world examples of leaderless self-organization and anti-capitalism.

[-] 0 points by GarnetMoon (424) 2 years ago

Bien dicho! Your English is very good!

[-] 0 points by struggleforfreedom80 (6584) 2 years ago

We will win this fight eventually. Keep up the good work!

Chomsky on corporations and the media http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mpd3grtjkK8 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F8fzQ6ZnNu0&feature=related

Chomsky on how to achive social change http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=27gfHU6G-hI http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_cdSoMbwTA4

Chomsky on alternatives to capitalism http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YftlB3AxBws

Yours s http://struggleforfreedom.blogg.no/

[-] 0 points by ARealNewYorker (227) from Brooklyn, NY 2 years ago

I wouldn't say that they were "wasted" at all. The difficulty in seeing what's been accomplished comes from the way we've had to channel our energies, given our general political beliefs and the media we use to organize ourselves. The first is easy to explain: direct democracy is time-consuming (apparently more so without the aid of microphones!).

The second is where it gets complicated, because it's one of the most truly novel things about OWS. The simple fact is, you just can't frame goals effectively on Twitter and Facebook - there's a very limited (in Twitter's case, extremely limited) amount of information that can be conveyed, and that's just not practical if you want to frame what it seems we've all wanted - broad-based institutional change. It's an unfortunate side-effect of social media that you're put immediately in the public eye at the very start of your conversation, and I think we've really made the most of what we can do within those bounds at this point. And this is why demands for demands are constricting, and complaints that we're all over the place with our message are dishonest or just miss the point (I'm not accusing you of complaining about our, um, "dispersed" message). For example, there's a real correlation between complaints about the privatization of natural resources and complaints about campaign financing, but it's not an obvious one, and not one that's framable within the currents of contemporary political conversation.

That's why I agree with CountryGranny below: changing the conversation is huge. We have done that, and, along with it, we've gained a remarkable amount of sympathy (we're currently at 54% according to some polls, up from like 2% back when everyone thought we were smelly hippies having sex on the lawn that Zuccotti Park doesn't have). Considering we talk frequently about socialism, and that was a forbidden word in public debate about two months ago, this is huge.

That said, I do get your complaint - we're getting near a point where we will be wasting time, even if I don't think we did it yet. I think we need to start framing practical goals, even if it takes us a long time to do it. While I do think putting pressure on Congress is a great idea, in the coming month I think more nuanced explanations of how our various demands interconnect should just be published and put out there, and in common language (nothing personal against Zizek, and I thank him for his support, but theoretical language is hardly the language of the average member of the 99%). I don't entirely feel like the site is doing anything like that. It would be a first step towards two things. One, convincing people that are on the fence that there's a real process happening here that they can cooperate with even if it seems on the surface of it that we're doing things they don't like (just for example, most Americans, for good or for ill, identify with "capitalism" - but what they want out of it is something we can (hopefully) offer them, without its detriments, but that needs to be framed so that it's intelligible). And, two, it's a better step toward drawing genuinely interested institutional people into our fold, which is necessary because they're informed about how these processes work in a way that we can't be from the outside (I'm not suggesting that we let them direct our debate; the point of my saying that a more nuanced explanation would be helpful is that it would control the discussion in a way that's amenable to US, and, if they agree, to them).

[-] 1 points by daverao (124) 2 years ago

Great. I was watching msnbc as they cover a lot and I saw Al Sharpton talking about OWS as if he is the spokesman. These politicians are going to hijacking the movement if we do not have agenda and see how we are progressing. That is my biggest fear. It is one in life time chance.

[-] 1 points by ARealNewYorker (227) from Brooklyn, NY 2 years ago

It's true, and we have momentum. Also, I think Al Sharpton thinks he's the spokesman for everything he's talking about...

[-] 1 points by SwissMiss (2435) from Ann Arbor Charter Township, MI 2 years ago

He he.... true!