Occupy Chicago Being Dispersed / Arrested By Police Presently
Posted 12 years ago on Oct. 23, 2011, 2:31 a.m. EST by OccupyWallSt
Right now our sisters and brothers on the ground are in trouble and need your help!
- 15 have been arrested so far
- 120+ are in the process of being arrested tonight
Please show up and help them if possible. They're currently occupying the Federal Reserve Bank - Chicago at 230 S Laselle.
If you can't make it in person, you can do the following:
Please follow:
- Livestream
- www.OccupyChi.org
- Twitter Hashtag #occupychi
- Twitter @occupyt
Please call:
- Chicago Police Department: 312-744-4000
- Mayor's Office: 312-744-5000
- Governer's Office: 312-787-0244
The police told them they could leave and not get arrested. The protesters held the ground in defiance and because what they believed in. The police were proffesional and were doing as ordered. Sadly they had to destroy the bill of rights but the protesters there said the cops were pretty cool and that neither side got violent. So even though they got arrested the occupy movement will get more attention for this. It's more media attention. It sucks the sacrafise the protesters are having to give but this is a battle won for OWS. They will be back and there numbers will be greater. You can't arrest ideas. The ideas are still on the street spreading. Good job Chicago we love you
[Removed]
All it takes for evil to prevail is for good men and women to do nothing
Nice. Lets be bad!!
here is my post. if you want to get the attention of america, if you want to get the attention of wall street, if you want to get the attention of washington, then there is one common thread. hit everyone in the wallet all at once! occupy black friday!! this is the day corporate america waits for in glee because it is profit day! wall street investors wait in glee because based on sales they make a bundle, this is the day washington waits in glee because they profit through wall street in the never ending run for office!! i say occupy black friday! on this day stay home, do not shop for anything for any reason. stay home and teach your children that a homemade gift for your family members is worth more than a gift purchased from overseas by virtual slaves at wal mart!! when we don't shop at walmart, the retailer that supports china does not win. when walmart doesnt win then wall street doesn't win. when wall street doesnt win then the polititions lose. now and only now do theese animals hear the 99%!! occupy black friday!! occupy because you belive that the woman in china working 72 hours a week should be able to feed her children! occupy because the children in pakistan should be in school instead of toiling in a factory for no more than subsistance. occupy for the unemployed americans who have lost their jobs to countries that view their workers as a commodity rather than a golden asset. it all starts and ends here in america. occupy black friday! tell walmart we want american goods made by americans! tell wall street you will not profit by subversing human rights around the world! occupy black friday by telling washington that we are not stupid!! you are bought and paid for and "we aint gonna take it!". occupy black friday, do not shop, teach your children, end the regression of the 99%. occupy black friday!!!!
This is a great idea, but I'd like to expand on your plan a little bit. If you're not going to stay home on black friday, DRIVE SLOWLY, the slower the traffic moves across the country the less money those fuckers can make. Strategically plan your shopping trip for the least amount of driving, buy only what you need, and drive slowly everywhere you go all day.
If we are going to occupy on black friday then we need to make THAT the day everyone sitting at home is waiting for. Occupy the biggest shopping center in every town. Organize these protests to all drop at the same time the morning of black friday in one location in every big city nationwide.
Discuss.
I NEVER EVER shop on black Friday, but I may be motivated enough to get out on the streets and drive around town VERY slowly as to help clog up the streets!!! There is one particular shopping plaza near me where traffic is bad generally, and it's HORRIBLE during the holidays. I think I'll go out there and will keep driving in circles in and out of the parking lot and in front of all the store entrances, acting like I'm lost!!!!
Yes, this is what Ghandi proposed when he was fighting to liberate India from colonial rule: stop working for a day...
here is my post. if you want to get the attention of america, if you want to get the attention of wall street, if you want to get the attention of washington, then there is one common thread. hit everyone in the wallet all at once! occupy black friday!! this is the day corporate america waits for in glee because it is profit day! wall street investors wait in glee because based on sales they make a bundle, this is the day washington waits in glee because they profit through wall street in the never ending run for office!! i say occupy black friday! on this day stay home, do not shop for anything for any reason. stay home and teach your children that a homemade gift for your family members is worth more than a gift purchased from overseas by virtual slaves at wal mart!! when we don't shop at walmart, the retailer that supports china does not win. when walmart doesnt win then wall street doesn't win. when wall street doesnt win then the polititions lose. now and only now do theese animals hear the 99%!! occupy black friday!! occupy because you belive that the woman in china working 72 hours a week should be able to feed her children! occupy because the children in pakistan should be in school instead of toiling in a factory for no more than subsistance. occupy for the unemployed americans who have lost their jobs to countries that view their workers as a commodity rather than a golden asset. it all starts and ends here in america. occupy black friday! tell walmart we want american goods made by americans! tell wall street you will not profit by subversing human rights around the world! occupy black friday by telling washington that we are not stupid!! you are bought and paid for and "we aint gonna take it!". occupy black friday, do not shop, teach your children, end the regression of the 99%. occupy black friday!!!!
all the talk about making corporate bribery illegal will lead to nothing. only taking away the resource of the bribe money will prevent bribes. take away the wealth of 1%, they will never bribe again. a society without private ownership over production system will leave the politicians eager for bribe money out of the political system. there will be no motive and logic for corporate bribing, no givers and takers of bribe. except that, any legalization or 'illegalization' of certain actions only cannot prevent the men at the top of financial power and the men at the top of state power, that is corporates and politicians, from giving and taking bribe. make as many laws you can, they will always find a quasi-legal or illegal way of bribing. and even if they caught red-handed, who will stop the judges from taking bribe and exonerating the victims? big money is not used for personal comforts, it was, is and will be used for power over other people. to cut out the government, as we know it now, completely and to take the power back to people, the only prerequisite is abolition of private wealth. it can only be done in a global margin, because if we continue to have different countries, we also have to have so many governments and armed forces.
the movement of 99% is leaderless, and let it be so. this movement is unprecedented in history, so this is incomparable to other big movements of past. this is FRENCH REVOLUTION of new era. that revolution took the power from feudal land lords to new capitalist lords, but this revolution is about taking the power from capitalists to the workers of all section of whole world. this taking of power will make the 'power' itself unnecessary, because to maintain the power of 1% over 99%, that 1% needs special powers and police and armed forces of all brands. but to maintain the power of 99% no such special powers will be necessary. moreover, after taking away the wealth of 1%, they will be same as rest of 99%, so it will be a society for 100% by100% of 100% at last, where no government , as in the present form and content, will be needed. (am not good in english, as this is not my mother tongue. please ignore mistakes in my language... oh no, on the second thought, don't ignore, please let me know the mistakes, in my language and more importantly, in my content...)... from kolkata, india.
It's crazy to think that all of the 1% are thieves and we should take away all of their wealth. We should focus in on the part of our system that so readily allows for the deception, theft, and bribery of banks, wall street and the government. By doing that you will inevitably find the abusers and then prosecute them to the fullest extent of the law!
Informed Direct Democracy, the process by which the average well informed real public opinion is brought to the attention of all, directly, is now obviously made possible by the internet. Just as we have secure online banking, shopping, chat, forums, libraries, dictionaries, and many other types of large online services and gathering places of opinions and facts, we can have direct voting on ISSUES that affect everyone, accompanied by direct FACTUAL open sourced information available to all so we can KNOW what the issues are and how the issues affect people. The idea that most people are incapable of making direct decisions in their communities, governments, and international affairs because of lack of abilities, information, and lack of a practical method, is no longer tolerable. Most people on Earth, are perfectly capable of making sound decisions about any political, environmental, social issue, IF the people are provided with factual free open sourced information about the issues. Most people have enough common sense and reasoning abilities to understand and reach very reasonable solutions to all the issues we, the people of Earth, face today on local levels as well as global levels. Having poor education, as the 1% have turned our public education system into their consumer-worker brainwashing, is not the same as being stupid; and being trusting, as most people are, is not the same as being gullible, and is a virtue, not a weakness to be exploited by the greedy 1%. Most people should trust each other to share control over society together, not give up our liberties to a system of greed made by the 1% that's causing famine, wars financial desperation, poor education, and the destruction of our planet, all for MORE PROFIT FOR THE 1%. The internet already offers EVERYTHING that is needed to have Informed Direct Democratic voting on issues everywhere. All that is needed is for people to organize a system. This system should be started by the 99% Occupy International Movement right NOW, while there is still time. In a few short years, the PEOPLE OF EARTH could be voting on local politics and local issues, and on issues that affect their country, and global issues that affect everyone. Let's not allow the 1% to make us out to be a petty and shallow and selfish and cowardly poor VS rich movement. It's not about taking down rich people, it's about taking down GREED itself; most rich people have the same capacity for being reasonable as most poor people do. A real economic recovery is not accomplished by restoring the health of the financial institutions, because they measure their recovery in profit; we need to eliminate GREED from the financial system, because too-big-to-fail corporations reporting record profits does not equal healthy fair economy. The people can come up with MUCH better solutions together online NOW! It's time to stop handing over our control and trusting our representatives to make policies that reflect the will of the people, which they never do. We now have a system of greed running all governments and societies on Earth. Having the ability to vote AND BE INFORMED WITH THE FACTS about the issues directly as a people can FORCE our corrupt and greedy leaders to make the will of the people a reality. After all, in a Democratic society, the government's job is simply to administrate the process by which the will of the people is formulated into a body of laws and policies, which MOST people agree with, and then protect the peoples' rights to have such a Democracy. The government is sort of the secretary and the bodyguard of the people, not the authority for the people to be forced to follow even when most people disagree with its policies and decisions. In a true Democracy, the PEOPLE are the authority of the government. MOST PEOPLE ARE REASONABLE, give most people the power of direct voting on issues, and we will have very REASONABLE policies, everywhere. Remember, the key is the FREE OPEN SOURCED INFORMATION (kind of like wikipedia) accompanying the voting sites on the internet. So when reporters come to ask protesters on the streets what we are protesting for, what do we want, what are your demands (as if we were robbing a bank or something) we can say: "WE THE PEOPLE OF EARTH DEMAND DIRECT INFORMED DEMOCRACY ENABLED BY OUR CURRENT COMMUNICATIONS TECHNOLOGY, WE DEMAND VOTING ON ISSUES THAT AFFECT PEOPLE DIRECTLY THROUGH THE INTERNET AND WE DEMAND THAT WE HAVE AN OFFICIAL OPEN SOURCED ONLINE LIBRARY OF FACTS ABOUT ALL THE ISSUES WE ARE VOTING FOR."
U.S. News - Chicago prepares for G8 and NATO summits
CHICAGO, Feb. 16 (UPI) -- Chicago police are preparing for the Group of Eight and NATO summit conferences the city will host in the spring, city officials said.
If these police officers knew the crap that Wall Street has put in their pension plans, they would be protesting with OWS.
Follow the police, gently plead with them to help us. It's not illegal to talk with them! Encourage them to leak docs and info. about these crackdowns.
Even if it doesn't work, their superiors will be less likely to send them into action against protesters like this!!
I'm sorry but i don't feel sorry for Occupy Chicago. Inviting an extremely polarizing, divisive (and clearly anti-American) figure such as Bill Ayers made me lose what respect i had for them.
I'm sorry but i don't feel sorry for Occupy Chicago. Inviting an extremely polarizing, divisive (and clearly anti-American) figure such as Bill Ayers made me lose what respect i had for them.
oops, never mind.
something wrong here. i posted a a blog earlier but don't see it? no one would remove it, right?
take america back from the corporate coup! YOU GO GUYS!! TAKE BACK AMERICA, TAKE BACK AMERICA, TAKE BACK AMERICA!!!
why, won't it post or just don't like caps?
Jones Group Inc
The New York Times recently ran an article with evidence that China sold nuclear weapons to countries in the Middle East.(http://www.nytimes.com/1991/06/10/world/china-said-to-plan-new-arms-sales-us-is-concerned.html ) Western diplomats and other experts are increasingly expressing concern over China's actions. Despite this, Americans still overlook the critical problem with China. Unlike America and many other world powers, China embraces communism. This system of government is fundamentally opposed to the democratic ideals espoused in America.
While it is each country's right to self-govern, it is important that Americans understand the dire consequences if China continues to thrive and exert power the way it has in recent years. A world dominated by Chinese interests will signify a loss of liberty for everyone, especially Americans.
Therefore, it is up to Americans to protect our freedoms. It is our social responsibility to stop supporting companies that outsource work to China. Companies such as the Robert Rodriguez Design Collection, the Jones Group Inc., have all outsourced to China, pouring millions of dollars into that economy. The Chinese government, in turn uses eighty percent of that profit and reinvests it into military growth. If Americans continue to patronize these companies, we are ultimately funding our own destruction.
The New York Towers are just a reminder of what further destruction could be incurred if China is allowed to flourish and provide missiles to countries that oppose us. It is time for Americans to take social responsibility and stop supporting companies that undermine America before it is too late.
Democratic workplace? That will work fine as long as everyone is equally motivated and able. Unfortunately, that isn't the case.
The arrest of the protesters implies that you have won and need to motivate others to join the protest.They arrest the Chicago people because as they proved unable to contain the legal protest in New York that is why they want themselves to focus attention only on the new yorkers not on the other cities.They are afraid of growing popularity of the peoples protests.
I sent this email to the City of Chicago mayor:
Stop detentions of Occupy Chicago demonstrators
This is one of the biggest shows of public outrage in decades and these people represent hundreds of thousands across the world who stand with the protesters and the movement for real democracy.
The protesters are cleaning up the park, keeping it clean and safe
We have a constitutional right to protest.
Thank you Marco Silva
All we want is fair pay & decent living conditions. If the 1% aren't willing to allow us to even have that small thing, then yeah, it's definitely time for class warfare. I won't shut up. And neither should any of you!
Maybe if an organized OWS had tried to get police on their side from the beginning this woud not have happened. They are unionized and OWS didn't try to work with them. Smart!!
Dane Clark "Over It" is a very thought provoking song. Dane is the lead drummer for john mellencamp. This should be the song for our movement. I know i'm OVER IT. Dane Clark "Over It" youtube it guys
I'd like to see the OWS theses statement. That will quell the media spin of "we don't know what they are about and don't know what they want".
In terms of general proposals:
1) Campaign funding reform. 2) An amendment to eliminate greater political influence for corporations over individuals. 3) A level playing field on the tax code and elimination of tax loopholes that prevent corps from paying no taxes. 4) A requirement for corporations to pay into social welfare programs for every U.S. job that is outsourced to a foreign worker. That foreign worker should have responsibility for domestic benefits lost to a U.S. citizen.
etc.
http://market-ticker.org/akcs-www?post=196292
To all Polish political refugees in Chicago and other occupied US cities. Your political refugee status in US must have special meaning.unless you lied about being active in Solidarity movement in Poland. Those who worked for communists already returned to Poland and are the most greedy capitalists exploiting even their family and friends. Now they live in Poland under German economical occupation. Those of us who defeated communism and created the biggest peace dividend in human history will always fight for liberty, justice and freedom from any kind of oppression ( political, religious, economical and other ).When we arrived to our adopted country we believed in human, political and economical values. In the past of 3 decades all of them vanished. 1.US is more racist and hateful than ever ( courtesy of The Ku Klu Fox Hatequarter and Ox Sick on Teen Limbaugh ) 2. Economy have two principles;corporate communism and fascism for middle class. This economical Communo-Fascism produced the Apocalyptic Capitaclism. 3. Political thugs used Wall Street to sell our freedom and delusional dream. Today, like 30 years ago in Poland police use their big boots to push freedom to the ground. Freedom of speech and assembly is the Corporate Governments mortal enemy. They hired gestapo like brainless tools ready to follow the most criminal order, use brutality, terror, hostages, kidnapping in the Communists' and German Nazi style.These monsters are giving bad name to other good and decent police community members. I am asking all the people who were involved in Polish underground resistance and are the only abstract Cold War Soldiers and Victors, to get involved and share their wealth of knowledge in liberating Our Country from the Corporate Fascism. Preparation to the General Strike should be already in progress. The Anti American Hateful Conservative Media - Murdoch Imperialism (RAT RadioActive Terrorists - Limbaugh, Hannity, O'Reilly, Levine, Bortz, and other hoodlum) must be occupied and closed. This is just a beginning. American Children deserve better life and we must do it for our future generation. Otherwise we all will live in The United Concentration Camp. Imagine, the Pizza Co Caine presidential candidate is openly talking about US people living behind electric barbwire. Today Corporate Government promise US people: "Arbeit Macht Frei".- Work makes you free. Hitler did the same when was sending innocent people to the Auschwitz. Any doubt! Enough.
Do Polakow w Stanach;
Pomozcie w zorganizowaniu podziemia w walce o przyszlosc waszych dzieci i wnukow. Nie uzywajcie waszych prawdziwych nazwisk. Tworzcie male grupy. Uzywanie internetu i telefonu jest niewskazane. Spotkania poza domem w miejscach publicznych takich jak park, ulica jest najbardziej bezpieczne. Uwazaj na kamery przy kazdym parkingu, drogach, skrzyzowaniach. Nie uzywaj swojego komputera do pisania planow akcji. W miejscach publicznych komputery sa monitorowane wewnetrznie i zewnetrznie. Uwazaj na kolaborantow, pracownikow sluzby. Unikaj innych grup namawiajacych na akcje terorystyczne, Sa to zazwyczaj pracownicy sluzb. Uzywajcie znajomosc obcych jezykow. wiekszosc z nas zna 3-4 jezyki i nozna je wykozystac. Reszte sami wiecie jesli byliscie w podziemiu. Powodzenia. Czas aby zwrocic waszej nowej ojczyznie dlug. Pseudonim " Zorba "
Political Refugee in US Teachers Solidarity Union Leader from Poland expelled from Poland in 1983
I urge The General Assembly to support the protesters in Chicago and raise bail money for those who are still in jail.
Chicago Mayor Direct Phone Line 312-744-3300
They shouldn't put you in jail, they should put all of you back in school to get an education. Instead of whining and crying about not making money, why don't you make yourself useful to society. Of course, I understand if you don't want to do that either because that takes hard work and dedication- things you you probably need a dictionary to look up. Its easy to see why you have to resort to hissy fits when you don't get your way. How's that working for ya, now?
You are unlearned Mr.thezeropercent instead the one percent who are ruling the 99% are at the most literate but not really educated because which needs a lot of hard work which they do not want to do.
Bring Naomi to the scene and talk about what she predicted in her documentary the end of America. The resistence to Occupy Wall street in every form is confirming what people once insisted was paranoia.
Naomi Klein is a journalist, not a fortune teller and she therefore bases her hypothesis on past history. What Klein coins as "disaster capitalism," has in the past been called war booty...accept the difference in that it is illegal and unethical and contrary to the civilized and democratic society that we humanity has been striving to create for several centuries. Not to mention that statesmen steeling from their own government, essentially, is illegal. This has all been broken down, in an alarmingly short period of time, by a few vane men and women. Those who call it paranoia simply don't want to admit that Rome is burning, or vulnerable to being burned, proverbially.
i heard something about new york saying that there will be no more tents? the city will not them put them up. well listen up!!! under the constitution freedom of speach this is what you have to do? mark each tent with a sign. so it will be a statement of its own. like ( if corporate america had there way this is where you would be sleeping?)
Long Live Working Class Of the World... Long Live The Struggle Of Working Class Of the World....
You do not want to bring down the system that caused the problems..... you simply want it to start benefiting you again!
You really do not care about anything going on outside as long as you have what you need. You don't care that American life is so much more comfortable than 80% of other places in the world. We have it good......really good!
I support the OWS movement and some of their ideas, but for some reason I think its mostly about money and the personal comforts of some spoiled Americans who opted for the easy life and cannot handle the fact that everything crashed down on their heads. Suck it up! Nothing is easy..... When it seems too good to be true then it usually is.
Libya! Now that's a revolution!
Jeez.... you are so wrong and misguided. Please educate yourself.
Dear Shizzle08, Simply because the U.S. is a developed nation and Libya is, by comparison, underdeveloped, hardly means that demonstrations in the developed world are less integral. In fact, they are more integral. Libya will be taking orders from the U.S. now that the "revolution" is "over." The people of Libya will be sucking up whatever is in the alleged interests of the U.S...even if it does not interest the people of the U.S.
No, we will not suck up the dysfunction. It is our duty, it is our history to promote Democracy, not simply for self interest, but because of the basic understanding that what is good for each person must also be good for the community. We have been ten years in the throes of overtly corrupt wars and overtly corrupted politics and these are not acceptable in a Democratic society.
I agree with you on the points you made above....., but I want to know why now? I would appreciate it if you could enlighten me on how this movement is not about self interests? Capitalism and American greed has sunken its roots deeper into our minds than you think. If it was not for money and power we would not even be having protests.
You want to make an impression and change some things? High profile Heads on sticks always seem to get attention and trigger frantic change. This is the language our gov. and corporate executives understand and its the language they use themselves. Its only a matter of time before they find a way to circumvent all your rights, label you as terrorists, and use force to expel all protesters.
Frantic change is not valuable. I don't think that the movement is not about self interest, it is about exactly that, its about the majority of the people admitting that the status quo is not serving them, the majority in whose name wars are fought and debts are incurred and taxes are spent...yes, this is about self interest, but not ONLY about individual interest. One does not have to be selfish to care about their well being, as it is simply tied to the well being of others insofar as how we all survive. The more politically involved people are, the less politicized the world has to be. What is the bane of equality is our economic system that is barely workable anymore. This is why government has become a central figure and it is aiming to hand out scraps to those who are not a well connected as the top 1%...and these demonstrations are about saying NO, we deserve better, we can imagine better and we can implement better.
In America with reference to our culture of greed, selfishness, violence, and hegemonic hedonism, a peaceful revolution will not work. People have been brainwashed their whole lives to think that ideas of socialism "What occupy seems to be about" are the enemy. We are determined to earn what we can by the sweat of our own brow and that is a commendable ideal, but the 1% has taken that away.
Many people attending OWS have scattered ideas, do not have the balls to see a real revolution through, and have no intention on achieving a real revolution.
We Americans were fine when the economy was booming, we kept our mouths shut when we all had jobs, we voiced opinions about issues with no real intentions of solving problems when they arose because our lives were too comfortable to actually change anything. We were lazy, comfortable, and spoiled!
Do you think elites will fold to peaceful demonstrations? NO! That's the beauty of freedom of speech! You have the rights to voice our opinions, which acts as a vent for our frustrations and gives us a false sense of control. The real control was planned when they built our nation with foresight enough to prevent any real revolution in America. Corporate America will not stop simply because we take to the streets in disapproval of their game.
There must be a threat........... A real threat........ Corporate America and gov. kills, exploits, brainwashes, and manipulates us and the world's population to make these riches, SO DO YOU REALLY THINK THEY WILL GIVE IT UP PEACEFULLY?
Why do you think they keep trying to take away our right to bare arms? Because force is the only effective means we have to oppose them.....
Peaceful protest may only work in other countries because the AMERICAN HEGEMON and other western countries assist those protesters in achieving their means...... We cry about human rights, stop trading with those countries, and apply political pressure.
Please tell me where peaceful uprising has succeeded in today's world?
If it gets ugly there will be a civil war in America and none of you have the guts to fight for what you believe in.
Dear Shizzle08, Do you really think that violence against the U.S. government will work? Plus, since you are inciting riot in the form of violence, you are suspect. Stop talking about violence, only those who have not suffered it believe in its value.
Ok perhaps not violence per say, but some seriously threatening mobs of pissed off people seriously posing a threat will at least make it convincing. Merely occupying does not seem to be getting enough attention. We need to take over! Take it back! Not only stand ground, but take ground! They come to arrest they get arrested. They try to blockade, they get blockaded. Take control! As long as we are obeying laws, peacefully occupying, and allowing them to keep control we lose. They have no reason to do anything.
In this way we only get minor concessions and promises to try that will undoubtedly be broken. They will just wait it out until everyone goes home and gives up on this so called "revolution." Look at the protests in Europe! France (a while back), Spain, Greece, Libya, Syria, etc..... Do you remember what images were shown on the news and what language was used to describe those protests? Frantic reporting and strong language describing desperate situations was used because government did or does not have control over the situation! Reports of OWS are like a hippie drum circle. Yeah so fun! Bring the kids! Bring your family out to have a BBQ in the park! Lets protest greed and corruption! Camp out in the city like a bunch of homeless people! That will stop em.........
You are dealing with the most powerful government in the world for crying out loud! You are not even creating even the tiniest concern other than how the presidential candidates can use this so called unrest as a campaign booster! I wish you luck, but I really think you guys are not prepared to see it through to the end.
What would you do if you get overwhelmed by national guard? This will happen soon enough, and we will see if I was right when it does. happen.
I agree with you on the whole, which is why going home is not an option. It is integral to undermine the authority of the status quo, but peacefully. If the U.S. wants to kill people in order to uphold our increasingly corrupted political system, so be it, they are foolish. It is key to reveal the underlying energies of any government and these demonstrations, sustained, are crucial.
tsdevi: Are you on the ground there in NY? You and SwissMiss sound like you know what your talking about. Did you study civil disobedience or something?
More power to you guys! I hope our goals are met. I am an American working in Beijing China now, so its a bummer that OWS started while I am abroad. Its good to know we have people on our side..... we may not all agree on how to get it done, but we definitely agree that it needs to be done........
Thanks for the vote of confidence. I am not in NYC, but in Austin, TX. OWS cannot end. Even if people dissipate, a new crop will have to emerge, so worry not, there is plenty of work to be done!
Stay strong my friends! You are not only standing up for Americans, you are standing up as an example to all oppressive regimes all over the world! Our regime in the USA is cleverly disguised, but this unrest will cause them to show their true colors. Power to the People!
agreed
Please educate me SwissMiss. I am listening......
I promise that I am not a troll. I am simply a person like you with a different opinion and a different idea about how revolution will come about in the United States. I am not an advocate of violence, but do not see an alternative when standing up to a violent unrelenting foe. I think now is not the time that we will change the society the way we need to. However, this is only my opinion. I'm actually torn because I support the protests because I am the 99%, however I do not think we will succeed in this fashion. It will get worse before it gets better....... Good luck OWS!
I do not agree that violence should be used, unless all other avenues have been exhausted. If it came down to the ones in power getting really out of control, then perhaps violence would be necessary..... but it shouldn't be used as a tactic unless that happens. It won't solve anything and will just bring about more chaos.
Some people who've posted on here have said that the best way to start to bring about permanent change is to start working with the local governments in each area. Then, the movement can continue and work its way up to larger governments, until it gets to the federal level. I think this would be a good approach to get real change to happen.
The police in NYC and Boston and other areas being abusive is a problem, but violence should not be used at this time. Violence should only be used as a very last resort.
Do not let anyone say: It has to be Us vs Them.
We are the 99% is genius.
I'm here to tell you, the original tea party is a natural companion.
This movement needs to disavow Obama. Right now.
It's the best chance to grow, and the only chance for change.
It would be better to disavow the office of the Presidency, since far too much time and money and energy is wasted in picking the corporate figurehead.
This is true. Haven't we learned that whether the gov't is left or right, it's not about the interests of the people? At all.
NESARA "National Economic Stabilization and Recovery Act" http://wh.gov/4d5 ...it is time to act now...five minutes can protect your childrens liberties...and yours...
woo hoo!
http://democracyforum.blogspot.com/2011/10/occupy-wall-street-my-idea-of-obama.html
AN ODE TO OCCUPY WALL STREET By Thomas E. Sobon
Rebellious youth cannot you see …What is to be your destiny …You rail against your elder’s ways …Which you'll adopt in later days…From chaos order you would make …Your brother's thirst you'd toil to slake …Corruption you'd not tolerate …And men enslaved you'd liberate
And there's much more that you would do …To gain just ends that you'd pursue …But have you heard of worldly ways …They're like a maze within a maze …The ways of life that you demean …Are variations on a theme …The strong and rich exploit the weak …In ways that often are oblique
And ways in life are mostly fads…Like plain clothes instead of plaids…Though elders each is thought a sage…He's just a child advanced in age…Ideals were meant for saints and gods…Who'd change the world must buck the odds…These odds aren't merely one in ten…They're more like one in ten million
Look back in time and count the men…Who lived among us denizen…And changed the course of history…By more than just a small degree…If you'd not compromise ideals…Nor sell your souls in devilish deals…You're going to have to fight like hell…Rebellious youth, I wish you well
Please repost
Dont listen to tsdevi. I love it!
Is this an homage to Dr. Sues...it is very ageist, since people across generations are motivated to fundamentally change our economic order.
remember this when rahm emmauel is up for re-election. f him
i just called the Springfield ph # and reached Marcus; he is a dedicated young man who is doing everything he can to help people who need help with housing, foreclosures, etc.; he asked me to tell people to call him if you need help! he even gave me his direct line: 217 782-1115
Go Chicago Occupiers!!! Love from Beverly in California
here is the link for Contacting the Illinois Governor's office: http://www2.illinois.gov/gov/pages/contactthegovernor.aspx
phone # is Springfield is: 217-782-0244
phone # in Chicago is: 312-814-2121
call and say you support the Protestors!
Just called. Governers office is disconnected. Mayors Office: Called twice, once I get put on hold and then hung up on. The second time I inquired about why they were being arrested and if there if it ok to go down to protest. She said they were being disorderly and that they weren't arresting them for no reason. She said I should go down. I live in Maryland haha. Anything else I can do to help please let me know.
i just called Governor's office; that phone is disconnected;
i called Mayor's office and reached a PERSON who was taking a poll! she asked me: r u 4 or against the protests! i said FOR -- so everyone should call and say that.
i called CHicago PD and got routed to an endless list of districts to choose from; can someone tell what district is involved where the 130 people were arrested? Bev
typical bullshit from those who control everything
District 1 CPD is 312-745-4290 Gov's Chicago Office is 312-814-2121 Thanks Bev, love from Chicago!
do the folks that got arrested last night in Chicago, need bail posted today? if so how do I post it for some of them?
Kate, thanks we are ok on bail cash. We were told we could bail out 2 people, if we knew who they were. We had received no information on charges, but a sympathetic officer dropped the two names. When we returned with cash (literally after walking outside, immediately getting donations, and walking back in) the desk sergeant had been replaced and the offer was no longer valid!
We have been told the CPD has discretion to wait for a judge to determine bail values, so several of our people may be forced to spend a second night in jail.
There are serious blinders on when the city uses bail law - a deterrent on flight risk - against people who were arrested for trying to stay peacefully in their city.
I would like to hear NYC's thoughts on where Chicago should Occupy. Many folks seem dedicated to setting up a camp and I don't see that a camp is essential to the movement. Please school me.
They do this to protesters instead of focusing on REAL criminals (like themselves).... and people keep wondering why the protests are happening and spread lies about them. Our system is so fucked up.
the organizers are the 1% and they are using you to make big money for themselves- demand your piece of the half a million before the organizers keep it for themselves.
Are the organizers taking a salary out of the money you earned with your protesting and leaving none for you?
You earned the money with your protesting- why do the organizers want to control all of it just like the big banks?
If in the general assembly all of you vote to distribute the money the organizers can't keep it for themselves- they have to give it to you!
What are the organizers doing with the half a million and why aren't they giving any of it to you!!!!!! http://www.nypost.com/p/news/local/manhattan/they_want_lice_of_the_occu_pie_9xKCxcI4aectFYkafMb8UJ
Their is something to be said about that... I heard about this.... The books should be open and transparent. ...and IF the general assembly brings up the question of redistribution... THey darn sure should give all the money they raised to every single protester!
Come on people- if in the General Assembly all of you vote to distribute the money between you- they have to do it! There is over half a million- take your piece of the pie!
In Philly occupiers are allowed to camp with real tents all around City Hall despite it being in the center of tourism. Democracy is Pennsylvania?
social ownership of property( not state ownership of property) combined with direct democracy in workplaces, communities and all over the society with free campaigning from all possible groups and parties about different ideologies and different view points of all and any problem, these will make the concept of government and state redundant. on a free earth, no one will be bound to follow or obey anyone, that will make everyone 'equal' in a sense that none will have special power or privilege over others. and only then everyone will have the scope to be 'unequal' in their very unique ways. only then individuality will have any true meaning. (am not good in english, as this is not my mother tongue. please ignore mistakes in my language... oh no, on the second thought, don't ignore, please let me know the mistakes, in my language and more importantly, in my content...)... from kolkata, india.
WHERE HAVE ALL THE POWER GONE? all power must be with 99%! but why it is no so in the first place? because most of the wealth of this earth is being accumulated by the 1% and all the power with it. take back the wealth from 1% and the power will be with 99%. this is certainly not about changing a couple of laws, this is about changing the law structure itself. this is not about any country or nation, it is about whole world and entire humanity. this can not be done in any country, this have to be done all over the world. soviet union failed for that very reason that it tried to 'implement' it in a single country, which finally gave birth to autocracy and a very mean war machinery, which is against all the basic principles of socialism in general and marxism in specific. and they made it a single-party system, which became the cause of certain downfall of that kind of system. that very notion of 'implementing' socialism in a single country makes china a 'slave labor land'' though all of it started with very good and high intentions. in effect soviet union, china, cuba etc. are models of state controlled capitalism, not of socialism. socialism can not be 'implemented' from above, it can only be made possible from the grass roots, as marx said for time and again. however, with marx or without marx, the social control over all the wealth (not private property like your PC or dining table) of the world is the key to the central problems of the present day world financial crisis, which is threatening to take apart the civilization. private control over wealth can try to survive a crisis only by destroying already achieved productivity, that is by reducing workers and laying off factories, and thus further aggravating the crisis and deteriorating the living standard of the workers. this is in effect takes the humanity on a backward route. social control over wealth only can face the problem of under production, that is the demand being higher than the supply, which it must try to overcome by escalating the production. this is in sharp contrast with the crisis of over production of the present day capitalist system, where supply is more than the demand( in this system 'demand' means purchasing power only, not the real demand). social control over wealth is the way to the ever growing production system, whereas private control over wealth is bound to destroy it's own productivity from time to time for the crisis of over production. realization of this single demand will make the total spectrum of the demands by 99% solvable. otherwise all the demands of us will be just that, demands. no law will make corporates less greedy, or politician leaders less manipulable, ever. however, to achieve this we must protest globally in content but against each of our governments and capitalists nationally in form. don't make it an agitation against US 'imperialism', we must make it a revolution against world capitalism. (am not good in english, as this is not my mother tongue. please ignore mistakes in my language... oh no, on the second thought, don't ignore, please let me know the mistakes, in my language and more importantly, in my content...)... from kolkata, india.
Keep going OWS the elite have been in power far to long and are ruining the world. It's time the 99% have control so we can live in a true democracy.
I'm a huge fan of you guys! in a country where the corporations manipulates all the media, you are doing a great job using the social networks just like in the arab spring!
Here in Brazil, the people are doing the same with the fight against corruption. we're going to make a manifest in November 15. in the Day of Proclamation of the Republic, in all regions of the Country
Keep doing this!!!!
Bernard, just ignore "job4me" (and that goes for all of you). Don´t get into discussions with this guy. Just pretend he doesnt exist. He´s a troll all out of arguments just trying to provoke. Dont respond, dont sink down to his level by namecalling etc. Just ignore all the garbage he writes and simply just vote him down when you see his nick.
That's the truth man! But he's not the worst :)
These trolls are so tiring. It is important to ignore them so we can concentrate on the important debate, not engage in dead ends. Onwards!
Have you been around? Have you done your share a-coming down Of different things that people do
Have you been aware? You got brothers and sisters who care About what's gonna happen to you In a year from now
Maybe I'll be there to shake your hand (Shake your hand) Baby, I'll be there to share the land (Share the land) That they'll be givin' away When we oughta live together I'm talkin' bout together, now
Once upon a time, honest U.S. citizens could purchase (and keep) their homes (see, e.g., Bank of America forecloses on someone without a mortgage).
Once upon a time, honest U.S. citizens could peaceably protest (see the U.S. Constitution).
We cannot (a) live in our own homes or (b) protest the (fraud) foreclosures in this country.
What do we have left?
Once upon a time U.S. citizens lived within their means and didn't purchase things on credit they couldn't afford.
Very true. It was hard even for someone to get credit. The predatory lending these days are a symptom of the problem. Bankers, stock brokers the people we trust with our money rob us quicker than any old western crook ever could
No homeowner would lose their home if the housing market were not crashed. They would simply sell the house.
No homeowner crashed the housing market.
Therefore you cannot blame the homeowner for losing their home.
I can't blame someone who didn't pay their mortgage for getting foreclosed on? Oh right, we're not supposed to take responsibility for ourselves. We're just supposed to sit around until the government takes care of our problems.
And what happens if someone loses their job and then cannot pay their mortgage? Should they be booted out of their house? How about they have the opportunity to find another job within their career field that pays a REAL living wage instead???
You are SO naive.
Your post exposes your basic ignorance and naivete on the subject. Over 60 percent of people who took sub-prime mortgages would have qualified for a traditional mortgage. This was a scam concocted by Wall Street and carried out by unethical realtors and brokers. They targeted minorities. They exploited the ignorance of the buyers, which is highly unethical. There should have been absolute disclosure about what mortgage payments would be, instead of the hidden fees. This was not a crisis imagined or caused by the people and various books have been written confirming the foul play of the real estate and finance industries. Just because it is easy to blame the persons who have the least amount of resources does not make it accurate or valuable critique...in fact it is callow.
Thank you!!
Spot on! I have never heard so many ADULTS not take responsibility for their actions. This is a consumer's economy, it crashes and grows with the population's purchases.
People were buying homes they couldnt afford, upgrading to homes larger than they could afford, leveraging their home equity, taking interest only loans, reverse mortgaging their properties.... When interest rates rose to ease inflation everyone was surprised. "why does it cost more for my house?" "I don't have equity to pull out of my house?"
It's surprising how everyone forgets the contracts they signed, or delegate the responsibility of their financial mistakes on corporate america who made it cheaper for them to borrow.
Who made this legal? Who benefited the most? These are the questions that need to be asked.
yep
Why shouldn't it be legal. They are borrowing strategies that could benefit some people. I do agree that lenders took on risk of providing debt to non-creditworthy people, the lender takes the responsibility by taking losses on that debt.
The borrowers (percentage of the 99 who made unwise decisions with their finances) should take equal responsibility and understand the implicAtions of borrowing more than they could afford.
False: lenders did not take on risk, as they were bailed out. They also lent high risk loans to people WHO WERE CREDIT WORTHY OF TRADITIONAL MORTGAGES- over 60% of them. Unless you want to admit the truth, the facts, then it is not worth discussing the issue because you are irrationally biased. If it was so unwise, why were these mortgages bundles and sold as prime commodities all over the world? Blaming the little guy is a sorry excuse.
Why should it be legal to obfuscate the real cost of a product? Who benefits from not knowing the real price and value of what they purchase? This is a rhetorical question, as your premise is disingenuous. It is disingenuous to claim that ethics do not matter.
Again, it wasn't the act of the masses that caused the housing bubble collapse
These Police are stomping on our rights to protest. Are we in China????
Basically yes. Our economy has been modeled on the Chinese model of slave labor. Look on any college campus in USA where Chinese students are abundant .... these are not the poor of China they are sending here ... these are the status quo, the top 10 percent of a billion and a half of Chinese who can afford to pay cash to got to our most expensive Universities. They HATE occupy Wall Street. Their greed has been fueled by Wall Street and outsourcing of labor to their slave labor economy. Wake up and smell the roses.
they dont have a permit. rather than find a base on private property, they want to overrun a park the city has every right to regulate. hope everyone who shows up is arrested.
Either you are a troll or just plain ignorant Neil. The first amendment states SPECIFICALLY that we have an OBLIGATION ( not just a right) to protest our grievances to our govt through assembly. It also states that POLITICAL protesting on PUBLIC property ( parks, gotv buildings etc) is the HIGHEST and most protected form of free speech. You clearly don't know our constitution. All the idiocy concerning " permits" to protest, and not being allowed after 10 pm -5am is UNCONSTITUTIONAL. Anyone who reads this and disagrees, please look up case law after case law. There is plenty of precedents.Jesus, I think part of the problem in our country is most of us have not been TAUGHT what's IN the constitution.
The Constitution does not place any OBLIGATIONS on the people, it only places obligations (mostly in the form of strong limits) on government. If you don't understand that, I wonder what else you are fuzzy on . . .
According to Jefferson, part of what led up to the grievances clause was what he wrote to his fellow signers:""If a law is unjust, a man is not only right to disobey it, he is obligated to do so." – Thomas Jefferson
If you want to argur about that being in the Constitution and parce meanings, so be it. But please don't bother me any more. You can be on whatever side you choose to be on and I will follow the founding fathers intenttions and words. But don't tell me I am fuzzy on this.
I do want to argue and parse meaning. I think that the belief that the Constitution places obligations on us, or even that it gives us freedom, is at the root of the massive misunderstanding I see writ large on this site.
Have you bothered to read Thomas paine or John stuart Mills, or Jefferson or any other philosophers or founding fathers??? You see, as a philosophy major, I HAVE. Go troll along now.
As a philosophy major, you have yet to answer a direct question that has been put before you. Perhaps it is because you are so very full of yourself, son. You will outgrow it. Among other things, you will learn to identify yourself as something other than your "major".
LIsten you ignorant excuse for a cogent argument, I happen to be 46, a woman and went back to school to get 2 degrees. I mentioned one of my degrees since it is relevant to the argument. You are too foolish to waste my time on. Additionally, most of us on here would wonder why you would bother to be on a site where many of us truly detest what you believe in . Goodbye
And even more electrons have now died to carry your non-response across the ether to our hungry, waiting eyes . . .
You are filled with anger, and "detest" too much. Get over yourself and your "philosophy degree"
Sheesh
Ok Mr. Free markets, you want to play this game and try to lie and claim you are a civil rights attorney who knows the consitution inside and out? go play somewhere else. I am done with you pathetic trolls
By the way, I did not claim I was a "civil rights attorney" - whatever THAT is . .
Troll
YAWN. I will make it REAL simple for your pathetic brain: definition of a civil rights attorney:http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/21134540/vp/45055061#45055061 YOu are not worth any more of my time. Bye Bye
You seem to have a fixation on authority figures. This is a well known attribute of those attracted to the "left": They crave a strong big-daddy government, and ordering society along the lines that they see fit - rather than letting a free people organize themselves. The Constitution was written to be understood - even by a simple physicist like me. The only way to NOT understand it is to read all of your inner fascism into it . . .
blah blah blah....... vomit
you're right, my law degree is worthless. too bad they didn't teach me about the constitution in law school.
Yup. Too bad you are ignorant of the law of the land. Maybe you should sue for redress. Your degree doesn't appear to be worth the cereal box that you got it from.
good for you AAron. I smelled a rat immediately
u mad?
I'm mad as hell and I am not going to take it anymore.
relax. a black man is president. just blame him for everything.
Go post on your klan website.
do you own firearms?
Yes I do that's my right
Obama will lose for our sins
"they dont have a permit. rather than find a base on private property, they want to overrun a park the city has every right to regulate. hope everyone who shows up is arrested" Yea, I would say your law degree is worthless. It doesnt make you a constitutional attorney, and the constitution is only taught one semester. Frankly I think you are full of shit. You passed the bar? Tell me what law school you attended from what years. Since the reason I took philosophy was to pass the bar, I have a few friends that can verify whether you are lying or not. If you can prove you arent lying, you are still one of the bottom feeding attorneys I went to school with who should be barred for incompetence. So: What law school, what years and your full name, otherwise you are full of shit my friend. .
penn. '02-'05. u mad?
look up time/place/manner restrictions and get back to me. every moron with a pulse on here is all of a sudden earl warren when it comes to the constitution.
you people are worse than tea partiers lol
at least we know more than you you pathetic excuse for a human being. Go troll along now loser
I don't play for anything but to win. You should really think about leaving the site as I think it is going to get very embarrassing for you
lol post up your info and i'll post mine, you self important hippo
I never claimed to be anything but what i am. You, on the other hand, have misrepresented yourself fraudulently. That's the difference. that's why I asked you to prove yourself. You won't . You have been "outed" to everyone on this link. I will now cease to respond to you since you have shown your true colors. Its was just a matter of time.
you're gonna toss and turn tonight in bed over this, you're so mad lol
stick to being a homemaker, the grown ups are talking
you are truly pathetic. Actually, I didn't give it another thought until your message popped up . Good try though
yet you're still typing lol
typical emotional woman. i expect you to reply to each of my proddings after refreshing the page every other minute.
Now give your real name so I can confirm it. NO I am not mad. I think you are pathetic frankly and you are either one of two things: a shitty lazy attorney who skipped out of class during that semester, or a liar. I stand by liar as I hate to think you are yet another poor excuse for what should be an adequately trained attorney . Real name please, so I can confirm it over the next few days. Also, On your license you have a number, please include that too. We will see Mr Neil Diamond
face it, lady, someone qualified told you something you didn't like about your precious cause and now you're consumed by anger over some silly discussion on the internet. get a life.
in case i get harassed, post your full name, address and phone number and i'll gladly give you the requested info.
You are exposed. You got my answer. Troll along now, liar
So the constitutional right to assemble, only applies on private, not public property? Any constitutional lawyers out there?
Yes, he is full of shit. Get the book, Hell No, by the center for constitutional law. It spells it out very clearly: The highest form of protected speech is POLITICAL speech/protest on PUBLIC lands. He is a liar. Frankly I wish the moderator will ban him/her for misrepresentation and fraud.
You and I are the only moderators.
any idea how we can complain about these losers or where we can actualy go on a link not full of trolls and plants? Thanks in advance
I think ows has adopted an all are welcome policy. It does bring out the uninformed and the haters but I thought you shot that one down pretty effectively. Don't know offhand of a moderated site.
thankyou, but I don't have any interest in shooting these losers down. I am 46 and don't have the energy to "play games " with these types. Only interested in spending my energy poitively and wisely. Nice to know you though. Do you live in the West coast like me? maybe we can facebook each other. If you can email me (hs4265@aol.com) I will give you my facebook name
Boo Neil you used your freedom of speech to sing rhinestone cowboy shame on you Neil
krack-a-lin rose!
A new law that internet voting should pass next year is that protesters cannot be attacked by police under any circumstances.
This winter we can keep the 99er's message going at:
http://www.americanselect.org/
See ya there! Love never sleeps.
This is going to escalate and we should understand that like the Civil Rights movement of the 50's/60's we are challenging the real power behind their shills in DC and elsewhere. These are the Oligarch wizards behind the curtains of the system and they will not yield us power easily or peacefully.
What is Rahm Immanuel doing in the midst of the social upheaval, he who basically bought his way into public office. He is a perfect example of how money is obviously not the apex of human existence.
Rahm Immanuel is about as corrupt as it get's... He fits in well in Chicago politics.
Ah.
ABOUT F@#*ING TIME! Nice to see that the "Unoccupy Wall Street, throw the worthless rabble in jail" is starting to gain momentum.
Sorry, guys, but the whole your "fight" looks like a poor spectacle: The "arrested" persons stand and wait until the police arrests them -- compare this with Italian or Greece protests. You put forward ambitious goal ("world revolution"), but at the same time You make everything to fail: You distance from politics and avoid collaboration; instead of clear political demands which could be incorporated into law You put forward vague "stop greed and bailouts". You claim that You are against Capitalism as a whole, but at the same time your movement is financed by donations from "capitalist sharks".
Who are You, guys ? Who stands behind You ? Is the only purpose of your OWS is to let the steam out ?
you are a typical nutter as in the real 99% which is the total amount of idiots on planet earth.. first of all and most widespread, your moral thinking: taking something from capitalists is bad because capitalism is bad. ouch! this like a disease infection or something? no just morals. it would only be bad if they can make demands, but if its a donation ... what can u blame?? furthermore ignorance: world revolution and distancing from politics. do you know what a revolution is? it is the destroying of all politics, all relations of social power and making anew - the breaking of the state machinery, otherwise its reformism, not revolution and u dont need a street for it but a ballot box, thats all. its only the logical followup to this stance of self-chosen ignorance and its fitting morals that your brain arrives at conspiracy theories. because you understand nothing, you think there is forces behind everything that you cant see. really you are so typical, not only on this forum but around the world... and its not like only youngsters say this ... this is a matter of being not educated and not wanting to think about things but instead blaming stuff.. really really the wrong path to chose, start to explain things, get knowledge and spread it, stop blaming, get involved with the thinking of people, with the social relations, there is plenty chance to be sorry about many things once you start seeing through. because if one thing is sure as hell: as long as the majority keeps thinking like you there wont be any change at all.. nowhere.
First of all, regarding financial part: now your movement is entirely financed by donations of the "capitalists" (with whom You fight). At this moment You are pretty harmless for "them", so "they" feel empathy to You and give You a charity. But if it will become a real threat for them, do You think anybody will give You a penny ? Your movement will silently disappear because of the lack of resources.
Next, by itself your ideas are very utopic. The ideal society which You advertise is not possible: only ~10% of society are freaks ready to work for idea. And there are only two ways to make the remaining 90% to work: (a) Stimulate with money (but this leads to different forms of capitalism) (b) Force everybody to work in GULAGs (as it was in Russia).
Now in capitalism there are some disproportions, and they can be corrected with what You call reformism. And this is the only way for You to achieve something. If You think that standing in the street and shouting You make revolution, You are too naive and just waste your time. Nobody will let You break the current system and build communism in USA.
We are not against capitalism. Quote from occupychi Mission Statement
“Occupy Chicago is here to fight corporate abuse of American democracy in solidarity with our brothers and sisters around the world.”
1% buys their representation, 99% are left with the scraps.
But if "occupychi" are for the "pure" capitalism, then what's the difference between OWS and tea party ? :-)
I didn't say it was for "pure" capitalism. I don't think it has made any official statement for or against capitalism.
But from the discussions that I have been involved in there, it is really not much of a topic. Corporate abuses, fair and equal representation in government are two big topics. Capitalism is not.
I am not very familiar with the tea party, so I cannot say what the differences are.
I'm proud of all the people who stood their ground, not afraid to get arrested, I know here where I live, their are the negative people who told me this was pointless, and they need to be arrested, I proceeded to tell them why the protestors where doing this, I'm the 99% so of coarse I'm going to defend the protestors to the end.
I don't call going and standing in a park for a few hours once a week standing their ground. If they actually cared they would go back to the park every day until they were allowed to stay.
There is no alternative to admitting that how the dysfunction is untenable, but this is somewhat of a taboo it seems. 99% is a lot of people!
Easy this will not be and unboring that's new speak........
Call, and get all of your friends to call.
nice job, glad you found the right place to occupy
Hmm i wonder how much their fines will be.
OUT WITH FINANCIAL GREED AND CORRUPT POLITICIANS. ’The New WorldOrder’ puts and end to the culture of financial greed and corrupt politicians as we know it today. The power is given back to the people (the members) who decide in permanent referenda on issues that matter to them directly. Also their opinion is asked continuously on the big issues. By compulsory voting the power remains with the members. The movement has its own currency free from speculation, its own bank and a central thought based on equality regardless of sex, race, ancestry or religion. Voting is compulsory for the members so they get involved in society. No longer will the few make decisions for the many. Members will be closely involved in the new democracy in which we go from the I-age to the we-age. The new democracy will keep itself clean and will be fulfilled by the members themselves. Power to the people. Han Peeters Breda, Holland. Author: ‘The New WorldOrder’.
Did they break any laws? Why were they arrested? Are the police committing any crimes themselves? I know that I am being lazy. But, if someone would be kind enough to respond to my questions so that I don't have to do any research on my own.
What does "libertarian left" mean? Libertarians believe in funding for military and police for the purpose of protecting private property. I am not familiar with a leftist variation. The drawback of our current system, which is a combination of socialism, capitalism, corporatism, democracy, plutocracy, and add in any other ideology you'd like, is that all these systems have been tailored to meet the needs of the few. The goal of elitists is to maintain their power and comfort level, even if it means stealing, waging war, gross exploitation and the promotion of ignorance and mindless production and consumption across the economic spectrum. People must be allowed to take ownership of their communities, to understand how the systems and resources they rely on work and how they may best work for communities and for society at large. The prime problem is that work is scant and less and less rewarding, the need for work causes people to be disjointed from their communities because they are expected to move around the country, if not the globe, for their work, which further disjoints them from community. As Elinor Ostrum discovered in her research, industry and government are not the most effective means of providing for the needs of the people...go figure. People need to be willing to communicate and cooperate absent these influences as well as have access to the money that is needed to make transitions possible.
origianally "libertarian" was used mostly by Socialists and anarchists
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RxPUvQZ3rcQ
from wikipedia: The first anarchist journal to use the term “libertarian” was La Libertaire, Journal du Mouvement Socialand it was published in New York City between 1858 and 1861 by french anarcho-communist Joseph Déjacque[28]. "The next recorded use of the term was in Europe, when “libertarian communism” was used at a French regional anarchist Congress at Le Havre (16-22 November, 1880). January the following year saw a French manifesto issued on “Libertarian or Anarchist Communism.” Finally, 1895 saw leading anarchists Sébastien Faure and Louise Michel publish La Libertaire in France."[28]. The word stems from the French word libertaire, and was used to evade the French ban on anarchist publications.[29] In this tradition, the term "libertarianism" in "libertarian socialism" is generally used as a synonym for anarchism, which some say is the original meaning of the term; hence "libertarian socialism" is equivalent to "socialist anarchism" to these scholars.[30][31] In the context of the European socialist movement, libertarian has conventionally been used to describe those who opposed state socialism, such as Mikhail Bakunin. However, the association of socialism with libertarianism predates that of capitalism, and many anti-authoritarians still decry what they see as a mistaken association of capitalism with libertarianism in the United States.[32]
Libertarian left is bottom left on the political compass: http://www.politicalcompass.org/crowdchart.php?showform
thank you.
PRESS RELEASE 10/23/2011
ANNOUNCING, US PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATES TO MEET VIA TELECONFERENCE DEBATE
Four U.S. presidential hopefuls, Libertarian Jim Burns of Nevada, Independent Tina Cook of North Carolina, Green Tea Roseanne Barr of Hawaii and Free Parliamentary James Ogle of California will be recording a "conference call debate" in conjunction with Ernest Hancock's Freedom's Phoenix website on Wednesday, October 26th, 2011.
For more information, please contact Ernest Hancock at 602-717-5900 or visit the website: http://www.freedomsphoenix.com/Front-Page.htm?EdNo=001
Roseanne Barr [Green Tea] for President http://www.facebook.com/pages/Roseanne-Barr-for-President-2012/153524907998543 http://www.RoseanneWorld.com
Jim Burns [Libertarian] for President http://www.jimburnsforpresident.com/
Tina Cook [Independent] for President https://www.facebook.com/pages/Tina-Cook-For-President-2012/218463864831092
James Ogle [Free Parliamentary] for President http://usparliament.org/fpp.php
show up and help? how? beat the police with brooms?
wag their fingers and hiss in unison?
Keep going OWS the elite have been in power far to long and are ruining the world. It's time the 99% have control so we can live in a true democracy.
Hmm. Just checked the major news sites: No mention of this "heroic tragedy". Perhaps your time of irrelevancy is upon you . . .
ABOUT F@#*ING TIME! Nice to see that the "Unoccupy Wall Street, throw the worthless rabble in jail" is starting to gain momentum.
Awesome! Occupy Jail, libtards!
IMPORTANT
ALTERNATIVES TO CAPITALISM: Democratic workplaces and communities. Direct Democracy should be our goal:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vu8J_UKKa-c
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3gUgfyVt3mE
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YDHBvQRyOr0
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YftlB3AxBws
HOW TO ACHIEVE SOCIAL CHANGE
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=27gfHU6G-hI
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_cdSoMbwTA4
CAPITALISM IS PRIVATE TYRANNY
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iqlTyAMVDUk
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mpd3grtjkK8
http://occupywallst.org/forum/replace-capitalism-with-democracy/
good links, thanks!
you´re very welcome. This lecture by Noam Chomsky: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iebK7VVDayY is also very good. I linked to this earlier, but if you missed it here it is! Enjoy
Pure genius. his comments at about 1h07m in are interesting in regards to the Occupy movement.
Important Update: Show Solidarity For Our Arrested Brothers And Sisters
Posted on October 23, 2011 by occupychiadmin
Friends, last night 130 fellow occupiers were taken from us as they defended our rights to assemble and free speech. As of 9:30pm Sunday most of our friends have been released, except for 5 people who have pending bond violations because they had been arrested last Saturday as well. They are being held until they go to bond court tomorrow. Locations & details are here, please try to come down at these times and show some support.
In addition, we are joining National Nurses United to picket the mayor’s office at 10 a.m. Monday (10/24), at City Hall at the LaSalle entrance. Nurse leaders of NNU who set up a nurses’ station to provide basic first aid to Chicago protesters – as NNU has done peacefully in five other cities across the U.S. – were among the some those arrested. We appreciate their service to this movement and stand in solidarity for everyone’s right to practice free speech. We will meet at Jackson & LaSalle to march over at 9am.
Whole humanity is with you.The tyrants are afraid of you.The tyrants are the big fools who shall repent later on for their evil deeds.
I just wish we didn't have politicians in politics. I know that doesn't make sense, but I think you guys know what I mean.
Ron Paul 2012?
I know what you mean:)
oh, btw, DONT support Ron Paul. He wants to give all the power to the corporations and give HUGE tax cuts for the superwealthy. Hes on the far right politically, hes on the side of the finacial elite.
These are excellent excerpts, great posts, as few people are as articulate as Noam Chomsky and we need to be in order to promote the good fight.
Now, what the videos under "Alternatives to Capitalism" are advocating is what`s called "Libertarian Socialism" ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Libertarian_socialism ). As we all now the word "socialism" has gotten a bad rep because of propaganda and misuse (even though it originally ment that workers should be in control of the workplaces), but alternatively these kinds of ideas can also be called "libertarian left". But what is the core of the libertarian left? The core is democracy - democratic workplaces, communities and so on; more direct democracy, more particiaptory democracy. Now, by organizing society in this fasion it will become more egalitarian and many hierarcichal structures will therfore vanish. By looking at statements from this movement and how the movement is structured, it seems to me that the Occupy Movement share a lot of the values of the libertarian left. My guess is that a vast majority of the occupy movement that has spread all over the world is libertarian left, or at least libertarian left-leaning. I just mentioned that the core of libertarian socialism, or the libertarian left, if you will, is democracy - democratic workplaces, communities and so on; more direct democracy, more particiaptory democracy, and that is exactly what you should advocate and strive for. Hope you all agree. Yours S:) Keep up the struggle for freedom
Socialism probably gets a bad rep because it makes life miserable. Who represents the worker in socialism?
in a perfect socialist world that would be a union
It doesn't make life miserable in countries like Sweden, Finland, Norway, etc. Americans REALLY need to learn the TRUE meaning of socialism and what it REALLY is..... instead of imbibing on the right wing propaganda punch all the time.
So what does it REALLY mean then?
worker´s control of production http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K4Tq4VE8eHQ
you´re probably thinking about leninism and stalinism. These systems are awful and has nothing to do with libertarian socialism. In a free decentralized democratic society workers will elect/agree on delegates for representation (where representative democracy is necessary)etc http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vu8J_UKKa-c
It does make me think of Stalin. I agree with the decentralized democracy, but how does socialism come into play? It doesn't seem like an economic system that would work with complete freedom of choice.
Socialism originally meant that workers should be in control of production. The libertarian socialist idea is worth concidering. Libertarian Socialism means democratic control over workplaces an communities by the participants. Real freedom - freedom for people to control thir own lives and work.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vu8J_UKKa-c
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YDHBvQRyOr0
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Libertarian_socialism