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Forum Post: Why so unorganized?

Posted 12 years ago on Nov. 21, 2011, 1:53 a.m. EST by BrickBuilder (14) from Riverside, CA
This content is user submitted and not an official statement

OccupyWallStreet is a mish mash of opinion.

I want them to poll me.

Ask me what I want.

A voice without direction is just noise.

Making noise is just making noise.

What are the issues? Why aren't they asking me?

"I'm mad as hell and I'm not going to take this anymore" Now what? Academy Awards for everyone?

Are we trying to get someone elected? Someone kicked out of office?

Burning off some steam? Too few camping trips, time to put old tents to some long needed use?

Why isn't Occupy Wall Street more organized?

What are the wants? Not toothpaste, donuts, coffe and soup.

WHAT do YOU want? What do WE want?

Poll me! Ask me!

What is the most effective way to get results?

How does one define the message?

Clarify the message.

Questions are not being asked. The right questions are not being asked. Choices are not being given. The message isn't clear. 99% chaos instead of 99% we are _ we want . To achieve _ we want to __ to _.

You must start by asking.

We must stop wasting taxpayers money by breaking things that will need to be repaired, by being unruly requiring a police presence. By not listening and obeying officers requests. CIVIL disobedience.

Have a nice day. ;)

There is a real wealth gap in our country, the rich get richer, the middle class is disappearing, and the poor get poorer. Those are facts.

What do you propose to change that? What laws should be created, what incentives should be created?

Poll me. Give my voice the ability to be heard.

Fold, staple and collate me into a voice that can be heard.

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10 Comments


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[-] 2 points by JProffitt71 (222) from Burlington, VT 12 years ago

I would say that our movement resembles your comment in a way: somewhat disjointed and chaotic but synthesizing along specific sentimentalities. I am too tired to say much but erm, how about me...

I want to change the political system to one that I feel represents me, I want to get rid of the barriers to political office and cut the ties between money and politics as thoroughly as possible. I support organizations like www.BeYourGovernment.org/ towards this end, and am open to anything else I can do to make this closer to the reality.

Once I have a government that represents me, I want change in how society operates. We are very divided, unequal and petty, stuck in a consumerist system that is quickly expending our resources pointlessly. We need more equality, smart limits on the markets that force it to value production and embrace cooperation rather than the hyper-competitive "I've got mine" philosophy.

I want to embrace the absolutely mind blowing technology we have developed in the energy sciences, to at least make moderate efforts towards creating a world where we don't have to worry about where our energy comes from – even simple geothermal would be nice. I want us to begin embracing progress and civilization, and shake loose the conceptions of "dying the richest in the world."

It's a tall order, granted, but I hope OWS can create the foundations for it, that from here, I can begin nudging the world in that direction, and find others who also want to. I am noticing that to be heard, I have to MAKE myself heard, this movement isn't coming to ask me, but asking me to come to it and tell others.

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[-] 1 points by BrickBuilder (14) from Riverside, CA 12 years ago

Organized organizations get results.

OWS will die on the vine unless it gets organized.

Get a clue, see what Martin Luther King Jr. did.

Newt said: They take over a public park they didn’t pay for, they use nearby bathrooms they didn’t pay for to obstruct those who are going to work to pay for the taxes to sustain the bathroom to sustain the park so they can self righteously explain that they are the paragons of virtue to which we owe everything,” Gingrich added.

“That is a pretty good symptom of how much the left has collapsed as a moral system in this country and why you need to reassert something as simple as saying to them, ‘go get a job right after you take a bath,” the former House Speaker said.

Read more: http://www.thestatecolumn.com/articles/newt-gingrich-slams-occupy-wall-street-at-family-forum/#ixzz1eMN6AlDx

Why make him more RIGHT than WRONG?

The 99% should include middle class.

The 99% should include 1% that don't believe the system is fair.

To bring mainstream to the OWS movement you can't be destroying property. You can't be wasting taxpayer money on police to control crowds. You can't be shutting down businesses that wasnt to work and put food on the table.

So...

Identify with polling software what people want.

Attract more 99%.

Have a real agenda.

Have a political solution, work the system.

Your voice is fading because a lack of organization and direction.

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[-] 1 points by occupymission (8) from New York, NY 12 years ago

Vietnam Protest we shut schools across america to fight about the war - We shut down Highways- Roads -This is like a bunch of Bitches screaming and chanting for what - we had 1 purpose and got the pres to bring home soldiers - You guys cant close down some shit Stock Exchange lol -Wake up Kiddies lol --Send food send generators lol what is that crap -You guys need to learn how to Protest Right Youtube Vietnam protest kids

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[-] 1 points by RedJazz43 (2757) 12 years ago

Come to an occupation. Bring your own sign. Write anything you want on it. We're for anything you want. Just say so publicly and join us.

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[-] 1 points by badconduct (550) 12 years ago

It's not the job of the protesters to make change. The protesters tell the people at the top what is wrong, and the people at the top need to make changes to satisfy the protest.

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[-] 1 points by AFarewellToKings (1486) 12 years ago

the occupation of Wall Street is just a warning shot across the bow. TPTB laughed, sipped champagne, and ordered out their security team. King George ignored the protests of colonists too. Remember, they started out as protesters and wound up being Presidents.

https://sites.google.com/site/the99percentdeclaration/

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[-] 1 points by badconduct (550) 12 years ago

King George didn't ignore the colonies, he was too busy fighting France to spend the resources on America. He had to take and couldn't give.

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[-] 1 points by AFarewellToKings (1486) 12 years ago

gee that sounds kinda familiar. Too busy fighting foreign wars eh?

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[-] 1 points by badconduct (550) 12 years ago

No, actually quite the opposite. He was fighting a war at home (Europe) and didn't spend the resources to maintain the North American colonies. Except Canada.

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[-] 1 points by gawdoftruth (3698) from Santa Barbara, CA 12 years ago

the answer to the question is that the astro turfers want a disordered movement which accomplishes nothing but bump their numbers in the election.

The solution to the problem is we have to organize ourselves above all of that, and this is how;

===========

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OPR3GlpQQJA

I have been active here since the very beginning, and since the very beginning I have been trying to make some core points. These points clearly have not been digested or fully understood by the mob, and so I'm going to try to make a further attempt here again.

  1. Merely protesting in the streets will not bring change. In fact merely protesting in the streets is in fact a means to the end of avoiding the real work of a revolution, which consists of the evolutionary solutions, answers, problem solving process, and new political alignment we create.
  2. This forum is absolutely disorganized. It won't be read by most people and it won't and can't function as a core organizational system.
  3. Back at the very start of this, I petitioned the admin to add multiple sub forums and a wiki. Multiple sub forums were promised but have never arrived. I think that this tells us that the intention actually of this forum is message control and containment. The entire purpose really of this forum has always been to keep us spinning in disorganization. We are hanging out on a forum that expressly exists to actually keep us confused and disorganized.
  4. The real work of a revolution isn't going to happen on forums, it needs to happen in a much more organized fashion using collaborative software.
  5. The assorted other details about how to collaborate, how to work open source direct democracy, how to focus in on science instead of isms, how to become hyper rational about this, are details which are essential and crucial, without which we can predict the movement to fail.
  6. Technically speaking we are not 99 percent, we are one tenth of one percent attempting to represent the 99 percent. Our core mission must be to communicate to and with the 99 percent, and get them to join us. This forum will not accomplish that and neither will any of the other main websites.
  7. You can follow other people out to other wikis and other websites, where they will try to get you to get involved with what they want and their program, but frankly speaking, there is no other website and no other operation out there which understands the complexities involved with meaningful organization. In short, everyones being led to get involved here there and everywhere else, scattering the movement in directions which ultimately do not gain us critical mass, criticial momentum, or critical systemic lucidity.
  8. I have managed to get a wiki put up and have already put on that wiki evolutionary details which make it more organized than anything else. I can't do this alone. There are 10 or so wikis now out there, most of which were created in response to my pleas for a wiki, and several of which are in domains owned and operated by some corporation, (wikia, etc) And which we can thus assume will simply be closed, shut down, or deleted if they become useful to the movement.
  9. Probably at least half of the invites you have to go participate at some other site are people who are scamming everyone to waste time and energy, distort the movement, co opt it, and etc. When you walk off into a closet ask yourself how you know that the closet isn't created by some fed, or by some republican, or by some democrat, in order to sway things in their direction.
  10. The only meaningful strategic option we have for real change in this country is to create a new third party, and take every political office in this country.
  11. Once that is done, we can have an article 5 convention. If we have an article 5 convention before getting rid of the oligachs, that just opens the genie from the bottle for them to abuse that process with their corruption and evil.

For these reasons, I beg of you to please immediately join me on the wiki. We need to have all of these details and all of these ideas put together in an organized fashion, rather than posted in a long scrawl which will never be read.

http://occupythiswiki.org/wiki/THE_99%25_POLITICAL_PARTY

http://occupythiswiki.org/wiki/Main_Page

http://www.followthemoney.org/?gclid=CMbY87bB-qsCFUPt7Qod9HE8mQ

http://maplight.org/us-congress/guide/data/money?9gtype=search&9gkw=list%20of%20campaign%20donations&9gad=6213192521.1&9gag=1786513361&gclid=CP61oYbB-qsCFQFZ7AodcTF0jw

http://www.opensecrets.org/

http://occupywallst.org/forum/our-new-wiki/

http://occupywallst.org/forum/non-violence-evolution-by-paradigm-shift/

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