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Forum Post: Was racism the PRIMARY issue ???

Posted 1 year ago on July 15, 2013, 7:55 a.m. EST by bensdad (8977)
This content is user submitted and not an official statement

IMHO - I think not.
I certainly hope a civil suit & a federal case follows,
based on racism or anything else.

BUT, to me, the primary issue is
GUNS & stand your ground

Sadly, legislating away in-bred racism is impossible. Legislating GUN limits is possible.
I do not believe zimmerman would have been carrying a gun w/o stand your ground laws.
These nra purchased - alec written laws must be repealed.

The pro-gun lobby,
the pro-privatization lobby,
the oil lobby,
the bankster lobby
ALL MUST BE STOPPED !

We must sever crapitalism from democracy!

The only way is to vote
Vote for pro-99% electables

HJR29 &
OWS: http://corporationsarenotpeople.webuda.com

73 Comments

73 Comments


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[-] 1 points by MattLHolck (16833) from San Diego, CA 1 year ago

Racism is not the primary issue

shooting people is


napalm burns the little children

all the children of the world

red , and yellow blank and white

they're the same when they ignite

napalm burns the little children of the world


those in power want racism to divide us so they push the racism button

[-] 1 points by WSmith (1429) from Cornelius, OR 1 year ago

Since we failed to override the NRA and regulate guns, let's use Jujitsu and Arm the Blacks!! "The best defense against bad guys is arming the good guys!"

[-] 1 points by BlackRepublic (-33) from East Windsor, CT 1 year ago

Right on. That and getting us some real estate to set up; whatchoo got?

[-] 1 points by WSmith (1429) from Cornelius, OR 1 year ago

Unity.

Look UP at your enemy, not at our neighbors.

It's Class War (1% VS 99%) and we're losing bad.

They have us pitched and armed against each other.

Unite and Win!

[-] -2 points by Theeighthpieceuv8 (-32) from Seven Sisters, Wales 1 year ago

I so agree! See, I knew we'd find common ground.

[-] 1 points by WSmith (1429) from Cornelius, OR 1 year ago

Perhaps even retro SYG posthumously from Trayvon.

[-] -2 points by Theninthpiecesuv8 (-26) 1 year ago

Excellent idea! I see no reason for Africans to run, do you?

[-] 1 points by WSmith (1429) from Cornelius, OR 1 year ago

Trayvon ran in GZ's own words!!

MURDER!!

[Removed]

[-] 0 points by Theninthpiecesuv8 (-26) 1 year ago

I know this is hard for many to grasp but this is a Nation of Law. If we were one people, if we were tribal, there would be no need of law because all would be subject to community censure and possibly even invite evil spirits. But one cannot expect a tribal verdict in a Nation of Law because it's intended to protect the individual from those who would convict simply due to difference.

[-] 0 points by factsrfun (5968) from Phoenix, AZ 1 year ago

I think this is a rare miss on your part bensdad, not that it is really off the mark this is certainly a big part of this story. I like to think back to the OJ verdict when thinking of the Zimmerman result, for a couple of reasons. The first of which I think it helps to reduce the chance of violence if we take as many different ways to look at this as possible. There was a racial component to why this tragic event occurred, the verdict however is common when large defense funds are available as they were here due to the issues you cite above, in the OJ case they came from his personal wealth, here's a link to a few cases that have a theme

http://www.criminaljusticeschools.com/blog/21-celebrities-who-have-killed/

When you consider that 95% of cases are settled with a guilty plea because most folks can't afford legal help but if you can afford it, you get off well it creates a special kind of world.

[-] 0 points by BlackRepublic (-33) from East Windsor, CT 1 year ago

Well, that and the fact that they're guilty and often of far worse. So they very reasonably cop to the lesser.

[-] 0 points by factsrfun (5968) from Phoenix, AZ 1 year ago

Yeah they plea to rape because they are guilty of processing pot, but with the law being what it is, the rape charge is a lighter sentence.

[-] -2 points by bensdad (8977) 1 year ago

I dont disagree with your post , but as you know, I am really pushing for solutions - all of which are difficult to implement.
BUT
most "solutions" are IMPOSSIBLE
I believe that, in today's climate, ending stand your ground is a much more achievable goal than funding public defenders - an almost unknown travesty.

[-] -1 points by factsrfun (5968) from Phoenix, AZ 1 year ago

"stand your ground" is being addressed and I think you're right in that I think some of them may be stopped/repealed

The best system would require all to use "public defenders" that is the only way for real justice in America.

If the people are to be angry I would rather their anger be directed at the true "winners" in this, (the wealthy) as opposed to random people of a different skin tone.

But as I have said before one of the reason I want the wealth inequality to be addressed is that I do not want the rich drug into the street and lynched, I want a peaceful solution.

[-] -1 points by bensdad (8977) 1 year ago

The wealth inequity is "easy" to solve if we can convince OWS
and 20,000,000 - 50,000,000 Americans to support HJR29

[-] -1 points by factsrfun (5968) from Phoenix, AZ 1 year ago

send me a link to that HJR29,

I think this requires a vast communication of a new way of thinking about money and what it really means in society, we have gotten so caught up in winning and losing, our corporate leaders talk about "teamwork" then cut workers pay while raising their own compensation, year after year after year, there is a cumulative effect and it will eventually crush the entire system all over again. But we forget that Monarchy is the normal order of things this people ruling themselves is something pretty new and very well may not last. Indeed within the climate change crisis we see the very end of humanity as we know it.

[-] -1 points by factsrfun (5968) from Phoenix, AZ 1 year ago

here's another way of saying what I said above you might get a smile from it

http://occupywallst.org/forum/money-money-money/

on HJR29 I like it, you know it's near a 50 year process and I think it must be started, but in the mean time I believe the GOP is on life support if only people could see what could be done in maybe as little as ten years

[-] -1 points by bensdad (8977) 1 year ago

My fear of the gop is based no their brilliant efforts to buy our democracy for the last 40 years. Gerrymandering & voter suppression are truly evil

[-] 1 points by TikiJ (-38) 1 year ago

"Gerrymandering & voter suppression are truly evil"

I agree.

http://www.democracynow.org/2012/10/17/green_partys_jill_stein_cheri_honkala

[-] 0 points by factsrfun (5968) from Phoenix, AZ 1 year ago

we got RI http://www.nationalpopularvote.com/pages/states.php?s=RI

This thing is achievable within 4 to 6 years I think and would change things a lot more than some people think, I would love to see this effort get more support:

http://www.nationalpopularvote.com/pages/states.php?s=RI

[-] 0 points by bensdad (8977) 1 year ago

I hear RI just tipped this to 50%

[-] -1 points by factsrfun (5968) from Phoenix, AZ 1 year ago

Yes but it is 50% of the 51% we need, but if you go to their website there is some movement in NY and that would be huge!

[-] 0 points by bensdad (8977) 1 year ago

I don't know how to do it, but D Congresspeople should discuss this in every town all meeting & every constituent communication

[-] -1 points by factsrfun (5968) from Phoenix, AZ 1 year ago

This would be a very important step toward getting a government that is more responsive to the people and less dependent on the system. Any change that can be made that reduces the advantage of gaming the system is one in the right direction. Look at how gerrymandering is making a mockery of the original concept of a people's body, responsive to the people out of fear of standing for election every two years. I know that's different thing it's the concept I'm talking about, anyway, I agree.

[-] 0 points by Narley (295) 1 year ago

The people you speak of support stand-your-ground. According to a national Quinnipiac University poll: "Fifty-three percent of American voters said they support the laws, which came to widespread national attention after the fatal shooting of Florida teenager Trayvon Martin. Activists in Florida and other states have called for a review of the law, which supporters argue has helped lower crime rates. Forty percent of those surveyed oppose the laws..

http://usnews.nbcnews.com/_news/2013/08/02/19831793-majority-of-americans-support-stand-your-ground-laws."

[-] 0 points by bensdad (8977) 1 year ago

Self defense shootings have GROWN since syg

The interviews with the TM jurors made it clear that this is a complex issue that is easy to misunderstand.

Here is how I understand it
If you are confronted by anyone, armed with skittles or not, and if there are no witnesses, you can say you were afraid, pull out a gun, and commit murder.
yeah - I spun this - but is there anything INACCURATE ?

[-] -1 points by DemandTheGoodLifeDotCom (3213) from New York, NY 1 year ago

So black teenagers should have a right to punch adults in the face, break their nose and pummel their head into the sidewalk?

If you defend yourself against the brutal assault of a teenager who is black, you are a racist?

[-] 1 points by MattLHolck (16833) from San Diego, CA 1 year ago

adults should have the right to shot teenagers regardless of their skin color

[-] 1 points by MattLHolck (16833) from San Diego, CA 1 year ago

NO and NO

[-] 1 points by cruisecontrol (-49) 1 year ago

That's what I think the "justice for trayvon" folks are saying. I cannot understand how OWS has become so involved on the wrong side of this situation. Beginning to believe it really has been co opted by the Democratic Party.

How come the full force of the leftist media isn't pushing the daily black on black killings as a great moral issue that needs to be addressed? Well, beyond trying to blame it on guns. Have you noticed the subtle shift from "gang violence" to "gun violence" in media coverage? They take all the guns away and then I guess we will have "gang violence" again?

[-] 0 points by RadBrad (12) 1 year ago

We will never move forward when every time a black man is killed or injured by a non black man and everyone decides to play the race card.

[-] 1 points by gwb (42) 1 year ago

And what would have happened if TM had a gun and a gunfight ensued?
Wait till next time
Do you seriously think Florida black men will not increase their "carries"

[-] 1 points by RadBrad (12) 1 year ago

That's not what I was talking about.

[-] 0 points by WSmith (1429) from Cornelius, OR 1 year ago

You're a damn fool or liar if you really mean that. Off duty documented misanthrope/racist vigilante murders completely innocent black minor ~ Florida PD busted for trying to hide it. Trayvon failed to defend himself from a homicidal vigilante. Never has a PD testified for the defense against the State's Prosecution. Covering Their Asses!!!!! Evil Prevails!!!

[-] -1 points by DemandTheGoodLifeDotCom (3213) from New York, NY 1 year ago

"completely innocent black minor"

So black minors should be allowed to punch adults in the face, break their nose and pummel their head into the sidewalk?

[-] 1 points by WSmith (1429) from Cornelius, OR 1 year ago

Murder in Cold (racist/vigilante/stalker) Blood.

Trayvon had every right to defend himself and rid the planet of that human turd, if only he had been armed, instead.

Attempted ~ botched Sanford PD coverup.

Show (CYA) Trial, with post- and pre- SYG double standards.

Evil Prevails over justice ~ a foregone conclusion.

[-] -2 points by DemandTheGoodLifeDotCom (3213) from New York, NY 1 year ago

Trayvon was defending himself? lol

From what? From zimerman smashing his nose and head against his fist?

Come on. You are blinded by your racism.

[-] -1 points by WSmith (1429) from Cornelius, OR 1 year ago

You live in RW Opposite World: Machiavellian Expediency and Denial, the desired end justifies/purifies any rotten means.

Trayvon was hunted and murdered by the cretinous pathological racist with a gun! And you know it!

Trial Fraud to protect ALEC's SYG divide and conquer law!

[-] -2 points by Veracity777 (-9) 1 year ago

So you were at scene at the time of the assault? 6 women found him not guilty. 6 women who went thru a jury selection process. I presume they were 6 women who were mothers and might be sympathetic to the tragic loss f a teenager.

Justice spoke. You might better serve by taking action vs black on black crime. That's the ongoing tragedy.

[-] 1 points by gwb (42) 1 year ago

one died
one lied

[-] -2 points by Veracity777 (-9) 1 year ago

And you know this how?

[-] 1 points by gwb (42) 1 year ago

just listen to the hannity interview where z said he did not know what syg is

[-] 0 points by WSmith (1429) from Cornelius, OR 1 year ago

This wasn't justice, this was Trial Fraud.

[-] 0 points by Veracity777 (-9) 1 year ago

So you don't care about about the 21 black men killed in Chicago over he long weekend?

Just the one black teen killed in self defense?

How do you sleep? You hate blacks I guess.

[-] -1 points by WSmith (1429) from Cornelius, OR 1 year ago

You're DRUNK on RW (Rush, O'Really, Beck, Hannity) propaganda!!!

[-] -3 points by WSmith (1429) from Cornelius, OR 1 year ago

"OK (Crazy fucking vigilante) we don't need you following this person."

Listen to the tapes!

Off Duty documented profiling vigilante HUNTS a black kid in the dark and shoots him! GUILTY!!! CYA Show Trial!! Justice GAGGED!!!

[-] -2 points by Theeighthpieceuv8 (-32) from Seven Sisters, Wales 1 year ago

Are you saying you believe it is immoral to police one's own neighborhood? Funny because it would seem the Hasidics have been doing it forever; so has Chinatown and our Italian neighborhoods; in fact, they do it in the "hood."

Vigilante by the way does not imply policing; it implies prosecution.

[-] 0 points by WSmith (1429) from Cornelius, OR 1 year ago

Strawman.

Pettifogging.

[-] -2 points by Veracity777 (-9) 1 year ago

So what? The prosecution had an opportunity to lay out a case to a presumably sympathetic jury, a jury the prosecution chose itself and failed to convince that same jury of Zimmermans guilt. Justice was served. Good citizens heard the case and did their civic duty by finding for the EVIDENCE.

[-] 0 points by WSmith (1429) from Cornelius, OR 1 year ago

See below:

"Show (CYA) Trial, with post- and pre- SYG double standards."

[-] -1 points by stevebol (1269) from Milwaukee, WI 1 year ago

Who knows. Over time I find myself spending less time trying to understand Americans.

[-] 2 points by bensdad (8977) 1 year ago

It is simple - look at what TR & FDR did
they put America before crapitalism
it does not require understanding
it requires VOTING

[-] -1 points by TikiJ (-38) 1 year ago

haha... If you want trust busters, I suggest you stop endorsing the group that are in there now.

[-] 1 points by bensdad (8977) 1 year ago

which ELECTABLE trust busters do you endorse?
Here's my list The Best 99%ers

Bernie Sanders
Elizabeth Warren
Alan Grayson
Wendy Davis ( TX )

James Clyburn
Tom Harkin
Al Franken
Tammy Duckworth
Sherrod Brown
Amy Klobuchar Patty Murray
Angus King
Sheldom Whitehouse
Ron Wyden
John Conyers
Donna Edwards
Peter Defazio
John Lewis
Ed Markey
Rick Nolan Mark Pocan

Yes – none are perfect,
but would ANY of their R opponents have done
ANYTHING better than they did? ANYTHING?

Are there ANY electable candidates that you think are better?


Vote for the progressive - anti-corporation - 99% supporters


and support HJR29


OWS: http://corporationsarenotpeople.webuda.com

[-] -2 points by TikiJ (-38) 1 year ago

And I will repeat, if our idea is "not perfect" when talking about poisoning the food of the entire population, then why endorse this system at all?

[-] 3 points by WSmith (1429) from Cornelius, OR 1 year ago

Name ONE THING that's perfect!! Raygun??

[-] -2 points by TikiJ (-38) 1 year ago

Fuck Reagan.

Nothing is perfect, but this level of pathetic-ness is simply inexcusable.

We are suppose to be better than this. Much, much, much better.

[-] 1 points by WSmith (1429) from Cornelius, OR 1 year ago

Never were, never will be, don't let anti-Dem obstructionists control your mind.

[-] -3 points by TikiJ (-38) 1 year ago

Don't let pro Dem campaigns control yours. Those people don't have your best interest at heart. Its run by Wall St, just tailored to a different crowd.

[-] 1 points by bensdad (8977) 1 year ago

I do not endorse systems or generalizations, if you study my post,
I endorse specific people. True, it is easier for the lemmings and pea brains to condemn a system of a type of person or a race or a religion.
Generally, I find that never results in SOLUTIONS

[-] -2 points by TikiJ (-38) 1 year ago

Your solution involves endorsing people who voted AGAINST Bernie and are in favor of Monsanto and poisoning the kids.

Thats a fucked up solution.

[-] 0 points by bensdad (8977) 1 year ago

I will ask you one more time
Do you have the courage to tell you which ELECTABLE
candidates you would vote for
or are you just a standard "negatroll"

[-] -2 points by TikiJ (-38) 1 year ago

Those who are "electable" in this system are sell outs and criminals, as the votes against Bernie prove.

Stop clinging to a dream that was never there to begin with.

[-] -1 points by MattLHolck (16833) from San Diego, CA 1 year ago

weapons merchant and producers

[-] -3 points by georgyz (-16) 1 year ago

Oh Yes. It's all about racism. ...Hispanics hate blacks. They enjoy killing them. Everyone knows that.

[-] 0 points by bensdad (8977) 1 year ago

Hispanics dont hate blacks
blacks dont hate Hispanics
men with small ones love guns

[-] 1 points by gameon (-51) 1 year ago

georgyz was baiting you and you fell for it.

[-] 0 points by AdamSelene (-3) 1 year ago

But small penis jokes are always funny, right? Especially after a murder.

[-] 1 points by gameon (-51) 1 year ago

hilarious,.................what does he have to say about women,........p*nis envy? is that what annie oakley was all about?

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[-] 0 points by cruisecontrol (-49) 1 year ago

Don't you mean white racist men with small ones?

[-] 0 points by Theninthpiecesuv8 (-26) 1 year ago

What's even more disturbing is what this says about the anatomy of many women.

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[+] -5 points by beppe (-87) 1 year ago

Yawn.