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Forum Post: The truth about anarchy.

Posted 2 years ago on Sept. 6, 2012, 1:48 a.m. EST by Proteus (141) from Quebec, QC
This content is user submitted and not an official statement

An anarchist is to capitalism what an antichrist is to Christianity.

People will probably quote me someday for that one.

123 Comments

123 Comments


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[-] 3 points by DKAtoday (22316) from Coon Rapids, MN 2 years ago

ummm probably not.

I mean for one thing the powers that pee already compare anarchy with chaos and that is a patent lie.

[-] 1 points by brightonsage (4494) 2 years ago

Chaos produces anarchy. Apparently its the only thing that actually does.

[-] 2 points by DKAtoday (22316) from Coon Rapids, MN 2 years ago

That would be what the powers that pee and their MSM minions would have us believe - Yep - pretty much.

[-] 1 points by brightonsage (4494) 2 years ago

What we believe should have an incidental relationship to the powers that pee and mine do.

[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (22316) from Coon Rapids, MN 2 years ago

Please explain further. Take your time - I need to get something to eat.

[-] 1 points by brightonsage (4494) 2 years ago

I don't take much stock in the MSM, which is mostly in the pocket of the .01% Is that what you wanted explained? I just had a burrito in a bowl (no tortilla) so take your time.

[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (22316) from Coon Rapids, MN 2 years ago

OK - gotcha - sounds like the general public is finaly coming to the same conclusion.

Beef & cheese green peppers?

[-] 0 points by brightonsage (4494) 2 years ago

Chicken with corn salsa, lettice and tomatoes, & guac. Hopefully, they are starting to get it.

[-] 2 points by DKAtoday (22316) from Coon Rapids, MN 2 years ago

Some one must not like chicken burritos - you got a down vote for it.

[-] 1 points by brightonsage (4494) 2 years ago

It was actually Stegosaurus, but it tasted like chicken. Maybe it was the salsa (it had black beans in it)

[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (22316) from Coon Rapids, MN 2 years ago

In that case they should maybe give you back your point - I mean it wasn't chicken after all. Well you didn't mention the black beans - so maybe it was the corn or guac.

[-] 1 points by brightonsage (4494) 2 years ago

There are some serious antiguac folks. Something about their Green Card?

[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (22316) from Coon Rapids, MN 2 years ago

LOL - illegal guac - I hear it is some sort of problem - the RINO's are concerned - Right?

[-] 1 points by brightonsage (4494) 2 years ago

They are worried sic (sic). Wet back guac. It'll ruin the country.

[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (22316) from Coon Rapids, MN 2 years ago

I think you are supposed to wash your avocado (guac) - huh - RINO's

[-] 0 points by richardkentgates (3269) from Fort Walton Beach, FL 2 years ago

And I would know. I favor chaos. Well, clearer to say, I acknowledge chaos.

[-] 2 points by DKAtoday (22316) from Coon Rapids, MN 2 years ago

Chaos is what happens in a crowded square - when some poor sick individual blows them self up in the middle of it.

[-] 1 points by richardkentgates (3269) from Fort Walton Beach, FL 2 years ago
[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (22316) from Coon Rapids, MN 2 years ago

Yep - I have worked with the chaos theory before - it comes up a lot in promoting/maintaining Quality Assurance in running a business as well as in running/maintaining aspects/pieces of a business.

[-] 1 points by richardkentgates (3269) from Fort Walton Beach, FL 2 years ago

Which in that case, controlling the chaos would be the priority. Think of yourself as a spec in a much larger system that you have no real control over. How could you effect change? By acknowledging the chaos factor, making use of it by creating a vibe so to speak, you become the unknown mechanism effecting on the larger system.

[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (22316) from Coon Rapids, MN 2 years ago

In a sense - all individual specks pieces atoms etc etc etc work on each other - by simply being - and thus come to their own order - just by cause and effect. People government society - interact in somewhat the same way except that the individual pieces can make their own determination of actions/motions/movements/interactions. So this second type of structure can be more chaotic until pieces start working together and that is when a developing flow enters into the picture.

[-] 1 points by richardkentgates (3269) from Fort Walton Beach, FL 2 years ago

We are in an infinite process. We are always in a state of change, therefore there will always be some level of chaos. If you ignore it and are unaware, you are equally effected by the chaos as you are able to effect it. The acknowledgement and utilization of it is one of those "knowledge is power" things.

Just my opinion.

[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (22316) from Coon Rapids, MN 2 years ago

A good insight - one with many adherents. From the smallest sub-atomic particle to the vastness of the galaxy to the multitude of galaxies to the universe - to the multiverse(?) It is all connected.

Random events can disturb - so will be looked for to understand possibilities of effect. One small example : a machinist will study the machine he runs to understand its little variations - random events and what not - to control the process and make good parts/product continuously.

[-] -3 points by Suetorp (-104) 2 years ago

Hyper-Chaos is what happens when a gust of wind blows your perfectly arranged letters to the president out the window and into a passing manure truck.

[-] 4 points by DKAtoday (22316) from Coon Rapids, MN 2 years ago

trashy! U gettin N touch with your female side 2day?

[-] -3 points by Suetorp (-104) 2 years ago

My female side? Explain...

[-] 2 points by DKAtoday (22316) from Coon Rapids, MN 2 years ago

I'm sorry R U not being female 2day? R U being the boy named Sue 2day?

[-] -2 points by Suetorp (-104) 2 years ago

Why do you use 'R' and 'U'. Is it because you are slow-witted? You write like a young teenage girl SMSing her punk boyfriend?

My username directly refers to Proteus, as did all my usernames of the last two days. Why don't you drink a coffee and look at it again after that. Wake up that little brain of yours.

[-] 2 points by DKAtoday (22316) from Coon Rapids, MN 2 years ago

Sorry trashy U R so touchy 2day.

[+] -4 points by Suetorp (-104) 2 years ago

I'm not touchy at all. I just think it's lame that you write like a teenage girl on her cellphone. I hope your letters to the president aren't like that. You need to develop your culture and intelligence so that you can discuss in a proper manner and write like an adult.

[-] 3 points by MattLHolck (16833) from San Diego, CA 2 years ago

I'm pretty sure o matter what I do

you'll tell it's wrong, officer

[-] 2 points by LetsGetReal (1420) from Grants, NM 2 years ago

I love the way you write Matt. I enjoy your simple truths simply stated, and things you write which make me laugh too.

[-] 2 points by Renneye (4141) 2 years ago

You make me lolol Matt!

[-] 2 points by Renneye (4141) 2 years ago

Victoria would have been better. Lame is a juvenile word used only by teenagers. You're withering trashy-Rush'kah.

[-] 2 points by DKAtoday (22316) from Coon Rapids, MN 2 years ago

Eye try not 2 limit my-self. It is helpful 2 B flexible in 1's thinking. Don't U agree? Then 1 does not B-come in-flexible fragile brittle. 1 can then converse/interact on many levels - Hey?

[-] -2 points by Suetorp (-104) 2 years ago

I never found your thinking to be flexible. It's rather dull and grey... every single day.

True flexibility of mind does not come from gimmicks like changing a one to a 1. That's just teenager nonsense which is gratuitous and empty.

[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (22316) from Coon Rapids, MN 2 years ago

That could B B-cause U R so 1 dimensional & stuck in your rut. Kind of - I mean when U R dealing with reality.

[-] -3 points by Suetorp (-104) 2 years ago

Could be. But the chances are that you're simply not very smart. Am I the first to say that you're bland and predictable? The worst offense on this forum is not to troll, it's to be boring and that's something you're guilty of, but not me. In one year, people here will remember Thrasymaque and you'll be a forgotten footnote.

[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (22316) from Coon Rapids, MN 2 years ago

U R such a spoiled child - of "coarse" people will remember U . U do have memorable tantrums.

[-] 0 points by April (3196) 2 years ago

Teenage girl/Prince fan.

[-] 1 points by richardkentgates (3269) from Fort Walton Beach, FL 2 years ago
[-] 2 points by agkaiser (1314) from Fredericksburg, TX 2 years ago

Are you still here? When you leave as promised, you won't be remembered long enough to be quoted 'some day.'

[-] 0 points by Proteus (141) from Quebec, QC 2 years ago

I never "promised" I would leave, you and Odin seems to hate me very much, did I hurt you personally somewhere? No, It's just that I like to correct liars and manipulators. I prefer dealing with Trashy, he's worth both of you taken together, and he tries to understand and apply new stuff to his life, contrary to both of you, maybe it's an age thing, I don't know, what's more, I don't feel hate in him, only a game of extreme pushing. There are a few people here that are trying to copy his troll style, but none trying to copy you two, sheep already got many copies...

Anyway, I said I would quit after my score reached 0, and after trying as hard as I could, I passed from 400 to 100 and can't get lower, probably the rest of my messages are in removed treads so I can't eliminate them. So I'm condemned to hunt you forever...

Seriously, I wanted an official line to the effect that OWS was not an anarchism movement, and that "hunger strike" was a way to make understood that I was serious about it. I wrote letters to both the address of this site and Jart but got no answer. I mentioned that I would accept such a line anywhere here, in the "about" section saying something to the effect that "Even though OWS grew its roots from anarchy and anarchy is critical to it, OWS is not an anarchism movement", or in the forum rules something saying that pressure to define OWS an anarchism movement would not be tolerated.

I'll wait some more for an answer, no need to quit as fast as you want me to, but I won't post anymore for some time, are you happy?

[Removed]

[-] 1 points by jph (2652) 2 years ago

tell that to the anarcho-capitalists (or Libertarians as they currently like to call themselves),.

[-] 0 points by Proteus (141) from Quebec, QC 2 years ago

Ahahahah, anarchism is becoming so desperate to include everybody and win new members that they have an hierarchy of divisions now? The anarchic-capitalists division will run the business!

[-] 2 points by jph (2652) 2 years ago

lol,. there is no "anarchism" to look for "members", or members of anarchism! You may have old broken control-structures in your eyes,. read a bit before you attack a concept, as if it was a political party. lolz.

[-] 0 points by Proteus (141) from Quebec, QC 2 years ago

I know that, ah, damn, I can't believe people can't understand that. Allright, I replace "anarchism" by "anarchists" and I hope you corrected everybody on this forum that used "Capitalism" instead of "capitalists", still, I don't see what's so wrong writing it like that.

And yes there are members of anarchism, like a political party, anarchism got an ideology endorsed by people.

Maybe you are the one missing some education.

And by the way, I do not attack, i show my view of it, can I?

[-] 2 points by brightonsage (4494) 2 years ago

anarchronism

[-] 0 points by Proteus (141) from Quebec, QC 2 years ago

Yeah, anarchronism is the right word...

[-] 1 points by brightonsage (4494) 2 years ago

A throwback to a time that never existed?

[-] 1 points by Proteus (141) from Quebec, QC 2 years ago

I don't know what you mean.

[-] 1 points by brightonsage (4494) 2 years ago

Anarchy has never been a system in use by a significant country. If it is ever to exist, it must be in the future. Therefore, since it hasn't really existed, calling it a throwback, would be an anachronism, "an error in chronology."

You might think of it as a joke?

[-] 1 points by Proteus (141) from Quebec, QC 2 years ago

Oh, yes, a good one too, well thought.

[-] 1 points by brightonsage (4494) 2 years ago

THANX Is all caps legal?

[-] 1 points by Proteus (141) from Quebec, QC 2 years ago

Yes to me, I have no problem with language diversity as long as the message passes across and its not difficult to read. Anyway, I prefer all caps to mean an emphasis than to mean shouting angrily, are you shouting angrily at me?

[-] 1 points by brightonsage (4494) 2 years ago

I meant, thanks, sincerely, thanks!

[-] 1 points by jph (2652) 2 years ago

"anarchism is becoming so desperate to...and win new members,.." you act as though there is an organisation with an agenda, when what there is are various names of different ideologies, that is what I am talking about. It just seems rather silly, as there really IS a Democratic Party with a specific platform, that is a structured organisation, with an agenda. This is not the same with Anarchy. Anarchy is no more desperate than Math or Geography are desperate,. see the difference?

[-] 1 points by Proteus (141) from Quebec, QC 2 years ago

I talked about anarchists as a group supporting an ideology. Be done with this,

And sorry if our opinion differ, but I see anarchy as an ideology with, yes, a goal.

I don't "act" I "write" btw.

[-] 1 points by jph (2652) 2 years ago

writing is an action,. how does an ideology become "desperate for members"? do the members pay dues,. sign a card, go to the national convention? you are personifying a concept,. where as other political Parties actually have dogmatic platforms and do seek members,. just pointing this out, no need to comment back,. you can drop it at any time. thanks for playing.

[-] 1 points by Proteus (141) from Quebec, QC 2 years ago

Ouf! you don't need a card to be a member of an ideology, or to go to a convention, you just need to endorse it, but then you'll say endorsing is signing a cheque or something.

[-] -1 points by oneandone (-67) 2 years ago

No...you're forgotten already....you fucking narcissist.

[-] 1 points by Proteus (141) from Quebec, QC 2 years ago

Wow, take it 'n easy, take a deep breath, don't break things, I hit a nerve somewhere? Happens all the time with me, as I have all qualities and all defects.

You actually made a new profile to tell me that? Then you're worth a long answer:

I’m a megalomaniac because I think, imagine and visualize great things, so don’t come at me brandishing that one like a great truth to squash me into obedience (anyway, you’d have to know who or what I’m controlling except myself). I’m pathetic (this is the word I detest the most hearing, it make me feel antipathic) in my way of seeing things, it’s classic lowlife stuff. I’m a hateful being too, so hateful it’s pathetic. I’m negative, slowly regressing to chimpanzee state, I pass my time criticizing and I’m pessimist, it’s because of people like me that things go wrong. I’m a psychopath because, because I don’t like the way most people are in this reality and that is seen as a violent attitude, and I spice this with misanthropy; the total! I’m slightly schizophrenic, that could explain those crazy theories and farfetched associations. I’m a lazy fuck-all that profit from the system because I don’t encourage it, and I’m an egocentric if I don’t encourage it, so suicide is my only option to feel good. Oh! A narcissist almost forgot that one. I’m psychotic because I’m far out of reality standards. A paranoid because I have a different opinion than the mass, or because I don’t explore other possibilities? A potential killer because I’m alone. I’m obsessive compulsive because I have a tendency to count how many times I hear things. I’m a fanatic from believing too much in myself. I’m mentally retarded because I didn’t have an easy youth. I’m suffering from having multiple personalities so I’m kind of complicated. I practice insubordination; the army is a good place to test this. I judge people while I’m not supposed to. I practice discrimination; this comes with my bad habit of judging people. I’m a moron; my IQ is a proof of that, but a moron that intellectualize everything and that’s bad, some intellectual said it! I’m monotonous (look at synonym), I scare women with that. I’m still a baby because I say no to everything of this reality; I must adapt, accept and tolerate to become an adult. I’m an insecure frustrated homosexual missing it’s coming out feature (gotta say something fast, if not, it will be a proof that I am, no, no, that’s not it, gotta say nothing because if I defend myself it will mean I am; open mouth, close, open, close, bug.) And I’m suffering from homophobia at it because I’m a homosexual that don’t “love” homosexuals?? I’m a compulsive liar because I don’t have much experience at talking and I’m scared of people’s reaction if I say the truth. I’m a manipulator because I argument a lot and defend my point of view. I’m suffering from all kind of mental displacements as I don’t order things in my brain like most people do. As an animal, my nearest cousin is the pig because I don’t pass my time cleaning around. I’m a masochist because the way I have chosen is not the least resistance path. I’m a fatalist; “dust to dust” could be my motto. I’m a traitor because I’m not a nationalist. I’m crazy because I make associations different than those I hear from psy. I’m pretentious; I pretend to know things without a diploma. I’m suffering from a complex of inferiority too, I’m suffering from a complex of superiority he too! Mmm, inferiority plus superiority equals…mediocrity? I’m suffering from a complex of mediocrity. Why does that sound so bad? It’s democratic you know, 50/50 mediocrity! But sorry I invented that one “superiority” never heard it, strange, that could be true you know, but don’t worry you won’t find that one in the psy nomenclature…Want more? Find some, there are many ways to make war to a mind you know, someone like me is bad, very bad…Go right ahead, I’m sensible, I’m insensible, I’m presumptuous, I’m psychotic (always show respect to the mentally ill…), I’m a lunatic moralist paternalist that infantilize, etc, etc. there’s a whole variety of problems to add for my fingernails eating rages too, don’t forget those, neither some blasphemous antichrist stuff as an add-on, and you can invalidate anything I say with a shut-up argument to the effect that I’m on the defensive because I defend my view with arguments, like I shouldn’t, and defending my view is a proof that I’m wrong…Now, what is the truth of me? Those actions I make that define what I am? You can’t be a king if you aint got a kingdom…

[-] -1 points by Proteus (141) from Quebec, QC 2 years ago

I wrote this for people of the future. Still, I will explain, even if this tread will be automatically flooded with frustrated anarchist gone completely nuts, and a few Christians too, and probably, I will be kicked out for what I’ll say is illegal here.

An anarchist is to capitalism what an antichrist is to Christianity.

A tool

Who invented the antichrist? Christianity hypocritically, and for what? For protection, to prevent an uprising against its institutions. To a Christian, nothing can be worse than an Antichrist walking the earth. At the beginning, an antichrist was a single being that would attack Christianity, then as time passed, the definition changed to an enlarged one, an antichrist would be anybody attacking “the good order of things”, causing chaos on earth. Today, if an antichrist was given the name, he would get many followers forming a gang of antichrists, and a Christian strong believer would go kaputt wanting to destroy the enemy, and normal people at home only half believing would slowly polarize their opinion toward that end too. The antichrist was invented to protect Christianity, or take the blame when the institution will crumble.

Who invented anarchy? The system of rich people hypocritically (today capitalism), and for what? To protect their system, to prevent an uprising against their institutions. In that time, anarchist people were crazies without laws and the worst enemy of people of sense (or the original definition has been quickly manipulated to become that, for those who absolutely want to believe that). Then as time passed, the definition changed to an enlarged one to embark as many people as possible, it would become a system against a system. Today, anarchism have many followers, and a Capitalist would go kaputt being besieged by anarchists, he would want to destroy them, and normal people at home only following the laws would slowly polarize their opinion toward that end too. Anarchism was invented to protect the rich, or take the blame when their institutions will crumble.

All I asked was an official statement that OWS was not an anarchism movement, and I almost only get insults, ignorance and opposition. People see anarchists as violent, or people that scrap good things, even terrorists, and that will not change whatever you twist the definition to include everybody and everything, like love, people know what true love is, they’ll always do, whatever you twist it to include everybody and everything. If OWS doesn’t take its distances from anarchism, then OWS will be crushed in violence, or it will be used to take the blame of troubles; the system will let OWS scrap things for some time and when people will have enough, it will be eliminated and its partisans will be persecuted, call that twisted natural selection.

If OWS doesn’t write an official line to the effect that it is not an anarchism movement, then it is doomed, even worse, and I will not associate my work to it for sure.

Now you understand why I say OWS have become exactly what governments wanted it to be, in fact, I could say that over the years, many people who were part of anarchism violence in all kind of protests around the world were probably paid by governments to scrap things and manipulate public opinion, to create an enemy, the rest are an inexpensive bunch indoctrinated to the beauty of anarchy, like they are in a religion or sect. Finally, I would put my hand in fire that there are quite a few posters here that are actually paid by the government to sing the glory of anarchy.

In the end everything is a matter of public opinion.

[-] 1 points by notaneoliberal (2269) 2 years ago

It is not only Anarchism that can be turned into a "boogey man". Almost anything can.

[-] 0 points by richardkentgates (3269) from Fort Walton Beach, FL 2 years ago

The fact that you compare Christianity to political ideology and capitalism, shows you have no understanding of either. It also shows that you are a republican. I would like to just say, republicans are welcome here. It is you who ostracize yourself. But maybe thats the point. Maybe you are here to ensure the separation. It has not gone unnoticed that there is an effort to drive a wedge here. If you don't like OWS, nobody is forcing you to participate.

[-] -1 points by Proteus (141) from Quebec, QC 2 years ago

Maybe you should learn that you cannot compare identical things, Einstein!

[-] 0 points by richardkentgates (3269) from Fort Walton Beach, FL 2 years ago

LOL, Christianity and Capitalism are identical?

[-] -1 points by Proteus (141) from Quebec, QC 2 years ago

"It also shows that you are a republican"

What a moron, but yest, I'm a separatist!

Whatever I don't vote.

[-] 0 points by richardkentgates (3269) from Fort Walton Beach, FL 2 years ago

LOL, Christianity and Capitalism are identical?

[-] -3 points by Proteus (141) from Quebec, QC 2 years ago

You're making a fool of yourself, it is not the first time you fail to read what I say to end-up spreading bullshit.

[-] 0 points by richardkentgates (3269) from Fort Walton Beach, FL 2 years ago

LOL, Christianity and Capitalism are identical?

[-] 2 points by VQkag2 (16478) 2 years ago

He ain't me boss!

Good morning. What are we debating today? Are different opinions allowed?

Peace.

[-] 0 points by richardkentgates (3269) from Fort Walton Beach, FL 2 years ago

Are Christianity and Capitalism identical?

[-] 3 points by VQkag2 (16478) 2 years ago

Not in my humble opinion.

  • One is an economic theory, the other a faith driven fairy tale from the bronze age created by men to control/oppress other men or explain the unexplainable.

Hows that?

Peace

[-] 1 points by richardkentgates (3269) from Fort Walton Beach, FL 2 years ago

Right on.

[-] 2 points by VQkag2 (16478) 2 years ago

Planets must be aligned!

[-] 1 points by richardkentgates (3269) from Fort Walton Beach, FL 2 years ago

lol. I told you. I do not agree or disagree based on social politics. I do so based on the argument. I liked it.

[-] 2 points by VQkag2 (16478) 2 years ago

Rock & Roll boss. I want only to help the 99%.

Don't really know how this thread is related but I suppose there is some value.

Peace

[-] -1 points by Proteus (141) from Quebec, QC 2 years ago

Allright moron, show me where I said that.

[-] 0 points by richardkentgates (3269) from Fort Walton Beach, FL 2 years ago

Show me where it says this is an anarchist movement? You first.

[-] 0 points by Proteus (141) from Quebec, QC 2 years ago

What I want is a line that say that even though anarchy is critical to OWS, OWS is not an anarchist movement, that way I can close the mouth of anybody telling me OWS is an anarchism movement, and then, as an author, I can be associated to the movement, because, yes, as an author, public opinion is important to me, and I don't want to be seen as an anarchist, whatever anarchists see it as a wonderful thing.

You answered my question by a diversion, you did not find where I said Christianity is identical to Capitalism, so you, like many anarchists I have dealt with in the last few days, are on the defensive and you lie, twist, manipulate and spread bullshit.

[-] 0 points by richardkentgates (3269) from Fort Walton Beach, FL 2 years ago

Answer the question. Where does it say this is an anarchist movement?

You see the comparison and you don't want to be backed into a corner, fine. So you better make your case and make it good.

PS, I'm not an anarchist.

[-] -1 points by Proteus (141) from Quebec, QC 2 years ago

"You see the comparison and you don't want to be backed into a corner, fine. So you better make your case and make it good."

You didn't answer the question, you are the one that is backed in a corner, and my point is well made, I repeated it at least 5 times in 1 day.

You are a fool.

[-] 0 points by richardkentgates (3269) from Fort Walton Beach, FL 2 years ago

Your connection of the two has been pointed out already

http://occupywallst.org/forum/the-truth-about-anarchy/#comment-826494

Let me expand on that. Christianity does indeed make economic recommendations. Does this make Christianity an economic platform?

To say that a congress contains Jewish persons, does that make it a Jewish congress?

Your confusion between similarities and absolutes is becoming familiar. I know you conceded the point to April, but I want you to understand that your logic will show itself regardless of what form of devise argument you present. Whether it be about anarchist or any other group you choose to single out. There is only one way to make the case you've been trying to make and as you see, it doesn't go very far.

[-] -1 points by Proteus (141) from Quebec, QC 2 years ago

You twist everything I said, I compared a process.

I NEVER, EVER, compared Christianity to Capitalism, LIAR!!!

I didn't talk economics, LIAR!!!

I don't want to single out anybody, LIAR!!!

[-] -2 points by Suetorp (-104) 2 years ago

You really have no idea what you are talking about.

I wrote this for people of the future, nobody here can understand, only future people will.

The more a people is far from a text in time, the harder it becomes to understand. Read Shakespeare, English changes! Society changes, etc... in 100 years when serious archeologists discover your serious text, they will have many unanswered questions because they do not understand our time like we do.

[-] 1 points by Proteus (141) from Quebec, QC 2 years ago

Man; you are really panicking!

100 years? for how long the definition of anarchy existed?

You think "archeology" of the present in 100 years?

[-] -1 points by Suetorp (-104) 2 years ago

The definition of anarchy has existed for thousands of years. The word comes from Ancient Greek.

[-] -1 points by Suetorp (-104) 2 years ago

False dichotomy. Anarchy is the opposite of hierarchy, nothing else. The opposite of capitalism is communism. Anarchy is a theory of political organization, while capitalism is an economic theory.

As such, you'll find that you can mix anarchy with capitalism, communism, or any other type of economic theory.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anarcho-capitalism

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anarchist_communism

And, of course, you can use both capitalism and communism with various forms of political hierarchy.

As for OWS, it's based on anarcho-communism. Anarcho-capitalism derives from anarcho-individualism.


It's back to the old drawing board for you. I suggest you read about anarchy.

[-] -1 points by Proteus (141) from Quebec, QC 2 years ago

I never talked opposites.

And I won't read until I'm brainwashed to see anarchism everywhere, the way this stupidity is going, soon anarchism will mean anything.

[-] -1 points by Suetorp (-104) 2 years ago

I never talked opposites.

You compared the duality anarchy/capitalism with a duality which is a clear dichotomy, i.e. antichrist/Christianity. Anarchy/capitalism is not a dichotomy and so it is not comparable to antichrist/Christianity.

[-] 2 points by Proteus (141) from Quebec, QC 2 years ago

You can't understand, read my long piece of text on this tread, then go ahead, go nuts.

[-] -2 points by Suetorp (-104) 2 years ago

May I ask how old are you and what type of schooling do you have?

[-] 0 points by Proteus (141) from Quebec, QC 2 years ago

I'm an ordinary person.

[-] -3 points by Suetorp (-104) 2 years ago

Do you have a form of Asperger syndrome? This might explain why people have difficulty understanding you.

[-] 1 points by Proteus (141) from Quebec, QC 2 years ago

Going nuts?

[-] -1 points by Suetorp (-104) 2 years ago

No, I was asking seriously. I have a good friend with Asperger and having a conversation with you reminded me of one with him. It's nothing to be ashamed of, and it could explain the problem you've been having with your book.

[-] -1 points by Proteus (141) from Quebec, QC 2 years ago

There is a psy malady to sink anybody, I don't play that game, I prefer simpler insults.

[-] -1 points by Suetorp (-104) 2 years ago

It wasn't meant as an insult. I was trying to help by attempting to understand why you have a miscommunication problem with many users here. I don't consider Asperger as a bad thing, and I wouldn't use physical or mental particularities as insults. You know, some people with Asperger are extremely intelligent, and many people have it but are not diagnosed.

[-] -1 points by Proteus (141) from Quebec, QC 2 years ago

It wasn't meant as an insult, yeah...

You are not trying to help, yeah...

I don't have a communication problem except when I'm talking to people like you.

[-] -1 points by Suetorp (-104) 2 years ago

Do you have a problem with people who have Asperger syndrome? Why would you consider it insulting if someone asked you if you did have it? Why not simply answer matter of factly, yes, or no? People sometimes ask me if I'm gay because of my fancy dressing habits. It does not bother me.

[-] 1 points by Proteus (141) from Quebec, QC 2 years ago

What is that? What are you trying to prove with this? You think someone that minimally make sense will see your arguments as making sense?

Nobody like to be told he have a mental sickness, why should I be happy about it? And if I'm not happy about it, why twist that to mean I hate those with the malady?

It is you that have no respect for anyone except your gang.

[-] -1 points by Suetorp (-104) 2 years ago

Asperger is not a sickness, a malady, nor a disease.

[-] 0 points by richardkentgates (3269) from Fort Walton Beach, FL 2 years ago

Nicely done.

[-] -1 points by Suetorp (-104) 2 years ago

Thx Richard.

[-] -1 points by richardkentgates (3269) from Fort Walton Beach, FL 2 years ago

Free markets are based on the same individual freedoms that Anarchism is built on.

[-] 2 points by shoozTroll (17632) 2 years ago

Free markets are an illusion, there quite simply is no way for them to exist.

You had better luck with your faster than light theories.

[-] 2 points by JesseHeffran (3903) 2 years ago

Could't free markets be seen as the state of man before civilization? You know that magical place called the state of nature where life is "solitary, poor, nasty, brutish, and short." If this is the case then free markets are just mental scaffolds used to make critical arguments. I have never seen a free market in my life time, have you?

[-] 2 points by shoozTroll (17632) 2 years ago

I've heard rumors that the collapse of the club market led to the demise of the Neanderthals.

Even then though, it was the Cro Magnon manipulations of the market.

This being so, I tend to think that all markets are controlled by someone, somewhere.

[-] -2 points by Proteus (141) from Quebec, QC 2 years ago

"You know that magical place called the state of nature where life is "solitary, poor, nasty, brutish, and short."

Isn't that a definition of anarchy?

[-] -1 points by richardkentgates (3269) from Fort Walton Beach, FL 2 years ago

lol, if you don't like the speed of light being variable or broken, you better call CERN. I have been nice to you quite often but if you wana go at me union boy you better eat your fuck'n wheaties.

[-] 3 points by shoozTroll (17632) 2 years ago

Hmmm. Strangely enough, my cereal is incapable of sexual activity.

It just lies there, in a bowl of milk and fruit...............:)

[-] -1 points by richardkentgates (3269) from Fort Walton Beach, FL 2 years ago

lol, smart ass.

[-] 0 points by Proteus (141) from Quebec, QC 2 years ago

You forgot the Christianity part, but it's a nice try.

[-] -3 points by Suetorp (-104) 2 years ago

Anarchy does not stipulate a set of freedoms, the only freedom it proscribes is a freedom from hierarchic power. We could easily imagine a type of wild anarchy where everyone is left to themselves and no one has any protections. You could engage in cannibalism, in robbery, whatever.... There are all types of anarchic setups, the only thing they have in common is the absence of hierarchy (or at least the attempt to do without it).

[-] 0 points by Proteus (141) from Quebec, QC 2 years ago

That' s a good view, but to the general population and me, the true definition of anarchy is a mess. And wathever the effort being made you will never get that out of their head. You could say simple people are happy with simple things and there is truth too, why change an ugly definition until it become cute? If the first definition of anarchy was a kind of mess, then that's the true definition, the rest are "twisted" ones to embark more people. The same for love you know, and many other definitions that changed with time for the sole goal to manipulate, remember that, because what I wrote up there is all about manipulation.

[-] 1 points by April (3196) 2 years ago

I think the 'mess' or chaos that is sometimes associated or used to define anarchy, is not so much an accurate techinical definition as it is the likely resulting outcome of a system of organization that lacks hierarchy. This may or may not have to be the outcome. But experience shows that 'order' is better achieved (more effectively and efficiently) through hierarchical structures.

If the general population has an inaccurate view of the meaning of anarchy, it's not exactly the fault of OWS. 'you will never get that out of their head'. Perhaps not. Does it matter?

[-] 0 points by Proteus (141) from Quebec, QC 2 years ago

Thank you for your answer, you are right across the line, I don't know what to say.

[-] 0 points by Suetorp (-104) 2 years ago

But experience shows that 'order' is better achieved (more effectively and efficiently) through hierarchical structures.

The word "order" here is problematic. Order comes from Latin, ordo, which means 'row, series, rank'. As such, it is often understood as being hierarchic by nature.

'Structure' or 'arrangement' are more general terms which could refer to anarchy or hierarchy without causing confusion.

[-] 0 points by April (3196) 2 years ago

Agreed.

[-] -3 points by Suetorp (-104) 2 years ago

The first definition of anarchy was not a "mess". That came later with propaganda efforts against anarchy. The origimal definition means what it means, i.e. an absence of hierarchy. Nothing more, nothing less. The definition that you refer to as a "mess" is the one used to manipulate.

I'm sorry, but scholars and anarchists cannot take the blame for your ignorance due to a bad education.

It's the job of OWS to explain what they are and they have done a good job at that. They have been clear from the beginning that they will use direct democracy, make no demands, use civil disobedience, and avoid getting involved in the political theater from the inside. They have even compared the protest to previous protests like the Arab Springs which gives us a model that we can use to better understand OWS.

It's your job to educate yourself. Learn about the various forms of government, the various forms of economy, etc... There's no reason to remain ignorant in the digital age. Information lies at your fingertips.

[-] -2 points by Proteus (141) from Quebec, QC 2 years ago

How do you know what was the first definition? Wikipedia? The bearer of ultimate truth?

[-] 0 points by Suetorp (-104) 2 years ago

I read many books. Anarchy has a long history, it dates back to Ancient Greece. In modern times, Immanual Kant did much to define it. Don't be afraid to learn! It's a wonderful ride!

Do you like etymology?

ORIGIN mid 16th cent.: via medieval Latin from Greek anarkhia, from anarkhos, from an- ‘without’ + arkhos ‘chief, ruler.’

If the first definition of anarchy was meant to define "chaos", then the word anarchy would not have been used!