Forum Post: occupy wallstreet stealing from the poor to give to themselves
Posted 12 years ago on Jan. 16, 2012, 9:42 p.m. EST by mdarling
(7)
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The purpose of occupying foreclosures is to return homes back to their rightful owners, not to kick out the rightful owners and put our buddies in them. Stop this practice now! This is a grave schism in the movement. I can't believe it. We cannot allow a bunch of self interested hooligans to co opt the movement. We are not a private club. My God, is our next step to expel NYOW from the movement?
Michael Occupy Edmonton
OK, what exactly happened here? Did they decide that it was a good idea to install themselves in a foreclosed home over the objections of the owner? If so, then it pretty much goes without saying that the group in question was way out of line and owes the owner an apology, a check for any damages incurred by whoever they put in there, and of course access to his home back and full support in retaining it. That said, something tells me there's more to this than the OP is saying; if anyone could elaborate on what exactly is going on over there I'd really appreciate it.
As I understand the situation the man was in the process of buying the house. Not living in it, which I thought odd but whatever. And the occupiers actually took control of the house in order to give it to a homeless family. Also, as I understand it, the family is rarely there and the occupiers use it as some kind of base.
OK, that doesn't make much sense. Was he buying it from a bank after a foreclosure after OWS was unable to get in touch with the original owner?
I'm really not sure. Thats actually a pretty good summary from the article I read. I think he had been in the process of buying the house for a while now but I could be wrong on that. By a while I meant 2 or 3 years,
he was unable to pay his mortgage for couple years and he actually being forced to leave out his house, but still paying slowly for that property and also paying rent for another appartment. that what news saids
Why do all the trolls now say darling? I don't like to hear the word "darling" from trolls.
http://occupywallst.org/forum/this-is-very-bad-occupy-fix-it/
Im guessing this is the issue you are referring to. Real sad situation for the man who owns this home.
If the story is true. It may be yet another disinfo piece, certainly not the first. I sent an e-mail to 'Occupy Our Homes' but haven't received a reply yet. Personally, I'm skeptical about the article.
Seems the story is true , here is a link to OWS' response to the articles. http://therealdeal.com/blog/2012/01/16/occupy-foreclosure-protesters-shoot-back-after-post-article/
My problem isn't with whether OWS is occupying Ahadzi's foreclosed home, it's with the 'slant' of Daily Mail's story. They're painting the occupiers as somehow screwing Ahadzi, but according to the Gothamist, they're working with Ahadzi as well. There's more to this than what is portrayed in the Daily Mail article. For example, the article says Ahadzi is still paying on his mortgage. If he was having a problem paying his mortgage when he was in the house, how is he able to now pay the mortgage AND his apartment rent as well? I also get a bit frustrated (not much) with posters that read some bad OWS press and come on here attacking the entire movement. I don't think they see the big picture.
Not sure what the big picture is frankly. I didn't see how this takeover of a house that didn't belong to anyone in OWS, as helping or attempting to fix the housing and foreclosure issues. I brought up many issues when they first did this, primarily the safety and health concerns such as the mold in the house, especially when there are children involved. From the many reports Ive read, the house is still without basic needs such as water and electric. Also that this supposed homeless family still hasn't moved in. Unfortunately this did recieve bad press from the beginning. Not sure what the answer is regarding an action like this.
I understand your concerns. From your comments yesterday, I can tell you know a whole lot more about this than I, so I hope I'm not offending you by downplaying it. I received an e-mail this morning from Matt Hamlin at Occupy Our Homes, but he didn't really clarify anything. All he sent me was a link to the Gothamist article. Just out of curiosity, was there a mold problem when Ahadzi first moved in? Seems to me he could have a case against the bank if there were.
No not offending me at all. in fact it is nice to be able to hold a civil " chat" on here. I happen to read everything I get my hands on and as far as housing issues.. I run a small construction co in NY , so I know alot about health and safety codes and violations in the housing industry. My understanding is this house sat vacant for a few yrs when Ahadzi moved out. What happened according to what I read is that vandals were in and out of it.. thats a pretty rough part of Brooklyn and Im guessing the house was used as a drug den . But as far as mold, all you need is a good rain and a leak in the roof or an open window and when sheetrock gets wet, it just grows like crazy. Mold is impossible to get out once it festers like that.
When the previous owner bought the house he would have needed to have it inspected to get a mortgage approved so Im guessing it was in ok shape when he bought it.
What the banks did by approving the number of mortgages they did back in the early to mid 2000 yrs was wrong, they knew most of the folks could not ever really pay these loans back. But there is also this personal responsiblity piece involved. So its really a two fold kind of problem. When I saw what Ahadzi paid for this house in 2007 ( 424K) I was pretty stunned actually. The housing market was already going downhill. Just makes me think in what world did he think he could afford a loan like that. Then all you need is someone saying " oh go ahead sign.. you can handle this" . In my little world its called getting bamboozled. These days we all need to read documents carefully.. hire an attorney if necessary to understand what it is we are signing. All those tiny little words and clauses often go unread in the excitement of making a big purchase. I wish I had the answer.. I would like to see the banks really work with people to lower the interest rates. These empty homes are nothing but an eyesore and a problem for the neighborhood and the banks. I also would love to see organizations crop up similar to Habitat for Humanity to put these vacant homes back into working shape and then offered at a lower rate for more people to be able to afford them , either thru purchase or rent. It would for starters, put more tradespeople back to work, it would stimulate the economy as far as housing supplies needed and it would help more folks put a roof over thier heads. Just my 2 cents worth of opinion.
A lot of people have come down hard on those who took out these loans, but I believe they've been overly critical, and a bit simplistic in their views. Consider the amount of paperwork to read through when purchasing a home. How many people in the world actually read all the fine-print? Of course you should, but I'd be willing to bet most people don't, they just hope for the best, and usually there's no problems. Add to that the tactics of high-pressure salesmen and the fact that a lot of people are basically non-confrontational. They're often intimidated by the process and just want to get it over with and get the hell out of there. I've been through this on a used-car lot. Once they had my down-payment check in their greedy hands, they did everything they could to not give it back, although I asked for it back twice. I don't know this personally, but I'd also be willing to bet that somewhere in the conversation there was a part that went like this: houses rarely lose value, they increase in value every year by an average of five to ten percent and if, in as few years, you can't afford the mortgage, you'll have no problem selling the house at a profit. Historically, houses HAVE gone up five or ten percent a year, so that belief was completely understandable. That nugget was probably the deal-clincher in a huge number of cases.
By the way, your idea of Habitat rehabbing some of these houses is an excellent idea. I think right now they only build new homes, is that correct?
The sheer amount of paperwork to read thru when purchasing a home or even refinacing it, is mind boggling. Thats why I always suggest an attorney. What I saw in the early part of this decade was people selling thier moderate homes and " upsizing". I would often wonder what in the world do you need with 4K , 7k or even 10ksquare feet . I live in a small cape cod ( 1600 sq) that I bought in 1987 when my late husband and I had saved for 2 yrs so we could put a sizable chunk down. When he died in 91, I had a 2 yr old baby and a mortgage that I thought would choke me on 1 salary. I can remember calling an attorney friend who put me in touch with one of the good mortgage brokers back then ( I was lucky) and he refinanced me to a lower and longer loan so I could manage. But I still had to work my ass off for years to keep current and still be able to enjoy my life. Over the years I upgraded my home.. added a 2nd bath.. small projects to make my home more desirable to my son and I. But all around me I watched young couples come into the neighborhood and buy these starter homes and tear them down to rebuild the " Mcmansion". These big massive homes under construction.. months and months would go by and no work was being done. My son would ask me what was going on.. my standard answer was " they bit off more than they could chew".
That is what caused alot of the foreclosure stuff going on. People buying and building way out of thier means.. keeping up with the Jones;s kinda mentality.
Yes of course the banks and mortgage lenders were a huge part of this but I still feel that alot of people really put themselves out on a tight skinny limb, with nowhere to turn if things turned bad.
As far as Habitat for Humanity, my understanding is yes it is new construction. But what we all see in every neighborhood, is a glut of empty homes that just need some TLC.
I don't think there should be any freebies out there.. I would love to see things like " work to own/rent" sort of scenarios. I truly think when you put some blood sweat and tears into something you really want, the rewards are great. That is part of the self responsibility part of this to a degree. That to me would be a wonderful way to start to " fix" this problem.
Who knows, maybe in my next reinvention of my life, this will be the path I take.
Yes, keeping up with the Jones' and not living within ones' means is definitely a huge part of the problem nowadays, not only in regards to housing but life in general; multiple credit cards, a couple new car payments, etc. It's ridiculous. I've made that mistake in the past and being hounded by creditors is extremely stress-inducing. We also bought this house in 1987, a two-story brick Victorian that cost a 'whopping' $370 a month house payment. No car payment, no credit card debt. I definitely sleep better at night.
Work to own/rent is another really good idea. Seems you have a good head on your shoulders, CatLady. I'll bet you've been a positive role-model for you son. Keep up the good work.
Thank you. I like to think this good head on my shoulders came with alot of hard lessons learned in my life. Nothing came easy to me, I always had to put my hand on that hot stove so to speak to really make sure it was hot lol Took me a long time to figure life out and I can hope that my son takes some of my lessons with him on his road to adulthood. Be well and all the best to you and your family.
Thank you. The best-learned lessons are those learned the hard way. I, too, have learned many things the hard way; lots of wrong choices along the way that didn't seem wrong at the time. That's one of the ironies of life, isn't it? By the time you have it pretty well figured out, you're too old to really capitalize on it. Like they say, if I knew then . . .
If I knew then... it wouldnt have been so much fun lol Thankfully today I can laugh at some of the really stupid things I did and horrible choices I made and know I don't ever have to go back and repeat them.
Heh heh heh. Wouldn't have been so much fun. So true. So very true.
If by, "yet another disinfo piece" you mean, "yet another account of the violence, stupidity and hypocrisy inherent in this joke of a movement which fly against my sollipsistic self-delusions".
These OWS loons think if the "occupy" something then they do not have to pay and think they own it. They all should be pepper sprayed
Stay in Canada loser.
Unfortunately Obama has made the younger generation think they are entitled to more. It's his one term, it'll be over and people will realize they need to get a job and wok for a living.
I'm not fan of the current administration, but I have to think the entitlement concept is a combo of both the gov't intervention and bailouts along with upbringing.
Just glad I raised my son to be accountable for himself, which means if you want it, work for it. Nothing good comes easy and without a little old fashioned elbow grease.
"I have to think the entitlement concept is a combo of both the gov't intervention and bailouts along with upbringing."
I think you are dead on with that statement. Great Post.
Thank you
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