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Forum Post: maybe God will help us get middle class tax cuts

Posted 1 year ago on Dec. 11, 2012, 7:20 a.m. EST by bensdad (8977)
This content is user submitted and not an official statement


^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ OR
we can vote out the obstructionist shills owned by the 1%

86 Comments

86 Comments


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[-] 2 points by SparkyJP (1646) from Westminster, MD 1 year ago

I'm not sure how the middle class tax cuts will fair; but I do expect them to lower corporate tax rates.

The United States is a low-tax country. That’s true for individuals and for corporations, and it’s true whether you compare us to other countries or the America of the past. No matter how you slice it the conclusion is the same.

http://www.americanprogress.org/issues/tax-reform/news/2011/06/10/9751/ten-charts-that-prove-the-united-states-is-a-low-tax-country/

[-] 1 points by conservatroll (159) 1 year ago

Socialism, meet low taxes and trillion dollar deficits.

[-] 1 points by SparkyJP (1646) from Westminster, MD 1 year ago

Fascism, meet low taxes and trillion dollar deficits more appropriately.

[-] 2 points by conservatroll (159) 1 year ago

Touche!!

[-] 0 points by DKAtoday (28241) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 year ago

LOW TAX FOR WHO ??? You can not take this country and hold it up next to another country and say look at the income look at the taxes look at the quality of life. Each is to an extent a closed environment that runs on its existing internal/infernal parameters and those do not necessarily translate to other economies/societies.

[-] 2 points by SparkyJP (1646) from Westminster, MD 1 year ago

Did you look at the charts in the link at all ? They do name their sources on each graph. The point is that while we do have a spending problem (IMO wars that weren't paid for, corporate welfare, bank bailouts, money printing, etc), the other side of the issue is the huge revenue reduction. Corporations and the wealthy have been treated very well.

http://www.americanprogress.org/wp-content/uploads/issues/2011/06/pdf/low_tax_graphs.pdf

We compare numbers such as education, trade, manufacturing, employment, etc., all the time to other countries; so why are tax revenues something we shouldn't compare. Maybe to your point, we need to understand that that many of these countries also extend some form single payer HC, and other social programs that the US does not, that they pay for through taxes. Regardless, you are only addressing Chart # 2. There are 9 more charts that support the revenue issue.

[-] 0 points by DKAtoday (28241) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 year ago

And what do they tax fee and special charge on their store items?

[-] 1 points by SparkyJP (1646) from Westminster, MD 1 year ago

Who do what? Not sure what you mean.

[-] 0 points by DKAtoday (28241) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 year ago

We have income taxes SS deducted FICA and State - but then there are all of the taxes we pay on food clothing gasoline tobacco etc etc etc fees for communication home heating electricity water service garbage service etc etc etc - how does all of that compare with other countries?

[-] 2 points by SparkyJP (1646) from Westminster, MD 1 year ago

I don't know what amount other countries pay for these services, but I feel confident that it's not volunteer workers performing them, although some services may be non-profit.

Out of more than 30 countries in the Organisation for Economic Co-Operation and Development, the United States ranks fifth from the bottom in total taxes paid to all levels of government, as a share of GDP. Total government revenue in the United States is nearly 25 percent lower than the average OECD country.

United States - 26.9 percent

Denmark - 49.3 percent

Mexico - 18.4 percent

UK - 35.8

http://www.americanprogress.org/wp-content/uploads/issues/2011/06/pdf/low_tax_graphs.pdf

[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (28241) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 year ago

Well anyway - I am not gonna get into this any further - right now. This has been gone over before - and there are lots of finicky little things that go into it all - including how taxes are spent - but the upshot is USA citizens to a very large extent pay a lot in taxes and very little is then placed back into the general economy or used to pay for public services - like health care.

I do believe there is a TED talk that covers a lot of this.

[-] 0 points by SparkyJP (1646) from Westminster, MD 1 year ago

In short the R's claim that we have a spending problem, not a revenue problem. These charts debunk that theory. Thanx for the exchange :)

[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (28241) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 year ago

No problem - you know the difference could(?) be found in the low rate of taxes collected from the wealthy and many corporations.

[-] 2 points by SparkyJP (1646) from Westminster, MD 1 year ago

Yes - That's my point :) but the other smaller taxes that you mentioned does disproportionally hit the middle and lower class and increases inequality in this country. What bothers me now is that both sides are now discussing reducing corporate taxes in the fiscal cliff talks. I'm trying to make people aware of how little the corps pay in taxes now. Hell, by paying little to no taxes, increased productivity from workers, low interest rates and high stock prices, these companies are in a good place and are sitting on record cash. They certainly don't need a tax cut.

http://www.businessinsider.com/these-are-the-30-american-companies-that-paid-less-than-zero-income-tax-from-2008-2010-2011-11?op=1

[-] 2 points by DKAtoday (28241) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 year ago

Absolutely. These are games of blackmail/coercion. I will let you keep the tax cuts for the needy - IF - you don't raise taxes on the wealthy or corpoRATions ....................

[-] 0 points by bensdad (8977) 1 year ago

in 2010 GE paid zero in corporate tax how much lower should it be?

[-] 0 points by SparkyJP (1646) from Westminster, MD 1 year ago

It was LESS than $0. Actually 45.3% of their profits came from the taxpayer!! A tax rate of - 45.3%. (Note the minus) And that's just one company. Click the link below to see more. That is exactly my point though. The government is borrowing to support these giveaways and to make up for the lost revenues rather than make these companies and the wealthy pay a fair tax. To compound the problem, we have to pay interest to treat them so well.

See charts here: http://www.americanprogress.org/wp-content/uploads/issues/2011/06/pdf/low_tax_graphs.pdf


General Electric

'08-'10 Profit: $10,460,000,000

'08-'10 Tax: $-4,737,000,000

'08-'10 Rate: -45.3%

Read more: http://www.businessinsider.com/these-are-the-30-american-companies-that-paid-less-than-zero-income-tax-from-2008-2010-2011-11?op=1#ixzz2EzL5z2vq

Cheers

[-] 2 points by bensdad (8977) 1 year ago

As long as corporatioins are people and money is speech,
the corporate ownership of democracy will continue

[-] 1 points by SparkyJP (1646) from Westminster, MD 1 year ago

For true !!

[-] 0 points by town (-374) 1 year ago

jeff immelt, head of ge, friend ( and money bundler) of obama and was on his economic council.

[-] 1 points by bensdad (8977) 1 year ago

so with Obama as President, they will pay less next year?

[-] 2 points by DKAtoday (28241) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 year ago

Let us hope for a "REAL" positive addressing of the fiscal cliff with the needed wealthy reforms - elimination of subsides and loopholes/breaks a raising of rates all on the over 250,000 a year crowd as well as wealthy CopoRATions/Business - let us not see cuts to social aid medicare SS etc - let us see foreign aid change from throwing money at em to buying supplies and equipment from USA DOMESTIC business's of all sizes but preferably from the small business's that we want to see grow and expand - these supplies equipment materials can then be sent in "REAL" aid to foreign countries that need developmental help. Send No More Cash or Weapons.

[-] -1 points by town (-374) 1 year ago

if they make more money than they did in 2010, yes. more money that wont be paid on bigger profits.

[-] 2 points by bensdad (8977) 1 year ago

Here's my simple solution- screw the corporate loopholes
create a corporate AMT of 20%

[-] 2 points by Shayneh (-482) 1 year ago

Everyone complains about what's going on and but you know what - stupid is as stupid does.

How on earth would you even think things could have changed with Obama being re-elected, the Republicans controlling the House and the Dems controlling the senate.

It has been like this for the past two years and there wasn't any change was there. What in the hell makes you or anyone think that putting the same program back in the computer will change things - there is no upgrade.

Insanity, nothing but voting insanity.

[-] 1 points by bensdad (8977) 1 year ago

right- NOTHING will change except tax rates on the 2% will go up and tax rates on the 98% will go down
Democrats have spent the last year suppressing union rights, voting rights, womens rights. - exactly the same as the fascist Rs.


or do I have something confusdicated?


If I was in congress, I would demad a 45% rate on incomes over 10,000,000

[-] 0 points by bensdad (8977) 1 year ago

Obama advocates a constitutional amendment to overturn citizens united. If we can push out the tp from the House, it will be done.

[-] 1 points by VQkag2 (16478) 1 year ago

Would be Funnier if it weren't so sad.

[-] 0 points by WSmith (2091) from Cornelius, OR 1 year ago

Corporate Tax Rates, Then and Now

By Barry Ritholtz - April 14th, 2011, 7:15AM

GE paid no taxes; Goldman Sachs paid $14 million last year. The GAO reported in 2008 that “two out of every three United States corporations paid no federal income taxes from 1998 through 2005.”

Companies have become all too astute at paying for loopholes which allow them to shift profits abroad, or move their gains (on paper) to foreign low-tax/no-tax nations.

Time to look at the overall tax payments corporations have made. As the graphic below shows, the change in corporate taxes — not merely rates, but what they actually paid — over the past half century is astounding.

http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/2011/04/corporate-tax-rates-then-and-now/

New Study Finds Tax Cuts For The Rich Cause Income Inequality, Not Economic Growth

By Pat Garofalo on Sep 17, 2012 at 11:00 am: http://thinkprogress.org/economy/2012/09/17/857861/study-tax-cuts-rich-no-growth/

INFOGRAPHIC: We Could End Homelessness With The Money Americans Spend On Christmas Decorations

By Adam Peck on Dec 10, 2012 at 4:25 pm: http://thinkprogress.org/economy/2012/12/10/1311041/infographic-homelessness-christmas-decorations/

X-Ma$$ Song: http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=Zrhh8YeQjdc#!

[-] 0 points by Clancy (42) 1 year ago

Is this supposed to be bashing Christians?

[-] 1 points by VQkag2 (16478) 1 year ago

No.

It is bashing ignorant people who stand against middle class tax cut.

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/12/12/business/top-executives-end-opposition-to-higher-taxes.html

[-] 1 points by VQkag2 (16478) 1 year ago

Priceless, I'll send that to all my friends.

[-] 1 points by WSmith (2091) from Cornelius, OR 1 year ago

OK, someone who knows good music humor.

Did you like any of the songs I replied on Girlfriday's post?

[-] 1 points by VQkag2 (16478) 1 year ago

Didn't notice those. I suppose I would though.

[-] 0 points by WSmith (2091) from Cornelius, OR 1 year ago

"Goodbye thread something..."

[-] 1 points by VQkag2 (16478) 1 year ago

I'll look for it.

[-] 0 points by WSmith (2091) from Cornelius, OR 1 year ago
[-] 0 points by Theeighthpieceuv8 (-32) from Seven Sisters, Wales 1 year ago

There's just no accounting for ignorance, is there?

[-] -1 points by Clancy (42) 1 year ago

That didn't anwser my question.

[-] 2 points by bensdad (8977) 1 year ago

I am bashing ignorance stupidity and GREED

[-] 0 points by Clancy (42) 1 year ago

I got that, but I was just wandering if you we're bashing Christianity to because that what it sounded like.

[-] 2 points by bensdad (8977) 1 year ago

Most "religious" people do evil and blame God
some religions tell you you will go to heaven if you blow yourself up with the infadels
some religions tell you that if you kill 75 people and then confess to God's "representative", you will get into heaven [ ask Michael Corleone ]

[-] -1 points by Clancy (42) 1 year ago

So most Christians commit evil and blame God. Or are you saying that Muslims are the only ones?

[-] 1 points by bensdad (8977) 1 year ago

I dont say most religious people
I do say most "religious" people to differentiate people of true faith from people such as the Borgias and the violent Imams

[-] 0 points by VQkag2 (16478) 1 year ago

I Bash with you.

Bash away

[-] 1 points by Theeighthpieceuv8 (-32) from Seven Sisters, Wales 1 year ago

Yes, he's Christian bashing; more specifically he is "believer" bashing. I smell the arrogance of fear... just so much dust, sweep it away.

[-] 3 points by bensdad (8977) 1 year ago

And yes - I am afraid - how many millions of people have been killed in the name of God?
enslaved? tortured?

Not because of God -
but because of what man has created with religion

[-] -1 points by Clancy (42) 1 year ago

Myth 1: The Crusades were wars of unprovoked aggression against a peaceful Muslim world.

This is as wrong as wrong can be. From the time of Mohammed, Muslims had sought to conquer the Christian world. They did a pretty good job of it, too. After a few centuries of steady conquests, Muslim armies had taken all of North Africa, the Middle East, Asia Minor and most of Spain.

In other words, by the end of the 11th century the forces of Islam had captured two-thirds of the Christian world. Palestine, the home of Jesus Christ; Egypt, the birthplace of Christian monasticism; Asia Minor, where St. Paul planted the seeds of the first Christian communities — these were not the periphery of Christianity but its very core.

And the Muslim empires were not finished yet. They continued to press westward toward Constantinople, ultimately passing it and entering Europe itself. As far as unprovoked aggression goes, it was all on the Muslim side. At some point what was left of the Christian world would have to defend itself or simply succumb to Islamic conquest.

And please tell me how many millions of Christians were tortured and killed for their faith? Many are still killed today for their faith as well.

[-] -1 points by Theeighthpieceuv8 (-32) from Seven Sisters, Wales 1 year ago

I've estimated the number of deaths due to Christian Holy Wars, inquisitions, persecution, etc. at 2.5 million. And there are others who compiled similar numbers.

You see, for a long time I sincerely believed that all wars were merely economic and territorial. I am no longer convinced that that is entirely true - some really do go to war and commit unnecessary murder for religious belief. But in the case of the later, it is almost always about preserving the religious polity. Attacks on the religious polity are but challenges to power; there is a power element that supersedes all economic concerns.

By the way... man did not create religion. Religion was born of some more archaic pre-homo saps form. We merely refined it - a process of natural selection - and we did so as guided by evolution.

[-] 1 points by bensdad (8977) 1 year ago

since 1948, arabs& muslims have killed 11,000,000 arabs & muslims

[-] 1 points by OTP (-203) from Tampa, FL 1 year ago

Rewind 10 more years and Christian vs Christian deaths dwarf that number.

[-] 1 points by Ache4Change (3280) 1 year ago

How many europeans have died at the hands of other europeans in the 20th century? How come you just pick 1948 as an arbitrary point in time? Is it a coincidence or does that leave out WW1 & WW2 to suit some agenda you have? Why are you lumping together all arabs and muslims together? Do we do the same for europeans and christians? What does this have to do with your posted cartoons? What is your agenda here? Actually for real issues - http://www.nationofchange.org/right-s-sham-religion-rugged-individualism-1355328952 Never Give Up Occupying Reason and Reasonability! Occupy Love Not Hate!

[-] 1 points by bensdad (8977) 1 year ago

I pick the date because it relates to Arabs/Muslims killed by Israel during the same period = 35,000
religion has been used to justify some very crazy things

[-] 1 points by Ache4Change (3280) 1 year ago

Nothing to do with the removal of hundreds of thousands of people from lands that hey had lived in for centuries then? Are you aware that nearly a quarter of Palestinians in 1948 were Christians? Does this affect your point of view any? Or would you rather this was ignored and not known because you wish to see all arabs as muslim for some reason? Any links to back up your number?

More importantly from your interesting answer which really totally ignores the core points of my previous comment, is the final question - what is your point? I'm running late and have to log off and get on with my day now, but I'm actually really interested in any answer you may posit. Occupy Love Not Hate!

[-] 1 points by bensdad (8977) 1 year ago

number from:
http://www.godlikeproductions.com/forum1/message581679/pg1 It is scary that more Syrians have been killed in the last few months than Israel has killed Arabs/ Muslims since 1948
very sad

[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (28241) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 year ago

While the whole world watches - and does nothing - nothing positive.

[-] 1 points by UnFriendlyObserverB (-55) 1 year ago

What is that syrian protest all about ?

[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (28241) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 year ago

In a WORD - YES


[-] 1 points by UnFriendlyObserverB (-8) 1 minute ago

From your stand point .. is whatever the problem is .. resolvable ? ↥twinkle ↧stinkle permalink

[-] 1 points by UnFriendlyObserverB (-55) 1 year ago

Try two words ..

[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (28241) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 year ago

Still being rather vague and all to general - you want to work on a question that does not require a history book and a whole new book to address your inquiry?


[-] 1 points by UnFriendlyObserverB (-8) 0 minutes ago

Sure, ..what is going on over there ? ↥twinkle ↧stinkle permalink

[-] 1 points by UnFriendlyObserverB (-55) 1 year ago

From your stand point .. is whatever the problem is .. resolvable ?

[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (28241) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 year ago

You want to expand on the query a bit?

[-] 1 points by UnFriendlyObserverB (-55) 1 year ago

Sure, ..what is going on over there ?

[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (28241) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 year ago

Religion is most often used by those in a position of power/authority to get WHAT THEY WANT not to promote fellowship health and prosperity of the people.

[-] 1 points by VQkag2 (16478) 1 year ago

best estimates I could find are 50Million- 100million.

Why is this important?

[-] 1 points by VQkag2 (16478) 1 year ago

Heres an articlethat has different numbers than your estimates.

http://articles.exchristian.net/2002/10/how-many-people-have-been-killed-by.php

How did you come up with you're numbers?

[-] 0 points by Clancy (42) 1 year ago

Myth 1: The Crusades were wars of unprovoked aggression against a peaceful Muslim world. This is as wrong as wrong can be. From the time of Mohammed, Muslims had sought to conquer the Christian world. They did a pretty good job of it, too. After a few centuries of steady conquests, Muslim armies had taken all of North Africa, the Middle East, Asia Minor and most of Spain. In other words, by the end of the 11th century the forces of Islam had captured two-thirds of the Christian world. Palestine, the home of Jesus Christ; Egypt, the birthplace of Christian monasticism; Asia Minor, where St. Paul planted the seeds of the first Christian communities — these were not the periphery of Christianity but its very core. And the Muslim empires were not finished yet. They continued to press westward toward Constantinople, ultimately passing it and entering Europe itself. As far as unprovoked aggression goes, it was all on the Muslim side. At some point what was left of the Christian world would have to defend itself or simply succumb to Islamic conquest. And please tell me how many millions of Christians were tortured and killed for their faith? Many are still killed today for their faith as well.

[-] 1 points by mideast (506) 1 year ago

THE HISTORY OF THE MIDDLE EAST IN 11 MINUTES 11.37▬►
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_ZY8m0cm1oY&feature=endscreen&NR=1


WHAT IS THE WEST BANK 6.17 ▬► http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uq6tDmLNPjU&feature=endscreen&NR=1


THE PASLESTINIAN CONFLICT 4.20 ▬►
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4TI5Mwyhzhg


[-] 1 points by VQkag2 (16478) 1 year ago

It took us until WWI to finally destroy the Muslim hordes.

[-] 0 points by VQkag2 (16478) 1 year ago

I guess you didn't count the 50 million lost in the slave trade capture/ocean crossing/submission tactics & such. I suppose christianity was only partly to blame but maybe half should be attributed?

[-] 0 points by Theeighthpieceuv8 (-32) from Seven Sisters, Wales 1 year ago

No, I did not count those lost in the slave trade and I did not count the many indigenous people that suffered as a result of English migration or the Spanish invasion. Because those people died for economic and financial reasons and not religious reasons. I was counting deaths that appeared directly attributable to religious belief.

[-] 1 points by VQkag2 (16478) 1 year ago

So the spanish didn't come to convert the heathens? The ships did not include priests? The voyages did not get blessed by the church? The spanish/portugues did not work with the church to maintain their power?

And didn't all slave traders use church/religion to justify the practice.?

I think you are mistaken.

[-] -1 points by Theeighthpieceuv8 (-32) from Seven Sisters, Wales 1 year ago

That's like saying that the Morannos and Conversos who converted to deal in slaves were commanded by the Torah; they were not - slavery both African and indigenous was a financial endeavor.

[-] 1 points by VQkag2 (16478) 1 year ago

Ahh so then they get a buy for those 10's of millions. Convenient!

Nice of you.

Some think religion was a major power in all european countries, that the Roman Catholic Church was the evolved Roman empire. They controlled more wealth than most European countries, Controlled most education, and had to bless the various kings of european countries.

Why wouldn't the church be responsible for the govts that worked hand in hand with them

[-] 0 points by Theeighthpieceuv8 (-32) from Seven Sisters, Wales 1 year ago

The Vatican may have acquiesced but it never openly endorsed African slavery; it was largely opposed to slavery, and in particular indigenous slavery, by the end of the 16th century. To put this another way, the message of the Vatican was rather confusing and there was no direct involvement.

In reference to the relationship, Roman Catholicism to New World missionary, communications with the Vatican were forbidden; the missionaries were ordered to remain independent of papal interference and all correspondence to the Pope was filtered through the Spanish Crown.

The Catholic Church is not responsible for New World slavery. Although they are partially responsible fro driving the Moors from the Iberian peninsula. But this, very obviously, is territorial and not religious.

[-] 0 points by VQkag2 (16478) 1 year ago

But the catholic church didn't use their direct communication/influence with the spanish crown to stop it. And the Catholic church DID benefit from Spanish missionary work. So.....

The Catholic Church does share responsibility for new world Slavery and the slaughter of millions as a result.

I think the right number was about 93 million slaugtered by the catholic church or their agents.

Any other organization responsible for more death?

[-] 0 points by Theeighthpieceuv8 (-32) from Seven Sisters, Wales 1 year ago

We're essentially talking Charles V here; it was Charles V who oversaw the expansion of New Spain into Mexico and Peru. And it was Charles V who invaded Rome, imprisoned Pope Clement the 7th, and prevented the annulment of Henry VIII's marriage to Catherine of Aragon.

If anyone at all is "responsible" for African slavery it was the African monarchs themselves who initiated and promoted the trade; followed in close second by the Spanish Crown which licensed the trade.

Any other organization responsible for more death than the Christians?

Well, duh...

[-] 0 points by VQkag2 (16478) 1 year ago

So the Dutch, portuguez, English, french, & Americans don't deserve metion? Just the Afrixan monarchs, & the spanish crown.

LOL.

Too funny.

[-] -2 points by Clancy (42) 1 year ago

Yeah, we'll said.

[-] -2 points by highlander (-163) 1 year ago

OK. We tax the wealthy. You guys will go dancing in the streets, banging your pots and singing. Let us move forward 10 years. I wonder who will be considered the wealthy then?

[-] 3 points by bensdad (8977) 1 year ago

Not a serious question, but I'll give you a serious answer- If it was up to me, I would tax the 1% at 50% and the second from the top 1% at 40% what would you do?


here's a simplified hypothetical:
If you were a stock broker or an artist and your income was
$10,000,000 - putting you in the 50% marginal rate bracket
so your net is $5,000,000
now there is a new tax bracket of 60% on money OVER $10,000,000 YOU have an opportunity to make an extra gross $1,000,000 this year on top of your $5,000,000 net so you can take home an additional $400,000 after the new tax ion the additional million- or do you decide not to?

[-] 1 points by highlander (-163) 1 year ago

I could perhaps work my ass off and earn $10 million, only to have Papa Government take 5.5 million of that. On top of that, I could be villified by the Progressives and the Dems and the Media that they have in their pocket. Thanks, but no thanks, I would pack my money and underwear and ship overseas to a country that is a little less progressive, but would perhaps have people who would be grateful to have a fucking job!

[-] -3 points by OTP (-203) from Tampa, FL 1 year ago

Right. The party that accepts more bribes than the Dems from the insurance cartel is actually going to repeal it. The biggest payout ever to one of the top three lobbyists is going to change. haha. moron.

As if nominating the guy with Romneycare wasnt enough. hahaha/.

Stop insulting the site.

[-] 2 points by bensdad (8977) 1 year ago

The ACA is the best that could be pushed thru the koch stooges in the house. LOOK at the numbers - how many Rs voted against the ACA
and tell me why
Do you seriously believe that if we replaced the 50 tp reps in congres with "Elizabeth Warrens", that the Ds would NOT pass Medicare for all?
Seriously?