Welcome login | signup
Language en es fr
OccupyForum

Forum Post: Infectious disease insurgencies

Posted 1 month ago on July 26, 2014, 8:50 a.m. EST by grapes (3036)
This content is user submitted and not an official statement

Infectious diseases have made strong comebacks but our defenses such as antibiotics are dwindling. In this jet age, the citizens of Netherlands turned out to be right on top of warring Eastern Ukraine and were murdered. We are all targets of the infectious disease insurgencies spread globally sometimes at jet speeds. Deadly Ebola flies to Nigeria.

What can we do? What should we do to prevent pandemics?

38 Comments

38 Comments


Read the Rules
[-] 2 points by JackHall (401) 1 month ago

Doctors Without Borders has described the Ebola epidemic sweeping across West Africa as “out of control.” The Ebola virus, which is fatal in 90 percent of cases, has killed more than 670 people in West Africa and spread to 60 locations in four countries. The obstacles to bringing the virus under control are formidable, among them a shortage of medical resources and resistance from local communities terrified by a disease they do not understand.

The current outbreak began in Guinea in March. Sierra Leone is now the epicenter of the epidemic. The situation is deteriorating rapidly in Liberia. On Friday, a man died of an Ebola infection in Lagos, Nigeria.

Nurses and doctors are also falling victim to the disease. Two American aid workers have tested positive, and a doctor at Liberia’s largest hospital, the John F. Kennedy Memorial Medical Center in Monrovia, has died of the disease. The virus is amplified by a mobile population, especially across the shared borders between Guinea, Sierra Leone and Liberia. In the Nigerian case, the infected victim entered on a passenger flight from Liberia. The World Health Organization and the Nigerian government have shut down the hospital where the man died, and other passengers on the flight are being tracked down and tested.

The Ebola Outbreak

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/07/30/opinion/the-ebola-outbreak.html?_r=0

[-] 2 points by grapes (3036) 1 month ago

The West African region needs to impose no-fly restrictions on anyone running a fever or exhibiting sickness symptoms. SARS, MERS, and West Nile all spread to North America by passengers on jets. Curbing the spread at the sources are the most cost-efficient way to prevent the spreading. The lower the dimensionality of the containment zone, the easier it is to contain the spreading (flying zone is three dimensional; country quarantine zones are two dimensional; funneling traffic onto a single road is one dimensional).

The big challenge this time with Ebola (which has erupted sporadically since 1976) is that it appears in densely populated areas where people are both well connected and mobile. Nigeria has the largest population in Africa. NYC people fit the description of well connected and mobile, too.

[Removed]

[-] 2 points by pigeonlady (177) from Brooklyn, NY 1 month ago

Don't go to Brooklyn Hospital. Most of the staff there do not sanitize, wash, or glove, especially the Caribbeans. I've argued with nurses who say they showered yesterday, that means they're 'clean', and you don't wash your hands unless you're dirty!! Use the restroom at the same time and you'll see what I mean. They're so busy socializing and picking up coworkers they don't do the basics. As a former 'bubble' candidate my susceptibility makes 'small' things like that of great hazard to me personally. Paramedics are inexplicably cleaner, and always wash! They're handling the same people, in contact with the same germs, they just are more cautious and don't think they're so holy they are exempt from the rules of nature and physics. All attending medics are to wash between every patient or wear the gdamn gloves, and change them in between each contact. But they don't. Any patient is within their rights to ask a doctor or nurse if they washed after the last patient. Caveat emptor, buyer beware. We or our insurance are paying to be made sick!!

[-] 2 points by grapes (3036) 1 month ago

I have just thought of the Hindu "handshake" which can be great for greeting people without passing germs through contact. Putting your two hands together right in front of your chest as if you are praying and a little nod of your head show a welcome and respect with no contact. If the Westerners do not change their handshaking custom fast, maybe the Hindus will inherit the world.

[Removed]

[-] 1 points by grapes (3036) 1 month ago

We ARE already in the New Globalized Age! Our only hope is walls for germs but no walls for sympathy, compassion, and respect.

[-] 1 points by grapes (3036) 1 month ago

Could it be that the nurses are farther removed from the paramedics on the frontline of fighting diseases so they feel safer and more relaxed? In EU's responses to Russia's being on the prowl, the ones farthest from Russia such as France and the Netherlands were the most nonchalant about meeting the threat but the ones which could feel the hot moist breaths of the polar bear were more agitated.

Behaviors of the nurses will probably improve after a major outbreak of infectious disease at Brooklyn Hospital which shows that they are really right on the frontline. All patients should insist on their healthcare providers follow hygienic procedures meticulously between consecutive patients. Sometimes, your and others' lives are at stake.

[-] 1 points by pigeonlady (177) from Brooklyn, NY 1 month ago

They're handling the same people. Incoming patients transported via ambulance are not bathed or disinfected before arrival. Nurses are not really removed from the contact with bacteria. Perceptual.

[-] 1 points by grapes (3036) 1 month ago

Yes, indeed, perception IS reality until reality pokes through to change perception.

[-] 1 points by MattHolck0 (1301) 1 month ago

ZMapp uses an approach called passive immunotherapy. Instead of having a vaccine stimulate the immune system to make antibodies that attack the virus, passive immunotherapy simply supplies the antibodies to the patients. For some infectious diseases, these antibodies are extracted from the blood of patients who have survived the infection and presumably have effective antibodies.

ZMapp instead consists of antibodies that are made by exposing mice to a key Ebola protein and harvesting their antibodies. Those antibodies are then genetically modified to make them more like human antibodies and therefore less likely to provoke an immune reaction if injected into people.

Ebola Therapy From an Obscure Biotech Firm Is Hurried Along

[-] 1 points by grapes (3036) 1 month ago

Here is another U.S.-government funded potential Ebola treatment: FDA relaxed clinical hold on Canadian (Vancouver) company Tekmira with a candidate Ebola treatment.

[-] 1 points by grapes (3036) 1 month ago

The Ebola crisis afflicting repatriated U.S. citizens (Kent Brantly and Nancy Writebol) put pressure on the U.S. to come up with the best-hope treatment it has. It is definitely a step in the correct direction towards a treatment but it may well be too little and too late for the current outbreak of Ebola in West Africa.

The best-hope ZMapp treatment has not even completed Phase I of the three-phase trials required by the FDA. Phase I assesses in closely monitored medical environment the toxicity of the treatment in a number of healthy human individuals. Kent Brantly and Nancy Writebol were very sick individuals, definitely not healthy, and their number being two is too low to assess toxicity for larger diverse human population. Their participations in the best-hope ZMapp treatment were a desperate measure of last resort. ZMapp, even if it were to have passed all three-phase trials of the FDA would still have great difficulty of scaling up production quickly. Imagine watching the tobacco plants grow to produce the monoclonal antibodies. This reminds me of the saying, "watching the grass grow." It is not comforting if life depends on it. Compare the growth rate of the number of infected individuals still alive with the rate of growth and number of the tobacco plants after inoculating them after several weeks. The current Ebola crisis is unlikely to be stopped by these tobacco plants. Fast identification, early supportive therapy, contact tracing, isolation, and quarantines are probably the methods that may be successful.

[-] 1 points by grapes (3036) 1 month ago

Wearing protective goggles/glasses and facial masks may help protect against airborne Ebola droplets of moisture because seeing and breathing can expose the mucous membranes in the eyes and airways.

Dr Gary Kobinger: we saw a lot of evidence in the lungs of the non-human primates that the virus got in that way.

[-] 1 points by grapes (3036) 1 month ago

Should we treat our farms and hospitals as bioweapon factories?

[-] 2 points by DKAtoday (28241) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 month ago

Might not be a bad cautionary action to consider - hazmat suits and self contained air supply when visiting either.

[-] 3 points by trashyharry (1893) from Waterville, NY 1 month ago

Survivaball !

[-] 1 points by grapes (3036) 1 month ago

We all have a bit of Venetian nobility at heart, don't we? Get Beethoven's Ninth and get it on. I am going Hindu with my hands (namaskar), though, to form a good habit while I am still sober.

It intrigues me whether the Hindus developed their greeting due to the existence of the "Untouchable" caste amongst them or they had actually lived through pandemics before and got wiser.

[-] 3 points by trashyharry (1893) from Waterville, NY 1 month ago

Looking at Venice on Google Maps is an addicting pastime.About the great Venetian mercantile empire,I know very little.It was my understanding that the great fortunes of the Venetian Elites were destroyed by profligate heirs who were devoted to gambling.I can't relate to such people,unless they suffered from clinical depression,which is quite possible.On the subject of Mudra,not much is known because the practice is so ancient.Your supposition that it may have developed due to something in the environment is an intelligent conjecture,IMHO.

[-] 1 points by grapes (3036) 1 month ago

Why 'Namaskar' and not a 'hand shake'?

The "black rays emitted from the hand of a person having distress of negative energy" almost seem a picture of really bad germs and infection directions. It might have been a pre-germ spiritual theory that has modern germ theory support. It is remarkable!

[-] 3 points by trashyharry (1893) from Waterville, NY 1 month ago

Agreed.The Ayurvedic Tradition is an intriguing window into seemingly endless possibility.More proof that another world is possible.

[-] 1 points by grapes (3036) 1 month ago

Absolutely, we must, however, remember to put the tradition through the strict filter of the scientific method of large-scale (long-term if necessary) randomized double-blind controlled studies before widespread adoption unless they can already be well understood by established scientific knowledge.

Traditional knowledge can provide good hypotheses but they can also be garbage. Rigorous scientific proof is still needed.

[-] 1 points by trashyharry (1893) from Waterville, NY 1 month ago

"Food for thought,grounds for further investigation."

[-] 1 points by grapes (3036) 1 month ago

Yes, we need to understand that the vocabularies of traditions often require interpretation in modern context because the ancient ones often have much empirical knowledge but they tend not to have discovered our integrated body of knowledge spanning multiple disciplines. They may have foresight but we have hindsight and with effort and humility, allsight.

[-] 1 points by trashyharry (1893) from Waterville, NY 1 month ago

Ibid.

[-] -1 points by shortNbaldNfatBUTSexy (-79) from New York, NY 1 month ago

Ibot.

You bid, I bot.

[-] 2 points by trashyharry (1893) from Waterville, NY 1 month ago

I'm sorry.I don't understand your response.Is that a joke,or some kind of a suggestion that you.or I,or someone else is a simulated user AKA 'bot?" If you think I am a "bot," or someone else is,why not just say so? If your response is a whimsical joke,I must say that I think you can do better than a mere 4 words.Are ye a wordsmith? Where be thy curlicues?

[-] 0 points by shortNbaldNfatBUTSexy (-79) from New York, NY 1 month ago

Just a simple joke. No meaning.

[-] 1 points by MattHolck0 (1301) 1 month ago

lacked content

the number that died of ebola is slightly less than the number that died in the gaza bombing

should we be scared ?

[-] 0 points by grapes (3036) 1 month ago

Can we have rapid disinfecting of air instead of the often bulky self contained air supply?

[-] 2 points by DKAtoday (28241) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 month ago

As far as hospitals go - it is possible to set-up disinfecting stations at every entry exit intersection between wards or hallways or patient room and hallway or entry exit between the building and the outside world itself. One such is no more than high power black lights to shine from above below and from each side - people walk through the light field and bugs are killed while passing through.

And I don't see why that could not also be done for entering and exiting animal housing - like milking stations or hen houses or

So take it further and they could be set up at every point of exit and entry into and out of a country or state = train stations or air-ports etc

[-] 1 points by grapes (3036) 1 month ago

We should probably have sinks, hot water, and paper towels at every entry/exit of the farm or hospital. A chemical bath with showered disinfectant can work, too. Black light may take a while to work and besides, there may be unexposed areas.

[-] 2 points by DKAtoday (28241) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 month ago

Thing about disinfectants - with regular use they can lower the bodies natural immune system and like overuse of antibiotics - germs can become resistant = mersa.

[-] 1 points by grapes (3036) 1 month ago

If everyone has their own hazmat suit, they can avoid having the disinfectants affecting their immune system. With the black light, we may design the hazmat suit to fluoresce so we can see which area is unexposed.

It is not just MRSA we need to worry about. There are also multi-drug-resistant TB, avian flu, SARS, polio, foot-and-mouth disease, etc.

[-] 2 points by DKAtoday (28241) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 month ago

That is why finding alternatives to drugs and disinfectants where ever possible would be a good thing - and certain wave lengths of light seem to be able to kill germs without the germs adapting.

[-] 1 points by grapes (3036) 1 month ago

The only problem is that in many ways our own cells are just like germs so the same wavelength light may kill them or turn them cancerous.

The classic disinfecting instrument in a clinic is an autoclave that kills by heat. Perhaps a hot-water-disinfected hazmat suit can work.

[-] 2 points by DKAtoday (28241) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 month ago

For workers that might be practical - but light would still be more effective than hot water - some germs "can" survive some really hot water - even the ones that can't need the water to be at least 200 degrees F to kill em.

[-] 1 points by grapes (3036) 1 month ago

Very true indeed. The "temperature" of some wavelength light can be far "hotter" than boiling water.