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Forum Post: Incredible Article: Voting Green in a Swing State

Posted 1 year ago on Oct. 30, 2012, 12:48 p.m. EST by hchc (3297) from Tampa, FL
This content is user submitted and not an official statement

This isnt just good on the level of what it means to do so, but also a good reflection on just what our thought processes are in these elections, and how flawed they are. Highly recommended reading.

http://www.opednews.com/articles/Voting-Green-in-a-Swing-St-by-B-Sidney-Smith-121025-298.html

67 Comments

67 Comments


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[-] 6 points by gnomunny (6587) from St Louis, MO 1 year ago

Great article, hc, with a lot of great points. I like this one:

"Check yourself: if you have mentally colored yourself red or blue, if you see the country as made up of red, blue, and purple blotches, then your political identity is no longer yours. You have been co-opted. Occupied. Welcome to the game."

I'll give you three guesses as to who, on this forum, won't be reading it. :-)

I have a question. I know you're voting third-party, but have you convinced anyone else to do likewise? People that were either voting R or D, or who hadn't planned on voting? I've talked a few people in my family to vote Rocky. They weren't planning on voting AT ALL.

[-] 4 points by hchc (3297) from Tampa, FL 1 year ago

Oh, I've got a ton that now are :) Many could care less who they vote for, because they dont have faith in the promises from the candidates anyways.

[-] 4 points by gnomunny (6587) from St Louis, MO 1 year ago

Excellent. Too bad more on this site haven't done the same over the last year. It wouldn't have swayed this election, but at least it would have shown that OWS (this site anyway) refuses to play the same old game.

[-] 3 points by gnomunny (6587) from St Louis, MO 1 year ago

Down-votes on the comments, I see. No surprise, eh?

[-] 2 points by hchc (3297) from Tampa, FL 1 year ago

Very predictable and well trained. Ugh.,.

[-] 2 points by gnomunny (6587) from St Louis, MO 1 year ago

Hey, we've at least been vindicated in one of our comments. Months ago I predicted the, ahem, 'polls' would show the race being neck-and-neck later in the race, and I think you did as well. We'll be vindicated again after the election when Obama wins. I'll refrain from saying "I told you so" on this forum, but fuck some of these people, hc. They think they know politics. They don't know their ass from the proverbial hole in the ground.

[-] 3 points by LeoYo (5762) 1 year ago

Faith is for the religious. If people want to get something done in the real world, they should take matters into their own hands and not leave things to chance http://occupywallst.org/forum/freeda-template/ . After the election, people will have the next two years to work towards making a significant difference rather than waiting for the next vote-n-hope event.

[-] 0 points by hchc (3297) from Tampa, FL 1 year ago

I agree. By the time the election comes, all the work is already done.

[-] 1 points by TrevorMnemonic (5827) 1 year ago

The only people I've been able to talk into voting for 3rd party candidates are people that haven't voted before or have not in a while.

[-] 1 points by gnomunny (6587) from St Louis, MO 1 year ago

I'm definitely in that group. The last President I voted for was . . .<cough> . . . Reagan.

Hey I was young, what can I say?

[-] 1 points by frovikleka (2563) from Island Heights, NJ 1 year ago

We've all made mistakes gnomunny, but gee! lol

[-] 2 points by gnomunny (6587) from St Louis, MO 1 year ago

But, heh, at least I'm not afraid to admit it, hehheh. It actually gets worse, though. Back in the early '70's, when I just started high school, the guy I thought should be President was . . . . . no wait, I can't admit that even to myself!

[-] 1 points by frovikleka (2563) from Island Heights, NJ 1 year ago

Still without the knowlege of who you supported in the early '70s, you're more courageous than me. :-)

I will admit though that when I first came here, i was afraid that OWS was too radical, and now i fear that they are not radical enough.

This is turning into a political-like version of AA.

~Odin~

[-] 1 points by gnomunny (6587) from St Louis, MO 1 year ago

Interesting analogy. I'm thinking more like mental patients than alcoholics. Do they have MA meetings? heheheh

[-] 1 points by TrevorMnemonic (5827) 1 year ago

Tom Morello said it best. "You're never too far down the wrong road to turn back and change your plan. Save the hammer for the man"

Who are you voting for this year if you don't mind me asking? Congress level too

[-] 1 points by gnomunny (6587) from St Louis, MO 1 year ago

I've always liked Rage.

I plan on voting for Rocky, but Jill's been pretty impressive lately. And she's on the ballot here, so I may flip-flop at the last minute. Probably not, but considering the Green Party will probably get a ton more votes than Rocky's, it would be nice to see a kick-ass turn out for the Green Party this time. Might send a message to the people maybe. It might give the Green a leg up for 2016.

As for Congress, man, we've got shit for choices IMO. There's Todd Akin, the Rep, so that ain't happening. Claire McCaskill's voted for just about every bill we've been railing against here, NDAA, TARP, you name it. So, that's a vote for Obama policies. The other guy's name is John Dine (Libertarian), but I haven't checked his credentials. It's gonna be Claire or Todd, no doubt, so I might not even bother with pushing that button.

[-] 2 points by TrevorMnemonic (5827) 1 year ago

I like Jill because she is also a protester. It takes a lot of guts to hit the streets and get out and protest like she does. I have great respect for her!

You're a Missouri guy? I'm not too far away. I'm in Nebraska. Lol at Akin. That's definitely not happening. If that guy gets re-elected I will be shocked.

I'm going with John Ewing for congress. Preferred someone else in the primaries. Wish their was a third option. I'm really hoping he takes out Lee Terry. I despise Lee Terry so much. The guy voted to give himself a raise during a growing deficit and a financial crisis where millions of Americans were losing their jobs. He has voted in favor of every piece of legislation that is wrong. He must go. Him leaving Congress will make me very happy.

Senate I can't support either one of them. Still debating that.

[-] 3 points by gnomunny (6587) from St Louis, MO 1 year ago

Nebraska? I'll lived there for a couple years in North Platte. St. Louis gets some damn cold winters, but once I moved there i realized the true meaning of "bitter cold." heh heh heh. The coldest day I ever had to work outside was Winter '79. Seventeen below, wind chill minus 70! No bullshit. Still makes me shiver to think about.

[-] 1 points by frovikleka (2563) from Island Heights, NJ 1 year ago

Greetings From Alaska. You guys are babies.

[-] 1 points by gnomunny (6587) from St Louis, MO 1 year ago

Greetings from the lower 48. You guys are crazy! brrrrrrrrrrrrrr

But I do admit. From what I hear, the Alaskan attitude is right up my alley.

[-] 1 points by frovikleka (2563) from Island Heights, NJ 1 year ago

Except for some of those who are running away from something in the lower '48, Alaskans have great attiudes for the most part.

Nights here are near the single digits, and days get up to the low 30s, but it is the dang wind that emanates mostly from the glaciers 30 miles or so away that are crazy. They have been blowing steady, at 25-40 mph, and gusting a lot higher for the past week. When you park your car, it's best to park into the wind lest you might have your door blown off, if you don't hold onto it. Of couse, I don't have to worry about that, as i have been using my ex-wifes car. just kidding ;-)

~Odin~

[-] 1 points by gnomunny (6587) from St Louis, MO 1 year ago

That's what makes winters in western Nebraska so cold I think. You have that cold wind and snow come down the eastern side of the Rockies and it's nothing but nearly barren flat lands. No wooded areas as windbreaks, no hills and valleys to break it up. Just endless, flat plains.

[-] 1 points by frovikleka (2563) from Island Heights, NJ 1 year ago

Yep, i know that feeling of having cold winds blow down on you unhindered by wind-breaks of any sort from my thirty plus years of working on the boats out of New York.

~Odin~

[-] 2 points by Nevada1 (4651) 1 year ago

Yes, Rocky and Jill are excellent.

[-] 3 points by gnomunny (6587) from St Louis, MO 1 year ago

Hi, Nev. I was leaning strongly toward Rocky at first. I noticed there were quite a few issues he didn't have comments on. I went thru it twice and both times Jill came out on top. I went thru twice 'cause the first time I automatically chose yes or no on topics I felt strongly about. The second time, I check out the "other options" button on all questions. It's a lot more accurate I noticed. What's funny is the first, half-assed time, Rocky was third. On the second more complete try, he was fourth! I'm starting to lean toward Jill here in the eleventh hour.

[-] 5 points by Shule (1976) 1 year ago

It is becoming increasingly clear to me, what we really should be focusing on is not the election next Tuesday, but rather mounting an opposition for whomever does get elected.

[-] 2 points by hchc (3297) from Tampa, FL 1 year ago

I think that hits the nail on the head.

[-] 1 points by gsw (2693) 1 year ago

Yes. Look at you voters guide. Examine who wins locally, in your distinct..

Follow their votes. Study up.

Then, get your papers together and run your best local occupy poll.

Someone's got to step out and be leaders politically.

And you can get out the info locally on non corporate candidate options.

Great article. You've been up voted.

[-] 1 points by Shule (1976) 1 year ago

I'm thinking more along the lines of Malcom X.

[-] 1 points by MattLHolck (16833) from San Diego, CA 1 year ago

more focus on news events?

[-] 1 points by Shule (1976) 1 year ago

Now, Malcom X did do more than just make headlines.....

[-] 1 points by DanielBarton (1345) 1 year ago

perfectly stated the election in 2014 is a much more important one that we can influence

[-] 0 points by Nevada1 (4651) 1 year ago

Agree.

[-] 4 points by zacherystaylor (243) 1 year ago

A vote for the establishment is falling for the same trick over and over again; as W said "There's an old saying in Tennessee — I know it's in Texas, probably in Tennessee — that says, fool me once, shame on — shame on you. Fool me — you can't get fooled again."

Vote for evil and they both get eviler!

Here's another good one on the same issue reprinted in Oped news as well.

http://www.opednews.com/articles/Obama-and-Romney-Brothers-by-Glen-Ford-121024-852.html

[-] 1 points by Nevada1 (4651) 1 year ago

Agree.

[-] 3 points by Nevada1 (4651) 1 year ago

Good article hchc. It says so much. Good news site.

[-] 2 points by nomdeguerre (1775) from Brooklyn, NY 1 year ago

Keep it up little kids. You are the same fools who fell for the Bull Moose Party, that split the Taft vote, giving us Woodrow Wilson and the FED -- it was a plan, the progressive voters were being played, just like you are now.

On a scale of badness from 1 to 10, Obama may be a 7, but Romney is a 30.

A vote for Romney (and that includes a direct vote for Romney, a third-party vote in a contested state, or an abstention) is a vote for Cheney, Rice and the neocons. The individuals who pined for a New Pearl Harbor a year before 9/11 happened. Amazing coincidence.

[-] 1 points by hchc (3297) from Tampa, FL 1 year ago

Clinton was a Bush guy, you realize that right? And world trade was bombed on his watch too, and he bombed Saddam three seperate times. You hacks are too dumb to connect the dots. Like Bush is some leader who came in and changed the course of the nation. Bush is an idiot. Just like CLinton. Just like Obama.

Your two parties were bought out a long time ago.

Seems how you are such a hack, you should fuckin LOVE Ross Perot. I guess the establishment wanted Clinton more than Ex cia at the time.

Get out of your own way. Or at least go to your GA and tell everyone that Jill Stein is evil. Id love to see that. Please livestream it.

[-] 1 points by nomdeguerre (1775) from Brooklyn, NY 1 year ago

I like Jill Stein, if there were instant runoff voting I might vote for her (I haven't studied the third party candidates). I don't believe she's in on the scam.

There's no doubt that Clinton was owned by the Bushes.

I don't believe the puppetmasters have the detailed, exact control you describe. After all they are puppetmasters of live puppets. Live puppets who will act on their own, who may stray off the reservation. They play the odds.

[-] 2 points by hchc (3297) from Tampa, FL 1 year ago

If they stray, they know what happens. The precedent has already been sent. Its why we need radical leaders, not these prechoosen puppets- that is the words of this site, not mine.

[-] 1 points by nomdeguerre (1775) from Brooklyn, NY 1 year ago

We, OWSers, progressives, Ron Paul folks (the FED is sacrosanct to the power elite), dissidents, constitutionalists, patriots, would not survive another 9/11 crime.

[-] 1 points by VQkag2 (16478) 1 year ago

Well said.

Keep the right wing wackos out.

Then get back to the business of remaking the broken system after the election.

[-] 2 points by nomdeguerre (1775) from Brooklyn, NY 1 year ago

I believe Oped News is a psyop site. One of those that tell truths for 99 days, so they can sell their lies on the 100th day.

After the election, OWS and the progressives need to figure out how to takeover the Democratic Party. It's not that hard, it's divided into small district clubs under majority rule.

Any true third party believer should back intant-runoff-voting, otherwise they're just manipulators.

[-] 1 points by VQkag2 (16478) 1 year ago

I support instant runnoff, open primaries. Eliminate elctoral college, mandatory voting. and money out of politics. I would urge everyone to support real election/campaign reform.

Peace, & Solidarity.

[-] 1 points by nomdeguerre (1775) from Brooklyn, NY 1 year ago

If any so-called third party partisans don't support real election/campaign reform then they are frauds trying to thwart the popular will with cynical, machaevellian third party manipulations (the third party standard bearer doesn't have to be in on the fraud -- most of our third party candidates are personally of very high caliber as far as I'm concerned).

You forgot to add making Election Day a holiday.

[-] 1 points by VQkag2 (16478) 1 year ago

3rd party supporters are naive, shortsighted at best. Evil, right wing, Machiavellian at worst.

Definitely election holiday. extended early voting, And so much more.

[-] 0 points by nomdeguerre (1775) from Brooklyn, NY 1 year ago

Absolutely correct.

[-] -1 points by VQkag2 (16478) 1 year ago

5 days to go!

[-] 2 points by NVPHIL (664) 1 year ago

This quote puts into words an idea I have not been able to name.

If Romney is elected, he will re-empower neocons and serve the interests of the national security state with (perhaps) greater zeal than Obama would, but with this difference: his every move will be scrutinized and hampered by a determined opposition. Also if Romney is elected, he will try to privatize Social Security and Medicare and transfer even what little remains of the nation's wealth to the oligarchs--but he will face the same wall of opposition that stymied Bush on these issues. Obama, on the other hand, can continue to negotiate away Social Security and Medicare and progressive taxation and face only whimpers from his own base. Romney may nominate a justice likely to reverse Roe v. Wade, but it would be with the certain knowledge he was engendering an electoral tsunami against Republicans that would last a generation, if not forever. Obama will nominate another corporatist jurist certain to further indenture flesh-and-blood citizens to their corporate-citizen betters, and pay no political price. From the bank bailouts to climate change to Israel/Palestine to the Patriot Act--one could go on

[-] 0 points by nomdeguerre (1775) from Brooklyn, NY 1 year ago

How's the determined opposition doing in Minnesota, Michigan, Florida, etc. Not so good. Your cutting off your nose to spite your face.

[-] 2 points by hchc (3297) from Tampa, FL 1 year ago

Behave yourself of you will be indefinitely detained. Good thing you dont live in Libya, Yemen, Somolia, Pakistan, Iraq, and Afghanistan...

Ofcourse we have just sent troops into Uganda, Sudan, Guatemala and now Turkey (getting ready for that last piece of the ME puzzle)...

If only you could vote for Dems, let them know you are happy, then surely things would change!!

Thats all they need is votes. Lets them know the public still trusts em. Now go and give it to em.

[-] 1 points by MattLHolck (16833) from San Diego, CA 1 year ago

lol

[-] 1 points by NVPHIL (664) 1 year ago

Where is the opposition to ndaa and obama's kill list. You can't honestly say the reps would have gotten away with this without much greater opposition then obama has received.

[-] 1 points by nomdeguerre (1775) from Brooklyn, NY 1 year ago

I think you are correct on almost all counts. But I don't think it's Obama's kill list, he's merely an employee.

Absolutely, there is an authoritarian, fascistic structure being set up. But who would wield it with murderous effect? Who would you rather have as leader, Satan or Satan's involuntary servant?

I'm quite willing to vote for Obama and then turn around and fight him (as a proxy for his masters) tooth and claw. The surrender of the "peace movement" is a massive failure.

On another hand, NDAA and many other monstrosities are, to their core, no matter what crooks in robes say, absolutely unconstitutional. And thus null and void.

[-] 1 points by NVPHIL (664) 1 year ago

I respect your willingness to look at the issues and not just the party in office. I might not agree with voting for either party but if we can keep the pressure on then we have a chance.

[-] 1 points by MattLHolck (16833) from San Diego, CA 1 year ago

either one will pull the lever

vote to repeal the death penalty in CA tuesday november 6th

[-] 1 points by NVPHIL (664) 1 year ago

I'm torn on the death penalty. I don't want innocent people killed but their are some crimes that are beyond forgiveness.

[-] 2 points by MattLHolck (16833) from San Diego, CA 1 year ago

what does outlawing the death penalty have to do with forgiveness ?

[-] 1 points by NVPHIL (664) 1 year ago

Not much. I had just had a conversation with someone excusing criminals with a bad childhood and let my frustration get the better of me. I believe some crimes do deserve death but the chance for innocents to be put on death row is too great.

[-] 1 points by MattLHolck (16833) from San Diego, CA 1 year ago

no one deserves death

[-] 1 points by NVPHIL (664) 1 year ago

I have to disagree. If someone takes an innocent life I believe they have given up their right to live.

[-] 1 points by VQkag2 (16478) 1 year ago

There are many crimes that are unforgivable! And I would want to kill an assailant myself if they hurt my loved ones. But as you point out. It is the whole innocent person thing.

We have to be satisfied with life in prison with no chance of parole.

The state should not be killing people. Not even Charles Manson.

It's tough but it is best.

[-] 1 points by NVPHIL (664) 1 year ago

I know you're right about that. I just think we are to soft on child predators and let my frustration influence me.

[-] 1 points by VQkag2 (16478) 1 year ago

I agree. They deserve a special place in hell (if hell exists).

I just can't say I approve of the state killing people since they are clearly unjust.

[-] 0 points by Nevada1 (4651) 1 year ago

Good Post

[-] 2 points by TrevorMnemonic (5827) 1 year ago

Preface to the article

"This article isn't really meant for everyone, so I might be able to save you some time. If you think climate change isn't a serious electoral issue, this probably wasn't written for you. If you think American presidents should conduct wars on their own authority and that it's okay if they secretly assassinate whomever they (secretly) decide are bad people who might hurt us then you needn't concern yourself with what follows. If you think the Bill of Rights of the Constitution doesn't necessarily apply when terrorism is involved, or that letting gays have civil rights should be decided on a state-by-state basis like slavery before the civil war, or that the health of the environment isn't more important than economic growth, or that whistleblowers who expose governmental and corporate crimes should go to prison but that privileged lawbreakers shouldn't, or that whether a candidate is electable should depend on how much she pleases wealthy donors--if any of these approximates your own take on the issues, please read no further. You'll be bored. Honestly.)"

[-] 1 points by frovikleka (2563) from Island Heights, NJ 1 year ago

Good post hchc. I think i mentioned in another thread that i have already done an absentee vote and went Green all the way except for one Marijuana party candidate for a state office.....not that I want to light up, mind you, but rather because the War On Drugs is insane.

~Odin~