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Forum Post: Happy Birthday to the greatest country ever!!

Posted 2 years ago on July 4, 2012, 2:01 p.m. EST by delayedgrat (-157)
This content is user submitted and not an official statement

Where ANYONE can go from poverty to affluence with consistent effort. Where a man/ woman can chart their own future and live the dream. Your only limits are self induced.

Is this a great country, or what?!

336 Comments

336 Comments


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[-] 6 points by jph (2652) 2 years ago

There is nothing about america that makes it better than anywhere else, in fact america has been losing so much ground in the last 30 years, that we are only number one in weapons production, and the amount of people that we hold in our prisons!

Profits over everything?? Nothing "great" about it at all.

[-] 1 points by shadz66 (19985) 2 years ago

Re. "Greatest Country Ever" :

veritas vos liberabit ...

[-] 1 points by PeterKropotkin (1050) from Oakland, CA 2 years ago

Thats pretty good where is it from?

[-] 1 points by shadz66 (19985) 2 years ago

Beginning scene of the new HBO series 'The Newsroom'.

fiat lux et pax ..

[-] 1 points by PeterKropotkin (1050) from Oakland, CA 2 years ago

I miss HBO but i can't have it. Someone has to have showtime so she can watch Dexter.

[-] 1 points by shadz66 (19985) 2 years ago

LOL !!! Where'd you be without "someone" tho' ?!! "Dexter" ?! Sounds 'Sinister', lol !

pax, amor et lux ...

[-] 1 points by PeterKropotkin (1050) from Oakland, CA 2 years ago

Yeh she's lying here snoring into my ear right now. She's worth it.

[-] 1 points by shadz66 (19985) 2 years ago

Bless !!! Here's something for you to peruse re. "The Imperial U$A" - after you've found some earplugs :

fiat pax ...

[-] 1 points by PeterKropotkin (1050) from Oakland, CA 2 years ago

I can't read this right now I took some sleeping pills for my insomnia and to be honest all they make me want to do is party.

[-] 1 points by shadz66 (19985) 2 years ago

LOL ! Save it to 'bookmarks' for later !! Fighting the effect of your sleeping pills will leave you trippy now and heavy headed and befuddled tomorrow !!!

dormire bene ...

[-] 1 points by PeterKropotkin (1050) from Oakland, CA 2 years ago

Rightd

[Removed]

[Removed]

[-] -1 points by Clancy (42) 2 years ago

I don't see peoole risking their lives to get into Brazil or Germany or France.

[-] 6 points by jph (2652) 2 years ago

You don't see, because you don't look, and your eyes are glazed over by that mental illness of blind-faith NATIONALISM.

Wikipedia; " Since the 1970s, France has continued being a country of mass immigration. In recent years, immigrants have accounted for one quarter of the population growth Net migration is estimated at 93,600 persons, slightly more than in 2005. 11.8 million foreign-born immigrants and their direct descendants (second generation) lived in France representing 19% of the country's population.

In 2009, the country was home to 3,982,000 foreign born people, that represents 2.36% of the Brazilian population. n 2010, Brazil is home to 4,251 refugees from 76 different nationalities. The largest refugee ancestries were Angolan (1688), Colombian (583), Congolese (402), Liberian (259), and Iraqi (197)

(in 2010) The largest absolute numbers of people born outside the EU were in Germany (6.4 million), France (5.1 million)

Nearly 14 million immigrants entered the United States from 2000 to 2010. "

So the USA take ~1million a year,. while all the other countries you mention take MORE! Nationalism, and the cry of "how great" you are, is just blindness, and stupidity. If you want to be great you must open your eyes.

[-] 2 points by Neuwurldodr (744) 2 years ago

That's because you are not a part of Corporate America's entourage who have moved to Brazil, bought up property, imported their own kind and our goods, leaving us without those jobs and pay practically nothing to the people who live there. They delight in keeping those who live in the ramshackle tinpan (same as Johannesburg and Apartheid era) hill shacks economically depressed and mentally enslaved. As stated before, this country did and still do, as many others in Europe, got their wealth through the exploitation of other nations. When are you going to come to grips with that reality? It is being done here to your own kind right in front of your eyes and you still want to remain asleep? No one is bashing this country, per se, it is what the rulers do to continue to enslave its own people to maintain their dominion, power and wealth that is in question!

[+] -7 points by delayedgrat (-157) 2 years ago

Yes, there is lots that make America better. Only in the increasingly tinier world of OWS, where the self hatred is endemic, is America to be cursed.

[-] 3 points by jph (2652) 2 years ago

So you like that we are losing in all areas except incarceration rates and weapons production? How does that make any place "great" ??

Or are you just here to bitch about Occupy?

[+] -4 points by delayedgrat (-157) 2 years ago

OWS now only represents the 1% that hate America. Your mission will never resonate with the common man as long as you constantly portray America as evil. People that go to baseball games and Nascar races and state fairs love their country.

[-] 2 points by Neuwurldodr (744) 2 years ago

Knowledge base? Very limited.

Are you a 17 year old, still wet behind the ears and unable to understand the real world?

[-] -2 points by delayedgrat (-157) 2 years ago

Real world? As OWS continues to alienate people from all walks of life, I doubt there will be much real world left.

[-] 2 points by arturo (3169) from Shanghai, Shanghai 2 years ago

The "American System" of economics:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_School_%28economics%29

is what once made us great. To the extent that we have abandoned it for free trade/globalization, we have abandoned that greatness. That is, we have given up our manufacturing capacity, allowed our infrastructure to decline to grades C and D, closed our schools and hospitals.

The greatness of America still exists in potential, but we need to reclaim it.

[-] 1 points by Neuwurldodr (744) 2 years ago

If you will take time to learn your "true" history, you will understand that the "newcomers" alienated all people and all nations that existed on these shores.about 800 years ago. That was the goal then and that is the goal now, but look around, it has moved further beyond a color barrier...hasn't it?. Furthermore, how can OWS further divide a country that never had a unified base or thought regarding its populace (all colors, creeds, nationalities and religions) in the first damn place? As I have stated before, as long as a certain segment was being used to make this country wealthy, those who benefited from it could give less than a rats ass what became of anyone else! Tell me what part of history (that you have been indoctrinated with) shows where "people from all walks of life" maintained a cohesive and equal existence with one another on these shores. Just one example....and then I'll get my bull shyt blaster back out for ya with facts, not fiction!

Who gives you your answers....your baby sister?

[-] 3 points by MaryS (678) 2 years ago

America I Give You My Heart by Andrea lynne Zimmerman

Doctors please roll up the cart, your nurse, and let my surgery start, for today I have ripped out my heart. If there is a way to use it for the people on the streets, make sure it is free as they have nothing to eat. What General Washington did foretell, as he bravely stood in battle by the cold Delaware, he put in his journals notes about a paper money beast, that my country not be lost to commerce pirates as he fought for no defeat! That no paper spun from fiber in one breath of a viper, Shall rule a land like an island does a nation. And known by all men created, Thomas Jefferson relayed this. Yet now one stroke of a pen does wipe out nations of men. In the name of gold once sold in fair shares, now worthless as money in thin air. What my father did work for and all my 20 years of service, has no value but my number on a certificate of birth, for Wall Streets decision about all of our net worth. Did not our sacrifice have more glory, than this horrible ending to such a sad story? Has it no greater meaning than these treasonous global secret meetings? Doctor please do your best mends and repairs, With no more heart, I might live like those beasts, who abandon us in the streets, And never know my country’s deep despair , But even then my mind will know that we were all so cleverly told, that gold so oversold is okay to make into paper. And then, “We will rape her Miss Liberty” the viper said! “Just lay on the honey, and no one will stare”, “Her people are sleeping watching that millionaire show”, “Hey turn up the neon lights they like it when it glows!” “And if they awake, we will make a war break” “Distract them from our game” “And pain from death will make them weak and our selves much prosperous gain” “We come by day in one easy breath”, “Land of bold and brave and free”, “A vipers’ venom is in your veins and its color green” My sweet land of liberty, Here is my blood, You have my heart, Cut out and in a cart Don’t let my sacrifice be in waste, Now get to work, The beast is here, Oh so near, My God, Do They Hear? Andrea Zimmerman for Every Soldier of Truth

[-] 3 points by flip (7101) 2 years ago

I'm sure most Americans are mighty proud of the fact that Julian Assange is so frightened of falling into the custody of the United States that he had to seek sanctuary in the embassy of Ecuador, a tiny and poor Third World country, without any way of knowing how it would turn out. He might be forced to be there for years. "That'll teach him to mess with the most powerful country in the world! All you other terrorists and anti-Americans out there — Take Note! When you fuck around with God's country you pay a price!"

How true. You do pay a price. Ask the people of Cuba, Vietnam, Chile, Yugoslavia, Iraq, Iran, Haiti, etc., etc., etc. And ask the people of Guantánamo, Diego Garcia, Bagram, and a dozen other torture centers to which God's country offers free transportation.

[-] 1 points by Neuwurldodr (744) 2 years ago

What a crock! The United States of America's government, as you all know it, has had a hand in overthrowing, disrupting and instituting their policies in most of the countries you write about!

Don't believe it? Try this...."United States foreign policies in _". Now fill in the blank with each country you have mentioned, Google it and see what develops.... Now, once you've read all the fluff and powder puff propaganda, Google this, "Covert United States foreign regime change actions in ____" once again, fill in the blanks... Happy reading!

Oh, and don't forget...South Africa, the Sudan, in fact most of Africa, and Afghanistan, and oh, hey....put in any country or nation you want, even the Japanese Americans and Indigenous people on these shores. This is the beauty of being morons living in the US while supporting Wall Street and Corporate America, since they will let you continue to dream on at your own expense! Now...understand the entities here in America who claim to run this country are many. I believe your history has gotten lost in the sauce.

Boy, what illusions you all like to live with!!!

[-] 1 points by flip (7101) 2 years ago

you writing to me?

[-] 0 points by Neuwurldodr (744) 2 years ago

Why.......did you read it?

Why......are you a moron?

If the information helps you in anyway, form or fashion, you have my blessings.

[-] 1 points by flip (7101) 2 years ago

i did read it - twice and it makes no sense if it is a response to me so thanks for the offering of your blessings but keep them - you need them more than i do you unpleasant little shit

[-] 0 points by Neuwurldodr (744) 2 years ago

Well, if it didn't make sense....why are you on this forum?

A tad bit above your realm of thought, wouldn't you agree?

Better yet, stick around, you just might learn something, you unpleasant little child!

[-] 1 points by freewriterguy (882) 2 years ago

the most powerful country whose government has run amuck imposing on our liberties when were only hired to protect our liberties.

[-] -2 points by delayedgrat (-157) 2 years ago

You are another wack job.

[-] 2 points by flip (7101) 2 years ago

and you are a patriot - the last refuge of the scoundrel

[-] 3 points by writerconsidered123 (344) 2 years ago

well it's either a birthday or a eulogy

[-] 3 points by jrhirsch (4714) from Sun City, CA 2 years ago

The greatest disparity in wealth! The greatest percentage of prisoners! The greatest numbers of wars fought! The greatest number of people who believe government lies!

[+] -5 points by delayedgrat (-157) 2 years ago

Hey, if you dont like America and cant appreciate whatthis country has done, leave.

[-] 4 points by jrhirsch (4714) from Sun City, CA 2 years ago

Typical response by someone who can't refute the truth. I'll stay and fight.

[-] 0 points by betuadollar (-313) 2 years ago

I'm dusting off the ammo as they speak.

[-] -2 points by DKAtoday (23961) from Coon Rapids, MN 2 years ago

That is what should be said to the corpoRATions - America love it or leave it.

[-] -2 points by delayedgrat (-157) 2 years ago

And whatb hapens to the 85000 well paid Halliburton employees?

[-] -3 points by DKAtoday (23961) from Coon Rapids, MN 2 years ago

They can start-up a new business or new businesses - and get together with the other 150,000,000 unemployed/underemployed/underpaid Americans and do something good for society like implementation of green technology in our infra-structure.

[-] -2 points by delayedgrat (-157) 2 years ago

You're insane.

[-] -3 points by DKAtoday (23961) from Coon Rapids, MN 2 years ago

No - you are thinking of the greedy corpoRATs.

So who are you shilling for?

[-] -2 points by delayedgrat (-157) 2 years ago

The average joe working for Halliburton makes $75000. You want him to drop that and open a green business? Thats crazy.

[-] -3 points by DKAtoday (23961) from Coon Rapids, MN 2 years ago

You have no vision. Shift your paradigm.

Green is clean money - a healthy and profitable way to make a living.

Green technology can be incorporated into our daily life same as the poison/polluting fossil fuel business is now.

Green technology can be exported as product and as aid - end fossil fuel strife and make an honest buck doing it.

Green Tech. New and improved - now with Liquid Metal Battery for efficient power storage and distribution.

This is where we should be going: Green Energy we have the technology we just need to use it. This is what I am talking about. A clean future to be implemented NOW!

http://www.hopewellproject.org/

http://ecat.com/

http://www.wired.com/magazine/2009/12/ff_new_nukes/all/1

FuelCell Energy http://apps1.eere.energy.gov/news/progress_alerts.cfm/pa_id=600

You have got to watch this vid: The liquid Metal Battery - another piece to the puzzle.

http://www.ted.com/talks/lang/en/donald_sadoway_the_missing_link_to_renewable_energy.html

Additional Liquid Metal Battery links.

http://lmbcorporation.com/

http://lmbcorporation.com/files/flyerFinal.pdf

Support green energy technology - industry - jobs. Save our world save our economy.

Rework free trade agreements as they are currently detrimental to the Business, Employment, Economic and Environmental health of the USA and in extension the world.

Put an end to outsourcing for Profit over People and the environment.

Stop world wide corporate abuses of people and environments.

[-] 2 points by brosefstalin (139) from Wantagh, NY 2 years ago

I love America, but hate the United States. If only we could get rid of this corrupt government and let this land be free.

[-] 1 points by Neuwurldodr (744) 2 years ago

Only one thing to say.......look at your future....

Children....stop wasting your time!!! Time to grow up!

http://www.whatdoesitmean.com/index1547.htm

[-] 1 points by freewriterguy (882) 2 years ago

the proof that america has been sold out to rich bankers, and corrupt politicians lies in a personal investigation into "land patents". Land patents were originally issued by the government of the united states so that we the people can own land, and no other entity, not banks, not corporations, not even government can "own land". Lessor "colored titles" were created to go against land improvements on land, but over the years, they have also taken land away from the only people that can own land, citizens, as land patents have been phased out. Are wealth has been transferred over to the hands of a few wealthy men who are bankers.

[-] 1 points by letsdomore (89) 2 years ago

A blind patriot is nothing more than a traitor.

[-] 1 points by nobnot (529) from Kapaa, HI 2 years ago

Yes.and we have sixty one flavors of rice a roni also.

[-] 1 points by Noncompliance (11) 2 years ago

That's the ideal, but this is a little closer to the current reality..

http://occupywallst.org/forum/the-most-honest-three-and-a-half-minutes-of-televi/

[-] 1 points by oneAdam12 (-7) from Queens, NY 2 years ago

Howdy, sorry I am a bit late. but i'm fixin' to tell y'all somethin'; God Bless my home sweet home USA !

[-] 1 points by cJessgo (729) from Port Jervis, PA 2 years ago

Yes Happy Birthday Iceland.

[-] 1 points by freewriterguy (882) 2 years ago

yes the 4th of july is my favorite holiday. Its the day we celebrate treason against an oppressive government!!!

[-] 0 points by betuadollar (-313) 2 years ago

Such a shame we have to celebrate this one with Obama.

[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (23961) from Coon Rapids, MN 2 years ago

Such a shame we are celebrating the 4th ( Independence day ) while not protesting the whole government for selling out to Greed.

[-] 0 points by betuadollar (-313) 2 years ago

This celebration of America is not one of governance but one of liberty.

[-] 0 points by VQkag2 (16478) 2 years ago

Whats wrong with Obama?. Doesn't he support OWS?

[-] 3 points by freewriterguy (882) 2 years ago

he bailed out rich bankers who then gave themselves over 500 million dollars in bonuses alone. They should have helped we the people, as we are the ones who work to pay the bills, not the rich bankers. You dont know our country was sold out to private banks? How couild anyone not know by now after the last 5 years of telling everyone, and the scandals and greed, etc.

[-] 0 points by VQkag2 (16478) 2 years ago

Wasn't it Bush (and his 1% plutocrat friends) that created the the bank crises, the bail out plan (tarp), and didn't Bush sign the tarp (last gift to his base)?

Why would you suggest Obama bailed out rich bankers? Thats not true!

Didn't President Obama sign the fin reform that repub 1% tools delayed and weakened, and that rich bankers still hate.? That is true.

Aren't your repub 1% tools still delaying the fin reform implementation at the behest of the rich bankers you erroneously claimed Pres Obama bailed out?

Didja know that?

[-] 1 points by freewriterguy (882) 2 years ago

the fact of the matter is obama approved the final checks distribution, not the ex president bushes. If I was president, I would have put a stop to them checks being issued, but he just dont have a clue like most government workers, or hed be self reliant like me instead of a government bum!

[-] 2 points by VQkag2 (16478) 2 years ago

Wrong.

Bush's Economic crash (great recession), Bushs plan (As a gift to his plutocrat friends) Bush's signature.!

President could not undo what your boy Bush (and his republican 1% tools) did! And you could not and would not do anything different as president. Because..........Ready............. Wait for it.........

You ain't ever gonna be President.! LMFAO

Elect progressives! Vote out conservatives!

Peace out!

[-] 1 points by freewriterguy (882) 2 years ago

now now, the topic isnt about me EVER BEING PRESIDENT, its about getting a good man to represent we the people, and bailing out banks, instead of putting a stop to it with an executive order from the man who said, "change has come to america" is the point.

[-] 2 points by VQkag2 (16478) 2 years ago

President has done what he could. When the people wake up and start protesting, and voting out the conservative 1% plutocrat tools we'll see real change.

Please don't expect one moderate politician to hit some switch and undo all the damage done over the last few decades. The plutocrats have too much control. Nothing will change if people don't rise up and insist on the progressive policies we need.

Peace

[-] 2 points by MattLHolck (16833) from San Diego, CA 2 years ago
[-] 1 points by jrhirsch (4714) from Sun City, CA 2 years ago

Thought you meant he was looking back at the fire and brimstone falling on the old tired partisan politics of Sodom and Gomorrah. He'd better start looking ahead and progressing to the promised land of no partisans if he doesn't want to share in the punishment and be turned into a pillar of Democratic party salt.

[-] 2 points by MattLHolck (16833) from San Diego, CA 2 years ago

thanks for listening

[Removed]

[-] 1 points by flip (7101) 2 years ago

number one is military spending that is for sure - with our only threat being some poor people with ak 47s - what else are we number one in - health stats, education - i can't seem to get the numbers - maybe someone can help

[-] -1 points by betuadollar (-313) 2 years ago

We have the most rapidly expanding population in the world. And the military machine is vital - who are we going to sell all that Green-for-green to?

[-] -2 points by 1sealyon (434) 2 years ago

Number one in:

  • World economic power

  • GDP

  • Manufacturing

  • Destination for immigrants

  • Oldest continuous democracy

  • Highest $ to charity

  • Automobile Production (next to PRC, 50% of which is Ford, GM, and Chrysler)

  • Commercial Aircraft

  • Movies

  • Music

  • Beer (China drinks more)

  • Heavy equipment production

  • Concrete

  • Gypsum

  • Milk

  • Uranium

  • Total Exports (next to PRC)

  • Energy Production

  • Agriculture

  • Nobel Prizes

  • Number of patents

  • Innovation

  • Corporate tax rate (well, nobody's perfect)

  • Largest corp market cap

  • Largest corp

The list is long if you dig a little.

[-] 3 points by brightonsage (4494) 2 years ago

Let's see, corporate tax rate. That's the rate that no corporation pays?

[-] -1 points by 1sealyon (434) 2 years ago

I don't blame corps for tying to avoid the tax. Corporate taxes are regressive and disproportionately hurt the poor because they affect goods like food and clothing that are normally tax exempt.

[-] 2 points by DKAtoday (23961) from Coon Rapids, MN 2 years ago

Sorry - I don't know where you live but food and clothing are taxed here in Minnesota and have been for quite a while.

Hell even water and air are taxed.

Yes - air - is taxed. It is in your bill passed on to you the consumer by your provider the power companies. Many power companies are either subsidized or are allowed to skate on their taxes - they however collect money from you due to costs they say they incur due to EPA clean air regulations.

[-] 1 points by MattLHolck (16833) from San Diego, CA 2 years ago

electricity taxes(charges) for energy must be raised

[-] 2 points by DKAtoday (23961) from Coon Rapids, MN 2 years ago

The cost being passed on to the people. Yet the power companies ( many of them ) are not paying taxes some are even getting money from the government - but that does not matter it ( the EPA ) gives them an excuse to raise rates that most of the public will not question.

[-] 2 points by MattLHolck (16833) from San Diego, CA 2 years ago

times is hard

cuts must be made

[-] 3 points by DKAtoday (23961) from Coon Rapids, MN 2 years ago

Cuts must be made - OK - lets start at the top of the pyramid = no more subsidies or tax breaks for the wealthy - real or artificial entities.

Times are hard - sorry you wealthy bastards but you gotta paymore - it hurts for me to tell you this - but watcha ( we ) gonna do? - the country needs your participation in supporting/contributing-to society.

[-] 0 points by 1sealyon (434) 2 years ago

Why, do you want less electricity?

If you tax a thing you will get less of it.

[-] 1 points by brightonsage (4494) 2 years ago

Then we should tax 527's and 501 C4's, and all contributions at 95%.

[-] 1 points by 1sealyon (434) 2 years ago

If you tax a thing you will get less of it. If you tax 501Cs you will get less of :

The Red Cross, Kaiser Foundation Hospitals,
MS Foundation for Women Inc , Childrens Defense Fund, Pride Foundation, American Jewish Committee , American Civil Liberties Union , Arctic Slope Native Association Ltd Patient Advocate Foundation Inc, Medical Disciplines Research, Public Broadcasting Service, Lincoln Center for the Performing Arts, The American Legion,

This is a tiny portion of the entire list of 501C corps that do a much better job at spending their money to help people than the Fed Gov ever could with the tax you want them to steal from the poor and disadvantaged.

[-] 2 points by brightonsage (4494) 2 years ago

501(c)(4) organizations are generally civic leagues and other corporations operated exclusively for the promotion of social welfare, or local associations of employees with membership limited to a designated company or people in a particular municipality or neighborhood, and with net earnings devoted exclusively to charitable, educational, or recreational purposes.[32] 501(c)(4) organizations may lobby for legislation, and unlike 501(c)(3) organizations they may also participate in political campaigns and elections, as long as its primary activity is the promotion of social welfare.[33] The tax exemption for 501(c)(4) organizations applies to most of their operations, but contributions may be subject to gift tax, and income spent on political activities - generally the advocacy of a particular candidate in an election - is taxable.[34]

Contributions to 501(c)(4) organizations are usually not deductible as charitable contributions for U.S. federal income tax, with a few exceptions.[35] 501(c)(4) organizations are not required to disclose their donors publicly.[36] This aspect of the law has led to extensive use of the 501(c)(4) provisions for organizations that are actively involved in lobbying, and has become controversial.

You will note that I didn't say ALL 501 C's.

"501(c)(4) organizations are not required to disclose their donors publicly."

How conveeeeenieent!

Of course I could have added: 501(c)(6) organizations include Business Leagues, Home Builders Association, Chambers of Commerce, Real Estate Boards, etc. such as the U.S. Chamber of Commerce political action committee and the National Football League.

There are some shining examples of organizations who are trying to strip the assets of America.

In contrast to the absolute prohibition on political campaign interventions by all section 501(c)(3) organizations, public charities (but not private foundations) may conduct a limited amount of lobbying to influence legislation. Although the law states that "No substantial part..." of a public charity's activities can go to lobbying, charities with large budgets may lawfully expend a million dollars (under the "expenditure" test), or more (under the "substantial part" test) per year on lobbying.

Your obvious attempt to mislead by lumping all 501 C's together is dully noted.

[-] 0 points by 1sealyon (434) 2 years ago

The issue of political contributions by 501s is separate from the many good works that they do, and their efficiency and accountability relative to the Gov. You can stop sending money to a charity if they have lousy performance, but there is no choice with money sent to the Gov.

While the impact of money on our elections is regrettable I don't see a way around the problem without affecting free-speech rights.

One way could be to reduce the allowable campaigning time to a few months. Britain has this practice and it seems to help.

Not sure how the NFL is stripping the US. They are one industry that is growing and exporting the product over seas.

BTW, how does the NFL (and other pro sports) get away with their no-woman policy?

[-] 2 points by brightonsage (4494) 2 years ago

Yes, the issue is how to separate the good works that 501's do and get rid of the cancer that some are hosting. They aren't all charities either. Free speech rights have always been restri9cted for the public good. Calling money speech is categorically wrong an only a recent and regrettable invention, that contravenes established precedent. The specious fiction that is doesn't create the appearance of impropriety is obliterated by the obvious fact of the corruption it has produced.

There are many ways to get the money out of not just politics but the whole process of governance, without compromising actual free speech..

Finally the NFL is a red herring, because I didn't go out of my way to include them, There are there thanks to the infinitesimal "wisdom of Congress

In high school sports (when I was an assistant coach) we had girls on our football teams (we had a linebacker and a kicker), but as the boys grew, the girls couldn't compete for playing time and didn't play based on ability to contribute rather than sexual exclusion. I imagine that is true in the NFL.

[-] 0 points by 1sealyon (434) 2 years ago

I agree with you, however am not too keen on the Gov deciding who's speech gets restricted. I would vote to err on the side of liberty.

I would also really like to see a comprehensive study on the actual effect of all the money spent on political campaigns. I have a suspicion that Ad Agencies and TV Networks hype the importance of political ads for financial gain.

Is your vote influenced by all of the $ folks spend to get elected?

[-] 2 points by brightonsage (4494) 2 years ago

Right now the side of liberty is going to the highest bidder. That is the only competition left.

If you look at the ad revenue maybe you will understand why nobody knows about most of the scandals that are discovered, prosecuted and plea bargained. Never reported, or he said, he said with no follow up investigative reporting. Nobody goes to jail, they just settle and do it again: LIBOR, robo-signing, Friends of Mozilo (Countrywide) included hundreds of politicians etc. It isn't just corruption in elections. It continues in all aspects of governance while they are in office and after they leave. Lucrative contracts, rigged clinical trials, Head of Homeland Security selling full body scanners that are sitting in warehouses worth $millions. etc.etc.etc.

You confuse me with a Tea Party Republican. they work for minimum wage and hope that if they keep their mouths shut and cheat every way the possibly can they will somehow get rich. My vote is diluted by the idiots that fall for the hopeless prospect of getting rich, while somebody punishes everybody else for some aspects of sex. It works, you see it too.

[-] 0 points by 1sealyon (434) 2 years ago

Well I am somewhat more optimistic. Most politicians do the right thing most of the time. There is a small minority of corrupt criminals in Gov that make headlines when they get caught.

The bigger problem with Gov is the built in disincentives to pursue excellence in what they do. Mediocrity is the norm. This stems from the fact that Gov is a monopoly and monopolies are almost always bad for the consumer. At the same time Gov has tremendous power. Think of how much of your life is affected by Gov rules, procedures, taxes, regulations, fees, the list is long.

My experience has been that local Govs are manageable and can operate pretty effectively with a lot of citizen involvement. Large cities, Sate, and Fed Govs need to be checked. Take the power away from centralized control and spread it to cities, towns, and local communities.

One way to make this happen would be to change the way the US House operates. They typically vote on about 3 meaningful bills per week. Let the House members keep their jobs, but their role is to construct the bills and educate the people on the meaning and impact. Each Thursday night there will be a prime-time show (the best reality show ever) where the people vote directly on bill passage. This change would have the happy consequence of virtually eliminating party rule since independents, greens, communists, and the Martian-Purple-Alien parties would all get a vote. It also dramatically reduces the influence of special interests on individual House Members.

Keep the Senate in place to protect States rights, the President keeps executive power for rapid response, and the courts protect individual rights. Just change the House for starters.

This is all technically possible now; the resistance will come from the ones that have to give up power. Let’s see how many of them are really for the 99%.

[-] 1 points by MattLHolck (16833) from San Diego, CA 2 years ago

all the numbers are moved towards the power company

[-] 1 points by 1sealyon (434) 2 years ago

There is some argument about sales tax in MN:

State taxes:

Minnesota has a progressive income tax structure; the three brackets of state income tax rates are 5.35%, 7.05% and 7.85%.[69] As of 2008, Minnesota was ranked as 12th in the nation for per capita total state and local taxes.[70] In 2008, Minnesotans paid 10.2% of their income in state and local taxes, compared to the US average of 9.7% of income.[70] This ranks Minnesota 12th among the states for total state and local tax burden.[70] The state sales tax in Minnesota is 6.875%, but there is no sales tax on clothing, prescription drug medications, some services, or food items for home consumption.[71] The state legislature may allow municipalities to institute local sales taxes and special local taxes, such as the 0.5% supplemental sales tax in Minneapolis.[72] Excise taxes are levied on alcohol, tobacco, and motor fuel. The state imposes a use tax on items purchased elsewhere but used within Minnesota.[71] Owners of real property in Minnesota pay property tax to their county, municipality, school district, and special taxing districts.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Minnesota

[-] 1 points by brightonsage (4494) 2 years ago

You should blame them for buying loopholes, hiding the profits offshore, stealing workers pensions and few other nefarious tactics and looking for sympathy by invoking the poor for which they, and apparently you, care zero.

[-] 1 points by 1sealyon (434) 2 years ago

Corporate taxes are just hidden taxes on the consumer and they hurt the poor. Make the Gov look you in the eye when they take your money. Using corp taxes the Gov takes money from people on food stamps. Where is the outrage.

[-] 2 points by brightonsage (4494) 2 years ago

We should just tax the poor directly then and leave out the shareholder who get the dividends and the management and the traders who rake in the huge bonuses for doing a bad job?

Is that the trickle up theory on taxes? Not everyone is a sucker. You need to be talking to the Tea Party'ers. They are willing to work for minimum wage and no benefits, because they are sure they are about to become fat cats, real soon. It's the American Dream, "If you work hard and cheat enough..."

[-] -1 points by 1sealyon (434) 2 years ago

The fat cats don't need help. They are doing just fine.

Get rid of all hidden taxes on the consumer. Sales tax in general is a bad idea. It discourages consumption and hurts the poor.

A progressive income tax is probably the right course, but the money should be dispersed locally. Let local and State Govs do more and take the power away from inefficient, lethargic, centralized Fed Gov.

Get all Gov out of the business of business. They have no capacity for it and frankly no competence.

Gov should be great at over sight. Use competitive bidding to hire a private contractor to do the work, make them post a bond, if they do a lousy job fire them and get a better supplier.

[-] 2 points by brightonsage (4494) 2 years ago

Might also want to get business out of the business of government instead, Privatizing prisons, privatizing, intelligence, privatizing security, privatizing special ops, privatizing drone warfare, privatizing torture, privatizing logistics and supply and privatizing insurance and benefits administration are all bad ideas that add cost, more remove responsibility and mis allocate costs.

Private contractors doing government functions don't cost less, they cost more and they promote corruption to pay off investors and politicians.

Take a close look at the DOD and I am sure you will agree on the rampant corruption in all of their contractor programs.

[-] 0 points by 1sealyon (434) 2 years ago

I agree. Get business out of the business of government. There should be a wall to prevent Gov corruption.

That said your list should be sorted carefully. For example, managing and distributing materials is probably better left to the private sector (think fedex, ups, and the post office).

There are many current Gov operations that would benefit from private sector competition like the administration of SS and Medicare and primary and secondary education.

[-] 2 points by brightonsage (4494) 2 years ago

Not in the military. Transportation, logistics, and security of materials are a specialized set of skills and integrated communications. Think Army with discipline, loyalty and commitment to mission.

There isn't any competition in government contracts anymore, that left decades ago. Now it is 65% no bid contracts and the rest are rigged by "unique" required but unnecessary capabilities. You are ignorant or misinformed about how the government has been made to work by the 1%.

Competition? How archaic. That was in the olden days. Low bidder? They never win now. Google it. I have been there.

[-] 0 points by 1sealyon (434) 2 years ago

So how do you propose fixing the problem?

[-] 2 points by brightonsage (4494) 2 years ago

For starters, get the money out of governance and elections at all levels.Public financed, no contributions what so ever, very short campaigns, blogs, white papers, books to communicate positions. Term limits, two for Senators, three for Reps, two for Pres. generous pensions for all of them. No lobbyists, no lunches, dinners, travel, golf etc.. No consulting contracts, no jobs, board seats, book deals, stock tips or other incentives for the pols, staffs or their families. Staffs are career govt. employees, no government related jobs after govt. service, teaching OK.

Term limits for Supreme's, removal for conflicts of interests, lying in confirmation hearings, generous pensions.

The problems are less structural than corruption in various forms. Pols are lazy and corrupt. Legislatio

[-] 3 points by VQkag2 (16478) 2 years ago

I agree with all that.

Maybe also if I may:

No campaign ads! Weekly debates on all channels (in the shortened campaigns) with more than just the 2 parties.

End the Electoral College (antiquated system to remove choice from the popular vote)

Expand the House of Reps: It's been done before. We have to allow for the increase in population and will therefore provide better and more diverse representation. Will also allow for other parties to achieve some success.

Mandatory Voting for all eligible citizens: It works in Australia. It is what the 1% fears the most (look @ their ALEC efforts at vote suppression)

Holidays every election day all levels of govt. Easy electronic voting, easy verification of vote that each voter can execute.

These suggestions (and yours) can help dislodge the 1% plutocrats who stole our govt.

Peace

[-] 2 points by brightonsage (4494) 2 years ago

Well let me agree with you, while we are being agreeable. I have advocated most of these previously except for the mandatory voting. I am still a little ambivalent about that one.Having more low information voters (read GOP) is scary. Maybe we need supervoters. If you can pass a test you get n votes? Yeah, I know. Cheat sheets etc.

But there is nothing worse than democracy when the voters have no idea what they are voting on. But I hope that with the other fixes, we might just turn the corner.

[-] 1 points by 1sealyon (434) 2 years ago

The House made sense when it took two weeks to travel by horse from Philadelphia to Washington. Today the people should vote directly on these laws.

The House typically votes on about 3 meaningful bills per week. Let the House members keep their jobs, but their role is to construct the bills and educate the people on the meaning and impact. Each Thursday night there will be a prime-time show (the best reality show ever) where the people vote directly on bill passage. This change would have the happy consequence of virtually eliminating party rule since independents, greens, communists, and the Martian-Purple-Alien parties would all get a vote. It also dramatically reduces the influence of special interests on individual House Members.

This change could be eased in by starting with one non-binding vote per month. Let's see the reaction the first time a representative votes opposite the popular vote in her district.

Keep the Senate in place to protect States rights, the President keeps executive power for rapid response, and the courts protect individual rights. Just change the House for starters.

This is all technically possible now; the resistance will come from the ones that have to give up power. Let’s see how many of them are really for the 99%.

[-] 2 points by VQkag2 (16478) 2 years ago

I agree uninformed electorate is a serious problem. I agree the MSM does not inform adequately. In fact they do the opposite. It is up to the people. The Internet can be the vehicle. Independent, uncorrupted, diverse opinions can exist and spread if handled intelligently using new tech.

It is the thing that can make the difference in this new progressive movement (as opposed to all the previous ones)

Peace

[-] 2 points by brightonsage (4494) 2 years ago

You are right, as usually, but the Internet being the only vehicle with the truth still exposes the real problem, "terminal laziness".

Live long and prosper.

[-] 2 points by VQkag2 (16478) 2 years ago

Yes indeed all the items we agree on can make a real impact.

Can I just say regarding mandatory voting: I do not believe the rate of "low info voters" would necessarily be different. We have many like that now. Some of our suggestions, if implemented would address some of the threats to low info voter manipulation. (no ads, money out of campaigns, wkly debates) In addition the act of voting can be the incentive to get informed.

I also think progressive leaning voters make up more of the apathetic electorate. (I always hear repubs vote more then dems) The poor appear to make up a lot of the disaffected, demoralized voters. I think that is why the 1% fears bigger turnouts. (note the ALEC voter suppression efforts)

Finally we do not test or exclude the low info voters we have now. because who would create the test? Who would decide which voter is informed enough?. There was a time I'm sure you know when whole groups of eligible American voters had to submit to impossible tests (because they were called too ignorant to have the responsibility) like counting how many jelly beans in a jar, reciting portions of state constitutions and many other ridiculous tests.

That was the southern states denying African Americans the right to register and vote.

So I think we are better off with more voters. And WE have to better inform the entire electorate.

Peace.

[-] 2 points by brightonsage (4494) 2 years ago

The much hated MSM has been getting fat off of the Citizens U decision. And they haven't been doing their jobs for some time (two sides to every issue, they said, they said. ) I was joking about the test, for the reason the history that you note. Still, the ignorance of the electorate is a serious problem. A solution? Don't look at me.

[-] -1 points by 1sealyon (434) 2 years ago

Why does voting have to bee so difficult.

I can buy an automobile without getting up from my armchair. Why can't we have online voting?

If Amazon can secure 99.8% of all purchases why can't we have secure voting from a smart phone?

[-] 1 points by 1sealyon (434) 2 years ago

Term limits are not a bad idea, but how about a better process for finding the best and brightest for these positions in the first place. Right now we pretty much get whomever the Dems or Reps assign to the job.

Many pols also come from the ranks of the legal profession. We should draft more doctors, engineers, teachers, business executives, and the like to round out the field. Draft them for two terms like we draft juries. Service should be an an honor and duty, just like in ancient Greece.

As you suggest make them untouchable with good salaries and no motivation for graft. Once they leave they have a life time ban on lobbying or profiting in any way from their service.

BTW all of the recent suggestions are structural changes to the system. I continue to believe that the Gov structure is flawed. There are a few criminals in Gov but most people want to do the right thing. The current system does not attract the best people for the job and frustrates those that really want to improve Gov.

[-] 2 points by brightonsage (4494) 2 years ago

Draftees rarely make good officers. The changes I mentioned are primarily process changes rather than structural.

Virtually every office holder has sold out. Is that a crime? No, they made loopholes big enough for a 747. They aren't doing the right thing now. If the laws were proper, they would all be in jail. When the incentives to do the wrong thing are removed, will they still be interested in serving????? Fix the process and the incentives and see if there remains problems that are structural.

[-] 1 points by VQkag2 (16478) 2 years ago

I'm not against the weekly direct vote concept thing. I rather like it. I think one day we will have a system very much like it. I will agitate for it whenever possible.

Peace

[-] 3 points by Neuwurldodr (744) 2 years ago

Don't forget.....SLAVERY!!!

Mentally, physically and economically. Past, present and future!!!

You all just don't get it!!!

United States of "America" is a corporation and that is how it functions!!!

[Removed]

[-] 0 points by betuadollar (-313) 2 years ago

Could you by chance define "corporation" for us? Is there anything of human endeavor that is not in some manner incorporated?

[-] 1 points by Neuwurldodr (744) 2 years ago

Once again, my definition would not give you proper understanding since I have a legal government background.
Therefore, I would suggest that anyone who does not understand the differences of papers of incorporation as made through the state vs. the Federal laws and Constitution, take up classes on the subject.
Get a Blacks law dictionary.....look it up and do the research.

Obviously, if you are on this forum, forming opinions and posting so-called truths, then you should know what YOU ARE POSTING (TALKING) ABOUT!!!

[-] 0 points by betuadollar (-313) 2 years ago

Legal definition or otherwise, there is little that does not exist as some form of incorporation.

[-] 1 points by Neuwurldodr (744) 2 years ago

Your opinion means little in this judicial system of ours wouldn't you agree. So, on that note, understand that childish logic makes me sick!

Thanks anyway....you bore me.

[-] 0 points by betuadollar (-313) 2 years ago

Your original comment was long on vision, short on focus.

[-] 1 points by Neuwurldodr (744) 2 years ago

Now pray tell, what generic bull shyt edited fake "political science" Texas book did you get that phrase from?

Just be honest, you don't understand a damn thing that's going on either in the world or with OWS, now do you? Pretty much kept in the dark...eh?

Truly, I do understand....that's why school kids such as yourself should stay on this forum.

Stick around, you just might learn something yet!

[-] 0 points by betuadollar (-313) 2 years ago

haha... I'm in metro New York; get a grip, dude. (Or dudette, whatever the case may be.)

[-] 1 points by Neuwurldodr (744) 2 years ago

Really now? Don't you and your cronies think its time to bring yourself up out of the dark ages, or is it the Middle Ages?

Just so you won't think I'm whistling Dixie, why not read more about who is actually running your lives? Who and what do you think keeps your minds so "colorfully" programmed? Sheep follow its shepherds who lead!

"By sheer force of its population size, Texas has long held outsize influence on national textbook publishers, some of whom sent curriculum writers to take notes in the boardroom."

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/05/21/education/21textbooks.html

Oh, and FYI, I am not a dude or a dudette, I am a PROFESSOR OF TRUTHS!

[-] 0 points by betuadollar (-313) 2 years ago

If you're a professor, then I'm the Prophet.

[-] 1 points by Neuwurldodr (744) 2 years ago

Well, congratulations....but as you wrote earlier.... "The problem is that it's a an abstract concept and a rather mute statement"

So, by declaring you are a Prophet, what you are saying in reality is you are truly a NOBODY!

Is this forum the only place you can feel important? How sad for you. Now, get to work!

[-] 0 points by betuadollar (-313) 2 years ago

Am I to assume that I hit a nerve here? I'd respond but I no longer recall what we were talking about.

What none seem to realize is that the American people have heard all this before - whether we speak of union empowerment in the form of an early IWW, anarchist societies in the form of an early "Home Colony," feminism in the form of an early Heterology Society of Greenwich Village, empowerment of the immigrant as a challenge to establishment "Anglo Saxon," or even the attack on the powered monopoly of a JP Morgan - we've seen it all before; this is 1915 all over again. Both sides are every bit as radical in their self interest, over public interest, and the vast majority are just stuck in the middle with YOU as moderators who limit the ability to respond by failing to provide a 'reply' link.

[-] 1 points by Neuwurldodr (744) 2 years ago

Oh, you recall....you just don't like the subject of the fact that you all are running scared and can't do a damn thing about this failing economical crap in this country or across the globe except....remain comatose!

The jest is....none of you want to face the truth. But that's fine since the truth is not going away, no matter what anyone says.

[-] 1 points by JesseHeffran (3903) 2 years ago

The fact that so much of life is incorporated, is that not a sign that the rugged, self made individual is a figment of certain people's imaginations?

I believe in Unionization because from an early age, life has taught me that collaboration and harmonization with others is the best way to get shit done and feel safe. This understanding just does not let me put much stock in the autonomous individual, the Atlas that holds the world up.

If so much of the world is corporatized, why are there intelligent individuals still preaching the gospel of individualism?

[-] 1 points by betuadollar (-313) 2 years ago

The problem is that it's a an abstract concept and a rather mute statement. While simultaneously we rail against the "self-made" as a literal impossibility, we also invite more diversity and economic conflict through immigration; economic stress is growing. And as corporations and manufacturers continue to fall to our economic history, their skeletal remains evident everywhere in this country, more and more will seek to restate that individualism, recreating themselves in self-employment. It's the old case of Natural Law versus positive law - if real world experience does not align with philosophical interpretation, than obviously our interpretation must be reconsidered.

It doesn't matter whether we encourage individualism or not - it will naturally occur or many will not survive and in the process we will invite others to economically associate, and ultimately in-corporate. It's an apparatus that lives outside ourselves, we cannot control it. On the aggregate, mankind will continue to energetically promote self-survival.

[-] 1 points by Neuwurldodr (744) 2 years ago

OMG.....please get off that soap box!

This is so rhetorically passe' in european thought and philosophy. None of this can actually be utilized in today's environment.

Filling the forum with hope for mankind, when mankind dupes himself into believing he has all the answers?

People, please, please get with the new era of time now. You have control over nothing, not even your own minds.

How arrogant a race you are! Keep your heads to the skies and try to control that!

[-] 0 points by betuadollar (-313) 2 years ago

In Europe they rail against even our air conditioning yet in the American South many would die without it. And that's the difference, the Progressive agenda has no basis in reality.

[-] 1 points by Neuwurldodr (744) 2 years ago

Neither do the European gods (way of life) that everyone worships, but that doesn't stop most nations from believing in those myths, nor do those gods have any saving power for Humanity. Henceforth, the world has been totally tilted on its axis, economically, spiritually, physically, mentally, socially, etc. Now we see that in all projection of inevitable occurrences that man has no idea what is taking place here on earth nor does he have any control over it, nor does he care why these occurrences are taking place, but believes things will stay as they are with only more improved technological advances and trains of thought thereof and that these god myths will save us? Oh, I forgot...You are a Prophet, so you realize all this....right?

So, as I was saying, "How arrogant a race you are! Keep your heads to the skies and try to control that!"
So, on that note, keep posting smack, it really don't amount to a hill of shyt... in reality!

[-] 0 points by betuadollar (-313) 2 years ago

Leave two children on an island, uneducated and uniformed, and they will invent an organized religion within but three generations; we know this because there are some 30,000 documented cases of this in the world, and only one people, that we know of, devoid of any religion, and even those it appears employed certain spiritualism. The point is our Gods are evolutionary; so is the necessary ability to reinvent them or deny them. So I think you're wasting your breath; mankind marches on without you, without me, without our callous and superfluous opinions. The question becomes, do we want today's progressive to continue on this path of towards tribal regression in light of our desire to survive by means of ever better science. This is but the hedonist versus the stoic; an argument as old as mankind itself.

[-] 1 points by Neuwurldodr (744) 2 years ago

Huh?

Too much world religions for you son....the god I am talking about is the one on the Dollar Bill...you know...the one the rich believe in and the poor die for?

Where is your head?

http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-500395_162-57469161/peregrine-financial-group-brokerage-said-to-be-$220-million-short-in-customer-funds/

Don't you think it's time you all woke up from your self-induced Coma? ..

[-] -1 points by 1sealyon (434) 2 years ago

Explain what you mean so that I can get it.

Check out this book. A pretty good read and will give you a different perspective on US corporations.

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/06/03/business/in-freedoms-forge-us-industry-as-war-hero-review.html?_r=1

[-] 1 points by Neuwurldodr (744) 2 years ago

What do you mean what do I mean?

Please read it for yourself.....the United States Code. TITLE 28 > PART VI > CHAPTER 176 > SUBCHAPTER A > § 3002

§ 3002. Definitions

(15) “United States” means— (A) a Federal corporation; (B) an agency, department, commission, board, or other entity of the United States; or (C) an instrumentality of the United States.

No where does it state it is a government created for the people, or by the people.

The Constitution is the greatest document on these shores.

[-] 0 points by 1sealyon (434) 2 years ago

Many governments are corporations. Most cities and towns in the US are incorporated. Why is that a problem?

[-] 1 points by Neuwurldodr (744) 2 years ago

I believe you are asking the wrong individual since I didn't have a hand in creating this particular corporation in which everyone is trying to survive within.

So, why is it such a problem with the 99%. And on that note....why does OWS even exist if it is not a problem?
Why are you asking me? Present the question to the people.

[-] 0 points by 1sealyon (434) 2 years ago

Why do you believe that legal incorporation of governments creates such a problem for the 99%? Give me some examples of cost/benefit analysis that tips the scales against the 99%.

Why OWS exists is a bit of a puzzle. Why they chose to incorporate OWS in 2011 is a bit of an oxymoron.

[-] 1 points by Neuwurldodr (744) 2 years ago

Who are you and why are you here? You can't state to the public what I believe or state what I don't believe.

I owe you nothing, no answers, no explanations, no pieces for your puzzles.

This website clearly states its purpose, it's reason for existing,
Are you one of those rabble plants who picks a target in order to feed it to the wolves?
I am not your sheep, I know why I am here and why OWS exists, history-past present and future. Although I may not agree with everything on this website, I do support and understand the underlying reasons for their actions. Now, on that note, read Blacks Law Dictionary. Look up Govern, Govern Body and Government. That is all the explanation necessary since most Judicial processes follow this book, legally.

So, on that note, choose another target....you are not a friend here!

[-] 0 points by 1sealyon (434) 2 years ago

Are you looking for friends or solutions to problems?

The first step in solving any problem is to measure it. You offer no metrics.

[-] 1 points by Neuwurldodr (744) 2 years ago

Get lost.....find your own solutions....or metrics (guffaw)

Define friend....define foe.....you are the latter. You are bickering with me because you see my posts are truths, nothing made up or intangible to human perception. What I post here can be researched, investigated, pondered and referenced again and again for all to see, for all to form their own opinions and conclusions. You, on the other hand present questions that let me know that Wall street has many personified FLUNKIES (such as yourself) on this forum!

Stop trying to get personal (into my head) on here....there is nothing personal about this forum....only truths. Individuals such as yourself surely realize that truths about this GREAT NATION of ours has been covered up....correct? So, if the truth is out there....why aren't you looking for yours? Why are you trying to cover it back up again on this forum?

Once again....get lost...you are wasting your time....not ours.

[-] -1 points by 1sealyon (434) 2 years ago

Why so cryptic? What truth is being covered up and what effect of that truth is so damaging to the 99%?

[-] 0 points by 1sealyon (434) 2 years ago

Congratulations. That was a very cogent and well thought out rebuttal.

[-] 1 points by Neuwurldodr (744) 2 years ago

Glad you liked that....now vote again!!

http://i183.photobucket.com/albums/x259/bethlovesD/kiss_my_ass.jpg

I kinda like this!!!

[-] 0 points by hchc (3297) from Tampa, FL 2 years ago

If you dont know why that is a problem, then you should just focus on eating another big mac.

[-] 0 points by 1sealyon (434) 2 years ago

I like corporations. They are just a group of people that join together in order to achieve some great thing. Like Google, or Apple, or the Church of Latter Day Saints (Yes, they are incorporated).

The good news is that if a corporation does a lousy job competitors eat their lunch and they go out of business. Government, on the other hand, can go on day after day producing the same crappy product, charge outrageous prices, deliver poor service, and continue in business forever. Or what seems like forever.

BTW, OWS was incorporated in October, 2011

[-] 1 points by Neuwurldodr (744) 2 years ago

In addition, the legal definition of a government does not require it to be incorporated. It is done so in order to preserve the republic for those who have acquired the power to govern (on paper) by law. Unfortunately, most individuals do not understand that if those "corporate governing bodies" do not have the peoples best interest at heart in the way they govern those people (another word for control) then the only power that can step in and make it right for the people are the Feds. Now, if the Feds were being bought out as well, then hell, everyone is shyt out of luck!!

18 U.S.C. § 2331 : US Code - Section 2331: Definitions

(1) the term "international terrorism" means activities that - (A) involve violent acts or acts dangerous to human life that are a violation of the criminal laws of the United States or of any State, or that would be a criminal violation if committed within the jurisdiction of the United States or of any State; (B) appear to be intended - (i) to intimidate or coerce a civilian population; (ii) to influence the policy of a government by intimidation or coercion; or (iii) to affect the conduct of a government by mass destruction,

So, one must investigate as to why companies such as Haliburton, and other major Banking industries and corporations have a free hand to utilize corporate America as a front to create this international terrorism here, while utilizing their free reign to also destroy other countries under the guise of "CORPORATE AMERICA" investments...which by the way creates the ripple effect here on these shores which clearly has violated the above laws.

Think out of the box, eventually you'll get it!!!

[-] 0 points by hchc (3297) from Tampa, FL 2 years ago

I could care less if ows, apple or google are incorporated. They obviiously deserve some of the protections for taking the risk.

My problem is govs being incorporated.

[-] 0 points by 1sealyon (434) 2 years ago

Many US cities and towns are incorporated. What problem has that caused?

[-] 2 points by flip (7101) 2 years ago

don't you think some of those numbers should be per capita - that would change things. you might add prison population and death by hand guns. what did you find out about poverty - how do we rank there - we take care of our people right? i notice many of your categories (except beer) have little or no effect on the health and well being of the population but why would that matter? i give you black elk - the wasichus are mostly shit don't you think?
“I did not see anything [New York 1886] to help my people. I could see that the Wasichus [white man] did not care for each other the way our people did before the nation's hoop was broken. They would take everything from each other if they could, and so there were some who had more of everything than they could use, while crowds of people had nothing at all and maybe were starving. This could not be better than the old ways of my people.” ― Black Elk, Black Elk Speaks: Being the Life Story of a Holy Man of the Oglala Sioux

[-] -1 points by 1sealyon (434) 2 years ago

I agree with you about poverty. By every measure that I can find poverty is on the rise in America. The question is what to do about it.

Here's some good news that spells new high wage jobs that don't require a lot of skill. Manufacturing is on the rise in the US:

http://www.eetimes.com/electronics-news/4376150/U-S--European-manufacturers-join-forces-to-compete-with-China?pageNumber=0

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/06/28/technology/google-and-others-give-manufacturing-in-the-us-a-try.html?_r=1&smid=tw-nytimes&seid=auto

[-] -1 points by 1sealyon (434) 2 years ago

You don't think being #1 in agriculture production helps the health and well being of the people in the US?

What about these?:

Manufacturing Destination for immigrants Oldest continuous democracy Highest $ to charity Automobile Production (next to PRC, 50% of which is Ford, GM, and Chrysler) Commercial Aircraft Movies Music Milk Energy Production Agriculture Nobel Prizes Innovation

[-] -1 points by 1sealyon (434) 2 years ago

When the Yankees win the World Series does anybody talk about per capita?

No.They just won.

I agree with you about the beer, just have to figure out how to get the rest of the world to drink it. In Europe they call the stuff we brew sex-in-a-canoe.

I wish we would stop calling ourselves African Americans, Italian Americans, Native Americans; why not just Americans? Look forward, not backwards. Make things better now instead of trying to figure out who flung dung.

[-] 2 points by flip (7101) 2 years ago

yankees - right. this is just like sports except some die instead of losing a game. because some go hungry and what their children shit themselves to death. here is the great liberal capitalist maddy halfbright - Lesley Stahl on U.S. sanctions against Iraq: We have heard that a half million children have died. I mean, that's more children than died in Hiroshima. And, you know, is the price worth it?

Secretary of State Madeleine Albright: I think this is a very hard choice, but the price--we think the price is worth it.

--60 Minutes (5/12/96). why not just americans - sure let's look forward because backwards is not a picture you want others to see - those who don't know history.......

[-] 1 points by TrevorMnemonic (5827) 2 years ago

Try starting a hemp farm to make hemp paper and hemp bricks to build homes.

Try going to the airport without getting touched by the government.

Work your way up in a company and maybe you can get laid off in one of those corporate cutbacks.

Sure there is still room for great success... but shit aint anywhere near perfect.

[-] 1 points by Neuwurldodr (744) 2 years ago

Sure, but at what price did it get that way?

Remember, for 400 years, the American Dream only existed for a few, and now it exists for no one but those good at propaganda. Of Course this is a great nation.....just don't forget on whose backs, whose blood and whose ancestries (destroyed) it got its foundational start!! What most don't know is it was a great nation before it was invaded back in the 1400's as well!!

[-] -3 points by salta (-1104) 2 years ago

400 years ago there was no united states of america.

[-] 3 points by Neuwurldodr (744) 2 years ago

And 2000 years ago, there were no alleged "white" people, so what's your point?

[+] -4 points by salta (-1104) 2 years ago

YOU said that for 400 years the american dream existed. I said that there was no america 400 years ago.

[-] 2 points by Neuwurldodr (744) 2 years ago

And pray tell, where were you then?

Oh, never mind....you are totally clueless as to where, who and what you are now....so please forget that question!

[-] -1 points by DKAtoday (23961) from Coon Rapids, MN 2 years ago

Yes there was it just wasn't the USA yet.

[-] -3 points by salta (-1104) 2 years ago

the pilgrims came to north america in 1620. there were settlements but no states for long time. the declaration of independence was written and signed 146 years later.

[-] 2 points by Neuwurldodr (744) 2 years ago

I just admire how good a job of Indoctrinating its sheep these false leaders did (and still do) on these shores. The masses are too lazy or either to dense to do anything else but be led over the cliff!!.

No such thing as Pilgrims, most individuals who arrived here were commissioned and sent by the Kings, Queens and rulers of Europe, Spain, Portugal, and don't forget Great Britain!

Read the writings of Benjamin Franklin....This was all mapped out and planned!! The different Peace Treaties explain how the land was divided, who got what, and how they were able to keep their property (humans) to create more wealth for themselves!

In addition, the people (only two actually) who signed the the Original Declaration of Independence were put under house arrest.

Now, is there any other reason as to why OWS exists? Everyone, and I do mean EVERYONE....has been bamboozled!!

No wonder this country is imploding!!

Tehehehehe!!!

[-] -3 points by salta (-1104) 2 years ago

you are the one that has been brainwashed. my ancestors were not sent by anyone , they came of their own accord.

[-] 2 points by Neuwurldodr (744) 2 years ago

Who cares? Royalty was sent here, diplomats and officials of royalty were commissioned to do the bidding of the European nations.. Royalty is also what they found when they got here! So, you state that you don't know what your ancestors lineage was now do you? Other wise you would understand that the families of immigrants that followed and migrated here, from which you were bred were plain old peasants and heathens and not of royal blood!!

So stop acting as if that pale pink ass of yours is so special!!

IT IS NOT!!! Get a grip on reality!!!

[-] -1 points by salta (-1104) 2 years ago

when did i say i did not know what my ancestors lineage was?

[-] 1 points by Neuwurldodr (744) 2 years ago

And.....that would be?

How old are you really?

[-] -2 points by salta (-1104) 2 years ago

my ancestors come here on ship that came right after the mayflower. the settled in ny, long island and nj. in time they moved south and west.

[-] 2 points by Neuwurldodr (744) 2 years ago

Sure they did honey... Let's discuss all this after you put the fake history book down and pull up the real documents.
Most individuals go by hearsay in this country, Those of us who know have correct documentation!!!

Moving right along....This subject is boring because I am unable to relate to fairy tales.

I have mine, where are yours. .

[-] -1 points by salta (-1104) 2 years ago

it's been traced and verified through public and family documents.

[-] 3 points by VQkag2 (16478) 2 years ago

Then you are an illegal immigrant! ( I mean the inhabitants of the day (native americans) didn't want you here).

But Don't worry we're trying to get amnesty for all of you illegals.

[-] -1 points by DKAtoday (23961) from Coon Rapids, MN 2 years ago

But America has been here since it was 1st discovered/named America.

[+] -4 points by salta (-1104) 2 years ago

The United States of America was formed in 1776.

[-] -1 points by DKAtoday (23961) from Coon Rapids, MN 2 years ago

So what. The country - America was named long before the formation of the united states and there is much history of this continent being settled prior to the formation of the United States of America. That is the point that was being made.

[-] 1 points by beautifulworld (22089) 2 years ago

1 in 7 Americans are on food stamps, 22% of children live in poverty, 42% of African American children live in poverty, 49 million Americans have no health insurance, wages have been declining for the past 30 years while corporate profits are at an all time high, CEO's earn an average of 343 times the wage of the average worker today when 30 years ago they earned 40 times the wage of the average worker, college costs are skyrocketing, home prices declining, foreclosures are up, millions are unemployed, our children rank horribly in math and science, we engaged in useless costly wars that have killed hundreds of thousands of innocent people, every day we're losing more and more of our civil liberties, etc. etc. etc. Yep. It's great!

[-] -1 points by caseman (-24) 2 years ago

One and seven are on food stamps mainly because the Obama admin is encouraging them to do so. There is jobs out there if they want to work. If they cannot make it on one job then get a second job. I have done it for years now

[-] 1 points by beautifulworld (22089) 2 years ago

No. Many people who qualify for food stamps are, in fact, working. Many employees at WalMart, for example, qualify for food stamps. This is because greedy employers keep all the profits for themselves and exploit workers through low wages that make them indigent.

[+] -5 points by caseman (-24) 2 years ago

If they cannot make ends meet on one job then they need another job also. I raised two children this way and others can do it as well. The Gov is encouraging welfare, to make us more dependent on the Gov

[-] 3 points by beautifulworld (22089) 2 years ago

So, you're all for exploitation. Sorry, I'm for worker's being treated fairly. I'm for children being raised by parents who are around because one job is enough to cover the basics.

[+] -6 points by caseman (-24) 2 years ago

If a person cannot make it on one job or does not want to get a second job then they need to train themselves for a better job that pays more.

[-] 1 points by beautifulworld (22089) 2 years ago

Okay. So they train themselves and then, where are the jobs? Most available jobs today are extremely low paying. Therefore, there are not enough decent paying jobs for everyone. Why not set up the economic system so that it benefits all people and not just the wealthy and corporations. A healthy society has healthy people and families that are able to support themselves.

[+] -4 points by quicklynow (0) 2 years ago

It's funny that you ask Where are the Jobs. My daughter just graduated from College with a 4 year degree in Human Resources in May. She was hired for a job making good money just 5 weeks after graduation. Jobs are apparently out there for those that take the time and effort to better themselves.

[-] 4 points by beautifulworld (22089) 2 years ago

Wow. That is so smug of you. I'm happy for your daughter, but you are one smug person. Have you learned nothing of humility in your life?

[-] 2 points by flip (7101) 2 years ago

why do you waste time with these guys - oh, sorry - i forgot - i do the same thing and i cannot answer my own question. the good thing is you are nicer than i am - keep it up - if you change one mind it is worth it. there is no changing these minds (is that the proper word for what they have between their ears?) but someone else might read the conversation. you can see the effect of the proaganda that we have suffered under the last 40 yrs (more really) - i like the line there are none so blind as those who will not see. it doesn't really apply here but even better i like - those that put out the people's eyes reproach them for their blindness! you might be able to use it sometime - i want to be cited if you do!

[-] 3 points by beautifulworld (22089) 2 years ago

LOLOL!!

[-] 1 points by francismjenkins (3713) 2 years ago

Not smug, since (at least) in my opinion, true smugness requires intellectual aptitude. Calling the guy you're responding to "smug" gives him far too much credit (and quite frankly, it's sort of insulting to those who deserve the label "smug"). In other words, poorly informed does not equal smug (it's just poorly informed) :)

If a religious fanatic tries to dispute the science of chemistry, and insists chemical bonding happens because of magic (not hydrogen, covalent, or ionic bonding), and I call him an intellectual midget, I would be considered smug, even though chemical bonding is of course well understood and very uncontroversial among scientists. Even if I used kinder words, he would still try to accuse me of smugness, because ultimately ... that's the only weapon he has.

So I don't mind smugness, as in "true" smugness (for which intellectualism is a prerequisite). In fact, we need more smugness. As it is now, we're an anti-intellectual culture, because people think stupidity is cool. Well, I say it's time to call stupidity what it is ... stupid.

[-] 3 points by beautifulworld (22089) 2 years ago

LOL! I disagree. My use of the word smug fits exactly with the dictionary definition and only definition I've known until now. Also, I don't think we need more "smugness" as being smug turns people off. So, if you are "right" about something and you are "smug" people will likely not listen to you because they'll think you are, well, an a-s.

Now, did I fail in labeling his comment "stupid?" Yes, I did because I was so blown away by his hubris and lack of empathy. So, thanks for addressing that, but keep in mind that people who have that much hubris and lack of empathy have a hard time "knowing" anything as they already think they "know" it all.

[-] 2 points by flip (7101) 2 years ago

so do you think there are lots of good paying jobs but most of the unemployed are just too lazy to take them? you people (that would be shadzworthless and caveman) are stupid and sick - it is a bad combination

[-] 2 points by MattLHolck (16833) from San Diego, CA 2 years ago

none of my friends have fared well

no one keeps a job for long

[-] 1 points by francismjenkins (3713) 2 years ago

We're all happy for your daughter, and I'm glad you're glad about your daughters success (as of course any parent should be, or at least ideally), but of course the implication of your comment seems like the byproduct of very crude, simplistic, and anecdotal reasoning.

It would be awesome if the many homeless people out there, who often suffer from mental illness, had the good fortune of your daughter (who I assume does not suffer from mental illness). It would also be awesome if every child on earth had the good fortune of a stable family, a mother and father who were not drug addicts, who were not raised in communities immersed in drugs and poverty (sort of hard to achieve when a society invests far more in its penal system, police, military, and surveillance infrastructure, compared to its educational system).

So what do I do with your simplistic and crude remarks? I could print them out & use them to wipe my ass, but toilet paper is much more comforting to my ass hole, so I guess they're completely worthless.

[-] -3 points by shadzworth (-394) 2 years ago

That's great but beautifulworld won't acknowledge your post. bw is too controlled by a Leftist ideology that won't except reality or truth. bw would rather continue the failed Occupy narrative of victimization and hating Corps along with Conservatives and anybody else who isn't a Progtard.

[+] -4 points by Growup6 (-125) 2 years ago

Typical moonbat leftist that's learned to hate the country that's given them everything.

Just a few questions: Please ,straight answers.

What country remains the #1 immigration destination?

What country of origin has the highest share of US immigrants?

Is the typical educational attainment of those immigrants higher or lower than the overall US average?

Do you expect people with very low educational levels to have low, moderate or high incomes?

Do children of drop-outs have higher or lower rates of high school graduation than their parents? Would you expect them to do better or worse on the science and math tests you whine about?

Is not having healthcare insurance the same thing as being denied healthcare?

Of the 49 million people alleged to lack healthcare insurance all Americans as you claim? How many simply choose to not carry coverage because they're young and healthy?

How much of the world's population wouldn't have its freedom today without the United States?

[-] 4 points by HempTwister (667) from Little Rock, AR 2 years ago

How many have their freedoms in spite of the United States? How many times have we overthrown democratically elected governments to install our puppets? You can start with Iran and they are still pissed.

Check out Naomi Klein and John Perkins. http://www.economichitman.com/

[-] -1 points by Growup6 (-125) 2 years ago

Or, gee, I dunno, Western Europe or Japan. You might want to add Eastern Europe too. Smarten up. The United States is the best thing that's ever happened to the world. It's just too bad that we can't swap you out for an immigrant that understands what this country offers.

[-] 3 points by HempTwister (667) from Little Rock, AR 2 years ago

"The United States is the best thing that's ever happened to the world"

No doubt. That is why I am embarrassed by some of the things we have done and don't want this country run by deniers.

[-] 4 points by beautifulworld (22089) 2 years ago

zzzzzzzzzzz. Take off your rose-colored glasses. It's people like you that are going to cause this country to continue to decline. If you love it so much don't you want it to exist 200 years from now?

[+] -4 points by Growup6 (-125) 2 years ago

Moonbat America basher with no answers.

For a place that's so awful, funny how billions would move here if they could. Ahh, but no matter with simple reality. Say, you hate it here, but they love it here. Any chance we could arrange a swap where you give up your seat? Clearly, there's gotta be a better place. It's so terrible here, it should be easy. LOL.

[-] 2 points by beautifulworld (22089) 2 years ago

LOL! Ignorance is bliss.

[-] 2 points by DKAtoday (23961) from Coon Rapids, MN 2 years ago

Well then it is funny that Growup6 is so angry and out of sorts - he is ignorant enough to be floating off the ground in bliss.

[-] 2 points by beautifulworld (22089) 2 years ago

Seeing the light can take a while sometimes. I hope he does someday soon.

[-] 3 points by DKAtoday (23961) from Coon Rapids, MN 2 years ago

No matter how improbable - anything is possible.

[-] -3 points by Growup6 (-125) 2 years ago

It is. It also supports Anti-Americanism, despite being one of its beneficiaries.

America continues to be the #1 destination for the world's immigrants. It's too bad that American leftists can't straighten them out with the facts before they waste their time. If they only knew the horrors and injustice that awaits them. LOL.

[-] 4 points by beautifulworld (22089) 2 years ago

Wanting my country to succeed for ALL of its citizens is un-American? Really?

[+] -5 points by Growup6 (-125) 2 years ago

No, your perceptions are twisted by your anti-Americanism. It's one of life's ironies that some inside the place that has given themselves and the world so much, hate it. Those on the outside want in more than ever, but moonbats on the inside think it's horrible. Go figure.

It's right up there with liberal American women that defend muslim values. You just can't make this stuff up.

[-] 5 points by beautifulworld (22089) 2 years ago

There is no helping you.

[-] 4 points by flip (7101) 2 years ago

just sent this to your friend growup6 - oh yes you do need help. anti american - weird concept don't you think - let's think about that - the only other country is maybe north korea where they say such things. used to be in the soviet union one could say anti soviet and it would mean something to some sick people but where else - try going to italy and telling someone they are anti italian - you would be laughed at. just goes to show the depth of the indoctrination - you don't even recognize the stupidity or your comment!

[-] 2 points by beautifulworld (22089) 2 years ago

Good job, flip, as usual. Maybe some day these folks will open their minds, and hearts. I'm hoping.

[-] -3 points by Growup6 (-125) 2 years ago

Don't really need the help. I know that the United States is a gift to its own people and a gift to the world. Billions would love to live here and I'm lucky enough to be one of them. Poor means something elsewhere in this world, but being poor in America still ranks you among the world's "haves". It's a miracle that never existed before this place. The United States is best place in the world to be female or to be a minority. The US has also created the greatest period of stability in history. Death by conflict continues to fall globally because of the international system we've installed and defend.

Sorry to burst your America bashing, but that's how it is. You didn't answer the questions because the answers would just make you look foolish.

[-] 4 points by beautifulworld (22089) 2 years ago

zzzzzzzzzzzzzzz.

[-] -2 points by Growup6 (-125) 2 years ago

I know there's no cracking your anti-Americanism. If it can hold true despite everything in front of your eyes in daily life, reading a few things on a board won't change anything.

[-] 3 points by beautifulworld (22089) 2 years ago

You need to read some history. You are really showing your ignorance here. In fact, your beloved nation is quite disliked around the world for reasons that are very complicated and that reach far back in history. Imperialism, capitalism, colonialism, the divisive nation-state, to name a few reasons, cultural hegemony to name another. Your hubris exemplifies your lack of understanding and is the backbone of why so many people around the world, in fact, dislike Americans. So, get your head out of the sand and take of the rose-colored glasses.

[-] -1 points by Growup6 (-125) 2 years ago

I'm aware that many dislike us, but even for them, where'd they like to move? Yep, the USA. People hate the Yankees too. We embarrass them. We still up a lot of jealousy too, I get that. There are also people in Europe, for example, that wouldn't even have their freedom that hate us too. I've met plenty of them. But that's the nature of things. We're number one in so many ways and that brings out the bashers, just like you.

[-] 4 points by Neuwurldodr (744) 2 years ago

The only people you have met are those who write your text books, Texas hypocritical, goons, and liars...the same ones who sit inside the wall street corporate America boardrooms and political offices. . If you had traveled around the world, as you say, you would be doing more for your own kind since they are being run out of most countries around the globe. You don't keep up with who was backing these countries that have had the bloody revolutions? It's not a secret anymore sonny.... You have been no where, know nothing, and cover yourself in the illusionary bliss that you "ARE SOMEBODY?" Your lack of humility as well as lacking in knowledge presents itself through your posts. If I didn't know any better, I probably would feel sorry for you.....

[-] 0 points by beautifulworld (22089) 2 years ago

They're not jealous! They see unwarranted hubris for what it is. You've been brainwashed, and like I said, there's no helping you.

[-] -2 points by Growup6 (-125) 2 years ago

Gosh, you're right. We're horrible and wrong. People like you should tell the millions upon millions upon millions of immigrants lined up to come here before they make a terrible mistake. LOL.

[+] -4 points by Growup6 (-125) 2 years ago

Sure, you're right, it's unwarranted. I'm sure that's what people without indoor toilets have in mind. LOL.

[-] 2 points by Neuwurldodr (744) 2 years ago

Somewhat like the condition of your brainwaves I presume? Do you know who invented toilets and its systems...here's a hint... It was not the royalty in mid Europe, since they used stairwells for their bodily eliminations before invading Eastern Africa and Asian countries which gave them hygiene instructions, soap and water filtration systems, long before the Middle Ages.
Yet, here on this continent, ground water wells and man made pathways for flowing water infiltration underground were available before "OUR" allegedly discovery by Europeans. Here in lies the secrets to the first sewage system that was created. Didn't know that did you little one?

You are going nowhere fast with this thumb sucking logic of yours child!

Your points cannot be proven, you have no knowledge of your history or that of your ancestors, which, unfortunately leaves you at the mercy of the very ones who are sucking the life out of your soul and making you believe it is someone else' fault besides them!!

[-] 1 points by beautifulworld (22089) 2 years ago

Ever hear of the ancient civilization, the Indus River Valley? They were the first to have toilets over 4,600 years ago.

[-] 2 points by flip (7101) 2 years ago

oh yes you do need help. anti american - weird concept don't you think - let's think about that - the only other country is maybe north korea where they say such things. used to be in the soviet union one could say anti soviet and it would mean something to some sick people but where else - try going to italy and telling someone they are anti italian - you would be laughed at. just goes to show the depth of the indoctrination - you don't even recognize the stupidity or your comment!

[-] -2 points by Growup6 (-125) 2 years ago

Say what you'd like. I'm just noting how foolish it is. That's your right and my right. But it's truly a leftwing moonbat that would make any comparison between the U.S. and North Korea.

[-] 3 points by flip (7101) 2 years ago

i notice you cannot respond to the point - you are the one who made the comparison. can you name another country where the anti label might be taken seriously

[-] -2 points by Growup6 (-125) 2 years ago

Of course. Every country has people that hate their own country. But having the United States to hate, encouraged by people like you, makes it more of an issue here. It's especially easy to see here because we're uniquely favored by immigrants. So, it's a starker contrast between the line that waits to come here and moonbat liberals that are already here but hate the place.

[-] 5 points by flip (7101) 2 years ago

so let's see how this works. i don't dislike my country but i do dislike many of the things my government does - in fact they disgust me. you one the other hand love our government don't you - the government of barack obama - the government of obama care. no somehow i don't think so - you probably hate the man (do you know what malcolm x would have called him?). you probably hate the illegals - those you point to right now to make your point. but you love the law right - like the recent court decision on obama care. come on you are a fool and pick and choose as you like. tell me exactly what you like about the country and what you hate - then maybe there is a reasonable conversation here. i give you mario savio - “There's a time when the operation of the machine becomes so odious—makes you so sick at heart—that you can't take part. You can't even passively take part. And you've got to put your bodies upon the gears and upon the wheels, upon the levers, upon all the apparatus, and you've got to make it stop. And you've got to indicate to the people who run it, to the people who own it that unless you're free, the machine will be prevented from working at all.” ― Mario Savio

[-] 2 points by VQkag2 (16478) 2 years ago

We need more people being disgusted with the machine to accomplish that. I wish we could do that. Boycotts, sabotage of business, shutting down commerce, mass strikes would work. We need more people.

More inclusiveness in our efforts to grow the movement. The plutocrats depend on the fact that while we have probably 20% people out of work and struggling we still have 80% working! Still among those many struggling. So maybe it's possible to grow into that group of working poor.

A greater effort needs to occur. I'm with the idea. I know we need more people.

And I think we do love this country. So much we want it back from the conservative plutocrats who have stolen it.!

Peace & Solidarity.

[-] 1 points by jrhirsch (4714) from Sun City, CA 2 years ago

Sabotage of business, shutting down commerce?

I hope you don't expect to repair a transmission by throwing a wrench in it. What we need is to redirect the flow of lubricating oil so that all the gears that are running dry get enough.

[-] 2 points by VQkag2 (16478) 2 years ago

So the engine seizes up with your analogy (no oil ) and mine (strikes and such)

I think we might agree but I'm not entirely sure.

peace

[-] 1 points by jrhirsch (4714) from Sun City, CA 2 years ago

Pretty close. Those poor gears and bearings are really feeling the heat from lack of oil (low wages), yet they still do not strike. Amazing.

[-] 2 points by VQkag2 (16478) 2 years ago

You've taken the analogy too far. is the lubrication money? What are you tryin to say.

Peace

[-] 1 points by jrhirsch (4714) from Sun City, CA 2 years ago

The little gears (poor) need a portion of the oil (money) to lubricate them. If the large gears (rich) divert too much oil to themselves, the small gears seize and the whole machine suffers.

[-] 1 points by VQkag2 (16478) 2 years ago

bread and circuses baby

[-] -2 points by Growup6 (-125) 2 years ago

Sure, liberal moonbats like you claim to love the country, but as the list of complaints grows and the hyperbole deepens, it gets harder and harder to take that love seriously and a better conclusion is to understand that it's hate.

[-] 0 points by flip (7101) 2 years ago

can you read - can you respond to what i said - tell me i am wrong - tell me you love our country - you love our government - you love our new health care and the president and you love the latest court decision. tell me you love the government bureaucrats and social security and medicare. tell me you love the taxes the government imposes since they pay for the things we all need and love. come on you can do it - tell me that you love the president - if you cannot then you should grow up! are you 6 in yrs or mental age?

[-] 1 points by flip (7101) 2 years ago

i noticed you have not responded - are you waiting to grow up - it may take a while - some never do.

[-] 2 points by Neuwurldodr (744) 2 years ago

Don't you mean the country (created by the pale skin invaders of europe) that took away everything from its original inhabitants and called it their own?

No one gave anyone anything, it was already here! Besides, who in the hell made these morons god, other than their own powerless followers of sheep who basked in the blood of the defeated to enjoy the illusions?

Stop being ignorant!

[-] -1 points by Growup6 (-125) 2 years ago

Yes, we're very bad. It's really too bad that some other country isn't shaping the world. Sure, maybe China.

[-] 2 points by Neuwurldodr (744) 2 years ago

Oh for godsakes, ain't no body shaping the world. This world is shaping us!

Are you looking beyond the economical divide and checking out what is going on with the earth and its climate, its structure, its shape shifting and its pivoting on it"s axis?

Believe you me.....in the eyes of the universe, mankind, as it stands right now ain't shyt in the eyes of the Universe. The only thing man can do right now is either straighten up, fly right or just die in the process, after all we all gonna die any way now ain't we so who in the hell has the power??? Not you, not me, not China (just had two major earthquakes in the past two days), not Russia, not Africa, not Europe, not NOBODY!!! This is all a dream and one day when everyone wakes up they'll ask.... "why did I waste so much precious time being ignorant???"

[-] -1 points by Growup6 (-125) 2 years ago

Sure, it is. And when you climb under your bed with your blankie, at least be thankful that you'll be doing it in the USA.

[-] 1 points by Neuwurldodr (744) 2 years ago

Are you that immature that you can't see the forest for the trees? Look around you.....are you hiding from the 50 fires in the west, or the storms in the east, or the death and destruction in the south? If I am hiding under the bed, I am sure you are there also..... your name says it all and that is what you need to do...right now, this minute!! Here....let me help you understand why this nation is on a collision course with ITSELF!!!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vZwF9NnQbWM

I am grateful for the men, women and ancestors who remained morally awake. Their strength passed on and kept those of us who have love in our hearts a legacy that will continue on beyond the madness you all have created!!!

HAPPY DAY TO THOSE WHO ARE FREE FROM FALSEHOOD and have kept us and our families safe!!!!

[-] -1 points by Growup6 (-125) 2 years ago

The United States runs about 8 million acres a year in forest fires. Before modern fire fighting, nature typically burned about 23 million acres a year. Calm down.

[-] 2 points by Neuwurldodr (744) 2 years ago

So....did you just Google that, or was it from Facebook?

You're hilarious!!! GROW UP!!!

[-] -1 points by Growup6 (-125) 2 years ago

Learn up. And calm down.

[-] 3 points by Neuwurldodr (744) 2 years ago

Still looking in that mirror....EH????

[-] 1 points by quicklynow (0) 2 years ago

I notice that no one has answered any of your questions. It's funny how most liberal minded people refuse to answer straight forward questions that require straight forward answers. There is no way they can spin an answer to them so instead they chose to deflect and insult.

[-] 1 points by Growup6 (-125) 2 years ago

Exactly. They won't. They have a narrative about how horrible this country is, especially for minorities, yet the line of minorities to come here ins hundreds of millions deep. That doesn't seem to be a problem for liberals.

[+] -5 points by salta (-1104) 2 years ago

the current govt encourages dependency

[-] 4 points by beautifulworld (22089) 2 years ago

....by providing little economic opportunity to its citizens.

[+] -5 points by salta (-1104) 2 years ago

get rid of the govt regs. get rid of the epa, get rid the dpt of energy, get rid of hud, get rid of hhs. get rid of osha, get rid of obama.

[-] 4 points by beautifulworld (22089) 2 years ago

And you love America?

[-] 2 points by Neuwurldodr (744) 2 years ago

Hmmmm..

[+] -5 points by salta (-1104) 2 years ago

yes i do.the constitution is sound , the business hindering depts are a disgrace.

[-] 2 points by grapes (3548) 2 years ago

Most of these came from the American people and/or their duly-elected or appointed representatives or their agents over the years. We can and should always question their appropriateness for our perennially changing circumstances but we should accord them with a measure of respect, if for nothing more than to observe the sovereignty of the American people. By the way, I learned that there IS truth to the general "wisdom of crowds" as there is to the "madness of crowds" if information is distorted.

[+] -5 points by delayedgrat (-157) 2 years ago

42% of black children live in poverty because black men are worthless reproductively irresponsible losers. 74% of black children are born out of wedlock because black men wont use condoms or get vasectomies. Spare me the violins overs blacks, they live in poverty because getting laid is more important than being a good father to a black male. Thats not America's fault or the founding fathers fault or conservatives fault.

Our children rank low in math because parents dont parent. Kids need guidance and a firm hand.

Home prices need to decline, thats not a bad thing at all.

[-] 3 points by grapes (3548) 2 years ago

Ignorance and poverty are pollutions that we need to get rid of. The association of blackness with poverty and irresponsibility is just an incidental historical legacy. I am sure that at one time or another various people (Asians and ancient Islamists) have looked with disgusts at a domineering albino Western culture. Seeing the world through skin-colored lenses distort our thinking. It is as ridiculous as the old proverbial sock-wearing having caused cancers. Very high percentage of people who developed cancers wore socks!

[-] 3 points by beautifulworld (22089) 2 years ago

You should be immediately banned for this racist crap. Don't ever comment to me again and I won't comment to you.

[+] -6 points by delayedgrat (-157) 2 years ago

Its the truth. If you cant handle truth, thats your issue. Asians dont have 42% in poverty.

Practically every black pro football player has several out of wedlock kids. These men went to college. What is racist about an absolute truth? You brought it up, I completely refuted it.

Whose fault is it? Please answer.

[-] 4 points by Neuwurldodr (744) 2 years ago

Your pale bubble is about to burst. You are not from a great race of people. In fact all races have been so intermingled and amalgamated that no one can say what they are for certain. Stop trying to drape the cloak of a god like origin over this country.....there is no such thing! Stop pointing the finger and find out the truth about your own race....All people on this earth have to deal with the fact that those they hold in high esteem are no greater and no less than any other race and you all need to find out why... This world has been made a shyt hole by all nations and all races, who in reality are one in the same!!

[-] 1 points by beautifulworld (22089) 2 years ago

Good post. And, delayed gratification is used by major religions to say that it is okay that we are all unequal here on earth because in the afterlife, ahhh, then we'll all be equal. It's b.s.

[+] -6 points by HempTwisted (-28) 2 years ago

Why DKAtoday Should Be Permanently Banned From The Occupy Wall Street Forum & OWS Movement:

http://pastebin.com/n2B7ZMXy

[+] -4 points by delayedgrat (-157) 2 years ago

What a dumb post.

[-] 4 points by Neuwurldodr (744) 2 years ago

Yes, I do agree....."42% of black children live in poverty because black men are worthless reproductively irresponsible losers. 74% of black children are born out of wedlock because black men wont use condoms or get vasectomies. Spare me the violins overs blacks, they live in poverty because getting laid is more important than being a good father to a black male. Thats not America's fault or the founding fathers fault or conservatives fault.

Our children rank low in math because parents dont parent. Kids need guidance and a firm hand"

WHAT A DUMB POST!! Teach our children the truth...like why people like you hold on to those pale skin lies!!!

[Removed]

[Removed]

[-] 4 points by beautifulworld (22089) 2 years ago

Read one book for me. Read "The Black Image in the White Mind: The Debate on Afro-American Character and Destiny, 1817-1914" by George Fredrickson.

http://www.anisfield-wolf.org/books/the-black-image-in-the-white-mind-the-debate-on-afro-american-character-and-destiny-1817%E2%80%931914/

[+] -5 points by delayedgrat (-157) 2 years ago

Its not white peoples fault that black men are reproductively irresponsible. Quit manufacturing phony victimization excuses.

With 74% of black children born w/o a frher, the blame is pure and cannot be argued. Black men are their races own evil enemy.

You want to give them a pass and make others raise their children? You are complicit in black childrens piverty. How do you sleep at night, baby hater?

[-] 3 points by Neuwurldodr (744) 2 years ago

You brought it up!!! Yet, I don't see any men of color running the wall street corruption, European demise, or creating lies regarding how this country got so great! All the history books, news media and falsehood have one thing in common, origins of pale skin hypocrisy....no more...no less. Now, if you are so proud of your race, why not run with the big dogs in the Mother country.....Europa!!! Hey kid......the jig is up!!! No one believes you alls bullshyt anymore..not even your own kind and that's it in a nutshell, pure and simple!!

[+] -4 points by delayedgrat (-157) 2 years ago

The hunger and despair of fatherless black children has your soul to blame. Revel in your hatred of children, you sociopath, you assassin of hope.

[-] 3 points by Neuwurldodr (744) 2 years ago

Get out the mirror fool!! You can't grow that way!!!

[-] 3 points by beautifulworld (22089) 2 years ago

It's about history, delayedgrat. I can't help you any further. Learn your history.

[+] -4 points by delayedgrat (-157) 2 years ago

Bull shit. Put on a condom. Itsthateasy. What an apologist for horrific behavior.

Every fatherless black child is on YOUR hands. Their poverty has you to blame. Drink their blood, its on your hands.

[-] 3 points by beautifulworld (22089) 2 years ago

Read a book, open your mind, quit judging other people and thinking you are better. You're clearly not.

[+] -5 points by HempTwisted (-28) 2 years ago

Why DKAtoday Should Be Permanently Banned From The Occupy Wall Street Forum & OWS Movement:

http://pastebin.com/n2B7ZMXy

[-] 2 points by beautifulworld (22089) 2 years ago

Enough. I got your message.

[+] -5 points by HempTwisted (-28) 2 years ago

Why DKAtoday Should Be Permanently Banned From The Occupy Wall Street Forum & OWS Movement:

http://pastebin.com/n2B7ZMXy

[+] -5 points by salta (-1104) 2 years ago

you're talking to someone with agenda, when a person has an agenda, the facts are bothersome.

[-] 0 points by grapes (3548) 2 years ago

Have you considered that the 74% of black children being born out of wedlock might have something to do with our laws? What happens to the families' income if the black fathers stay with their families to raise their kids with firm hands? Does our government cut their support payments? It may well be poverty that makes people dependent and creates broken families and "lost" kids.

[+] -4 points by delayedgrat (-157) 2 years ago

multi millionaire black pro athletes have kids out of wedlock. Terrell Owens, All pro and a TV icon has 5 kids by 5 different women. Ochocinco has 6 or 8 kids by a like number of women.

Sexual Irresponsibilty is a trait of black men. Deserting their kids is another.

[-] 4 points by JesseHeffran (3903) 2 years ago

To call you racist is to gloss over your childish, inexperienced ignorance. Sexual irresponsibility is an equal opportunity infliction. If you don't know that, you need to get out more.

It is funny you use television personalities to make your case, and since we are pontificating about why people are the way they are, I wonder if that says anything about you.

[+] -4 points by delayedgrat (-157) 2 years ago

And you have the misery of fatherless etched into your soul. Have fun crushing youthful dreams and their futures.

[-] 3 points by JesseHeffran (3903) 2 years ago

Well, since you went there. I'd say my fatherlessness has protected me from the sins of the father. Can you say the same, ass hole?

[-] 1 points by grapes (3548) 2 years ago

Even that could NOT have accounted for the 74% of black children born out of wedlock that you said. Perhaps that was due to the lack of proper role models. There is definitely a cultural component to the problem because in the old days, the born-out-of-wedlock percentage was vastly lower and I just do not think that human biology had evolved THAT fast in the last few decades. Linking icons to generalized stereotypes is inductive reasoning. It is ONLY good for generating hypotheses and is NEVER good as a component of proofs.

[-] -3 points by salta (-1104) 2 years ago

you did NOT say anything racist. you spoke the truth.

[-] 1 points by Neuwurldodr (744) 2 years ago

True....Because the truth perpetrated by one's particular race just might be another race's demise!!

It all depends on who is on the receiving end and who is doing the perpetrating ...wouldn't you agree???

[+] -4 points by salta (-1104) 2 years ago

No. race and racism is perpetuated by blacks who make a living off of it. the truth is the truth. black "leaders " have turned their people into professional victims. why is that when a black person is a conservative that person is reviled by his/her own people ( blacks)?

[-] 3 points by VQkag2 (16478) 2 years ago

Yeah lets blame the victim, Then we don't have do anything to address the problem. Poor schools.? The kids did it themselves. Unfair application of laws that destroy young minorities lives. Serves them right. We didn't do it. Slavery for 250 yrs, brutal racist rapes, hangings and discrimination by the terrorists KKK for another 100 yrs ('til 1950) was there own fault. The crsappy schools, racist drugs laws, redlining by banks/real estate/employers is all the blacks faults.!

Cause their makin money from it. Are you joking? They have no money.! What money are they makin?. The people with all the money are the right wing wackos who crashed the world economy and prey on all the 99%.

[-] -2 points by delayedgrat (-157) 2 years ago

I believe there is racism. However that doesnt in any way justify the "primitive savage" mentality where they arent reproducively responsible. Sorry, that dog dont hunt. Black men are relegating their offspring to a virtual economc sub species.

I dont give a shit what happened 200 years ago. That in no fucking way excuses bad behavior toward black women or children. Just put on a condom, 50c. I laugh at white people who defend black men as a way of proving being enlightened or hi, when in fact you look like utter fools.

BTW blacks see you as fools too.

[-] 3 points by VQkag2 (16478) 2 years ago

Your name calling = weak arguments. I am also against irresponsible parents. Of course that is not just black people. And the rate of fatherless children changes with income level. So since our society has created the poverty that black people are victimized by perhaps that has something to do with it. Thats not an excuse! Thats me using intelligence. Your comments suggest it must be because they are black. That seems to be race based logic and therefore easily interpreted as..... Ready?....... Wait for it........

Racist!

[+] -4 points by delayedgrat (-157) 2 years ago

poverty causes reproductive iresponsibilty? No its the reverse. Yes you are excusing bad behavior, so you are complicit, horribly, evilly complicit in the poverty of black chidren. Hope you are happy, sociopath!!! Drink their blood, child hater!!!

Sorry, you are truly the hideous racist.

[-] 3 points by VQkag2 (16478) 2 years ago

Your name calling = weak arguments. I am against irresponsible fathers. Whatever color they are. I also know that if we minimized poverty we would have less fatherless children.

That is the truth. You don't have to respond. We disagree. And please refrain from the horrible name calling. Your not gonna bully me into believing that irresponsibility is a result of what race we are.

[-] -3 points by delayedgrat (-157) 2 years ago

Bullshit. poverty and being a responsible father have no correlation. Multi millionaire pro footall and basketballers have scores of children out of wedlock.

I wont refrain from name calling till you proclam that black fathers are failing their children.

Your truth is a lie.

[-] 3 points by VQkag2 (16478) 2 years ago

many fathers, (black, white, yellow, brown) abandon their children. It's less about race than it is about income level. Your athlete example proves nothing, out of wedlock is not the same as child abandonment.

[-] -3 points by delayedgrat (-157) 2 years ago

All you have proven is that you tacitly agree to coddle and mollify 75% of black fathers and who knows what other sociopathic behaviors because they were oppressed. It goes back then to YOU being complicit, intimately engaged in the destruction of black children's future as you and their fathers oppress these innocents by leaving them fatherless and regaling in that oppression by not holding anyone accountable.

You PRETEND to be a humanist, but at your core you are a savage.

[-] 3 points by VQkag2 (16478) 2 years ago

Your name calling = weak arguments, your race based theories are so 19th century. Please refrain from the hostile offensiveness. It isn't believable.

[+] -4 points by DKAtoday (23961) from Coon Rapids, MN 2 years ago

Look into the facts of white deadbeat fathers - there are plenty.

[-] -3 points by delayedgrat (-157) 2 years ago

It is a problem in white families, but 74% points to a genetic defect.

[-] 2 points by Neuwurldodr (744) 2 years ago

The only problem alleged "white" families have is facing the reality of their own existence, or should I say now, their demise without people of color. Without the mothers and fathers of the globe who continue to guide you all into the role of civilized beings, you would not exist to this day. Now, that is the fear you all are facing, not "blacks" or fathers who aren't around, or any of the racist indoctrination you love to throw around in order to feel as if you are different. You know that you are not, nor are you anything special, nor are you placed upon some pedestal that states you have the right to exist above all others on this planet. That is falsehood personified! Now, if you look at the origins of the races, you will realize that you could not have been created without the blood of the very individuals you are taught to hate and despise. Why is that and why do you hate so? If you dislike being around people of color, I do believe the Caucasoid mountain range still has a place for you! No, I am not racist, I am a realist because I know who gave birth to your kind and it wasn't SNOW WHITE!!!

[-] -2 points by delayedgrat (-157) 2 years ago

You are the most extreme racist of all.

[-] -3 points by DKAtoday (23961) from Coon Rapids, MN 2 years ago

Fatherless children is not a race issue - it is a societal issue.

[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (23961) from Coon Rapids, MN 2 years ago

As I said it is another sign of a sick society.

It is like the world has fibromyalgia - a disease that affects the central nervous system. As the whole body functions off of the central nervous system - you can well imagine that anything and everything can be affected by the disease.

Systemic - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Systemic Systemic refers to something that is spread throughout, system-wide, affecting a group or system such as a body, economy, market or society as a whole.


[-] 1 points by freewriterguy (747) 0 minutes ago

in my case, i did divorce my 1st wife, but shouldnt have been denied the right to ever see my children. It was the 1st wife who changed her number, and then the state of texas, that denied me my God given father rights, because they said, "they couldnt supervise me in California". Needless to say, both me and my daughters are very disappointed with not having their father in their life, especially after finding out that I am a good man. ↥twinkle ↧stinkle permalink

[-] 1 points by freewriterguy (882) 2 years ago

in my case, i did divorce my 1st wife, but shouldnt have been denied the right to ever see my children. It was the 1st wife who changed her number, and then the state of texas, that denied me my God given father rights, because they said, "they couldnt supervise me in California". Needless to say, both me and my daughters are very disappointed with not having their father in their life, especially after finding out that I am a good man.

[-] 1 points by freewriterguy (882) 2 years ago

I agree with you, and like your comment, Black men are relegating their offspring to a virtual economic sub species. Now granted, if our fathers would have loved them "negroes" and embraced them and shared their land with them after seeing they suffered so much I tell you that blacks wouldnt be a scourge to us as a nation today occupying a majority of our prison population even though they only represent 18% of our population. I blame our fathers for this, as they will and are being held accountable for this injustice in the courts on high. But blacks need to come to realize, their curse has been lifted, and though the ground had been cursed to not yield its strength unto them, as evident in Africa, since the curse has been lifted, they are invited to prosper and join the civilized world. (Of course, gangster mentality which we see both in Africa as they force children to machine gun their parents or chop off their arms, and here in america, where rap music fuels their hatred for "popping a cap in their brother, and controlling their bitches" and they are still shooting their brothers like the recently deceased black rappers we see, puts them at risk of bringing a new curse upon them.)

However, I do not believe they stand alone in being at risk of a new curse. I see the people of this land witholding the abundance of the earth from each other, and their hearts are set upon their riches, and greed is transferred to their children, who do persecute the poor by renting their many homes to the poor their parents have "invested" in. And the courts are in alignment with the rich issuing judgements and bench warrants against the poor, and forming laws that say the poor have to park their trailers in trailer parks owned by corporations who charge them as much as 600 a month just for space rent enough to actually buy a home today thanks to the low interest rate that must be kept low to avoid our nation defaulting on its 55 cents on every dollar of debt it continues to incur to pay private rich bankers, who are so wealthy they dont even need the interest on our money. Yes Ill say it again, our money. our wealth has been handed over to a few private individuals.

In effect it has become illegal to live anywhere on the earth that isnt zoned for a person to live on it. And that zone is set up to take the lion's share of the working mans money and give it to rich men who dont even need his money. Nowhere is this more evident than the recent decades of bankers activity who have charged the poor 12 billion dollars a year in overdraft fees for such ridiculous things as a gallon of milk +39 dollars, or a blockbuster movie rental +39 or a gas tank fill up +39 dollars. They didnt just "assume" that we didnt want to be inconvenienced with not being able to get that gallon of milk, they hide behind that as an excuse! Or the interest on our mortgages, where they take 80% of their interest up front for the first part of the mortgage, what if we only owned the home for a few years? Then the banks again would have taken the "lions share" of the working man's money again, and left him with not even enough to cover closing cost on his home. This needs to be changed. We need a bank that charges simple interest where the principle and the interest are equitable!

[-] 1 points by Neuwurldodr (744) 2 years ago

Boy, somewhere along the line someone must have let you know that "black" blood actually runs through your veins. Why blame it on the "blacks"? Don't you live in a protected environment around those who are the same as you? So, what are you really worried about son? Now, here's a question for you.....what is the real difference between "the primitive savage mentality" of what is being done to individuals in the East, Afghanistan, Mexico, Brazil, Bosnia, in Russia, in China, In any other country you can throw a dart at? Why do you insist on blaming blacks for all your troubles when all you ever look at is how different you are from them? Is this a Freudian self-hatred scenario that makes your envy come out in this manner? I don't see where all "allegedly white" people are any worse or better than any other race, yet, I know what they have done across the globe, just as the dark skinned races have done and are doing the same. You have got to let go of race indoctrination and understand that in every man beats a spark in their heart that either makes them want to help or harm humanity. So which spark guides you? Obviously we already know.. Hatred, greed, lust, envy, murder, theft, does not have a monopoly on any skin color or any one perpetuated historical bull shyt!!! You and many others need to understand why you feel so bad about yourselves!! Learn your history and realize, we are all on a sinking ship. So, how do you save yourself, and yourself only??
Learn to love instead of hate!!!

[-] -2 points by delayedgrat (-157) 2 years ago

What a phony. We are talking about the greatness of America, not "Bosnia" et al.

BeautifulWorldPhonyHateAmericaFirst commented on black poverty. I get to rebut his hatred of America with fact. You drift off into some useless New World Order diatribe that does nothing but excuse bad behavior.

Please leave.

[-] 1 points by Neuwurldodr (744) 2 years ago

Oh, and in response to your thumb sucking pout...."Please leave"

Make me little man!!!

My ancestors have been on these shores for over 10,000 years! Now can you disprove that?? Find out where you come from, then we might be able to have an intelligent discussion child!

[-] 1 points by Neuwurldodr (744) 2 years ago

No, you are talking about the greatness of America. I am referring to other countries that have the same, if not worse problems than America. You keep referring to the greatness of America, yet you refuse to understand that the very people you are hating on are the very lost nation of people whose blood, sweat and tears created the wealth for this country. Now, if you want to be genuine, then you should understand that you are living in some made up Disneyland daydream where you believe that the non-melanin in ones skin gives one the right to ignore facts and declare superiority across the planet....IT DOES NOT!!! You can ignore it all you want, but it doesn't change the fact that most of those who live in this country come from a bloodline whose DNA can be traced back to the dark skinned race, not only here but elsewhere. As for the New World Order, bull shyt my man, Bush already got that on track for Corporate America...henceforth....the reason OWS is alive and kicking!!! You my friend are in need of a re-educmication!!!

[+] -4 points by salta (-1104) 2 years ago

who has no money? for sharpton and jackson, race baiting is their lifes work. and they have done quite well by it. the kkk ws started and perpetuated by democrats

[-] 3 points by VQkag2 (16478) 2 years ago

Dems who created the kkk were the racist conservatives until the great FDR changed all that. Now repubs are the racist conservatives. Right? Jesserev are good, positive soldiers against racists who try to twist, deflect, and distract the discussion into "blaming the victim".

Most people are smart enough to see that obfuscation. Good people know that Jesse, and the Rev are fightin the good fight AGAINST racists!

[-] -2 points by salta (-1104) 2 years ago

jesse jackson is a race baiter. he has made his lifes work. the same with sharpton. professional haters.

[-] 3 points by VQkag2 (16478) 2 years ago

They are lovers of humanity!. They have been threatened and attacked, numerous times by hateful racists who will do anything to silence their message of love.

They don't do it for the money. They do it because it is their calling from God.

Why do you attack them? Are you trying to silence their message of love. Are you one of the racists who would assassinate these 2 strong righteous soldiers for the 99%.?

[-] -3 points by salta (-1104) 2 years ago

tawana brawley ws a calling from god? jackson calling nyc was due to a calling from god? the only thing the race bait twins have in common is their own bottom lines.

[-] 1 points by VQkag2 (16478) 2 years ago

Singular isolated incidents from decades ago. Got anything else?

[-] -2 points by salta (-1104) 2 years ago

crown heights(1991) freddies fashion mart(1995)

[-] 0 points by VQkag2 (16478) 2 years ago

Your a republican partisan. I don't expect you to support these 2 great men, or OWS.

[-] -3 points by salta (-1104) 2 years ago

cant stand that the facts of crown heights, tawana brawley and freddies fashion mart dont support your agenda?

[-] -1 points by VQkag2 (16478) 2 years ago

Never heard of them. Can you list all the good work, protests they have been involved in. They amount to hundreds of important issues.

You are attacking 2 of the most prolific, and self sacrificing soldiers in the war against the right wing wacko racists who run the country.

[-] -2 points by salta (-1104) 2 years ago

do a search on the two incidents and tawana brawley. sharpton and jackson are dirt.

[-] 0 points by caseman (-24) 2 years ago

Got that right and neither one will not make any appearance without getting paid, they are both useless

[-] 2 points by Neuwurldodr (744) 2 years ago

Wow.....did your mother tell you that, or her great great grandfather? Who, by the way, just might be Harriet Tubman's brother!

Don't get too carried away honey, remember, "white" men love dark meat too!!!

[-] 1 points by rpc972 (628) from Portland, OR 2 years ago

Wage Slavery:

It's way cheaper than slave

and anyone can do it

no pov if job

get'n rich just work'n this bitch

the dream self induced

O Baby!

[-] 1 points by nazihunter (215) 2 years ago

This Big Brother. Keep up the good work. It is with great gamesmanship that we have a avoided a revolution. When we no longer have to "fool" the public, we will throw your gutless ass a bone.

[Removed]

[Removed]

[-] 0 points by TryingForAnOpenMind (-358) from Yonkers, NY 2 years ago

USA all the way . Land of the free and home of the brave. God Bless America my home sweet home.

[-] 3 points by flip (7101) 2 years ago

how about love it or leave it like the old men said to me in 1969 - my response was fix it or fuck it - well we haven't fixed it yet! would this apply to you -"Patriotism is the last refuge of the scoundrel."

[-] 0 points by TryingForAnOpenMind (-358) from Yonkers, NY 2 years ago

God Bless America. land that I love. stand be side her.

[-] 2 points by flip (7101) 2 years ago

well your screen name is appropriate because you do not have an open mind. i give you credit for admitting it and at least trying - try harder - yonkers - the white rich section i imagine.

[-] 0 points by TryingForAnOpenMind (-358) from Yonkers, NY 2 years ago

shame on u for playing the race card, because I said something patriotic?

[-] 1 points by shadz66 (19985) 2 years ago

"Trying for an Open Mind" ? Try :

pax et lux ...

[-] 0 points by TryingForAnOpenMind (-358) from Yonkers, NY 2 years ago

tempus fugit. memento mori.

[-] 1 points by shadz66 (19985) 2 years ago

'Time Flies' & remember -

That indeed 'We All Die' !

Try to look around now &

To use your inner 'eYe' !!

~*~

fiat lux ...

[-] 1 points by TryingForAnOpenMind (-358) from Yonkers, NY 2 years ago

e tu brutus?

[-] 2 points by shadz66 (19985) 2 years ago

EH ?!!! Ain't nothing 'treacherous' in my wee ditty pal !! Now why not continue 'trying for an open mind' with something a little more relevant to things going on in the world at large ?!

Please keep "TryingFAOM" dude ; it'll be rewarding I promise & TPTB won't be able to hoodwink you into being 'a Lamb at a Wolves' dinner party any longer ~:~

dum spiro, spero ...

[-] 2 points by Middleaged (5140) 2 years ago

Nice link. I looked up Dennis Kelleher and found these two:

http://www.politico.com/arena/perm/Dennis__Kelleher_824D7380-EFB2-407F-925F-DEB4A304F3DC.html

http://www.politico.com/arena/perm/Dennis__Kelleher_368CFB67-1507-44A7-9F66-1FFB3D660137.html

Open Minded ideas and other large topics brings me to Prisons. Honestly I don't think anyone believes we have reform in our penal systems. Prisons have long been a business. A money earner for some companies.

So if we agree to stop putting non-violent people in prison while embracing the idea that white collar crimes on Wall Street should be stronger.... I mean people picked up for drug possession should not be in jail.

1) The US South Pioneered the Work Prison
2) We have private contractors that are required to be awarded Federal Contracts which use volunteer prisoners (UNICOR, FPI)
3) Private corproations run prisons now

So Ideas? How do we make prisons places where

1) Juveniles don't be come career criminals
2) 1st Time Prisoners don't learn how to commit crime or terrorism
3) 1st timers don't become gang members or have to join a gang in prison to defend themselves

Clearly we have to restrict movement of prisoners to prevent them from being assaulted, threatened, blackmailed, and taught crime. Clearly we have to make prison a place of dread, but not a place that is unsafe. Our prisons are unsafe and training criminals.

Having said all that. Somehow we have to allow prisoners to get out of jail and get jobs and get appartments so they don't join the unemployed and the people that need hand outs, social programs, food stamps, public assistance.

After all, if I owned an appartment do I want a gang banger living there? No. But the gang banger might be forced to be a criminal if there are no jobs or apartments. (BTW there is an apartment shortage in the USA these days).

[-] 1 points by shadz66 (19985) 2 years ago

'Private Prisons' are indeed a huge and developing subject in The U$A & as such, I append :

e tenebris, lux ...

[-] 2 points by Middleaged (5140) 2 years ago

Excellent Mother Jones Link! Clearly this is another Government Subsidy that removes individual rights and freedom of information rights.

[-] 0 points by TryingForAnOpenMind (-358) from Yonkers, NY 2 years ago

Vocatus atque non vocatus deus aderit. Thanks for the latin banter sweetie.....TPTB got nothing on u.

[-] 1 points by shadz66 (19985) 2 years ago

One wonders what Jung would've made of parochial, right-wing, nationalism.

"Vocatus atque non vocatus, Deus aderit." = 'Called or uncalled, God will be present'.

This is actually a statement that Jung discovered among the Latin writings of Desiderius Erasmus, who declared the statement had been an ancient Spartan proverb. Jung popularized it, having it inscribed over the doorway of his house, and upon his tomb - as you point out below.

As a fellow CGJung fan, I offer a quote from 'Synchronicity : An Acausal Connecting Principle' (1960) : "Primitive superstition lies just below the surface of even the most tough-minded individuals, and it is precisely those who most fight against it who are the first to succumb to its suggestive effects."

Keep "TFAOM" ~*~

multum in parvo ...

[-] 1 points by shadz66 (19985) 2 years ago

vincit qui se vincit et ne quid nimis !

pax et lux ...

[-] 0 points by TryingForAnOpenMind (-358) from Yonkers, NY 2 years ago

let us not talk falsely now, the hour is getting late

[-] 1 points by shadz66 (19985) 2 years ago

That really depends where you of course & re. the above = 'He conquers who conquers himself' & 'nothing in excess' ...

concordia discors !

[-] 0 points by TryingForAnOpenMind (-358) from Yonkers, NY 2 years ago

what is up? r u really serious w/ all this stuff? I just got a new job and am 1/2 dead..from trying to handle the work load.. I just come on this OWS site for a laugh once in a while.

[-] 2 points by shadz66 (19985) 2 years ago

Chill - nothing was was said or meant with any malice or even a frown :-) & "et tu brutus" was your line. lol ! Relax and here's one for you - Q : Who wrote "How to get rich quick" ? A : 'Robin Banx' !

pax et lux ...

[-] 0 points by TryingForAnOpenMind (-358) from Yonkers, NY 2 years ago

see >>>>http://www.jungnewyork.com/photo_vocatus.shtml

[-] 0 points by TryingForAnOpenMind (-358) from Yonkers, NY 2 years ago

I am relaxed..did not mean to come off any other way. I have a new job and am working like crazy, Always aware the ax could fall. I like >>>>.....Vocatus atque non vocatus deus aderit.. I knew that one...because I am a fan of CG Jung...he had that quote engraved over his door...and on his grave...I do believe..:))

[Removed]

[-] 0 points by rpc972 (628) from Portland, OR 2 years ago

Can anyone believe this SHIT??!!

Makes you want to break down and just cry!!!!!!!!

http://occupywallst.org/forum/vote-or-stfu/

[-] 0 points by rpc972 (628) from Portland, OR 2 years ago

See The News Room, HBO

[+] -4 points by salta (-1104) 2 years ago

YES !!!!! It is.