Forum Post: End the points system! Part 2. Replys to get 0 points to start instead of 1 point.
Posted 12 years ago on Sept. 12, 2012, 3:48 a.m. EST by jrhirsch
(4714)
from Sun City, CA
This content is user submitted and not an official statement
After reading some of the responses to the previous post about ending the point system, I came up with a possible compromise.
Instead of awarding one point for every reply to a post, why not award zero points for every reply? There should be no points gained for something that no one has voted for. Points would only be gained when someone has upvoted someone's reply. Doing this will help eliminate the desire to boost point scores by replying endlessly to posts.
In the present system, if a person makes 1,000 replies, with an equal number of up and down votes, he receives a 1,000 point score. What sense does that make? The score is meaningless. Just quantity, no quality.
If a person starts with zero points per reply and makes 1000 replies, and receives a thousand up votes, that is meaningful. Quality, not quantity.
Another idea would be to reward posts, not just replies. Any thoughts?
Better yet. Lets end the endless bitching about the point system.
Don't you have important things to consider?
What about a system of cashing in our points for gifts.?
A toaster, a nice iphone case, something like that. ;)
Otherwise, we must recognize that the numbers serve no real purpose because they are too easily manipulated!
Other important changes can be implemented that might guide the forum to more valuable goals.
It's just an unreliable, meaningless number.
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Doesn't that require more work and financing?
I support getting rid of the number system. It does not work.
Many people are preoccupied with the points system. Of course the numbers are irrelevant. Mainly because they are easily manipulated. For this reason, poor comments could have large positive numbers and good comments can have large negative numbers.
Thanx
I'll vote 1 for you on that ;) :P
Thx. I'll return the favor.
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Re. this self-referential & relatively useless navel gazing, here's what's important from your 'Part 1' :
ad iudicium ...
"Quiescence Is Not An Option & To "Ignore The Troll" Is To Enable Him To Co-opt This Forum"
Explain how not engaging a troll will help him co-opt the forum?
I'm in danger of getting bored with this but here you go :
multum in parvo ...
In theory you post about what you believe and make occasional replies for the same reason. The points should be irrelevant. They do seem to have only two purposes, they allow you identify almost immediately who is or isn't likely to agree with you and they offer an ego boost for those that need it.
I've never seen a point system that didn't end up turning into a political buddy systems, etc. It is after all voting, therefore political in nature. Isn't that what we are fundamentally trying to fight against in our US political landscape?
Are you implying we have cronyism here too? Probably true.
Not implying anything - I haven't been here often enough to say one way or another. But based on experience from other sites, it is inevitable.
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Why not embrace anarchy by removing points?
The points are irrelevant. Shouldn't we agree on finding new ways to protest the 1% oligarchs?
Encourage all people to get on the streets?
Our energies are not best used fighting with each other or discussing the meaningless point system.
I like the word 'oligarchs' !! Thanks VQkag2 for using it, and making it a part of the regular language/conversations here.
No prob. It's what they are. They control the politcal system & have their tentacles in both parties.
We must :
replace pro 1% conservatives with pro 99% progressives, & protest for change that benefits the 99%.
You didn't answer my question.
Your question: "Why not embrace anarchy by removing points?"
My answer: Because the points are irrelevant.
My suggestion/question" Shouldn't we agree on finding new ways to protest the 1% oligarchs?
Encourage all people to get on the streets?
My reasoning: Our energies are not best used fighting with each other or discussing the meaningless point system.
I did answer your question sweet Martha, YOU did not answer MINE!
How's Odin?
I agree we should remove the points because they favor hierarchy instead of anarchy.
I also agree we should favor having protesters on the ground. Did you sign the "OWS For One Day" pledge put out by Odin's friend Thrasymaque?
http://occupywallst.org/forum/the-be-ows-for-one-day-pledge/
The best way to do this is to avoid partisan politics like Thrasymaque mentioned. Everybody is welcome in OWS, including republicans. If they want to march with us, let's let them. It's better not to insult them at all. Let's be the 99%.
Perhaps you should join the OWS Crew For Factuality AKA Bridge To The Ground, and leave Partisan Powers behind.
Odin's fine as usual. We will be protesting together at the next OTS. You're welcome to join.
It's been tried and it was a miserable failure.
Thrashy was/is a lair and a tyrant.
He created more pointless issues around here than ANY point system possible could.
What's been tried?
His idea of protesting for one day? http://occupywallst.org/forum/the-be-ows-for-one-day-pledge/ His idea of Building A Bridge To The Ground? Those are good ideas! They should be tried again and again!
I protest as much as I can at OTS and it's the best feeling. There's nothing that feels like ground protesting. I say do it! Who cares if you like Thrasymaque or not! His ideas are in line with OWS. We support them at OTS.
See the title of the thread. ending or adjusting the point system.
It's been tried. It failed.
I'm sorry. thrashy is an ass and a tyrant that has done unaccounted damage to this site, and drove away good posters by the score, while he continuously bitched about lizard people.. while running bots and sock puppets.
If that's in line with OWS, then WTF?
There has NEVER been anything at all preventing anyone from building this "bridge to the ground", that some people keep bringing up.
Nothing at all.
That too, was tried in the early days and your "friend" thrashy never did a thing to help them out.
He was far too busy with his beloved lizard people.
I'm not interested by the past, I'm interested by what's going on now.
jrhirsch brought up the idea of removing points and I think it's good.
I also think Thrasymaque's idea of Building A Bridge To The Ground is good. And, I like his posting about being "OWS For One Day". That's also a good idea. You should sign it. We would love to see you at OTS. http://occupywallst.org/forum/the-be-ows-for-one-day-pledge/
He's also correct that partisan politics should not be part of OWS.
I joined this site last week, and that's what I judge. Since then, his ideas have been directly in line with those we see at the OTS protest.
Those who ignore the past, are destined to repeat it.
No thanks.
I don't cotton to liars, tyrants, bot runners, or sock puppeteers.
Thrashy is all of those and more.
Also considering the fact that "thrashy" has not posted under that moniker for a while now. How do you know?
I'll also inform you that we are all partisan. It's part of the human condition. Like it or not.
Personally? I won't trust thrasy until he apologizes for his behavior and performs some form of contrition.
The ain't nothing about him to recommend.
Nothing.
I don't care about Thrasymaque, I care about his good ideas. If we want OWS to work we must put personal differences aside and focus on the good ideas. His ideas are good. That's all that matters.
Are you sure that you're not 'arthurfromOTS' ? Martha / Arthur - what's in name, huh ?! Hmmm ....
ad iudicium ...
That's a bit confused.
His ideas are sock puppets, bots, lying, misinterpretation, manipulation, egoism, attacks on the 99% and so many more negative emotional things.
To say that doesn't matter, is a bit disingenous.
It does matter.
I did not see this. What I saw was his idea for more protesting on the ground, his idea to stop partisan politics which only divide us, and his idea to Build a Bridge To The Ground. I agree with all those ideas. They are good ideas and they are in line with OTS and OWS.
(response to below).
You just got here and have actually been stirring up the partisanship you claim to be against.
That's what your last post was all about. Nothing more.
Indeed, doing nothing more than bumping this bullshit thread.
I will no longer respond to this thread on any level, although I may try and get it removed.
Perhaps I will see you again in a thread on inequities?
Where we may have a chance to get to know one another.
I don't think this thread is bullshit. I respect the poster jrhirsch for his ideas.
Why would you try to get jrhirsch's posting removed? His idea is good. Isn't he allowed his opinion? I heard you and DKAtoday were busy banning people from this site. How many people do you want to ban? And, why? We never ban people at OTS. It's not in the spirit of OWS.
You're repeating yourself and not responding to what I'm saying.
I find that divisive, and I have a great deal of experience interacting with the entity called thrashy........and his twisted beliefs.
Please if you will, tell us why thrashy believes there is anything at all that has ever prevented this so called bridge.
.
Martha says she wants to date Thrashy. Maybe that's why she doesn't see the Thrasy despicableness.
Love is blind! But us neighbors ain't!
From what I understand, DKAtoday has been banning Odin who had been trying to start the bridge. Yesterday, DKAtoday banned April, and he often bans Thrasymaque. He also talked about banning hchc. These are all people that want to build a Bridge To The Ground with this site instead of having it has a political campaign headquarters. He's right when he talks about Partisan Powers and the fact that all the higher scores on this site who work with the moderators are Obama supporters. This site no longer reflects OWS, and every time someone who does reflect OWS comes around he is banned by DKAtoday and his Partisan Powers.
The points are meaningless.
I would never sign anything attached to Thrasy. He has been offensive, abusive, homophobic, racist, and more partisan than anyone on this site. & come here only to launch hateful personal attacks against decent people who happen to disagree with him.
If you or Odin would befriend that kind despicable person you are not my friend.
Besides I am on the street often. I was @60 wall st & Zuccotti park last night, don't need that despicable persons pledge, thank you very much.
I will not pretend there is no election in 54 days. I AM partisan. I know one party is better. I do not support silencing people, or abridging the right to free speech.
Partisan debate will encoutrage more people to get on the street.
You offer a nce defense/invitation to republicans. I will challenge all opinions against the 99%, all efforts at anti dem partisan campaigning, all anti OWS rhetoric (which comes from republicans BTW).
I have never met a republican at the many OWS protests, meetings I've been to. Only if they are viciously attacking OWS.
Have you?
I did meet republicans and members of the Tea Party at OTS. They came to a few protests about Wall Street. We don't agree about many things, but there are certain points that we do agree on. As an anarchist and a member of OWS, I believe in accepting all people who want to fight with us against the system from the outside. Partisan politics are not accepted at OTS because they do nothing but divide OWS.
I am not here to become friends with Thrasymaque or anyone else. But, I do support all ideas which are good no matter who they come from. A lot of his ideas are good and in line with OTS. I support his call for more protesters and his call to stop partisan politics. He seems to know a lot about OWS.
You are against dividing us?
And you are supporting the Thras? Is that a joke.? He has NO good ideas only division! His hateful tactics are insulting to all human beings.
"if you lay down with dogs, you're gonna get fleas!"
Please tell me what idea from republicans/tea party you support. Maybe I could agree.
I don't support ideas from the republican party nor do I support ideas from the democrat party. I'm an anarchist, I don't support ideas coming from politicians. I support OWS ideas.
If we have a protest and a republican wants to join because he believes in what we are protesting, then I accept him with open arms. This is a decision that comes from NYCGA. OWS is about accepting everyone in the 99% to fight the system from the outside. It's not about fighting with partisan politics by insulting someone who supports the republicans or someone who supports Obama. We don't talk about that at OTS.
Iv'e read Thrasymaque's ideas and I think they are good and in line with OWS.
Yes, I believe we must stand together against the current system.
You said "there are certain points you agree on" with repubs.
Which ones?
Getting corruption out of politics and Wall Street. The republicans that came to protest with us were there for those reasons.
I don't believe you. If you can be friends with a liar like thrasy you are capable of lying. In fact it is likely you ARE lying!
I've probably been to more Occupy events than you, and I can tell you repub only viciously attack us.
I suppose you're gonna say you never see Dems either right?
OWS does not care about political affiliation. We don't talk about politics at OWS protests. That's not what the protests are for. We attack the system from the outside. All of us, the 99%, together. Most of the people I meet at OWS won't vote as they don't want to legitimize the system. But, we don't care, anyone can vote as they please. OWS was not created for election campaigning.
I see people from all parties at OWS. We are all against corruption. We try to focus on what unites the 99%, not what divides it.
Then focus on those people who agree with you on the despicable Thrasy! I will not pretend he has not personally attacked me just because he has hidden his true self from you.
Good luck in all your good efforts.
NO! I will provide nothing. Make your own judgement as I have. If you choose to befriend that horrible offensive person you cannot expect the people he attacks to respect you or your suggestions.
You should seek out the people who support the despicable Thrasy and focus on them. You do not have a sympathetic ear with me.
And I hope you are mistaken that Odin has befriended that despicable Thrasy because I thought better of Odin.
I guess you never can tell.
Good luck in all your good efforts!
We all have different opinions. Thrasymaque's opinions seem very sound to me.
I would say that you accusing him of posting homophobic and racist comments without wanting to show proof is despicable. To each is own.
I have not seen him accusing you or others here of such despicable acts. He always provides arguments, not hominem. That I find respectable.
Never mind - you have your agenda. Just try not to bother those supporters on this site that disagree with your point of view.
[-] 1 points by marthafromOTS (34) 1 minute ago
I read those links. They match everything I have said above. Perhaps you should read them again. But, also, remember, this is the unofficial site of OWS. My experience is on the ground at OWS and OTS. There is no partisan politics there. The site rules here state the same, but the moderation does not seem to be good. ↥twinkle ↧stinkle permalink
My only agenda is to push for OWS ideas. I do that at OTS. I protest for OWS.
If someone is bothered by my ideas here, then he or she most likely does not support OWS.
Yeah but if you can befriend the despicable homophobic, racist thrasy then you probably don't really have very good observational skills. Or you support that kind of divisive behavior in which case you would be very comfortable with republicans, whose leaders also push homophobic, racist, anti immigrant, anti womens rights divisiveness as well!
Oh and all the many OWS protests & meetings I've been to are made up of dem leaning VOTERS!. It's only the core anarchists founders who are against working within the system & prefer creating the new system from the gound up, horizontally, with real direct democracy.
I support that effort as long as no one starts telling me what I can or cannot speak, or tries to presuad me not to exercize my right to vote.
Are you an anarchist working on the new system?
I haven't seen homophobia or racism coming from Thrasymaque. Perhaps you can provide links to substantiate your hateful attack? What I see are good ideas. Plain and simple.
When you say you will fight divisive partisan politics - what do you mean? Will you go after individuals who are talking about taking political action? What do you mean?
As this site does not restrict actions of supporters/contributors on the forum from discussing political actions - this forum recognizes working within and without the system. This forum ( admin owner ) does not forward political parties or individuals. But this forum has forwarded political protest. That in itself is working within the system.
[-] 1 points by marthafromOTS (36) 0 minutes ago
What will I do? Push OWS ideas. Protest. Fight divisive partisan politics. Encourage fighting the system from the outside together as the 99%. Etc... All the stuff OWS has been doing since day one. ↥twinkle ↧stinkle permalink
I read the forum rules and they are against partisan politics.
Protesting against a particular party is not playing inside the system. OWS does not play from inside the system, OWS is based on anarchy. It's about fighting the system from the outside. You should come to a protest one day to get the feel for it. You're welcome any time.
Then what will you do?
[-] 1 points by marthafromOTS (36) 5 minutes ago
My only agenda is to push for OWS ideas. I do that at OTS. I protest for OWS.
If someone is bothered by my ideas here, then he or she most likely does not support OWS. ↥twinkle ↧stinkle permalink
What will I do? Push OWS ideas. Protest. Fight divisive partisan politics. Encourage fighting the system from the outside together as the 99%. Etc... All the stuff OWS has been doing since day one.
Click on the - about button - top right. Make sure to click on the high lighted links in the page as well.
I read those links. They match everything I have said above. Perhaps you should read them again. But, also, remember, this is the unofficial site of OWS. My experience is on the ground at OWS and OTS. There is no partisan politics there. The site rules here state the same, but the moderation does not seem to be good.
You must not agree with the position of this forum then. I mean have you read the positions of the forum? They are not exclusionary as to tactics like you and trashy and Odin seem to be.
What position are you referring to? Link?