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Forum Post: Will Alaskans Repeal The Oil Tax Giveaway?

Posted 2 months ago on Aug. 20, 2014, 3:41 a.m. EST by eklutna (101)
This content is user submitted and not an official statement

For the past couple of months that I have been in Alaska, there has been a lively debate going on, and there have been oodles of signs alongside the roads that help spark that debate here.."Vote - NO" or "Vote - YES". The voting took place today and Alaskans are anxiously awaiting the results. About an hour ago the Yes vote was leading by 50.3%, but it's still early.

A No vote means that you do NOT want the reduction in taxes given to oil companies turned over. A Yes vote means that you want that law that was recently passed, repealed and have them pay the same amount of taxes as before.

The oil companies and their cohorts have spent millions to keep this law in place that would save them millions every year. The opposition has been a spirited grass-roots campaign of which I am happy to say that a friend in Fairbanks has played a big role in. But they have been out-spent from approximately $15 million to several hundred thousand dollars. Just from my observation the Vote - No signs have far out-numbered the Vote - Yes signs.

http://www.reuters.com/article/2014/08/20/oil-alaska-tax-idUSL2N0QQ09820140820

A little tidbit - Governor Parnell who helped usher this nefarious law in was a lobbyist for Patton Boggs, one of the most powerful law/lobbying firms in Washington with offices in several locations (including Anchorage) throughout the country. That stinks to me.

175 Comments

175 Comments


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[-] 3 points by elf3 (2720) 2 months ago

Thanks for this story...I really like the stories coming in from around the country reporting effects of corporate influence on people from all over ...it helps put together a larger picture ...I think a separate forum posting just these stories would help sort the cause into discussion vs experience...pure observation and retelling taking out the politics...news the big media outlets won't tell and each post a headline...could be very telling because the stories can be researched and fact checked if someone is of the mind to do it.

[-] 1 points by MattHolck0 (1728) 1 month ago

in black ballot box, we trust

[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (26439) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 month ago

Why do you care? You don't believe in voting. Right? Why aren't you railing at them ( Alaskan's ) for not just taking to the streets in protests?

[-] 0 points by 99nproud (2697) 1 month ago

Please "vote early & often.!"

;\

[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (26439) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 month ago

Please vote intelligently - be informed - use tools such as the listing of legislators that are members and supporters of such groups like ALEC - and vote em out of office and oppose their attempts to get into office in the 1st place.

[Deleted]

[-] 2 points by MattHolck0 (1728) 1 month ago

lol

[-] -1 points by 99nproud (2697) 1 month ago

Of course, only joking. The ALEC list is great, I like the various climate denier lists, & others.

All must, & will make their voting decisions responsibly.

Did the 'All Father' (Odin) say he actually voted in Alaska?

That would be momentous, although as you point out he is not attacking an election, & even encouraging participation.

Oh how the mighty have fallen.

(but was it passed?)

[-] 0 points by DKAtoday (26439) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 month ago

The comment wasn't aimed at you - the vote intelligently - was aimed at everyone who reads the comment - there are tools - to be - informed and intelligent voters - and that is what the people need to be - informed and intelligent in their actions. This is also how protests can also be intelligent - to pressure those in office who are making the decisions at this very point in time. But nothing changes ( for the better ) without the INVOLVEMENT of the people. ( that last was also not aimed at you - but at Goatin and those like him ).

I don't know what has happened with that vote. ( search it on the web ? )

[-] 1 points by eklutna (101) 1 month ago

This is not a movement to vote in more Democrats. You should get yourself a styrofoam DNC hat and go hang out with your neocon friends there. They betrayed us, remember?! BTW, when's the last time you left Coon Rapids?...lol

[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (26439) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 month ago

ALEC membership a good list to remove from as well as keep from office.

YES ???

[-] -1 points by turbocharger (1418) 1 month ago

Yes.

[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (26439) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 month ago

Conflicted much?

[-] -3 points by turbocharger (1418) 1 month ago

I dont support government giving favors to business, so why would I support ALEC?

[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (26439) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 month ago

The Hell You say.

Really why would you?

It does seem that you are though as you put down attempts to remove such operators from office.

Ya know - your poo pooing suggestions for positive action for the people to take in exercising their access to direct democracy ( what little of it there is ).

[+] -4 points by turbocharger (1418) 1 month ago

Go ahead, remove em. I certainly don't vote for any of em, so whats the freakin problem now?

[-] -1 points by DKAtoday (26439) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 month ago

GFYS naysayer.

[-] -3 points by 99nproud (2697) 1 month ago

Does every comment you make have to include a partisan attack?

This movement is not an excuse to engage in the distraction of meaningless partisan bashing.

Issues matter.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/07/09/fossil-fuel-subsidies_n_5572346.html

http://insideclimatenews.org/carbon-copy/20140801/imfs-blunt-message-nations-raise-fossil-fuel-taxes-fight-climate-change

http://truth-out.org/opinion/item/25825-a-carbon-tax-is-absolutely-essential

These are current news items regarding the topic YOU posted!

Get off your lazy partisan ass and get in the fight.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/07/09/fossil-fuel-subsidies_n_5572346.html

[-] -1 points by eklutna (101) 1 month ago

The biggest partisan on here calling me a "partisan.' You're funny VQ. I guess a good offense (no matter how twisted) is better than a good defense, eh VQ?

[-] 2 points by DKAtoday (26439) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 month ago

Though you have not declared yourself ( yet ) - your defense of ALEC membership - really makes one wonder about your motives - to say the least.

[-] 0 points by turbocharger (1418) 1 month ago

Its most likely not a defense but more a matter of people trying to get the attention off of the low lying fruit and further onto the root problem.

Take for example my pointing out that the corporate board of ALEC- the corporations who hire the people to write the bills and then give to the politicians- is filled with corps who donate more heavily to Dems than to Reps.

I mention this, and then right on que one of four posters- all of whom are either on here or somewhere on the internet literally all day- accuse me of being an ALEC supporter.

This literally makes no sense at all. I can denounce em, tell em to rot in hell, etc, but if I mention something deeper than simply "Arghhh lets kick em all out!!!" then its all eyes on me.

This ultimately leads people to then wonder why this little band- who like I said is on the internet every day, most of the day- is doing what they do.

Toss in the fact that people whom others dont like, if they dont comment on their comments its then an admitting of endorsement... thats the type of stuff that attack ads are made of.

[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (26439) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 month ago

is on the internet every day, most of the day

You mean like yourself? and Goatin? He is here quite a bit like that - oh - and thrashingmasks? Because he is also here quite often for most of a day for most of a week or longer - Like flip? yeah he is also here quite a bit or Engineer? He is here - has been here for almost three years now - doesn't say much though - except for recently and only to add to your flame wars. Sorry your friends flame wars - as you do involve yourself from time to time you generally are not the instigator that your friends are.

[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (26439) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 month ago

Post the corporations and campaign to boycott em - meantime put together a non-partisan list of every member of government that is acting against the best interests of the people - show their actions for the corp(se)oRATions and against the people separate em out into the 50 states that they are supposed to be representing ( like the ALEC list is ) - and get the word out that these individuals must go for the reasons that you have just shown.

Don't whine at me because the ALEC list is composed of the members it is - that is their membership. Do something yourself to further remove other poisonous individuals from office.

[-] -1 points by turbocharger (1418) 1 month ago

Omg, ok let me repeat again:

Its not that nothing can be done, its that the things that people think need to be done- like focusing on who to get out, just mindlessly ranting and raving for years on end- instead of worrying about, um, who the fuck is replacing this freak... thats a failed strategy, right?

Go ahead, make your list. It will take you about a day to figure it all out.

Congrats, you now have another 700+ days to jump into the deep end where things get really frustrating.

Let me know when you are ready, I'll toss you some floaties lol!

[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (26439) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 month ago

I am not your god though like you Goatin is also confused in this manner.

The list is already made to remove from office - ALEC Membership - you want to spur the public to find replacements? It would help if you educated em on the vermin and their Operational HQ ( ALEC ) and then knowing that these individuals need to be replaced and/or kept from office - then - they the public ( and it is not left to just you or I ) will know to start looking in the 1st place.

[+] -4 points by oneeyedjack (-125) from Queens, NY 1 month ago

Get off this forum you Obama lover.

OWS is for making revolution, it's not about kissing up to president.

[-] -1 points by DKAtoday (26439) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 month ago

GFYS thrashingmasks

[-] -1 points by flip (7042) 1 month ago

right on!

[-] -2 points by turbocharger (1418) 1 month ago

Create a list of those who ARE acting, it will be dramatically shorter.

Then after that, cross of the people who are too timid to really make any real noise.

Wow, the slate is blank..

Time for a total revamp.

Now how do we create this call for candidates?

[-] 2 points by DKAtoday (26439) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 month ago

Like always - get involved in your state - I don't live in Florida so I would not be your best resource to find good people there - you have got to have options there other than Dem or Rep - look into em - then educate the public on what you find. It would help if you supported Move To Amend to get money out of politics - then - the money you raise for campaign efforts would be worth more.

But stop crying to me that you can't do anything to make a difference - if you really feel that way - please then - just go away as you are no use to anyone.

[-] -1 points by turbocharger (1418) 1 month ago

Ever try opening up bank accounts for affiliated CECs or PECs? Lots of fun. If you want to help, let me know.

[-] 0 points by turbocharger (1418) 1 month ago

Even the simplest tasks are a pain in the ass when you are trying to balance work, balance family, and then toss in the other volunteers involved.

Each one has their own idea of what needs to be done, who is going to do what. Then you get to create a board, wow is that fun. All of a sudden everyone has an issue with everyone. By the time you have plowed through it all, inevitably a few people have had life situations come up, or simply decided its not for them due to the nonsense or some personal attack. Better make sure there are equal number of men and females, so where are we going to find someone of whatev gender who wants to get wrapped up in this? Etc etc etc. Frighteningly similar to trying to get anything done in occupy.

[-] -1 points by turbocharger (1418) 1 month ago

Listen dickhead, Ive done more work with groups and 3rd parties then you can shake a stick at- currently working on stuff as we speak- so fuck off with your "crying" and "whining" attacks.

No one is saying they cant do anything to make a difference, thats just you- another internet moron- making up shit again.

[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (26439) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 month ago

[ edit ] Bravo - looks like you and your stinkle team members are back to the old tag team routine.

edit-> These long silences between bouts? Is it because you are in meeting strategize-ing on your next tactic and who should deliver it ( or start it off )?

[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (26439) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 month ago

No dickhead it's not me making stuff up - it is me repeating what you keep saying - you keep saying that nothing can be done - you keep poo pooing positive actions that people can take part in - you and your friend Goatin and thrashingmasks.

[-] 1 points by flip (7042) 1 month ago

ok, off topic but what is with the points here?? seems no rhyme or reason to this stuff

[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (26439) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 month ago

You are asking the right individual - as he is part of thrashingmasks twinkle/stinkle team. You are inquiring of elkunta - right?

[-] -1 points by flip (7042) 1 month ago

Correct I am speaking to my old friend. And I know better but thanks anyway

[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (26439) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 month ago

Your an old friend of his and you say that you know better than to be talking to him? What kind of friend are you?

[-] -1 points by flip (7042) 1 month ago

You're not really that stupid are you?

[-] 3 points by DKAtoday (26439) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 month ago

[-] 0 points by flip (6878) 3 minutes ago

and what does alec have to do with your stupidity and my apology

↥twinkle ↧stinkle permalink

It has pretty much everything to do with why we even bumped heads - as this ( ALEC ) is the bone of contention that has fired this round of the flame wars. Initiated by Odin - this time around - because of the ALEC issue. That's all.

[-] 1 points by flip (7042) 1 month ago

i stand by my statement

[-] 0 points by DKAtoday (26439) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 month ago

[-] -3 points by flip (6878) 10 hours ago

i am really sorry - i thought it was obvious what i meant. and maybe it was to most but not you - maybe? so let me spell it out for you even though it seems like you have figured it out. i know better (and so do most here) than to believe your bullshit line here -"as he is part of thrashingmasks twinkle/stinkle team." i would agree that i can be very stupid - like now - trying to have a proper conversation with a dnc shill. i have only one question - are you an opportunistic creep like the clintons? by that i mean do you know you are shilling for a bunch of shits and like a lawyer with the facts against you just trying to confuse. or are you stupid like obama seems to be - believing the .01%ers that he has surrounded himself with - should i name a few for you or can you do that yourself

↥twinkle ↧stinkle permalink

As I asked your friend (?) Are you telling me that ALEC is a benign entity? ALEC and It's Membership? It's not my fault as to the make up of their Board of Directors or of their Membership or of their contributors nor of their actions. It is what it is.

[-] -1 points by flip (7042) 1 month ago

and what does alec have to do with your stupidity and my apology

[-] 0 points by DKAtoday (26439) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 month ago

You made the comment - seems if anyone is stupid - it would be you - for being so incomplete and unclear in your comment.

[-] 1 points by flip (7042) 1 month ago

i am really sorry - i thought it was obvious what i meant. and maybe it was to most but not you - maybe? so let me spell it out for you even though it seems like you have figured it out. i know better (and so do most here) than to believe your bullshit line here -"as he is part of thrashingmasks twinkle/stinkle team." i would agree that i can be very stupid - like now - trying to have a proper conversation with a dnc shill. i have only one question - are you an opportunistic creep like the clintons? by that i mean do you know you are shilling for a bunch of shits and like a lawyer with the facts against you just trying to confuse. or are you stupid like obama seems to be - believing the .01%ers that he has surrounded himself with - should i name a few for you or can you do that yourself

[+] -4 points by oneeyedjack (-125) from Queens, NY 1 month ago

You come here to fight against everyone. Typical Twinkle Team shill behaviour. Trying to make the forum and OWS look bad.

[-] 0 points by 99nproud (2697) 1 month ago

Join our divestment action

http://gofossilfree.org/

Perhaps after your political partisan policing you can take sometime to join with fellow like minded activists (whatever their politics) against fossil fuel corp planetary exploitation/destruction.

You think?

[-] -1 points by 99nproud (2697) 1 month ago

My response was also directed at any passersby, as I knew you didn't think I was serious.

I searched, I think they are waiting for absentee ballots. not sure.

[-] 5 points by trashyharry (2750) from Waterville, NY 1 month ago

Hey 99- I checked out the comments on zerohedge-they are saying that if the CFR is proposing sending out choppers to drop money on the American People,it must mean those trade agreements-TPP and the other one they are keeping on the downlow-TIPI or whatever,are about ready to rock and roll.It isn't a good sign of somebody trying to figure out a way to help-more like the crack of Doom.LOLLOLLOL! I'm such a sucker!

[-] 0 points by 99nproud (2697) 1 month ago

I wouldn't say you're a sucker but it is definitely funny. But money from helicopters? In Alaska? Maybe you mean hunting wolves from helicopters..

Stop TPP, end fossil fuel tax breaks!

[-] 5 points by trashyharry (2750) from Waterville, NY 1 month ago

These trade agreements are going to make plenty of work for gravediggers in the good ol' USA,home of that world class loser Can't Do attitude.The only solution is world Revolution.Vincit Qui Patitur.

[-] 2 points by MattHolck0 (1728) 1 month ago

can't afford is the excuse for government inaction

[-] 5 points by trashyharry (2750) from Waterville, NY 1 month ago

Can't do.Can't afford.Can't help-this,that or the other is impractical,unworkable,not possible,not possible until "the economy gets better," can't happen until workers go back for retraining again,can't happen until corporate taxes are slashed,can't happen until next week,next month,next year,etc.,so forth and so on.All hefty loads of Steaming Bullshit.

[-] 1 points by MattHolck0 (1728) 1 month ago

gotta deal with the real world now

[-] 1 points by MattHolck0 (1728) 1 month ago

I'm so retrained I'm retro

[-] 2 points by trashyharry (2750) from Waterville, NY 1 month ago

I have been retrained 5 times.You can stick a fork in me-I'm done.

[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (26439) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 month ago

NAH learning is a process that never ends - well until one dies anyway.

[-] 3 points by trashyharry (2750) from Waterville, NY 1 month ago

I have fallen back on my original job.I am an artist,and I hang in my studio.I don't like to come out.I don't do very much art anymore.There is no way to sell paintings,and the last big sale I had saved my ass,but nothing has been sold for 5 years.You have to stop if you can't store it.So now I just do small pictures which I hang up on random telephone poles.Angels and devils and devils and angels.They are beautiful paintings.It usually does not take long for someone to climb up the pole and take them down to take home for themselves.They work hard enough for little enough.I like the idea they can obtain something nice that they like for free if they are willing to put out the effort to climb up the pole and get it.Then they got something they wanted without being pestered by somebody to pay,pay,pay.I am an Unknown Artist.It is a satisfactory outcome for me.I am sure.

[-] 0 points by DKAtoday (26439) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 month ago

All hefty loads of Steaming Bullshit.

[ EDIT x 2 ] Prime example of the falsity ( um - sorry - GR8 - sorry Hefty steaming loads of BS ).

Oil Industry cries poverty = decades ago - as to why they can't improve their operations to be clean ( or at least cleaner ).

Response = government subsidizes them - to improve their operations - to defray cost of improving processes and cleaning up their activities.

Effect? Oil industry says thank you very much and stuffs new found ( extorted ? ) wealth into their own pockets and NOT into improving the processes.

Equals - DECADES of NET LOSS for the Public and the Environment.

EDIT -> OH lest we forget - all the while they ( fossil fuel ) makes obscene profits - Also ( nearly forgot ) by having government remove caps to the cost/price charged to the consumer.

2) With the removal of the caps on the price charged to the customer - began a huge FAST upward spiral in the cost of gasoline as well as heating oil as well as the cost for every consumer good that was made by the use of fossil fuel energy and/or transported by fossil fueled transportation - this of course also includes the production of food on the farm as well as down the line processing as well as end cost at the store..

[-] 5 points by trashyharry (2750) from Waterville, NY 1 month ago

The Birth of the Blues was a good thing.The Birth of The Bullshit-not so much.During the 80's and 90's I was buried alive in the Blues.Great music,interesting people,lots of parties and I made fantastic money.Being Buried Alive in Bullshit is not fun or profitable in any way and The Stench is hard to put up with.As well you know-we are all engulfed.Nobody really signed up for this.We gotta dig out.It's gonna be an an Aegean Style operation for sure,but w/o Hercules.The People United Can Never Be Defeated.We could use some experienced Cat Herders,though.

[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (26439) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 month ago

Cat Herders

lol - isn't that really giving cats an especially bad name? - could threaten their survival as a specie - well more so than currently with the fossil fuel assholes running amok - and really - isn't that enough of a threat to ALL life?

[-] 4 points by trashyharry (2750) from Waterville, NY 1 month ago

Cat Herders might have a transferable skill in dealing with getting swift,crafty,inscrutable,unpredictable creatures who all harbor hidden agendas to come together in one bunch that can then join forces.It is what the locals around here call a Job of Work.

[-] 0 points by DKAtoday (26439) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 month ago

They must have LOVED those cats.

Absolutely - the ones I have had were gr8 mousers - good for society as well as farmers in general = keep down plague carriers too.

[-] 3 points by trashyharry (2750) from Waterville, NY 1 month ago

LOL! Cats-there's an upside and a downside.I wish I could have cats here,but cats and birds don't mix well.

[-] 0 points by DKAtoday (26439) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 month ago
[-] 4 points by trashyharry (2750) from Waterville, NY 1 month ago

I love cats.I have a theory that Humans would never have survived the early developmental period of agriculture w/o them.Just imagine how the Ancient people must have felt when the armies of rodents that were destroying their stored grain were attacked and routed by armies of Cats.We do know they created a Cat God called Bas Tet.They must have LOVED those cats.

[-] -1 points by DKAtoday (26439) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 month ago

[-] 1 points by trashyharry (1374) from Waterville, NY 3 minutes ago

LOL! Cats-there's an upside and a downside.I wish I could have cats here,but cats and birds don't mix well. ↥twinkle ↧stinkle permalink

I taught I taw a pudytat.

Yeah unfortunate but true - they play hell with bird populations.

[-] 3 points by trashyharry (2750) from Waterville, NY 1 month ago

We had quite a few chicks disappear a couple years ago-6 I think.Cats suspected.If we have alot of them we keep them in cages now.Lots of feral cats around here-but you rarely see them.

[-] 0 points by DKAtoday (26439) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 month ago

The only solution is world Revolution.Vincit Qui Patitur.

The Arab spring as well as the birth of Occupy was a start. Now lets hope it continues - as bloodless as possible - as healthily ( for all ) as possible.

[-] 2 points by trashyharry (2750) from Waterville, NY 1 month ago

Minutes to midnight...time to organize!

[-] 0 points by DKAtoday (26439) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 month ago

Minutes to midnight...time to organize!

And long past time - though it does seem to be happening more and more and better and better ( recent Koch favorites losses ) - almost three years now - seems like such a long time - and yet the time also seems to have just flown by.

[-] 2 points by trashyharry (2750) from Waterville, NY 1 month ago

To the choppers! Go! Now! Scrunch down to avoid the blades and run zigzag-we got incoming!

[-] 2 points by DKAtoday (26439) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 month ago

[-] 1 points by trashyharry (1353) from Waterville, NY 3 minutes ago

I have been waking up almost every day since the Iraq Adventure kicked off.thinking I just had the most perverse,vivid and frightening dream EVER.You could never make any of this shit up-or dream it up either.So many things have happened that just CANNOT happen,ever since that Debacle of a war.What a Buzzkill.

↥twinkle ↧stinkle permalink

[ EDIT ] The horrors of what is happening to our world all around us MUST be dealt with by each individual - if there is not time enough in the day - then dealing with the horrors will intrude into our sleep. For me it started back when I was in junior high ( middle school to some ) during our ( USA's ) involvement in the Vietnam Police Action ( sorry - scuse - WAR ) - and has only gotten worse ever since.

EDIT -> correction - it started in Grade School with the Vietnam war and gr8ly intensified in middle school.

[-] 4 points by trashyharry (2750) from Waterville, NY 1 month ago

Between '65 through '69,The Vietnam War was fought in the lush green backyards and overgrown abandoned farms of Suburbia,by children.I was one of those children.In our version of the Vietnam War,the Americans won.An exciting feature of the Child Vietnam War was that the females were allowed to play-as Charlie.Even though Charlie always had to lose,it was an empowering experience thinking of one's self as sneaky,tricky,resourceful,treacherous,diabolical and deadly.Some genius in my elementary school thought it would be a good idea to show us kids graphic footage of the aftermath of the Destruction of the European Jews in the Camps when we were only in 5th grade.I had a bad feeling I never could shake after that.Mother of all Buzzkills.to say the least

[-] 0 points by DKAtoday (26439) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 month ago

Apparently our silent down voter does not agree with me that everyone must process what they see and otherwise experience during their waking hours or if left incomplete ( processing information of the day ) that it will be dealt with by the subconscious during sleep.

[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (26439) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 month ago

faster Faster FASTER - the flood waters are raging in..................

[-] 5 points by trashyharry (2750) from Waterville, NY 1 month ago

I have been waking up almost every day since the Iraq Adventure kicked off.thinking I just had the most perverse,vivid and frightening dream EVER.You could never make any of this shit up-or dream it up either.So many things have happened that just CANNOT happen,ever since that Debacle of a war.What a Buzzkill.

[-] -1 points by 99nproud (2697) 1 month ago

Peaceful revolution please

[-] 4 points by trashyharry (2750) from Waterville, NY 1 month ago

Oh-I agree totally.I was referring to the inevitable deaths of civilians that are already happening and must get worse when it becomes even more difficult for ordinary people to provide for themselves.I am only one person,and I am not well connected,but I know of four people who have died since the economic crash in '08,and without a doubt because of it.Sorry I gave the impression that I might think our problems could conceivably be addressed by civilians murdering each other.I don't think that at all.I am against anything that promotes pain or misery.I know some of that is part of any scenario that is real world,but I firmly believe that another world is possible,and good outcomes cannot be obtained by violent methods.Deliberately promoting bloodshed is something I would never do and in any case it is illogical.

[-] -1 points by 99nproud (2697) 1 month ago

I'm with you. And MANY have died as a result of poverty during this crash, previous ones, & the endemic poverty that permeates our economic model.

Disgusting, requires massive action.

Years of hard work, on the streets, airwaves, & voting booth.

Peace

[-] 3 points by trashyharry (2750) from Waterville, NY 1 month ago

It's absolute torture to see what is happening to the civilians-esp The Poors-and not be able to offer immediate help.They are all in terrible shape.The Working Poors-how do they keep going? The small business owners-how do they exist as they do? Any of them that has not flopped out is walking the Razor's Edge,knowing they must be sliced to pieces if they put a foot wrong.It is so different sitting around making dire predictions from seeing it all happen as bad or worse than anyone thought.One good thing is #OWS-which appeared 4 years before my models predicted.

[-] -1 points by 99nproud (2697) 1 month ago

Depressing. I know. Gotta keep fighting.

Can't submit

[-] 2 points by trashyharry (2750) from Waterville, NY 1 month ago

As they say in Gaza-Hope dies last.Vincit Qui Patitur.

[-] -3 points by 99nproud (2697) 1 month ago

We excel @ killing hope.

It's built into our economic model.

[-] 4 points by trashyharry (2750) from Waterville, NY 1 month ago

That might be the plan-break the spirit of the American People.But will it be hard or easy to do? Will it all go down as planned-or is there maybe a variable in play that can't be controlled? I think we gonna find out soon.Here and in Europe.Now it seems to me that it was thought that Europe was Tamed.How's that working out now? Again,we be finding out soon.

[-] -3 points by 99nproud (2697) 1 month ago

Agreed, I think in fact 'the system' has not accounted for the variables it faces today.

[-] 3 points by trashyharry (2750) from Waterville, NY 1 month ago

LOL! The only ones who can't see Nemesis are the ones she will soon destroy! Blinded by Hubris,they think they can control everything!LOL!

[-] -2 points by 99nproud (2697) 1 month ago

I think I saw that movie

[-] 1 points by trashyharry (2750) from Waterville, NY 1 month ago

Sometimes being Invisible can be an advantage.Easy to be invisible when confronted with people who see only what they want to see.

[-] -3 points by 99nproud (2697) 1 month ago

Agreed, most are distracted by any number of 'bread & circuses', but be assured some are watching us & are scared shit.

We gotta stay focused, & persistent.

[-] 5 points by trashyharry (2750) from Waterville, NY 1 month ago

Everyone is scared.The economy has not recovered in any way that could be noticed on the Street.What can be noticed is empty storefronts,empty houses,people moving away,businesses going belly up and extreme.bizarre weather events that wipe the civilians out at random.And completely out of touch Elites who can't be as clueless as they make themselves out to be.

[-] -1 points by DKAtoday (26439) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 month ago

[ edit ] Well - you and I - both know damned well - that - if the peoples voice/vote is heard - then the oil companies will not get to keep reduced taxes.

edit -> We both also know that whoever forwarded and supported and pushed through the reduced oil company taxes in the 1st place - should be on the immediate list to be removed from office ASAP.

[-] 2 points by 99nproud (2697) 1 month ago

We do indeed.

Maybe Alaska is being punished for their oil whorishness by being cursed with Palin?

Instant Karma!

[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (26439) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 month ago

[ edit ] But but ..... but ( sigh )...... she is a reality show star queen! Who else should voters be interested in? aaaaaahaaahahahaha - sorry - obviously voters should have been interested in practically anyone ELSE heeeeheeeheee

edit -> oops - I almost said porn star . . . . aaaaaahaaahahahaha - sorry

[-] 0 points by 99nproud (2697) 1 month ago

I'm sure there is some pseudo PalinPorn out there, personally I like the Palin 'speaking in tongues' video.

THAT is priceless,

[-] -2 points by eklutna (101) 1 month ago

I have no problem with people voting. I will continue to vote myself, and rest assured I will not be voting for any neocons, no matter what party that they are in. It is when you and shoozy as moderators let partisan posters run rough-shod over this forum in their attempt to co-opt Occupy into the Democratic fold is where I have always had a problem with you two. The focus of Occupy should never be about voting for politicians in either of the parties....'cause then we will undoubtedly loose.

I did not have a lot of time to stir things up in Alaska, but I had great conversations with both people on the left and the right, including several at the Alaska State Fair (which BP & ConocoPhillips seem to sponsor...;-(...) with campaigners for Governor Parnell R and Senator Mark Begich D, some nutty religious zionists, an old-timer who came up there under Roosevelt's New Deal (which I mentioned earlier), and a very brief one with Governor Parnell himself while he was marching in a parade. My last conversation was with the airlines ticket agent, who was also a union rep. That was one of the best convos...

[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (26439) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 month ago
[-] 2 points by MattHolck0 (1728) 1 month ago

any word of peace ?

[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (26439) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 month ago

any word of peace ?

If Bernie wins? Don't count on it - he can't do it all by himself - pure poison removed from office would be a help though = remove members of ALEC from office and prevent others of them from gaining office.

[-] 2 points by MattHolck0 (1728) 1 month ago

win or loss calling for peace in congress would be a victory

[-] 2 points by DKAtoday (26439) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 month ago

Win or Lose - campaigning on real issues and slapping down the failure of congress and the department of justice would be very good for the public to hear loud and clear and on prime time.

[-] 1 points by eklutna (101) 1 month ago

Think about the rest of my post DK., and the implication that I tried to put across, and that is; This forum under both your and shooz's tutelage is becoming inconsequential. If a book is written about Occupy years from now, and a chapter is devoted to this forum, how will it read? We still have time to redeem ourselves for the benefit of our struggle. It's up to you DK.

[-] 2 points by DKAtoday (26439) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 month ago

Bernie won't be able to make a difference by himself - so you ready to campaign/protest out of office the ALEC membership?

[-] 1 points by eklutna (101) 1 month ago

Never mind about my request DK. So tell me after we work on the ALEC membership, what about all the neocons in both parties who support WARS, GMO's, corrupt money in politics... the big banks.... corporate welfare...the prison industrial complex (including militarized police), etc, etc.

You belong on a DNC forum DK where you could continue to waste your time with the status quo because you obviously believe revolutionary change will come about when we keep doing what we have been doing...voting..peppered with a little protest and sprinkled with some petition drives. That's all.

Systemic change has always happened from the bottom up! That's more than a mantra DK, that's fact.

[-] -2 points by DKAtoday (26439) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 month ago

Systemic change has always happened from the bottom up!

And yet here you are trying to stifle positive action from the bottom on up.

You and YOUR partisan hang-ups.

[-] 0 points by eklutna (101) 1 month ago

That's right I forgot, you & your cohorts have redefined the word 'partisan'. It now means anyone who believes both parties stink....laughing.. You aren't the same dudes who redefined 'patriotism' to mean compliance....well are you?...lol

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[-] -2 points by DKAtoday (26439) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 month ago

Tell you what OLD GOAT - why don't you put a solid list of pure poison together like the ALEC pure poison list - being a list for use in the 50 states and post it for use as a tool to remove poison from office - just try to show factual connection to actions those on the list have taken against the Public - like ALEC is notorious for being nothing but against the best interests of the public.

BTW - did you note that in posting the ALEC membership list for a removal from office tool - I did not post my thoughts on who should replace them. HUH - funny that I missed such an opportunity to be the partisan that you say I am.

BTW - you do realize that Bernie Sanders is an Independent? Yep an independent that has quite frequently lambasted all of the senate as well as congress. - for failing to act in the best interests of the people.

So who do you have in mind that would be good replacements for the ALEC membership if and when they get removed from office? Anyone?

As I recall - you never have ANYTHING to offer on what to do to make things better for all. You always just stop at saying we need to protest - you never get beyond that point - you have offered nothing.

[-] 2 points by eklutna (101) 1 month ago

You are out of touch with this revolution, and with reality as welll, but that is not surprising considering that you obviously have rarely gotten out of Coon Rapids.

[-] 1 points by MattHolck0 (1728) 1 month ago

I don't understand why der media keeps telling me about airport security checks

when the poor already can't fly

[-] -2 points by DKAtoday (26439) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 month ago

That's all you got? Never Mind responding to that - I know you have nothing - you never have had anything - you present nothing for people to move forward and you do your best to put down others who do have actions that the public can take.

Don't bother trying to tell me how useless I am or how useless anyone else is - as - it is very apparent that you do not believe that - or you would not bother with trying to mess with me.

[-] 1 points by eklutna (101) 1 month ago

WOW DK, you have grown amazingly popular over-night....me..not so much. I guess when your points and goal of co-opting Occupy are all that you have in life...anything goes, eh DK?!?

"Don't bother trying to mess with me further."...laughing You continue to shill for the Democrats on an Occupy forum...whether blatantly or insidiously, and I will continue to respond to your comments at my discretion. You can count on it.

One more time DK.. You have made a mockery of this forum when as moderator giving carte blanche support to your DNC, neocon accomplices on here, and now giving them your full support. You and your ilk are not what Occupy is about.

BTW, have you tried cashing in some of your points for a sandwich at the local Coon Rapids Diner, or better yet see if you can cash them in for some integrity.

[-] -1 points by DKAtoday (26439) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 month ago

Rant on crazy OLD GOAT rant on

[-] 1 points by eklutna (101) 1 month ago

Addendum to that last comment; In the almost three years I have been going to NYC, I know of no one like you or your neocon accomplices on here. I guess it's a bit more difficult to snow people when you have to face them eye to eye.

[-] 0 points by MattHolck0 (1728) 1 month ago

I guess it's a bit more difficult to snow people when you have to face them eye to eye.

that's why bradley manning is imprisoned and called a freak

and snowdown is glorified

[-] -1 points by DKAtoday (26439) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 month ago

Addendum to that last comment; This last comment that you would likely be a perpetual mass of deep bruising - is indeed aided by your assertion that it is easy to snow people when not face to face - if so then you must be in serious danger every time you set foot in public - because you snow very few here. Yeah you came in glad-handing everyone saying how they were all so terrific and then once you figured that you had established yourself - you started tearing into those same people.

You are a failure. Don't bother trying to mess with me further.

[-] -1 points by DKAtoday (26439) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 month ago

That can't be true - or - likely you would be a regular walking (?) perpetual mass of deep bruising.

[-] 0 points by eklutna (101) 1 month ago

It's true, believe me, you & your fellow neocon buddies are non-existent in the Occupy I know. I suppose in knowing that and in my expressing it is why you have felt it necessary to have banned me, and so many other good Occupiers, and why you have let your accomplices run roughshod over this forum with impunity.

Your goal of co-opting Occupy will never succeed. You will have to be satisfied in being near to making this forum of no consequence.

Your legacy in this revolution is secured DK. Good Night.

[-] 2 points by flip (7042) 1 month ago

right on man - i like the face to face comment. very true - these guys can only get away with this bullshit over the internet. in the park they would slink away like the weasels they are. i just posted this - thought you might like it - "Mr. Nesbitt and the President are basketball addicts. They play as much as they can and talk basketball incessantly. They, of course share this addiction with Arne Duncan, Secretary of Education and Craig Robinson, former Oregon State coach and Michelle Obama’s brother. Mr. Nesbitt sponsors and participates in three on three basketball tournaments all over the country.

During his first campaign, the President narrowed his friendship group, forcing long time friends Bill Ayers and Rashid Khalidi out of their social circles in response to attacks from the right concerning Mr. Ayers’s political past and from AIPAC on Professor Khalidi’s advocacy for Palestine and criticism of American Middle East Policy.

In Chicago, Mr. Nesbitt was the President of the Chicago Housing Authority in the late 90s where he worked with Rahm Emanuel and other power brokers to create public-private partnerships that created housing on Chicago’s south and west sides to replace the drug and crime ridden behemoth projects, the Robert Taylor Homes (see Gang Leader for a Day) and Cabrini Green..................................................So the connection between real estate developers who speculate on land and building investment and the push for charter schools is very strong. Chicago real estate moguls lead by Bruce Rauner, the Republican nominee for Illinois governor, and the Crown family drive much of the Chicago push to close public schools to expand the charter sector. Indeed, the Commercial Club of Chicago, known as “the billionaires club” on the streets of Chicago, drives the Education policy of the mayor and funds, through connections with the Joyce Foundation (the Director of the Joyce Foundation sits on board of the Commercial Club) funds education “research” (non peer-reviewed) that is printed on the editorial pages of the Chicago Tribune to legitimate public school closings.

This pattern of connection between real estate developers, the creation of and public-private partnerships to build low density mixed income housing in impoverished neighborhoods, and the drive to close public schools and open charter schools has been chronicled in powerful detail by Education theorist and sociologist Pauline Lipman. I have addressed these issues in more detail in an Education Week piece, “Why Obama’s Education Policies will not Change and why ‘Change is Hard.'”

Mr. Nesbitt and Mayor Emanuel are the leading political actors who have orchestrated and executed public policy for the interests of the Commercial Club. Their chief supporters need the value of the land that they bought in gentrifying neighborhoods to increase. They see charter schools as a key magnet to attract middle class professionals back into neighborhoods within a three to four mile radius of downtown on the south and west sides.

......................................."The take away from this piece is that many of the people who provided the funds to transform Mr. Obama into a viable national candidate after he passed the litmus test of Iowa are associated with the Commercial Club of Chicago were heavily invested in real estate speculation and building charter schools as a way to increase the value of property purchased by investors. All of this is couched in the language of making Chicago a global city and creating school choice for parents.

At the national level, Democrats for Education Reform stepped into the discussion over schools in exchange for raising money for Democratic campaigns that was needed to counteract the impact of the Citizens United decision.

The reason why those closest to the President are strong supporters of RTTT and charters is because they are connected to south and west side real estate investment in Chicago and bad press for public schools in the form of low test scores will create the pretext and legitimation for more investment and funding of charter schools that will lead to rising condo sales, condo values, and land values. Once values rise and more middle class professionals move into these areas, commercial shopping and retail investment will do its work to increase the value of real estate.

That the President’s best buddy, should attempt to capitalize on on charter school investment after playing a role in the shaping of the President’s education policy, is either the hallmark of a “free enterprise system” or more grease to the wheels of yet another episode of crony capitalism excreted by the proximity to power of buddies helping each other out.

I taught Mr. Nesbitt’s two oldest children and I have communicated my disappointments about the Obama administrations education policies to him.

I told Mr. Nesbitt several times that the Democratic party would pay a price for creating education policies that did not serve the interests of the majority of parents, students, teachers, and administrators.

He told me that “teachers do not deserve the amount of money that they make,” “that their salaries should be reduced,” and that they deserve no respect for sacrificing other career paths to answer the calling of teaching.

He seemed more concerned about reducing teacher’s salaries to create a profit margin for investors than about the impact the disruptive policies of school closings would have on human communities.

[-] 0 points by eklutna (101) 1 month ago

Replying here. You're right these DNC'ers would not have lasted in Zuccotti, or in the Occupy affinity groups either where you have to look at people in the eye. I remember how difficult it was to leave the park to go home...knowing that there were so many kindred spirits there, and knowing where I was going, there were few. Did you feel the same?

As we move ahead with our struggle, we will need to identify those who want to hold us back by taking the traditional route which is subversive. Systemic change will not happen by begging for help to one of the parties who has been instrumental in causing this unprecedented dilemma we are in. They will just jerk us around like they have been for oh so long.

[-] 1 points by flip (7042) 1 month ago

i was never in a hurry to leave the park that is for sure. we are both old enough to have witnessed the dems fighting to keep the status quo at every turn. in many ways the dems are worse - if bush were still in office there would be a world wide outcry about drones - but since we have a noble peace prize winner all the libs (like 99, vq, and factless - don't you really dislike liberals?) try to keep a lid on things. i am sure it will be a democratic president who cuts social security - not a republican

[-] 0 points by DKAtoday (26439) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 month ago

In the meantime you sit on your thumb and spin - getting nowhere.

[-] -1 points by eklutna (101) 1 month ago

"Keep slapping them down." Thanks for your support, but undoubtedly it will cost you as these guys have a little army of monikers to vote down posters who are recalcitrant to their co-opting goal.These dudes are here for one reason and that is to make Occupy part of the Democrat party. As a consolation they will be happy though with just ruining this forum...

[-] 2 points by flip (7042) 1 month ago

you always have my support - well almost always. the obama shills are annoying here. i would love to recreate zuccotti park and invite them down. they would find out what occupy is really about. i miss the park! bullshit got called right away whenever i was there. great atmosphere! fun open and interesting debates. i would advise putting up the info, countering their arguments and ignoring the shills. i think we play into their hands by engaging. i will let you know when i follow my own advice.

[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (26439) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 month ago
[-] -2 points by oneeyedjack (-125) from Queens, NY 1 month ago

I guess when you live in Coon Rapids, that is considered a revolutionary idea. What do you think?

He's not only limited to Coon Rapids. He doesn't even leave his therapeutic bed.

Hey, he's sick. He needs money. So he's a forum shill for the Democrat party. A man needs to make money, and he has very limited potential in terms of mobility and intellect. I feel bad for him in a way.

[-] -1 points by eklutna (101) 1 month ago

From my POV, it's "crony capitalism." That was a very insightful comment flip. Thanks.

[-] 0 points by flip (7042) 1 month ago

Keep slapping them down. They really should not be here.

[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (26439) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 month ago

[-] 0 points by eklutna (84) 0 minutes ago

Anyone who is not a fellow neocon Democrat and has been on this forum, for any length of time in the past 3 years, knows how true your statement is.

I've said it before, but I'll say it again, your recalcitrance to the bullshit they have been slinging on here is very admirable.

↥twinkle ↧stinkle permalink

neocon? Really? You are calling me a conservative? LOL - too funny for words.

[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (26439) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 month ago

[-] 1 points by eklutna (83) 1 minute ago

Replying here. YOU want me, a person who has attended many Occupy events in NYC at considerable expense to prove myself to YOU a partisan, neocon, co-opting Democrat who hasn't been out of Coon Rapids in ages. ...laughing uncontrollably. What a funny little man you are DK.

I stand by every comment that I ever made on here. Can you say the same thing DK? Of course that would have to include your neocon-like support of Israel's murderous campaign, and your spineless change of opinions which seem to be based on which way the political winds are blowing on here. Your point total means everything to you, doesn't it DK?

↥twinkle ↧stinkle permalink

Why Elktuna you story telling Old Goat You. I never supported nuttersyahoo and the criminal attacks on the population of Gaza by the IDF. Show me where I ever did that - you lying Old Goat.

My point total seems to mean much to YOU yuh Old Goat - as it is you bringing it up - Right?

I banned you and I banned others ( un-partisan like or equally if you can warp your brain (?) around the concept ) - you and those like you from either the right or the left that went on campaigns of attack on other users here - most notably thrashingmasks ( your friend ) - whom I had banned in the neighborhood of a thousand times in my short time as a moderator for his non-stop attacks on users of this site as well as for his attacks on the site itself ( bots and such ).

Your goal of making this site useless as a place to forward pro-active actions that the people can take ( like eliminating ALEC members from office ) will ultimately fail. The more you do such - the more clear your animus becomes - like your intense animus now as I continue pushing for the members of ALEC to be removed from government and as others agree that this would be a good thing to do. To stifle this activity all you can think of to do is try to point your finger at me and others and call us all Dem shills.

So sorry OLD Goat but as time goes bye you become more transparent as to being against actions that can move this country to health.

Just remember Old Goat - that just because you will try to eat anything ( like a goat ) - including tin cans and toxic sludge and tax breaks for the wealthy and subsidies for fossil fuel and and and and........ Others do not have your insane appetite - and will try to do something positive rather than sit and do nothing.

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[-] 0 points by turbocharger (1418) 1 month ago

Again, this isn't about me or one person. Its about what happens when certain people start playing favorites and tilt the playing field, of which you were guilty.

I mean, you can at least admin it at this point, right? A little self reflection and humility goes a long way towards leadership.

[-] 0 points by DKAtoday (26439) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 month ago

No I can't admin it as I am not an administrator.

[-] 0 points by turbocharger (1418) 1 month ago

"you and those like you from either the right or the left that went on campaigns of attack on other users here"

All while ignoring the ones whom political views you agreed with, allowing them free reign.

That is the epitome of corruption. That is the epitome of cronyism.

And that is why occupy pushes for decentralized power.

[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (26439) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 month ago

Sorry rock head - i disagree with your perspective almost always - and yet here you are - do you think it might be ( you still being here ) is because you do not routinely go on attacks of users that you don't agree with or because you think that I do agree with you though evidence would say that that is not possible.

[-] -2 points by eklutna (101) 1 month ago

Anyone who is not a fellow neocon Democrat and has been on this forum, for any length of time in the past 3 years, knows how true your statement is.

I've said it before, but I'll say it again, your recalcitrance to the bullshit they have been slinging on here is very admirable.

[-] -1 points by eklutna (101) 1 month ago

Are you saying that you and shooz did not have what was in effect a two-tiered banning system in place and that you banned your fellow partisan Democrats with the same frequency, and under the same criteria as you banned people whose views were a lot closer to Occupy's DK ? !

Is that what you are saying DK??

Gee DK, I have never heard so much vile stuff that was said on here continuously from partisan posters like GirlFriday, Zendog and WSmith, but not surprisingly, none of these people were ever banned. Why DK? Because they were your buddies and you were complicit with them in trying to co-opt this forum. That's 'why'!!

We can all understand debates that get ugly from time to time..... the tit-for-tat exchanges that escalate in a bad way, but many of your cohorts' comments were initiated in vile ways and were purposely meant to intimidate other posters....and they had your support DK!

I can't think of one partisan Democrat poster that was banned.. Can you?

I'm not religious, but I have always tried to keep Sunday special. Anyway, I remember one Sunday morning having coffee and turning on my LT where I saw GF had at least 4 comments up that all began with, "Mornin' Dicknose." Was she banned for that? - No! Would I have been banned for doing the same? - In a heart-beat I would have been gone, and you know it DK. And that example was not near the most noxious.

You are a MAJOR hypocrite, and to put it euphemistically - you are extremely careless with the truth DK.

[-] -1 points by DKAtoday (26439) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 month ago

Here ya go - a sterling issue to get behind and support and protest for and and and.................. yeah yeah yeah - I know I know - go apeshit over the source of the message - but it is what it is - if there were an independent source for posting this message - believe me ( or not ) that I would have posted it instead ( maybe if one shows up later I can do that - post it - as well - a show of non-partisan ship ). But like I said earlier - It IS What IT IS - don't like the source find and post the message from a source you do like. OK ????

Anyway:

The American people are poised to make history.

If we act now, generations to come will remember the historic September 8, 2014, U.S. Senate vote on S.J. Res. 19, a constitutional amendment to overturn Citizens United. They will remember the coast-to-coast cheers that erupted from a nation desperate for a solid gain in the fight to rid U.S. politics of the corrosive influence of big money.

For months, I've been working side by side with MoveOn's team to make sure that more Americans understand the sprawling impact of Citizens United, as well as their absolutely critical role in pushing for the very first Senate resolution dedicated to its demise.

We're in a sprint to the finish line. Our work is paying off. Together with our allies, we have secured 50 senators who are on the record as supporting S.J. Res. 19. But there's still much more to do before and after the vote on September 8. And, quite frankly, we need $200,000 to get it all done.

Please join me in supporting MoveOn's work to overturn Citizens United by chipping in $3.

When folks ask me why defeating Citizens United is essential, here's how I frame what's at stake: In case after case, the Roberts majority of the Supreme Court has basically told a handful of billionaires, "You and your corporations already own and control our economy. Now, we're going to give you the opportunity to purchase the U.S. government, as well."

Among these billionaires are Charles and David Koch, who—thanks to Citizens United—are now busy unabashedly buying Tea Party-esque politicians in key states such as North Carolina, Kentucky, Michigan, and Colorado. Koch candidates are hell-bent on twisting our nation to match the interests of the elite and ultraconservative.

Let's put the Koch brothers on notice that our democracy is not—and will never be—for sale.

Will you support MoveOn's work to help secure the first big milestone in our long-haul fight to overturn Citizens United?

Here's MoveOn's plan between now and September 8: With your support, MoveOn members will generate a blizzard of phone calls to cement existing Senate supporters of S.J. Res. 19. But that's just the beginning. Using creative media and social-media tactics and hard-hitting on-the-ground events, they'll also go after every senator conspicuously absent from the co-sponsor list, especially key Republicans.

It will be impossible to hide from MoveOn members. Each senator's vote on S.J. Res. 19 will answer the question: Which side of history do you want to be on—that of your constituents or that of big money?

Please help MoveOn ask this critical question of every single senator and candidate by donating now.

Senators who have the nerve to vote against overturning Citizens United will be held accountable by MoveOn members through the midterm elections and beyond.

Think of S.J. Res. 19 as the American people's first giant springboard. The fact that it's coming to the Senate floor for a vote is already a big victory. Our job now is to secure as many votes as possible and—in a critical election year—not let the American people forget the senators who voted for the interests of big money instead of their constituents.

Will you join me in supporting MoveOn's work before and after the groundbreaking September 8 vote? Click here to donate $3.

I can't help but reflect on past constitutional amendment victories that changed our nation—like the ones propelled by people just like us to give women the right to vote or advance civil rights. We have big lessons to learn from each of these breathtaking victories and others like them.

The journey to a successful amendment passage—two-thirds majorities in both houses of Congress—was long and arduous. Millions and millions of Americans joined together in common cause. Every single person was necessary. And because of the grit and faith of our courageous predecessors, our nation emerged from these struggles a little wiser and a whole lot more just.

And so it will be when we rid our nation of Citizens United and take back our democracy. Let's take a bold step forward on September 8, and let's not look back until we win.

Thanks for all you do.

–Senator Bernie Sanders


Again this is NOT about supporting Move On - but IS about supporting ->

September 8, 2014, U.S. Senate vote on S.J. Res. 19, a constitutional amendment to overturn Citizens United.

Think you can get behind spreading the word about the vote and the need for positive action from our current representatives? You know rally support in the streets as you are always on about.

I added the bold-ING to help you see the message and so perhaps get past the source.

Nope I am not looking to drum up contributions to Move On .

Nope just trying to put this important upcoming vote out in front of the public - ALL of the public.

[-] -1 points by DKAtoday (26439) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 month ago

Hey elkunta -

Are you saying that you and shooz did not have what was in effect a two-tiered banning system in place and that you banned your fellow partisan Democrats with the same frequency, and under the same criteria as you banned people whose views were a lot closer to Occupy's DK ? !

Is that what you are saying DK??

That is what you are saying.

Gee DK, I have never heard so much vile stuff that was said on here continuously from partisan posters like GirlFriday, Zendog and WSmith, but not surprisingly, none of these people were ever banned.

Your query would best be directed to jart. It IS her site after all - perhaps she will go into her reasoning for banning you - again.

I can't think of one partisan Democrat poster that was banned.. Can you?

Short memory OLD GOAT? How about jiffy squid for one?

You are a MAJOR hypocrite, and to put it euphemistically - you are extremely careless with the truth DK.

That would be you = major hypocrite and wild exaggerator as well as fiction writer.

[-] -1 points by oneeyedjack (-125) from Queens, NY 1 month ago

DKAtoday is a system lover. He is a conservative who wants to conserve the old ways. He loves the republic and capitalism. His lacking vision and limited creativity stops him from imagining other types of systems. He thinks the actors are the problem, not the system.

[-] -1 points by turbocharger (1418) 1 month ago

I just said, teh replacement is the key, if electoral politics is the goal. Attack ads only get you more crap to fill in the vacancy.

Finding the good, aggressive leaders is the hard part. All of the focus is always on who to remove, never on who to replace them with.

Damn right its maddening. Try being out there trying to find those people to run, set up fundraisers and organize people who are not getting paid at all, organize them with deadlines, details and benchmarks, for a duration longer than a couple months outside of the media frenzied election season.

Just because someone like me is frustrated doesnt mean I throw in the towel. I even try to, but like Godfather III "they pull me back in" lol.

Bottom line: in electoral politics, if the main focus is to simply get XYZ out, then 99% of the time ABC that replaces them fuckin suck too, because there was 0 effort in that area.

The system is set up like this for a reason.

[-] 2 points by DKAtoday (26439) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 month ago

Well there ya go - while you are looking for good people to represent the people - at this very point in time - you have an easy job laid out in a handy dandy list of people to remove from office - ya know the ones passing stand your ground legislation the one pushing for more tax breaks for the wealthy the etc etc etc etc etc etc - THEY are a known commodity = pure poison - pure organized law making poison. So breath a sigh of relief that this is one clearly identified thing that you can do - even if you don't know who to replace em with.

[-] -1 points by turbocharger (1418) 1 month ago

Who are you planning on replacing them with?

Most "vote out" strategies by the right and left kind of end with replacing that said person with Democrats and Republicans. A shuffling of the deck chairs if you will.

Meanwhile, the ship is still sailing in the same direction, with the same captains the same crew and still have control of the PA system to tell the passengers whats coming next.

Just remember: If Bernie is allowed the position, its because he's either an ineffective leader or he's complicit. This system straight up kills effective people, the great organizers.

This is where people's frustration comes into play with those who think that replacing some politicians is going to change anything. Replacement strategy is what matters, hiring the same types of people, or putting new people into the same broken system, gets us no where.

Even the ones who believe voting is the ultimate freedom and answer cannot bring themselves to create anything outside of the 100+ yrs old corrupted to the core D and R corporations.

Its maddening to the rest of us.

[-] 1 points by MattHolck0 (1728) 1 month ago

I don't understand why no one has spoken against our current wars in Washington

The subject is not represented at all

[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (26439) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 month ago

Yep your mad alright. So you don't believe in removing demonstrated pure poison from office and you don't believe in trying to find good people to represent the people to replace them. So tell me - why are you not out in some remote area of the swamps/everglades waiting for things to end one way or another?

[-] -1 points by turbocharger (1418) 1 month ago

Ok well that got about as far as I thought it would.

In the meantime, Try to lighten up on Odin, some people are not what you think they are.

[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (26439) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 month ago

I left the OLD GOAT alone - he came after me when I and others started talking about using the list of ALEC membership as a good tool for removing pure poison from office - so perhaps you should be admonishing the OLD GOAT - Hey?

[-] -2 points by oneeyedjack (-125) from Queens, NY 1 month ago

Stop up voting yourself with your VQ bots you dirty old man.

[-] 2 points by eklutna (101) 1 month ago

"He [DK] thinks actors are the problem." Good point. Presently he seems to want us to replace all the politicians who support ALEC with ones that just support all the other egregious crap they want to push down our throats. It sounds like he just wants us to keep doing the same thing that we have been doing to me. I guess when you live in Coon Rapids, that is considered a revolutionary idea. What do you think?

Anyway, you're right he does definitely "lack... vision and [has] limited creativity." I guess being somewhat older and living in and rarely leaving Coon Rapids has taken its toll on the ol' bugger.

I'm still waiting for him to answer my last reply to him, the one that started with;

'Are you saying that you and shooz did not have what was in effect a two-tiered banning system in place and that you banned your fellow partisan Democrats with the same frequency and under the same criteria as you banned people who had views who were a lot closer to Occupy's... [hence non-partisan]? !'

I think it may be too unpleasant for him to face the hard truths in it that post.

[-] -2 points by DKAtoday (26439) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 month ago

[ edit ] WTF are you talking about? Are you a member of thrashingmasks stinkle team?

edit-> If you think something funny is going on with voting - point it out to admin - but then they will likely find your messing around - Hey?

[-] -2 points by eklutna (101) 1 month ago

"I left the OLD GOAT alone. - he came after me." ...lol

Earth calling DK in Coon Rapids. You're on a forum - remember?? You post bullshit on continuing what we have been doing for the past umpteen years without success, and i will reply at my discretion - remember.

I do think that it would do you a world of good to take some time off DK. Do they have special rates on vacation packages for DNC members?

[-] 2 points by DKAtoday (26439) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 month ago

umpteen years?

Not even three years yet Goatin. Exaggerate much? Yes - Yes you do. Does that have anything to do with your thinking of yourself as a Norse god?

[+] -4 points by oneeyedjack (-125) from Queens, NY 1 month ago

Don't waste your time with Twinkle Team dork trolls. You are too smart for that.

[-] 0 points by DKAtoday (26439) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 month ago

Here ya go Elktuna - in all of your ranting - I thought that you may have overlooked an opportunity offered for you to be pro-active - so here have a little helpful reminder:

  • why don't you put a solid list of pure poison together like the ALEC pure poison list - being a list for use in the 50 states and post it for use as a tool to remove poison from office - just try to show factual connection to actions those on the list have taken against the Public - like ALEC is notorious for being nothing but against the best interests of the public.

You need not even sully your hands with campaigning to have the public vote them out of office.

Please feel free to keep with your protest in the streets ( only ) program. Wouldn't want you out of your comfort zone.


Knock yourself out - go forth and be fruitful ( though - really - I prefer that you "just" knock yourself out )

[-] 0 points by DKAtoday (26439) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 month ago

Goat got your tongue Elktuna? Or are you so quiet as to this offering to be proactive because you are busily researching and compiling away?

[-] 1 points by MattHolck0 (1728) 1 month ago

DK has not made any comments supporting Israel's study on shotting down rockets and lobbing artillery

[-] 0 points by eklutna (101) 1 month ago

Replying here. YOU want me, a person who has attended many Occupy events in NYC at considerable expense to prove myself to YOU a partisan, neocon, co-opting Democrat who hasn't been out of Coon Rapids in ages. ...laughing uncontrollably. What a funny little man you are DK.

I stand by every comment that I ever made on here. Can you say the same thing DK? Of course that would have to include your neocon-like support of Israel's murderous campaign, and your spineless change of opinions which seem to be based on which way the political winds are blowing on here. Your point total means everything to you, doesn't it DK?

[-] 0 points by DKAtoday (26439) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 month ago

GFYS ooops sorry I meant G-night rock-head.

[-] -2 points by eklutna (101) 1 month ago

"In the meantime you sit on your thumb and spin - getting nowhere."

Your contribution to this struggle is not only measured by the good that you have done, but also by the damage that you have done. You have excelled in the latter mostly because of the despotic way that you have ran this forum; hence the way that you have driven off so many good people, and the way that you still deceitfully continue to support partisan Democrats on here.

Now you are trying to hinge everything on whether a politician is in ALEC or not....which provides a insidious veil for your partisan propagating How stupid is that DK. Like I asked before, how many politicians are not ALEC supporters, but are TPP supporters, big bank supporters, corporate supporters, prison industrial complex supporters, etc, etc. You are either daft or manipulative. I'll give you credit for not being stupid...so far.

[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (26439) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 month ago

You telling me that ALEC is a benign entity? ALEC and It's Membership? It's not my fault as to the make up of their Board of Directors or of their Membership or of their contributors. It is what it is.

Your striking out against those who would remove them from office - as I have said before - IS curious.

[-] -3 points by oneeyedjack (-125) from Queens, NY 1 month ago

In the meantime you sit on your thumb and spin - getting nowhere.

Is that what you do in your therapeutic bed all day long? You stick your thumbs up your anus. And I thought it was a cactus that was lodged up there.

[-] -1 points by DKAtoday (26439) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 month ago

thrashingmasks - how many more socks you got?

[-] 1 points by MattHolck0 (1728) 1 month ago

I hate acronyms

how about protest aggression ?

[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (26439) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 month ago

Always a good thing to do.

[-] 1 points by eklutna (101) 2 months ago

At this point, it looks like the oil tax giveaway will not be defeated (52-48% the last I heard). So that means that the big oil companies will continue to pay lower taxes and that their will probably be more cuts in governement spending, or higher taxes for the people.

[-] 0 points by eklutna (101) 1 month ago

I guess you didn't read the last paragraph of my post VQ. Nice try though in your effort to conflate anyone who is not a partisan, neocon Democrat like yourself with being a Republican.

[-] 2 points by 99nproud (2697) 1 month ago

I just wanna know if your post supports oil company tax subsidies, as well as whether it has passed.

Does every comment you make have to include a partisan Dem bash?

[-] 2 points by eklutna (101) 1 month ago

I do not support the oil tax give-away to that benefits the oil companies and is to the detriment of Alaskans, but like most people up here, I am not surprised at the outcome of the vote as many Alaskans can be fairly stupid, not unlike the rest of the country tho... Unfortunately the repeal of the give-away was turned down by a vote of 50-48%, the last I heard.

On a side note, an activist friend in Fairbanks (6-7 hours away from where I am) was very instrumental in trying to get the higher tax on the oil companies reinstated. And coincidentally that friend visited Zuccotti Park with me in October of 2011 several times when he was doing free-lance reporting for a small AK newspaper.

[-] 0 points by 99nproud (2697) 1 month ago

How very special for you. Love havin you here in the big apple but wouldn't mind if you focused on the on going oil whorishness up there.

Peace

[-] -2 points by eklutna (101) 1 month ago

I have no patience for your bullshit that is aimed to put me on the defensive. That especially being the case coming from one of the biggest partisan hacks who has ever been on this forum. It is good to see that you & your fellow $elf-$erving, neocon Democrats view Occupy as such a threat though.

[-] 1 points by 99nproud (2697) 1 month ago

I love Occupy. It has revitalized numerous progressive groups & millions of progressive people.

What is to feel threatened about?

Direct democracy? I support it!

3rd party talk? banning parties? Anarchy? Duopoly ranting?

Have at it! Who cares?

I remain at the ready to attempt to moderate the flame wars, and direct the discussion to useful, activism.

Solidarity, ......All Father! LMFAO!!!!

[-] 0 points by eklutna (101) 1 month ago

"I love Occupy." What you really mean VQ is you would love to co-opt Occupy into the Democratic party, isn't it?

[-] 1 points by 99nproud (2697) 1 month ago

Not even remotely. YOU are the only one mentioning the 'parties' or any co-option. That would be a waste of time.

You are beginning to exhibit the harassment that has gotten you banned many times.

Get a grip, Please stay focused on the important issues that affect the 99%.

Leave the Dem supporters alone, we need them.

Peace

[-] 1 points by eklutna (101) 1 month ago

We do indeed need the Dem supporters to come to our side, but we do not need their shills to redefine what occupy is about, or to have their way in swallowing up Occupy.

[-] 0 points by 99nproud (2697) 1 month ago

After your anti dem harassment, consider this topic related effort:

http://gofossilfree.org/

Put aside your unfounded partisan attacks. Jon Occupy & all the progressives fighting against fossil fuel exploitation/destruction of our planet.

I know you can do it. You have all my confidence.

Solidarity, All father