Forum Post: Why I Despise the Democratic Party
Posted 12 years ago on June 16, 2012, 7:51 a.m. EST by PeterKropotkin
(1050)
from Oakland, CA
This content is user submitted and not an official statement
I think that the professional middle class is who the democrats try to win in elections along with blacks and other minorities but I do not beleive that is who they are trying to serve. They certainly aren't trying to serve minorities and people of lower economic status. I know that many profesional middle class types identify with democrats and certainly most blacks do beacause the democrats absorbed elements of the civil rights movement from the 60's
I don't associate the democrats with the left. democrats serve capitalist interests just like the republicans do. Often they just serve different corporate elites. Or they compete to serve corporate interests. How can you serve corporate elites and working people at the same time? It can't be done those two interests are diametrically opposed. So asking the democrats to more ferociously fight the republicans to me makes little sense especially when they often serve the same intrests.
If obama was a white republican how many of the democratic supporters on here would be outraged that he boosted troop levels to Afghnistan right after he won a nobel peace prize?(which to me sullys the name of that award) They would call him a war monger and a killer for the drone attacks and they would feel so bad for the poor innocent children of Pakistan that are killed in those strikes. During bush's term there were gigantic protests here on the west coast to get us out of the war led by democratic front groups like moveon and others.What did those front groups do after the 2007 elections when the democrats took both houses? They packed up and went home like the war was over. Today 50,000 troops remain in Iraq.
If this hypothetical republican's healthcare reform bill flooded corporate pockets with tax payer cash they would be outraged. If he made Arne Duncan a man who's major accomplisment in life was to privatize and dismantle the Chicago public school system as much as possible secretary of education they would howl. obama( I refuse to capitalize his name) does all these things and not a peep out of them.
Any significant change to the U.S. will only come through popular struggle. Just like all other change in this country. People died and went to prison to get the 8hr work day. People died and went to prison to get rid of segregation. People died and went to prison to unionize their work places. The elite will never give you anything. You have to take it. Which is why labor lost Wisconsin. Its already posted in the artcle "Learning from Wisconsin" but I for the most part agree with the analysis of the author. The democrats and the union bosses instructed the workers to leave the capital house there in Wisconsin and try to run the democrats against the republicans in a recall. They should have stayed there until walker sent in the goon squads to take them out. They should have stayed and fought and turned it into a popular struggle. Thats the lesson of Wisconsin. As Emma Goldman said If voting could change anything they would make it illegal.
In my mind the democrats are just as much of a problem as the republicans. In fact I think they are worse because they are smarter. They speak in the language of populism but they really serve the interests of the corporate elite. It keeps the people that identify with them from realizing that they are not really working for them. Which makes them more effective in their domination of the working class and poor.
So, I'm hearing this more and more from the forum, and getting feedback from the likes of Jart and shadz66. What is the suggestion?
Exposing the problem provides no solutions.
Voting for either party is pointless.
What is needed is another party that won't cowtow to the dems or reps.
Can we swing that in the time left? Is there a candidate already in the minors that can handle the influx of all the support coming their way?
'Exposing the problem provides no solutions.'
Thats a bit shallow. There are plenty of solutions if you read the comments. Exposing the problem is the biggest step, bring the darkness to light... that still hasn't been done. Most of the country has fallen into a state of our current situation being the new norm. That is unacceptable.
Exposing the problems is the first step to the solution. No massive problem was ever solved over night. Look at civil rights for example. This is going to be a long struggle. But if people believe in the dream, we can make it a reality.
Most people are simply unaware of the truth. It's like in the movie They Live where Rowdy Roddy Piper had to get that guy to put on those sunglasses to see the truth. When everyone knows the truth, the solution will present itself. Most people are still stuck believing the lie that it's the republicans fault if you're a D or that it's the democrats fault if you're an R. When in reality it's both their faults. Financial Modernization Act passed by both parties. War in Iraq supported in Congress by both parties.
The 2 party system has completely hijacked the government and money in politics is causing massive levels of corruption.
I definitely support good D's like Dennis Kucinich and Bernie Sanders, but fake D's like Obama and murderous scum like Bush need to GTFO.
Expose the truth!
There is no chance of that in this election. We cannot rely on this system for any meaningful change. If we want change we have to do it ourselves. Through non violent resistance and civil disobedience.
Aye.... true that.
Then the push must be for a no-confidence vote in the current system. There's a provision for that in the constitution.
The United States Constitution has no provision for voters to express a no-confidence vote, except by voting for the opposing candidate(s). Even worse, the writers of the Constitution made no provision for popular recall of representatives or for national initiatives or referendums.
The idea was that the House of Representatives, subject to popular vote every two years, would represent the popular will. Of course that was formulated at a time, when most people probably knew their local representatives personally or knew of them through acquaintances.
I doubt if the framers of the American Constitution envisioned a day, when the ruling class could literally buy the entire system.
Yes I am beginning to lean to a no confidence vote, and I was an avid Obama supporter at one time. My conscience will not allow me to ever vote for him again.
Oh and I forgot to mention the complete privitization of the public school system they are big on that too. Both parties
Dems want to privatize the public schools? I don't think so. Certainly not in NYC.
No but they want to deregulate Wall Street and get into wars. Look into congressional voting records. Bipartisan support on a lot of bullshit.
Financial Modernization Act - helped create the financial crisis, D and R support
War in Iraq - Voted for by D's and R's in congress
Continued funding of the wars - voted for by D's and R's
Provisions for indefinite detention of American citizens - voted for by D's and R's
Patriot Act etc...
Even the republican JOBS act was passed with bipartisan support even though this bill didn't create a single job and took away regulations put in place after the ENRON fraud.
There's a big difference between a D like Bernie Sanders and a phony like Barack Obama.
Money in politics is the problem, not just republicans. In the 2008 primaries, why else do you think Democrats voted for a pro-war supporter of the patriot act like Obama instead of Dennis Kucinich, the man that actually tried to impeach Bush? -MONEY and TV
Why do you think republicans chose a clown like Romney over a guy like Gary Johnson who actually stands for their "principles" ? -MONEY and TV
We agree money in politics is the problem! 1% money that has rigged the system to pass right wing policies! The Dems are worse than Repubs because they (many, not Bernie) have betrayed their left wing principles. The repubs proudly trumpet their support for 1% right wing policies. OWS can provide the pressure to all pols (especially naturally, historically left wing dems) to push and pass left wing/progressive agenda that will help the 99%. Dems can be made to serve the 99%. Bernie hasn't given up! he votes with Dems! I trust him!
[Removed]
Good Call on GOP JOBS Act. I missed that one since I cut off the Cable TV. Small Businesses given tax breaks can include the worst of the worst Wealthy with few employees.
http://crooksandliars.com/jon-perr/eric-cantor-unveils-gop-con-jobs-act
As it turns out, that someone else might be Donald Trump, Oprah Winfrey or, say, the owner of the New York Giants. That's because, as we learned during the GOP's successful 2010 fight to prevent a return to the Clinton-era tax rate for those earning over $250,000 a year, the Republican definition of small business includes tens of thousands of doctors, dentists, lawyers, consultants, athletes - even author Barack Obama - who employ few or no workers. As after Bloomberg, the New York Times, the Washington Post, TPM, CBPP and MSNBC among other documented, that list of the top 2% of small business earners (just 400,000 out of 34.3 million filers) also includes multi-billion dollar firms, partnerships and "S-Corporations", such as Bechtel, Coors, and PriceWaterhouseCoopers.
I remember posting about the JOBS Act on here a while back before it passed and my post just got attacked by Neocons and Obama supporters and I was told it was really amazing... even though no one could tell me what jobs it would create because there is no part of the bill that creates a job. The title of the bill was just a scheme to pass by the public.
You know all the Dems that voted for it.... were knowingly abetting the GOP. Defining a Small Business is an on going tactic and problem in many federal programs (or at least in contract awards). Congress knows the issue very well - only a freshman would vote without knowing it was bogus.
That is true. Obama is just as much for this as Reps. They see profit there, and any way to make money is all these folks care about. Make a profit and turn our children into corporate drones to make more profit.
We are a long way from that. This country is owned lock stock and barrel by the corporate elite. They own the media which means they decide what gets reported and what opinions are acceptable to present to the public which in turn gives them the ability to manipulate public opinion. They own the courts the police and everything else.
What we are locked in is going to be a struggle at least in this country for probably the rest of my life and I am in my mid thirties. The right wing has much to gloat about. Aside from social issues they have gotten everything they have wanted from both parties for the last 35 years. Of course the country is in a wreck from it but they have accomplished most of their goals. Next will be the destruction of social security and medicare or finally ending any kind of welfare at all. Which in essence puts us at the level of a third world bannana republic.
I agree we must protest. Non violent civil disobedience. Even provoke (on film) violence by police against us. Arrests, even beatings, hopefully not deaths as you mentioned above.
All the movements you mentioned wouldn't have succeeded without that people powered pressure. Of course all the movements you mentioned ended with some legislated solution/partial solution. So we shouldn't deny that it is not a possible resolution to our current crises.
I agree that both parties are guilty. I agree that the dems are probably more to blame because they "speak the language of populism" then cave in and vote for the right wing that you correctly stated "have gotten everything they have wanted".
It is important to recognize as I think you do that right wing policies (passed by repubs and dems) are at the center of our problems. Dems may have moved right and have caved in to the right. But the repubs proudly trumpet and push the right wing agenda that benefits the 1%.
I agree that a 3rd party will not succeed this election. But unless there are real election/campaign law changes a 3rd party will never succeed.
I agree this Pres has gotten very little of a left wing/progressive agenda passed. I also know that the right wing hates him and has fought tooth and nail against any efforts he has attempted.
OWS is only 8 mos old. While we attempt ground up revolution we should be pressuring all pols to pass the left/progressive agenda that will benefit the 99%. We should not allow the right wing trumpeters to gain more power. We should pressure the dems to stand against the right wing policies.
As you pointed out previous movements have made the difference. This movement can make the difference and force the change we need. This Pres would have gotten more done if the people of the left hadn't been asleep. We are awake, we must use our influence to pressure all pols to help the 99% even while we work to build a new country from the ground up.
Good Call. We need phrases like United States of Bananas (USB). Or...Banana States of America (BSA). The USA (AKA United Banana Republic UBR). US Banana States (USBS).
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Banana_Wars
I just think we need Major Media support, but without that we can push for Banana Republic comparisions.
So when the Democrats raise minimum wage they are serving the corporate interest? I just don't see it that way. I suppose if you take the position that Citizen's United represents no "significant change" to our system then I guess you could raise that bar to a point where nothing short of Mad Maxx would suffice.
When they fail to reduce inflation, and throw a minimum wage bone once in a while, that is not helping the problem.
That is duping the idiot public into thinking you are doing something decent, when in fact you are avoiding the underlying problems that cause the unequality to begin with. Smart for votes, disgusting for those that want change.
"So when the Democrats raise minimum wage they are serving the corporate interest?"
Sigh.
Yes.
Corporations use technology for production. Robots and automation replace labor to a large extent in many corporations. It is small and medium sized businesses who cannot afford expensive automation and must rely on human labor for production. Besides, minimum wage laws really just raise the cost of living and outsource jobs.
We can't vote for Republicans because we know they will cut the budget: Budget cuts and Tax Cuts (it's the only Tune they can play). Maybe the Democrats won't cut as much ....
http://occupywallst.org/forum/list-of-legislation-for-civil-rights-labor-rights-/
All Social Programs are on the table for the Republicans.
The only real difference I see in the parties is the segments of the voting population they feed lip service to. Meanwhile, over the last 30 years, all the significant changes and victories in this country have exclusively benefited the wealthiest.
Nothing happens without the involvement of the people http://occupywallst.org/forum/political-organization-rather-than-political-party/. That's the key to getting anything done. If you can get the people involved, you can make a change.