Forum Post: Why Do Moderators Not Block Anti-Semitism Here?
Posted 13 years ago on Nov. 13, 2011, 11:10 p.m. EST by GypsyKing
(8708)
This content is user submitted and not an official statement
I am not Jewish, but I have seen MANY disgustingly anti-Semitic posts here, including direct references to Auschwitz! I cannot imagine comments using the "n" word for African Americans making it through moderation. That guy who reffered to Auschwitz made me so mad I really lost my cool for the first time on this forum. I demand that this tollerance for intollerance cease imediately! I simply cannot believe this kind of hatred and intimidation is allowed to go on here!!! Who the hell is actually in charge of this site anyway, and why isn't there more trasparency?!!!
it's a forum open to anyone. I am in Nebraska and have nothing to do with OWS. Just to point out a fact about the website.
But Occupy does not descriminate against religion. About 800 people celebrated Yom Kippur in OWS and didn't see any discrimination.
Thinking that 100% of OWS is discriminatory based on a few assholes is like assuming the entire Tea Party is full of biggots because of this video
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZXaILy3GE7U
I'm sorry, I am genuinely confused right now! Firstly, I don't think OWS is discriminatory. If you had had an opportunity to be on this site more often you would see that it is the movements opponents who post these things, and I was wondering why the moderators weren't blocking anti-semitic headlines because they give the impression that we are anti-semitic, something that would be very damaging to our credability. Secondly, your username is so similar to that of a moderator that just blocked one of my own posts, and a VERY important one, that I had a hard time for a moment figuring out just what the heck you were driving at here. Anyway, thanks for the comment. I hope that cleared up what was meant by my post.
I had one great uncle die on a bomber over Germany and my other fought the Germans and made it back. I'm right behind you in kicking out the nazi pricks
This is a very serious issue. As this is OUR site - even in the name of free speach - do we want actual Nazis here? Man that's really taking free speach to the limit! My concern, aside from my abhorence to their ideology, is how does this affect the critical issue of coalition building, of drawing people into our effort rather then leaving them with an impression that we're really out on some weird psychotic fringe. This site bares our movements name, damn it! To leave that impression with people is beyond counter-productive. It's idiotic!
There is an international consensus that hate speech needs to be prohibited by law, and that such prohibitions override or are irrelevant to guarantees of freedom of expression. The United States is perhaps unique among the developed world in that under law hate speech regulation is incompatible with free speech.
I have seen less of these guys,but there is a troll issues.
send a brief email to abuse@occupywallst.org with the name of the poster
it is disgusting!
I will do so, if it has not been deleted.
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I keep screaming at the worthless mods to do something about it and they never do.
Damn right, I have been confounded by the way this has been allowed to go on. Who the devil controls this site amyway? I want to know and ferret them out. I want to know exactly who they are, and what their agenda is!
Anybody can submit pull requests if they want to make modifications to the forum software. It's open source and transparent. The link to the repo is at the bottom right of this page. Look for the link named github.
Thanks, I'm techno-illiterate. If anyone competent to deal with this can deal with it, for the love of God, do so! My uncle died fighting the Nazis, and I will not see this movement, founded on the desire to renew human dignity, undermined by this contageous hatred! It makes me sick!
Are there not times when you wish to insult someone? I see lots of insults directed at different groups by OWS. Why should you control what others say. Free speech is a right. The control of it is not. It is also counterproductive to go around convincing people that they should be upset by words from people that are inconsequential. Be upset by bad acts, not bad words.
When will you people ever realize the difference between speach as a form of communication - as something noble, as even sacred - as a search for truths that might benefit mankind, even under the strain of strong disagreement, and that speach which is used simply to foster the basest animal impuses of mankind that lead only to fear, chaos and destruction.
I swear, I think you people revel in that emotional orgy of hatred like the minions of Satan, and then deprecate those of us fighting for moral order as being immoral and through some bizzare destortion of Christian scripture, as being Un-Christian. It's just lies, lies, and ugly self-serving lies, and we're sick of it and prepared to hold people legally accountable if it results in anything remotly resembling a hate crime!
I have not made any negative comments about Jews or any other groups on this forum - or any other, so I am a bit confused by your "you people" comment. Consider the total stupidity of allowing yourself to get upset by words on a screen. It is sheer lunacy to raise kids to get upset at negative bs directed at them. Political correctness prevents open discussion that might lead to better relations among people. Your kind of thinking actually empowers those that want to use speech to "foster the basest animal impuses of mankind that lead only to fear, chaos and destruction."
I agree with your thoughts on political correctness to the degree that it prevents open debate. But advocating gas chambers (which I do not acuse you of doing certainly, but which others have done here) is not encouraging open debate, it stirring incindiary hatred. Please bare in mind that I am being barraged right now by posts and cannot keep everyones specific posts in mind at all times. I am simply responding to what I see as a general trend.
Understood, but if I read posts advocating gas chambers, I would not be stirred toward hating Jews. I may hate the poster though...
I think ignoring totally useless crap posts is the best thing. btw, I appreciate your open discussion.
I grew up during the time when political correctness was being instituted in the US, and have observed that it is a total waste of time; nothing but a form of racism that is worse that the more overt forms.
Point well taken about "political Correctness". To the degree it promotes respect it is a good thing. To the point that it stifuls real communication between people, a bad thing. But there are some forms of speach that are not simply politically incorrect, they are incindiary, and prone to encourage violence. I would point to the climate created that may have influenced the shooting of Congresswoman Giffords as one example. Such things happen, and we have a responsibility to bare that in mind.
because we respect are African brothers. when I was young i used to fear my African brothers.
You have family in Africa?
no, i live in america. oops, i ment the USA
Why have the comments on this post been censored in a way that very much slants the meaning of what was said here, in favor of the moderator's extremely questionanable use of censorship? Just a week ago or so, almost every 10'th headline on this site contained blantant profanity, and far worse, divissive ethnic and/or racial invective. That was allowed to stand. Now they censor a rational debate on the subject, posted with the objective of healing this breach. Think People - is this website on our side?!!!!!
I told you they'd start voting down what they don't want people to see.
In my opinion you were absolutely right!
But if you go to the bottom you can click the plus sign next to subtopics and that opens them up.
If you go to Mongolia you can find a nomatic tribesman selling fermented yak's milk.
Thanks, they just blocked my post dirrectly addressing this issue.
Why has this exchange been censored?!!!!!
Nearly one hundred comments have been deleted from this post by the moderators, all of which point at least obliquely, to criticism of what is and is not censored from this site, and why? In my opinion the moderators are trying to use selective censorship to impose a false impression of this movement to the public, and to promote their own agenda separate from that of OWS. If you read this please forward it, as this comment will probably soon itself be censored. I will post, or comment on this forum no further, and advise others to do likewise!!!!!!
Just about half of the comments I made on this topic have now been censored, leaving, I think, the most unfavorable impression of my views here that the "moderators" could achieve. I'm through permanently with this site, and I just might sue whoever runs it for defamation. My advice: abandon this sit now altogether, there is a very real question as to where their allegences really lie. I am abandoning it as of now, and records of actual, unexcerpted exchanges, can be produced if anyone else is feels they have a basis to sue the operaters of this site in the future.
Hate Crime Legislation Will Target Your Freedom of Speech
By Tom DeWeese
A battle has been waging during the opening months of the 110th Congress over proposed Hate Crime legislation. The main bill currently before the House is H.R. 254, titled, "The David Ray Hate Crimes Prevention Act," introduced by Rep. Sheila Jackson-Lee (D-TX).
Opposition is growing to the legislation because hate crime laws would make certain types of speech a federal offense, allowing federal "thought police" to interfere in the law enforcement authority of states and local government. Such interference is blatantly unconstitutional.
HR. 254 would require every state to pass and enforce "anti-hate" laws, making it a federal crime to express bias against specifically federally protected groups. Some hate laws have been interpreted to mean documents like the Bible are hate literature and preaching from it is hate speech. Nowhere was this more clearly shown than in England under a similar law, where two men who called Islam "wicked" were indicted, and now face seven years in prison. The British law blatantly says "truth" cannot be used as a defense.
The main force supporting the bill is the Anti-Defamation League (ADL). This group was behind passage of the British law. The ADL is a radical organization, which routinely charges organizations more to its right, of hate speech. It appears that nearly any organization that does not accept the ADL's worldview is marked for advocating hate.
Freedoms of speech and hate crime legislation are not compatible. Many organizations who advocate hate crime legislation, such as the ADL, are pushing for control of the Internet to stop "hate speech." While most people would interpret hate speech as being on the lines of neo-Nazi white supremacy, in reality the ADL really means groups which advocate issues like free enterprise, property rights, gun rights, etc.
In 2005, the ADL targeted the Freedom 21 Conference as an advocate of hate speech. Prior to the conference in Reno, Nevada, the ADL sent out alerts about the gathering. Their premise that Freedom 21 was advocating hate was the group's advocacy of private property rights. The ADL believes ownership of private property is a social injustice that oppresses the poor.
Others are now advocating that skeptics of global warming theories be denied the right to speak out. Still others advocate making it a crime to use the term "illegal aliens." Reason and rationality are thrown out the window for political correctness under so-called hate speech.
To preserve freedom of speech in America H.R. 254 must be stopped. In fact, now that many are protesting the bill, supporters on Congress are trying a new tactic. While using H.R. 254 as a shield, House Judiciary Committee Chairman John Conyers is quietly gathering support for yet another hate crimes bill entitled, The Local Law Enforcement Hate Crimes Prevention Act of 2007. This bill is actually worse than HR. 254. Both must be stopped. Call your congressman and demand he/she stand for free speech and against any hate crime legislation.
March 8, 2007
© Tom DeWeese, 2007
American Policy Center 50-A South Third St., Suite 2 Warrenton, VA 20186 (540) 341-8911
A lot of people made huge money on antisemitism and antiantisemitism. I believe freedom of speech is superior to all the rest of rights and laws. Let people speak whatever they feel. And then we will se what the problems we have in the society. Absolutely the worst thing is to censor the freedom of expression. Under not any pretense it should be done. Freedom of speech is sacred and nothing, nothing should get on its way!
Freedom of stupidity must be banished as well, and freedom of putting people like you in schools to get an education to get a definition of freedom should be implemented. FYI, Freedom stops when harm is being made to your neighbor. In other words, because we are lucky enough to have a free country with freedom of expression, it doesn't mean that you are free to insult people on their race, ethnicity, or religion. Hate speeches are condemn by our courts of justice and thank God our ancestors fought for that. And for the record, our bill of rights doesn't include hate speeches and racism as part of people's freedom of speech. please review your references.
At late discussions in UN and other international organizations there is an international consensus that hate speech needs to be prohibited by law, and that such prohibitions override or are irrelevant to guarantees of freedom of expression. The United States is perhaps unique among the developed world in that under law hate speech regulation is incompatible with free speech.
Bill of Rights does not have words "racism" or "hate". Racial issues came out after WW2. Slavery during Civil War times. Founding fathers thought slavery is OK. And they knew that freedom of expression or freedom of speech can't hurt anybody. Actions can. Actions are not speech. And who is going to be a judge to make definitions what is smart and what is stupidity. That is why our fathers made laws against restricting freedom of speech. If our courts will not be prejudice toward any group, many of our presidents will be in jail for making wars. If american public will be not prejudice, there will be no hate toward muslims or their leaders also and then there will be no support of wars in Congress. Laws are not prescribing what to hate and what to love. That is for us to discuss. Without expression can't be a discussion. Without discussion can't be an agreement. Without agreement can't be a law. Without a law can't be a country. Making taboo for any expression you can lay a foundation for one group to be on the top of others. And there you will have smart 1% taking over the media and stupid and silent 99%. Guess what will happened then?
Most of the anti-Semitic posts are coming from the trolls and Ron Lawl supporters. Let the posts remain since it reveals the hate these folks carry inside.
I it wasn't on the OWS site itself, and if they were't at times drowning us out to the point that newcomers might see them AS the Occupy Movement, I would agree with you. A lot of people are very politically unsophisticated, and such first impressions might close their minds to us completely. It's a real quandry - freedom of speach Vs. the possibility to letting our opponents spread a really false picture of who we are. *^&$@&!
Wouldnt it be funny if they changed Jew to 'Jewel' like they change Ron P.aul to Lawl?
I like that idea! I also want them to change "Fuck you!" to "You're right. I have to admit your points are solid, well thought out, and generally sound."
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It's not coming from our supporters, needless to say, it's coming from (people?) like you.
This post is VERY illuminating, in regards to the way the 1% would like to tarnish our vision, and I think explains this issue. We must separate this site from any outside source of control, or we cannot than credibly repudiate it.
This is exactly why the titles of those posts, at least, need to be censored.
I would not doubt that those trying to tarnish this movement as anti-semitic would send bots in with some of those hateful titles, just to discredit OWS.
I think that is almost beyond question. Thanks.
I heard somewhere that this site is controlled by the founder of AdBusters ultimately. Don't know if it's true or not. I initially used to look at it because it was advertisement free, but I found it to be too skewed towards those that violently oppose the Jews rights to exist. I don't read it anymore, but I still like the ad free concept.
That is exactly why the hate needs to stop. It's not about censorship, it's about chasing people away that are getting the completely wrong impression. By the way, the anti-Jewish posts are fairly new. Personally I think it's just the latest ploy by those who oppose us to undermine the cause. First it was 'get a job you dirty hippies,' then it was advocating violence in the streets, now it seems to be Jew-bashing. One wonders what's next.
I'm waiting for the other boot to drop myself.
That is a very important question, because if AdBusters controls this site, and has anti-semitic tendencies, it should NOT bare the OWS name. It discredits our movement. Where do people go when they want to learn about us - to the OWS site. This has grave implications for the success of this movement as a whole.
Yes, but should we throw out the baby with the bath water? It doesn't seem too apparent if it's true, and it's spurred quite a few good dialogs. I try to ignore the trash. It's true about bullies, if you ignore them they'll go somewhere where they can get the reaction that they want. Maybe it's just something as simple as a few whacked out sk1n h3ads. I noticed some stuff gets censored quick, and some of this hate you speak of has been hanging out for a while now. Can someone get to the bottom of it? I shudder to think if this is true.
Yes, it seems that way. The stuff that doesn't get moderated seems to be predomenantly anti-semitic to me.
Well, his minions will start voting down any posts questioning this. They'll down vote it into oblivion once they see it. The thing is that Kalle Lasn is pals with Robert Halper, an EXTREMELY wealthy retired WS investor, who is the one who donated the 20,000 dollar seed money to start the movement. Around the same time, he donated 2500 to the Romney campaign (2500 is the most an individual can donate). It's all very creepy, but those two are the ones who came up with the hashtag for OWS over a steak dinner in NYC.
BTW, JP Morgan owns 10 percent of Twitter in a round about way. That's an aside. Not sure where it fits into this crap. It's a total cluster fuck, pardon me, but Twitter is making a monstrous amount of profit off these revolutions- it doesn't matter whether one agrees or disagrees with the movements - many people are making LOTS of money.
What are all of you "hooray for Jews" people so afraid of?
Like anyone should have to have a reason beyond basic morality for objecting to the persecution of a people:
Maybe you have to be a liberal to understand?
That's the whole reason why I yell at the pieces of filth running around denying the Holocaust and posting anti-Semitic crap; not only is it a pack of lies but it's honestly scary to see such strong hate directed at a particular ethnic and religious group. It makes me wonder a lot of things about certain people in this country, not least of which how the bigots on here are any different than the bigots in the Likud Party whom you profess to hate so much.
Honestly, the quote explains why I back OWS even when I don't necessarily agree on all of the individual policies and actions the group takes. First they came for organized labor, and not many spoke out because they weren't affiliated with organized labor. Then they came for the poor, and again not that many spoke out because most of the country wasn't poor and the stereotypes they presented were easy to swallow. Now they're coming for the rest of the middle class, and now it is time to speak out because the longer we wait the nastier this is gonna be.
Who is talking about communists? Who is talking about trade unionists? Perhaps you could find a quote that actually has something todo with the issue at hand.
OMFG you're a moron.
Good answer. You get a cupcake.
Thank you. Accepted. Morons make good cupcakes. Everyone is useful in their own way.
Typical of leftist filth.
Uh . . . fascism?
I just skip it. I don't even [click.]
I agree it needs to be blocked. Spreading hatred is vile.
Yea, something needs to be done about it immediately.
The forums seem to get swept out once a day. Not often enough. I'd also be more aggressive with IP blocking.
Yea, can't allow free speech, gotta have control!
They don't block it because they agree with it.
ows lives on hatred.
It's NOT OWS, but the enemies of OWS behind this stuff. OWS holds the exact opposite position, one of inclusion!
Wrong, ows is based on envy, jealousy and hatred.
its bc the mods are yermans
You do realize that we've been purging virulent antisemites for a while. The mod team is not bots.
Got Ya. My objective was more to point out the problem itself rather than criticize the moderators. The problem is those hate-filled headlines themselves. But I did just have a VERY important post blocked because it was "Too Long," when I've seen much longer posts here. Then I was told I was ignorant due to some technical crap about not connecting links or something, when there was no need for links in the post at all.
Abuse@occupywallst.org for reports. If they don't get reported we can only get rid of the ones we spot ourselves.
Thanks, I'll do that . . . This is to the moderators of this site: my intent here has never been to antagonize the moderators, but rather the fear that because A LOT of people get their first impression of our movement through this site there needs to be more effort on the part of the movement as a whole to get you whatever resources you need to get a FIRM grip on this site. This is, after all, like it or not, a political movement and in politics the whole objective is to win people to your side, rather than let your opponents define you. The only thing that has really angered me happened here tonight, when I tried to post something I have thought out for weeks that took several hours to compose, and had it blocked because it was 'too long.' I didn't retain a hard copy because nothing like that has happened before, Worse, whoever blocked it responded by overriding my message and imposing their own. I tried to post that piece about ten times, and I know a copy is still out there somewhere, because he quoted some of it back to me, in an attempt to insult me. I want to see that posted, or I will take steps to get to the bottom of that. I am on your side, but this IS NOT A GAME. When I post something there is a good reason, and in this case, a reason nothing less than critical for this movement. Call me an arrogant jackass if you will, I don't care. I am long past caring about ego, mine or anyone else's. I am concerned that we win this thing with as little violence, injury and suffering as possible, and I think that piece outlined a serious path towards that goal. If it is not reposted I will rewrite it, but also bring the whole subject up before others on this site and before the general assembly. You need to step up your game; if that takes reinforcements or money you can get both simply by asking. We are in a deadly serious undertaking here and better open our eyes to the implications of that! There can be no acceptance of sloppyness, egoitism and arrogance at the heart of this organization. These things can result in tragedy in an undertaking like this. In support and solidarity, and in all best wishes . . . really!
GypsyKing
I dislike all religions and don't believe Israel has a right to exist, does that make me antisemetic?
That's an excellent question. I vote it doesn't make you anything bad at all.
Congratulations
I would just like to take this time to congratulate the 2.1% of the United States population for their many contributions to our society.
Lloyd Blankfein - Jewish Bernie Madoff - Jewish Alan Greenspan - Jewish Richard Fuld - Jewish Tim Geithner - Jewish Hank Greenberg - Jewish Benjamin S. Bernanke - Jewish Donald L. Kohn - Jewish Kevin M. Warsh - Jewish Randall S. Kroszner - Jewish Frederic S. Mishkin - Jewish
Presidents of Federal Reserve Banks... FRB of Boston: Eric S. Rosengren - Jewish FRB of New York: Timothy F. Geithner - Jewish FRB of Philadelphia: Charles I. Plosser - Jewish FRB of Richmond: Jeffrey M. Lacker - Jewish FRB of St. Louis: James B. Bullard - Jewish FRB of Minneapolis: Gary H. Stern - Jewish FRB of Kansas City: Thomas M. Hoenig - Jewish FRB of Dallas: Richard W. Fisher - Jewish FRB of San Francisco: Janet L. Yellen - Jewish FRB of Cleveland: Sandra Pianalto - gentile FRB of Atlanta: Dennis P. Lockhart - gentile FRB of Chicago: Charles L. Evans - gentile
The list goes on and on. If this was a list of Muslims, would you be as not concerned? If you see a name you do not recognize, Google them. It happened in Russia. It happened in Germany. Now it is happening in America.
I would also like to point out - Jewish Albert Einstein - Jewish Paul Krugman - Jewish Al Frankin - Jewish Abbie Hoffman - Jewish Yitzsak (sp) Rabin - Jewish Rudolf Horowitz - Jewish Eli Weasell etc., etc., Jews have found promenent places in societies, but I see no reason to fault them for that because, as far as I can see, it has come mostly through a native intelligence born of thousands of years of exclusion and struggle (oppression)), and through a tenatious drive toward education.
Their success has been a very mixed blessing to them, considering that they are a small monority, and it has engendered much hatred towards them. But make no mistake; the overriding power is still very much in the hands of a small fraction of the White, Protestant, ultra-wealthy - not in the hands of the Jews.
Jews have long been used as scapegoats for the powers that be, to divert attention from themselves when discontent arrises and those powers feel threatened. It is a divissive tactic used to fragment dissent.
These are my opinions on the subject, anyway. If Jews have done one thing to add fuel to this fire, again in my opinion, it has been to emphasize their "otherness" from the majority in nations from which they do not originate. The danger is that in convincing themselves of their "otherness," they run the risk of convincing non-Jews likewise. That, I believe, is a profound mistake.
But please, please, let us not go down THAT path of tried and true tragedy and horror, benefitting no one, and simply plunging the world into yet another cycle of violence and futility, while human survival is truely predicated upon the complete opposite approach, of spiritual growth and transformation! We must talk openly about our feelings, but not succomb to the senseless malestrom of eternal conflict.
I have some real qualms in regard to "political correctness" where this issue is concerned. To the degree that it promotes mutual respect it is good - to the degree that it stiffles honest dialogue, and therefore increases mistrust and misunderstanding, it is bad. People must be able to say what they truely feel. I understand your anger and frustration, but please try to channel it towards the building of a better world for all. I really do not believe it is an us or them proposition, regarding Jews, or any other ethnic or racial group. That is a misinterpretation of the complexities of the problems we face, and a very dangerous one . . . Just my thoughts on the matter.
Now the trolls will probably just insist that I am a Jew and all that stuff to antagonise people and try to reduce the issue again to one of simple hatred. How utterly tiresome that all is. I sometimes think that, like The Joker, they simply want to see the world burn! But they generally lack even his human pathos. They mostly just seem more like the guys with the pile of money, that even he had justifiable contempt for. Wow, what a connundrum we are in, and yet out of this effort at visualizing something better, I do think something better may come - that a real spititual awakening is possible within us. We have walked that road before as well, and it is a far richer road to walk.
they may be bad people but it's not because they're jewish.
Someone else has a list just like that. Maybe Kalle Lasn. The plot thickens. The revolutions around the world will be brought to you by Twitter. Who owns Twitter? Who has invested money in this private Co?
mel brooks - gentile-correct jew
Not all Jewish people are bad. I mean I love Jon Stewart and other talented people who happen to be Jewish.
But orthodox Jewish people in generally are freaking arrogant. Like seriously you don't need a special term for racism towards your people and you don't need to eat kosher food. They really do believe believe they are God's chosen people and everyone else is a peasant.
Anti-Semitism is oook but Ron Lawl will not be tolerated here.
lol
shrugs ..Is it silly? yes, but then sillyness cannot be regulated. The trolls and haters out there will just find some other dogmatic issue to divert attention to. I will delete my posts if a thread becomes too nasty. But I will copy and paste it first and repost it fresh. With a slightly altered headline of course.
Thanks, I now probably know who's posting the hate-Jews-stuff, and why.
lol the mods keep erasing my comments concerning this topic...they and even entire threads I was a part of....they let threads like this go until someone really starts to make sense
No one can blame an entire group of people for mistakes of a few others. Auschwitz happened but all Germans cannot be blamed for it the same way all Jews cannot be condemned for the actions taken by other Jews. Surely you must know this. Those who deny the holocaust are probably too young to know what happened or do not know anyone directly effected.
Our educational system may be partially to blame for omitting certain events from the teachings in history. They don't usually tell both sides of our colonization in America, we only hear our side, not much about how the Indians felt about it or some of the terrible things done to them.
The problem with the educational system is that is doesn't teach proper critical thinking. Most people don't know what's bad about conspiracy theories and so they don't understand how to separate them from real science.
Agreed that critical thinking skills are not taught.
Hey I'm not Anti-semitic!!...Ilove my Palestinian Arab Semitic Brothers and Sisters..How dare you call me anti-semitic!!
Anti semitism is not surprising coming from supporters of OWS. Unsuccesful people love to rip those who are more successful. Keep up the anti-semitism OWS! It destroys credibility.
GARBAGE
successful in lying stealing killimg. in bilking the world of trillions upon trillions of dollars? yes, i'm quite jealous of a bunch of Murderers. Ever read the Talmud? Most hateful literature in the world.
I just tried to post something like this and it didn't go through, it made me think that there was some kind of filter going on, but in the opposite way then one would hope. It's truly awful what some are using this forum to spew.
Yes, really strange moderation going on here!
Because these people hate Jews. I have complained of this too. I never thought I would see the day I came to the support of Jews
This post has been the best news for me here in an otherwise dismal and agonizing day. Thanks. By the way, it is not OWS spreading the hate, but those who log onto our site to discredit us. There is simply no end to their morally repulsive tactics.
No one is in charge, free speech is the norm. If the speech upsets you go somewhere else.
The bill of rights doesn't cover the internet and private property.
Hate speeches have no freedom whatsoever and must be condemned according to democratic principles, because harming people doesn't seem to be a liberty included in the first Amendment. Please review your definition of FREE SPEECH or you will be put in the same basket as German Nazis, and will loose the little credibility you have on all the important subjects that the wall street protest has been raised.
So free speech is only allowed if it meets your definition?
Exactly! There is freedom of speech for you as long as you say what they want. I've been censored on this site for no other reason than pointing out the truth. These people suppose to speak for all of us yet if anyone dissents they are silenced immediately, especially if you criticize Obama! Hmmm...
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radicalarchives.org/2011/10/20/lasn-adbusters-helps-you-find-the-jews/
Thanks, I will check this out. I'm really curious about what the hell is going on with this site!
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Dig into some of the information about Lasn and the seed money from a Wall Street fat cat who gave 20,000 seed money to this cause. Also check out links between who owns large part of Twitter/Obvious Corporation and who lunches together. People are making money off this. Bank on it. Or Credit Union on it.
Interesting indeed. Sounds like his parents fled Estonia with the Germans before the advancing Red Army of WWII.
The article he wrote though points to what is obvious. The neocon movement is heavily far disproportonately Jewish. On the left there is an argument about whether Israel dominates US middle east policy (if not more than that) Vs. The Chomsky/old left view that israel is but a tool of the USA. There happen to be people of Jewish origin on both sides of that argument. If the side of the argument that puts Israel in the dominant position re US middle east policy then certainly the neo cons have a lot to answer for regarding the Iraq war in particular as they were front and center in advocating for it.
Not questioning that so much as motives of the people who started this thing. Also the money that is being made. Corps that are private don't have to disclose finances. Orgs and public corps do. Not going public can hide a bunch of stuff. Twitter and its investors are definitely making boatloads off the revolutions around the world. There are some strange bedfellows here.
I'd like links about the seed money, etc.
articles.businessinsider.com/2011-10-18/wall_street/30292660_1_crude-wall-streeter-traders
just Google lasn halper ows. lots of legit info on it. that's just the first one that popped up.
Okay Halper is a Wall Street veteran born in Brooklyn. Is he Jewish? I ask because it's being alleged that Lasn is anti Semetic and his parents apparently thought the wise thing to do was head for Germany (they were the "bad guys") while the Red Army (they were with the "good guys" and "our side" then) advanced. I would guess then if that's the case his upbringing might have been influenced by a dislike of Jewish people.
It gets messy because there are valid reasons not to like the influence of certain Jews without blanket hating each and every Jewish person.
I can't speak to that because I don't know much about it. There are a lot of WASPs influential in politics too. Don't know what to say.
However, I did come across the document Lasn wrote on Jews. It was rather odd to me.
Just think there is stuff going on behind the scenes that might not be so noble. There always is.
George Washington took material assistance from France, which was an absolute monarchy at the time. Each had their own distinct motives. Politics makes strange bedfellows as they say. I'd not judge OW either on Lasn or Halper, but rather on what OW does.
I don't have a problem with what they do for the most part, but I always question motives and who's making money. Unfortunately, there are very few wholly decent/pure people on this planet. And every movement in the end is politics. I don't think this will remain pure due to human nature. Insidious greed is always there.
Seems that Lasn is dependent on Halper's generosity or good will. I know nothing about Halper or his motives. I support OW for what I have seen of it. $20,000 would be chicken feed to Halper and looks to be a donation and not an investment.
Twitter. Obvious Corporation. I'm quite interested in that too. Halper also donated the maximum legal amount to Romney. I have a hard time overlooking any of this. But I do think OWS is on its own now, as Lasn has called a victory and thinks people should leave the Parks and work from there, so no I don't think they are listening to him as of a couple of days ago. Anyway. This is the stuff I fnd intriguing for now.
(Also have issues with the real suffering going on on this planet compared to America's but tired of talking about that as it doesn't mean anything to anyone apparently. I give my monthly money to Doctors Without Borders. That/Somalia mean more to me than this)
well here's what i think about Romney:
http://occupywallst.org/forum/mitt-romneys-magic-mormon-underwear/
I think that it is possible that halper is trying to hurt obama with OW. Obama had to express sympathy with the grievances expressed by the OW movement. then OW gets inevitably trashed by the media then the repugnicans try to pin OW on Obama. this is possibly why there is a national campaign to snuff out OW while Obama is out of the country.
Hmmm. Very interesting. I got a good laugh out of that too - Obama the catalyst of OWS. I'm afraid it will hurt the Dems more than help and mainly because I fear people won't vote. The only Rep I wish they'd talk about more is Roemer. He's sort of interesting, but they won't let him participate in debates.
I would truly love to see the list of big doners to OWS. Somebody has to know.
Look up Kalle Lasn, the King/puppeteer of Occupy and the people running this site, and see his feelings about Israel. There you find the answer why.
It's actually part of their agenda.
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Everyone who watches the posts in here knows there is widespread hatred of Jews. Little has changed in the past century apparently. This "anti-semtism doesn't exist" meme is cover for anti-semitism. Next you'll be telling us there was no holocaust, right?
Get a clue. You have a problem with Israel? So do I. I also have a problem with the USA and Zimbabwe and most other governments. I express my objections without condemning an entire group of people.
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NO such thing as anti-semitism? You must have not read about WWII,
I like the lack of modding here. Though it is odd they have blocked references to Ron Paul and not some of the words others are using.
If that serves your agenda you like it, if it doesn't you don't. What an impoverished spirit.
Not sure what angle you are taking here. I made no reference to wishing my agenda (which I don't have) to be allowed, while having others silenced. In fact I was saying the opposite and that is what you called for in this post.
These people exist and they are not going to have their mind changed ever or at the click of someone's fingers. I think the best approach is to talk to them in a level headed way or just ignore them. Further, shoving them under the carpet only isolates them more and further justifies that what they say is all true.
I have found a number of people on here posting hateful and angry tirades. When approaching them in a neutral manner, the barriers are lowered and only then can you broaden their horizons.
I think you may be unaware of the degree to which RP supporters have actively tried to disrupt this site, not with reasoned argument, but with hate filled invective. Your question is legitimate, but you might understand the frustration here if you had to deal with this continual harassment. I believe one of them actually goes by the name annoy2, or something like that.
In order for communication to take place at all, there must be some limits placed on such really sleezy and counterproductive tactics. And having Neo-Nazis posting here, advocating concentration camps for Jews, is going beyond the bounds of accepable free-speach, in my opinion, no matter how tollerant we would like to be. I made a knee-jerk assumption that you were one of these people; a hazzard of dealing with them CONSTANTLY. I'm sorry.
Freedom of speech is why. Say the dreaded N word if you want. It is complete BS to try to make rules preventing free speech anywhere, much less here.
I don't like people hating Jews or blacks, but it is their right. What gives you the right do decide who can hate who?
If hate is what you're interested in promoting there's the door. Use it, and get your own damn neo-nazi site. See how many log on. At some point I think this may pass into the realm of criminal activity. There are laws against promoting hate crimes, and I wouldn't mind seeing them are enforced!
Already cursing... I am trying to point out how wrong it is to stop free speech and how silly it is to push the idea that people should be so deeply offended by mere words...
No you oppose cursing but not advocating concentration camps. Wow, a really weird take on freedom of speach!
observing cursing and opposing it are quite different. I do not oppose it.
Readers should have the right to read discussions which are on topic and not spam or hate messages. There are neo-nazi forums for yourself. Use them. If we allow the boards to turn into center for spam, then we have lost a really good forum for interesting discussion. That would be sad.
I actually have a lot of admiration for Jews. I am pointing out the lunacy of political correctness, and reminding people that freedom of speech is a basic right. We might not like what people say, but they have every right to say it, wouldn't you agree?
Freedom of speech protects you from government interference with your self expression.
Website owners are not the government and have every right to moderate messages and ban members, if they choose to do that.
Crying "free speech" here carries no weight.
You have the "right" to create your own forum and spew hate speech, if the owner of the server is okay with it.
I agree. On top of that, this forum is Canadian owned and in Canada there are hate speech laws. But yes, a forum owner can decide what topics of conversation are legit and which ones are not. Some people here are so funny. They think they could go in any assembly, meeting, or university seminar and say whatever they want because they have free speech.
It would be be a little strange to have people calling for the killing of capitalists while preventing other people from voicing their own stupid ideas, don't you think?
How can you have free, open discussion, if you erect all kind of rules?
That said, I do agree with you. The website owners can and should do whatever they want. It is their site. Users can take it or leave it. Kind of like employment.
Who calls for capitalists to be killed?
Not OccupyWallSt. Crappy, slanderous straw man redirection.
Not incidentally, I've seen posts advocating violence deleted here also.
Yes, but I also have every right to shut my ears. That's why I think we should provide tools for every user to filter out spam as they wish. You want to set your preferences to ignore any posts with the word jew, no problem enter it in your filter. You want to ignore some poster, no problem enter it in your filter. Why should I be forced to read through inane crap so that I can find a couple of interesting arguments.
I actually like that idea. You are then controlling what you hear (read), rather than what others say.
There's one thing you have to understand though. This site is Canadian owned, and in Canada there are hate-speech laws. Some of the posters on these boards could face criminal charges. When you use the Internet, it doesn't mean US laws always apply. It depends who owns the site and where the servers are.
You are right! That's cool. I know that Canada is pretty fascist. I am stoked at the idea of mounties coming to the US to arrest people -lol!
I don't consider hate speech laws as being fascist at all, but we all have different opinions.
I'm curious. Do the speech laws cover recordings?
I'n not a lawyer, why don't you do some research. You know, the irony is that the US government controls what you say much more than the Canadian one. With the Patriotic Act, you have become little patriots that care so much for your country that you let the government spy on all your conversations.
I'll keep my hate speech laws so I don't have to hear the nonsense of racist provocateurs, and you can keep your Patriotic Act since I don't want to tell the government everything I say.
I can't reply below your last post for some reason... but I had a good laugh - the police thing would be really fun, but at some point you are disturbing the peace. As for shouting "fire" in a movie theater and the like, threats of violence and intimidation that encroaches on the rights of others is not permitted by the Constitution. Our constitution was crafted by people that tried to preserve the rights of the individual and tried to limit the power of government. They did not think anything they could construct would withstand bad people for long, and they were right.
Understand I am not ragging on the over controlling (imo) Canadian gov't exclusively. I include the US gov't too.
I am 100% with you on our patriot act - pure crap!
Oh yeah, here are some free speech tests to try.
Go to the airport and start rambling in a loud voice about bombs and hijacks. Carry a suitcase and say things like "Ah shucks! My luggage is so heavy it feels like there's a bomb in it." Have a Qur'an in your hand when you say this. Make a video of the whole thing with a cell phone and paste it here so we can all see the freedom of speech you have in US.
Stand in front of your city's police station and keep shouting "Cops are lazy donut eating pigs. I want to shoot them all. I ate them. I'll buy a gun and kill them all!" Ask a friend to tape you doing this for a few hours, then post it on here so we can see your free speech in action.
I'll say! What would you say about laws that control what people think?
Why the slippery slope fallacy. Controlling what people think and controlling hate speech are two different things. If you believe everyone should be allowed a gun, why don't you agree everyone should be allowed a bazooka or a tank? Slippery slope fallacies are lame, stop that.
Our gun laws are based on the populace protecting ourselves from an overzealous government, so I am for tanks and bazookas in private hands, even knowing the dangers.
I have to wonder about the speech laws... What if I mumble something that sounds offensive but is misheard? What if I am a black rapper saying nig... in my song? What if I am a white back up rapper singing with him?
Sounds like an overreaching government to me - just like we have now... sad.
You could always try this in US and see what happens:
Go to the airport and start rambling in a loud voice about bombs and hijacks. Carry a suitcase and say things like "Ah shucks! My luggage is so heavy it feels like there's a bomb in it." Have a Qur'an in your hand when you say this. Make a video of the whole thing with a cell phone and paste it here so we can all see the freedom of speech you have in US.
Stand in front of your city's police station and keep shouting "Cops are lazy donut eating pigs. I want to shoot them all. I ate them. I'll buy a gun and kill them all!" Ask a friend to tape you doing this for a few hours, then post it on here so we can see your free speech in action.
BTW - You can say words like nigger in Canada. You won't have a problem. You're so simple minded.
That's because OWS are largely represented by AntiSemites
I am the moderator and you can fuck yourself for telling me what to do!
I could almost believe this. If this is the "moderator," he needs to be dragged out by his ear, and I'll volunteer to do it!
In case you didn't know, though, if you report posts via email abuse@occupywallst.org you will probably get results.
anony1 is definitely not the moderator, trust me. He's one of the opposition. Check some of his other comments.
Thanks
I don't know but they do block Ron Lawl. see
Ron Paul? They're blocking Ron Paul?
Ron Lawl Ron Lawl Ron Lawl RONPAUL.
Just for me I guess
I wish I could claim credit for that trick but I can't. There's two ways around it according to some of the more savvy users on this forum. One way is to put two spaces between Ron and Paul and the other was to use a capital i instead of the L in his last name. Clever, eh?
ron paul
Heh heh heh. Looks like the censorship is effectively useless. It needs to go. Too much negative feedback from it anyhow.
ya it worked. it's silly and doesn't make sense
Why is it allowed? It's simple....it's in your DNA. Liberals hate Jews. While Glenn Beck and conservatives hold rallies to "stand with Israel"...liberals lead by Code Pink are gun running weapons to Palestine on boats.
What the fuck do think is happening?
The inability to distinguish between the rogue state Israel and the Jewish people is at the root of most modern anti-semitism. Maybe if you could see the difference you'd have a coherent worldview, like liberals.
By rogue state..I assume you mean, vibrant economy, freedom and democracy. Yes..agreed. in the Middle east...that is a "rogue state"