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Forum Post: What Would Modern Day Bread Lines Look Like?

Posted 1 year ago on Feb. 2, 2013, 8:57 p.m. EST by OTP (-203) from Tampa, FL
This content is user submitted and not an official statement

Please check out this article before reading: http://demonocracy.info/infographics/usa/food_stamps/food_stamp_nation-SNAP.html

So back in the day, it was bread lines. You had to wait in a line to get some food, probably something that wasnt that great (honestly was probably healthier than most crap at Walmart these days)..

That had to irritate the shit out of the people. Make em mad. And make em ACTIVE (active=activism=activate=action).

So what would the deal be right now, if all the people on foodstamps were forced to wait in lines to get their food. Were forced to take what was given to em.

And what would their level of anger be if they didnt have a nice card that looked like a credit card, that looked just like what everyone else had, and they can buy what everyone else has?

Some say that analogy is cruel. "You are going to embarrass the poor? What an asshole!" or "They dont deserve to be treated like that"...

And I understand that reaction. And I agree. No one deserves to have to beg for food. But that level of discomfort can be healthy. It can lead to things. FDR had to deal with a very angry public, and guess what... Shit Happened. Shit got done.

And this is where it gets interesting. Have they really gotten wild with handing out the foodstamps the last 12 years because they care? (keep in mind these people are killing the very same kids and families overseas ) Or are they simply trying to keep everyone calm as the country turns into a polluted corporate knock off of Idiocracy?

And what would happen if the foodstamp program was all but eliminated, and all that money went back into the churches, the soup kitchens and the charities? Would people tolerate it? Would they be complacent sitting on the sidelines for the most part?

Or would the masses reach an activation level that led to the changes we saw the last time an economic situation of this magnitude happened, the FDR era?

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59 Comments


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[-] 3 points by Gillian (1842) 1 year ago

I was reading this 'vintage' article this morning over my coffee and thought I would post it relative to your post re: FDR ...then and now.

Economic Rights, Then and Now January 11th, 2010 marks the 66th anniversary of FDR’s Economic Bill of Rights. BY SUSAN FEINER

Economic security today? Yes. FDR’s January 11,1944 State of the Union Address unveiled a “Second Bill of Rights under which a new basis of security and prosperity can be established for all—regardless of station, race, or creed.” Roosevelt, citing “accepted, self-evident economic truths,” called economic security the “foundation of true individual freedom.” He continued, “equality in the pursuit of happiness” requires the right to “a useful job” that “provide(s) adequate food and clothing and recreation,” “a decent home” and, “adequate protection from the economic fears of old age, sickness, accident, and unemployment.”

That was 66 years ago.

Today’s unemployment—nearly 30 million people when you include those working part-time and those so discouraged they’ve stopped looking—rivals that of the Great Depression. Record numbers of households—their earnings stuck at 1998 levels—are worried about food and clothing. Recreation? Forget it. And for the millions whose homes are foreclosed decent housing is a distant memory.

Is it possible that economic policy makers don’t understand the magnitude of the crisis facing Americans whose livelihoods depend on jobs? Don’t they care? Or does economic ideology so blind them that they can’t see what was so obvious to FDR? “ ‘Necessitous men are not free men.’ People who are hungry and out of a job are the stuff of which dictatorships are made.” We ignore this at our peril. Today, as in 1944, “the grave dangers of ‘rightist reaction’” threaten economic security and political freedom. With insight and prescience FDR warned that if we return to business-as-usual after we have “conquered our enemies on the battlefields abroad, we shall have yielded to the spirit of Fascism here at home.”

Insecurity breeds Fascism. Too many of us begin each day staring anxiety in the face. Only the richest Americans enjoy an acceptable measure of economic security. With security in their pockets and billions (of our tax dollars) in their bank bonuses, they leisurely contemplate which mansion to live in, how much to spend on designer clothing, where to sip champagne, and who to hire to wash their clothes and tend their intimate needs. While the rest of us—checkbooks empty and shelves bare—worry about meeting our basic human needs.

What policy levers must we pull today to ensure economic rights proposed in the 1940s?

According to the Center on Budget and Policy Priorities the states face combined budget gaps of around $350 billion for fiscal years 2010 and 2011. The states, unlike the federal government, cannot run deficits. Moreover, when states cut spending to balance their budgets, the ensuing job losses cause further declines in tax revenues, necessitating more spending cuts. Forcing the states to run balanced budgets in times of extreme economic duress creates a vicious cycle of rising unemployment, falling tax collections, job cuts and more unemployment.

The federal government is the only economic actor with both the resources and power to counter this downward spiral. Yes, this means deficit spending.

If the Federal government stepped in with the $350 billion needed to balance state budgets, the states could hire 15 million (or one-half of all the currently unemployed) at $25,000 per year.

The alternative is worse! If the federal government does not step in—does not provide state grants sufficient to prevent further spending cuts—the resulting unemployment will create the same federal deficit, but we’ll have nothing to show for it!

The arithmetic is simple, the logic straightforward, the policy direct. Only fiscal dinosaurs and rightwing class warriors don’t get it.

President Roosevelt knew that significant federal spending was the key to economic security.

Deficits be damned. Full speed ahead!

Susan Feiner is a professor of economics and of women’s and gender studies at the University of Southern Maine.

[-] 2 points by GirlFriday (17435) 1 year ago

You know, Al Capone started some of the first soup kitchens.

[-] 1 points by quantumystic (1710) from Memphis, TN 1 year ago

being the kind of guy who has feet in both worlds i can tell you most gangsters of any kind are decent people but if you are in the game well then you know the risks and the stakes involved. don't confuse gangsters with thugs and punks though they just don't give a fuck and that is what it is that's why we need gangsters to keep those types in line. for example little italy in nyc has always been one of the safest neighborhoods in the city. old ladies could feel safe walking at night with no fear. try that in the bronx.

[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (26682) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 year ago

Winning neighborhood support - while he also took money from those in the neighborhood who had any.

[-] 1 points by Narley (284) 1 year ago

Capone supplied a demand. Much like the drug gangs do today. I have no idea if he was a good guy or not, but he was a good businessman. Bootleggers killed to protect territory and illuminate competition. Not for the sake of killing Again, much like drug gangs do today.

[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (26682) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 year ago

Yep - pretty much - the big guys provide a product and keep a low profile in that regard - the little guys fight for distribution territory.

[-] 1 points by GirlFriday (17435) 1 year ago

I know, right? A bigger badder 2.0 version of the Black Hand...........

[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (26682) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 year ago

The Mob has Morphed - now they are a part of wallstreet and into banking - DEEP

[-] 1 points by GirlFriday (17435) 1 year ago

For me, I've always had a problem with seeing a clear division there.

[-] 2 points by DKAtoday (26682) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 year ago

Well - really - there has never been a whole hell of a lot of difference - just a difference in areas of operation.

[-] 1 points by GirlFriday (17435) 1 year ago

Agreed.

[-] 2 points by DKAtoday (26682) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 year ago

Now they have merged - and are doing their damnedest to make a complete merger with government.

[-] 1 points by GirlFriday (17435) 1 year ago

Honestly, I think it's always been one gang banger for another.

[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (26682) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 year ago

While it is true that criminal activities have always happened - street - Banks - government - it seems that it is so much more prevalent today then ever before. Or is it only just that it is more blatant ( out in the light of day ) - like - so what - who cares.

[-] 1 points by GirlFriday (17435) 1 year ago

It may be that it is just more prevalent because we happen to be living in the times.

[-] 2 points by DKAtoday (26682) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 year ago

Yeah - could be more noticible living it in the present moment.

[-] -2 points by OTP (-203) from Tampa, FL 1 year ago

Seems strangely familiar eh?

[-] 2 points by DKAtoday (26682) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 year ago

The Mob has morphed/expanded they never went away. Now they are heavily into banking and wallstreet.

[-] 1 points by gnomunny (6614) from St Louis, MO 1 year ago

He also donated milk to schools, if I remember correctly.

From what I read I mean. I wasn't there. I ain't THAT damn old yet!

[-] 2 points by GirlFriday (17435) 1 year ago

Ya. I wasn't dating ya.

[-] 1 points by gnomunny (6614) from St Louis, MO 1 year ago

I'm trying to get my sense of humor back. Seems I lost it over the last few years.

Hell, if I was old enough to remember 'Big Al' passing out milk I could become a figurehead: Oldest Occupier Ever!

[-] 2 points by GirlFriday (17435) 1 year ago

Yes, you would.

We will hunt down your sense of humor and bring it back for you. Right after I hunt down mine.

[-] 0 points by gnomunny (6614) from St Louis, MO 1 year ago

Based on how entertaining your comments are now, I can't wait to hear what you'll say once you hunt yours down. Hurry the hell up!

[-] 1 points by GirlFriday (17435) 1 year ago

I'm working on it.

[-] -1 points by OTP (-203) from Tampa, FL 1 year ago

I was not aware of that. Interesting.

[-] 2 points by GirlFriday (17435) 1 year ago

Yes. Nature abhors a vacuum.

[-] 0 points by OTP (-203) from Tampa, FL 1 year ago

I dont like vacuums. Or carpet for that matter. :)

[-] -1 points by OTP (-203) from Tampa, FL 1 year ago

Did Sammie Gingello do anything?

[-] 2 points by GirlFriday (17435) 1 year ago

Well, not during the depression. He died in 1978?

[-] -1 points by OTP (-203) from Tampa, FL 1 year ago

Not sure when he died, just know he had quite the rep.

[-] 1 points by GirlFriday (17435) 1 year ago

I think he died with a car bomb.

At any rate. Many of these people that use food stamps are homeless. I cannot find it in me to manipulate them for any agenda when they have so obviously been fucked already.

[-] -1 points by OTP (-203) from Tampa, FL 1 year ago

I think they are already being manipulated for an agenda, and its certainly not mine.

[-] 1 points by GirlFriday (17435) 1 year ago

I don't think it is yours. , I wanted to respond to this yesterday but I didn't want it to come off as offensive. So, I figured I would wait a day to see if I could figure out how to say it right.

I do not think that you see it as manipulation in an evil way. I don't think that you view this as harmful. I think that you see this as the quickest way to get from point A to point B.

[-] 1 points by quantumystic (1710) from Memphis, TN 1 year ago

suggesting that embarrassing food stamp recipients is part of the solution is ignorant at best and a right wing talking point. who has gotten wild with handing out food stamps? what people can't eat? they don't have a right to food?

[-] -2 points by OTP (-203) from Tampa, FL 1 year ago

Im not suggesting that we embarrass them, thats not the point, and thats why I made the point of mentioning that, because theres always that reactionary comment when talking about this.

I saying that I believe that if it werent so easy, and so hidden from society, that shit would be changing a hell of a lot quicker than it currently is, which isnt hard, because we are still going backwards at a very fast rate.

[-] 1 points by shoozTroll (17632) 1 year ago

They never actually went away.

This ones been around for over 80 years.

http://www.cskdetroit.org/

[-] 1 points by elf3 (2693) 1 year ago

Passification of the masses and bonus for WS the EBT /tax money spent is keeping corporations in business with tax payer funds and enables WS to keep cutting jobs while retaining consumers. People at the very top commiting fraud aren't any different from those at the bottom committing fraud they both want to take while giving very little in return. For all those people filling two carriages full of meat paid with EBT to resell to bodegas for cash while the frail old woman eats cat food to the big business executive with his mercedes SUV as a write off while his employee can't afford his kid's penecillin, neither knows how to play fair they both feel entitled and they don't feel they should have to care about others they think that if we are willing to put up with it we deserve it....

[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (26682) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 year ago

They would be a whole lot more crowded and visible - problem with food stamps - the people needing them are a lot less visible than if they were in a soup line - so the general public is less conscious of them.

[-] 2 points by Gillian (1842) 1 year ago

Yes, people needing food stamps are less visible. One reason is because in order to get food stamps, you need a job to qualify for them...a job that is less than 30 hours a week and or that pays less than minimum wage x 30 hours or you need to be disabled. It's a huge hassle to get food stamps and keep the benefit. It's very common for those who need this assistance to just get a mental illness diagnosis from a doctor ( very easy to do) which then exempts them from the employment requirements.

[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (26682) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 year ago

Actually varies a lot from state to state and even county to county as to what kind of hoops you need to jump through to get the assistance.

[-] 2 points by Gillian (1842) 1 year ago

I wonder where it's the easiest? It's not easy in VA. Our system is designed to force people to take menial jobs and keep them in those jobs.

[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (26682) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 year ago

That has been my experience here in Mn as well - you will work at any available job no matter how little the pay is - if you want assistance. Unless you are disabled - but then you have to live long enough somehow during a couple of year ( average ) process to prove that you are disabled.

[-] 2 points by Gillian (1842) 1 year ago

It doesn't take that long here to prove you're mentally disabled. As long as I can get a PTSD diagnosis which is as easy as getting an ADD diagnosis and I get put on medication, I could then go through social services to get assistance. I know this because when I was married, I was having one heck of a time trying to get out of the marriage and I met a woman who did just as I mentioned and was able to get all sorts of assistance. Then she introduced me to more women doing the same thing. I was terrified of getting caught in the assistance web but I can certainly understand why many do and I must confess that I did consider it as a last resort.

[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (26682) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 year ago

And therein lies the problem - getting a bogus medical diagnosis - misrepresenting - that puts others in a bad position. I had a medical history of over 15 years and still had to fight for over two years to get recognition after I had lost my job ( the job I had when the illness really took hold ).

[-] 2 points by Gillian (1842) 1 year ago

That's really stinks DK. I totally agree with you. It pisses me off too. My father had MS and he fought like hell for all sorts of reform for the truly disabled. I became the fraud's worst nightmare...turning in people and businesses for not having proper parking and such. But, the system isn't designed to help assist people who would rather be self reliant because there is too much incentive for doctors/psychiatrists/psychologists etc.. to label someone as disabled and get them into the system. There are huge kickbacks. Not only that but there's an unforgivable amount of fraud in social services where the employees are actually filing false claims and stealing money- including food stamps. This is a rampant practice especially during natural catastrophes. The mental health industry is the worst. Psych hospitals all over the country institutionalize people for no reason just to receive more funding. Schools receive financial kickbacks for drugging students. If our entire economic system were not so full of corruption, then otherwise, able-bodied citizens wouldn't need to resort to such desperate tactics. I was very humbled and shocked to hear the stories of the women who told me about their situations.

[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (26682) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 year ago

It is a systemic illness of society. Improper health care that instead of working with someone to overcome or manage and maintain - it prescribes medication and says there ya go you are healed - now get out of my office I have another customer waiting.

Extension of profits over people/society.

[-] 1 points by Gillian (1842) 1 year ago

Yes indeed. " Oh, my patient is mentally ill so we'll give him/her 12 vists' to cure that with some medication. Since when are all mental ' illnesses' curable in 12 weeks?

[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (26682) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 year ago

Well - there really is such a thing as situational depression that can respond in a short period of time - usually goes away with a change of circumstances = unemployed to employed, going bankrupt to resolving issue. Then there are those where it is not a mental illness but an organic problem - like something in the diet that the body can't tolerate.

Anyway the main thing being - it seems 99% of people do not receive proper care, treatment, testing, diagnosis, therapy, support to get on their feet again.

Take the pill damn it and stop bothering me.

[-] 2 points by Gillian (1842) 1 year ago

A doctor won't even begin to look for an organic reason for depression and even situational depression is being treated like a disease. Being bummed out isn't an illness. It's a normal reaction to a bad situation. It doesn't even warrant a diagnosis or medication though it can certainly help to sit and talk with someone while grieving or adapting.

My friend went to see her doctor last week and he asked her if she owned a gun and if she felt like harming someone. Gee, not much discretion being used there!

[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (26682) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 year ago

Common risk assessment stuff - some Dr.s are better at being conversational about their assessment - others not so much.

Hell - listen to me complain about medical care - and - Minnesota is highly rated nationally for all medical care.

How bad is care truly sucking elsewhere?

[-] 1 points by Gillian (1842) 1 year ago

The other night I saw a TV advertisement for a drug that treats excessive laughter or crying!!!!!!!!!! Nuedexta.....NO JOKE! Is there any reason to doubt that we are deliberately being dehumanized?

[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (26682) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 year ago

Increasingly medicated - without a doubt.

Feeling hysterical ? People looking at you funny when you laugh and cry inappropriately? Not a problem any more now you can........... BTW - you may want to kill your self or others while taking this medication ....... enjoy life again ................ some other side effects can be serious even death ..... remember to call a Dr. if you have an erection lasting more then 4 hours and are not enjoying it . . . other side effects such as constipation . . . irritable bowel . . . internal bleeding may occur.....

And yet - marijuana is illegal - heh.

[-] 1 points by Gillian (1842) 1 year ago

An erection for more than 4 hours! Everyone wants one of those before they die!
Yeah, marijuana leads to heroin addiction, didn't you know?

[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (26682) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 year ago

Well coffee is the gateway drug to cappuccinos & latte's.

[-] 1 points by elf3 (2693) 1 year ago

You obviously don't shop were people are using the cards like candy they have no shame at least the ones committing visible fraud filling three carriages while laughing about it and reselling it for cash at a discount right in the parking lot. They don't try to be discreet abot not showing the cards either

[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (26682) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 year ago

You obviously don't shop were people are using the cards like candy

I guess not.

No my personal experience has been to see card users getting food to bring home.

But yes I have heard of places exchanging card credit for purchasing alcohol or cigarettes or even for money ( .50 on the dollar exchange rate or less ). Generally in areas of wide spread poverty - kind of a black market economy.

[-] 1 points by Gillian (1842) 1 year ago

Same experience here. I don't see many folks abusing their food stamp cards. But, surely there are some who do, many do no doubt but, I doubt they would abuse the cards if they had other alternatives in sight. Instead, they live with chronic hopelessness and desperation. We can't really blame them for wanting to maximize their ' income' ...after all, our leadership models crony capitalism for us every day. Interesting how the big bankers can behave the same and are perceived as powerful and yet when a penniless mongrel does this they're nothing but pond scum.

[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (26682) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 year ago

Yeah - it would be helpful to have available employment that paid a living wage - that I think could make the real difference in getting people off of aid - if they only had a viable choice/option.

[-] -1 points by gnomunny (6614) from St Louis, MO 1 year ago

The same goes for extending unemployment benefits.