Forum Post: What will you sacrifice????
Posted 12 years ago on Jan. 11, 2012, 11:51 a.m. EST by ssjkakkarotx
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What are you willing to give up for the "cause"? What will you sacrifice to make your dreams a reality? Are you willing to give your own life up if you knew it would further the cause?
Ok since I have to be more specific for some people. The cause I specified are your own personal beliefs. Maybe the reason your here on an OWS board. Or the reason you protest or 1 of a million other reasons that drive you. This board seemed an appropriate place to ask this question. I figured that most people would be able to fill in the blank without my having to take your hand an walk you through it.
I'd sacrifice ssjkakkarotx in a heartbeat.
That's because you're a coward. I imagine you like the Portland OWSer who put her child on the train tracks
No, it's because if you are not part of the solution, you are part of the problem. And in your case, the problem is obvious.
The elite oligarchs.
Another useless post
nothing at all, zip, zilch, nada... not even a tax increase of 3% on my income over a million to help the national cause in reducing debt. in fact i commissioned a study that proves that taxing me more will cause hundreds of layoffs, and possibly numerous deaths and war.
please recognize sarcasm.
Clearly recognized and not needed. You have added nothing to this conversation. Congrat's
and by the way, i would sacrifice your life. uncommonsense also said the same--you must really have only a few gifts: alienating and pissing people off.
la la la you really smacked me down like a bitch with that bright critique. what does a "shut the fuck up" comment like your's add? mine was serious commentary about a pervasive attitude among uber-rich.
And not relevant to the question asked. Take your Ritalin or Adderall and come back when you can focus
backing away from the above question directed to you? or maybe you cannot focus (i left out the childish ritalin reference). the question is: what does a "shut the fuck up" comment like your's add?
1 I did not say STFU. 2 The conversation was not about what you want others to do. It's what YOU are willing to do. Since you won't answer or stay on topic , you add nothing to this. You might as well have said you like blue or that you think tin foil hats are fun. I have no obligation to respond to your questions if you won't make a useful contribution that is RELEVANT
How about you define "the cause" before asking that question? No offense, but I'm not completely sure what you're asking and until I am I can't answer you.
Well I was being rather general , since OWS seems to have multiple factions. I guess it would pertain to what you personally want to see OWS achieve. Are you looking for a top down over haul of the entire gov't? Are any of your OWS beliefs strong enough that you would be willing to sacrifice your self for that belief.
I am willing to sacrifice my beliefs in favor of the discovery of truth. But sacrifice my life for my beliefs?.. eh, not so much.
We should not have to sacrfice anything, just make the system we have in place work.
I'd like very much to be able to say "Yes " absolutely. However until I'm directly confronted with a situation that requires my acting on my beliefs I couldn't say for sure.
My own history with having to choose the "right" thing over what my heart wants me to do is for the most part on the plus side. When I was younger though, my choices were often not ones I'd make today. I now have the benefit of a fair amount of perspective that comes with having lived a fairly long time.
I've learned this: those who speak in terms of absolute certainty are often foolish.
It all depends on what the meaning of "is", "is".
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I'm not sure what you are asking but let me ask you your own question:
Are you willing to give up your own life if you knew it would further the cause?
Yes I am willing to give my life for my personal beliefs. I have already offered it once. 9 yrs ad USAF
Have at it.
belief noun 1. something believed; an opinion or conviction: a belief that the earth is flat. 2. confidence in the truth or existence of something not immediately susceptible to rigorous proof: a statement unworthy of belief.
offered but not given.
Offered but not given? What exactly does that mean?
You turn the question around instead of answering it yourself. Has there been a point in your own life that you "offered" your life for something you believed in?
I do believe that some of you need to learn to think before you type.
Sorry I didn't die. Maybe next time
ssjkakkarotx - I hope you were replying to farforall and not me! I was addressing my comment to his/her ridiculous and obviously thoughtless response to your serving in the USAF : )
Yeppers , don't sweat it :)
What will we sacrifice if we don't take up this cause?
What is the point of taking up a cause if you are not willing to stand your ground? Lots of sound and fury yet no actions
I agree. That's my point. We have too much to lose if we maintain the status-quo.
Not any children I may have in the future or the safety of any family I have in the future. If I believed in the cause I would gladly go hungry while I still fed my family when I have them. Sadly, I do not support most of the absurd BS I've heard on this forum.
nor is their any specification on what said BS is
change what?
hope what?
As a skeptic, there is no belief for which I could sacrifice my life or anyone else's life. Logically, a sacrifice of one's own life seems inconsistent with the need to test the results. If you don't care about the results, then it cannot be a sacrifice.
True , however not every person will share your indifference. Most of the OWS will fall quickly away from logic when faced when a challenge to their beliefs. Emotion quickly overcomes logic and a simple choice becomes in their eyes a life changing event.
Yes, because nature created emotion before logic. Without emotion first, there would be no us, and no logic. We just have to figure out how to live with it.
Yes but we don't have to be slaves to our emotions either. I would venture that some folks are simply not evolved enough to muster the mental fortitude required
In the defense of people who cannot muster the mental fortitude required, we could draw upon the nature and nurture literature to point out that "All men are [not] created equal" nor are all people reared equally or even appropriately. In some, the Limbic system (emotion networks) of the brain dominate, in others, the cerebral cortex (logic functions) dominate until accident or drug abuse (such as alcohol) destroys key areas in the frontal lobes of the cerebral cortex, releasing emotions from its control. So, some do have to be slaves to their emotions, how many do, I cannot say. Does not our republican form of government depend on the rational behavior of its citizens? If so, then what are the consequence if a significant number of citizens do not act rationally? And what are our alternatives? Another question appears in this context: should we restrict the fundamental rights of people who are not balanced emotionally and logically?
Truthfully I am lacking in time to discuss this further. This would make a great discussion. Gotta head into town for now though.
Got my steel for my new tank stand. So I figure i will take a few minutes. Clearly any form of gov't requires rationality from it's citizens. A republic even more so I would say. The consequences of not acting rationally have led us to some of the issues we see now. A great example is the EPA's Biofuel fines, they want to assess , even though the bio-fuel they a demanding doesn't exist. Alternatives.....unfortunately most if not all other styles have advantages over a Republic in THEORY. Practical application however renders them mute. As for rights. We would have to identify what those fundamental rights are. Right now it's Life, Liberty and the PURSUIT of Happiness. Adding to them is a monumental undertaking , that would have to be given an extreme amount of thought and debate
One core right must be the right to vote. It was a question at the origin of our republic, and remains an issue today. A rational decision (even a self-interested decision as the evidence for rationality) was assumed by the framers. Even so, they preferred to give more weight to the interests of the States in the electoral college, and in the Senate, over the interests of small communities. Today, we are faced with an electorate that does not seem to vote rationally, but rather focusses on a few hot button issues and fears (pure emotion!). So again, what are our options? What can we do about it? Would our fellow citizens read through a series of 21st Century Federalist Papers, or even watch a series of 21st Century YouTube documentaries?
Would I give my life for the cause? That is a good question that I cannot easily answer, yet. Considering all the people that benefit from the current corrupt staus quo, I do not think this will be easy and unfortunately I do suspect before this is all over that there will be people that sacrifice their lives.
I know that we like to compare ourselves to the people in Egypt and other countries that are experiencing the Arab Spring, but clearly we are not on the same level. Those people have my deep admiration and respect for putting themselves in harm's way, often to see that their children have the chance to grow up in a better world than they did.
Thank God that you and a few of the others are mentally capable of handling this question.
I promise to give up more whining time and work.
lol
What "cause"?
WHy are you here?????? Seriously do I really have to explain this.
yes
Why are you here?????? WHY DO YOU PROTEST????? That would be your CAUSE
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some of my own friends are dead.
I think I have something of a grasp of what may be at stake.
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Hello Zendog. Nice poem, nice sentiment in your second stanza, but curious: what is "that thread that permeates the universe"? in what context are we "a secular nation", and" a progressive nation"? and in what context are we deficient in these traits? Sorry, I know that poets dislike having to explain themselves to literal types.
Yay another worthless zen post. ME ME ME I I I MINE MINE MINE. Self centered ego maniacs such as yourself do much damage to OWS. Maybe you could add lots of you cut n paste's now or talk up your "platform" Reading is clearly not one of your strong points either. I didn't ask if you understood what was at stake. I asked what YOU would sacrifice. Not that some one so selfish would ever be able to do such
Are you selling violence?
NO, I am not at all encouraging violence here. I think any acts of violence committed by OWS simply reinforce negative stereotyping about OWS. Self sacrifice does not require violence on your part.
Then further explain the following: "Are any of your OWS beliefs strong enough that you would be willing to sacrifice your self for that belief."
It's pretty self explanatory. What are you having trouble with??? I am not calling for suicide bombings in case that crept into your head.
Well, that is a plus! :D
I'm asking for you to clearly define sacrifice.
I'm sorry, how does sacrifice need to be explained? I am somewhat trouble by the fact that I would have to explain it to someone with your score.
Sacrifice has been interpreted in a multitude of ways.
No , no it hasn't. To Sacrifice is to give up something in exchange for something else. The who what where when and why might be different but the meaning is the same.
I see your added to your OP, which makes this a bit easier. Initially, I thought you were going to sell me something. :D
I sacrifice time and energy currently. If I thought that my death would change everything-sure. But, that isn't how it works. In fact, it would land someone in a loonybin. So, therefore, collecting information, sharing information, brainstorming, pursuing by means of contact and attempting to implement change is my course. Further, sacrifice is also found in looking for alternatives to what are considered quick and easy. This may take many forms. Such as purchasing some groceries once a month in order to support local farms.
lol I ain't selling nothing , my name ain't zen. At least you're a lot more agreeable today :) We're not spiraling into the name calling contest again
It takes two to tango.
Acckkk I don't Tango. I prefer Swing