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Forum Post: What the demands of OWS should be

Posted 12 years ago on Oct. 22, 2011, 12:30 p.m. EST by sarahpalinfan2012 (7) from Genova, Liguria
This content is user submitted and not an official statement

The way I see it, OWS has 3 main concerns, which are actually shared by 98% of the American people, without hesitation:

  1. Standard of living for Americans
  2. Student loan debt and employment (related: healthcare)
  3. Ending irresponsible and/or corrupt practices of government and corporations (especially banks and "wall street")

I will make a thread on each of these points, since the site is telling me the essay with all 3 included is too long to post on OWS :(

  1. Our standard of living:

We want it to be higher (duh!). So far, most of the people I have seen have been calling for a higher minimum wage, or a "living wage". The idea is to pay people more, so they can afford more stuff, thus making their lives better.

This is a decent idea, but there are a couple of problems. First- fewer jobs will be created because each new job will automatically be much more expensive. There will be fewer people working harder and more people with no job at all. Second- it causes wage inflation, which leads to price inflation. When prices go up in sync with wages, we aren't any better off. Third- the reality of the world today is that a small number of firms supply a huge amount of the goods and services Americans buy. These increased wages will be going to pay increased prices with the profit going right back to the ruling elite (the 0.1% to 0.001%, who are surely laughing at all of you as you get arrested trying to implement their wish list of policy goals).

Here is a two-part alternative plan OWS should consider.

Part A. Let working class Americans keep their money. Cut working class tax rates to zero. Currently, "the 53%" have pointed out that 47% of americans pay no federal income tax. But, a lot of those 47% still have to file a tax form and still have federal income tax deducted from their checks. And a lot of those 53% are currently paying so little, it's barely worth it for the Gov to spend the money required collect from them. The government should equalize the nominal rate and the effective rate, keeping more of people's own money in their own pockets instead of giving to the government first, so they can slosh it around to whatever corporation's lobbyist gave them a handie that week, then borrow more money from international financiers so they can give you a tax "refund" check.

Part B. Increase the American people's purchasing power by taking steps to MAKE THE DOLLAR WORTH MORE. Hello? DUH? No need to increase wages, just make every dollar we have buy more stuff. When the house of Rothschild set up the US Federal Reserve Corporation, they promised us a dual mandate. The official purpose of the Fed was to both keep inflation low and aim at full employment (which means, bizzarely, as some "acceptable" % of unemployment). Today, full employment part has been somewhat revised, the Fed now sees it's role as to ensure that the stock market keeps going up. But now, Bernanke has made a statement, officially ending the dual mandate of the Fed. The Federal reserve will no longer attempt to control inflation. It is out in the open now, the only purpose of the Federal reserve is to pump more money into the "too big to fail" banks and hope that they gamble wisely. OWS must take a stand against this. NO more bailouts, NO more monetary easing, NO more troubled asset purchases. NO more of our dollars can go to help the banks (and other companies, ahem, Solyndra) avoid the consequences of their own stupid decisions. We must demand an end to these inflationary policies which make our dollars buy less and less stuff every day. At the VERY least, we must demand that Bernanke re-affirm the dual mandate. Ideally, it should be a single mandate, to keep inflation low so our dollars buy more stuff. But baby steps.

Your thoughts?

20 Comments

20 Comments


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[-] 2 points by TheZombiesareComing (8) 12 years ago

Occupy Wall Street idiots are the greediest people in this country-except for Obama and his FELLOW communists.

[-] 1 points by atki4564 (1259) from Lake Placid, FL 12 years ago

Agreed, and I particularly like the statement -- NO more bailouts, NO more monetary easing, NO more troubled asset purchases and NO more of our dollars can go to help the banks -- so perhaps you would consider our group's proposal of an alternative online direct democracy of government and business at http://getsatisfaction.com/americanselect/topics/on_strategically_weighted_policies_organizational_operating_structures_tactical_investment_procedures-448eo , hit the facebook “like” button if agreed, and then join our group's 20 members committed to that plan at http://finance.groups.yahoo.com/group/StrategicInternationalSystems/

[-] 1 points by XtowerMan (2) 12 years ago

Isn't wanting the bank to forgive student loans or failing to pay on any loan a form of GREED?

[-] 1 points by XtowerMan (2) 12 years ago

Isn't wanting the bank to forgive student loans or failing to pay on any loan a form of GREED?

[-] 1 points by sarahpalinfan2012 (7) from Genova, Liguria 12 years ago
  1. Student Loan Debt and Employment (and Healthcare)

There is an easy, one-word solution to the student loan problem. Ready? Bankruptcy.

The whole problem goes away instantly if you treat student loans like all other forms of debt. All other debts can be dissolved if the person is willing to declare bankruptcy. This is, obviously, a personal choice that everyone must make for themselves. It has negative consequences, it is NOT a "get out of jail free card". Most people who have student loans, it probably wouldn't make sense to declare bankruptcy anyway. But there are a lot of people who it would make sense for, and they should have that option.

The benefit is a lot bigger than just helping people who are crushed by their student loans right now. This reforms the entire system, because it FORCES the lenders to make careful decisions about lending the money out. Students will have to show a credible plan for how they will pay the loans back. The current system is, the government says the lenders MUST lend no matter what and the borrowers MUST pay it back no matter what. This might -sound- right to you, but it's not. This is completely backwards. This means there is no risk, and therefore, no incentive to do things that make sense.

Instead of demanding free education from the government (which, btw, I think is a good idea, but it is un workable), OWS should be demanding that a college degree no longer be a de-facto requirement for middle class/white collar jobs. Look up the griggs v. duke power decision of the US supreme court. That is the reason why the college degree became standard. Once the Universities figured out that everybody basically felt they HAD to go to college, the Universities noticed they could jack up their prices continuously and people would just keep paying.

The second thing OWS should demand is for the government to make it easier for people to start their own businesses. In America, it is very complicated and expensive to start a new business and it takes a long time. This makes it harder for us to compete against the megacorporations and essentially makes it impossible for us to build our own wealth. OWS is demanding more regulation, but you guys need to realize that the big corporations LIKE regulation. Regulation means they don't have competition. This pic (http://bit.ly/qbb5Px) explains how and why that works. OWS needs to demand that small businesses get a fair chance to compete. Reduce start-up costs and make regulation more efficient, so small businesses can afford to operate. Most of the people who are occupying wall street are smart and driven and they could create their own wealth if government got out of the way.

Finally, on health care, we HAVE to repeal Obama's health care law. The law was supported by the Pharma companies AND the insurance companies... those are the two industries that the american people dislike the most, and Obama's idea of reform was to force everyone to become their customer. Now big pharma and big insurance have literally no reason to offer us good service because we are forced to buy from them anyway. This is INSANE. We should demand more competition in healthcare and more innovation. Not monopolies.

[-] 1 points by Yepper (277) 12 years ago

When the feds guaranteed student loans they put a clause in them that basically syas the student loan is not part of personal bankrupcy. Decalre bankrupcy and you still have the loan.
Start your own business it takes guts. If you fail you can't even get unemployment.

[-] 1 points by sarahpalinfan2012 (7) from Genova, Liguria 12 years ago

Yepper-

That is the point, I am suggesting that OWS demand that Student Loans be treated like all other forms of debt, so that you can get rid of them in bankruptcy. Drives down education costs, de-flates the bubble.

[-] 1 points by Yepper (277) 12 years ago

Not a bad idea but refunding fed loans and taking out the bankruptcy clause ....i don't see that happening. Even the Feds will demand some upside to change to less secure loans. Rates might go up, restictions on them might be put into effect etc. I am biased againts bankruptcy and admit it. I find it morally wrong. When a man's words becomes worthless who is to be believed?

[-] 1 points by sarahpalinfan2012 (7) from Genova, Liguria 12 years ago

Well, that's your problem. Bankruptcy is a necessary thing if you want to have a halfway advanced economy, there has to be an orderly way for failure to happen and for people to move on.

[-] 1 points by Yepper (277) 12 years ago

All I am saying is Bankruptcy should be a last resort. ANy loan app always asked one question as do my job applications. Have you EVER filed for personal or business bankruptcy?

[-] 1 points by sarahpalinfan2012 (7) from Genova, Liguria 12 years ago

Indeed. It's a personal choice for people to make. If its harder to get future loans, it'll force them to be more careful in the future. More debt isn't really a good idea for people who go bankrupt anyway.

[-] 1 points by Yepper (277) 12 years ago

After bankruptcy some lender will love it. They know you can't go bankrupt again for 7 years.

[-] 1 points by SChung (9) from New York, NY 12 years ago

What about things like education, social security, green energy, and immigration?

[-] 1 points by sarahpalinfan2012 (7) from Genova, Liguria 12 years ago

In the current system, immigration is net loss for the 99%. It directly drives down wages. That right there is enough. Illegal immigrants mostly take the jobs of previous immigrants. Legal immigrants take high paying, high-skilled jobs that the OWSers want for themselves. Green energy is a pipe dream at the moment, and it is best left to the private sector. Environmental regulations, ironically, kill a lot of green energy projects. So maybe look into that.

As for SS and Education, that is point 3:

  1. Ending corruption and reckless behavior

One Sentence Solution: Break up the too-big-to-fail banks and break up the too-big-to-fail federal government.

Break up the banks into smaller parts and force the liquidation, yes, at an actual loss to the uber-wealthy bankers of the divisions which are loaded with toxic assets. It is really that easy. They will tell us that this will make the economy even worse. Maybe it will, maybe it won't. The fact is, there are lots of responsible banks, credit unions, and insurance companies out there who are in a position to buy up parts of these insolvent banks cheap and turn them around. They are small companies now because they used good business practices instead of cheating like the too big to fail banks did. Banks fail and are bought by other banks all the time. If the TBTF banks actually are allowed to fail, it will be VERY bad news for the mega-rich people who will lose their trillion dollar empires, but there's NO reason to think it would actually be bad for the majority of Americans.

Next, break up the federal government. Social security, medicare, medicaid, education, environmental protection, even the federal income tax, should all be administered by the states instead of the federal government. This gives people more accountability and more freedom to tailor solutions to the unique needs of a very diverse nation. It also creates jobs all across America, instead of concentrating them in DC. I have an apartment in the DC area, let me tell you, DC has no recession. It is BOOMING. Why? Because ALL OF YOUR MONEY is coming here. DC gets to spend your money before you do. Why should the DC politicians get all the money? Spread the wealth around!

[-] 1 points by SChung (9) from New York, NY 12 years ago

There is abs no logic to your argument. So you suggest we live in a society that is completely ruled by the people, no government ? If anything, govt intervention is neccesary to break up the banks. As for green energy, without it, there will be no "environment" left to protect in the next 30 years, and actually immigrants and low skilled laborers are absolutely essential to the agriculture, restaurant industries. Fact check that. Look up what is happening in Georgia right now. They banned illegals from working in the state of georgia and their agricultural industry is going down the tubes as we speak. No joke. so what... deport them all and watch the economy crumble? Or mayb.. as Hermain cain, the Great one, said, install electric fences across the border? ( oh wait.. he said that was actually a joke....oops)

[-] 1 points by sarahpalinfan2012 (7) from Genova, Liguria 12 years ago

No environment left in 30 years? Are you kidding me, do you even listen to how insane this sounds?

If illegal immigrants are essential to the agriculture industry, ie, if the companies that feed us feel they have to break the law in order to make money at it, what does that tell you? The agriculture industry, Monsanto, etc, is a criminal enterprise. How come none of the OWSers went to get those good agriculture jobs in GA? They felt farming was beneath them since they had a degree in political science?

[-] 1 points by stevonbi (85) 12 years ago

But, I am complete agreement with the poison that is the Fed....... :)

[-] 1 points by stevonbi (85) 12 years ago

DIS-agree!!! THE most important issue is tho get the money out of the public election system. This means eliminating "corporate Personhood's" ability to contribute unlimited (and anonymous) money to their bought-ans-paid-for politicians, and honest campaign finance reform. All the other things will fall into place should we have the voice of the people heeded......

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