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Forum Post: I have a dream not I have a drone

Posted 2 years ago on June 14, 2012, 2:31 a.m. EST by TrevorMnemonic (5827)
This content is user submitted and not an official statement

“We went to war against a nation that didn’t attack us based on choice. A million innocent Iraqis died as a result. That is a significant number, and there are consequences for that. If America is to shed the shackles of war, we need to go through a period of truth and reconciliation.

“We have to recognize that we are still choosing war. We chose war in Iraq. We chose to go to war in Afghanistan. I think it was right to strike the training camps, but we chose to stay at war for more than a decade. And we are choosing to possibly go to war with Iran.

“If you go deep - and I spent the better part of the last 10 years, every single day challenging these wars - what I have learned is that people in Washington just don’t understand that there is another way to end conflict without killing people.

“When we look at Afghanistan, Iraq and Libya, which was a war of choice, and after you wreak havoc on these countries and then you sing Kumbaya and work at conflict resolution, there is magical thinking there. If we create these wars, we are not accepting the consequence of what we have done. To leave it to peace keepers and conflict resolution experts, we are way disconnected from our own actions. We have a country that has not been able to shed our imperial instincts. The idea that we can dominate the world through a global war on terror is insanity.

“All our peace-building efforts will fall apart as long as we believe we can control the world through the use of force. We must acknowledge that every time we drop a bomb, it expands the war and ripples into the future ultimately coming back to us.”

-Dennis Kucinich

67 Comments

67 Comments


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[-] 5 points by MattLHolck (16833) from San Diego, CA 2 years ago

US drone strikes target rescuers in Pakistan – and the west stays silent

Posted 5 minutes ago on Aug. 23, 2012, 4:16 p.m. EST by TrevorMnemonic (3613) This content is user submitted and not an official statement

Attacking rescuers – a tactic long deemed by the US a hallmark of terrorism – is now routinely used by the Obama administration

The US government has long maintained, reasonably enough, that a defining tactic of terrorism is to launch a follow-up attack aimed at those who go to the scene of the original attack to rescue the wounded and remove the dead. Morally, such methods have also been widely condemned by the west as a hallmark of savagery. Yet, as was demonstrated yet again this weekend in Pakistan, this has become one of the favorite tactics of the very same US government.

read more - http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2012/aug/20/us-drones-strikes-target-rescuers-pakistan

Whether you vote for him or don't vote for him... tell this president as commander in chief "END THE WARS NOW" Not tomorrow. Not in 2014, not in 2016, "END THE WARS NOW"

After tons of civilian casualties Pakistan leaders have asked several times for the US to stop bombing them. They'd probably fight back but then they'd just get done to them what happened to Iraq. US foreign policy makes me sad to be an American.

http://occupywallst.org/forum/us-drone-strikes-target-rescuers-in-pakistan-and-t/#comment-813605

[-] 2 points by MattLHolck (16833) from San Diego, CA 2 years ago

Drone Strike Killed another 13 civilians on Sunday - You still think that's not a war crime?

Posted 39 minutes ago on Sept. 8, 2012, 3:02 a.m. EST by TrevorMnemonic (3744) This content is user submitted and not an official statement

http://occupywallst.org/forum/drone-strike-killed-15-civilians-on-sunday-you-sti/#comment-828519

[-] 2 points by MattLHolck (16833) from San Diego, CA 2 years ago
[-] 2 points by MattLHolck (16833) from San Diego, CA 2 years ago

U.S. missiles fired from a drone in a Pakistani tribal region near the Afghan border killed eight suspected militants early Sunday, officials said, as the controversial American strikes continue despite Islamabad's persistent demands that they stop.

Pakistan: US drone strike kills 8 militants

By ISHTIAQ MAHSUD

July 1 2012

Associated Press

http://www.nrtoday.com/article/20120701/API/1207010671&ParentProfile=1055

[-] 1 points by Builder (4202) 2 years ago

It's a global war OF terror, Dennis.

[-] 2 points by MattLHolck (16833) from San Diego, CA 2 years ago

one step at a time

Libya's included

[-] 1 points by Builder (4202) 2 years ago

Was the public in America aware that NATO was about to bomb Libya? I was travelling remote at the time.

[-] 2 points by MattLHolck (16833) from San Diego, CA 2 years ago

There was a tsunami on Japan coast at the time.

3 drone strikes hit Pakistan during the Walker election

[-] 1 points by Builder (4202) 2 years ago

I have a theory that when the frackers are finished polluting our water tables, Libya's enormous aquifer will be the bottled water supply that the oligarchy will sell to the world.

[-] 3 points by MattLHolck (16833) from San Diego, CA 2 years ago

glaciers are gonna keep melting

[-] 1 points by TrevorMnemonic (5827) 2 years ago

I was. I don't know about the public.

It came up incredibly fast.

one week it was "I think we're going to bomb Libya with NATO"

then they just did it

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[-] 0 points by rpc972 (628) from Portland, OR 2 years ago

RE: "Both Parties the Same Propaganda Ploy?"

The squeaky wheel gets the grease.

Big $ shows up, We the People don't!

Of course it is a "Propaganda Ploy," you'd have to be blind, deaf, or live in a cave, to believe Cons and Dems are the same. Not even the RW Zombies and RepubliCon Propagandists who work night and day advocating this falsity are dumb enough to actually believe it. Their goal is to discourage the turnout (LIKE THEY DID IN 2010).

But there is one more (Both-Parties) option which is only found on our Left side: Prejudice. Purists and Perfectionists (who have no candidates because Perfection does not exist) who refuse to consider the vast and important differences between Cons and Dems because they made their stubborn minds up over one or two flaws. OR over a "Political System" that is in massive disrepair because of a lack of maintenance and an abundance of neglect! Making their desertion of our Political System a self-fulfilling prophecy and a Surrender!

This would all be perfectly fine (Who Needs Narrow-Minded dunderheaded bigots anyway!) except we all have to suffer the consequences of their blind Prejudice (ie. 2010 TeaBag takeover)!!!

Everybody needs to do their Homework: http://www.randirhodes.com/pages/homework.html?feed=364336&article=10248139

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[-] -1 points by rpc972 (628) from Portland, OR 2 years ago

Where was your silent cowardly fucking ass when the country was seized in mass hysteria, war time frenzy after 911?? Invasion of Afghanistan?? Invasion of Iraq?? Now you snipe?? Coward!!

[-] 0 points by TrevorMnemonic (5827) 2 years ago

Dennis Kucinich voted no on the war against Iraq and no on the patriot act and spoke out against the wars just as he does now. He also tried to impeach Bush.

[-] 3 points by Builder (4202) 2 years ago

I'm on his side, too. Was just pointing out what should now be obvious to everyone.

The true terrorists don't wear towels on their heads.

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[-] 0 points by rpc972 (628) from Portland, OR 2 years ago

I asked about you sniper!

[-] 1 points by TrevorMnemonic (5827) 2 years ago

I was 12

I didn't really get into the anti-war momentum until I was about 19 when I started researching info.

Where were you? Whats with the term sniper?

[-] 0 points by rpc972 (628) from Portland, OR 2 years ago

I figured you were a newbie. It's OK. But don't be presumptive please.

I have been fighting this KingCon Class War since they started sandbagging Carter. Raised a lot of old school (pre-internet) hell with Raygun, Bush-1, Clinton GOP-Witch hunt, and of course the SCOTUS Cheney appointment, Bush Doctrine and 911.

Snipe/Sniper: One who/to shoot at individuals as opportunity offers from a concealed or distant position: The enemy was sniping from the roofs. 6. to attack a person or a person's work with petulant or snide criticism, especially anonymously or from a safe distance.

[-] 1 points by TrevorMnemonic (5827) 2 years ago

A newbie? "Don't be presumptive" ?

I didn't "snipe" anyone either. All I did was share an awesome press release from Dennis Kucinich who has opposed the wars and even tried to impeach Bush.

Take some of your own advice. Don't be presumptive please.

[-] -1 points by rpc972 (628) from Portland, OR 2 years ago

Just like you "presume" Obama has complete control, try to imagine the possibility of having read your constant callow "sniping" at a POTUS who inherited a load of shit, who is stabbed in the back at every turn right in front of the press and public's oblivious/indifferent eyes, and who has a base to back him up as stable and reliable as puppymill poodles. Your current flaccid grasp of political/government reality is breathtaking, but there's hope and time, being a "newbie."

[-] 3 points by JackPulliam3rd (205) 2 years ago

Obama doesn't need you to make excuses for him. He's really really good at doing that for himself. Poor guy . Everybody's so mean to him. It's not his fault.

[-] 0 points by rpc972 (628) from Portland, OR 2 years ago
[-] -1 points by rpc972 (628) from Portland, OR 2 years ago

We could have done the same thing to Cheney-W, except WE DON'T HATE AMERICA like you righties do.

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[-] 0 points by fiftyfourforty (1077) from New York, NY 2 years ago

Too damn bad that Democrats and progressives act so meekly.

http://nomormonpresidentnomittromney2012.blogspot.com/2012/07/martin-bashir-and-william-cohen-msnbc.html

you might find the video interesting.

[-] 0 points by rpc972 (628) from Portland, OR 2 years ago

Meek Dems could be explained two ways. I've been puzzling over it myself for decades.

  1. Finesse: Like working a 100 lb fish on 15 lb test. Big $ PTBs against lowly under-supported/funded Dems.

  2. Overruled: Con owners, Big $ and Biz PTB have a consistent world record turnout, We the People have the worlds worst Voter Turnout!

  3. One and two: Fickle and unreliable Dems: Obama was on a role until Petulant Pouting Dems went AWOL in 2010 and let crazed Teabaggers take offices all over the fucking place. I would not have blamed him if he just quit and gave Dems the finger.

What we need: http://occupywallst.org/forum/vote-or-stfu/

[-] -1 points by JackPulliam3rd (205) 2 years ago

And you lack balls and brains. Like a certain POTUS I know.

[-] -1 points by rpc972 (628) from Portland, OR 2 years ago

You think you have balls and brains because you Hillbilly Taliban traitors emulate the 911 Al Qaeda terrorists, only you sabotage your own country and stab your own countrymen in the back. Can you say "RW Zombies!"

[-] 1 points by MattLHolck (16833) from San Diego, CA 2 years ago

poppy derivative pill distribution in Florida

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[-] 1 points by rpc972 (628) from Portland, OR 2 years ago
[-] 1 points by rpc972 (628) from Portland, OR 2 years ago

Yes, Romney is a pathetic mess, but so was Raygun, both Bushes and Cheney!!

Ever hear of, selling ice to Eskimos? Cons are ice, we are the Eskimos.

This is the answer: http://occupywallst.org/forum/vote-or-stfu/

[-] 0 points by MattLHolck (16833) from San Diego, CA 2 years ago

this whole "commander and chief" clause has me confused

[-] 1 points by rpc972 (628) from Portland, OR 2 years ago

There you go. You should never have listened to that goofball W.

[-] -2 points by rpc972 (628) from Portland, OR 2 years ago

The bogus Cheney wars were inherited, we are getting out of them ASAP considering Big Military does not want to leave. All's fair in love and war, and I would rather send a drone than my son into that shit storm any day! So would you.

I think all wars should be fought entirely by drones, all drones, drone on drone war!! That would be awesome!!! But it would require employment for hundreds of thousands of young adults ~ the dirty little secret revealed.

War is not just Big Biz, but Big Jobs!! So....

[-] 2 points by flip (7484) 2 years ago

oh yea, you figured out the dirty little secret - War Is the Health of the State

by Randolph Bourne

First part of an essay entitled "The State," which was left unfinished at Bourne's untimely death in 1918 - drone on drone war - you are the typical apologist for the dems

[-] 1 points by rpc972 (628) from Portland, OR 2 years ago

Go ahead a spread this to everyone you know:

Everybody needs to do their Homework: http://www.randirhodes.com/pages/homework.html?feed=364336&article=10248139

[-] 0 points by rpc972 (628) from Portland, OR 2 years ago

Oh Yeah! That's exactly it, Shock Doctrine! Incredibly evil and fucked up, too! SEE/READ fucking SHOCK DOCTRINE!! http://www.filmsforaction.org/watch/the_shock_doctrine_2009/

What to do: http://occupywallst.org/forum/vote-or-stfu/

[-] 0 points by TrevorMnemonic (5827) 2 years ago

Drones aren't attacking drones right now. They're killing people.

Not bombing anything would be awesome.

instead of building drones to create jobs, we could build roads and schools and create jobs that way instead.

Also what did Cheney have to do with Libya? Obama not only supported the war in Afghanistan he wanted to increase it when he was running for president. Sorry Obama supporter... both the dems and the repubs share blame in these wars. Just look at congress who finances them and voted for war in Iraq. My democrat senator has voted yes on every war plan there is side by side with my asshole republican congressmen.

[-] -1 points by rpc972 (628) from Portland, OR 2 years ago

OK, naive is one thing that can be fixed, but dense is permanent:

  1. We all know what drones are being used for. We've inherited a war, just like Vietnam, and we yelled and screamed but NO ONE LISTENED!!

  2. The jobs are not in drones... troops. Massive employment program. We don't like or want it, that's why it's "dirty."

  3. Clinton took a major bashing for waiting so long to act on Bosnia. Bush for Darfur. Obama along with the United Nations (idiot) could not stand by and let Libyan rebels be defeated by Gaddaffi. Before you open your mouth, find out something. Context for starters. You sure "think" like a rightie.

  4. To end a war you sometimes have to escalate, Cheney-W negligence created a mess. Why don't you try figuring this stuff out your self? Wiki? Library?

  5. Cons are owned by the 1% PTB, Dems are overruled because Voters don't show up like Big $ and Biz does. Wake up. The squeaky wheel gets the grease.

Ignorance can be fixed, prejudice is another matter. I smell righty, but Jonathan Krohn snapped out of it.

[-] 3 points by flip (7484) 2 years ago

boy are you in the wrong place - so which mass murderer should i vote for? before you answer please give me a number for the people that obama has killed - could you make separate categories for women and little children. while your at it could you also separate "terrorists" from normal peasant men - poor brown men trying to support a family. it may take you a while but please do it! your bringing up vietnam was appropriate but why did we stay so long and how many did we kill there? and which murderer should i have voted for - lbj, nixon? you certainly know little about bosnia - don't really blame you since you obviously read the mainstream media when you are not watching hbo. as to voting - emma goldman was right - "Female suffrage was a major reform goal of the Progressive Era. Emma Goldman, however, did not believe that the ballot would secure equality for women. She rejected the idea, which many suffragists held, that by voting women would clean up politics". - they thought it would end wars and gain women equal rights - how did that work out - or would you like to give it a little more time?

[-] 0 points by rpc972 (628) from Portland, OR 2 years ago

All that "mass-murder" is Crap so crawl back into the hole you came out of and we'll have the union mason come and fill it in with cement. Vermin be gone!

[-] 2 points by flip (7484) 2 years ago

so can you come up with some numbers or just make assertions that are baseless

[-] 1 points by rpc972 (628) from Portland, OR 2 years ago

Nixon helped develop Shock Doctrine. See Shock Doctrine!

[-] 1 points by flip (7484) 2 years ago

are you 12 yrs old? numbers little one - can you come up with some?

[-] 1 points by rpc972 (628) from Portland, OR 2 years ago

Nixon developed Shock Doctrine with Milton Friedman and a others....

[-] 1 points by flip (7484) 2 years ago

thought so - and add more than 2 + 2 - i own naomi's book since it came out - wasn't my favorite - could have been a long article stating the obvious. so thanks but unless you want to pony up some numbers you can stop now - you are 12 right?

[-] -3 points by HempTwisted (-28) 2 years ago

Why DKAtoday Should Be Permanently Banned From The Occupy Wall Street Forum & OWS Movement:

http://pastebin.com/n2B7ZMXy

[-] 1 points by flip (7484) 2 years ago

why send me this nonsense - fire up a doobie and watch a movie - get some popcorn (lots of salt and butter) and a coke then follow it up with a box of dots - you will fell better

[-] 1 points by TrevorMnemonic (5827) 2 years ago

You come off as a weird person when you chat with others online.

It's really ignorant when you say that the idea of using diplomacy over war is "thinking like a rightie"

[-] -1 points by rpc972 (628) from Portland, OR 2 years ago

You're naive and suspiciously dense (RW MO), you think I'm weird here, you should here me when I'm with peers. Run-on partial sentences, strange words and logic, no explanations. It's so... "weird."

Never attributed diplomacy to the RW, NEVER!

[-] 3 points by TrevorMnemonic (5827) 2 years ago

This entire post is about using diplomacy instead of war.

Let me copy and paste it so you can read it again

“We went to war against a nation that didn’t attack us based on choice. A million innocent Iraqis died as a result. That is a significant number, and there are consequences for that. If America is to shed the shackles of war, we need to go through a period of truth and reconciliation.

“We have to recognize that we are still choosing war. We chose war in Iraq. We chose to go to war in Afghanistan. I think it was right to strike the training camps, but we chose to stay at war for more than a decade. And we are choosing to possibly go to war with Iran.

“If you go deep - and I spent the better part of the last 10 years, every single day challenging these wars - what I have learned is that people in Washington just don’t understand that there is another way to end conflict without killing people.

“When we look at Afghanistan, Iraq and Libya, which was a war of choice, and after you wreak havoc on these countries and then you sing Kumbaya and work at conflict resolution, there is magical thinking there. If we create these wars, we are not accepting the consequence of what we have done. To leave it to peace keepers and conflict resolution experts, we are way disconnected from our own actions. We have a country that has not been able to shed our imperial instincts. The idea that we can dominate the world through a global war on terror is insanity.

“All our peace-building efforts will fall apart as long as we believe we can control the world through the use of force. We must acknowledge that every time we drop a bomb, it expands the war and ripples into the future ultimately coming back to us.”

-Dennis Kucinich

[-] 0 points by rpc972 (628) from Portland, OR 2 years ago

We are in the aftermath of an enormous swindle perpetrated by the GOP and their Big Military-$ Masters. The wars, the theft, The Shock Doctrine! Better late than never to wake up.

All I can say is here: http://occupywallst.org/forum/vote-or-stfu/

[-] 1 points by Builder (4202) 2 years ago

Yes, we all are being gypped.

No doubt about that. Those who are responsible are realising the gig is almost up, hence the rush to bring in the NDAA and the FEMA camps, and rush in the drones in the homelands.

Time to wake up and smell the roses, all you American people. Most of you have been swanning along, quite unaware of all this. Time has come to take affirmative action, or wind up in a prison camp, with no chance of a fair trial, or any trial, for that matter.

[-] 0 points by rpc972 (628) from Portland, OR 2 years ago

Here is the answer: http://occupywallst.org/forum/vote-or-stfu/

Wage slavery is much cheaper than camps and drones.

VOTING is our secret weapon!!

http://occupywallst.org/forum/vote-or-stfu/

[-] 1 points by Builder (4202) 2 years ago

I'm in Australia.

Just lending solidarity to your cause, and making sure you get the real nooz, as opposed to corporat nooz.

[-] 0 points by rpc972 (628) from Portland, OR 2 years ago

See this shit!!?

[-] 1 points by Builder (4202) 2 years ago

From what I can gather from reading at this site (and others) marginal voters (Afro-Americans, Peurto Ricans, Hispanics) etc., are finding it almost impossible to gain a "voter card ID" due their dwelling status, or employment, or lack thereof.

Despite having an Afro-American president, the current status quo for voting in the US of A, is pretty phukking limited, for a country that claims to be Land of the Free.

[-] -1 points by rpc972 (628) from Portland, OR 2 years ago

See The News Room, a new HBO series starring Jeff Daniels who has finally come out as a flaming liberal!

Massive propaganda, massive Voter suppression, massive CU bribery!!

With a populace this manipulated and disenfranchised, and Big Biz-$ so blatantly controlling, Dem POTUS can do very little. Con POTUS just does what he's told. "Land of the free" again see The News Room.

Wish us happy Independence Day!!

http://occupywallst.org/forum/vote-or-stfu/

Read below.

[-] 1 points by Builder (4202) 2 years ago

Happy Drone Day, more like.

Time to organise an armed resistance movement, and get some geeks working on jamming those drones. You're sitting ducks. Just waiting.

[-] -1 points by rpc972 (628) from Portland, OR 2 years ago

Let's advocate mandatory Voting!

It's gotten to the point here where people think it's cool, the real brilliant alternative, to abstain from voting. Real Jim Jones' People's Temple shit!! "Drink the Kool-Aid, Voting is futile!" Then we get another fucking Cheney!!! And a "war on terror" and the biggest heist the world has ever seen!! If Cons steal this again, Please NUKE us!!!

I've been banned twice, for "my cause."

Support this: http://occupywallst.org/forum/vote-or-stfu/

[-] 0 points by conservatroll (161) 2 years ago

If Obama steals it, please NUKE ME!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[-] -1 points by conservatroll (161) 2 years ago

Need I point out that Dr Paul feels the same way?

[-] -1 points by TrevorMnemonic (5827) 2 years ago

I'm sorry I'm too busy looking back at history during the Bush administration and the fact that Romney wanted to stay in Iraq longer as well as the majority of voting records from "conservative" republicans in congress. As a majority republicans are pro-war. Same with democrats. Voting records don't lie.

[-] 1 points by conservatroll (161) 2 years ago

And that relates to Dr Paul how?

[-] -2 points by HempTwisted (-28) 2 years ago

Why DKAtoday Should Be Permanently Banned From The Occupy Wall Street Forum & OWS Movement:

http://pastebin.com/n2B7ZMXy

[-] 3 points by DKAtoday (22349) from Coon Rapids, MN 2 years ago

Fuck-off shithead.

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