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Forum Post: "truthers", you are pwned by the government. This is why.

Posted 7 years ago on Dec. 12, 2011, 5:46 a.m. EST by Fluke (47) from Örebro, Örebro Län
This content is user submitted and not an official statement

This is true:

"One of the major consequences of the 9/11 movement has been to draw enormous amounts of energy and effort away from activism directed to real and ongoing crimes of state, and their institutional background, crimes that are far more serious than blowing up the WTC would be, if there were any credibility to that thesis. That is, I suspect, why the 9/11 movement is treated far more tolerantly by centers of power than is the norm for serious critical and activist work."

Noam Chomsky


http://www.debunking911.com/index.html

You are doing the goverment a favour by diverting attention and energy from the real issues here. I ask you politely, PLEASE stop that!

This is, from my part, a one way communication. I won´t answer any comments on this, so don´t waste your time on it!

39 Comments

39 Comments


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[-] 5 points by BlueRose (1437) 7 years ago

They have been told government is Satan, they actually BELIEVE this. Someone needs to tell them this is a trick of the 1%. The elite just want to not pay taxes, not have their corporations regulated. The 1% doesn't care if the "Govt is Satan" message bleeds over to create a 9/11 conspiracy. They are ruthless.

[-] 2 points by bensdad (8977) 7 years ago

lemmings will be lemmings
maybe the only cure is a cliff

on the other hand - would we really welcome this kind of dullard to contribute ( interfere ) with
the OWS movement?

[-] 0 points by Tinhorn (285) 7 years ago

It has already high jacked the movement on both sides.

[+] -7 points by Thrasymaque (-2138) 7 years ago

Truthers are conspiracy theorists. Failed individuals that fool themselves into thinking that they are on the path towards the truth when, in fact, their method of investigation is entirely flawed. They start with an assumption that some dark evil power like the government is behind some big secret scheme, then they pile more an more assumptions on top of each other in the hopes that it will lead them to so some kind of truth. It's like a drug; they feel powerful because they think they have gained special knowledge that other "normal" people don't have. Then, instead of publishing in peer-reviewed journals (they can't because they don't investigate properly with the scientific method), they write their self-published articles to their self-hosted blogs and go to random forums to try to convince random people they don't know to look at their "research" and "unusual findings". A failed and desperate plan indeed.

When evidence refutes their claims, they just counter it by making more and more ludicrous claims. One of their tactics is making claims that can't be refuted. For example, they brandish the idea that Reptilian Overlords or the Illuminati control the government from behind the scenes. Of course, they can't name anyone who is in the Illuminati because it's a secret organization. How they know about this secret is a whole different problem. They don't understand that they have the burden of proof, and that extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence.

These people are mentally ill. They are like children in desperate need for attention. Truthers have been going on for ten years making one dubious claim after another. They have found nothing of worth and still come to this forum to waste everyone's time.

All Truthers should be banned for this website, and their posts should be deleted. It's an insult to intelligence to have them here in the midst of scholars. Occupy should be better than to allow them free reign on this forum. Ban them and give their IP to the authorities so they can be taken away to a mental health shelter where they can be cured from this terrible mind disease. These are poor souls in need of help.

[-] 4 points by ZenDogTroll (13032) from South Burlington, VT 7 years ago

I don't think I like you very much.

I don't like truthers either - they tend to be rabid and close-minded.

But you -

you completely disregard the way in which faulty systems of belief can be selectively and systematically reinforced - I could show you how - it's a fucking crime it is, outrageous and unconscionable.

many of the truthers have been victimized by just such methods

perhaps you have no idea what I mean -

you could begin with an examination of When Prophecy Fails by Festinger et.al.

The People Shapers by Vance Packard

and then begin an examination of MK-ULTRA

Once you understand that this single program had tentacles in many universities, it may begin to help explain the almost universal nature of the behavioral characteristics so prevalent among truthers

[-] 0 points by Thrasymaque (-2138) 7 years ago

I know exactly what you mean and I agree. I'm not saying it's there fault. I say they need help. I blame the leaders like David Icke and religious gurus, not their sheep. That being said, the sheep are mentally ill and need help. They have been brainwashed.

[-] 0 points by ZenDogTroll (13032) from South Burlington, VT 7 years ago

then where is your compassion?

if you understand their malady then you understand there is no hope of reasoning on the issue because it is one of emotion, and one of conditioning.

where it is the result of conditioning it is the result of abuse - and so, as you said, not their fault.

. . . . anyone can be trained to tremble . . . .

[-] -1 points by Thrasymaque (-2138) 7 years ago

I don't believe compassion means giving them free reign to post their nonsense everywhere. It's not because they are victims that they don't spread nonsense that can hurt more people and make more victims. It's a dangerous disease. Iv'e told them they are sick, but they don't care. It's their responsibility to step out of denial. I can't do that for them. Sorry, but I don't tolerate conspiracy theorists and religious zealots just because they are victims. They are also oppressors of logical thinking.

"if you understand their malady then you understand there is no hope of reasoning on the issue because it is one of emotion, and one of conditioning."

This is exactly why I deface their threads instead of trying to reason with them. They can only save themselves if they want to. I'm hoping to save a few souls from their nonsense by making their comments harder to read, and by making it obvious they are brain dead idiots. I don't care about the Truthers, I care about the next generation. I think it's important to talk about this problem for the youngsters out there.


You don't have to agree. That's fine. I do what I do because I believe it is important to fight against this mind disease. If you think it's better to ignore it, then you should ignore it.

[-] 0 points by ZenDogTroll (13032) from South Burlington, VT 7 years ago

which in their view demonstrates the validity of their view

it becomes a part of the reinforcement for the behavior

there is no excuse for defacing the thread

[-] -1 points by Thrasymaque (-2138) 7 years ago

I believe it's important to deface illogical thought. There was a time when editors decided what was worth publishing. Those times are gone. In this new age of the Internet where any numbskull can publish something, it's important to out what is worthless illogical thought. It's a form of expression. It's designed for the next generation. Again, you don't have to agree. I'm not concerned about that. I'm my own man. I do what I believe is important. I don't care much about the opinion of others unless I can use it to further improve my own thought.

"which in their view demonstrates the validity of their view"

Again, it's not about the Truthers, but about the next generation. The Truthers you see on these boards cannot be saved. Their brains have already been ruined. They must simply be discarded so that the new generation is not infected.

[-] 2 points by XXAnonymouSXX (455) 7 years ago

If you "don't care much about the opinion of others unless I can use it to further improve my own thought." Then you are no better than the truthers. You only listen to those who agree with your ideas. What makes your ideas of truth the only ideas worth listening to? You are not the forum police and you have no right to censor other peoples opinions just because they don't mirror your own. You are a complete douchebag. Yes I'm calling you names. Now go on for 10 minutes about how I have no facts so I'm resorting to name calling. Yeah I don't care about your opinions either you fucking jerkoff. You are just here to insight anger with your crackpot banter about how other peoples opinions don't matter and the great Thrasymaque has all the answers. Gime me a fucking break. You are the lunatic. You are mentally ill. You need help. Please get some.

[-] -1 points by Thrasymaque (-2138) 7 years ago

I don't censor the opinions of anybody. They can still post anything they want. The difference between you and I is that I don't use profanity to express my arguments.

[-] 1 points by XXAnonymouSXX (455) 7 years ago

Must be that soft french mouth of yours. Just remember that you are not changing anyones mind. If anything you have only strengthened everyones negative opinion of you and your elementary school tactics. Live well stooge. I hope you are enough of your "own man" to eat your words. Peace out.

[-] 1 points by ZenDogTroll (13032) from South Burlington, VT 7 years ago

yeah I can see that

doesn't change the fact - you're being childish, and in the process,

you become the reinforcement for the belief system - you become a fact of conditioning

thereby reinforcing and repeating the victimization

and you are, apparently smart enough to realize that,

which means it is willful.

you willfully reinforce their own faulty system of belief.

I did say I didn't like you much, didn't I.

[-] -1 points by Thrasymaque (-2138) 7 years ago
  1. Please explain how it is a fact that this is a childish act. How is this an objective judgement on your part and not simply a subjective one.

    1. Please explain how their system of belief is being reinforced by my defacing their threads. (I believe you are right, but I want to hear your argument.)

    2. Please tell us what you would do to help the next generation. You've already mentioned that arguments don't work. If you use censorship they will simply call it a conspiracy. What would you do?

[-] 1 points by ZenDogTroll (13032) from South Burlington, VT 7 years ago
  1. it is the equivalent of having a tantrum - it is the refusal to acknowledge the right of others to have and to hold their own opinion - it is the refusal to acknowledge the principle of free speech endorsed by the admin of this website - making the post illegible does not constitute speech, it is vandalism.

  2. Where they have faced repeated denial of the exercise of their voice - by for example,

    • large crowds showing up at the same time they arrive at Kinkos to print multiple copies for leaflets -

    • or when they arrive at the library to use the internet, and find, at a time when it is usually empty, that instead it is packed,

    • when instances like this happen repeatedly without explanation,

    • when words are whispered as they pass indicating that these things will happen before they do happen,

a process of conditioning has been implemented. Where your behavior is reminiscent or reflective of past such events, it becomes a continuation of and so reinforces the process of conditioning.

In one way or another they have attempted to reject that conditioning, even while being conditioned. It is a thorny knot, one you help perpetuate.

  1. the next generation? Or the current lot of broken people? In either case, I try to do what I can.
[-] 2 points by April (3196) 7 years ago

Can't we all just get along?

I think you both have points. The graphics are annoying. It hurts my eyes. But you have to admit, some are pretty funny.

Occupying parks and ports is annoying to some people too.

[-] 1 points by ZenDogTroll (13032) from South Burlington, VT 7 years ago

must be you liked his

  • pink penis

    • and
  • matching panties

< blech !>

; P

[-] 1 points by April (3196) 7 years ago

Agree, blech! Must have missed that. That doesn't sound right.

[-] 1 points by ZenDogTroll (13032) from South Burlington, VT 7 years ago

LoL!

I dunno . . .

[-] 0 points by Thrasymaque (-2138) 7 years ago

It was the guy who used to post http://global-human-rights.us/home/ He came back for revenge. I helped jart ban him last month.

[-] 0 points by Thrasymaque (-2138) 7 years ago

I didn't post those. A poser did.

[-] 1 points by ZenDogTroll (13032) from South Burlington, VT 7 years ago

don't lie

you know you did it - you just used a sock puppet

you had it mixed in with those comic pics you think are so . . . what'd you say?

oh, yeah . .. .

The clearer the better. Plus, it's fun to ridicule them, and it saves their posts from being ultra boring. Posting great comics and interesting pictures helps render the mind more flexible. I consider www.abstrusegoose.com the best online comic. It is intellectual.

[-] 1 points by April (3196) 7 years ago

I wasn't sure if Zen wasn't just joking around. I knew that didn't sound right.

[-] 0 points by Thrasymaque (-2138) 7 years ago

You are a conspiracy theorist now? Building your thought with a mountain of assumptions? Why don't you simply ask the moderators and jart. They will tell you what happened. The guy who posed as me has around 100 usernames on this forum. Here is a list of the usernames he was using last month. It was pulled directly from the database:

set([u'1Thrasymaque', u'AnonymousUScitizen', u'Hassan', u'JL2267', u'KahnII', u'Kisama', u'Koko883', u'MiKEYD', u'MikEYD', u'MikeYD', u'MikeyD', u'PerfectTaco', u'StopForeclosureFraud', u'Thrasymaque1', u'Thrasymaque2', u'Thrasymaque3', u'Thrasymaque4', u'Thrasymaquethegreat', u'Thrasymaqueythethird', u'Zivot', u'Zyzz', u'apple', u'austin2', u'demonstrator', u'freestyle', u'globalfreedom', u'guest', u'isthatthebestyoucando', u'meagain', u'misunderstood101', u'resistance0is0futile', u'resistance0is5futile', u'resistance1is1futile', u'resistance2is2futile', u'resistance35is5futile', u'resistance3is0futile', u'resistance3is5futile', u'resistance3is6futile', u'resistance56is5futile', u'resistance5is5futile', u'resistance7is5futile', u'resistance7is7futile', u'resistance8is5futile', u'resistance8is8futile', u'resistance9is4futile', u'resistance9is5futile', u'sirpoeticjusti', u'sirpoeticjustic', u'unwelcomedguest', u'youcannotsilanceme'])

You might remember him. He's the guy who used to post this link all the time: http://global-human-rights.us/home/

I helped jart track him about a month ago. He was banned, but came back for revenge a few days ago. He was banned again.

I'm surprised an intelligent person like you didn't realize his modus operandi was entirely different than mine. His targets were different, the style of pictures posted were different, his English was different.

If it comforts you to think like a conspiracy theorist then that's fine. I understand how this type of easy lazy thinking can seem rewarding. At least it can appease you and make you feel like a young successful MatLock. Just put a little pipe in your mouth and you'll upgrade to Sherlockian standards.

If you're more serious, you can simply ask jart and she will explain. I'm still here for a reason. If I had posted those pictures, I would be gone, just like Thrasymkay.

[-] 0 points by Thrasymaque (-2138) 7 years ago
  1. I think jamming can be considered art. Interventionists have used it so often that it has become a part of postmodern art. Occupy is based around this concept. I consider Occupy a type of social art piece.

    1. The goal is to feed the Truthers so that they expose themselves even more. As you said, you cannot debate seriously with them. So, instead I give them more and more material for them to create more conspiracies until it becomes clear they are confabulating. A Truther who sticks to a few conspiracies is harder to disprove then one who goes all out like David Icke. I'm pulling them out of their hidden place. They have started making the conspiracy that I'm a secret agent provocateur working for the government and here to disrupt and infiltrate the minds of other forum users. That's the first step into showing that they are mentally ill idiots.

    3 That is not an answer. What do you do exactly? What methods do you use.

[-] 1 points by ZenDogTroll (13032) from South Burlington, VT 7 years ago

So, instead I give them more and more material for them to create more conspiracies until it becomes clear they are confabulating.

it already is clear - you don't need to give them a reason to humiliate themselves further.

3) what the fuck is it to you

[-] 0 points by Thrasymaque (-2138) 7 years ago

The clearer the better. Plus, it's fun to ridicule them, and it saves their posts from being ultra boring. Posting great comics and interesting pictures helps render the mind more flexible. I consider www.abstrusegoose.com the best online comic. It is intellectual.

  1. I care about others. I teach part-time and it's important for me that the minds of the next generation not be torn apart by the shenanigans of Truthers, Creationists, and the like. Every time a mind is torn by conspiracy type thought, a river of blood pours from my soul. You don't have to agree with this. Most people don't care about the youth of today.
[-] 1 points by ZenDogTroll (13032) from South Burlington, VT 7 years ago

that clown who shot the cop and then himself - after shaving his head

what do you think, it just happened? you don't think, you don't think at all.

that's where some of these people end up, as statistics.

as symbols

they know that. They also know that in some way, shape, or fashion they can be next.

[-] 1 points by ZenDogTroll (13032) from South Burlington, VT 7 years ago

you want me to act like an adult when you've already established you have no intent of doing the same.

Plus, it's fun to ridicule them,

just admit it

yer a fukin punk

[-] 0 points by Thrasymaque (-2138) 7 years ago

Your twisting and turning like a snake changing the discussion's topic with every paragraph. You say I lie, and when I ask what lies you don't answer but start talking about someone shooting a cop then himself. Sorry, I can't follow you. I'll debate the issue seriously if you can stay on topic an announce your intentions to derail when you do. And, if you stop using profanity and name calling. It don't the the point of calling someone a fukin punk to make an argument. Act like an adult, and I will be happy to share my opinions. If not, there are many other mature posters here I would rather discuss with.

[-] 1 points by ZenDogTroll (13032) from South Burlington, VT 7 years ago

what - so you lie to them?

even kids conspire - to stay out late at night for example - its a fact of life, especially life at this time in history, when drugs are so prevalent and yet illegal.

that's alright. I get it. its fun to pick on the weak.

yer a fukin punk

[-] 0 points by Thrasymaque (-2138) 7 years ago

What lie? I never lied to them.

[-] 2 points by riethc (1149) 7 years ago

"Truthers" are a pretty broad group. The blending of fact, fiction, and speculation is what really characterizes them. But I see this as a common human behavior. The only thing that makes them different in this is that they do this blending to an extreme degree.

If "Truthers" were smart about it, they would simply point out the flaws in the 9/11 investigation, showing the need for a better investigation.

[-] 1 points by Thrasymaque (-2138) 7 years ago

Very good comment. I agree 100%.

[-] 1 points by riethc (1149) 7 years ago

A real investigation would follow the money.

[-] 0 points by Thrasymaque (-2138) 7 years ago

Yeah, I don't understand why Truthers don't investigate using proper methods. Why they choose the David Icke way is beyond me.

[-] 1 points by gawdoftruth (3698) from Santa Barbara, CA 7 years ago

the people who are mentally ill are the ones who use such methods to discredit them. 911 was an inside job, and all of the evidence shows this. I can name all kinds of people who are in the illuminati. The truthers have been going on for ten years now because they are right, and sick and evil for people like you to slam them like this when they are the ones who are doing the real work of waking everyone up.

They have redundantly proven that 911 was an inside job, thousands of bits of evidence deep.

I think i begin to understand whats really going on. sheeple herders and minders like you are the problem, and why this site is crap and baloney.

you are proposing fascism, you are in fact proving whos side you are really on- take them away... you are no different than the evil con scam republicans who say the same thing about occupiers.

fascist fucktard.

[-] 0 points by Thrasymaque (-2138) 7 years ago

Please name some of the Illuminati and tell us how you were able to gather information about this ultra secret collective.

And, please, tell us why Truthers are so desperate if they have so much evidence? Why are they here posting to random strangers instead of publishing their evidence in more appropriate medias. They're committing suicide by doing this. Can't you see? You'd never catch a serious scientist trying to convince complete strangers in a random forum.

[-] 1 points by gawdoftruth (3698) from Santa Barbara, CA 7 years ago

behold the power of google. http://meetilluminatimembers.com/illuminati/

http://meetilluminatimembers.com/Topic/illuminati-members/

http://meetilluminatimembers.com/

These families (generally 17) are still in charge of society today through many fronts. High level government officials, CEO’s of major multinational conglomerate corporations, heads of colleges, many religious leaders, military generals, titans of industry are all chosen and put in place by the specific design of Illuminati members.

These 17 families include:

  1. Astor

  2. Bundy

  3. Collins

  4. DuPont

  5. Freeman

  6. Kennedy

  7. Li (Chinese)

  8. Onassis

  9. Rockefeller

  10. Rothschild

  11. Russell

  12. Van Duyn

  13. Merovingian (European Bloodlines)

  14. Reynolds

  15. Disney

  16. Krupp

  17. McDonald


truthers are desperate because evil basterds like you demonize them and ignore the evidence. Why are they here? because we are fighting oligarchy and this is one of the grand crimes of oligarchy. I keep trying to get them into more appropriate media. Send them to the wiki. But i won't stand by while you slander them. Yeah, i understand that this is not the way to win the 98 percent over. So? Does that give you or me the right to demonize them? I AM a serious scientist, i have a 180 IQ and enough factual simulations expertise to know the moment i saw the towers fall that internal demolitions were involved. Are you going to call me insane and demonize me now? I was calling foul on 911 the DAY AFTER IT HAPPENED. Most of these truthers were not to get involved until years after. Yeah, they make me feel like not admitting that I started their movement with how they conduct themselves. But You aren't asking them to go to the wiki. You are calling them NAMES.

Grow up, and have a new adult message. which is; take this to the wiki, the forum can't handle the social bandwidth.

please. thank you.

[-] -1 points by Thrasymaque (-2138) 7 years ago

I demonize them because they suffer from a mental disease that is dangerously contagious. Look at Zendog, he just fell ill. He is now piling up assumptions like you are. If they want to make idiotic claims on the forum, they have to understand I will call them idiots.

I don't consider calling an idiot an idiot name calling.