Forum Post: This kind of shit is doomed to happen
Posted 12 years ago on Dec. 6, 2011, 11:01 p.m. EST by rightniche
(12)
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The failure of economy, the loss of jobs, the foreclosures of homes...this kind of shit is doomed to happen. There is no way to prevent this kind of shit from happening when the world's people have long come to terms with the modern ways of life. Corruption and the 1% are problems, but they are not THE problem because they are always there and there is no worldly solution. If possible at all, the best way we can do is that some people live otherwise willingly and rationally and help each other. I really don't think yelling against the 1% is of much help and I really hope the voices about influencing people ourselves get stronger.
Now there is a movement against the foreclosures of homes, but why we took out loans in the first place? It is the way it is, but from the perspective of the truth, it is us ourselves who let this shit happen.
I don't want to say the bullshit like everybody should do this or that. Some people, I mean, try their best to make some differences, define some kind of peace of mind or happiness and give other people some inspiration. I truly think this is the best we can do.
By the way, please excuse my poor English. I'm not American.
I'm criticizing the consumption culture of the world. I mentioned many people taking out loans to buy apartment houses (a typical loan to get an apartment house probably is more than 30 years ) because a funny fact is many people don't actually need them and it seems all of a sudden people have become some kind of investing businessmen when they live still like underdogs, some rich people doing so and many grass-root people following suit. It is just the way it is here in my country, and more and more people "have to" buy cars not because they don't want to commute or they can easily afford cars but they want some kind of sense of being important or middle class or just to keep up with others. You people might not know how expensive it is to buy a car and drive a car here in my country. When so many such people have cars, they drive and honk car horns like maniacs. This pattern may be much the same in many countries, but the problem is how much under-paid people are willing to buy things they don't know they actually don't need when those things are so expensive. This pattern might be much the same in many countries, but the problem is the degree. This is clearly a result of the twisted consumption culture in an instance of trickle down economy.
Whether you agree with this or not, you Americans are a strong people, at least much better than people in my country where there is way much more ignorance and way much less freedom. You kind of have the responsibility to make some differences to inspire the world at least because you can.
it was a fraudulent lending scheme, set up by the lenders.
There is a DA in Boston pursuing charges against some of the lenders
The head of CountryWide out of California has already been fined over $20 million USD over his role - while walking away with over $80 million more, he has yet to face a criminal court, but I insist he shall.
Don't keep spreading the myth that it was entirely the borrowers fault, it isn't true, and suggests there is nothing we can do.
Both points are completely false.
Why wouldn't you take out a cheap loan?
Its not like most people were aware they were being scammed.
Just like American being a free country, the current consumption culture of the world is a "free culture". We can rightly take out loans and use credit card to consume so much as we like. But is this really a righteous pursuit of humanity?
The truth about life is actually very simple and have way gone astray too far? It is true there are people who still adhere very hard to some old doctrines about living a real human life, but such people are just so low profile and scattered. I don't know how it is in America, at least it is very much so in my country. I truly hope to see something high-profile and inspiring out of this movement that help refind the truth of life.
Of course this is not the only goal of this movement, but I think at least it should be one. I don't know if I should say I do have some faith in you American people and I think you do see yourselves as a leading people in this world. So, please be one.
If you understand the problems in my country, you know they are much worse than what you are up against today. In my country, the problem of unemployment is as bad, most people are under paid and under appreciated, but the strange thing is that there is no failure of economy. Currently people have little faith in anything other than such things as money and rich or middle class lifestyle. They may give up many other kinds of happiness only to look successful and rich. You might say people are the same everywhere, but it is the similarity of choices and behaviors that is really a very bad problem. You know why there is no crisis in my country? The government is controlling the media, and people can't hear that many pessimistic opinions about the problems of economy, and to make it even worse, most people are simple-minded and single-minded.
The problem most people don't understand is the problems faced by the low-wage workers here in America. Even a lot of our own people don't understand the challenges they face, or turn a blind eye to it. Their classic defense is to blame these people for their own problems, while ignoring both their own moral responsibility, and the workings of the very system these workers are fighting against.
People see the wages here compared to other countries or compare it to what it was in other decades in America, and say - how can these people want more? They're being greedy/They must be buying things they have no need of/They must be lazy/They want handouts/etc. But the truth is, the prices here are so high, that this "high" low wage can now afford them less and less. These people go without housing, food, electricity, medicine and health care, etc. And they're working and earning a paycheck the whole time.
A typical loan to get a house is 30 years. But it's not so simple as to say - so save 30 years because they'd never be able to. To rent is the same price as the payments on these loans to buy. So the money they would be putting into buying, they are putting into renting. So without that loan, they'd never have a house.
Then the economy took a downward spiral, people lost work and couldn't pay, or accepted jobs that paid less and couldn't afford the whole payment. The banks wouldn't make deals with them, and instead said get out. Even though, in some cases, they'd gotten over half or even three-quarters of the agreed upon amount. Then they turned around and sold it or rented it, making more money while these people were forced to live in the streets.
The problem with the housing is the same with everything. If you want a car, you have to take out a loan. (And sometimes the only way to get to where your job is located here is to have a car, so it leaves them with no choice but to have another loan. People commute many long hours from where they were able to get hired compared to where they were able to get housing.) Then there's the infamous - "They didn't get better education so that's why they're in this position" - but how do you get better education? A loan.
It's an insidious rat race, where the only winners are the banks, and the companies who long ago decided it's more important to pad their pockets instead of pay their people what they need to survive.
People took out loans (they probably shouldn't have) with the expectation that they would maintain their income levels and be able to pay.
When Big Business moved overseas, and Big Brokers pilfered The Trust, and Big Government squandered the money, and Big Banks devalued the currency...
Guess who was left holding the bag?
When homes began to be alarmingly expensive in my country, some economist came out to say coldly "if you can't afford it, don't buy it.", and he was heavily criticized. On the other hand, you have no idea how much we have to cut back on now and in the future to buy a home but how much many people just have to buy it. Men kind of have to get married before certain age and they kind of have to buy a home to get a girl to marry him. And now comes the same thing about cars. This looks exactly like the "American dream". When things like education, environment, and health care still suck very much, and people are still poorly paid, more and more urban young women in this country sound just like those in "sex and city". I don't know how to judge and explain this, but there is definitely something wrong. Or I'd like to refer to a heated word "trickle down economy". What is trickling down is not money but something is pouring down. It is the love of money and power and a soul-destroying consumption culture.
"It is the love of money and power and a soul-destroying consumption culture."
Yes.
It is always a wisdom to save today and spend tomorrow. I can't help thinking how ridiculous things are with the world's people, when seeing the American way of middle-class life is massively challenged and in my country many people who can hardly afford a home even if they save today and don't spend tomorrow still work their ass out and borrow money to buy things that make them look middle class.
While I understand your critique of consumerism (at least i think I do), and it is correct by itself, there are certain things you may not know.
Many of the people who lost their homes due to interest payments they could not afford wer lied to outright by the banks. They were NOT told that their payments would increase 4 times as high in 4 years They were not educated, and did not understand the legal language of the agreements they signed. Even many professional lawyers didn't understand those agreements, which were written precisely to confuse people.
Not al the people being effected by the recession bought anything at all that would put them at risk. When the economy collapsed, millions upon millions of people who had done nothing wring, were not involved in excess consumer sending, lost their jobs. In tis country, if you lose your job and miss one single payment on a home you have owned for 29 years, the banks can still throw you out onto the street.
Also in this country, if you don't have an employer, you don't have health insurance. Since health care is private here, you can die without it. 45.000 people every year die because of a lack of insurance.
Right now, there is only one job available for every four people who need one. People who have worked honestly their whole lives cannot support themselves. They WANT to work, but the jobs are not there.
And the Government, held hostage by a right wing that only wants more for the rich, is not creating jobs, even temporary ones, that will help people not only eat, but regain their dignity.
Hard working retirees, in their seventies and eighties, who worked their whole lives, and were finally hoping to enjoy their old age, have had their retirement wiped out by the economic collapse they did not cause. These elderly people have no options but to be poor again, often choosing between medicine and food. After working all those years in good faith, many of them are hungry and destitute.
I know that we are seen by the world as a wealthy country, and in many ways we are. But that is mostly true only for the top quintile of people. Many people do not earn enough to feed themselves or their children, and get only limited help from the government. The gap here between rich and poor is the largest of any developed country in the world.
And the poor are SO poor that in East Harlem and other poor neighbor hoods, the infant mortality rate is higher than in Calcutta.
This is not their fault, but the fault of a system that has made sure the rich get richer and the poor get poorer year in and year out. And it is a system that effectively silences them, makes their voices impotent. those with the money have the ears of those with the power, everyone else has nothing. Our democracy used to be an example to the world we could be proud of. Millions of our young people fought wars and died to defend it. But now we have gone back to the era of kings who rule as they wish, without fear of consequence. Those kings wear no crowns, instead they wear corporate name tags.
I am not blaming any specific people. Yes it is true that people are "lied to" but how much eager are we to find out about the truth? In some sense, good economic times can easily numb people's minds and we just don't want to listen to the truth.
However bad the "rat race" is and however your democracy has changed, you are very lucky to be the citizens of one of the greatest nations where there are people who have different voices and have-nots still have their cultures and art. I believe American people can do some differences to the world.
I agree that there is much to be grateful for.
But I am also telling you the truth that babies die here at higher rates than in the third world if they are born to poor families, And tens of thousand s of people die because they can have no access to medicines. (I am facing that possibility myself right now.)
I do NOT agree with the implication that people were too lazy to find out what the papers they signed meant. Even experts had trouble understanding those papers. The blame lies 100% on the banks. Period.
I think you have a lovely, rosy picture of America. I wish it was a clearer, more accurate picture than the hard, selfish money-controlled country it has become.
I don't think I have any rosy picture of America. I totally agree that it is a "hard, selfish money-controlled country", but whose country is not? This is happening to the whole world. Believe it or not, some countries can even be nearly nothing other than "money-controlled". This I am afraid is what my country is turning into.
May I ask what country you are in?
I am curious.
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