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Forum Post: This Is What Class Warfare Looks Like

Posted 6 months ago on Oct. 6, 2013, 12:36 p.m. EST by ZenDog (20508) from South Burlington, VT
This content is user submitted and not an official statement

I've seen some argue that the Civil War was unnecessary, that the issue of slavery could have been resolved in some other way. I do not believe that to be true - for an entire social and economic structure had grown up around slavery, and concerted efforts were at that time underway to export slavery to new territories, thus demonstrating the depth of commitment to an injustice codified in law of epic proportions - it could not be relinquished without wholesale slaughter on an epic scale.

The ship of state today has been threatened with mutiny, and an argument has been put forth that this current mutiny has its roots in slavery.

I say that, as with slavery, it will not be retaken except by force.

Three decades ago a small handful of men set about stacking the Supreme Court with appointees sympathetic to the interests of money. Today we have a supreme court ruling called Citizens United, which permits the subjugation of Congressional leaders to the interests of money and does so at some considerable expense - what others would call hardship and suffering - to the people these elected officials are sworn to serve.

We see this clearly with the current shutdown of the federal government. A small minority stands in the house and insists this could all be over if only they get their way. A much larger segment within the house remains cowed, afraid to sign anything against the will of the House leadership.

All of this in the name of fiscal conservatism in yet one more attempt to delay the Affordable Care Act, or so it is said. And this at a cost estimated at upwards of $300 million each day. This on top of the $54 million already spent attempting to repeal the Affordable Care Act.

I say this is no longer about health insurance, if it ever was. This is about hubris, the kind of hubris that can produce a government shutdown as an end in itself.

This has been a long time in coming, and will not be rectified without massive amounts of blood.

Red.

American.

Blood.

Some might insist that this is no more than advocacy masked as hyperbole. I call it analysis. Consider: thanks to Citizens United, we find the creation, or the expansion, of that segment of politics we might call marketing. This creates an economic dependence.

At one time it used to be against the law to falsely advertise a product, or to engage in fraudulent marketing strategies. Yet it is, today, perfectly legal to employ any of these methods that are or that were illegal in the marketing of goods and services, to the marketing of politicians and their ideas.

This too, creates economic dependence. For without the deceit of fraud, the ideas of many of these politicians, as with the politicians themselves, would not be marketable.

This is, then, not simply economic dependence, but the means to power. It is the preferred route of the Conservative ideologue and their standard bearers; one that no longer hinges on ideas but rather on money and its expenditure harnessed to the production of lies.

Like slavery, this process will not be relinquished without the utter destruction of a majority of those who have brought it about, and they will be quite content to defend it, and do so with our lives.

If we are to stop this entire process, which is much larger than the present instance of government shutdown itself, then:

  • we must eliminate those who most clearly support it by material means for political or material gain.

.

d.



  1. Dumbest extortion attempt ever: Republican scheme’s perverse logic

    • By Brian Beutler | October 4, 2013 | Salon.com
  2. How GOP Extortion Is Rooted in Southern Slavery

    • By Robert Parry | October 3, 2013 | AlterNet.org
  3. Trailer to the documentary: Inside Job, by Charles Ferguson

  4. Sen. Bernie Sanders Explains How The Koch Brothers Are Keeping The Government Shut Down

    • By Jason Easley | October 4th, 2013 | Politicususa
  5. House Democrats Unveil Discharge Petition To Force End To Shutdown

    • By Jennifer Bendery | October 4, 2013 | Huffingtonpost.com
  6. Rachel Maddow: Republican Shutdown Evil And Planned (VIDEO)

    • Rachel Maddow | October 1, 2013 | DailyKos.com
  7. NBC's Chuck Todd causes Obamacare firestorm

    • By Matthew Emmer | September 19, 2013 | Examiner.com

See Also:

A bit of Activism, courtesy of Politicususa.com:

60 Comments

60 Comments


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[-] 2 points by ZenDog (20508) from South Burlington, VT 6 months ago

I do not see any holes in that reasoning.

Anyone?

[-] 0 points by MattLHolck (16833) from San Diego, CA 6 months ago

slavery did not make the economy

it just made slave owners wealthy

[-] 1 points by ZenDog (20508) from South Burlington, VT 6 months ago

I don't think I suggested otherwise.

[-] 2 points by equibble (34) from East Point, GA 6 months ago

sad but too true!

[-] 1 points by FrenchFontes (23) 6 months ago

The only way to defeat the Capitalist oppressors who want nothing more than to exploit the 99% is REVOLUTION. Just like Marx and Lenin say.

[-] 1 points by ZenDog (20508) from South Burlington, VT 6 months ago

I firmly believe too big to fail must be broken into many pieces. Toward that end we require an entirely different economic theory and practice.

I'm not at all convinced that either communism or socialism in and of themselves contain alternatives that lend themselves to anything that can be termed cultural success.

Cultural success is itself a term that requires definition, thus setting the goal for a social construct to aim at, around which political theory may grow.

[Removed]

[-] 1 points by ZenDog (20508) from South Burlington, VT 6 months ago

the fukers should be lined up and shot

  • published on September 18th by Media Matters, headlining "Candid Camera: Behind the Scenes Video at 9/12 Protest Shows Fox News Producer Coaching Crowd," and reported -- and presented videos of -- a Fox "News" producer off-camera giving the crowd a sign to applaud, at the same moment when a Fox "News" "reporter," on-camera, was "reporting" to its millions of suckers throughout America, as the crowd behind him applauded a politician who was urging the on-camera crowd of suckers to "renew that pledge" made "so long ago" by America's Founders, who would actually have been rolling over in their graves to know that a modern version of mass-manipulation, feudalism or fascism, was now being marketed in their names. Two days later, Michael Calderone at Politico headlined "Fox News Producer Rallied Tea Party Protesters," and reported: "Now Fox confirms that it was, indeed, a staffer," who had been giving the off-camera cues at this staged event, which Fox "News" had telecast as being an authentic grassroots protest against the President.

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[-] 1 points by ZenDog (20508) from South Burlington, VT 6 months ago

This is fuked:

  • The Ames/Levine article was perhaps the most important and most skillful piece of investigative journalism in years, but it was so hot that even Playboy would be too mainstream a news-medium to remain associated with it, even as a mere blog item.
[-] 1 points by ZenDog (20508) from South Burlington, VT 6 months ago

ooo, I don't have time at the moment. But I'm gonna look at that a bit later.

[-] 2 points by ZenDog (20508) from South Burlington, VT 6 months ago

I wish they would. The nation would really benefit from using those two fools to set a very graphic example.

you cannot hitch selfish to stupid, provide it with an organizational structure with which to peddle influence, and expect the social structure to continue to function. IT JUST DOESN'T WORK THAT WAY.

[-] 1 points by shooz (26680) 6 months ago

Perhaps it does, but only if you consider each corporate entity as a fully formed "super citizen", which you can be assured, is the way they look at it.

[-] 1 points by ZenDog (20508) from South Burlington, VT 6 months ago

I'm sure the kochsuckers haven't really thought this through. At least to me it appears to me more about ego and their narrow minded bigotry than it is anything else.

Certain industries do find it useful - fossil fuel/banking/and wall street. O wait. Maybe that means they have thought it through. Maybe they figure that as long as the investments remain in fossil fuels, and as long as the government cannot legislate, then the major market players can easily weather any government shutdown just because - fossil fuels remain not only in demand but become a de facto currency substitute.

But even so, they are still thinking very short term - their candidates cannot survive the next election in the face of default. So I really don't know what they can be thinking.

Maybe they are just giddy with excitement - that has been stated clearly by one of them.

The entire conservative movement has got to pay for this. The nation cannot be run this way.

[-] 1 points by shooz (26680) 6 months ago

While the circus they created in Congress distracts, the teabagge(R)s are still very busy legislating for ALEC in the various States.

Bernie, is one of the few who come close to understanding the roll of the highly libe(R)tarian Koch interests.

To what end? I don't know, but they are anything but stupid.

http://www.politicususa.com/2013/10/07/bernie-sanders-terrifies-koch-brothers-outting-role-government-shutdown.html

[-] 0 points by MattLHolck (16833) from San Diego, CA 6 months ago

{if everybody had a dollar}

we could vote on the direction of our economy

[-] 1 points by shooz (26680) 6 months ago

If only it were that simple.

[-] 0 points by MattLHolck (16833) from San Diego, CA 6 months ago

tax the money from where it gathers

those that want to remain rich will continue to work to get the public's dollar

[-] 1 points by shooz (26680) 6 months ago

Tax the rich.

I've been saying that for a while now.

Others just want to tear down everything, and that creates more pain for the 99%. In fact, it reminds me of current (R)epelican't thinking.

Therefore I oppose that thinking, in all it's forms.

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[-] 1 points by WSmith (5271) from Cornelius, OR 6 months ago

A war is raging on a people who think it was something they ate, the latest flu, the neighbor's dog, welfare queens, pan handler millionaires, tax & spend liberals, any one or thing in eye shot or on TV ~ while out of sight, behind mansion & boardroom walls, 1% of 1% Kings send orders to their GOP generals: "Keep them fighting each other! Make them hate their own government! Make sure the redistribution of wealth never stops flowing to us!"

[-] 1 points by ZenDog (20508) from South Burlington, VT 6 months ago

o no, that's not what they say that's just what happens

and they smile

[-] 1 points by WSmith (5271) from Cornelius, OR 6 months ago

Light the torch

[-] 2 points by ZenDog (20508) from South Burlington, VT 6 months ago

I think they already did and just don't know it yet - and if I am correct the longer it takes for them to notice the worse it will burn them

[-] 1 points by WSmith (5271) from Cornelius, OR 6 months ago

May they twist ever so slowly ~ and slowly more ~ in the wind!

[-] 2 points by ZenDog (20508) from South Burlington, VT 6 months ago

after a nice short drop - I wanna see'm twitch

[-] 1 points by WSmith (5271) from Cornelius, OR 6 months ago

Too quick!

Watch the horror slowly rising on their face as the Rodeo GOP-bags lasso Guvmint with their sadistic Shutdown now sob having caught their necks in thier noose: Twist Slowly In The Wind.

[-] 2 points by ZenDog (20508) from South Burlington, VT 6 months ago

yeah-ya - I'd like ta

[Removed]

[-] 1 points by agkaiser (1299) from Fredericksburg, TX 6 months ago

Is that a prediction or encouragement?

Either way, it can't come too soon!

[-] 3 points by ZenDog (20508) from South Burlington, VT 6 months ago

is there a difference?

I prefer to think of it as an . . . assessment.

Much of the bullshit of the past three years is supported by people in the fossil fuel industry, I am certain, and supported as a strategy of stalling and distracting Congress from any considerations regarding energy policy or the impact of fossil fuel consumption on climate.

That is I am sure not the only consideration nor the only source of support for this bullshit.

But in the midst of all of this we find, thanks to Citizens United, the creation, or the expansion, of that segment of politics we might call marketing. This creates an economic dependence.

At one time it used to be against the law to falsely advertise a product, or to engage in fraudulent marketing strategies. Yet it is, today, perfectly legal to employ any of these methods that are or that were illegal in the marketing of goods and services, to the marketing of politicians and their ideas.

This too, creates economic dependence. For without the deceit of fraud, the ideas of many of these politicians, as with the politicians themselves, would not be marketable.

This is, then, not simply economic dependence, but the means to power. It is one that no longer hinges on ideas but rather on money and its expenditure.

Like slavery, this process will not be relinquished without the utter destruction of a majority of those who have brought it about, and they will be quite content to defend it, with our lives.

If we are to stop this entire process, which is much larger than the present instance of government shutdown itself, then we must eliminate those who most clearly support it by material means for political or material gain.

.

thanks. I think that is what I was looking for.

[-] 2 points by agkaiser (1299) from Fredericksburg, TX 6 months ago

the warming planet probably is the greatest threat the rich and their principal servants pose to our survival but it may not be the most imminent.

I think the proximate threat to 90% of the American people is outsourcing that threatens to deprive us of the purchasing power to acquire the things we need to live even on a relatively cool planet. Ironically, it must also take down a big % of the rich and sycophants who sell the stuff we're less and less able to buy.

And the idiots call themselves the "best and brightest."

[-] 2 points by ZenDog (20508) from South Burlington, VT 6 months ago

what I was saying was that the most imminent threat to our survival is this current method of Govern by Crisis - it prevents any rational debate, let alone reasonable legislation, from taking place.

The nature of Global Warming is such that the decisions we make today may have their greatest impact 150 years from now - and we might not see that in an undeniable way for 20 - 50 years - and by then it will be too late.

The damage will have been done, and there may be no remediation. Geo-engineering isn't likely to provide the complete solution they are looking for.

.

and in the mean time these rich fukers are complaining they pay 16% on their taxes. This is no more than an exercise in class warfare, with long term consequences if we do not deal with it.

[-] 1 points by WSmith (5271) from Cornelius, OR 6 months ago

AKA Shock Doctrine

[-] 1 points by ZenDog (20508) from South Burlington, VT 6 months ago

very similar, same principles I think, but a little different, neither as effective or viable under the circumstances, in that it is an internally created crisis that is obviously intended to benefit those who created it.

Governing by Crisis is perhaps a better term.

[-] 1 points by WSmith (5271) from Cornelius, OR 6 months ago

contrarian

[-] 2 points by ZenDog (20508) from South Burlington, VT 6 months ago

you must have read the LA Times article

  • "Most of the messages I'm getting from Texas are: 'Hang on, you're doing the right thing,'" said Rep. Blake Farenthold (R-Texas), the attorney-turned-radio-host who pushed out a 14-term Democrat.

  • "We are not a bunch of hardheaded fools," added Farenthold, a friendly, robust man with a bushy mop of dark hair. His goal is not to "kick and scream," he said, but to "get the economy fixed."

looks like some kind of new stupid to me.

[-] 2 points by WSmith (5271) from Cornelius, OR 6 months ago

These are the Zombies who react on cue or dog whistle (or the hunger for brains). The STRATEGY is Shock Doctrine ~ crisis/disaster enabled-fueled-motivated-smokescreened anarchy, fascism, exploitation, theft, totalitarianism and vulture capitalism.

How many dirty deals are going unnoticed as they flagrantly usurp our government?

[-] 1 points by MattLHolck (16833) from San Diego, CA 6 months ago

see's the world as opposing sides ?

[-] 1 points by WSmith (5271) from Cornelius, OR 6 months ago

Who doesn't?

[-] 1 points by MattLHolck (16833) from San Diego, CA 6 months ago

we are surrounded by our environment

[-] 1 points by WSmith (5271) from Cornelius, OR 6 months ago

and oblivion

[+] -4 points by Narley (-634) 6 months ago

Aw jeez, You internet tough guys, wanting to start a war, beating your chest and talking trash make me realize how dumb some people are. So here’s a couple of things to think about before you start shooting citizens.

  1. There are an estimated 300 million guns and an estimated 80 million gun owners in the US. Most are owned by conservatives. To a lot of these people it’s a foregone conclusion that society will fail; and they are preparing for it. There’s hundreds of web sites, books and magazines specifically about how to prepare and survive the coming collapse. The best selling gun in America today is the AR-15 battle rifle. This is not just a small fringe group. There are tens of millions people gearing up for a fight. Almost everyone one of them are staunch conservative.

  2. The US is a large country. The logistics of mounting an armed conflict is insurmountable in such a large area. War is no longer two armies facing each other on the battle field. It’s guerilla warfare, meaning block to block fighting. Hit strategic targets and run. No one side can control much territory.

  3. While there are radicalized people on both the left and right. The masses aren’t radical. They will act in self interest rather than join in either side.

When I hear some Starbucks hipster talking about taking up arms I know they don’t have any military training, no understanding of military tactics or logistics. Just some loser who has no idea what they’re talking about.

Here’s a couple of my favorite Youtube videos about who will die first when SHTF.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J42CLa5iATM

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hSQVr2MHS7c

[-] 1 points by shooz (26680) 6 months ago

You found a whack 'a' doodle nurse too?

She really likes it over at Becks site. for real, she does get a lot of lpay there.

http://autismum.com/2012/01/17/the-patriot-nurse/

She's still a whack 'a' doodle, that loves what they've done to N. Carolina too.

She'd make a wonderful Waco neighbor for Terrible Teddy.

So what exactly, does SHTF consist of?

Sounds to me like she is anxiously trying to bring it on.

[-] -2 points by Narley (-634) 6 months ago

SHTF is any event where services and resources cease to exist. Could be a small as a weather event (flood, blizzard, hurricane, etc) that knocks out power, disrupts food and fuel delivery for a few days. Could be a big as an earthquake that cuts off resources for weeks. Could be civil unrest where you may have to defend yourself. SHTF comes in all shapes and sizes.

Surely you don't begrudge people for wanting to be prepared?

[-] 2 points by GirlFriday (21783) 6 months ago

You mean like NOAA, amiright?

[-] -2 points by Narley (-634) 6 months ago

I assume you mean the National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration. They don't cause disasters, their job is to report on them.

[-] 2 points by GirlFriday (21783) 6 months ago

Well, actually, what I mean is that you pretty much need that information to plan for several different types of disasters. Unfortunately, their site is down too. Wanna know why?

[+] -4 points by Narley (-634) 6 months ago

Let me guess. It's because the government is shut down. But generally NOAA isn't the only way people way people find out about potential bad weather situations. In fact i seems they're the last to know.

[-] 2 points by GirlFriday (21783) 6 months ago

Does it hurt when you do that?

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[-] 1 points by shooz (26680) 6 months ago

So would this be an example of common knowledge?

Was it her insistent posting on the Beck site that makes it so?

Or perhaps it's just an Alex Jones kind of thing?

How does she feel about global warming?

It sounded to me like she was just looking for some poor people to shoot at with her fellow "preppers".

Does she also blame them for their predicaments?

So many questions and so few answers.

[-] -3 points by Narley (-634) 6 months ago

If you don't like what she says, then don't watch her videos. I have no idea what her views are on global warming. It's not pertinent to this discussion. Sounded like she was telling people they have to protect themselves during a SHTF event.

As for Alex Jones, No one takes him seriously. He makes his living being a nut case.

[-] 1 points by shooz (26680) 6 months ago

She might as well be hiding from bigfoot.

Like Alex, she is a marketing campaign for the prepper supply industries.

The Paul's take Alex very seriously, he's their biggest fan.

You too, support much what he says, without even realizing it..

[-] -2 points by Narley (-634) 6 months ago

You're joking, Right? Nobody takes Alex Jones seriously. Ans saying I somehow unknowingly support him is just your way of trying to bait me.

[-] 1 points by shooz (26680) 6 months ago

There's people here, even now, that take Alex seriously.

Did you miss that?

Is it you, trying to bait me?? Again???

Besides, Alex is the original Prepper promoter.

So yes, even you support parts of his "platform".

[-] -1 points by Narley (-634) 6 months ago

I haven't seen anyone here support Alex Jones. Guess I missed it.

Is Alex a prepper? I didn't know that. I'm not a prepper, although I can understand why it might be a good idea. If Alex wants to be a prepper that's OK with me. It's a free country.

[-] 1 points by shooz (26680) 6 months ago

Freer for some, more than others.

[-] -1 points by HCHC4 (-28) 6 months ago

" thanks to Citizens United, we find the creation, or the expansion, of that segment of politics we might call marketing. This creates an economic dependence."

Its been that way since day one. This isnt anything new. The entire system is screwed, play more commercials or dont play any at all. It doesn change what the results are.

Election season is just something to make a slight few feel like they have a say. The other 700+ days prove they dont.

[-] -2 points by MattLHolck (16833) from San Diego, CA 6 months ago

yep and the violent will stay in power as long as we declare wars

don't call politics and currency cheating war

[-] 2 points by ZenDog (20508) from South Burlington, VT 6 months ago

I am not the one who stated that war was merely an extension of either, but it has been said.

Only a fool would deny it.

[-] -1 points by MattLHolck (16833) from San Diego, CA 6 months ago

no need for ta bad metaphor