Forum Post: The Real "Takers"
Posted 11 years ago on Sept. 27, 2012, 8:21 p.m. EST by UntilUKnow
(35)
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Here are the real “Takers” (aka:the face of the One Percent). Check this site out: SECForm4.com Info derived from the SEC's EDGAR database. It’s a site that allows traders to track Trading Activity for Insiders. You know, Board Members like CEO’s, Directors, VP’s, and others, who are supposed to be "Investors". But when you take a look, you'll see that most of them have not put up a penny. These people are NOT Investors. It's just plain GIVEN to them as Options, Gifts, or Awards. In "addition" to what they are paid for their Corporate roles. And when you see the amount of $$$, you won't believe it! You do not have to be a trader to figure this out, When Romney began his run for President, I decided to look into his baby. You know, BAIN! Man oh man, talk about the “bane” of mankind? I've seen a lot of companies on this site, but Bain is a whole different animal. Just do this: Go to http://www.secform4.com/insider-trading Type BAIN into the “Search by Company or Insider Name” box. Click “Search”. When your browser appears, click on the first link. When it takes you back to SECForm4, choose “All Data” in the top left box. Like I said, you don’t have to be a trader to understand what’s going on. Especially when you realize that all this $$$ is only taxed at 15%. Yup, that’s what they call CAPITAL GAINS! You know, what Romney & Ryan want to drop down to 0%. Zero tax. NOTHING! Bain happens to be Romney’s baby. He created it, along with their MO. But there are thousands of other Bains out there. Maybe not quite as bad, but take a look for yourself and you be the judge. Just plug in any public corporation’s name and see for yourself. Make you wonder, just how much is enough?
Okay. So vote for master Obama and we will have some form of paradise.
So let me ask - are you condeming Baine because they put all these companies into business or you condeming Baine because they receive capital gains on the "invested money" after taxes were paid on the profits?
What I see when I looked at the charts was quite a few businesses that employ people across the country. Think we should shut these businesses down and put these people on unemployment?
We can add them to the 47%ers who are without a job now.
I don't think you understand the point I'm trying to make. I used Bain as an example because it and Romney/Ryan are at the forefront of this Once Percent subject and that their return on investment for all the companies you see for the last 10 years is PROFANE. They in fact, DID NOT "put all these companies into business". They used these companies to "extract" $$$. The only money they actually "invested" is listed in the Total Buys near the column headers. So for Bain the Total Buys were over 18 million. That's it. Nothing more. Yet their Total Sales were over 6 BILLION. If you look at the return on investment for that 18 billion, it is astronomical. Where do you think all that money came from? But hey, it's not just Bain, it's just about every corp out there today. I used to watch this site because as their motto states "Insiders might sell their shares for any number of reasons, but they buy them for only one: they think the price will rise." Well very few Insiders ever buy any more. They just siphon cash out in the form of being GIVEN Option, or out and out Gifts or Awards of stock. No investment. No risk. Just drain the corp and appurtenant profit produced by the actual workers, and then walk away. And Bain is one of the worst. You don't believe me, just take a look at any other company and you'll see the same pattern. The ratio of Total Buys to Total Sales is infintismal. And that is my point.
Well from what Romney said is that Baine invested in companies so that Baine could make money - what's wrong with doing that.
If I had money to invest in a company I would want a return on my investment just like people do who invest millions in stock markets, other businesses and anything else they could invest in to make profits.
That's what this country is all about and if people have a problem with it then maybe they should move to a country where the government controls businesess and how much money they make.
Take a look at the ratio of Buys to actual Sales; 18 million to 6 billion. That's not investment. These people are GIVEN this money. And NOT because they earned it. I'm aware of what a Board Member's responsibilities are. It is a secondary function to their primary roles in a Corp. They are compensated separately for those roles, as well as their role as a board member. But the practice of GIVING them millions of dollars (often hundreds of millions) has created this group culture of "Takers". I spell out a lot more details in my post entited "These are the Faces of the One Percent".
So tell us, do you think all those businesses that Baine invested in would be here today? I don't think so - look at the overall picture - how much of an impact would there be on the economy without those businesses?
I'm sorry but I think you still don't get it. But you're not the only one, and I think that's the problem. If you do as I suggest in my initial post and go to SECFORM4.com and enter the name of any public company you'd like into that bottom box.Then take click on the first link when you're browser pops up. This will take you back to SECFORM4.com. The choose All Data in that Select Time Period box. Now take a look towards the top of the page just above all the columns where it lists "Total buys", "Total sales", and "Net total". Totals buys means that these Insiders actually put $$$ up. In other words, they INVESTED. But as you can see, proportionate to Total Sales, there are very few total buys. So how do you think someone can Sell more than they Buy? If you click on any one of those Insider names in the "Insider Relationship" column you will see it's because these shares are GIVEN to them in the form of Gifts, Awards, or Options. Actually they are given to them by a majority vote by the other Board Members who also receive shares GIVEN to them. It's one big happy club. So these people, or in the case of Bain these blind trusts, LLC's, etc., all this money that has been GIVEN to them NOT INVESTED(BUY) is only taxed at 15%. And that is my main point. I mention Romney and Bain, because Romney is the prodige' of Jack Welch, the father of this game (Shareholder Maximization Model), and Romney is the creator of Bain Capitial, whose sole purpose as you can now see, is NOT to INVEST but to TAKE using shares that were GIVEN to them.
You didn't answer the question why shouldn't a person except a returne on money they invested?