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Forum Post: Syria - Noam Chomsky and Human Rights Watch

Posted 1 year ago on Aug. 6, 2012, 8:46 p.m. EST by ZenDog (20391) from South Burlington, VT
This content is user submitted and not an official statement

For those interested in the issue of Human Rights as it pertains to Syria - Human Rights Watch has their World Report 2012: Syria

Where topics include:

Killings of Protesters and Bystanders

Security forces and government-supported armed groups used violence, often lethal, to attack and disperse overwhelmingly peaceful anti-government protesters from mid-March onwards. The exact number of dead is impossible to verify due to restrictions on access, but local groups documented 3,500 civilian dead as of November 15.

Violations during Large-Scale Military Operations

Security forces conducted several large-scale military operations in restive towns and cities, resulting in mass killings, arrests, and detentions as well as the use of torture. In April tanks and armored personnel carriers imposed a siege on the city of Daraa for 11 days, killing at least 115 residents according to local activists. Daraa residents told Human Rights Watch that security forces occupied all neighborhoods, placed snipers on roofs of buildings across the city, and prevented any movement of residents by firing on those who tried to leave their homes. Security forces launched a massive arrest campaign, arbitrarily detaining hundreds. Released detainees said that security forces subjected them, as well as hundreds of others they saw in detention, to various forms of torture and degrading treatment.

Arbitrary Arrests, Enforced Disappearances, and Torture

Security forces subjected thousands of people to arbitrary arrests and widespread torture in detention. The exact numbers are impossible to verify but information that Human Rights Watch collected suggests that security forces detained more than 20,000 people between March and September. Many detainees were young men in their 20s or 30s; but children, women, and elderly people were also included. While the government appears to have released most after several days or weeks in detention, several hundred remained missing at this writing.



I get bashing American Imperialism - that's a no brainer.

But this level of hypocrisy isn't simply unacceptable - It's outrageous.

So what's Noam Say?

.



.

Noam Chomsky’s interview with Al-Jazeera on the Syrian revolution is a classic exposition of the first approach. Chomsky is very clear on his opposition to any military intervention, but in his case this does not involve him in justifying the regime, or in treating the principled motives behind the revolution as if they were suspect.

.



You people should get a clue - try using both hands . . .

56 Comments

56 Comments


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[-] 2 points by ZenDog (20391) from South Burlington, VT 1 year ago

Tweet that!



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and you can kiss my ass

[-] 2 points by ZenDog (20391) from South Burlington, VT 1 year ago

yOU people take hypocrisy to a whole new level

[-] 2 points by ZenDog (20391) from South Burlington, VT 1 year ago

BULLSHIT

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.

It's outsourcing stupid ??!!! - 0 comments 13 minutes ago by elf3

Laissez Fairyland - 6 comments 1 hour ago by PeterKropotkin

The wise Willie Sutton stated - "Because that's where the money is" - 4 comments 2 hours ago by bensdad

Use your strengths to make change! Spread the word of Jill Stein! - 1 comments 4 hours ago by robbyfox

Quinoa destroys Jared Diamond"s lies - 2 comments 5 hours ago by delayedgrat

What to Do: Something Local: Occupy National Night Out August 7 in your neighborhood, cultural events, fairs. - 3 comments 5 hours ago by gsw

lets mic check david gregory, jack welch (GE), lou gerstner (IBM), and bob wright (NBC) - 0 comments 7 hours ago by bobjr508atyahoocom

.



You get the picture - this post doesn't show up.

  • BULLSHIT
[-] 2 points by ZenDog (20391) from South Burlington, VT 1 year ago

This post doesn't even show up in the list.

That's bullshit. BULLSHIT I said. I guess I don't have an approved point of view.

  • fuck you
[-] 0 points by DKAtoday (33128) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 year ago

Thats weird one of my posts won't go to the top of the list and it is just a tension breaker / stress reliever. Two short videos of a kitten and the kittens buddy a dog playing.

[-] 0 points by ZenDog (20391) from South Burlington, VT 1 year ago

the mods have taken to censorship - but the repelican frauds get all the eye time they want

the fuckin scumbags

[-] 2 points by DKAtoday (33128) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 year ago

I wonder - maybe it is a rogue mod. Think I should try and send a contact to jart?

[-] 1 points by ZenDog (20391) from South Burlington, VT 1 year ago

do what you think is right man

[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (33128) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 year ago

Do me a favor and copy and try re-posting to see if it will come up on the list.

[-] 1 points by ZenDog (20391) from South Burlington, VT 1 year ago

this already is the second post - I renamed it and cannot now repost for two hours

and when I do post next, it'll be to say KISS MY ASS

[-] 2 points by shooz (26598) 1 year ago

I see no reason for blocking this thread.

So, I'll bump it

[-] 2 points by ZenDog (20391) from South Burlington, VT 1 year ago

It doesn't fit the current ideology that we are about to embark on yet another invasion of a foreign nation, it does not support the nation that we have not yet invaded, and runs completely contrary to the 4, 5, or 6 other pro syrian posts floating around here.

that's what is wrong with it.

That level of hypocrisy makes me furious.

I get bashing American Imperialism - I get that.

Doesn't change the fact that Assad is probably even now killing civilians:

[-] 2 points by shooz (26598) 1 year ago

It's not exactly an American exception. Imperialism.

I rarely comment on that area of the World, as I don't trust even my own opinion.

But I see no reason to block the thread.

[-] 2 points by ZenDog (20391) from South Burlington, VT 1 year ago

Look at all the pro Syrian posts -

here's one of the worst -

It's complete bullshit.

[-] 1 points by shadz66 (17690) 1 year ago

Waging War for 'Peace' & Pipelines ... now that is "complete bullshit" !!

ad iudicium ...

[-] 1 points by ZenDog (20391) from South Burlington, VT 1 year ago

That is a trite little bumper sticker - one that completely ignores the fact that in the case of Syria it is the Syrians themselves waging the war.

Not wanting new oil pipelines is no excuse to downplay acts of mass murder where they occur -

much less deny them in their entirety

[-] 1 points by shadz66 (17690) 1 year ago

"Intervention is now Driving Syria's Descent into Darkness" :

"Western and Gulf regime support for rebel fighters isn't bringing freedom to Syrians but escalating sectarian conflict and war",

By Seumas Milne.

fiat lux et fiat pax ...

[-] 2 points by ZenDog (20391) from South Burlington, VT 1 year ago

It is an interesting and cautionary perspective, well worth noting. There is also a bit of spin on it as well - the blatant suggestion that the U.S. is providing arms, which as I understand is what the rebels want from us and are not getting.

There is also the last sentence:

Only pressure for a negotiated settlement, which the west and its friends have so strenuously blocked, can now give Syrians the chance to determine their own future – and halt the country's descent into darkness.

How do you negotiate a settlement? I don't care if it is in this case, or some other like it? How do you do it, when one side refuses to budge?

[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (33128) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 year ago

I posted it does it show up on your screen?

[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (33128) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 year ago

I'll try to re-post it.

[-] 1 points by ZenDog (20391) from South Burlington, VT 1 year ago

President Newt announces the real reason for the Mars mission 0 comments 3 minutes ago by bensdad It's outsourcing stupid ??!!! 0 comments 52 minutes ago by elf3 Laissez Fairyland 6 comments 1 hour ago by PeterKropotkin The wise Willie Sutton stated -

nope

[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (33128) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 year ago

So strange I can see it at the top of my forum page.

[-] 1 points by ZenDog (20391) from South Burlington, VT 1 year ago

It isn't in the Forum List at left - and that may mean it is entirely hidden, unless a comment shows up in the comment list on the front forum page.

[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (33128) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 year ago

Shadow banned?

[-] 2 points by ZenDog (20391) from South Burlington, VT 1 year ago

that is my expectation -

meanwhile we have this post:

Complete bullshit, and NONSenseDuJour is a goddamned repelican

[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (33128) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 year ago

PM sent.

[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (33128) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 year ago

I'm gonna try a contact to jart as this does seem more then a little inside-ish.

[-] 2 points by ZenDog (20391) from South Burlington, VT 1 year ago

ya think?

[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (33128) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 year ago

I am gonna try to contact her as I have also noticed some weird down voting and figured it was one of the regular attackers - but now this shit - either the system has been hacked or someone has gone renegade or the forum is seriously fucked.

[-] 2 points by ZenDog (20391) from South Burlington, VT 1 year ago

Who ever happens to be acting the role of

  • thought police

can kiss my ass

[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (33128) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 year ago

What is truly weird is why a for chuckles kitten and dog video would be blocked. One thing that has always bothered me is that there seems to be an anti uppercase ( capitals ) use mod. You use caps for an expression modifier and this mod will shut you down.

[-] 0 points by TrevorMnemonic (5827) 1 year ago

It's at the top of the list now. That's how I got here. Sometimes the site runs slower than usual. I've seen it happen when I post. Sometimes it appears right away and sometimes it takes a minute or so.

You shouldn't jump to conclusions so fast.

[-] 1 points by ZenDog (20391) from South Burlington, VT 1 year ago

fuck you Trevor - I didn't just jump to any conclusion -

look at the time stamp

  • Posted 12 hours ago on Aug. 6, 2012, 8:46 p.m

then look at the list of posts -

It's outsourcing stupid ??!!! - 0 comments 13 minutes ago by elf3

Laissez Fairyland - 6 comments 1 hour ago by PeterKropotkin

The wise Willie Sutton stated - "Because that's where the money is" - 4 comments 2 hours ago by bensdad

Use your strengths to make change! Spread the word of Jill Stein! - 1 comments 4 hours ago by robbyfox

and then look at the time stamp of the post where I made that comment, which has this permalink

That comment came an hour after the post went up, and did not appear in the list.

Fuck you - I'm not stupid.

[-] 1 points by TrevorMnemonic (5827) 1 year ago

You're definitely being stupid.

Also you look at the time stamp lol

[-] 1 points by ZenDog (20391) from South Burlington, VT 1 year ago

15 hours ago as of now

at 12:50, 15 hours earlier would make it 9:50 pm

and the Forum Post went up at 8:46 PM

and if you look at the list of forum posts that appeared in the list at that time, which I copied from another page you can plainly see, this forum post is not listed.

This post was shadow banned for at least two hours. I didn't appreciate it, and I don't appreciate you now showing up claiming that I was somehow . . . mistaken . . .

[-] 2 points by TrevorMnemonic (5827) 1 year ago

lol

Now I'm just commenting because every time I do this post goes to the top of the list.

[-] 2 points by ZenDog (20391) from South Burlington, VT 1 year ago

whew - thanks -

Like I said in the post - I get bashing American Imperialism. I get the concept that when a government like Libya falls it opens the door to the rapacious nature of American style capitalism. I get that, and I get that there are consequences to that, and these consequences may well end with adverse affects on the issue of human rights.

That does not change the fact that the Assad regime has engaged in mass murder.

That does not change the fact that the Russian military complex benefits.

All military industrial alliances benefit from conflict, and the sale of munitions.

To defend the Assad regime, to deny the mass murder of men, women, and children at their hands, is to become complicit in their crimes.

I find that not simply unacceptable, but outrageous.

[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (33128) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 year ago

Hear Hear - Well Spoken. ( well I see the Bloody caps lock nazi is on duty - HEY please mind your own business - my writing style should not be a concern of yours )

[-] 2 points by bensdad (8977) 1 year ago

Isn't the "caps lock" ban built in to the system?
like post is too short

[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (33128) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 year ago

Depends who is looking in - I quite often am able to start off with caps ( never have used a caps lock. But when the caps usage nazi is in attendance - nope sorry it is gonna mess with your writing style.

[-] 3 points by bensdad (8977) 1 year ago

As a programmer, I would say that evaluating a post a character at a time, there may be a limit on the percentage of caps in the post [ my tests show 50% caps triggers the "error" message ]

[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (33128) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 year ago

Anything is possible - I just do not see why writing style should be an issue - and as I said it only happens occasionally - it is not consistent. Further I have replied to a funny comment before with just "LOL" only to recieve the caps lock complaint I have at other times typed a whole 1st sentence in caps and not gotten the caps lock complaint.

[-] 1 points by ZenDog (20391) from South Burlington, VT 1 year ago

fuck you matt - how else can I test to see if it is still shadow banned

[-] 1 points by flip (4995) 1 year ago

the article on the positions of chomsky and galloway was a good one - i like george but he has some opinions that are not very well thought through! too many here cannot do anything but see the world in balck and white. this forum has taken a turn for the worse - in too many ways

[-] 0 points by ZenDog (20391) from South Burlington, VT 1 year ago

I was so furious at the defense of the Syrian regime I didn't look too closely at what the author was saying. He claimed Chomsky said:

  • but in his case this does not involve him in justifying the regime, or in treating the principled motives behind the revolution as if they were suspect.

and that is what I was looking for. I believe it must be correct because Chomsky is not going to throw his reputation away defending mass murderers.

[-] 1 points by flip (4995) 1 year ago

it is very hard to argue with noam on almost anythiing - he has very well thought out positions

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[-] -1 points by Thereaper88 (-30) 1 year ago

Only to brainwashed, sub human dumbasses.

[-] -1 points by Thereaper88 (-30) 1 year ago

Noam Chomsky? Good gods does anyone still listen to that elitist Jew asshole?

[-] 2 points by flip (4995) 1 year ago

nice nazi comment coming on the heels of a nazi massacre - oh, what would one expect from the reaper - you must be a little white boy

[-] 1 points by ZenDog (20391) from South Burlington, VT 1 year ago

you must be a little white boy

BWa hahaha!

little being the operative word . . .

[-] 1 points by flip (4995) 1 year ago

i am sure he would agree

[-] 0 points by Thereaper88 (-30) 1 year ago

Wonderful answer! "Little"! Oh gods I can't fight THAT answer!

[Removed]

[-] 2 points by ZenDog (20391) from South Burlington, VT 1 year ago

has the pavement buckled in your parking lot yet?

  • Global Warming
  • It's right outside
  • the repelican party is DONE

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[-] -3 points by bearclaw (-152) 1 year ago

Obama’s College Classmate: ‘The Obama Scandal Is at Columbia’ http://www.theblaze.com/contributions/obama%E2%80%99s-college-classmate-the-obama-scandal-is-at-columbia/