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Forum Post: So what are you trying to get out of this? a Communist Country?

Posted 12 years ago on Nov. 17, 2011, 12:17 p.m. EST by ikki5 (61)
This content is user submitted and not an official statement

really, you all want everyone equal but here is the thing, everyone is not equal. People that have their money worked hard for their money and are probably what keeps the economy of your country from crashing and burning.(or at least most, some inherit it). Then you have people that go out and get a job just to get a job an be able to make some money to be able to live, pay for stuff and so on. Then you got the people who just want to mooch off other such as the government, or don't want to do anything except for what they themselves want to do and then hate their Job, want instant money so they can do what they want. Now, for you guys stating that you want equal rights, that would mean that someone that works at a gas station would get about the same or similar to someone who is a doctor that saves someones life. Now tell me, should they be treated equal? Of course not. People who work for their money should be entitled to it. The lazy bums who don't want to work should get nothing.

Now flame me all you want but this is the truth.

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66 Comments


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[-] 5 points by PandoraK (1678) 12 years ago

OK, define lazy bum.

Do you mean the disabled? The senior citizens who already paid their dues? How about the children who have no voice politically?

Or do you mean the guy who goes out in 100+ or -20 temperatures to collect your trash, clear your highways, or repair sewer lines?

Maybe it's the guy who's only able to find work at McDonald's, or the guy who has 100+ applications out and his resume plastered all over every place he can find to put it, and gets no offers for interviews?

Or the mother who honestly believed everything the 'love of her life' told her, only to find that the jobs she could find weren't adequate to keep a roof over her and her children's heads?

Maybe it's the guy who works 20-30 hours a week because that's the 'new standard' work week in so many places?

Generic statements have a tendency to lump everyone together, it's even worse when the generic statement has no connection to events.

Equality...why is it that so many equate equality with money?

What about basic human value? Statistics show that the percentage of those who are dependent on governmental support is extremely low, although that number is growing because of the current economic downturn.

Equality, is not only sharing the responsibility it is also sharing in the rewards, it is having a voice that is actually heard and once heard taken into consideration.

Basic human value=equality.

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[-] 0 points by betuadollar (-313) 12 years ago

"Equality" says nothing of responsibility. It says nothing of sharing. In fact, what it says is quite the opposite - that I shall not be subjugated to another and that I can keep what is mine.

[-] 1 points by PandoraK (1678) 12 years ago

Oh but you are, we all are subjugated to another. We start at birth, our very lives depend on the largess of another or others. We enter school and we are subjugated, we enter the work force and we are subjugated.

Equality=basic human value. We have to start some place.

[-] 0 points by betuadollar (-313) 12 years ago

The value of human life is much like a portfolio - it can't be determined until the final sale.

We are speaking of two entirely different things... you speak of compassion and personal dignity. And not equality as defined by the Dec.

[-] 1 points by PandoraK (1678) 12 years ago

Not trying to be the 'spelling police' but rather clarifying, Dec=dictionary?

I am going to assume so.

When it comes to sentient beings the two are not mutually exclusive.

[-] 0 points by betuadollar (-313) 12 years ago

Dec=Declaration. I just get tired of typing it. The equality of the Dec speaks exclusively to law.

[-] 1 points by PandoraK (1678) 12 years ago

A declaration can only give a narrow definition of any subject, as it applies to the declaration. It can also leave it open for personal interpretation by the individual.

Yet when speaking of human beings there has to be a basic principal. When speaking of equality it does address responsibility as regards to the whole, no one of us can be more or less responsible in regards to the declaration than another. It is removed from personal areas of responsibility.

While we may not all be equal in our personal ability to speak, we are equal in our right to speak. To present our ideas and ideals for common consideration.

To remove the basic value of a human is to remove that right to speak regardless of ability to do so.

[-] 0 points by betuadollar (-313) 12 years ago

Declarations are generally rather specific; take marriage, for example - it's a pubic declaration and it is rather specific.

"All men are created equal" speaks specifically to law, as a mutual responsibility, to say that none should serve a master by strength or force of law. "Redistribution" is.slavery and that's exactly what these colonials were disputing, as a coalition of states.

No where is it suggested that one should forfeit one's property to the benefit of another; quite the opposite. And that's what the Dec's equality is; a right to be equally secure in one's property. Life, Liberty, and the Pursuit of Happiness speak directly to one's economic logic.

[-] 1 points by PandoraK (1678) 12 years ago

That's the beauty of it, you have the right to your interpretation as others have theirs.

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[-] -1 points by Cleitophon (43) from Brooklyn, NY 12 years ago

What's wrong with getting a job in McDonald's?

[-] 4 points by lookingfortruth88 (75) from Chicago, IL 12 years ago

Whats wrong with it? Everything. Name one person who can work at McDonald's and meet all of their demands as a human being. Name one person who can work at McDonald's and support a family. There is nothing disgraceful about working at McDonald's but what we are saying is that you can't make a living by working there. However, McDonald's makes billions in profits and don't pay their workers a living wage in order to meet all the demands that a human being must have. What's wrong with McDonald's paying their employees a fair wage? That is the real question don't divert people from the real message.

[-] 1 points by corbintechboy (9) 12 years ago

This is funny. I posted something like this on my site not to long ago http://revolutionartist.com/?p=221.

The problem is that people are brainwashed into thinking capitalism works. But what they do fail to realize is that capitalism is the one place that takes away from social equality.

[-] 2 points by WFCapitalist07 (24) 12 years ago

And socialism/communism is so great. The former Soviet Union, Cuba, North Korea those guys really had it made. Capitalist countries have by far been more prosperous than other nations. Additionally the poor in capitalist countries are and have historically been better off than those in socialist/communist countries.

[-] 1 points by PandoraK (1678) 12 years ago

Capitalism works, but unbridled capitalism doesn't do so well...

In a sense we are all capitalists.

We want to buy at reasonable prices and if we decide to sell we want to either get more for our item than we paid or we want as much of our expenditure back as we can get. We want wages that afford us a living we are comfortable with...

Any one of us would, if able, engage in capital exercise, but that type of exercise isn't what the problem is...

Unbridled capitalism, where inflated value, which is imaginary, (derivatives) and this inflated value is then over valued (leverage) and traded on the base of that over valuation, there's where trouble begins and grows.

When banks that were once not allowed to engage in such practices began to do so, putting the fund of depositors at risk, when banks that were allowed to engage in normal banking ventures, again putting the funds of depositors at risk, that was and is a problem. Especially when those investments became risk factors that exceeded the bank's ability to meet, and the taxpayer was handed the bill...

There are several articles online that describe accurately the functions of investment bank which make this much more clear.

[-] 0 points by betuadollar (-313) 12 years ago

What's wrong with it is that society should not attach such value to a McDonald's employee. That said, there are many whose value has been overstated by the force of labor organization.

We have become a nation of retailers. There are no skilled labor jobs, no engineering jobs... school districts are municipalities alike are instituting cuts under the burden of educating the non-citizen. In short, it's an upside down economy with far too much available labor that has no place to go.

And conservatives have been saying this for thirty five years.

[-] 0 points by ImDoingFine (36) 12 years ago

I know many people who have supported a family on minimum-wage jobs and have kept out of debt at the same time. It can be done if you don't feel compelled to buy that huge-screen TV every other month or have a cell phone and data plan.

[-] 1 points by Cleitophon (43) from Brooklyn, NY 12 years ago

It's sad to see when you post about the truth, people down vote you.

[-] -1 points by Cleitophon (43) from Brooklyn, NY 12 years ago

So McDonald's is wrong for running a successful business? They pay just compensation for their workers. It's not very hard to heat pre-packaged meats.

And don't say that any job which pays near minimum wage can't support a family, that's just ignorant. There are a great many people that get by with meager jobs because that is all they are qualified for. You can meet a family's basic needs with a job at Mcdonald's, provided you know how to manage your time and money wisely.

[-] 1 points by lookingfortruth88 (75) from Chicago, IL 12 years ago

McDonald's is beyond a successful business. They are a greedy business that is making billions off the hundreds of thousands underpaid workers. Why are some people only qualified to work at McDonald's? Is this what people are being taught in schools to aspire to do? To work at a dead-end job that has no meaning. YOU see no problem with McDonald's having a right to manage their business any way they want but you see a problem when people want to stand up for themselves and run their way the way they want. Sounds like a double standard and hypocritical. Also, the people that make McDonald's all the money and even are the consumers of their horrible product they get to only make minimum wage and barely survive but the corporate people get to share all of the profits that they made off of the workers. This is justified in your eyes, how?

[-] 1 points by PandoraK (1678) 12 years ago

Did you know that most McDonald's jobs are under 40 hours per week? Nothing wrong with it, but I did ask for a definition and gave starting points for one.

[-] 2 points by Vooter (441) 12 years ago

We want the bankers who committed massive fraud in their packaging, rating and promotion of mortgage-backed CDOs sentenced to prison, where they belong. What don't you get? You must believe that criminals shouldn't be punished--why is that?

[-] 1 points by Gbus (80) 12 years ago

This is the problem, they are legally off the hook because they know the legal systems loopholes, they did not break the law, and unfortunately, there is no law against being an immoral douche......

[-] 1 points by Vooter (441) 12 years ago

"there is no law against being an immoral douche"

We're going to make one...

[-] 1 points by Gbus (80) 12 years ago

I'll vote for it!

[-] 0 points by ikki5 (61) 12 years ago

if I remember correctly, a lot of them were convicted.

[-] 1 points by ZenDogTroll (13032) from South Burlington, VT 12 years ago

Truth? I'll hit you with some truth . . .

Right in the face. Mark it well - You have said: everyone is not equal.


Four score and seven years ago our fathers brought forth on this continent a new nation, conceived in liberty, and dedicated to the proposition that all men are created equal.

Now we are engaged in a great civil war, testing whether that nation, or any nation, so conceived and so dedicated, can long endure. We are met on a great battle-field of that war. We have come to dedicate a portion of that field, as a final resting place for those who here gave their lives that that nation might live. It is altogether fitting and proper that we should do this.

But, in a larger sense, we can not dedicate, we can not consecrate, we can not hallow this ground. The brave men, living and dead, who struggled here, have consecrated it, far above our poor power to add or detract. The world will little note, nor long remember what we say here, but it can never forget what they did here. It is for us the living, rather, to be dedicated here to the unfinished work which they who fought here have thus far so nobly advanced. It is rather for us to be here dedicated to the great task remaining before us—that from these honored dead we take increased devotion to that cause for which they gave the last full measure of devotion—that we here highly resolve that these dead shall not have died in vain—that this nation, under God, shall have a new birth of freedom—and that government of the people, by the people, for the people, shall not perish from the earth.


Such a statement as made by you is completely, and totally, un-American. Men bled and men died, by the tens of thousands, in upholding the simple principle that, indeed, all men are created equal. You can nit pick all you like about what that means and nitwits often do - but the meaning is obvious - no one of us has more rights, no one of us has less rights, than any one of us.

I'm sure old Abe never considered that such an issue would be confusing - especially not among party faithful - yet here we are.

As for what I hope for this movement? Social, economic, and environmental justice. I realize that covers a lot of territory, and there is much to be done.

Toward that end, I look forward in eager anticipation to the day the repelican party ceases to exist. They stand steadfastly in the way of any and all efforts to achieve anything like Social, economic, and environmental justice.

That they will cease to exist I take as a given. They have told many lies, chief among them is the assertion that there is no global warming. I doubt the party, on its own, can survive the next five years, given that single lie and the facts as they appear right outside every single American citizen's own window.

But I am not content to wait until that day. Much more preferable is it, to add my voice to the wind of public discontent in the hope that we may indeed speed that process that is even now under way and unstoppable.

I am a sick and twisted individual, this I well know. In my darker moments I can hatch such plots and devise such stratagems that would see Machiavelli smile. I am sure we both know well what will happen with the addition of public scrutiny upon the repelican party.

Facts will emerge. And as they do, so will guilt. Guilt of corruption. We know too, that to keep that corruption hid there are those who will do anything, and kill anyone, toward that end.

Murtha I say.

And Ken Lay.

And so I say, as they scramble to keep their stinking ship of lies afloat we will watch and see who goes overboard first.

And I will cheer.

Before this is over, I am certain, they will be killing each other in droves as they attempt to hide all that they have done.

And I will cheer I say.

I will cheer and you can believe that I am American.

[-] 1 points by ZenDogTroll (13032) from South Burlington, VT 12 years ago

You can take that home to your masters,

and tell them:

chaos has come

[-] 0 points by USCitizenVoter (720) 12 years ago

Awesome ZenDog

[-] 1 points by ZenDogTroll (13032) from South Burlington, VT 12 years ago

Really? Thanks.

It is proof - I am a bit twisted.

[-] 1 points by mikedenis (49) 12 years ago

boycott Wal-Mart

[-] 1 points by mkaylen (6) from Newhall, CA 12 years ago

OWS needs to post a list of demands on their website and give visitors to the website the ability to vote on each demand. eg. Right to work/ no more unions, a limit to campaign spending, no more money printing, restructure home loans now. etc. The total number of votes should display next to the demand. Which ever demands get the greatest number of votes over a defined period of time, should become the demands of OWS. They can get the names of the voters and use it as a petition as well.

[-] 1 points by missy13ny (8) 12 years ago

It's not the governments place to take care of you! If you wanted to get paid like a doctor, you should have gone to school, meanwhile working hard at McDonald's, and when you get your degree, work on paying your loan off no matter how long it takes to pay it, because it's YOUR loan. You do what you have to do. You work 3 jobs if that's the cards you have been delt. That's life! Quit trying to steal everyone else's hard-earned dollar and get up and work for it yoruself! It was your choice to have children, knowing you cannot support them(or you would have been smarter about birth control or abstinence), and it is also YOUR choice to save for retirement. Whatever happened to personal responsibility? We make our own choices and it's no one's responsibility to bail you out but your own. What we need is the federal government to butt out! The reason businesses end up overseas is because they are over taxed. They would be out of business if they stayed here in America. Lower taxes so they can come back and employ people. 47% of people do not pay taxes! How socially equal is that?

[-] 1 points by bindleheim (10) 12 years ago

Gods and Clods.

[-] 1 points by jobcreator (13) 12 years ago

Our Trade Deficit

(( trade deficit Not budget deficit (for all the AM Radio following parrots and idiots) trade deficit = Exports > Imports ))

has run around $50 Billion monthly for several years now. This is money leaving our economic system and going into another one.

Do you start to see the picture here? A net of $50 billion goes out of our country monthly. We continue to loose jobs to outsourcing. There is a link here.

Solution: It's simple. Bring back Tariffs. You righty's love to talk about "" Our Founding Fathers "" Well did you know our Founding Fathers HAD HUGE TARIFFS In place to begin, grow and protect OUR Manufacturing.

[-] 1 points by jobcreator (13) 12 years ago

Not the truth !!!

um, hey, in Case you haven't heard . THERE ARE MORE PEOPLE SEEKING WORK THAN THERE ARE AVAILABLE JOBS !!!!

YOU F**ING MORON. I have a 4 year degree and have had a couple of small businesses. I've SENT 100'S of resume's on every job site from craigslist to Careerbuilder to no avail. And- fyi- so have 1000's of people. T H E R E A R E N O T E N O U G H jobs out there.

Our economic model and structure has changed. How? Through outsourcing. .... Through Outsourcing. ...Through Outsourcing.

43,000 Factories have closed there doors here to outsource the labor from American's to Asian wage slaves

Approximately 4 Million american jobs have gone to China.

Where is Made in the USA? That would bring back jobs.

And I do agree with you on one point. A Janitor should not be paid as much as a Medical Doctor or an electrical engineer.

Now- reply to that.

[-] 1 points by missy13ny (8) 12 years ago

Tell your Big Brother to lower taxes so those companies are able to thrive in the US and employ you!

[-] 1 points by jobcreator (13) 12 years ago

AMERICAN JOBS have been outsourced over the 10-30 years PRIMARILY because of the vast wage discrepancy between Americans and workers from other countries.

NOT BECAUSE of taxes!

Can someone please do the simple math here? :
Average Chinese Factory worker has been paid $2.00 / D A Y (over the last 10 - 40 years). Average American Factory Worker $12 - $20 / H O U R (over the last 10 - 40 yrs).
If you're the accountant in american firm with the above labor cost options ; which one would you impulsively choose to line the pockets of the owners and salaried executives in this firm? The answer is obvious and easy.

The above example has happened to roughly 43,000 american factories and approx. 3-5 million american workers.

Money has left our(American's) system and gone into the Chinese system by way of the above example.

[-] 1 points by PandoraK (1678) 12 years ago

I realize you are angry, however, calling others moron and adding extraneous adjectives isn't going to help get your point across...many of us are angry, please use it constructively.

[-] 1 points by jobcreator (13) 12 years ago

point understood and well taken. Thank you Pandora. We do need to use the best PR methods possible to get the truth out there.

[-] 1 points by PandoraK (1678) 12 years ago

You are welcome, we are intelligent, we are educated, some formally others self taught and we are aware...that is the picture we have of us and the picture others need to see.

PR, maybe we ought to pool our pennies and hire a PR man? Nah, we're smart enough to do it ourselves.

[-] 1 points by jobcreator (13) 12 years ago

PR is of the highest order .

Here's a link:

Link 1: Economy in crisis, is an excellent source of info.

http://www.youtube.com/user/economyincrisis

look through some of their videos to see more about Free Trade, Job loss to outsourcing, etc.

I like the overall message of the occupy movement. However it would be a shame if they're slogans amount to such generalities as "To hell with rich people" ---or--- "I need a job". We need specifics, clarity and organization.

David - please feel free to contact me any time

[-] 1 points by PandoraK (1678) 12 years ago

At two months and three days, it's still young and will suffer growing pains...OWS has yet to figure out how to become a cohesive unit, but I think it will come over the coming months.

Where it's less 'here's the problems' and more 'we have suggestions for solutions'.

[-] 1 points by jobcreator (13) 12 years ago

TOTALLY agree with your last line:

""" Where it's less 'here's the problems' and more 'we have suggestions for solutions'. """

Yes, it has to be more " here are solutions".

And- I have to say that the solution in a Nutshell would be to protect our economy and quit supporting other economies - i.e. China's. Every time we fill our homes with goods made in other countries, we are supporting THEM financially. If we MADE what we CONSUME, I firmly believe we would not even be in this mess right now because MILLIONS of "Middle" class Americans would be working.

This Pandora Is what I believe is at the very heart of our economic problem.

I sincerely thank you for your correspondence.

[-] 1 points by PandoraK (1678) 12 years ago

Buying American products is one way to affect changes, however, we also need to create those products which requires an atmosphere amenable to the creation of a way to create those products. A atmosphere that does not depend on removal of regulation, some of those regulations are actually good for us all.

I've always said, America works, when Americans work. It doesn't have to be for a manufacturer, it doesn't have to be office or bank or any of the more traditional types of work.

Cottage industry was once the foundation of this country, local business, supported by local residents. Even today there are companies that actually do most of their manufacturing via cottage industry, ever wonder if there is someone on an assembly line putting two screws, to washers, two bolts, two nuts into those little zip lock bags?

Still we need to fix things on a larger scale, Citizens United has to go, Glass/Steagall needs to come back, and our solutions...sadly our solutions will have to be shown to work before we can get a majority to cooperate, or lacking cooperation to co-opt them.

[-] 1 points by jobcreator (13) 12 years ago

It's a little overwhelming for me - but in theory and practice yes - we very much do need to organize our PR. We're taking on the world. I've been on this issue with someone else now for about 4 years. The Koch brothers, IMF, and the other obscenely wealthy and powerful players in this world are sadly unbeatable I'm afraid. (their economic propaganda is upheld at ALL levels in the media) BUT, we can still spread the truth to as many as to why we've gotten to where we are economically in this country today.

I like information presented in simple - chart-like form. Such as :

43,000 factories have closed here in the last 20 - 40 yrs only to have the labor outsourced to China, etc.

3-5 million jobs have gone with them (the above)

Monthly trade deficit has run between $30- $50 billion / m o n t h l y.

Can you start to see the picture from the above 3 things?

Money circulating in our economic system (and largely through a working middle - class of people) has left our system to spread to other systems like China. It has actually left the hands of the many ((middle -class)) and been re-concentrated into the hands of the few.

PR - the most standard thing to do I can see is to have a video that very clearly defines not only what we are about and our awareness but also presents a clear picture of how we've gotten to this level of economic disparity.

[-] 1 points by PandoraK (1678) 12 years ago

While charts are great, for many it's just lines on paper, but that is only the mental/emotional differences between us all...some need words that bring it down to 'gut level'.

I think that perhaps we aren't so far off the mark, some walk, some sit in, some speak, some write and some create charts. All good.

PR, the best PR we can have is actually intelligent discourse, reasoned dialogue, to present ourselves as what we really are, intelligent, reasonable people, at least for the most part...we all have our moments when reason flies out the window.

Add the charts and break things down showing where and how, we'll have it. The argument, the discourse and the PR.

[-] 1 points by jobcreator (13) 12 years ago

Being "who" we are , is our reason for existence. I could now go into another philosophical area.

However when it's 70 degrees F and clear outside - this now is Information that is best presented to the masses of people in a certain way. ((I hope this analogy is well taken)).

Well, I'm going to play some basketball and maybe roller-blade today and get ready for another week. I hope we can keep talking.

Thanks for your writing

[-] 1 points by PandoraK (1678) 12 years ago

Understood and the analogy is also.

I think the issue is the 'chart guys' will respond best to charts.

The 'literal guys' will respond best to facts and figures sans charts.

The 'literary guys' will respond to a word picture.

We're all hard wired to respond to certain types of presentations. Good communications require that the presentation is representative to the entire audience.

[-] 0 points by ikki5 (61) 12 years ago

curious to wonder what you consider jobs? people say that here and yet i see places with "Now Hiring" on signs and on billboards at fast food places, retail shops, etc. and yet people still say there are no jobs. I bet you are one of those people that if it won't pay you $25 an hour then it is not a job.

Since you mentioned your education, I am currently finishing my last year here at university of a Bsc. and I am currently working 3 part time jobs to pay for it. so your B.S of there being no jobs is a load of crap.

[-] 1 points by jobcreator (13) 12 years ago

What are the unemployment facts right now ikki? I sent my resume HUNDREDS of times in the area I live in and made about 3-4 interviews and 0 jobs. AND the interviewers said THEY HAVE NEVER seen anything like this. Their fax machines / and email inboxes WERE LOADED with resumes applying for that 1 job.

For you to say that the unemployment situation is a lie shows you really don't know what is ACTUALLY happening out there.

My prediction: The fact that more and more americans are without work will hit you so squarely in the face that even you won't be able to honestly deny it.

[-] 1 points by metapolitik (1110) 12 years ago

We Expect Democracy.

[-] 1 points by Gbus (80) 12 years ago

It's true........OWS should have noted the amount of people who started camping out with them not because they support the protest....but because food and a place to camp had become available.......there are alot of us out here in the world who've been through this before and have experience with these sorts of things..............I'm all for the cause, but, there has been a swift move to shut all the camps down across the country, and in Canada too, not because people and municipalities don't support the cause, but because most of the protesters are young and naive and haven't yet realized that when you put fresh meat out, the wolves gather round............there is alot of confusion surrounding this move........the OWS movement would like everyone to think that the establishment shut down the camps because the 1% are scared and this movement need to be stopped....contrary......the camps were concentrating all the homeless, mentally ill hungry misfits in every city with nowhere else to go, it actually did become a health hazard..I say this from experience.........I've been through this whole camp out and protest thing a few times now.........

[-] 1 points by ImDoingFine (36) 12 years ago

I agree wholeheartedly from my 850 square-foot home with seven-foot ceilings, where my wife, baby girl, and I live happily on my lower-middle-class income (unsupplemented by government handouts) in an aging but clean and quiet neighborhood.

I'm part of the so-called 99%, but OWS does not speak for me.

[-] 2 points by Vooter (441) 12 years ago

Well, that's just because like the vast majority of people in the world, you don't give a shit about anyone but you and your own. Tell us something we don't know....

[-] 0 points by ImDoingFine (36) 12 years ago

The irony of this post is astounding. You claim to represent the 99%, yet claim the "vast majority" doesn't care about anyone else. And while apparently elevating yourself to a higher than average level of intelligence because you are not part of the "vast majority," you use profanity to make your point.

And how does my post mean I don't care about anyone but me and my own family? I search in vain for anything meaning close to that...

[-] 1 points by PandoraK (1678) 12 years ago

While I realize that many who come here are seeking to learn and trying to ask questions to help that process, there are many here also who are very angry...they obeyed the rules, worked hard, educated themselves and found that the rules don't seem to apply...

Once one gets past the anger then dialogue can occur and people can come to understanding, on both sides.

[-] 1 points by Vooter (441) 12 years ago

"You claim to represent the 99%, yet claim the "vast majority" doesn't care about anyone else."

Where's the contradiction? "99%" simply refers to people who aren't in the top 1% in the U.S. in terms of wealth. It doesn't mean that they're saints, or smart, or more caring than anyone else--it just means that they're part of the giant group of people who aren't as wealthy as the top 1%. That doesn't mean they can't be ignorant, uncaring assholes...

[-] 0 points by ImDoingFine (36) 12 years ago

The contradiction is that the "99%" is a pretty "vast majority," yet you say the "vast majority" doesn't care (including me, and financially speaking, I'm toward the bottom half of the 99%). If the vast majority of the 99% doesn't care that they're (supposedly) downtrodden by the rich, why should you try to make it an issue for them?

[-] 2 points by Vooter (441) 12 years ago

I work full-time, and I don't consider myself "downtrodden," either. But that, of course, has never been the point of OWS--that's just what your friends at Fox News like to repeat over and over and OVER. The primary complaint of OWS has been that the electoral system in the United States has been completely corrupted by corporate and Wall Street money, which has rendered my vote and yours (if you vote) COMPLETELY POINTLESS. It's a SCAM. Does that not bother you? Does it not bother you that this "democracy" that they're trying to sell you isn't actually a democracy at all? I mean, if you don't give a shit, or you want to just throw your hands in the air and say that there's nothing you can do about it, that's your business. But to be consistent, you should also not care when people call you an idiot for being that way....

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[-] 0 points by OWSisawaste (133) 12 years ago

OWS has no idea that their whole idea is not going to work. people will never be completely equal. Even in your perfect Communist world world there is still that "1%" that rules the country. There will always be a "1%" and you just have to except that. Also, getting the money out of the gov would make it collapse...money it needed to make anything run...countries, houses, businesses......THEY ALL NEED MONEY.......and your "list or demands" is completely moronic....

[-] 0 points by journey4word (214) 12 years ago

you are asking a group of primarily democrats to see further ahead than the day at hand.

I respect you trying to explain something to them like we did in 2008 but you see how well they listened then, and the mess we are in now.

IF OWS is responsible for making a single change in our government and that change doesn't amount to any good or like now makes it worse? They will then blame something else.

perhaps oatmeal or something will be the reason, never their own mistakes.

[-] 0 points by thethirdeye (-10) 12 years ago

Today me and a bunch of other independent traders are dumping lots of derivative positions on the market and shorting the S&P 500 basket. Helping do our part for the november 17 event.

Babyboomers ruined america, we will make sure they pay the price by destroying the 401K retirements of the babyboomers.

[-] 0 points by ImDoingFine (36) 12 years ago

There's productive for you. A revenge move that hurts everyone and helps nobody. So the babyboomers made some bad decisions - you think taking their discretionary income out of the economy is going to help your generation?

[-] 1 points by thethirdeye (-10) 12 years ago

It sure helps us. At least we are doing something with real impact and the money shorting their 401Ks to hell goes into our pockets and we spend it into the economy.

[-] 1 points by missy13ny (8) 12 years ago

So you want to punish those that had self responsibility and made a choice to take care of themselves(not relying on the government to play robinhood and give it to them) My mother was part of the babyboomers and had 3 children on less than 20,000/year. Now paid her home off and is saving for her retirement and you want to ruin it for her because you didn't do the same. Our government has created such a sense of entitlement with this generation(mind you I am 25) Keep giving people hand outs and they want more and more without lifting a finger. I work 50hrs+ a week to have a roof over my head and eat. I think it's a bunch of garbage that I work like crazy while someone else sits home eating bon bons and watching their 80" flat screen tv collecting a "free check" every month. subsidized housing is at 40% in my home town and trust me, more than 90% of them are able and unwilling to work, because why would they when they are handed free money?! It's all politics. Give to people and who will they vote for? YOU. That's what the left wants...More entitlements=more votes. And this whole OWS thing is aimed all toward the businesses! Look at Washington...Crony Capitalism!

[-] 1 points by thethirdeye (-10) 12 years ago

The baby boomers were the ones who put in all those politicians and who were for the destruction of the American middle class. They were responsible. Thank them for the 80s excesses and offshoring of our jobs to china.

Today we dumped all our short options positions via Cabinet trades on the CBOE and we shorted all the way till december. At your expense.

F.U we are now gonna make money to survive the mess you made, at your expense.

Sincerely 401K Pirates. Destroying Babyboomer wealth one day at a time.

Yaaarrrrr. Occupying the pockets of Babyboomers and taking it for ourselves.

BTW I nor the others in our group are getting hand outs, we are making money from your mistakes. Free market baby, Dont hate the player hate the game.