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Forum Post: Same - Same? Not So Fast

Posted 3 months ago on April 1, 2014, 6:42 a.m. EST by ZenDog (13324) from South Burlington, VT
This content is user submitted and not an official statement

Nobody can look at these facts and claim both parties are the same -

New G.O.P. Bid to Limit Voting in Swing States

By STEVEN YACCINO and LIZETTE ALVAREZMARCH 29, 2014

CINCINNATI — Pivotal swing states under Republican control are embracing significant new electoral restrictions on registering and voting that go beyond the voter identification requirements that have caused fierce partisan brawls.

The bills, laws and administrative rules — some of them tried before — shake up fundamental components of state election systems, including the days and times polls are open and the locations where people vote.

Republicans in Ohio and Wisconsin this winter pushed through measures limiting the time polls are open, in particular cutting into weekend voting favored by low-income voters and blacks, who sometimes caravan from churches to polls on the Sunday before election.

More from the NYT

This is bullshit. If the fukers cannot win their argument on the basis of merit, then they will cheat like the low life scum they are.

This article makes it indisputable: In the repelican veiw, if you do not have wealth or own property, you just shouldn't vote.

I say

FUCK THESE REPELICAN SCUM

.

fukers

.



.

fukers

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Further evidence - thanks shooz.

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The Senate Intelligence Committee voted 11-3 along partisan lines in favor of declassifying a report it has produced regarding the CIA's Rendition, Detention and Interrogation program. The U.S.A. Today news report on this Senate Intelligence Committee vote demonstrates yet another clear instance of the ideological divide that exists between party:

Sen. Richard Burr, R-N.C., a member of the panel, called the report "flawed and biased" but ultimately voted in favor of declassifying it.

"I had hoped that the authors of the report would ensure that the American public was provided facts, not fiction," Burr said. He added, "However, I voted today to declassify the report to give the American people the opportunity to make their own judgments."

Three Senate Republicans — James Risch of Idaho, Dan Coats of Indiana and Marco Rubio of Florida — voted against declassification. Sen. Tom Coburn, R-Okla., voted present.

"Unfortunately, the study has pitted the Senate Intelligence Committee against the CIA and distracted us from focusing on the many threats facing our national security," Risch and Rubio said in a joint statement. "Unlike previous bipartisan reports to come out of the intelligence committee – including the recent study investigating the terrorists attacks in Benghazi, which received broad bipartisan support – this partisan effort deserves to be discredited."

From: Senate panel votes to declassify part of CIA report, USA Today

Any goddamned fool can claim it's not cold out - but that will not stop the shivering.

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Further evidence:

The House Energy and Commerce Committee Tuesday voted down an amendment that would have stated conclusively that climate change is occurring.

E&C Committee members voted 24-20 against the amendment, introduced by Rep. Jan Schakowsky (D-IL) to H.R. 3826, the Electricity Security and Affordability Act. That bill, if it makes it through Congress, would put an end to EPA regulations on emissions for new power plants until technologies like carbon capture and storage are commercially viable in at least six states for one year. It passed in Tuesday’s committee, but the amendment, which would have placed on the record that the committee accepts that climate change is happening and is caused by greenhouse gas pollution, did not.

Twenty-four E&C members — all Republicans — voted against the amendment. Among them was E&C Chair Rep. Fred Upton (R-MI), who has said before that he doesn’t think climate change is caused by human activity, and Joe Barton (R-TX), who also questions humans’ role in climate change. In total, the Republicans who voted to deny climate change have accepted about $9.3 million in career contributions from the oil, gas and coal industries, according to analysis by the CAP Action War Room.

This isn’t the first time House Republicans have rejected amendments stating the reality of climate change. In 2011, House Republicans voted down amendments that called on Congress to accept that climate change is real, man-made, and a human health threat.

24 House Republicans Just Voted To Deny The Reality Of Climate Change - by By Katie Valentine on January 28, 2014

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And yet another stunning example of intransigent repelican insistence on ignorance and partisan denial . . .

Climate change has become a partisan issue in the US, such that a majority of Democrats is worried about it but only 29% of independents and only 16% of Republicans! The youth are more concerned than their elders.

The American public is reacting to climate change as though it were a lifestyle or culture wars issue, such as gay marriage or marijuana legalization.

They don’t seem to realize that the laws of physics don’t respect party affiliation. If you put 32 billion metric tons of carbon dioxide into the atmosphere every year, as human beings are currently doing by burning coal, oil and natural gas, then you will cause massive climate change.


UPDATE ~ April 30, 2014:

Senate REPELICANS block minimum wage hike to $10.10



Next: The False Equivalence Meme



136 Comments

136 Comments


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[-] 3 points by schmoot (72) from Kerrville, TX 3 months ago

"Nobody can look at these facts and claim both parties are the same"

Cons can look at anything and not see what they won't see, because it doesn't serve their agendae. They shouldn't be able to. But they can. Sadly

[-] 2 points by ZenDog (13324) from South Burlington, VT 3 months ago

what is it about the Koch brothers that makes them think they have the right to dictate policy to the rest of the United States?

I never voted for them, and I never would vote for them. As of yet, no one else has either.

[-] 2 points by ZenDog (13324) from South Burlington, VT 3 months ago

the lyin libertarian shillery insists that if you cannot criticize the President that you must then be somehow less than. Less than what is never specified.

I say why, why criticize the President, when it seems they are hard at it already

the stupid fukers

[-] 2 points by ZenDog (13324) from South Burlington, VT 3 months ago

to be effective, any movement of resistance that seeks to change our political culture at the national level must come to recognize and understand that the differences we see at state level are evident at the federal level - and much of this difference revolves around whether and to what degree an individual state system has organized itself around the corruptive influences of money.

Some states for example, are dependent on the coal industry, for jobs and the money this resource provides. The coal industry is dependent on the state not to write too much regulation into law, nor to enforce too vigorously those federal regulations that exit.

To accomplish this, the coal industry has gone to great pains to place itself as the arbiter of legitimacy for state government. The State is legitimate or it is illegitimate when coal says so. Toward this end the coal industry has in some states been very successful.

Kentucky most notable among them.

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[-] 1 points by ZenDog (13324) from South Burlington, VT 3 months ago

this place needs an ignore button so that I may take control over my own in box and prevent multiple identity lying scumbags

from sending me mail.

fukin conservative repelican Koch.suckers

since they are all, I am quite certain, the same person - or more properly, troll - I insist that a message from one is the same as a message from all of them.

I do wish the fuker would just go choke.

[-] 1 points by ZenDog (13324) from South Burlington, VT 3 months ago

test

[-] 1 points by ZenDog (13324) from South Burlington, VT 3 months ago

test 2

[-] 1 points by ZenDog (13324) from South Burlington, VT 3 months ago

You mutherfukers may think you're smart, and I really don't much care. You can all kiss my ass. All I get is a system malfunction when attempting to comment to shooz for cryin out loud.

and on my own forum post no less.

Lemme give you stupid fukers a little clue: I'd rather set myself on fire or go on a killing spree than change my behavior.

That's just how it is. And before you go assuming that this is just hyperbole let me assure you: I don't believe in coincidence.

you fukers keep calling me dog boy and then the news starts running spots on dead dogs - check wcax tomorrow.

And if that isn't good enough, consider I know a dog, named Codi

I don't give a fuk. Get it? I usually tune that shit out these days, and most of you will insist it's all over your head - just like those shooz left out on the road the other day.

I don't give a fuk I said. Kiss my ass.



.testing

LoL! Good One!

  • system malfunction Read the Rules


[ - ] 1 points by ZenDog (20490) from South Burlington, VT 0 minutes ago

test

twinkle ↧stinkle reply edit delete permalink

results: passed



fuk you scumbags

fuck you scumbags



test

LoL! Good One! How'd I miss this?

system malfunction Read the Rules




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I may not be able to prove anything, but anyone who can look at the contents of my in box can verify that libertarian Koch.sucking scum can indeed send me little notes.

And my ability to interact here became curbed following this comment.

That, in combination with the latest note I just received, seems to suggest that this little libertarian cluster fuk is run by a bunch of libertarian cops - which makes me wonder - how's the union feel about your political activities?

I don't have anything against cops mind you, but Libertarians?

they can all go choke

fukin scumbags

I hope that's clear enough for ya ya libertarian Koch.suckers

[-] 0 points by flip (5408) 3 months ago

first of all can you answer the question DOG BOY - did jfk bomb poor south Vietnamese peasants and how about telling us why that great liberal did that - the hero of the democratic party left! and please set yourself on fire rather than going on a killing spree. just one more enlighten statement from someone who puts zen in his name. now maybe you would like to enlighten us about the Buddhist priests who set themselves on fire - please - oh, one last thing - if you don't care - why all the flaming?

[-] 3 points by ZenDog (13324) from South Burlington, VT 3 months ago

so - what . . . you are going to sit there and insist to the whole world that Kennedy dreamed up our involvement in Viet Nam all on his own. You stupid Koch.sucker.

He no doubt stood in office surrounded by the bureaucratic leadership of the entire defense department who universally demanded a specific course of action based on a carefully tailored set of justifications which in part included those 9 dead Americans who were Killed In Action before Kennedy even took office.

And once these treasonous conservative cowards and scumbags realized he was not going to play ball indefinitely, that his ethics and morals would demand more from both their character as well as their service -

they had him slain.

Leaving scumbags like you to run around ever after to insist on a certain level of public disparagement of one political figure above all others out of absolute terror that one day that cold and brittle wall of lies and deceit might crumble.

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fuk you ya little flippant gipper flipper

ya libertarian Koch.sucker

ya black hole rabbit fuker

go flip

[-] 0 points by flip (5408) 3 months ago

you don't care? no answer - why can't you answer - simple question - come on tell us about jfk - the great liberal - come on boy - grow up be a MAN

[-] 1 points by ZenDog (13324) from South Burlington, VT 3 months ago

go suck some Koch.

go on.

beat it.

hssssssssssst

scram

[-] 1 points by flip (5408) 3 months ago

no I am staying since you don't care one way or the other. - maybe I will go if you answer the question??

[-] 1 points by ZenDog (13324) from South Burlington, VT 3 months ago

lyin libertarian jail house cunt I say.

choke mutherfuker choke

[-] 1 points by ZenDog (13324) from South Burlington, VT 3 months ago

and don't even think I am going to apologize - I really don'T give a shit how deeply entrenched you are with the Anarchist Elite around here. You're still nothing but a lyin libertarian fraud and subversive jail house bitch suckin that libertarian jail house Koch just as long and hard as you can.

fuk you

[-] 0 points by ZenDog (13324) from South Burlington, VT 3 months ago

so I'm gonna take a wild stab in the dark and assume that since I began receiving a system malfunction notice in attempting to comment immediately after posting the above that my list is if not complete at least it is accurate in so far as it goes. This is an accurate list of socks worn by a scumbag who comes here to persuade the rest of us on the basis of lies and attempts to create a false sense of consensus when non may exist.

I do hope the lying bald headed fuk cuts his own throat next time he shaves his head.

And why would anyone be expected to cut their own throat while shaving their own head?

well I dunno but at least one Kennedy assassination witness cut their own throat passing by plate glass, so why the fuk not?

it is, in my humble opinion, high time the American people rose up and ended the rein of these treasonous conservative scum

[-] 3 points by shadz66 (18128) 3 months ago

"The most difficult subjects can be explained to the most slow- witted man if he has not formed any idea of them already; but the simplest thing cannot be made lear to the most intelligent man if he is firmly persuaded that he knows already, without a shadow of doubt, what is laid before him." (Leo Tolstoy)

IF you think that hchc, flip, jrhirsch & gnomunny are the same dude then your are so full of shit as to be unable to discern shill from shinola or your own ass from your own elbow. Hurling more gob-shite insults at everyone to 'the left' of your own right-wing ass .. just does not cut it and has you down as an ''empty vessels make the most noise'' loud mouth bully boy !!! 'Cut own throat whilst shaving' huh ?!! Is that why you don't risk a razor yourself, lol ?!

You mention JFK here, which thus makes me ask - have you got the gonads to read these, I wonder ?

You may or may not have what it takes to engage with these articles but re. ''same same'' - wakeTF up & realise your silver tongued and far from unintelligent POTUS is a product of, apologist for and believer in - the One Corporate, Bankster, MIC Empire & Austerity Party, that runs the U$A. Stop wearing your ass as a hat, you fkn nicompoop & go get with the reality behind your B-S, Corporate, MSM headlines.

veritas vos liberabit ...

[-] -1 points by nazihunter (317) 3 months ago

OK. I haven't formed any opinion on this yet. Give it to me in summary fashion, will you?

[-] 5 points by shadz66 (18128) 3 months ago

Sorry dude, I can't spoon feed you your opinions and you gotta read and do the time if you want to understand the crimes ;-) The 2nd article by Jonathan Cook is probably the best primer and of course Seymour Hersh is the 'The Man' here although P.D. Scott's piece is more of an over-arching thesis but I won't hit you with another link as is my wont usually lol.

pax ...

[-] 1 points by nazihunter (317) 3 months ago

Most interesting, the first one. I was thinking of a few of those similarities myself, sometime back. Now that's what I'd call scary stuff.

[-] 5 points by shadz66 (18128) 3 months ago

Scary indeed & re. the Seymour Hersh related pieces, I just can't recommend those two enough to you too !! Also fyi : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N2Xh5eN2fXY @ you with a strong recommendation !

e tenebris, lux ...

[-] 1 points by nazihunter (317) 3 months ago

I'll definitely read 'em. and book the link. thanks.

[-] 7 points by shadz66 (18128) 3 months ago

You are more than welcome & I'll also humbly and genuinely recommend to you the video herein :

2nd link was added later due to my forum-post (1st link) having been banned for reasons unknown.

3rd link was then added as it was the article I excerpted and abridged on my now lost forum-post !!

pax ...

[-] -3 points by ZenDog (13324) from South Burlington, VT 3 months ago

you just said it ass wipe:

  • "The most difficult subjects can be explained to the most slow- witted man if he has not formed any idea of them already; but the simplest thing cannot be made lear to the most intelligent man if he is firmly persuaded that he knows already, without a shadow of doubt, what is laid before him." (Leo Tolstoy)

And I insist that your own conviction leads you to a mistaken assumption regarding the President that forces you to discount any and all other explanations for his behavior, even if they are more likely . . .

Or I dunno . . . perhaps you've been bribed . . . the plain fact is it is exceedingly strange to find someone claiming to be a brit insisting on the myth that both parties are the same regarding U.S. politics.

That's just like - what the fuk do you care?

But I get it, don't worry - you conservative shill

Go suck some Koch

[-] 1 points by shadz66 (18128) 3 months ago

You should take Renneye's good advice below and do some less 'Dog' and aspire to a li'l more 'Zen'. + :

I do ''care'' and could have given you such a long and passionate reply here but not sure you are worth it & I really don't need to fuel your Freudian fantasies about your beloved, 'can do no wrong', EmPOTUS !!!

pax ...

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[-] 3 points by Renneye (3314) 3 months ago

Gosh, am I ever glad to see you, Builder!

Life gets busy. I know that only too well, but I sure hope we see more of you again.

Oh...hey, the 'Moringa' supplements are working real nice!

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[-] -1 points by ZenDog (13324) from South Burlington, VT 3 months ago

no online conspiracy of libertarian lies, persuasive deceits, and repelican Koch.s0ckery is ever complete without the obligatory carpet bagging supplement snake oil saleslady . . .

Natural News is neither natural nor healthy

[-] 3 points by Renneye (3314) 3 months ago

Hahahah. Ya ya, I know...everyone's a kochsucker.

You really need a break. Go chop some wood or something. Get your mind right.

Try painting. That's what I'm doing right now. Kitchen cabinets. They look great!

You should get some quality supplements yourself. Especially a good B-Complex supplement. Keeps things calm, and keeps the 'creepies' away..if ya know what I mean? It separates the paranoia between the 'real', and the 'imagined'.

Also, take an extra quality vitamin B-12 (sublingual). Make sure it's 'Methylcobalamin', not Cyanocobalamin.

In fact, get your B-12 level checked by your doctor. Your 'intrinsic factor' may be gone and your body can't accept B-12 through the stomach. You may need monthly B-12 shots. Intrinsic Factor starts to diminish after the age of 50. It's very common. It might be a pain in the ass to get your levels checked, though. Doctors don't like to check it if there isn't an overt and very obvious problem, but by the time there's an outright problem, it's too late. It's like pulling teeth, I tell you. To complete the "B's", take a 30 day round of vitamin B1 (Thiamine). Do a 30 day run of B1 about every 6 months. Tres importante.

I think you could really use some Zinc, as well. But, you gotta be careful. It's very strong and can do damage if you overdo it. Use quality 'liquid' Zinc (Metagenics is a long reputable brand), for the best absorption. Use a dropper and put only half a mililitre in a glass of water each day. Should notice improvements in about a week. Do that for a good month, and if everything's okay, keep going with it. It's great maintenance.

Hmmmm. You know, I was gonna stop here...but, hell...I may as well round this off for a complete health regimen for you.

A good quality Fish Oil, is a must. No exceptions.

A good quality calcium/magnesium supplement is also a must. Make sure it has vitamin D3 (from cholecalciferol) in it, for the best absorption possible.

Finally, get yourself on a really good mutli-vitamin/mineral supplement.

Stay away from the drugstore brands. They're junk. With supplements, you gotta go with reputable brands from a reputable health store. No 'Centrum, One-A-Day' bullshit.

That oughta do it, I think. That's a well-rounded regimen that anyone over 50 years old should take as a good basic foundation for continued health and maintenance.

Seriously, Zen. Get to a reputable health food store. And Zen...run...don't walk. You need help, and right now!

Ultimately you should be seeing a good ND (Naturopathic Doctor), or better still, an Integrative Doctor, but if you can't or don't want to...this regimen is a nicely rounded one and you'll save yourself a few bucks.

And hey, let us know how you're doing in about a month, or so. I'd love to hear how things are coming along. ;-)

Well, back to painting!

[-] 0 points by ZenDog (13324) from South Burlington, VT 3 months ago

Keeps the paranoia down to the 'real', not the 'imagined'.

I keep trying to tell you people, I'm not paranoid. I just don't give a shit.

[-] 2 points by Renneye (3314) 3 months ago

Well, you're here. That would suggest different.

"I can't remember shit these days."

https://occupywallst.org/forum/the-debate-independence-or-partisanship/#comment-1027585

Like I said Zen...the B vitamins. They're all about the good neurological brain stuff and memory. Particularly extra B1 (Thiamine). But they work best when you're getting the whole spectrum of B's.

And take in a soothing song or something, would you!!

This one you posted was good. I couldn't stop singing it for a month.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xrC3Bf-CvHU

Hurry on now. Get to the health food store. Pitter Patter.

[-] -1 points by shooz (17782) 3 months ago

That site is the Alex Jones of anything natural.

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[-] 0 points by ZenDog (13324) from South Burlington, VT 3 months ago

I'm certain someone was running around peddling natural snooz way back when . . . and I know the fruitloops at world truth were prominent on that bullshit as well.

[-] 0 points by shooz (17782) 3 months ago

they were more fun, when they stuck to bigfoot and UFO's.

Now they peddle some rather dangerous, misinformative shit.

Look at the return of mumps and measles.

[-] 0 points by ZenDog (13324) from South Burlington, VT 3 months ago

or Aids denial in Africa . . .

[-] -3 points by ZenDog (13324) from South Burlington, VT 3 months ago

I just might do a damn sight better than that mutherfuker but certainly not on your account. Go fuk yourself - ya little brit-bot.

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[-] 4 points by shadz66 (18128) 3 months ago

He hates foreigners, so don't mind him but here are 3 reality checks to you for old time sakes and hello cobber ;-) & solidarity @ u + yrs [humans, chucks & 'pork-bone-puppy'] & also vry nc 2 hr th gd nws re. bees and Tasmania. Sorry I never got to read your 'removed' comment (^up there^) but gotta put up with that shit here to keep trying to bring the deeper truths to our other anglophone breathren & @ The 99% :

pax, amor et lux ...

Edit: Extreme shame re. the vindictive removal of Builder's inoffensive comment to which I replied above.

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[-] 3 points by shadz66 (18128) 3 months ago

I try not to think about that too much & carry on regardless + fyi :

pax ...

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[-] -1 points by shooz (17782) 3 months ago

Since you are allegedly in the UK and you do nothing but attack Americans, to the exclusion of any pertinent information of your own community, it would be YOU who HATES foreigners.

http://thinkprogress.org/climate/2014/04/09/3422063/england-town-sea-level-rise/

Look what's happening in Canada as the Neolibe(R)tarians continue to spread their philosophy.

http://o.canada.com/news/conservative-government-looking-to-bolster-canadas-arms-trade-with-developing-countries/

http://www.vice.com/read/canada-is-ramping-up-its-arms-exporting-trade

[-] 3 points by shadz66 (18128) 3 months ago

Aww, de-dums ! Are you feeling under ''attack'' ?!! Should I merely consider the UK my ''community'' in this globalised world and how come you have so internalised my criticisms of The US Corporatocracy - The 1% Lackeys and The 0.01% Parasite Class Oligarchy and taken what I say so personally, huh ?!!!

Have you swallowed one too many - 'Nationalism Pills' now ? D'you know what Oscar Wilde said about 'Nationalism' ? Is it a case of ... 'Amerika Uber Alles' and 'my oligarchs .. wrong or right' ? Should I just stick to matters'UK'? Does what the US does, have a disproportionate impact on the rest of the world ?

Why are you psychologically so aligned with The Ruling Class in The U$A ? Is there really any point in this dialogue ? Remember (cf.your 'Punk v Sharia thread) what happens when you exchange comments with me ? When you don't like what is said to you - you merely opt to ban, remove and censure, right ?

Nice links but what were their relevance here ? No point giving you any links but I append the following for any curious readers and leave it to them to judge their relevance here :

George Monbiot's article (1st link) is written from a UK perspective but the reality, alluded to therein - transposes itself totally to the USA and Gary Younge's excellent piece, speaks loudly for itself really.

e tenebris, lux ...

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[-] -1 points by nazihunter (317) 3 months ago

Leo Tolstoy? I thought I read that under definition of repelicans ! Hey, I'm doing a piece on ignorance. What is the post where flip calls you 'old'. ( poor flip :(

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[-] -2 points by ZenDog (13324) from South Burlington, VT 3 months ago

o I dunno - I might have the capacity but to store that much of what goes on here, but not the patience nor the tools to facilitate that kind of granularity on the drill down and thus make it all worthwhile.

[-] 1 points by nazihunter (317) 3 months ago

I was just thinking that! Well I can't even keep track of the posts.

[-] 2 points by ZenDog (13324) from South Burlington, VT 3 months ago

and did you know? At least 2 witnesses to the assassination, who were left handed are said to have committed suicide, by shooting themselves in the head with their right hands . . .

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[-] 1 points by ZenDog (13324) from South Burlington, VT 3 months ago

there is of course no case for capitalism that may legitimately be posed on an OWS forum. Not that I personally oppose capitalism, in fact, I really do wish that Capitalism were practiced here in the U.S. Not that I really know what it looks like, because we've never seen it.

I'm so sick of these Anarcho_Capitalist scum attempting to capitalize on the OWS tendency to favor libertarian ideals and anarchy in general.

These are the minions of banksters come among us to lie and bend our trajectory to their desired aim.

[-] 1 points by ZenDog (13324) from South Burlington, VT 3 months ago

Lying libertarian scumbags will attempt to boil every single candidate down to a single issue - they are part of the establishment. It's really a similar focus as that above, a similar goal, only approached from a very different direction.

  • Just don't vote.

I say that's bullshit. I say libertarians are bullshit. I say they are unAmerican, cowardly, scum.

And the leadership of the libertarians are all Koch sucking coal or oil men.

Global warming is here.

The repelican party is DONE

[-] 2 points by ZenDog (13324) from South Burlington, VT 3 months ago

that's right mutherfukers vote it down. go ahead. won't change the facts. [Global Warming is right out in the fuking parking lot and your day of reckoning swiftly approaches.

here's some of that lame stream main stream media you fukers abhor - now I see why - IT'S YOUR DEATH KNELL

[-] 0 points by ZenDog (13324) from South Burlington, VT 3 months ago

same same my ass

[-] 0 points by ZenDog (13324) from South Burlington, VT 3 months ago

I've updated the post to provide further evidence of that vast difference that does exist between party. Conservative Koch.suckin repelicans won't like it of course, but fuk them.

[-] 0 points by ZenDog (13324) from South Burlington, VT 3 months ago

Yet another clear indication of partisan ideological divide - chasm more like - that runs through both houses of Congress turned up in the news over the weekend.

I updated the op in an attempt to keep the forum informed regarding the facts.

The fact is, these parties are not the same.

[-] 0 points by ZenDog (13324) from South Burlington, VT 3 months ago

the parties are not the same and only a lazy lyin fool would insist otherwise.

[-] 0 points by ZenDog (13324) from South Burlington, VT 3 months ago

just look at that little trashy macaque

He can't even get a grip when given pictures

case for capitalism my ass

[-] 1 points by ZenDog (13324) from South Burlington, VT 3 months ago

there is no case for Anarcho-Capitalism

[-] 0 points by ZenDog (13324) from South Burlington, VT 3 months ago

why just look at that little shit throwing monkey stinkle

; D

[-] 0 points by ZenDog (13324) from South Burlington, VT 3 months ago

you libertarian scumbags . . . I assume the shooz that were left lying on the road about a mile from here were something you clowns stole from some homeless guy . . . and now he has no shooz . . .

and all to try an' be scary or somethin'. Fukin scumbags

YOu will just have to get your little minions to try harder

fukin snakes

come n' get me scumbags

[-] 0 points by ZenDog (13324) from South Burlington, VT 3 months ago

zero points - that didn't take long. Can't do any better than that?

don't worry mutherfukers, I'm already locked n' loaded

you fukers better get trainin'

[-] 0 points by ZenDog (13324) from South Burlington, VT 3 months ago

it would be really fun to get all five of these red neck mutherfukers in a room, and toss in some flash bangs. As soon as they begin to recover, toss in a few more. Just keep that up till they go fuking bat shit crazy.

libertarian scumbags

Corporations do not have Tongues

[-] 0 points by shooz (17782) 3 months ago

http://www.democraticunderground.com/1017184612

What more in the way of proof is needed?

Thanks to a (R)epelican't stacked court.

[-] 1 points by ZenDog (13324) from South Burlington, VT 3 months ago

thanks man - I couldn't resist putting it up.

[-] 0 points by shooz (17782) 3 months ago

Watch, 'em change the subject.

They always do when faced with reality.

I'll post Bernie's reaction later.

Just like hchc posting bullshit reactions to things I've said and then deleting them. It's part of the MO of the soap opera of the banned.

Fuck 'em.

Libe(R)taian bullshit all around us.

[-] 1 points by ZenDog (13324) from South Burlington, VT 3 months ago

Their day is numbered - I mean, I'm sure they are all getting paid, and probably it isn't more than one person, maybe two. Soon enough their paychecks will be cut off, you watch.

IT's fuked up, but Global Warming is both, a Terrible, a beautiful, thing.

[-] 1 points by shooz (17782) 3 months ago

When all they have is shit.

Shit is all they toss around.

Like monkeys in cages.

[-] 0 points by ZenDog (13324) from South Burlington, VT 3 months ago

It must really drive 'em nuts having their major justification for not participating undercut with pictures . . .

only the obstinately stupid could possibly fail to get it.

[-] 1 points by shooz (17782) 3 months ago

I like how the place will dead, until you or I post something and then the trolls all come out to play.

all they got is shit, so that's all they can toss around.

sick motherfuckers.

Did you notice that these fuck head libe(R)tarians failed notice the GM death panels that killed to save 57 cents on an ignition switch?

Oh no.. that's just market forces.

[-] -1 points by ZenDog (13324) from South Burlington, VT 3 months ago

I'm surprised they didn't pick it up as evidence that GM should have been allowed to fail.

[-] 0 points by shooz (17782) 3 months ago

They're waiting for CATO/Koch headquarters to put something together for them.

You didn't really think they could think for themselves, did you?

Or perhaps they were waiting for word from the head of the soap opera of the banned to give them the green light?

they do need a leader, you know.

[-] 0 points by ZenDog (13324) from South Burlington, VT 3 months ago

You didn't really think they could think for themselves, did you?

LoL! Even with pictures they do kinda fail, don'T they.

That's good tho - because soon they will be headless!

[-] 0 points by shooz (17782) 3 months ago

Unfortunately, they aren't anywhere near done yet.

They have all the Koch money to spend.

http://thinkprogress.org/climate/2014/04/02/3421941/house-passes-bridenstine-bill/

[-] 1 points by ZenDog (13324) from South Burlington, VT 3 months ago

what a stupid mutherfuker

Hopefully it doesn't even come up for a vote in the Senate.

[-] 0 points by shooz (17782) 3 months ago

It's the amount of time, money and effort spent on this shit.

I don't know how it is in Vermont, but there's plenty of people around here who still fall for the Koch/ALEC/Alex Jones/FLAKESnews bullshit, about how it's about thousands and thousands of scientists who made this all up.

[-] -1 points by ZenDog (13324) from South Burlington, VT 3 months ago

Vermont is really fortunate. We have a skiing industry, tied tightly to tourism, and tourism accounts for 11.5% of all Vermont jobs - 2011.

I'm sure the ski industry is a significant part of that 11.5%. Our economy demands an honest look at the environment and an accurate assessment of the changing climate. It's a necessity.

Vermont suffered through almost 100 years of uninterrupted economic stagnation and decline, from about 1830 to 1940 or so. It was tourism that helped us begin to turn a corner, and that began really around 1880. The ski industry began around 1945.

And maple syrup is a significant agricultural product - nationally Vermont leads with sales of 1.3 million gallons in 2013. That was 40% of the U.S. total maple production.

It all comes down to economics. Agriculture, Tourism, and a century of hardship tells us we have to have the facts.

At least, that's what I put it down to. We also have excellent and highly credible political leadership. I'm sure that helps.

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[-] -1 points by shooz (17782) 3 months ago

My guess would be that FLAKESnews viewership would also be among the lowest of any State.

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[-] 0 points by ZenDog (13324) from South Burlington, VT 3 months ago

My guess would be that FLAKESnews viewership would also be among the lowest of any State.

That I can't say. Vermont used to be repelican years ago. More recently the state called first for Obama both times, and I think it was 67% for.

[-] 0 points by ZenDog (13324) from South Burlington, VT 3 months ago

Go ahead and compare position statements:

now compare with the scumbag liars:

The lyin mutherfukers.

the parties cannot be said to be the same in the least.

global warming is here.

the repelican party is DONE

[-] -2 points by ZenDog (13324) from South Burlington, VT 3 months ago

so there ya go hc - an msn source

ya fukin repelican scumbag

[-] -2 points by ZenDog (13324) from South Burlington, VT 3 months ago

ya just can't stand it can ya ya cowardly libertarian scumbag. Global warming separates the liars and the fools from the rest of humanity. Your fukin day is done

can ya hear me scumbag?

DONE

[-] -3 points by ZenDog (13324) from South Burlington, VT 3 months ago

go change your shirt you fuker and drive me deeper into negative territory - see if I care - ya lyin libertarian shill you

git go on go change

[Deleted]

[-] 0 points by ZenDog (13324) from South Burlington, VT 3 months ago

fuck you

I never said the dems represent the solution to America's ills. As John Corzine aptly illustrates, they do not . . .

But at least, among dems you will not find either that commitment to, nor that ideological dependence on, corruption, as a way of life, not to mention the main avenue to wealth, power, and success.

Do you understand the basic difference between an individual who knows remorse and one who does not? The principle defining trait of a repelcian is their sociopathy.

  • Hence, the fukers know no shame as they lie and they cheat - about the calamity that is Global Warming or the electoral process - IE deceit at a very fundamental level on very fundamental issues.

they are fukin scumbags, there is no getting around it - no denial. they are scum and even their own children should be ashamed of who these people are and what they represent.

[-] 0 points by JGriff99mph (507) 3 months ago

It is a way of life for em, the messaging is different though. Working very well still apparently.

[-] -1 points by flip (5408) 3 months ago

we agree here mr dog, and I congratulate you on an intelligent and reasoned response. the "fuck you" was not needed but I guess you feel differently. I wish you would respond to my comments in the same way but I am not too optimistic on that front. here is noam expanding on what you said -

SPIEGEL: So for you, Republicans and Democrats represent just slight variations of the same political platform?

Chomsky: Of course there are differences, but they are not fundamental. Nobody should have any illusions. The United States has essentially a one-party system and the ruling party is the business party.

SPIEGEL: You exaggerate. In almost all vital questions -- from the taxation of the rich to nuclear energy -- there are different positions. At least on the issues of war and peace, the parties differ considerably. The Republicans want to fight in Iraq until victory, even if that takes a 100 years, according to McCain. The Democrats demand a withdrawal plan.

Chomsky: Let us look at the “differences” more closely, and we recognize how limited and cynical they are. The hawks say, if we continue we can win. The doves say, it is costing us too much. But try to find an American politician who says frankly that this aggression is a crime: the issue is not whether we win or not, whether it is expensive or not. Remember the Russian invasion of Afghanistan? Did we have a debate whether the Russians can win the war or whether it is too expensive? This may have been the debate at the Kremlin, or in Pravda. But this is the kind of debate you would expect in a totalitarian society. If General Petraeus could achieve in Iraq what Putin achieved in Chechnya, he would be crowned king. The key question here is whether we apply the same standards to ourselves that we apply to others.

SPIEGEL: Who prevents intellectuals from asking and critically answering these questions? You praised the freedom of speech in the United States.

Chomsky: The intellectual world is deeply conformist. Hans Morgenthau, who was a founder of realist international relations theory, once condemned what he called “the conformist subservience to power” on the part of the intellectuals. George Orwell wrote that nationalists, who are practically the whole intellectual class of a country, not only do not disapprove of the crimes of their own state, but have the remarkable capacity not even to see them. That is correct. We talk a lot about the crimes of others. When it comes to our own crimes, we are nationalists in the Orwellian sense.

[-] 0 points by ZenDog (13324) from South Burlington, VT 3 months ago

I now have to rethink my position on your bran power.

You showed up here October 15, 2011, have apparently commented something on the order of 5000 times, and only now are coming to understand the depths of my intellectual capacity.

Admit it. you are a repelican and honesty is simply something you are not capable of . . . and before you answer that question, stop and realize: I got you already.

I am personally convinced you are the same clown who was parading around as one TonyBuontempo - and most likely as one hc before that. I'm convinced. But I will grant you - if you can get me to act as if this flip is an individual character, in time I might be persuaded that it is so.

I think you just didn't do your homework, and it dawned on you after I mentioned it of course that Fat Tony might in fact take an exception to your charade. He might not of course. What do I know. But if he did, that would be a real problem for you.

So now you are attempting to cut your lies a little closer to the truth - and most likely the reason for that is the boss said so.

No. I don't do drugs.

No. I don't drink.

Jefferson said:

I've been saying pretty much the same thing.

And now I say:

We fought a revolution to defeat the corruption of conservatism, parading as it was at the time beneath a Whig banner. We fought a Civil War to defeat the corruption of slavery, a conservative institution supported by conservative southern Democrats. It is conservatism that today insists there is no Global Warming and attempts to shape international trade policy to foster global corporate hegemony. War is all the conservative mind can grasp. We have defeated them twice before. We will do so again. We will remove the conservative hand from the helm of our nation, and we will cut it off.

[-] -1 points by flip (5408) 3 months ago

by the way - which side was our beloved Madison on?? in your reading of history - nice quotes by the way but when Jefferson - that lover of slaves (literally) made that quote - where did he put Madison?

[-] 1 points by ZenDog (13324) from South Burlington, VT 3 months ago

careful, careful your libertarian shillery is showing through . . .

[-] -1 points by flip (5408) 3 months ago

james Madison - can you answer the question - by the way - don't you have to go to work or something. it's MONDAY - did you forget?

[-] -1 points by flip (5408) 3 months ago

I am not tony anyone or hc but no way to convince you of that - nor do I need to. think what you like - i have no idea what you are talking about with fat tony and all. you have written to me, previously, that you don't try to make sense - so what should i think of that?I don't agree with you view of history. you claim that "we" will defeat conservatism - and who might that we be - the liberal wing of the business party. it is easily demonstrated that this is not the way to go. take a look at the liberals - Wilson, jfk, lbj - should i go on - no i don't think so. how about coffee and chocolate?

[-] -1 points by ZenDog (13324) from South Burlington, VT 3 months ago

think what you like

Thanks but I really don't need your permission. You fukers have very successfully destroyed this forum. Now your principle aim seems to be to simply reinforce the OWS myths of purpose - those principles ingrained from the outset that ensure little more than a role from the sidelines in shaping policy - and that from a strictly libertarian perspective at that.

Smart move I guess. But I'll bet it won't be long before your mask slips, yet again, and you are foaming your right wing whackery all over the place . . .

What you fukers don't get is I really don't give a fuk. I've been stalked before, and I've a low tolerance for it.

right wing whackery . . . haha.

fuk you

and as long as I am the example, I tend to agree.

mutherfukers

[-] 0 points by flip (5408) 3 months ago

you said - "You fukers have very successfully destroyed this forum." - now you are a self proclaimed mainstream democratic party supporter and you have come to an anarchist site - a site where the founders have specifically disavowed any partisan politics and i am destroying it. the logic is impressive - i think it was from kissenger that i first heard the phrase - "a logical illogicality."

[-] 3 points by ZenDog (13324) from South Burlington, VT 3 months ago

and you are completely ignoring the reality - of what this site was in terms of active participation only a month after you signed up, compared to what it is now, not to mention your complete avoidance of any discussion of how it came to be this way.

No mention of bottery or other assorted bullshit carried out not by dems or any dem supporters but rather by terrified libertarian scum.

Go back to your tea

mutherfuker

[-] -1 points by flip (5408) 3 months ago

you are right i did not mention it. that does not change in any way what i just wrote

[-] 2 points by ZenDog (13324) from South Burlington, VT 3 months ago

no but you did mention kissinger . . .

now what did I say

[-] 1 points by flip (5408) 3 months ago

i don't get it - but you are correct - i did mention henry k. now how about Madison. do you realize what an anti democratic (small d here) elitist he was. can you answer my question. and thanks very much for not throwing your usual insult. i really don't need them - gotta go to work - looking forward to your comments on Madison!

[-] -3 points by JGriff99mph (507) 3 months ago

ZD can't make any comparisons to website traffic here- and every other occupy site- to anything that went on about two years ago. Its just an attack machine, probably why things didn't work out for him/her.

Apparently no one has informed it that online traffic is usually a direct result of real traffic. Hence trending.

[-] -2 points by flip (5408) 3 months ago

that sounds convincing to me but i have no idea what you are talking about - i am old and not well informed about this type of thing

[-] 0 points by ZenDog (13324) from South Burlington, VT 3 months ago

did you know that - except for when you are attempting to plead a certain ignorance . . .

ahahahahahaa BWAAAAAAAAAAAHA HSADASFAHNDFAJDFK

whew

< ahem >

where was I? o yeah . . . ignorance . . . except for when you are attempting to plead a certain ignorance . . . you, jgriff, hc all use the same linguistic pattern and structure?

what's my point?

well. It's quite simple really.

you can change your ids as often as most people change their drawers, and it makes little difference. An informed opinion will not be swayed by such chicanery.

you should really take your Koch.suckery elsewhere . . .

[-] 0 points by JGriff99mph (507) 3 months ago

Basically if something is trending on twitter, its because its become a hot topic. If its an event, you will see lots of chatter on it over the internet. But something has to happen to create that.

We were in the streets across the entire nation. Then tptb - including people that ZD actively phone banked for the following fall (how sincere, eh?) decided that it needed to be shut down. Can't have the people actually getting involved!!

ZD is simply making a very poorly informed viewpoint on website traffic in general.

We all know the government pays trolls to go to sites and act deranged, promote status quo viewpoints, etc. Same things they do in real life at occupy. We also know the DNC and the RNC actively promote their parties via trolls.

They do this because they believe they have something to benefit from.

That being said, anyone can do an analysis on websites. I suggest ZD and Shooz so some analysis before jumping to conclusions on why occupy related web traffic is down.

[-] 0 points by flip (5408) 3 months ago

thanks very much - well done - I have personally seen govt agents trying to disrupt peace demos - disgusting! like some of the things going on here

[-] 0 points by shooz (17782) 3 months ago

Coming from a guy that's posted from Alex Jones, Breitbart, and the fucking John Birch Society, you really have no room to talk.

Not to mention your hate for the 99%.

[-] -2 points by JGriff99mph (507) 3 months ago

^point proven.

[-] 2 points by shooz (17782) 3 months ago

Thanks for the down votes, jerk. Let's me know I've told the truth.

Go back to Alex Jones.

[-] 1 points by shooz (17782) 3 months ago

Not mention your active participation in a group that attacked MANY posters in an effort to drive them from the forum.

Although you and they must be PROUD of your success, you really have no place at all trying to blame it on anyone but yourself and the rest of the assholes that participated in those activities.

Would you care to admit for the few remaining how many times you were banned for those, and other equally nefarious activities?

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[-] -1 points by ZenDog (13324) from South Burlington, VT 3 months ago

What's that? what did you just say?

and what did I just say? I said:

  • careful - your libertarian shillery is showing through

and there it is again.

But to answer your question: No, Kennedy did not carpet bomb the North Vietnamese. In fact, during the course of his administration our role in Vietnam did not rise beyond that of an advisory capacity in so far as the military itself is concerned. He was slain by a conservative bullet long before we began any serious buildup of U.S. forces in South East Asia.

you libertarian whore

[-] -1 points by flip (5408) 3 months ago

well, my mistake, i thought you had read the comment from Chomsky that was posted somewhere else- it was SOUTH Vietnam that kennedy carpet bombed - was it not? it does show your lack of knowledge of history though - the fact that you did not know that the liberal democrats bombed Vietnam - oh, yea , lbj was a liberal - did lots of good things - war on poverty, expansion of Medicaid - just so happened that he also sent my best friend to die in the jungle - for what was that again?

[-] -1 points by ZenDog (13324) from South Burlington, VT 3 months ago

Chomsky is blatantly indifferent to the fact that the CIA had been playing politics almost since its inception: Paperclip and Iran are two instances that clearly illustrate that.

Cointelpro illustrates that the FBI under Hoover wasn't above political machinations either.

The Bay of Pigs demonstrates that Kennedy wasn't down with the CIA plots as a matter of principle, and that when given the opportunity to reconsider, he just might.

I would suggest that Kennedy lacked a certain clarity around our mission and its motivations at the time when it comes to our involvement in Viet Nam. We were, after all, already involved. Nine Americans had already died in Viet Nam before Kennedy even came to office.

And it was after his assassination that the real escalation began. The only reason for singling out Kennedy among all of those involved, including Presidents, is to prevent the martyrdom of the man in the wake of assassination. I presume Johnson was much a victim of this conservative policy as Kennedy - given the fact of his predecessors assassination I'm sure he felt certain . . . constraints.

Chomsky overlooks all of that simply because it is irrelevant to his central point, the U.S. media as well as all of Congress were complicit in our involvement in Vietnam - which is an entirely broad over simplification of the facts. The world was much different by the time he wrote that from the time he was writing about, although only about 20 years had transpired.

And there was always Cronkite - thus concretely demonstrating the vast cultural differences that exited in the U.S. when comparing pre - and post - Nixon eras.

But you keep on, home in on that Kennedy disparagement line. It's a bit tired and worn out but I'm sure you conservative fuukers with your repelican shillery derive no end of pleasure in it. It's a clear tell but never mind.

I'm sure you really don't care.

Neither do I.

scumbag

[-] -2 points by ZenDog (13324) from South Burlington, VT 3 months ago

Chomsky is a fine individual, an intellectual of note and reputation. But certainly there is more on the plate of American politicians than simply whether we will wage war or not. Global Warming for instance.

He may be comfortable tarring the entire political establishment with a single brush, but that is not going to provide us any meaningful solutions.

And you only point to him because what he is saying is essentially: the system is so fuked up you might just as well throw it all out and start over. Such an unspoken suggestion provides a tremendous amount of security to those in power who abuse the public in the interests of corporate America.

You scumbag little anarcho-capitalist.

Fuk you.

Go flip mutherfuker

[-] 2 points by flip (5408) 3 months ago

you are an old dog so I will assume you know who Justine is - she sent this to me a while back - From: Justine Tunney Subject: Re: website trouble

What on earth are you talking about with the democratic party? We don't have anything to do with them. Not in the slightest. Don't believe the lies. I mean... we've got all this stuff about revolution on the website. :rolls eyes: You should know better if you've been on the site for the past few years :P .............ok, I am back now - .thanks for your reasonable response - I would much rather have a conversation than the usual throwing of insults. we did not need that last bit did we? here is noam's take on global warming and our president - "Venezuelan President Hugo Chavez, who died recently and was the object of mockery, insult, and hatred throughout the Western world, attended a session of the U.N. General Assembly a few years ago where he elicited all sorts of ridicule for calling George W. Bush a devil. He also gave a speech there that was quite interesting. Of course, Venezuela is a major oil producer. Oil is practically their whole gross domestic product. In that speech, he warned of the dangers of the overuse of fossil fuels and urged producer and consumer countries to get together and try to work out ways to reduce fossil fuel use. That was pretty amazing on the part of an oil producer. You know, he was part Indian, of indigenous background. Unlike the funny things he did, this aspect of his actions at the U.N. was never even reported.

So, at one extreme you have indigenous, tribal societies trying to stem the race to disaster. At the other extreme, the richest, most powerful societies in world history, like the United States and Canada, are racing full-speed ahead to destroy the environment as quickly as possible. Unlike Ecuador, and indigenous societies throughout the world, they want to extract every drop of hydrocarbons from the ground with all possible speed.

Both political parties, President Obama, the media, and the international press seem to be looking forward with great enthusiasm to what they call “a century of energy independence” for the United States. Energy independence is an almost meaningless concept, but put that aside. What they mean is: we’ll have a century in which to maximize the use of fossil fuels and contribute to destroying the world.

And that’s pretty much the case everywhere. Admittedly, when it comes to alternative energy development, Europe is doing something. Meanwhile, the United States, the richest and most powerful country in world history, is the only nation among perhaps 100 relevant ones that doesn’t have a national policy for restricting the use of fossil fuels, that doesn’t even have renewable energy targets. It’s not because the population doesn’t want it. Americans are pretty close to the international norm in their concern about global warming. It’s institutional structures that block change. Business interests don’t want it and they’re overwhelmingly powerful in determining policy, so you get a big gap between opinion and policy on lots of issues, including this one.

[-] -1 points by ZenDog (13324) from South Burlington, VT 3 months ago

so, what . . . you drop Jart's name and you think that will convey some sort of credibility for your nonsense? Flip? Not likely.

Jart is simply mistaken. She is entitled to her opinion. But you, you Anarcho-capitalist scumbag are a different matter altogether.

Anarcho.capitalists seem to think that just because an anarchist exhibits certain libertarian preferences they can be pushed right round the corner into Koch suckers bullshit.

WEll.

Maybe they can.

I will not be so persuaded.

flip

flippant

flipper

flip the house

flip the switch

flip the flip

flip the flipper

flip the flippant flipper

.

go fuk yourself

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[-] -1 points by ZenDog (13324) from South Burlington, VT 3 months ago

more than enough spine for your koch.suckery

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[-] -1 points by flip (5408) 3 months ago

the dog boy or Obama?

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[-] 1 points by flip (5408) 3 months ago

right on! the dog boy has made it clear where he stands - and it is not with ows

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[-] -1 points by ZenDog (13324) from South Burlington, VT 3 months ago

flip mutherfuker flip

[-] 0 points by ZenDog (13324) from South Burlington, VT 3 months ago

OWS? Not at all. OWS is an anarchist movement. I have stood in solidarity with OWS opposition to Wall Street, no matter how misguided their solutions may be. Anarcho.Communism can only work on a very small scale.

While I am here I do my best to point out linguistic fraudulent mutherfukers like yourself.

Go flip, mutherfuker

[-] 0 points by flip (5408) 3 months ago

if you think you are a linguist expert I am surprised. first you say "Jart is simply mistaken" in response to her statement that ." the democratic party? We don't have anything to do with them. Not in the slightest." - then you say "OWS is an anarchist movement" - what the hell are you smoking - I want some! anyway it is a small point - we all know your thoughts are not coherent. but I do want to thank you for coming out as a straight on democratic party supporter and o not an ows supporter. as for your thoughts on anarchism - who cares what you think. nobody with a brain thinks we will trying to institute an anarchist system in the near future - it is a vision for the future and a guide to what might be possible.

[-] -1 points by ZenDog (13324) from South Burlington, VT 3 months ago

fuk you scum bag. I've seen your kind before. You're a liar and a fraud. O Wait!

Hark!

your buddy Glenn Beckons . . .

you fukin scumbag

[-] 0 points by flip (5408) 3 months ago

that's it? that's all you got? what a sad case you are. to which lies are you referring? did you learn this tactic from shooz or did you come up with it yourself? so you have no response and all you can say is LIES! never pointing out one of them. don't you realize how weak that is - no - come on even a little boy would know - are you a little boy? you resort to name calling and screeching when your argument is destroyed - point by point. everyone here knows that - well maybe there are two who don't. don't you have a democratic facebook page or twitter account you can go to and do your thing. or better yet - how about having real debates and discussion. I would still like to know what you are smoking - I am concerned that you are probably drinking your medication - maybe not - you are up pretty early for a drunk.

[-] -1 points by ZenDog (13324) from South Burlington, VT 3 months ago

you are up pretty early for a drunk.

Really? and here I was thinking I had slept in this morning . . .

As far as your pattern of behavior goes - one need look no further than your last comment above

Personally I am convinced you are a part of that movement committed to ensuring OWS remains little more than a pallid reflection of the Tea party. Which explains why you are so dead set to repeat any refrain that comes to hand regarding dems, the political establishment, even *name dropping as I said earlier.

OWS is - or was - engaged in a political act even while it refuses to engage in any meaningful dialog with our political system. And you are here to make sure it stays that way - and thus, keep OWS sidelined from field and diverted away from any meaningful influence it might wield.

Which is a shame really. We could have done so much more.

But don't worry. You haven't destroyed anything - much less any argument I might make. The social discontent that gave rise to OWS still percolates, even if it has been muted somewhat by the impact of government response and an improving economic picture.

That discontent still percolates.

And Global Warming is at the door.

Meanwhile your leaders keep lying. And you keep crying: Both parties are the same.

you stupid fuker

All of your Koch.suckery is on it's way home . . .

[-] -1 points by flip (5408) 3 months ago

well done - thanks - except for the last obligatory obscenities. very funny by the way - the up early line. I agree with much of what you say here. I also understand the legitimate questions of tactics - such as should we have a list of demands. where we differ it seems is that you think you know the right way forward and I realize that nobody has a crystal ball. what I do not understand is how you dismiss my last comment above - am I wrong to ask you to point out the lies or was it something else? as far as name dropping goes - I don't think you know what that phrase means. to point out that one of the founders of occupy says - " the democratic party? We don't have anything to do with them. Not in the slightest." is not name dropping. I know you don't like it but you and the shooz boy should call it by its real name. yours is a tactic of mainstream politicians and it has no place here.

[-] 0 points by ZenDog (13324) from South Burlington, VT 3 months ago

you think you know the right way forward

It's not a question of right or wrong - it is simply a question of effectiveness and expedience.

To suggest that there is no leadership among OWS members is a lie OWS members tell themselves - an examination of any GA will reveal silent acquiescence to the leadership of a small core of individuals. Yet as a whole the GA process proved itself highly ineffective at organizing the movement - its slow and ponderous method of consensus building made it extremely time consuming just to decide that the goals of PETA were not a major priority.

That constant refrain both parties are the same stands as another deceit that OWS . . . faithful . . . insist must be true, yet it is not and no one examines whether in fact it is or not. Such a complete intellectual deficit regarding domestic politics allows individuals such as yourself to insulate OWS from any meaningful impact on the political process and in part do so with a single minded focus on the mythology . . .

which you do very well . . .

I'm sure the Koch.suckers are very pleased with your efforts. Did you know they paid for the Tea Party? I'm certain they pay for you too. Among dems there is no hard core demands of adherence to party discipline, and therefore little to fear from them.

Yet that is often your selling point. Fear. You are a liar and a fool I say. That is my opinion.

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[-] -1 points by nazihunter (317) 3 months ago

Beware of two trolls, flip and JGriff, there just here causing trouble.

[-] 1 points by ZenDog (13324) from South Burlington, VT 3 months ago

it's one person with multiple sock puppets I'm sure

[-] 3 points by nazihunter (317) 3 months ago

My thoughts exactly. This flip can't handle facts. He also knows how to argue both sides of an argument and win both. Classic symptoms of repelicanism. Then, he and his sock puppets give each other congrats on their genius. Classic, classic repelicanism.

[-] 0 points by ZenDog (13324) from South Burlington, VT 3 months ago

Fuck the Kochsuckers

I'm not creating more ids just to compete. In my view, that's concession.

I'd rather just shoot myself in the head . . . or take an axe to some conservative money man

Either would be preferable to the lie of yet another id

fuk the scumbags

[-] -1 points by ZenDog (13324) from South Burlington, VT 3 months ago

system malfunction mutherfukers

it must really chafe your delicate ass no end to find that I treat you just like the jail house bitch you really are.

fuk you scumbag

you go read alinsky

and stop pm.ing me

you jailhouse bitch

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[-] -2 points by ZenDog (13324) from South Burlington, VT 3 months ago

huh? wut? wassthat?

  • from PM:

    • JGriff99mph said 2 minutes ago at April 13, 2014, 4:42 p.m. EST (delete)

    • 75% of the posts on your Same-Same post are from you and Shooz, whoever the two of you are.

    • It would seem you have an agenda.

um, yeah . . . the OP generally spells it out pretty clearly - it's the utter refutation of that bullshit piece of establishment dogma that both parties

  • are bad

  • are equally culpable

  • are the same

I mean, it really shouldn't take a genius to see it. Just read the post. Was I unclear? I can show you establishment politicians echoing that very sentiment: it could be either party . . .

can we find corruption among either party? I'm sure we can . . .

But only one party makes of corruption a plank of party platform

global warming denialist mutherfukers

lyin ryan social program evisceraters

.



.

on a side note: I've told you to stop sending me private messages

[-] 2 points by JGriff99mph (507) 3 months ago

"can we find corruption among either party? I'm sure we can . . ."

Its very hard for you to get too in depth on that one, eh?

Better stick to the attack style political ads I guess.

[-] -1 points by ZenDog (13324) from South Burlington, VT 3 months ago

establishing motivation behind a particular voting record can be challenging and difficult at best. IF you would engage in an exploration of that nature then you must first eliminate those who are blatantly corrupt. Vermont's DC delegation is not blatantly corrupt - then again, they are not repelican. In any case, I can't speak to the rest of the democratic or independent legislature in anything other than the most general of terms.

Of course, anyone can pick out those instances that do stand apart from the norm. Murtha's galbladder for example.

While I am not really familiar with the particulars in his case, and while it must be said that it is almost always far better for the corrupt to witness the facts of their own corruption aired before all under a brilliant and blazing sun and bright blue sky . . .

nevertheless . . . I do not chafe when corruption comes to an end even by accident

What I do object to, and that most strenuously, is this entire diversion of resources away from solutions, solutions that are based on facts that are clear and irrefutable.

Why? Why are we assisting in the repelican policy of ushering people out of one door while they usher the money in another

[-] 3 points by JGriff99mph (507) 3 months ago

Because your solutions are to put in more corrupt people. I mean, jesus you just said if Bernie doesnt run, you would vote for Hillary. And this from someone who claims voting and politicians are the answer to everything.

Almost as if you have been completely asleep or very very young.

Vermont has relatively few problems because its Vermont. No pain no gain.

Go to NY. Go get a dose of what its like to live in a rampant police state, throwing people in jail all over, taking your rights, shipping out your jobs, etc etc etc.

Like I always say, your beloved Dems helped to SHUT DOWN the very cause and site you are on.

If thats enough to get you to say fuck em, then probably nothing ever will be. Or you are simply here to pollute.

[-] -2 points by ZenDog (13324) from South Burlington, VT 3 months ago

Like I always say, your beloved Dems helped to SHUT DOWN the very cause and site you are on.

no fukin wonder, you same same libertarian shill

and by the way I guess you completely missed this:





we know who the enemy is :

Repelicans to undermine the Occupy Movement:

+ The Koch Suckers


and we know who the TeaParty is:

and:

More on the TeaParty:



And we know Otpor was funded by repelicans:, including:

see also:

[-] 0 points by JGriff99mph (507) 3 months ago

Go ask the people who run this site what they think of your short sighted garbage.

[-] -1 points by ZenDog (13324) from South Burlington, VT 3 months ago

I don't care what they think

and I don't care if you are referring to Jart or to adbusters

I just don't care

I keep telling you that and . . . Like a typical conservative . . . you just don't listen

FACTS I want FACTS and none of your complete bullshit

[-] -2 points by ZenDog (13324) from South Burlington, VT 3 months ago

so what - I can't comment at all?

fine

fuk you

libertarian koch.sucking cunts

[-] -2 points by ZenDog (13324) from South Burlington, VT 3 months ago

hand these libertarian fukers around here pictures and still they cannot grasp simple reality . . .

[-] -2 points by ZenDog (13324) from South Burlington, VT 3 months ago

yeah-ya - msm sources my ass

stupid mutherfukers

[-] -3 points by elf4 (-4) 3 months ago

ZenDog I guess living up in the backwoods of Vermont, you never acquired any "street smarts". Only a po dunk dolt would let themselves be played so easily by our political false dichotomy.

It's a con, a street hustle. Wake up! Get out of your country cabin and look around.

Part of the con they are so easily playing you with is called the Hegelian dialectic (look it up). That's all the dog and pony show stuff you so easily get mesmerized by. The good cop// bad cop ploy that you extol as a clear sign of political contrast. These battles are allowed to be played out so the public can vent through discourse and believe in self determination.

All of this political theatre is meant to distract and captivate the public on ancillary issues. The major core issues in our society do NOT change with EITHER party. Such as the FED, the military industr cmplx, crony capitalism, energy, money in politics, globalization,etc

It is so frustrating for those of us that see through this con like glass. to watch fools fall for this nonsense.

[-] 1 points by shooz (17782) 3 months ago

What made you think you needed another puppet to make this comment?

It's you who's fallen through the looking glass.

[-] 0 points by ZenDog (13324) from South Burlington, VT 3 months ago

right, right and so the vast ideological differences that we can examine state by state are . . . what exactly? More theater?

The Jeffords Jump was what? Theater?

Why don't you stop using 16 different identities to make the same point? Oh yeah, because . . . you could not create a false sense of consensus with a single id.

Don't worry. I get it.

Fuk you

ya lyin libertarian shill

I'd like ta cut off your head and shit down your throat, just to see what you think of my street smarts then . . . ya lyin fuker