Forum Post: Protesters - whats in this for you? - When its over, what about you?
Posted 12 years ago on Nov. 6, 2011, 7:12 p.m. EST by thomasmiller
(163)
This content is user submitted and not an official statement
Ok, lets talk some common sense. When all is said and done, what is in it for you? You could be searching for a job right now or getting educated or improving your situation somehow. If and when this is over with, what is going to happen to you after you spent all this time at the camp? Are there jobs out there for professional protesters? I think you are wasting time right now because when its all over there will be a few people behind the scenes who benefited...the labor unions will benefit, but you will go on your merry way with EMPTY HANDS.
Think about it...you can't change the world, but you can change your own personal situation. There are jobs out there. For example, there are good paying jobs out in Williston, North Dakota...hey its not the best place in the world, but the pay is very good and jobs available. You will not accomplish anything by living in a park. Please think about this...
"What's in it for me" is the mindset that created every problem we have as a global society.
Thank you.
Agreed, "what's in this for you", so perhaps you would consider our group's proposal of an alternative online direct democracy of government and business at http://getsatisfaction.com/americanselect/topics/strategically_weighted_policies_organizational_operating_structures_tactical_investment_procedures_as_of_11_6_2011 , for this is a small-business-bottom-up approach, not today's big-business-top-down approach, so if agreed, join our group's 20 members committed to that plan at http://finance.groups.yahoo.com/group/StrategicInternationalSystems/
It's simple minded people like you that just lay down and put up with the bullshit of the United States "Government" that make changing the world impossible. Before you go and criticize the people who are standing up for themselves and what they believe in do some research of your own and get educated on whats really going on and whose actually in charge. This country was founded on the beliefs that every one should have a say in the way we run things with and an equal and fair opportunity for every to prosper in their own individual lives. We're not lazy, we're not dumb, we're simply a group of people that have come together and decided we want a change in the way things operate. At the end of the day when you're lying on your death bed, what do you have to take with you? Not the "money" or success you've accomplished or the material things you own. It's the moments you have with the people you encounter and the positive memories you make of it. The world shouldn't have social classes, their shouldn't be anyone who is more important then the next we are all the same we we're all born equal, and we should work towards helping one another not ourselves. Personal profit is something the government has made appealing to you instead of humanity towards one another like they should have. It's a sad world we live in and I'm scared for my children and the children of theirs. So before you're so quickly to judge the people asking for a change, ask yourself if you really think this is the best way for use to prevail as a human race. But I'm just a dumb 20 year old COLLEGE student what the hell could I possibly know right?
Well put. Thomas isn't very bright, he thinks there's nothing wrong with this country just because his personal situation isn't that bad. And his comment just below mine, about it always being hard to find a job, even in the '80's, for example, is just not true. I remember those days (fondly). In the late '70's and the '80's, there were plenty of jobs, at least here in the Midwest. Probably out west too, Cal was booming at that time.
Even if there truly wasn't anything wrong with this country, there's still plenty of things wrong with the world as a whole, and being the top country that we are we should be the first ones to reach out and lend a hand. Instead of entering and starting wars that there's no need for why can't we start a revolution for the bettering of all humans, whether americans or not. The only way to do any of this is by fixing the problems we have here at home first. And they wonder why the rest of the world hates us. We're nothing but the bullies of world, and thats not the type of country i want to live in.
I couldn't agree more. I think if we clean our own house first, then the ripple effect would begin to show benefits worldwide. Once the wall fell, the US should have gone about bettering the world. Apparently, the 'powers that be' decided we should rule the world instead.
Its never been easy to get a job....even during the best of times. Talk to anyone who applied for a job in the 90s or 00s or even 80s...they will all say something like they put out 200 resumes to find a job.
So look, no one is trying to screw you over, but life is hard by default and you have to work your way through it. Throwing a tantrum at the world will not solve anything and, finally, there is no Utopia. Utopia is an imaginery place.
No one is throwing a "tantrum" here first off. We are a peaceful gathering of people who are questioning our own democracy. Which last time I check wasn't against the "law". So what exactly are you benefiting from by heckling us and telling us we can't do this. I don't come to your "job" and tell you you can't complete a task that you should know how to do since after all it's what you went to school for right? So what gives you the right to criticize true americans putting the democracy to the ultimate test, by putting the people back in it. Americans today think that just because they go to the polls and check off 1 of 3 or 4 names that they are taking part in their democracy, when really it doesn't matter what you put down on that senseless piece paper they could throw any one into office they choose and people like you would never ask any questions. Asking questions and bringing these issues to the test is the only way anyone will ever make a change. As for the Utopia you brought up, no one here is looking for an Utopia. We simply want to make a change for the better for all humans as one, not individual prosperities while others suffer.
We have local opportunities for protesters...
www.uponlocal.com
Apply here:
http://uponlocal.com/up-on-local-media/node/add/candidate
Get a job Hippy
http://occupywallst.org/forum/forum-topics/#comment-172997
hehe ... that's Great Matt... bk-marked.. I'll try to help ;)
"Think about it...you can't change the world, but you can change your own personal situation."
Isn't that what the Globalists achieved? They changed the World. Why didn't they just focus on changing their own personal situation? Why are you so obsessed with discouraging some people from changing the World, but so fast to accept the desires of others to change the World? The USA was not always in this bad shape, she is now, but change is a fact of life Steve, not just for me or you, but for everyone. Why not direct some of that change? Why live so passively?
We all are focused on changing our own personal situation. I am. I created my own business and boy its hard work, but Im making money and improving my life. Remember, you might have children one day like me. You have to focus on that.
First of all, congratulations on the family and the business. You are a good model, for some people, but not for all people. Let us remember that entrepreneurship, as a substitute for Corporate employment, has been tried in Cuba, with little success. Also, let us remember that the do it on your own model is not a great model for the future Super Power. Our children will need to know how to deal with a World that does not favor the do it yourself model. Chinese students are raised to work within relationship networks and to reject anyone refusing to help members,within the relationship network.
The success of the individual depends on his or her subordination to senior and elder members of the network, in exchange for the elders advancing the best interests of the younger member. If the USA is a second rate power, then why adopt a point of view that did not contribute to the economic and political conditions necessary to maintain US Global power? Why adopt the ways of a dying empire? Would you embrace Command economics, after watching the Soviet Union collapse? So why dabble in an individualist, sink or swim Neo Liberal economic outlook, that did not benefit the USA, as a whole, even if it helped you, in the final analysis?
Also, if this Neo- Liberal economic approach leads to the rise of China, India and Brazil, wouldn't it make sense to kill off Neo Liberalism, from the perspective of these Nations? After all, after the Reagan Neo liIberal Revolution is over and the USA is still bsing about starting mom and pop shops and digging ditches, for what purpose can the new Super Power, that is China, have for your system? Shall they send jobs abroad, to the USA, so they can become a second rate power? Should China eliminate the means of undermining China, by doing away with or marginalizing the persons, policies and conditions that led to the fall of the USA?
I will not compromise the way I would like to live for work. I only have so much time on earth so I must live my life my way. Mind you I have created a job for myself because I saw there was nothing out there for me but this does not have anything to do with the changes that have to be made. It is not just about "finding a job". It is about the enslavement of american people by manipulating the value of our monetary system. It is about becoming a free world for real. As in, a world where your freedom to be the person you want and basic survival it to be is held above the interests of the 1%.
What would you propose we do? Adopt a communist or socialist type system? Radically change the US Constitution? I believe most people are just angry because the economy isnt good right now...however, I do not believe most people want to change the system radically as most here in this forum are proposing to do.
Listen to me, things are just fine right now. Its all your state of mind...its all in your head and you are allowing the world to get to you. Remember this country has been through some truly bad times like real slavery, civil wars, etc. These are truly good times and I wouldnt ruin it by suggesting we all convert over to a system that is radically different then what we got.
Americans ignore the insanity and incompetence of the government
read more -- http://overthecoals.blogspot.com/
Let's begin with the budget and the squandering of trillions of dollars on more and more weapons. Only raving maniacs would create the American foreign policy and defense policy. Americans do it with a straight face as if they were sophisticated and educated people.
The economists and bankers in America have created policies that allow and promote wild gambling with derivatives that they claim are complex as if they worked. They worked to destroy the banking system and put 50,000,000 Americans out of work with the globalization policy that is nothing more than simple slavery of Chinese workers. That slavery is hidden behind the bogus claim that China's currency is too strong. If China allowed its currency to rise in value to the dollar, the US debt they own $1.137 trillion (the same as it was in August 2010) would be paid back with half of what they loaned.
The Chinese government isn't stupid. They aren't going to take half of what they loaned. The American people are completely uninformed nitwits who have no clue that the government they believe can't be voted out of office with a 3rd party, would be gone if they heard what SCREWED AGAIN is trying to publish for them.
The ignorance and incompetence of the American government is displayed by the liars that divert attention to 9/11 every day. The American people refuse to hear about and understand the evidence that proves clearly the 9/11 was a direct attack by Bush who was warned officially more than 40 times and chose to use the Al-Qaeda attack as a false flag for the incidents revealed by SCREWED AGAIN.
what is in it for us?... Pride & Integrity ... what's in it for you? thomasmiller
I will be honest with you. I lost my job back in 2008. I struggled for a while, but then I found work and then soon I started my own business. I work hard each day and I have work to complete before the morning comes. If I were to join you, then there would be nothing in it for me except losing what I do have.
I dont know how a person can camp somewhere from day to day...night to night...except maybe if they are homeless and crazy.
you don't have to camp... just support us.. we have nothing else to lose... except what is left of our country
Brad, let me give you some common sense. The United States has always been this way throughout history. Lets take the days of the wild west. If you lived during that time, you might think everything was falling apart. The 1960s-1970s were no picnic either. I guess I could go on and on, but there have been very few comfortable times in the US. I can tell you this much though...laying around a camp and telling the Bank of America teller off will not solve your problems...even if the Occupy world finds its solution, your problems will still not be solved.
I will be blunt. You need to find yourself a job, find yourself a woman and just move on with your life.
you don't don't understand Thomas... read a hundred of these threads... it will all make sense... we need to take back our country... or our children will not have one....
So are you proposing taking back the country by brute force like the American Revolution of the late 1700s? Would you kill me with a gun if it meant to take back this country? I dont want to be killed, I dont want my children to be killed. I would like for you to see this for what it is. The economy is bad right now, but it will get better if you work through it. Recessions come and go every 5-7 years. Please do not tell me you want to take up arm and kill fellow Americans to take back the country. Please do not say that.
"The economy is bad right now, but it will get better if you work through it."
Wishful thinking IMHO, considering the advances of robotics and other automation, better design, the accumulation of infrastructure, and voluntary social networks. We are seeing the death spiral of wage labor as more people get laid off and that big pool of unemployed further drives down wages, while at the same time automation continues.
There were zero net new jobs created during the last decade in the USA despite GDP growing about 25% and the population growing. That is the new normal IMHO. We may see some blips of job growth, especially with government intervention, but we are going to need a "basic income" or other more substantial intervention.
With that said, I think you make some good points on the tension between doing stuff for oneself and doing stuff for the community.
A "basic income"? Like everyone gets an automatic check? How would that work?
As one example, take one half the GDP (yes, via taxes or whatever, including renting government assets like spectrum or fishing rights or timber rights), and redistribute it so everyone gets $2000 per month from birth. That would leave a GDP of the size of the USA's GDP in the 1990s to motivate those to work who needed to be motivated by money. It was enough in the 1990s. Why should it not be enough now?
read.... the posts... this is non-violent .... and seriously... we want justice ... we want the money back that has been stolen from this country... we want the middle class restored... we want job's for anyone who want's one...
If this were non-violent, then why are you antagonizing the police and doing things to get them to grab you? Why are you blockading businesses and effecting innocent lives negatively? Why are you breaking the law and asking to be arrested? Is that what peaceful people do?
this is wasting my time... read the forums
My question still is whats in it for you...like I said...when all this ends then what will your life be like? You need to pull yourself up and start being constructive with your life then pitching a tent in Manhattan or Oakland. Even if Occupy is successful then who will hire you...where will your family be?
I might come out to Zuccotti one day just to meet some of you. I truly care about the people who immerse themselves in this event. I wonder what you are doing with your lives while everyone out there is trying to expand their lives...