Forum Post: People... I Have Your Solution
Posted 13 years ago on Oct. 15, 2011, 2:20 a.m. EST by kevinsutavee
(209)
This content is user submitted and not an official statement
you've gained the world's attention...now before you lose it.. i propose the following:
first it needs to be realized that designing political and economic systems have been the undertaking of the world's best and brightest minds through the ages.
it is blatently obvious that the world is need of a NEW humane and just economic and political system...in the face of rapid modernization and globalization.
THAT SAID:
crowd source the names of the best minds from around the world to come together for a "summit" where they can hash out the details and form a concensus for a proposed NEW system..
this is a vast undertaking...these minds should include the best and the brightest from a cross section of schools of thought.. economists, politicians, military leaders, proffessors, etc...
start with compiling a list of candidates...there needs to be a structure, if you think you can achieve something long-lasting without structure... i cant help you.
ows needs a leader group to administrate this.
this system is breaking down..and without a new one to take its place...what do you have?
a mess much bigger than what you are protesting now..
troll
troll? what does that mean in respect to this context?
Changing is a risk that can openning to progress...
It is a dumbass's response when they cannot think of anything else to say :)
It means somebody who intentionally tries to bait other people into a flame war.
Like...if I went to a Libertarian's website and posted this -
"This morning I was awoken by my alarm clock powered by electricity generated by the public power monopoly regulated by the US Department of Energy.
I then took a shower in the clean water provided by the municipal water utility. Then, I brushed my teeth with that water, filtered to standards set by the EPA and my state.
After that, I turned on the TV to one of the FCC regulated channels to see what the National Weather Service of the National Oceanographic and Atmospheric Administration determined the weather was going to be like using satellites designed, built, and launched by the National Aeronautics and Space Administration. I watched this while eating my breakfast of US Department of Agriculture inspected food and taking the drugs which have been determined as safe by the Food and Drug Administration.
At the appropriate time as regulated by the US Congress and kept accurate by the National Institute of Standards and Technology and the US Naval Observatory, I get into my National Highway Traffic Safety Administration approved automobile and set out to work on the roads built by the local, state, and federal Departments of Transportation, possibly stopping to purchase additional fuel of a quality level determined by the Environmental Protection Agency, using legal tender issued by the Federal Reserve Bank and printed by the Federal Bureau of Engraving and Printing. On the way out the door I deposit any mail I have to be sent out via the US Postal Service and drop the kids off at the public school.
I park my car on the street, paved and maintained by the Department of Transportation, and put quarters issued by the United States Mint into the parking meter.
Then, after spending another day not being maimed or killed at work thanks to the workplace regulations imposed by the Department of Labor and the Occupational Safety and Health Administration, I drive back to my house which has not burned down in my absence because of the state and local building codes and the fire marshal's inspection, and which has not been plundered of all its valuables thanks to the local police department.
I then log onto the Internet which was developed by the Defense Advanced Research Projects Administration and post on freerepublic and fox news forums about how SOCIALISM in medicine is BAD because the government can't do anything right. Keep government out of my Medicare!"
...I would obviously be trying to start shit. So a troll (well the lazy variant anyway) would be a shit starter.
Ha! That's hilarious.... very clever ;)
thats very funny
Voters’ turnout in North America is constantly going down and people are disillusioned with the electoral process and feel it has now become a bit meaningless to vote. It is not enough for most people just to vote once every four years to elect someone that will later be corrupted or do whatever.
In order to create a better democracy, we need to be able to bypass at least some of the representative process. Modern communications is now allowing us to say what we want as individuals and we no longer need to be represented by people in parliament to take decisions for us. The role of the government should be to propose directions society could take but letting the people decide through referendums (direct democracy). This process, while alleviating corruption by removing some power to elected people, would allow some decisions that no political party would ever attempt to take because they would often be against the interests of influent lobby groups and powerful corporations.
So far, the main stomping block for e voting taking on is revolving around confidentiality (anonymity) and hacking concerns. Those issues could be addressed by having an open e voting system by which the database, although anonymous, would be open allowing voters to verify that their vote is accounted for and accurate. The users could get a random number identifying them in the database and check if that number (or key) is associated with the correct vote for the given referendum, many could be run simultaneously. The best would be to create a package using maybe Open Office as a way for the user to manipulate the database to verify his/her vote and analyze the data if desired. The difficulty in having a representative and legitimate vote is to be able to use the electoral database for the constituencies to generate the individual keys; maybe someone would have to be elected the old fashion way clearly stating this goal as a platform... Looking at what is happening in the Arab world, this might be a way to quickly implement a form of democracy in places where there is nothing yet to support it. Your movement is very fertile ground for these ideas to take roots, there are highly educated motivated people in your group that could make this a reality and elaborate a system that would account for minority rights, server setups, phone interface etc. It could also (one can dream) create a whole new world where every voice can finally be heard and be as important towards decision making as anyone else. No matter the size of the voter’s bank account or number of influential friends: we have to take the power back.
How we can easily Reform Wall Street: Take away their powers once again.
"We are here Congress because we want to bring BACK the Glass-Steagall Act of 1933 http://www.investopedia.com/articles/03/071603.asp#axzz1aPEc3wX which saved our country from the Great Depression by preventing banks and insurance companies from merging and becoming large brokerage firms; instead of Banks and Insurance companies--can't we learn a history lesson here Congress? Btw, why did most of you vote for its repeal in 1999? http://www.counterpunch.org/2008/09/19/shattering-the-glass-steagall-act
Think about where we are now, it all started in 1999 with the subprime loans Senator Phil Gramm was peaching on Senate floor. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gKQOxr2wBZQ&feature=related
Furthermore, we also want you to CHANGE the Commodities Future Modernization Act of 2000 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Commodity_Futures_Modernization_Act_of_2000 BACK to where it was before 2000, which since has deregulated energy markets and has allowed for such scams as The Enron Loophole; whereas in the early 2000's Enron Corp. was charging 400 bucks plus for a kilowatt hour...They all when to jail for this. But, the Enron loophole is still not closed, for example, allowing speculators to resell barrels of oil over and over again before it reaches the gas station owner. It's basically, legal gambling at our expense. What were those lawmakers thinking then? What are you thinking now? Either do the right think, or you're part of the 1%."
Why are oil prices high? The Enron Loophole
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zbdtTGYQBMU&feature=related http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PNp0y0SjOkY&feature=related
Rolling Stones Reporter: Truth about Goldman Sachs--how they have cornered the markets--basically, The Enron Loophole and the Repeal of Glass-Steagall Act in 1999. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=waL5UxScgUw
http://occupywallst.org/forum/benajmin-rose-2012/
I'll throw out a name...benajmin Rose he is a librarian in Florida and he is a genius...he has the most radical mind I have ever come across.
............
The Iron law of Oligarchy in action! Robert Michels is proved of you! I nominate Vlademir Lenin!
lol living..nominations thanks
We don't need lists, names, leaders. We need the global mind-machine interface that is problem solving, resource circulating, emergency responding, and peace keeping 24/7/365 something like http://globalcognitiongroup.com merged with http://global-mind.org/ begun at Princeton.
All the authors on this list http://www.usbig.net/papers.php and this list http://basicincome.org/bien/papers.html and more, with expertise and networks across all domains, will all be there.
ALL THE TIME.
great stuff from what i read on global consciousness site.. but not relavent to this thread
So far the names we have are:
This is who I would recommend:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_3Qz1C-dAGc
excellent another nomination
PETER JOSEPH
ok...i'll throw out one name of an economist ive recently stumbled upon... Martin Armstrong, fascinating story and perspective... thats my 2 cents for now...the government imprisoned him for 11 years
i nominate Martin Armstrong to be a candidate for the group to formulate a feasable political and economic solution moving forward.
Sounds like Congress.
yes exactly...im saying ows should form a congress
lol
oh boy... i can see where this is going
Here's the deal: A group of really brilliant minds already figured this out. They were the founders of this country. All we need to do is restore the constitution and lawful money.
our global economy is far more complex than what our forfathers were working w/btw... u over simplify
economy yes, government no. Unfortunately I'm not sure if we, the human race, are any smarter about the forms of government and politics now then we were back then.
Global finance has been made complex by the corrupt money masters. They engaged in the same shit hundreds of years ago, too. Now they have computers to do it faster.
There is nothing new under the sun. You just have to study history to find that out.
Very true, It's all been done before. Though it's not necessarily that hard to understand some of the market manipulations, securitizations, and derivations that they are using today. It is though almost impossible to follow their paper trails.
You bet and they make sure of that!
agreed that its been made more complex than it need be
yes...a great group of brilliant minds over 200 years ago... the original document has been ammended... and in many ways distorted... how can we live by a 200 year old constituion drafted before the industrial revolution? drafted before globalization...before the internet...
we need a NEW constitution my friend. sorry to break it to you... when i say we i mean the world..
Our founders knew times and things would change. They allowed for the Constitution to be modified by , WE THE PEOPLE. Problem is it has been modified, circumvented, held hostage, and all but set on fire, and WE THE PEOPLE, ignored much of it. The solutions are there.
The principals of sound money are timeless, as are the principals for a government of and by the People. You will never see a new constitution for the United States. We need to enforce the one we have :-)
there was no electronic money when the constitution was originally drafted... no fdic, etc etc... no welfare, social security..
Welfare programs have nothing to do with it and sound money can still ne transferred electronically if it's deposited.
a new constitution with the same prinicples as a foundation i should ad, Liberty and Justice for ALL, whether they be mexican, american, chinese, or what have you
"we need a NEW constitution my friend. sorry to break it to you... when i say we i mean the world.."
Which is playing right into the hands of the people this protest is supposed to be against.
im sorry but i dont follow your logic what so ever
There is plenty more evidence out there about this. Just dig around a little.
Here is a nugget...
http://www.un.org/esa/dsd/agenda21/index.shtml
"i believe you... what i am saying is you seem to miss the point, we need solutions not perpetual banter"
I'm glad you believe me, but don't...believe them, they have laid it all out over the years.
Wanting to find a new solution is what they want us to do. They have been eroding our founding ideals for a long time. In order to find a solution, it helps to know the oppositions goals. One of which is to dismantle our constitution. The answers to defeating them are found in the un-perverted vision our founders laid out with those, oh so important documents.
i believe you... what i am saying is you seem to miss the point, we need solutions not perpetual banter
The banksters that own most major corporations, pushed the Fed act in 1913. Since then we have been in the slide to where we are today, and it's not an accident.
For starters...
In 2002 Rockefeller authored his autobiography “Memoirs” wherein, on page 405, Mr. Rockefeller writes:
“For more than a century ideological extremists at either end of the political spectrum have seized upon well-publicized incidents such as my encounter with Castro to attack the Rockefeller family for the inordinate influence they claim we wield over American political and economic institutions. Some even believe we are part of a secret cabal working against the best interests of the United States, characterizing my family and me as "internationalists" and of conspiring with others around the world to build a more integrated global political and economic structure - one world, if you will. If that's the charge, I stand guilty, and I am proud of it."
look we can banter forever on soundbites taken from here and there...again i propose you do the due diligence... seek out someone you would nominate, i nominated martin armstrong..
need more nominations
So you believe that the world should band together as one and be under the same law?
again...im looking for nominations of great LIVING thinkers... i do not pretend to have the answer for the world.. only a solution for ows
inb4NWO
im saying we need the worlds best thinkers to formulate some ideas... i am not claiming to be in that league... i dont have the answer to the worlds problems.. i have a solution for ows to continue meaningful forward trajectory
kevinsutavee, I agree with ya... contact them and ask them to get involved.. if they do and if they are that good.. they will bubble up to the top and gain support .... we will all follow truth
I get the impression that the 39+ comments above are coming from 99-100% males between 22 and 32. Just an observation of course. New "systems" are not as important as functioning systems that are regulated, transparent, and lead by ethical/moral human beings who are not guided purely by short-term greed. Isolationism from what and whom too? This is a global issue, but I do agree "Irresponsible One" that the "bigger, cheaper, faster" notions promoted by American business schools--and propogated the world over--has not helped to set the right foundation for business. Banks have been problematic for hundreds if not several thousand years. People who like to "handle" other people's money (good book by the way), are not necessarily motivated by altruism. We need small, local banks; small, local electric companies (and NO electric commodity trading--or eventual water trading!); NO carbon offset trading; and no dependence on oil, coal, or nuclear power where a region has the full capacity to produce other forms of energy. Still--bottom line is ethics!
@Brad and kevinsutavee---agreed in part. There is a fine line between justifying survival (cost of doing business) and justifying things like obsolescence in manufacturing, so-called "Gillette models", CSR, and other quasi-marketing/sales tacts that might or might not be ethically inspired. This is actually the crux of the debate isn't it? How to stay in business without cheating your customers, employees and shareholders while delivering a useful and desirable product. It's nice if the product works for awhile too! We all can imagine what it might feel like to have a dialogue box pop on on the computer panel of an aircraft in flight that tells us--"system error--reboot"!
kevinsutavee says ".... it needs to be streamlined and made efficient... efficient being the key, less waste, wasted time, wasted money, wasted materials...."
this is one of the few keys to problems with unregulated capitalism that has nothing to do with greed .. has more to do with survival... currently we damage the whole thing with planned obsolescence... all in the effort to keep the system going as means to provide jobs... so that's leads to the real key... we need to expand the job opportunites... I believe one solution is to expand what we consider wealth,, Is Art not a wealth... Is knowledge not a wealth... Is health not a wealth...
and there will never be one ideal fix all solution... solving poverty will only be accomplished from finding solution from everywhere and everything...
Still--bottom line is ethics! --- right on ...
mbss...do you have someone you would recommend?
i would argue that the political and economic systems we have currently are too unwieldy, it needs to be streamlined and made efficient... efficient being the key, less waste, wasted time, wasted money, wasted materials..
from my observation during my brief time on earth... it is human nature to be corrupt.. so maybe corruption needs to be harnessed some how?
I think we should be isolationist. That would solve some of the worlds problems.
There seem to be quite a few writers in this site on many forums who are advocating isolationism, protectionism and "buy Americanism". Global trade does not need to mean corporatism or big business or "multi-national firms" or Walmart or even IKEA (although I really like IKEA :-) . I think it's great when we can buy products from each other around the globe. But import/export laws are written for the big guys. And the only time we really need protectionism occurs when electric companies are advocating "smart grids" for instance--as a means to control commodity trading--which in turn helps them to defend the cartels which dictate the exorbitant and un-regulated prices we pay "locally" for electricity! ha. Think carefully about the big guys and how these expressions like isolationism can actually be used to manipulate workers (such as autoworkers in Detroit or Flint who thought that Saab had hurt GM!) GM, and even Ford, bought up Swedish brands to try to rescue their bottomline--and then in turn made life miserable for Swedish employees--who are now kowtowing to China, Netherlands and perhaps Russia soon. But protectionism wasn't necessarily the solution. What was lacking in the US was an ethical industry and ethical unions. What was lacking in Sweden was self-assuredness and good marketing of a decent product. And on and on . . .
so you also believe in the condemnation of gallileo?? you want to go backwars, when its obvious the world is moving forward? ;-) find me a name...im curious who you would nominate