Forum Post: OWS finances
Posted 12 years ago on Nov. 16, 2011, 2:30 p.m. EST by pinker
(586)
This content is user submitted and not an official statement
Will OWS ever disclose its finances again? Will we ever know who donated more than 100 dollars to OWS? Which businesses donated?
I don't think OWS was ever very transparent about how much they actually received in donations or how it was spent, how much is left... According to the statement online (as of 10/28, which only covers income/expenses up through 10/18) it says OWS has just over 339k banked. Who is going to pay taxes on that money? OWS doesn't have non-profit status through the IRS, so if you've donated, I wouldn't try to declare it on your taxes. If OWS is to have any credible future in the main stream as far as getting people behind them and involved or getting people backed in the political arena, they have to be more transparent about money. Just an opinion.
OMG the Alliance for Global Justice is the fiscal sponsor of ows and donations made their them to ows are tax deductible, as has been widely reported and is extremely easy to determine via some simple Google searches.
So basically the only true thing about your post is he last sentence: "Just an opinion."
That I know. I am curious to know who gave large chunks of money to OWS. There are rumors all over the place as to the who/why of donations. Some say Obama/Dems. Some say Republicans. Some say more sinister sources. I'd think because the movement is so highly opposed to corporation funding, they'd be totally transparent.
Since it is entirely possible and legal to donate to any charity anonymously, it may not even be possible for anybody to identify all funding sources.
An organization can always choose to make full disclosure, whether they are legally obligated to do so or not.
Right, so they receive an anonymous donation, they state, "we received an anonymous donation." BFD.
Depending on the size of an anonymous donation, or the cumulative size of multiple anonymous donations, it could indeed be a BFD.
That's a drag and will leave it open to speculation. Why don't they have a hundred dollar cap as they should for campaign donations?
It's not a political party.
And donations to political parties are not tax deductible.
Yes, I am aware of that. However, with the GAs, Spokes, etc, it appears OWS is showing us how things should be done. Showing a model community.
That doesn't even come close to meeting the legal definition of political campaigning. Hell many churches come closer.
Well, we don't know if they are politically/corporately financed or not.
I also wonder why donations are funneled through AFGJ, rather than paid directly to OWS.
Umm that is so they can be tax deductible and to provide oversight and accountability to the IRS. As it states on their site and has been widely reported for some time now.
Because they got a great deal of money in the first 2 or 3 weeks and were not prepared to handle the unexpected amount of donations that poured in.
They were not set up as a tax exempt organization and getting under the umbrella of AFGJ was simpler. AFGJ provides this service to numerous organizations, OWS is just one.
Yes, you would think that transparency would be very important.
Well, you'd think they'd have this information on their website, which you can click through this site. Why should I have to do further research? They should have it on this site and the NYCGA site as well, and provide updated statements.
Do you always disseminate erroneous information if it isn't stuck right under your nose? If you didn't know wouldn't it make more sense to ask instead of making shit up?
No, I expect people who ask me to donate my money to their cause to have clear information about their finances posted everywhere they have a donate button. I didn't make anything up, I got the information directly from the NYCGA website. If they haven't updated it, that's their problem and it's to their detriment. By not having updated it, it doesn't make me feel confident about donating.
That is so strange! When I go to the nycga site and click on the donate link, it goes right to a page which states that the Alliance for Social Justice is the fiscal sponsor for ows and furthermore says that donations are tax deductible. But that's not what you see when you do that. Huh.
I see that, but I don't see any statement where the money is going specifically, how much exactly has been taken in, it also doesn't account for all sources of income, including donations taken in on the streets. I want full transparency, that's all. Why is that hard for any charitable organization to provide, assuming they are on the up and up? They need to update their financial statement so donors can make educated decisions as to where their limited charitable donations will do the most good.
Since you research your charities so thoroughly I'm sure you are familiar with the form 990 and realize that, like most nonprofits, the AfGJ will be required to file one by the 15th day after the 5th month that its current fiscal year ends. I'm sure you also know these forms are publicly available for review.
See, information like that everywhere there is a donation button would be helpful. I've never had such trouble finding out financial information to any other charitable organization I have donated to, including churches and other secular charitable organizations. OWS (or any charity) can not assume people know these things, that's why transparency is so important. If I'm a young person or a person without any knowledge about what rules apply to organizations receiving charitable donations, how would I know this? It's not only the message that's important, it's the method too. People see OWS having no leaders, no structure, it can be confusing. Perhaps that would give them pause before donating. A transparent statement and information as to when financial information will be available would be very helpful to those who are unsure about donating.
I agree that transparency, beyond bare legal minimums, is important in evaluating charities. It is due to this lack of transparency that CharityNavigator.org gives this organization such a low rating.
http://www.charitynavigator.org/index.cfm?bay=search.summary&orgid=6247
It appears to me that several of the items in those metrics involve policies not being posted on their website.
The 1% within OWS are controlling 100% of the money! Oh, the irony! LOL
The world has become so inured to corruption that people will automatically think the worst about everyone else. Yet these many of these same people will pasively accept institutionalized corruption for fear of bringing attention to themselves. I suspect that most of the finger pointers are not contributors themselves, rather they are trolls trying to instill distrust.
Healthy skepticism in a world where there is corruption, along with honesty, is not a vice. Blind trust can be dangerous. Asking for the kind of transparency many charities routinely provide is not "thinking the worst". OWS lack of transparency is particularly concerning in light of the speculation about their funding. If there is nothing to hide, I would think they would want to show that. I hope they will.
join #occupywallst2 we look for ideas and ways to make ows stronger
The 501(c)3 status of AFGJ means that only the names of donors who give 5K or more need to be disclosed.
Why do you think you have a right to know who donated 100 or more?
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Many non-profits routinely disclose financial information beyond their legal obligations. They do so in order to provide a higher level of transparency to potential donors. The transparency level is an important factor in deciding what charities to support.
For example, CharityNavigator.org, rates non-profits on both their financial performance and their transparency and accountability. As you can see from their ratings, The Alliance for Global Justice gets a rating of 0 out of 4 possible stars, despite their high financial rating, due to their lack of transparency.
http://www.charitynavigator.org/index.cfm?bay=search.summary&orgid=6247
"Let's Get Real" - I'm sure our opponents would LOVE to have the name and home address of every single small contributor to OWS so they could proceed to harass them and "out" them to employers via the internet...and thus stem the flow of donations by instilling fear.
No, I don't want my name and address revealed because I chose to donate $100 to this cause.
The low score on transparency is not related to disclosure of names and addresses of small donors. If you scroll down to Accountability and Transparency Metrics, you will see the categories on which AFGI was evaluated.
http://www.charitynavigator.org/index.cfm?bay=search.summary&orgid=6247
Even so, I think your fears about harassment stemming from a small donation are quite baseless.
And actually my fears are not baseless.
http://www.correntewire.com/stalking_malkin_invades_schip_familys_home
Oh so appropriate when someone is quoting pajamas media right here in this thread.
Well, that's your opinion. And disclosure of small donor information is what this thread you're replying to is about.
I believe the topic of the thread is also a broader question about OWS financial disclosures.
OK so the answer to the first question is definitely yes, because AfGJ is required to by law annually.
The answer to the second question is no, not unless the people themselves choose to tell you. And it is none of your business.
The answer to the third question is the same as the answer to the second question, because corporations are people.
I think that covers the full breadth of the original topic this thread.
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Thanks. Where would one find access to that?
It will come when they do the IRS filings. Here is info on the disclosure requirements from the IRS website:
http://www.irs.gov/charities/article/0,,id=96430,00.html
Wow, I just got censored! It that common here?
Not sure if these groups donated any money, but they are supporters of OWS. Be sure to click the "source" link below each listing to verify. http://pjmedia.com/zombie/2011/10/31/the-99-official-list-of-ows/
The OWS Elites are counting on the peasants all getting busted tomorrow, so they can scamper away with all that cash. Who would know, eh?