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Forum Post: It's Time For a New Political Party.

Posted 1 year ago on March 10, 2013, 3:58 p.m. EST by quantumystic (1710) from Memphis, TN
This content is user submitted and not an official statement

One that represents the values of the intellectual left in America(Cornell West, Noam Chomsky). We have an obligation to the forefathers and patriots of this land we dwell to pursue every avenue possible for the experiment to continue. It's dying. The experiment is dying and we all know the litany of reasons why. The foremost being that it was always intended to continue to benefit the business class of the times then as it does today. The problem today more than in the past is that America has been for the most part a relatively classless society to the degree that there has never been soldiers at the gates of manors preventing a mob from burning inhabitants alive. This may seem trivial to some but it is not.

The business class has always been down in the muck in america with rest of us to a degree and that is why the Europeans have always regarded American business interests as brutish and uncouth. Not in business acumen or practice but the individuals themselves. I could get into what individual american business men's misdeeds entail but we already know if we are reading this board don't we? Not that the Brit's, the French, the Spanish, the Belgians, or any other colonizer have any room point fingers and say that one is brutish especially considering the brutish colonization of indigenous people the world over including the Americas of course, but I digress. The business class has traditionally been accessible in the American past excluding of course the robber baron period and the southern plantation owners. Just looking at those two examples you can clearly see what happens in America when the business class becomes inaccessible. The repercussions are very clear.

In one case you have the southern plantation owners who would do anything to preserve their economic and political interest. The results of this are indisputable and still reverberate 150 years later and resulted in untold death, suffering, and economic strife. In the second case we have the robber barons whose history of misdeeds is well chronicled through the muckrakers of the day. Which forced the changes in the economy eventually that led to a period of prosperity unrivaled in the history of man. Fast forward to today we live in a quasi-fascist quasi-police state society because the business class was not repressed, because the dictatorship of the proletariat was feared unjustly. Instead they reconstituted and executed a successful counter-strike subverting through legislation and regulatory capture democracy and liberty; and ultimately your freedom. Today the business class is completely inaccessible. Just try getting some face time with a hedge fund manger; here is a hint you better be his waiter. Seriously they live in walled off compounds with private security patrolling the grounds some have private elevators from the garage to to their office and of course private planes and helicopters and limo service they can go days without seeing a normal person for 30 seconds. This kind of disconnect always results in the business class growing out of touch with basic ethical ethos.

The time has come to take control of our land we can not look to the ignorant or the indoctrinated for aid. We can not choose to continue to stand idle while the last vestiges of democratic process and civil liberties are flushed down the toilet. The will of the people has been subverted so mush so that the people do not choose to even exercise their guaranteed constitutional liberties. The media has been manipulated so that many passionate so called "libertarians" are misguided into the notion of the very essence of America. It seems many have bought into the post ww2 rhetoric of a nations entrenched business class. What the results are; are plainly obvious. Wake the fuck up fucktard "the people" are not your fucking enemy the corporations and banks are. Of course the prospect that they may get cracked in the head with a billy club in response or a tear gas canister to the skull, or multiple rubber bullets to the body and then hand cuffed and left to urinate or defecate on one's self for tens of hours let alone the criminal charges list that can be as long as the prosecutor would like is more than enough to make most of these so called"tough guy libertarian patriots" reveal their true pussy colors; pink.

Someone recently said to me something on this board along the lines that we have to "plant seeds" or something for the ideals to grow and I replied imparting upon them the knowledge that traditionally in America any subversion to the status quo political or economic system is typically meet with death, imprisonment, or deportation and that the seeds of anarchist and socialist thought have grown, gone to seed, and died many generations already in America. It's time to put on the red and black and make it happen. Libertarian Socialist Party of America. Let's do this.

61 Comments

61 Comments


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[-] 4 points by bensdad (8977) 1 year ago

I realize these questions are conclusively un-answerable without thousands of hours of research, but consider an estimate of what your answers would be:
In the last 40 years, how many votes have been cast in the Senate for things you would vote for -

by the D senators ?
by the R senators ?
by any other senators ?


the question is not who will do exactly what YOU want
the question is - pragmatically - who can do the best for America?

[-] 2 points by jrhirsch (4714) from Sun City, CA 1 year ago

Political parties are the antithesis of Democracy. The power of the individual is given up and flows to the leadership just as in any street gang. The members are manipulated for the benefit of the leaders, not for the members.

If you can't give a rational reason to join a gang then you can't give one to join a party.

[-] 2 points by BradB (2693) from Washington, DC 1 year ago

TRUTH

[-] 1 points by quantumystic (1710) from Memphis, TN 1 year ago

i believe you are talking about a cult. not a political party which is simply an organization with a stated set of principals seeking political office.

[-] 0 points by jrhirsch (4714) from Sun City, CA 1 year ago

The Republican and Democratic parties are just organizations with a stated set of principles seeking political office? They don't have principles, they don't represent their members, and they don't care how many people they kill in order to achieve the goals of their leadership.

If you lived in a rough neighborhood with two street gangs controlling the town by fear and intimidation, would it be better to start your own gang to gain power and counter their threat, or would it be better to work to disband all gangs and return the power back to the people?

[-] 1 points by quantumystic (1710) from Memphis, TN 1 year ago

obviously you start your own gang.

[-] 0 points by DSamms (-294) 1 year ago

Well said.

[-] 2 points by HCabret (-327) 1 year ago

Isnt there already several socialist parties?

Aren't 'political parties' part of the problem? Representatives listen to thier parties and not thier constiuents.

[Deleted]

[-] 1 points by HCabret (-327) 1 year ago

!Gracias!

[-] 1 points by quantumystic (1710) from Memphis, TN 1 year ago

Libertarian Socialism is not classic socialism.

[-] 1 points by HCabret (-327) 1 year ago

Yah, I know.......but my point was against 'political parties' of any ideology.

The first part was just a question.

[-] 1 points by quantumystic (1710) from Memphis, TN 1 year ago

well as a matter of fact i am on it's face opposed to political parties because of the trouble they can cause, however that being said they can be useful to keep the democratic process in check. at this time i think is an appropriate time to form a party to in fact do just that.

[-] 2 points by HCabret (-327) 1 year ago

Form a politcal party to fight political parties. a novel idea........

[-] 1 points by quantumystic (1710) from Memphis, TN 1 year ago

Not to fight political parties. As a culmination of the class struggle and the apex of political and economic thought the libertarian socialism philosophy represents a set of political and economic ideologies that seek to rectify the former ills placed on humanity by the tyranny of men and it is only natural that a political party be the medium to execute the desired effect; a political party with a political, economic, and military wing each semi independent.

[-] 1 points by quantumystic (1710) from Memphis, TN 1 year ago

I was thinking the slogan should be "It's midnight in America".

[-] -1 points by OTP (-203) from Tampa, FL 1 year ago

There are a few people here that have started coopts, and it gives a great platform for political activities. May be something to consider doing along side the new party.

[-] 2 points by quantumystic (1710) from Memphis, TN 1 year ago

workplace democracy should be a central issue economically. i would suggest that a workplace sociocracy https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sociocracy with direct democratic checks and balances is the best model of ethical business mgmt. worker owned and worker managed.

[-] 1 points by LeoYo (5909) 1 year ago
[-] 1 points by quantumystic (1710) from Memphis, TN 1 year ago

Not going to work. What will work is a political party that represents a new set of ideals.

[-] 2 points by LeoYo (5909) 1 year ago

What exactly isn't going to work and just when is a political party that represents a new set of ideals going to work? In 6 years? In 24 years? In a hundred years? Just what is the time estimate for the success of the new political party?

[-] 1 points by quantumystic (1710) from Memphis, TN 1 year ago

6 months to 1 year. things will move very fast. the key is exploiting social media and packaging the correct product to sell. cause after all you have to sell your ideas.

[-] 1 points by LeoYo (5909) 1 year ago

A year! Very ambitious! Exploitation of the social media is indeed the key. I look forward to observing how the social media is exploited to sell the packaged correct product in a year's time.

This still leaves my original question of what exactly isn't going to work.

[Deleted]

[-] 1 points by quantumystic (1710) from Memphis, TN 1 year ago

well you gotta get the power to at least rattle sabers.

[-] 0 points by DSamms (-294) 1 year ago

"Instead they reconstituted and executed a successful counter-strike subverting through legislation and regulatory capture democracy and liberty..."

Great line. Pardon my ignorance, but what is Libertarian Socialism? I've read a bit, not nearly enough and am just trying to understand...

[-] 1 points by quantumystic (1710) from Memphis, TN 1 year ago

Libertarian Socialism https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Libertarian_socialism is a belief system encompassing a wide range of Socialist and Anarchist philosophy. It centers around worker owned means of production(not the state or private capital) and favors democratic cooperatives and democratic trade/worker unions. An overall priority is to organize in a manner with which there is a minimum concentration of power or authority in order to do this sociocracy https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sociocracy is often used.

Libertarian Socialism also emphasizes participatory direct democracy and as a key concept it must be noted that Libertarian Socialists reject Marxist notions of linear and inevitable historical progression unlike Marxists of course.

[-] -1 points by DSamms (-294) 1 year ago

Well, I can see some problems with it, but there are problems with everything. I trust an active democracy. Moreover, I like decentralization, cooperatives, and unions. But you've got a PR problem. Another issue is an anarchic insistent on political apathy... From my perspective, it looks like the perfect becoming the enemy of the good.

[-] 1 points by quantumystic (1710) from Memphis, TN 1 year ago

Anything can be rebranded and sold.

[-] 1 points by quantumystic (1710) from Memphis, TN 1 year ago

Americans will buy anything if the package looks nice enough.

[-] -1 points by DSamms (-294) 1 year ago

How fuckin' true. But I am trying to do the right thing.

[-] 1 points by quantumystic (1710) from Memphis, TN 1 year ago

where is the fun in that. i wanna start a fire and watch it burn.

[-] 0 points by DSamms (-294) 1 year ago

Pyro... But delightfully twisted.

[-] 0 points by peacehurricane (293) 1 year ago

We have already declared "the new" and it is also factual as well as all inclusive WE PARTY! For WE are People and have the right to voice FREEDOM in Worldwide Solidarity All One...

[Deleted]

[-] 1 points by quantumystic (1710) from Memphis, TN 1 year ago

Ill probably just adopt the name Bull-Moose party or libertarian progressive party or something.

[Deleted]

[-] 1 points by quantumystic (1710) from Memphis, TN 1 year ago

I think we could really make an appeal to people by being socially and economically responsible and crafting a platform that reflects these positions. For example I am pretty left orientated but you can't tell me there is no fat on the budget that can be trimmed our budget is over bloated with pork barrel spending with no accountability and enourmous redundancy. You also can't tell me that a ratio of 1 to 1 for revenue and cuts is unreasonable. SS can be saved by just removing the cap on taxes taken and means testing recipients. Health care costs can be greatly reduced by instituting a preventative care orientated single payer health care system. You can't tell me we can't reduce the military budget to 2003 level spending.

On the flip side you can't tell me the war on drugs is producing positive results. You cant tell me that austerity is the way to success. You can't tell me that not paying for education or healthcare is a practical way to ensure American exceptionalism. You can't tell me a poor single mother, her kids, and society are better if she is working and not raising and nurturing her kids. These are just a few of the no nonsense oints of view and policies that Americans across the political spectrum consider reasonable balanced p.o.v and approaches to dealing with our current situation. I have hundreds.

[-] 1 points by quantumystic (1710) from Memphis, TN 1 year ago

The vast majority of Americans support individualist and progressive ideals. This stretches back in time to our founding. Certain things are just more important than money, the vast majority of Americans believe this as well. Education, health(mental and physical), and general well being (enough to eat, clean clothes, safe residence, meaningful social bonds with others) are considered sacrosanct values by many Americans(poor, rich, white, black, when you really talk to people heart to heart).

Americans also believe in giving a hungry man a fish, teaching him to fish after dinner, and expecting him to be able to from now fish (who would have thought?). There is a streak of individualism that runs strong though our land. The creativity, the morality, the essence of what it is to be American all stem from this indelible value we share ingrained from generation to generation. Seemingly instilled as if it is in the very land, water, and air itself. This is true American exceptionalism. To do what is right and just no matter the costs. To follow your passions and dreams to their fruition. To not compromising your vision or values while realizing that every person has their own.

If you ask the vast majority of Americans will tell you that these things they hold above money, they are sacrosanct values of America. It is just not being packaged right and the forces that oppose such meaningful social change issue a constant stream of propaganda. Our great wealth and scientific progress are not a result of capitalism they are a result of true American values. That is what we need to get back to because that is what made us great and always has.

[-] -1 points by OTP (-203) from Tampa, FL 1 year ago

Something to consider may be avoiding those terms all together.

[-] 1 points by quantumystic (1710) from Memphis, TN 1 year ago

This is why i consider the Bull-Moose moniker. Plus it fits in nice with elephants and donkeys.

[-] -1 points by highlander3 (-62) 1 year ago

In a nutshell, what would be the Libertarian Socialist Party of America's platform?

[-] 1 points by quantumystic (1710) from Memphis, TN 1 year ago

worker owned means of production. not the state, not private capital, but the worker.

[-] -1 points by highlander3 (-62) 1 year ago

In the past, any political system that promoted "worker owned means of production" has led, through corruption, to communism.

[-] 2 points by quantumystic (1710) from Memphis, TN 1 year ago

I will never accept a central state planned economy nor will anyone in the west at this time. It has been a relative failure in practice, granted you have to admit the capitalists gave them no chance, by doing everything within their legal and illegal power to bring about the demise to the communist states. I would be open to the economic encouragement of the government to enterprise in certain cases where it is provable that said action would be a benefit to humanity. Like the exploration of cures and treatment for disease and disorders, or the development and refinement of means of agricultural production, or the development of low cost high quality housing and low cost low milage zero carbon transport and production technology for the developing world ie. http://opensourceecology.org/, or the development of energy technology(not that we need it, they just need to disclose what we already have course all that money in the ground says they have no economic reason to).

[-] 1 points by quantumystic (1710) from Memphis, TN 1 year ago

No government has ever explicitly advocated libertarian socialism as a means of economic and political governance and regulation. I aim to change that.

[-] 0 points by OTP (-203) from Tampa, FL 1 year ago

Decentralize. Bring back community. Bring back humanity.

[-] 3 points by quantumystic (1710) from Memphis, TN 1 year ago

That is a great slogan.

[-] 0 points by Builder (4202) 1 year ago

Reclaim the commons; is my fave.

You know that at the start of the industrial age, the sweatshop owners had to bribe their peers to close access to hunting and fishing areas, so that the working class had nowhere to hang out and catch a meal for free?

[-] 2 points by quantumystic (1710) from Memphis, TN 1 year ago

Well I aim to change all that. A food forest on every highway overpass a vegetable garden in every vacant lot.

[-] -1 points by Builder (4202) 1 year ago

Excellent ideas. I hear there are lots of vacant lots after the 2008 crash.

[-] 2 points by quantumystic (1710) from Memphis, TN 1 year ago

There where before the crash now its a guerrilla growing bonanza.

[-] 0 points by Builder (4202) 1 year ago

I heard a story that a large flock of migrating geese mistook an empty mall carpark for a lake, and all died on impact. That blew me away.

[-] 1 points by quantumystic (1710) from Memphis, TN 1 year ago

damn could have been dinner what a waste.

[-] -1 points by Builder (4202) 1 year ago
[-] -3 points by OTP (-203) from Tampa, FL 1 year ago

If you are looking for information on ballot access and establishing political parties, http://www.ballot-access.org is a great starting point..

I know in Florida it is very easy, and we did it with relative ease.

[-] 1 points by quantumystic (1710) from Memphis, TN 1 year ago

Thanks, yes I would like very much to establish a Libertarian Socialist political party.

[Deleted]

[-] 1 points by quantumystic (1710) from Memphis, TN 1 year ago

Perhaps you are correct. I am thinking a resurrection of sorts of the bull-moose party, a progressive-libertarian party that embraces populist ideals. We will cream the democrats and republicans with traditional individualist and populist themes that were so successful from the 1890's-1930's. We can crush them both on civil liberties and fiscal responsibility. We can introduce a lengthy number of measures to restore a sense of balance to the system by campaigning for the same direct democratic principles that the original progressive party made central to their platform.

The recall election (citizens may remove an elected official before the end of his term) The referendum (citizens may decide on a law by popular vote) The initiative (citizens may propose a law by petition and enact it by popular vote) Judicial recall (when a court declares a law unconstitutional, the citizens may override that ruling by popular vote)

The main theme of the platform was an attack on the domination of politics by business interests, which allegedly controlled both established parties. The platform asserted that

To destroy this invisible Government, to dissolve the unholy alliance between corrupt business and corrupt politics is the first task of the statesmanship of the day. Sound Familiar? I believe tapping into this as well as concepts explored in the new deal and in the 2nd bill of rights/great society need to be reexamined and brought into the 21st century and fused with the concepts like opensource, green, fair trade and sociocracy.

[-] 0 points by DSamms (-294) 1 year ago

What about the ability to reject all candidates for an office if the voters think no candidate is suitable?

[-] 1 points by analystwanabe99 (153) 1 year ago

At this point you could probably campaign on returning the principals of the constitution without amendment and be just fine. But then I'm no expert on this subject. Just spouting off. Ill shut up now. I don't know for some reason this idea gets me excited. . .That Progressive party sounds like they already thought this stuff through. We might tweak it a little but sounds like what we are trying to accomplish here. You got my vote preacher!!

[-] 0 points by DSamms (-294) 1 year ago

Hi, I think you meant to reply to quantumystic...?

[-] 1 points by quantumystic (1710) from Memphis, TN 1 year ago

not too big on that one. people will always find something to complain about.

[-] 0 points by DSamms (-294) 1 year ago

Even so, it is a democratic option. And a guard against what we suffer now. Nevada has it on the ballot, I don't notice any electoral chaos out there.

[-] 0 points by gnomunny (6614) from St Louis, MO 1 year ago

You've probably already done your homework on this, but I made a couple posts last year about third parties. This one has some links on what's involved in setting one up:

http://occupywallst.org/forum/third-party-redux/