Forum Post: I'm sick of this shit! they are diluting our message!!!
Posted 13 years ago on Oct. 9, 2011, 8:02 a.m. EST by Truth
(50)
This content is user submitted and not an official statement
Already Biden and Obama and others are sympathetic to our cause.....
The bullshit is starting. If this group is not about ending the corruption - then I'm going to quit.
I need real soldiers - I heard the spokesperson for this group say our demands on radio.... WTF? those werent the demands?
the bullshit is starting. I think we are getting played.
A leaderless group with a mystery spokesperson. Fuck outta here. Moore said were against capitalism.... WTF
Were against crimes against humanity...... people your getting played
Yes it is about crimes against humanity and people are getting played. But all of that crap is what you have to be willing to take on an fight against. If this were easy it would have been done a long time ago. The road ahead is tough.....who of us will last?
here is some truth for you. http://www.radiokazoo.net/OPV/
Who wrote that? is this you? I read it all, it took me in. OPV is EXACTLY what I'm talking about. I need to copy that. It will save me trying to explain it all. YOU COINED IT!!!!! Thanks for sharing.
indeed. my pleasure. pass it on. power to the people.
http://www.counterpunch.org/2011/09/23/obama-should-quit/
The 1% will use many clever tactics to divide and conquer us. Don't lose hope in humanity so early.
Couldent agree more.
Be subtle even to the point of soundlessness, be mysterious even to the point of formlessness. - Sun Tzu
Think tanks are buzzing!
I came to this site Friday night to offer my assistance as a non-profit organizer. I can do basic coding of web pages, accounting, and other functions.
Mainly I wanted to get some sanitation facilities out to Zucotto (sic) park.
In a matter of about 20 minutes I found over 15 contact listings, and left vmail and email on every one of them.
24 hours later, no response. They aren't even updating the site anymore.
Where did everyone, and the "tens of thousands" http://afgj.org/?p=1765#more-1765 of dollars go?
Well, the General Assembly never was in the US, they are operating out of a hotel room somewhere in Nicaragua, and the money has been deposited in a Central American bank.
How could the people do this to our citizens, how can members of our government support this?
They have to know, it only took me 20 minutes to find out, and they had days and hundreds of people on their staffs.
Slam1263 I have a solution that I could use some web skills. Please visit my message on my web site at ozzir.com
This is not the place for that, please send that request to my screen name @hotmail.com. thnx.
Yeah this is a big problem. I am an attorney and went down to wall street twice to actually try and talk to someone without luck. I offered my pro bono services to help them apply for the permits and no response. I also am part of a group of tudents and lawyers who drafts an action plan to keep the movement going:
https://sites.google.com/site/the99percentdeclaration/
https://sites.google.com/site/the99percentdeclaration/home/the-steps-to-non-violent-revolution
I can't believe what is going on. The group needs to get out and own this cause, they need to denounce the scammers that set this up.
The first revolt may be to take control of OWS itself.
You've been going around posting this trash about Nicaragua all over the message boards. So I looked it up and it's hosted out of LA. You're just a piece of trash getting paid to try to undermine this movement. However, you're only making us more angry and more steadfast that what we're doing is right. So keep spreading the trash. Unlike Teabaggers, we actually fact check what we read.
That is a message that states that whois has been requested to block their information from being released. Don't trust a word I am saying; go to whois.net, put in this sites name.org, and Freakin' read that it is now being blocked.
I looked up your site afgj.org. It turns out that donations to them are going to the "Nicaragua Network". Not sure who they are. But you should be ashamed of yourself.
That is not my Freakin" site!!! That is the site that collected the now missing donations, That is the site that the General Assembly was using to start OWS!!
Again, do not trust what I am saying, look for yourself.
You found the answers, didn't you.
Don't be discouraged, keep the faith.
We have to get it together,people, if we are to be taken seriously. First of all, we have few common goals (watch the interviews on the news) and fewer common reasons for our being there. How can we expect change when OWS is not pushing for something specific? Here's a cause that would allow us to take back some power in this country. This one would allow us to truly change the way things are done in Washington: We demand and work for a constitutional amendment that allows "We the People" to vote on major Federal issues. Not an easy thing to get passed, but this is an idea whose time has come and would eliminate the current "Holy Trinity" that now exists that gets things passed, without any regard for we, the 99%. The "Holy Trinity" being the Congressional, Senatorial and Lobbyist connection. Here's how it would work. We, the people, would choose, by vote, which new bills we would vote on. Then, using only the total popular vote ( 51% wins) each state's congress-person and senators would be required by the amendment to cast their votes only as their state voted. If we get this amendment, the collective intelligence of the people would be making these decisions, not the Parties, Corporations and lobbyists.
I wonder what Obama and Biden would think about taking the money out of politics, an end to being corporate puppets. The media has such a huge influence on what folks think, and they're also bought and paid for by corporations. The media is really good at pitting us against each other, and Obama and Biden's endorsement only helps to polarize us. They know that.
So the question to Obama and Biden is... What exactly about the cause are you sympathetic with ? The fact you are a complete liar ? The On going Wars ? loss of american's freedom ? Your buddies on wall street ? war on drugs ? outsourcing ? They don't get it yet ... We need to kick them all out .... We the people are hiring ... Republicans and Democrats need not apply.
DON'T QUIT! WE CAN DO IT, read this: https://sites.google.com/site/the99percentdeclaration/ and then this:
https://sites.google.com/site/the99percentdeclaration/home/the-steps-to-non-violent-revolution
Spread this far and wide. Moore can show up and be one of us, but he's not our fucking leader and he can't speak for us!
Moore is great and I love him (Capitalism a love story, Sicko, etc),, but if he tries to speak for us or be or leader he's DONE.
"Get the money out of politics."
Seriously, why is this not being used as the central message??
Its the fundamental problem. All the other problems stem from bought influence. Take back the government.
It is up to each one of us to work to create the unity the protests needs. So if this is what you believe, tell others and get them on board!
1% buy their representation in government and 99% are left with the scraps. We need to take our democracy back!
create a direct transparent system were anyone can verify the voting count
I don't think anyone is against capitalism. It is the corrupted capitlistic system we have now that is the problme. We do not have a true free market capitalism system right now when legislation can be bought to slant in a corporations favor.
Every out of work college graduate protesting right now went to school to have the credentials and the skills to make money. They worked hard and now cannot use their skills because of the corrupt nature of corporations killing the economy and then getting bailed out and not feeling the sting.
On the contrary, this group will absolutely fail without broader appeal and sympathetic voices in congress. It's a boring and uncool sign of success. Don't worry.
You new Obama was full of shit when you voted for him, but i guess you like the smell of your own shit...
They did it to the tea party too. This is much stronger. Hang in there, after reading this post I decided to hang in
Dude, please do not respond to bogus issues nor do comment on negative topics about OWS. The negative topics are generated by troll to defeat the cause. Do not waist our precious time.
Welcome to the world of the Tea Party... That's what happened to them, too.
Obama 2012 re-election Finance director is the son of former Bank Of America CEO charles gifford, just one of the bankers who created this mess, "keeping it all in the family" WE ARE DOOMED
I agree. OWS should call for Obama's immediate resignation. Just like the comrades in Tahrir Square called for Mubarak to resign.
http://occupywallst.org/forum/a-rally-cry-to-occupy-join-in-once-voice/
Now you know how the Tea Party feels. We agree on some major points with you but everyone is trying to co-opt us.
definitely obama and biden are the trash we need to take out. the secret to staying solid is getting lucid and detailed and doing the work which needs to get done to have a complete political platform.
to get serious requires a few things they don't have. like chat admins who aren't ego serving propaganda tools, a wiki, 1001 sub forums, an actual game plan, a straight up political platform... you know.. basic organizational things sane people do BEFORE protesting.. like figure out a diplomacy and logic centered metaprocess to give their chatadmins so that they don't really just drive out even more people than the trolls. Adminatrolla. trollaAdmin. Whats the difference to somebody whos got the truth facing a propaganda tool abusing admin powers to push their agenda? how can you prevent such a thing? Metaprocess. did i mention metaprocess? and science diplomacy science psychology science sociology and all those textbooks to read B4 protesting?
you can't have capitalism without a free(SLAVE) market. but you can have a free market without capitalism. And thats strangely the only way it CAN work.
Marketing 101 was fascinating. I admit thats a lot less than a bachelors but its sure more than enough to see whats really going on given the other things I know. Capitalism is not the problem since it does not exist. corporate oligarchy is the problem. capitalism has never been tried. I am a democracy guy. in order for real democracy to function a free market system is required. Thats not capitalism. thats a free market system. there is a subtle difference there which most people would miss. I will again repeat. Neither capitalism nor marxism nor communism nor socialism has ever existed. All of those governments were oligarchy pretending to be something as a con scam. Telling that simple truth gets one banned out of the Chat by either a capitalist or a socialist whos pissed you just said their pet ideology isn't real. It isn't. anybody who thinks that it is is accidentally playing for team corporate oligarchy as a tool. the ONLY system worth talking about is DEMOCRACY. how democracy HANDLES a FREE MARKET system is dynamic and interesting and NOT capitalism.
o. yes. no. yes. what? making change is not reliant on changing the money system one tenth as much as it is on changing the informational ecology. Going to a gold standard as an idea is a proof of ignorance, not a solution. Really the end game is we evolve out of money. To do that we evolve first new currencies and new economic strategies. this leads to economic singularity in about 50 years. If everyone is a millionaire how much you get depends on exactly the material valuation of that money. Which is to say that by the time money becomes obsolete everyone will live like the current millionaire. Tangible items to other tangible items? the real economy is about ideas, change the ideas and everything changes. the problem with the tangible economy is it does not change; its a static reality. you can't make a meaningful gold standard with only enough gold to represent on millionth of the economy. You can make a purely imaginal money system work; but it has to be subject to moral and ethical laws. This is about pinning down those moral and ethical laws and implementing them in new currencies; not trying to imagine a control freak impossible non solution because of the simplicity with which you go about thinking over the problem.
once again. there has never been a socialist or capitalist economy. in all instances such nations were oligarchies. using a mask and a con scam and telling their dupes and pwns that they were something other than oligarchy. the big hump to get over is that the USA oligarchy and the Soviet oligarchy are in on this lie against the rest of us TOGETHER. Neither of them was ever anything other than an oligarchy. both claimed some other system in order to have US fight over the ideals of THAT system while they secretly shafted us all playing a completely different game.
http://occupywallst.org/forum/stop-playing-the-devils-games/
https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=10150343790359248&set=a.10150264906064248.348293.511989247&type=1&theater
It's turned into a vote for Ron Paul movement. I don't think i support this movement at all anymore.
What’s YOUR occupation?!!!
Yes, they are trying to play us.
http://www.sott.net/articles/show/236013-US-Soros-is-Attempting-to-Take-Over-Occupy-America-Movement
I quit the "occupy" group, but I haven't quit the cause of getting money out of politics.
Obama is owned and operated by Wall Street
We need to stick together! Not get angry with each other. Trust your fellow protesters. Of course there will be people working against. Because true democracy is a powerful force and one worth fighting for! Be patient and help others to see the powerful light of a shining democracy that we are meant to have!
Many people do not trust the media. If we rely on the media AT ALL, we open ourselves up MORE to misinterpretation! The media itself will disect and destroy. If they don't know what it is about, they can only complain and criticise that they don't know what it is about. Surely this drives them crazy! And isn't that kind of fun!
Yes, you have been played for a long time, and although I'm all in favor of taking down today's ineffective and inefficient Top 10% Management Group of Business & Government, there's only one way to do it – by fighting bankers as bankers yourselves. Consequently, I have posted the Strategic Legal Policies, Organizational Operating Structures, and Tactical Investment Procedures necessary to do this at:
http://getsatisfaction.com/americanselect/topics/on_strategic_legal_policy_organizational_operational_structures_tactical_investment_procedures
Join
http://finance.groups.yahoo.com/group/StrategicInternationalSystems/
if you want to support a Presidential Candidate Committee at AmericansElect.org in support of the above bank-focused platform.
pyho! pull your head out... and get this country going in the right direction!
Take it back people!
I think we need to occupy Washington and the entire government, take it back from the 1% and get it in the hands of the 99% to whom it properly belongs! Look what kind of job Washington has done for us, 14 trillion in debt! And what do we have to show for it, just a bunch of greedy rich people that keep getting richer and the poor getting poorer! This is not what our founding father had in mind, this is pathetic!
I think we need to occupy Washington and the entire government, take it back from the 1% and get it in the hands of the 99% to whom it properly belongs! Look what kind of job Washington has done for us, 14 trillion in debt! And what do we have to show for it, just a bunch of greedy rich people that keep getting richer and the poor getting poorer! This is not what our founding father had in mind, this is pathetic!
This is EXACTLY what happened to the original tea party. First Palin jumped on board and forced her grill everywhere claiming to be the tea party candidate. Very few of the ORIGINAL tea partiers even like Palin. Much less endorse her dumb ass. Then the politicians squirmed out of the mud everywhere jumping on the bandwagon. That's when I and many left. When it started, we said the tea party would never endorse a candidate. Next thing you know, we were labeled a right-wing political party with "tea party" politicians. ALL self-proclaimed!
Yes, you should quit. Your soldiers cannot do their own laundry. I would not associate with such people. They cannot organize hence the varying messages. Like herding cats...
Funny, some people say that about Bronx residents..... Luckily I'm not one of them.
So you gonna quit?
How much you offering?
Pride in yourself for not joining a loser movement of cry babies.
Actually the movement joined me.
Michael Moore?
He's a wealthy guy,.. made wealthy by our real life issues.....why should we listen to him?
Moore owns you!
You think?
patience is a virtue, truth. this occupation businesses isn't even a month old. I think that shows the severity of what we are doing. And the fact that it is spreading like wildfire. Trust the process. Don't quit, thats exactly what "they" want you to do. Solidarity for the long haul........
Corporations are machinations of Pure Capitalism, thus the problem need for bank regulations and corporate tracking because of how important they are to a state.
"sympathetic to your cause" ? what is your cause? whining about being broke but too lazy to do anything real about it?
Anger will not solve the problem you are pointing to. Keep posting what you see as incongruous "to our cause". Use the harsh light of truth to burn the sociopaths that attempt to usurp our cause.
It appears to me that we all are angry about others debating our demands, or lack of goals, especially the media. And of course others want to weigh in. Be glad, it shows we are being taken seriously and want to make sure they are on our side, the 99%. Think about this, the repeat of, "What are their goals, they have not goals". The reason we have not set goals is because it is a democratic process. Don't are lawmakers explain the wars drawing out longer, that the goals were not met, what are their goals? It is a messy process, this democratic process, but we are not like our government, that has ony one goal, and that is getting reelected, or elected. So if you look at what is going on in our government they only have one goal, and cannot agree on anything, or get anything done. I think we are proceeding nicely with the process, and are accomplishing much, including gathering support all over the world. Now isn't that a goal we can rap our minds around. We can be an example of how the democratic process works, so our government representatives should be taking notes.
I agree with what your saying, but I don't wan't to see the group hijacked by any celebrities, polititians, etc.
Example: the group gets powerful and someone comes and snatches it up and says "this is what we are about" and it being untrue. Then the original core value gets lost and next thing you know, OWS is sponsored by COCA-COLA etc......
I know what you mean, but watching the protesters this morning with Jones, I think they have it in hand. It seems that the majority rules, imagine that. Already, they have welcomed support, but as just that a supporter, not as a partner.
less words please.
well said gemini, i think you nailed it
It appears to me that we all are angry about others debating our demands, or lack of goals, especially the media. And of course others want to weigh in. Be glad, it shows we are being taken seriously and want to make sure they are on our side, the 99%. Think about this, the repeat of, "What are their goals, they have not goals". The reason we have not set goals is because it is a democratic process. Don't are lawmakers explain the wars drawing out longer, that the goals were not met, what are their goals? It is a messy process, this democratic process, but we are not like our government, that has ony one goal, and that is getting reelected, or elected. So if you look at what is going on in our government they only have one goal, and cannot agree on anything, or get anything done. I think we are proceeding nicely with the process, and are accomplishing much, including gathering support all over the world. Now isn't that a goal we can rap our minds around. We can be an example of how the democratic process works, so our government representatives should be taking notes.
I'm not getting played.
I know why I'm protesting and I know who I trust.
I don't think anyone is against capitalism. It is the corrupted capitlistic system we have now that is the problme. We do not have a true free market capitalism system right now when legislation can be bought to slant in a corporations favor.
Every out of work college graduate protesting right now went to school to have the credentials and the skills to make money. They worked hard and now cannot use their skills because of the corrupt nature of corporations killing the economy and then getting bailed out and not feeling the sting.
Yes but no matter what, this is the end result of capitalism. Slowly banks and the rich will chip away until they infiltrate and corrupt our government.
i know it is taboo, but its not exactly "bad" to be against capitalism ...
Right on
If you went to school and got a degree in art, how is 'the corporations' fault you can't find a job?
Because this is an Oligarchic System. In which the skilled labor is pushed out and the ignorant labor (unskilled) is shot back in because of how much they cost.
Sorry but that didn't make a whole lot of sense. Try again?
AKA the banks keep people who go to college, the students who become the skilled labor indebted on these crazy loans with 8 - 10% interest rates. which exponentially increases over the years. It doesn't allow the skilled labor to assist the economy and instead focus on paying debt. The Unskilled labor, the non-college graduates and the only labor who is not indebted who can thusly put something into the economy but this is not enough because Intellectuals and skilled labor are indispensable to a healthy economic system. Thats why nations like China who eliminated most of the intellectuals and skilled labor in the Cultural Revolution are now trying to reverse the damage.
I'm not sure I really believe this.
If you're suggesting loans are unfairly given out by banks (i.e. the preconditions in the form of interest rates are 'not fair') then your other option is to save money up for school. That's if you don't believe you can pay it back after you graduate.
It's just like any other loan, really. If you buy a house you are expected to pay the interest rate attached. I'm not sure what the problem here is, everybody has to pay more or less the same interest rate, why is it such a problem for some people as opposed to others?
Is that what this is about? Perceived issues with how banks raise money?
Of course you´re getting played. And in someway it´s about corruption, don´t give up, I believe it still goes in the good direction, but it might not be an easy walk. And I don´t agree with the need of real soldiers, but looks like those who are really informed and believe in the movement, are all potential soldiers.
You aren't entitled to DEMANDS!