Welcome login | signup
Language en es fr

Forum Post: If you don't support this, it's because you are stupid. I am serious

Posted 7 years ago on Feb. 1, 2013, 10:12 p.m. EST by Misaki (893)
This content is user submitted and not an official statement

First, I should say that effective people will not go to any great lengths to convince people they aren't stupid.


The US has plenty of wealth, which is why wage levels are high enough that the cost of living prevents the unemployed from competing with workers in foreign countries on the basis of price, such as Bangladesh where many workers make less than $50 per month (http://www.bbs.gov.bd/webtestapplication/userfiles/image/National%20Accounts%20Reports/OTHER_REPORT/Wage%20Rate.pdf). That would not be enough for a US worker to even afford food, much less housing or health care.

Companies can encourage people to work less to create jobs by paying them a higher rate when they do so. For example, the first 24 hours of work in a week are paid at 1.2x an employee's normal rate, and after that at a 0.7x rate so that someone who works 40 hours per week is paid the same amount.

People with reputations in economics and politics fall into two groups for why they won't support this: 1) They don't listen to people without credentials, or 2) I said they wouldn't.

Paul Krugman, with 900k Twitter followers, falls into the second group as do many other people. They are not going to support this idea... again, because I said they wouldn't. That might sound ridiculous to someone who doesn't know much about the situation but it's true.

Yoko Ono, however (3 million Twitter followers and is following the second highest number of people in the world), has not supported it because she prefers change to happen as a general movement, not through someone with a reputation in the current system. This is because she wants to be able to think that people are not stupid, and that the world does not depend on her being able to survive.

This is quite possibly the most important event in history, at least for intelligent people who care about things like violence, terrorism, and suicides (and not just their favorite TV show). The list of problems it would fix:

  • A small chance [you], or people [you] know, will be killed
  • Mass shootings like the ones at Aurora and Sandy Hook
  • Unemployment and associated problems, including wasteful government spending
  • War and its effects like someone you know joining the military and being killed
  • Rapes
  • Unexpected events in general that cause harm and could have been avoided if people were smarter
  • Occupations that appear to be unethical having a 'wage premium', including the sex industry and finance
  • Nonviolent crime, like computer viruses and scams
  • Unwanted climate change like global warming
  • Smart people being unhappy because they feel more responsible for problems
  • The fact that the human race is getting stupider as time goes on due to genetic selection
  • Biased feedback for games like WoW or Aion that lead to people wasting time on things that do not have the intended result
  • Starvation in Africa
  • Friends or relatives committing suicide because of relationship problems or depression
  • High cost of college in the US and the inaccuracy of attendance at an 'elite' institution as a signal of ability despite that many people perceive it to be accurate
  • 'Nice' people going to prison or being accused of crimes, such as Aaron Swartz who committed suicide
  • Economic sanctions against nations such as North Korea that are seen as unethical
  • Intellectual property law that causes obvious inefficiencies, such as the patenting of round corners on electronic devices
  • Government corruption in places like China
  • Female persons, or even male persons, not being able to attain important positions in society because of a lack of time

If you support this, just say so in this thread. More details, as well as other random stuff, at Open to Change. Proof that the rich aren't "evil" and that the only reason problems exist is because people let them:

Trend: Do you think that rich people in America today are happier than you, less happy, or about the same?

If Yoko Ono were to try to get people to use this idea and was unsuccessful, I would expect that she would then allow herself to die. So if you don't support this idea, you are also saying that it's fine for that to happen.

If people reply to this thread, the next step might be a petition or something. With enough signatures, it would get media attention just like various petitions to the White House have gotten media attention. Unlike petitions to build a Death Star though this would actually work so media attention would lead to change.



Read the Rules
[-] 2 points by Shule (2638) 6 years ago

One needs to have stupid people. Stupid people do all the things smart people don't dare do. -Sun Tsu.

[-] 1 points by Misaki (893) 6 years ago

That sounds like a misattribution

[-] 2 points by OTP (-203) from Tampa, FL 7 years ago

The power has been, is, and always will be with the people.

Its just very rare that they use it.

[-] 2 points by GirlFriday (17435) 7 years ago


Don't waste my time.

[-] 0 points by Misaki (893) 6 years ago

Wasn't trying to

[-] 1 points by peacehurricane (293) 7 years ago

There is no need to appeal to the corruption that has been steering us to arrive here. Beneficial results as you have listed and probably more will take place as soon (& it will be) as Our United States makes the laws we go by in this free land which WDC is not. We drop the whole mess. The only reason that the so called capitol is Washington DC is to escape paying the first soldiers when they marched to go get paid at end of war. I believe that our forefathers that were true to this country went along with this because they lost the battle temporary and knew that if &/or when a chance came to establish again what this country was made to be that these people would see the light of how easy the escape clause to get FREEDOM 's way on fast track. And here we are ALL ONE I am WE...

[-] -1 points by Theninthpiecesuv8 (-26) 6 years ago


[-] 1 points by Misaki (893) 6 years ago

"If an action is something that both very stupid people and very smart people would do, by avoiding that action are people showing that they're stupid or smart?"

[-] -2 points by Theninthpiecesuv8 (-26) 6 years ago

Salaries are actually based on the value of production; hourly rates are but a reflection of this.

[-] 1 points by Misaki (893) 6 years ago

You should be able to understand, then, how by working less someone can cause the value others provide by working to increase. Supply and demand.

[-] -1 points by Theninthpiecesuv8 (-26) 6 years ago

You haven't spent much time in the world then. Because the mantra since the '90s has been to do more with less. This doesn't tend towards surplus. And when we are unable to do more with less they ship those jobs overseas - not to China, because China has become too expensive, but to Bangladesh. "They" here is corporate America and its co-conspirator, the Federal government.

[-] 2 points by MattLHolck (16833) from San Diego, CA 6 years ago

since the advent of industrialization

[-] 1 points by Misaki (893) 6 years ago

The evidence is that people in other countries are dissatisfied with how things are and would also use the system, so that's not a problem.

But even if they didn't feel this way, and rich people in say China actually enjoyed working 60 hour weeks so they can buy overpriced iPhones, the US would only benefit from this attitude because it would mean that consumption of fossil fuels by other countries would not go up as much. Even if US military spending is halved, we would still be spending much more than any other country and have thousands of nuclear weapons — whereas many people are afraid of Iran even getting ONE nuclear weapon.

Manufacturing jobs can be shipped overseas, but many jobs cannot. This isn't just restaurant and retail, but also things like knowing English well enough to be a lawyer in the US and other prejudices that ensure that there would be plenty of jobs even if only the US used this system.

See for example this video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=580VyI6hFmo#t=1m31s

The only chains on educated workers are the ones they put on themselves (and each other).

[-] 2 points by gnomunny (6819) from St Louis, MO 6 years ago

Interesting video, Misaki. Is seems there ARE people out there that support this idea.