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Forum Post: If Elections Could Change Things, They'd Be Illegal

Posted 2 years ago on May 7, 2012, 6:39 a.m. EST by veron (-39)
This content is user submitted and not an official statement

In America, as in Greece...

"Instead of cultivating illusions about change through elections, it would be more sincere to move quickly towards a post-representational system of Direct Democracy."

http://www.aljazeera.com/indepth/opinion/2012/05/20125493228914268.html

19 Comments

19 Comments


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[-] 3 points by mjbento (74) 2 years ago

The only way to bring real change in America is to change an OBSOLETE POLITICAL SYSTEM MADE FOR 18th century rich landowners.

Those delegates - rich and landowners - who choose the candidates don't give a D*MN about people. The only way to change things is that people choose DIRECTLY.

[-] 0 points by sycokilla (2) 2 years ago

I think your right in all respects...its a states quo out of date and redundant. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tSLwj0neLWk

[-] 2 points by LeoYo (5843) 2 years ago

Change can come to the various democracies, http://occupywallst.org/forum/free-democracy-amendment/ but the people have to want it by first realizing that democracy in and of itself doesn't make one free. The key is through the initiative process. Where there is democracy without the initiative process (as is the case for 26 of the United States), there is no freedom.

[-] 2 points by jph (2652) 2 years ago

good article,. and I must say I do agree. representational government IS the problem. It is way too corruptible, and not enough democracy, voting once every few YEARS is nowhere near a participatory government, and hardly a democracy. http://www.globalsafe.org read the section on voting!

[-] 1 points by SparkyJP (1646) from Westminster, MD 2 years ago

“What better way to enslave a man than to give him the vote and tell him he’s free.” -Albert Camus

http://osixs.org/Rev2_menu_commonsense.aspx

[-] -1 points by arturo (3169) from Shanghai, Shanghai 2 years ago

One problem with allowing people to choose directly is that the media can be used to influence them. In this way, the one percent can still control the process.

[-] 0 points by hchc (3297) from Tampa, FL 2 years ago

Another problem is that with a 3.4Trillion dollar budget, Im not sure hte people that work have enough time to study the issues enough to make informed decisions.

[-] 1 points by arturo (3169) from Shanghai, Shanghai 2 years ago

Yes, that's why representatives are good, but our representatives don't represent us. And many citizens are confused about the basic issues as well.

Confucius confronted the corruption of his time by forming a school that taught future government officials not only to be smart but also to be good. Eventually his teaching system was made available throughout China.

I think we need something like that in our modern world. Perhaps OWS can think about forming itself into more of a school.

[-] 0 points by hchc (3297) from Tampa, FL 2 years ago

We have an educational work group, and I helped social outreach spread some decent literature.

But I think we lose sight of the TYPE of people we choose to represent us. If someone has had some problems (like 99% of us) then we cast them out. We end up with goody goody yes men.

[-] 1 points by arturo (3169) from Shanghai, Shanghai 2 years ago

Yes, I understand. There is so much diversity in this group it would be hard to establish a curriculum.

I think what we need is something like a distance learning degree program.

[-] 0 points by hchc (3297) from Tampa, FL 2 years ago

The main problem is a cultural one. When we were killing it, we had about 400 people on average every weekend. Then the left media started embracing us, and the right started attacking, and those who were looking for something new started to see this was going to lead to the same stuff as before.

But even in the beginning, we were only getting tops 1400 people at GA. In a city of 2.2 million. I told them that 1% of the population showing up would be 20,000. There is a lot of work to do.

You can lead the horse to water, but....

[-] 1 points by arturo (3169) from Shanghai, Shanghai 2 years ago

As the economy continues to get worse, which I think is the only thing it can do now, more people will realize the necessity of this movement.

[-] 0 points by hchc (3297) from Tampa, FL 2 years ago

Some people have said we are building our own Fema camps. The gov is allowing us to get used to living like the middle ages again. I found that very disturbing on many levels.

[-] 0 points by arturo (3169) from Shanghai, Shanghai 2 years ago

With all the dread that we face in the world these days, I think it is important to remember that the power of the elite is crumbling now. Their financial system is collapsing. They are definitely not all powerful as some would imagine.

And just as we are people who stand up against them, there are also whole countries in the world who stand up against them, and in this way, we have very powerful allies.

[-] 1 points by arturo (3169) from Shanghai, Shanghai 2 years ago

Yes, true. But sometimes a determined group can make a difference, though it requires a lot of focus and clarity.

[-] 0 points by hchc (3297) from Tampa, FL 2 years ago

I agree 110%.

[-] 1 points by arturo (3169) from Shanghai, Shanghai 2 years ago

That extra 10% is what its going to take.

[-] 1 points by MattLHolck (16833) from San Diego, CA 2 years ago
[-] 1 points by SparkyJP (1646) from Westminster, MD 2 years ago

An option could be to give citizens oversight power of their government as described in the chart labeled Government 2.0 here:

http://osixs.org/Rev2_menu_commonsense.aspx