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Forum Post: I Thought OWS was Pro Government Control

Posted 2 years ago on Jan. 19, 2012, 6:22 a.m. EST by toonces (-117)
This content is user submitted and not an official statement

Then, oddly, I see the website here was down yesterday to protest the government leveling the online playing field.

Why is it bad to have the government control online content but good to have it control possessions?

42 Comments

42 Comments


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[-] 2 points by RedJazz43 (2757) 2 years ago

Where did anyone ever get the notion that OWS was for state control? Among other things it spends a good deal of its time fighting the police force, which is, after all, the ultimate expression of state control.

Or just read the hard copy on the home page of this very web site. It says we don't need Wall Street or politicians to build a better world. That doesn't sound like state control to me.

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[-] 0 points by toonces (-117) 2 years ago

OWS wants to have the government redistribute wealth. That is state control.

[-] 1 points by RedJazz43 (2757) 2 years ago

OWS wants to have the government redistribute wealth. That is state control.

Huh? Where is your evidence for this. It may be true that SOME OWS activists want the state to redistribute wealth, but as a movement OWS makes absolutely no demands on any state (the US or any other state). As a movement OWS doesn't want a fucking thing from the state, except perhaps, that it go away. If you want evidence of this just look at the hard copy on the home page of this very web site or read the only political document yet produced by OWS, the Declaration of the Occupation of New York City, available on this web site and elsewhere on the web. If you have any other evidence that OWS has taken a position at any time or anywhere calling on the state to redistribute wealth please produce it as I have been active in OWS from the very beginning and I am completely unaware of any such position.

[-] 2 points by beautifulworld (21297) 2 years ago

Actually, we believe our government is a plutocracy right now, bought and paid for by the wealthy and the big corporations. Our goal is to get money out of politics and return our government to the people.

[-] 0 points by uncensored (104) 2 years ago

So what have you done to advance your goal?

[-] -2 points by toonces (-117) 2 years ago

So, the wealthy are not people?

[-] 2 points by beautifulworld (21297) 2 years ago

Do you not understand that "the people" is a reference to the American people as a whole? If not, I feel sorry for you.

So, you really want to live in a plutocracy? That's interesting. What's in it for you, toonces?

[-] -3 points by toonces (-117) 2 years ago

So, the wealthy do not conform to YOUR idea of people. So, it is okay to discriminate against and take the possessions of people, as long as they are the people that you don't like.

[-] 2 points by beautifulworld (21297) 2 years ago

Not at all. What would be okay with me is an economic system, as well as a political system, that works for the majority of the American people, not just a tiny percent at the top.

If the system worked for everyone you wouldn't be hearing all this talk about "income redistribution." In an economy that works properly for the majority of people there is no need for that. That's what I want.

[-] -1 points by uncensored (104) 2 years ago

The real problem is that for your entire life your were told that you were great at everything you did. You have a wall full of "participation trophies" and a lifetime of scoreless T-ball games under your belt.

Guess what? Your parents and teachers lied to you. You actually sucked at everything you tried as a kid, but you were told just the opposite so there was no point in trying harder. Well guess what? You are in the real world now with no skills and no clue. Your silly little temper tantrums won't work here. So either man up or grab a tarp and find yourself a park bench to occupy. Oh wait, you already are!

[-] 1 points by beautifulworld (21297) 2 years ago

I am in my forties so none of that is true about me. LOL! You're pathetic the way you put down the younger generation. You're a fear mongering, reactionary conservative.

[+] -4 points by toonces (-117) 2 years ago

So, if someone is able to excel and make alot of money, you believe they have lost the right to keep the money they have earned though their work and/or inventiveness?

[-] 3 points by beautifulworld (21297) 2 years ago

Nope. Not at all. I just want to make sure that everyone has enough. There is no reason to cap wealth, but there is good moral reason to put a minimum on what people are paid.

This would be much easier had the wealthiest in this country not become so greedy. Just freaking share your profits a little with the working people. (Take the Walton family as an example. Six members of the Walton family of Wal-Mart have as much wealth as the bottom 30% of Americans combined. Surely, they could pay Wal-Mart employees a bit more and still have enough money for themselves.) Allow working Americnas to live a decent and respectful life. Having one-half of all Americans earning less than $26,000 per year is not okay with me. Is it okay with you?

[+] -4 points by toonces (-117) 2 years ago

So who is the greedy one here? The guy who earns their money, or you, who wants to decide how they should spend their money?

Check yourself... It is far more greedy to covet someone else's money than it is to earn and use your own.

[-] 3 points by beautifulworld (21297) 2 years ago

So, I'll assume living in an America where one-half of all Americans earn less than $26,000 is okay with you. Wow. That sucks.

Not for me. I think the way labor is valued is up for contention. It has nothing to do with one person taking from another, unless of course, you want to talk about how labor is under-valued right now and corporations are raking in the profits of their labor.

[-] -2 points by toonces (-117) 2 years ago

Why do you not create your own job? You would have the time to do what you want and you could make as much as you were capable of.

[-] 2 points by beautifulworld (21297) 2 years ago

I could, but it's not just about me. The problem with that argument is that not everyone could do that. Our economy could never sustain 300 million entrepreneurs. Therefore, in my mind, the economy must be structured in a way that will be beneficial to all people, not just those holding lots of capital.

[-] -2 points by toonces (-117) 2 years ago

Anyone who wanted to could. There would be nothing better for this country than to have 300 million entrepreneurs.

[-] 2 points by beautifulworld (21297) 2 years ago

Do you really believe the economy could sustain that? In my mind, it would be the equivalent of going back to a subsistence economy.

[+] -4 points by Ninetyninenot (-57) 2 years ago

And then bolt on a bigger social welfare state where defaulting becomes the banks fault and you get to keep what you bought as their punishment, you can borrow money for school, but then default on that too without consequence, government union employees can draw even more from people that don't work for government, and others are forced to buy you healthcare. I'm sure I missed something along the way.

[-] -1 points by Uncomemierda (1) 2 years ago

Yes you did. You forgot to mention earth.

[+] -4 points by Ninetyninenot (-57) 2 years ago

Yes, stop using fossil fuels. Oh, and open the border because the United States isn't entitled to an immigration policy. I'm sure I'm still missing a few. LOL.

[-] 1 points by Uncomemierda (1) 2 years ago

Let's defend imaginary lines... If the planet dies you die

[-] -2 points by muddFlapp (-108) 2 years ago

hahaha good post

[-] 0 points by Galt01 (55) 2 years ago

OWS people are confused children who dont know what they want. All this movement is is a collective temper tantrum.

[-] 0 points by toonces (-117) 2 years ago

Yes. I have been lurking here for a while and it is a little disheartening. They are all about feelings and what could be and how people just need to be manipulated to obey. If you question or oppose, you will be berated, insulted, and cursed at....

Enjoy

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[+] -5 points by muddFlapp (-108) 2 years ago

The OWS goons exist for only one reason. They are all socialist and want to try along with their failed leader Obama, to create a communist Govt controlled society. Thank God that the libidiots only make up around 2% of the population

[-] 1 points by guru401 (228) 2 years ago

Couldn't disagree with you more. Both parties want a government-controlled society. For my entire life, I considered myself a Republican, but the GOP is no different than the Democrats now. Both parties f*ck the people. I firmly support OWS and also the original Tea Party movement. Look at Romney and Obama's biggest donors to their campaigns. All huge banks. F that.

[-] 1 points by rayl (1007) 2 years ago

couldn't agree with you more! except i was a dem. both parties have failed the american people. politicians are not to be trusted, they are only interested in personal gain

[+] -6 points by ZenDogTroll (13032) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

why are you even here?

[-] -1 points by toonces (-117) 2 years ago

Because I am trying to figure out why OWS is so interested in granting government more power to control the lives of citizens. I am trying to show that the answer is more freedom, not more regulation. I am here because it is in the interest of America to try and make those who think the answer is to take from those who have understand it is better to do for yourself.

[-] -3 points by Kirby (104) 2 years ago

Good point. Top down massive centralized government that takes away freedom and liberty by runway regulation and control will doom us to tyranny. Four more years of Boss Obama and the constitution founded on the blood and sacrifice of the founders won't be worth an ass wipe. Obama believes he is the boss. His ass needs to be kicked down the steps of the white house like an obnoxious drunk in a bar and never let back into any part of government again.

[+] -4 points by GirlFriday (17435) 2 years ago

I find that interesting. Please, do go on. :D

[+] -5 points by ZenDogTroll (13032) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

right.

without government regulation we enable those who have to take from those who have not -

and we can begin with the oil industry. 50 years of no regulation has pretty much decimated the Nigerian Delta -

and they are claiming the oil from the Keystone that just got axed will now go to China -

when it always was going to China - they lie . . . .

[-] -1 points by guru401 (228) 2 years ago

You are truly brainwashed. As long as someone has a "D" next to their name, they receive your support. Wake up. The Democrats are screwing you too.

[+] -5 points by ZenDogTroll (13032) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

this may well be true . . . but only repelicans take such great pride in fucking the American public that they make it a matter of party policy and ideology.

[-] -1 points by BannedForTruth (233) from Christiana, TN 2 years ago

"50yrs of no regulation", what planet do you live on? http://www.regulations.gov/#!home if you cant go there let me know ill provide more info. it is a .gov

[+] -4 points by ZenDogTroll (13032) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

Do you know where the Nigerian Delta Is?

It's in Nigeria

"Conditions of capitalist exploitation are predicated upon the acquisition of territory and the dispossession and dehumanization of indigenous peoples." . . . . OccupyWallSt

This is most recently demonstrated by the hanging of Ken Saro-Wiwa -

[-] -1 points by BannedForTruth (233) from Christiana, TN 2 years ago

Nothing like editing you statement? Still you are wrong Nigeria is part of the world banking system. Their bank is part of the world banking system. This is not captolism it is fascism.

There are no country's with a capitalistic economy The closest there is Is The USA but because the gowernment has the power to force people to pay for services that they don't want to have a part of they must be clased as a socialistic economy.

[-] -3 points by ZenDogTroll (13032) from South Burlington, VT 2 years ago

Nothing like editing you statement?

can you read?

I said: this

  • right.

    • without government regulation we enable those who have to take from those who have not - and we can begin with the oil industry. 50 years of no regulation has pretty much decimated the Nigerian Delta - and they are claiming the oil from the Keystone that just got axed will now go to China - when it always was going to China - they lie . . . .

You inanely responded

And then I handed you your ass . . . .



.

Do you know where the Nigerian Delta Is?

It's in Nigeria

"Conditions of capitalist exploitation are predicated upon the acquisition of territory and the dispossession and dehumanization of indigenous peoples." . . . . OccupyWallSt

This is most recently demonstrated by the hanging of Ken Saro-Wiwa -