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Forum Post: I Am Protectionist And Proud ! ! ! !

Posted 2 years ago on Oct. 17, 2011, 7:54 p.m. EST by mac123 (64) from Canton Township, MI
This content is user submitted and not an official statement

Sir James Goldsmith foresaw everything that we are experiencing today. If you watch this video you will see the real reasons behind the state of our economy today. It's not just about corporate greed its about world trade and why it just won't work. Please watch this video it will be very enlightening. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4PQrz8F0dBI



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[-] 2 points by frankchurch1 (839) from Jersey City, NJ 2 years ago

South Korea protected their economy in the 50s and 60s when they had third world economies, but government intervention, protectionism, refusals to protect foreign patents, copyrights, they went from third world to first world. A small little exporter of fish was government supported, until it turned into a little corporation called Nokia! They are just the major cell phone company in the world! Protectionism works.

In Japan you had Toyoda. Small company. With government protection they later become the car wonder toyota!

[-] 2 points by nomdeguerre (1775) from Brooklyn, NY 1 year ago

They were probably following the "American System" of economy management brought to Asia by Sun Yat Sen.

It was this American System, developed by Henry Clay & others, that after the Civil War created the industrial powerhouse that was America. But now we no longer nurture American businesses, the fraud of free trade has taken over.

[-] 2 points by mac123 (64) from Canton Township, MI 2 years ago

I totally agree. Only this country is too stupid to see that let alone do it.

[-] 2 points by Lefty48197 (117) 2 years ago

No time to watch the video but I am absolutely convinced that the slave labor in China that Walmart and the American retail industry use like beasts of burden is the cause in the collapse of America's middle class.

[-] 1 points by mac123 (64) from Canton Township, MI 2 years ago

That is exactly what the video says!

[-] 1 points by nomdeguerre (1775) from Brooklyn, NY 1 year ago

Protectionism is the one and only thing that will save the American middle class. It's that simple.

[-] 1 points by notaneoliberal (2269) 1 year ago

That is absolutely correct.

[-] 1 points by darrenlobo (204) 1 year ago

A PETITION From the Manufacturers of Candles, Tapers, Lanterns, sticks, Street Lamps, Snuffers, and Extinguishers, and from Producers of Tallow, Oil, Resin, Alcohol, and Generally of Everything Connected with Lighting. To the Honourable Members of the Chamber of Deputies.

Gentlemen: You are on the right track. You reject abstract theories and have little regard for abundance and low prices. You concern yourselves mainly with the fate of the producer. You wish to free him from foreign competition, that is, to reserve the domestic market for domestic industry.

We come to offer you a wonderful opportunity for your — what shall we call it? Your theory? No, nothing is more deceptive than theory. Your doctrine? Your system? Your principle? But you dislike doctrines, you have a horror of systems, as for principles, you deny that there are any in political economy; therefore we shall call it your practice — your practice without theory and without principle.

We are suffering from the ruinous competition of a rival who apparently works under conditions so far superior to our own for the production of light that he is flooding the domestic market with it at an incredibly low price; for the moment he appears, our sales cease, all the consumers turn to him, and a branch of French industry whose ramifications are innumerable is all at once reduced to complete stagnation. This rival, which is none other than the sun, is waging war on us so mercilessly we suspect he is being stirred up against us by perfidious Albion (excellent diplomacy nowadays!), particularly because he has for that haughty island a respect that he does not show for us [1]. (snip) http://bastiat.org/en/petition.html

[-] 3 points by grapes (2631) 1 year ago

We in the U.S. tried to kill invasive species when they threaten the native fauna and flora. In global trade, it should be the same way. No species should be allowed to wreak havoc on the ecosystem. Only when environmental, labor price, safety rules, etc. are comparable should countries join in "free" trade. It is just common sense. Euro area included some weaker siblings and it suffers from the incompatibilities. The joining requirements for the euro area are a correct approach but they need to be rigorously enforced. Otherwise, it just gives every party involved stomach-aches.

[-] -1 points by darrenlobo (204) 1 year ago

The problem is regulated trade. That's what modern govt's do. If they would actually try free trade things would be different.

[-] 2 points by grapes (2631) 1 year ago

The ideal mix for trade is neither highly regulated trade nor free trade. Mother nature shows us how -- magnets' magnetic domains are broken up big and small and aligned to minimize frustrations. There are advantages to BOTH huge domains and minuscule domains. Depending on the particular country we are referring to, we can have over-regulation or under-regulation so we may be talking about different countries and seemingly agree or disagree. I believe that the U.S. had been hijacked by the free trade mania and got itself reduced to impotence and soon obsolescence. The U.S. has much to learn for example from the Brits how to behave as a declining world power and not lose its soul.

[-] 0 points by darrenlobo (204) 1 year ago

There is no compromise with force, don't kid yourself regulation is violently enFORCEd. After all, the Brits declined because they abandoned the free market for the Siren song of progressivism.

[-] 1 points by grapes (2631) 1 year ago

Correct. Regulations are ultimately violently enFORCEd but that is usually because nothing else works. Yes, we should electrocute, fry, and eat the snakehead fish in our midst. I wish that we can bring over Asian appetites for eating snakeheads or Burmese pythons to our ecosystem. The U.S. finance sector behaved like the Burmese pythons so we should trap it, cut it to pieces, and eat them up like our kitty placenta to prevent contagion, not only to our other sectors but to the rest of the world.

The Brits declined because they engaged in World War I and II with their homeland under fire and needing worldwide help from its colonies. No country is exempt from the ill effects of wars. That is why wars are to be prevented as much as possible but ultimately annihilation of the opponents may well be the only and final solution.

[-] 1 points by thegatekeeperbeta (25) from New York, NY 2 years ago

What an amazing video, lots of good points come out of it. Slave labour is evil, both for those working and for those that loose their job because of it.


[-] 1 points by flanga (26) 1 year ago

This is very true. I know a lot of people that loose their job because immigrants are cheaper (labor wise).

Thanks from Clive @ http://easydiablo3.com/.

[-] -2 points by yobstreet (-575) 1 year ago

I have had thus discussion many times with Leftists; they strongly support trade agreements - because - they are highly invested and are concerned about corporate profit.

[-] -2 points by insidervoice (21) 2 years ago

Globalism is not the problem. Global trade is inevitable and the U.S. is best positioned to benefit from that trade. The problem is how the very top corporate executives in this country have no problem enriching themselves while they enable the gutting of the middle class.

[-] 1 points by nomdeguerre (1775) from Brooklyn, NY 1 year ago

Globalism is not inevitable, it's not a law of physics.

One can not be a globalist and an OWSer. One can not be a globalist and an American patriot.

[-] -2 points by laguy (110) 2 years ago

Protectionism and Isolationism is not the answer, Strategic trade is. Nature abhors vacuum, if the US did not take the lead in global trade, somebody else would and they would dominate. It is because of global trade that the US became the most powerful nation. Like I told you in your other thread, the problem is trading with China and India, not with other countries. Trade has to be used as a strategic tool to keep dominance, otherwise others will take the lead.

[-] 3 points by jimhcom (10) from San Diego, CA 2 years ago

Tariffs were used to protect American workers ever since 1776. NAFTA, and the WTO have been disastrous for the US economy and have been extreamly profitable for multi- national corporations.
We will never be able to compete with 3rd world labor until we ourselves become 3rd world labor. We need to withdraw from NAFTA and WTO and implement trade policies that benefit the American workers, then we need to break up the large monopoly corporations, and make it illegal for corporations to give money to politicians in any way, shape, or form punishable by prison.

[-] 1 points by nomdeguerre (1775) from Brooklyn, NY 1 year ago

NAFTA was never passed with the 2/3 vote requirement for treaties. It is actually null and void and any president could declare it so.

[-] 1 points by an0n (764) 2 years ago


[-] 2 points by an0n (764) 2 years ago

Nobody said isolationism. Strategic trade would be considered protectionist by free trade fundamentalists. And I really recommend the video.

[-] -2 points by laguy (110) 2 years ago

Global trade is an irresistible force. The wage differential happened because of colonial domination of 2-3 centuries by Western Europe and it is slowly giving way to lesser wage differential. But it is happening for countries that got market access, which was given as a reward for political alliance. So to think that one country even the most powerful one like the US can stop global trends is wishful thinking.

It does not matter if people call strategic trade protectionism, this is what is needed to stop Chinese and Indian dominance, not just for US and EU, but for the rest of the world, who are essentially nations less populous than the US and will never be a threat for the US. But China and India, each individually, are a looming threat for the whole world. Because unimaginable power and just a small step from poverty and malnutrition is a bad cocktail and a recipe for global instability and chaos.

[-] 2 points by mac123 (64) from Canton Township, MI 2 years ago

He said the US should only have free trade with countries that have similar wages. It should be a regional thing. If the US engages with trade with low wage countries like India and China there will be a world wide economic catastrophy.

[-] 1 points by an0n (764) 2 years ago

Beyond similar wages, please include labor and environmental laws. Otherwise, intelligent tariffs that account for the differences, please.

[-] 2 points by mac123 (64) from Canton Township, MI 2 years ago

Another thing he brings up in the video is that millions of people in third world countries will flock to the cities to get the new jobs being offered and there will be far too many people to be employed driving wages down even further.

[-] 1 points by mbsss (92) 2 years ago