Forum Post: Homeland Security Cracks down on OWS
Posted 12 years ago on Nov. 28, 2011, 7:07 a.m. EST by bklynsboy
(834)
This content is user submitted and not an official statement
The UK Guardian has a good piece on how OWS is feared at the highest levels of Washington and attack dogs like Peter King are coordinating police responses throughout America. Press coverage is being restricted. There is an $850,000 contract to smear OWS. The OWS goals mentioned in the story: reinstatement of Glass-Steagle to regulate wall Street, repeal Citizens United which allows unlimited business money into politics, and the Congressional loophole allowing profits by insider trading to congressmen are terrorizing business and politicians for fear of losing billions.
Nothing is as strong as an idea whose time has come. Repression of OWS will backfire bigtime. This will become like Kent State and Vietnam protests.
Related to Obama's actions putting OWS in the news, is the distraction of the public and press to keep attention away from the endless wars and bloated military budget. 1000 bases around the world, global force projection by the military, cuts in all areas of US life so there's endless money for the military-industrial-congressional complex, are kept out of sight/out of mind with strawmen and false threats from OWS to keep the public and press focused away from military activities and spending.
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Glass-Steagle to regulate wall Street, repeal Citizens United which allows unlimited business money into politics, and the Congressional loophole allowing profits by insider trading to congressmen are terrorizing business and politicians for fear of losing billions.
small issues
we need to end war
and establish health care
and take responsible control or our government and our industry
Absolutely! Endless war enriches contractors and bankrupts the US. Dems and republicans embrace all war all the time.
but yes, bring the troops home...we need to not police the world anymore
Absolutely! Our military actions continue to provoke actions and hate against us. No other country does this. The Military-industrial complex wants endless war, win or lose, to keep the money flowing.
yes, let's not fight back. let's bend over for them.
maybe you can make an instructional video on how to bend over for someone.
Obama is already on tape bowing and begging other nations forgiveness for the US, let's just go all the way with it.
tomcat68...Where do you get your opinions from, can you quote sourses? Or is just your opinion.
Do Canada, the entire continents of Asia, Australia and South America have Middle East terrorism? No, because they're not invading and occupying countries for oil and minerals like the US. Instead, China goes in without firing a shot and partners with them and gets resources and wealth. Wake up. Do it smart. Win or lose the MIC wants endless war to keep the dollars flowing. All that bend over Fox crap is tailgate manure bullshit.
so, the truth is, You can't see any reason to be involved unless there was oil to be gained. and yet you claim its the motivation behind republicans.
I'm starting to understand how the Liberal mind works.
If they SAY something about someone Else, it means that's what They would like to do, just unable to do it.
I don't see any extra oil coming out of the middle east, and I'm sure that breaks the hearts of Every Bush hater alive today to be wrong but. it's not the 1st time a girl has cried, go ahead. let it all out
Put on your glasses and learn to read. I'll use bigger type for you. The Military-industrial-congressional complex wants endless war, win or lose, to make money. That's why they spend millions to brainwash weak minds like yours into supporting them with their propaganda bullshit.
you've explained what you think, yes we understand what conspiracy theorys are.
thanks.
yeaaa let's go home, the world is a beautiful safe place and everyone will just let us live our lives. no one will attack us :)
well If north Korea does acquire a nuke it will probably only be able to reach San Fransisco :) Hopefully during some big Gay fest and wipe out 200,000 Liberals.
I'd send them a thank you card.
please pay attention to the occupiers...as violence comes to them they staand, kneel, pray and look for the forces of the world to cleanse of us the madness...also what world leading nations need to do!
we do pay attention, despite their attempts to run off members some of us do remain.
we work daily to weed out the irrational, and instill some logic into the masses of brainwashed Obaminites, some we actually save. others are doomed.
but every town has its town idiot, every nation has its liberals.
In the end we get thanks for cleaning up the movement, and helping to focus on logical paths to success. in the meantime we get called "trolls"
wait...u r a troll? U want war? u are so scared of nukes that u want to police the world? I do not feel u pay much attention, unless of course u r gettin paid to? love ya tomcat
the Only people who Want war are radical Islamist.
and if by being Part of the world, being all over he world, being part of other peoples lives instead of hiding at home so their Dictators can claim we are the white devil is "wanting to police" then yes.
Liberals fail to understand this isn't 1776. it doesn't take 3 months to sail a wooden boat from half way around the globe to attack Americans. they can do it within 8 hours.
watch how fast they start burning American flags once we are gone, rally the ignorant with a common far away imaginary enemy. I've watched it my whole life. now especially with the WORST foreign policies in American history (thank you again Mr. Obama) in place we can expect matters to become much worse.
I'm not agaist your proposals, but the truth is money has dominated politics long before Citizens united, and the one percenters have gotten away wqith white collar crime against humanity with or without Glass Steagal.
Yes, money buys the best government possible.
small steps, small misstakes
Old hippie fuck I need your help. Need help making a t-shirt. We need to draw a picture of Zooccotti Park with a cage around it. Here are some ideas: Draw a hippie climbing the cage like a monkey and throwing shit. Draw a hippie rolling in mud and shit like a pig. Draw a hippies fucking like dogs. Draw a picture of a hippie eating peanuts like a big fucking elephant. Draw a hippie as a lazy fucking Ape doing nothing.
The Hippies traded LSD for Viagra a long time ago. If you want to insult hippies go to www.aarp.org.
I don’t know if you’re all getting this through your heads yet,
but
Senate Bill 1867 –the National Defense Authorization Act– would openly “legalize” the U.S. government’s detainment and murder of OWS protesters and the assassination of talk show hosts, bloggers, journalists and anyone who holds a so-called “anti-government” point of view. This is the open and blatant declaration of war against any who do not going along with TSA thugs reaching down your pants, the Goldman Sachs economic takeover of nations, the secret arrest and torture of American citizens, and other acts of outright tyranny waged by an out-of-control government.
Those who have been burying their heads in the sand over the coming police state need to wake up and face the music. That U.S. Senators would knowingly and willfully attempt to pass a bill thatlegalizesthe indefinite detainment, torture and killing of American citizens with no due process whatsoever — and on American soil! — is nothing less than a traitorous betrayal of the once-free American people. These are, our founding fathers would have said,acts of waragainst the People. They reveal the insidious plan to put in place a legal framework to end the Bill of Rights, murder protesters, and overrun America with total police state brutality.
And yet the sheeple are still asleeple
I grow weary of trying to warn the American people to wake up and see what is now right in front of their eyes, so for those who want to read these words themselves — right in the Senate bill — you can read it at: http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/query…
And YES, it has now been confirmed that the indefinite detainment and murder provisions do apply to American citizens on the streets of American cities. As Sen. Lindsey Graham explained in plain language on the Senate floor: “…1031, the statement of authority to detain, does apply to American citizens and it designates the world as the battlefield, including the homeland.”
That means America, for those of you who are still wondering what “homeland” means. It’s a phrase borrowed from Nazi Germany, of course, which is the source of much of this legislation as you might have noticed.
“The power is so broad that even U.S. citizens could be swept up by the military and the military could be used far from any battlefield, even within the United States itself,” says the ACLU (http://www.aclu.org/blog/national-s…).
Homefront: The U.S. government’s war against the People
If this bill passes and is signed into law, it would mean that America’s war machine could then be turned against the American people – liberal, conservative, libertarian… it doesn’t matter. If you question the government, you are suddenly an “enemy combatant” and they will cite this law as the legal justification for putting a bullet in your head, fire-bombing your little protest group, or literally running over you and your buddies with tanks. (And they won’t stop like China did in Tiananmen Square when that one brave citizen stood up against tyranny there in 1989.) (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6inW…)
The premeditate murder of U.S. protesters (Occupy Wall Street, anyone?) is now being codified into law as the government’s “right.” Of course, your rights to Free Speech, due process, owning a firearm and other rights are being obliterated in the process. Only the government has “rights” now, didn’t you know? Theslavesof the nation (i.e. the citizens) are being stripped of all rights, including the right to grow your own food, have a picnic or even buy fresh dairy products from a farmer.
Governments routinely murder far more people than terrorists
I don’t know if you’re all getting this through your heads yet,
but ....
Senate Bill 1867 –the National Defense Authorization Act– would openly “legalize” the U.S. government’s detainment and murder of OWS protesters and the assassination of talk show hosts, bloggers, journalists and anyone who holds a so-called “anti-government” point of view. This is the open and blatant declaration of war against any who do not going along with TSA thugs reaching down your pants, the Goldman Sachs economic takeover of nations, the secret arrest and torture of American citizens, and other acts of outright tyranny waged by an out-of-control government.
Those who have been burying their heads in the sand over the coming police state need to wake up and face the music. That U.S. Senators would knowingly and willfully attempt to pass a bill thatlegalizesthe indefinite detainment, torture and killing of American citizens with no due process whatsoever — and on American soil! — is nothing less than a traitorous betrayal of the once-free American people. These are, our founding fathers would have said,acts of waragainst the People. They reveal the insidious plan to put in place a legal framework to end the Bill of Rights, murder protesters, and overrun America with total police state brutality.
And yet the sheeple are still asleeple
I grow weary of trying to warn the American people to wake up and see what is now right in front of their eyes, so for those who want to read these words themselves — right in the Senate bill — you can read it at: http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/query…
And YES, it has now been confirmed that the indefinite detainment and murder provisions do apply to American citizens on the streets of American cities. As Sen. Lindsey Graham explained in plain language on the Senate floor: “…1031, the statement of authority to detain, does apply to American citizens and it designates the world as the battlefield, including the homeland.”
That means America, for those of you who are still wondering what “homeland” means. It’s a phrase borrowed from Nazi Germany, of course, which is the source of much of this legislation as you might have noticed.
“The power is so broad that even U.S. citizens could be swept up by the military and the military could be used far from any battlefield, even within the United States itself,” says the ACLU (http://www.aclu.org/blog/national-s…).
Homefront: The U.S. government’s war against the People
If this bill passes and is signed into law, it would mean that America’s war machine could then be turned against the American people – liberal, conservative, libertarian… it doesn’t matter. If you question the government, you are suddenly an “enemy combatant” and they will cite this law as the legal justification for putting a bullet in your head, fire-bombing your little protest group, or literally running over you and your buddies with tanks. (And they won’t stop like China did in Tiananmen Square when that one brave citizen stood up against tyranny there in 1989.) (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6inW…)
The premeditate murder of U.S. protesters (Occupy Wall Street, anyone?) is now being codified into law as the government’s “right.” Of course, your rights to Free Speech, due process, owning a firearm and other rights are being obliterated in the process. Only the government has “rights” now, didn’t you know? Theslavesof the nation (i.e. the citizens) are being stripped of all rights, including the right to grow your own food, have a picnic or even buy fresh dairy products from a farmer.
Governments routinely murder far more people than terrorists
before it becomes like Kent state people need to die. Only then will that pendulum begin to swing in the other direction. Do "we the people" have a army? or does the army have the people? Do the people want a huge military complex? I know we can not afford it, unless we can get the rest of the world to pay. Russia meanwhile is out of debt and growing its economy while we are still burdened by the costs of the cold war. Who won the cold war? Not us, we are about to drop from debt while Russia is becoming lean and out of debt.
Yes and the MIC wants endless wars, win or lose, for profits. We must fire politicians enabling this.
endless war you must admit does cause jobs and grows the economy, plus if we keep inventing they have to keep buying new weapons. Its one way to get the monies we spent on oil back. but not necessarily a good one. I spent some time making tank parts years ago. If we stop making tanks then what shall we build instead? tanks take people to build and make jobs.
True but the same money invested in civilian products is 3 times more effective in creating jobs.
all we need is a good path to follow from one to the other, so things can proceed without too much turmoil.
In fact war industries have converted to civilian products with benefit to all.
we used to build bombers in Chicago area now they build double wides in those plants. The US got the large aircraft industry after WW2 now we have Boeing benefiting all. so I agree with you.
The money spent on civilian products is 3 x more beneficial in creating jobs than military products which aren't used by society.
and if civilians were not given a steady diet of HEY buy this new electronic gadget you never needed before, they would save more of their money and would not need to borrow so much to have what everyone else has. You know of course that most of the world does not have what we have and they live all day long without needing the things we have. If teenager does not get the new ?Ipad they think they are being abused. Where did those ideas come from? commercials? less TV social programming would help.
another reply that points out the Movement Opposed to the Greedy is motivated by greed its self.
yes you are correct however be careful, they like to Ban your I.P for pointing that out, and if you continue they send a DOS attack. you are only FREE to speak your mind if they agree with you. (Liberal Freedom)
Exactly, advertising creating need.
corps drilling into your head thru the TV with constant commercials
I despise commercials and watch free movies loaned from the library whenever I can.
good solution
Another is to trade movies with friends.
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that's why many libertarians would get rid of the department of homeland security
The new department is a bloated carcass to suck up taxpayer money for imagined threats.
true
The old system of separate departments was better and transparent.
what good are overlapping departments? waste more money and infringe on freedom
DHS is so big, money flow can't be traced, like the pentagon budget.
good example of why we really don't need anothe george bush
Doesn't seem to be much diff with Obama: he continued and expanded most Bush policies.
sure
tax breaks to rich, roll back pollution and wALL sT. regs, expanded wars.
good lord, Bush was an Angel by comparison to this Administration.
I'm so sick of hearing about a Past President from the "Hope and Change" generation, can you really Change the past? no, can't change a damn thing now either so you turn around and point the boney finger of Blame.
pssst. Bush isn't in office anymore. and NO he can't control the weather
Bush was a sociopath, murderer, a liar and a thief. Same as Obama but I don't think Bush had any reservations.
Peter King is a raci$t & the worst example of the U.S. government. King's a guy who targets & profiles innocent Muslim-Americans to keep fueling wars in Afghanistan & Iraq.
A whore politician doing anything for votes and $.
you mean like the ONE ? the great Obama? God of Hope and Change.
The attempt to shut down OWS sites is well planned and coordinated. No question about the level of fear in DC. We have seen agents from all major agencies (CIA, ONI, DI, FBI, HS) at our DC locations. They have been tracking who is in the camps very carefully. Their goal may be to have people converge on DC for one major showdown. Resist this temptation. It is a trap.
Keep moving. Keep going. We are winning.
I don't think so. The problems we have go far beyond Glass-Steagle, regulating wall Stree and Citizens United. Most of the things we demand and need they can't give us. It will be to us. They are only 1% who have to lie, cheat and steal. Or I should say some of them. But 1% can fix what's wrong with our country. We need better way to move forward. We're going to get it from the 1% or government.
FIGHT THE CAUSE - NOT THE SYMPTOM Read “Common Sense 3.1” at ( www.revolution2.osixs.org )
We don't have to live like this.
rickmoss...The 1% are the CAUSE , they are NOT a SYMPTOM.
Flawed reasoning. They were once less than the 1%, so how did they BECOME the 1% ?
Rico...why don't you show something to back up your mouth...Like this.....According to the Congressional Budget Office, between 1979 and 2007 incomes of the top 1% of Americans grew by an average of 275%. During the same time period, the 60% of Americans in the middle of the income scale saw their income rise by 40%. Since 1979 the average pre-tax income for the bottom 90% of households has decreased by $900, while that of the top 1% increased by over $700,000, as federal taxation became less progressive. From 1992-2007 the top 400 income earners in the U.S. saw their income increase 392% and their average tax rate reduced by 37%.
Right, just like 1% percent can control 99%. The 99% must be really stupid or weak minded. Take your pick it doesn't matter.
...or they don't have the money to buy the politicians.
rickMoss....You have Zero understanding of what the 1% have done and are doing now........ Yet you have a strong opinion about something, what it can be is dumbfounding.
I've read everyone of your comments under this post and have not found a single statement backed by reason or fact. Your most 'formidable weapon' appears to be insult, and you're not even very clever at it. Let me guess, about 16 years old ?
Rico...Point them out to me...
Homeland Security would be doing a proper job if they were going after WallStreet, Big Corporations and Oil Corporations & Futures. Pharma, Health Insurance and Health Providers, Media Corporations. This is where true terror lives right now.
Include PACS and US policy of endless wars and interventions resulting in blowback and hatred of the US and desire to attack it. Ex.: the US (NATO) air strike killing 30 Pakistanis, and many others.
So to begin, we need to begin where we are right now. Take back the government and put a leash on corporations. War is profitable to corporations, not to people.
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I think this is called the attack and deny phase. How long will the government (especially the Republicans) deny that there is a problem? How long will the government protect the 1% (and themselves) ? How long will they deny that there is government corruption?
Are they in complete denial? Are there any Repelicans that have entered the acceptance stage?
http://my.auburnjournal.com/detail/192038.html
Dear Government, Is there any corruption in our government that you might be aware of? If yes, please explain what you intend to do about it. If no, you are either clueless or a corrupted reprehensible liar. Either way, start packing.
Sincerely and Respectfully, 99% of Your Constituents.
Nice letter. Money buys congress but if we vote as a block we can fire them.
You think?? I might just post this on my Representatives facebook page! Just for the shameless spamming sake of it. lol Besides, I don't really like the guy anyway. So I always enjoy posting a little sarcasm on his fb page.
And we need a concerted effort to get behind this kind of thing. I don't think either of these has all the right stuff, but it's a small step in the right direction anyway.
http://deutch.house.gov/News/DocumentSingle.aspx?DocumentID=269672 http://tomudall.senate.gov/?p=blog&id=970
Rattle their cage!
it's time these issues were fully investigated in OPEN committees so we can see all the dirt and who has it on them. it is totally unacceptable that our government is influenced by big money and that our elected representatives are profiting by having insider information.
Exactly! That's why they're attacking.
Coordinated Attacks in Philly & LA: Don't just read this. Do something. Sign the petitions:
End the Patriot Act. It is being used against Americans. We lost our constitution:
https://wwws.whitehouse.gov/petitions#!/petition/repeal-patriot-act/JF1pdPKg
https://wwws.whitehouse.gov/petitions#!/petition/end-patriot-act/nH20qwfr
Congress will respond if they are threatened by not getting re-elected.
There are so many parameters that go into elections. Most of these parameters are controlled by money. You need to get the message out. The group with the most PR money has a strong competitive advantage to win.
Exactly! Koch and industry hsvr bottomless pockets to influence opinion and pay off congress.
They are already getting an amendment for the military to have more power with the american people so this is official they are declaring war on its citizens.
Congress must be fired!
How is this legal? Of course, it's not.
It is absolutely, totally outrageous and unconstitutional that DHS could co-opt local authorities and coordinate a country-wide crack down on Occupy encampments. Any mayor could have told them to take a hike (the U.S. model is decentralized power - ha, ha), but none did. Ouch.
It shows how high and how deep money buys the government.
Join the Mormon Church. Mitt Romney will lead us to Heaven.
and whose interpretation of heaven is he peddlin'?
Jesus would never agree to these US wars for oil.
During the National Democratic convention in Chicago, 1968.. http://law2.umkc.edu/faculty/projects/ftrials/Chicago7/Account.html
there was a 'Known' Factor that the FBI had intentionally been involved to get the Local Police in an Aggressive stance CREATING the violence that ensued... Although the Chicago '7' were found guilty, they were later Pardoned by Nixon due to the Facts of the FBI involvement was about to be exposed... Nixon's Pardon was under that threat of exposure.
... Read the Link, and See how closely tied we are to our Historic Need as a Nation to get involved ... Do the Right Thing.... Damn the torpedoes... and Full Speed Ahead... 'American Way'!
Yes, the establishment has plants and spies to provoke riots upon command.
We can always occupy here. We won't get one peep from one soul.
http://occupywallst.org/forum/enterprise-rent-a-car-murders-children/#comment-443659
The Revolution starts here!
Agreed!
Thank you. The KTC want's all the support we can get for this one. It's just so awful. I know they asked us today to occupy some air show because they have military influence, but we can always do that stuff. I think this is one time where it's just the right thing to do, and we would be treated like heroes. We wouldn't have to say or do anything down there. Just hold signs and if anyone asks what's up, we would say hey, where were you on Thanksgiving, these girls were in the ground. :(
Ford Pintos had gas tanks that exploded when hit in the rear. Many young people got incinerated.
Whether by Obama or not I have to agree somewhat with your last paragraph. We need to spend some of our energy in forming self-sustainable communities and preparing for worse times ahead.
YES! The Western hemisphere has enough natural gas to get off oil! What we pay for oil is incredible!
http://blog.independent.org/2011/11/28/no-war-for-oil-confronts-a-key-premise-of-u-s-foreign-policy/
lol I mean our human energy though ....
Yes, building a community spirit is needed. Everyone is out for themselves.
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Mainstream media fail completely in giving complete news.
yep. The only Security of all is in a Free Press
and as soon as we Ban FOX news and radio talk shows everything will be perfect :)
All the result of not working to defend the constitution. It needs defense and we can prove it. Article 5 is the way to defend it. Law enforcement and municipal leaders must change their perspective while you are sing constitutional right to defend the constitution. Congress has criminally been failing to follow the constitution for 100 years. THis page has a video of Bill Walker who sued all members of congress for failing their duty.
http://algoxy.com/poly/article_v_convention.html
This is a letter that actually cites the violations of law that congress is conducting at this moment having neglected, non feased and mal feased for so long we are seriously needing to engage remedy. This could be legitimately be used to Occupy Congress in constructive notice.
Then go to the state with this house resolution after 45 days IF congress does not act.
http://articlevconvention.org/showthread.php?3-Letter-to-your-Representatives
Now it comes to finding who understands that protests need to be organized upon states legislatures. They need to understand some legal aspects too. Here is a letter template, resolution form that can be sent to state legislatures asking them to work for an article V convention.
http://articlevconvention.org/showthread.php?10-Templates-Letter-to-State-Representatives-request-for-house-resolution
Article 5 is our first and last constitutional right. If we don't use it now, we will not have any rights.
Lessig power point on article V http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4gpbfY-atMk
Lots of facts here about Article V. http://algoxy.com/poly/article_v_convention.html
Article V conference, Lawrence Lessig at harvard 9/25/11-other attendee video comments http://vimeo.com/31464745 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T-7ikbvu0Y8
You are so right. We The People have come alive and realize what is being done to us (as in BOHICA). This is now the greatest liberation movment in all of human history. As the great-great-great-great-great grandson of a Revolutionary War soldier who fought the British in North Carolina, I can do no less than the did in the struggle for freedom in our own time. I hope to make him proud of me, wherever he may be.
We are relatively peaceful protesters not violent terrorists.
My ancestor was not a violent terrorist, and neither am I. He was protecting his wife, family, and home from invaders and aiding the cause of American freedom. If necessary, I can do no less. Would you have preferred that he watch as his family was murdered and his home burned to the ground? He was given a land grant in Georgia in honor of his service in the Revolutionary War, and a letter of commendation from President George Washington.
That is hardly a factual report, but a political op-ed piece. I chased the links down and there are no sources identified other than Mayor Quan, and she never mentioned the DHS or FBI. This kind of 'reporting' which advocates a position and uses the conjectures of others doing the same is 'yellow journalism.' I don't trust this kind of reporting no matter what side the op-ed author supports being it pro-OWS or anti-OWS. There is a LOT of crap out there in the ether, and we have to confirm it's validity based on acknowledged sources lest we pollute our minds with crap.
Rico....Yeah right.....NOT.....Your full of shit!
Actually, I'm saying I work very hard NOT to be full of shit. You on the other hand, seem perfectly happy to just accept whatever anyone says that happens to reinforce your cherished fears and sense of persecution. Calling me names does not improve the quality of the story, it only further reinforces my suspicions of how 'journalists' are getting away with publishing such crap in the first place.
Rico...All you do is mouth the words...show some facts to back up what you mouth is saying.....Or is it everybody is telling lies but me.
great, about time a few core issues are found...
just a technicality... we can't "repeal" Citizens United because it was (unfortunately) a ruling by the Supreme Court. I suppose we could write new legislation (once we throw the corporate puppets out), but I'm not sure. There's also a movement underway to amend the Constitution on this point. (i think).
http://www.getmoneyout.com/
beamer i finally found a word I like on here or a phrase really ,yes one of yours,and yes its been around for years ,they are not criminals they are PUPPETS...thats the freaking phrase to describe them...thank you...lol
MichK...Who are THEY?
Chuk well you have to tell me...who do you think I mean since you are asking,who do YOU think they are?. Advice is look at the thread above and its not that hard to see who they are in this context.
Michk...Are you serious, you won't spell out who they are?...Lets see who would be puppets instead of the common criminals they are.....let me take a guess...Your a republican apologetic. am I right?
Well in this context yes,,,politicans most are that goes republican.democrat and anything in between...criminals means did something against the law...morally wrong is what they do to us all the time,legally well far and few in between or so we see.
MichK...Sorry you flunk the smell test....
oh ummm ok chuck very inteligent reply(s) I guess I flunked the smell test ...I will go hang myself now over it(sarcasm by the way)
MitchK.........Sorry Republicans set the table for the Criminals on Wall Street/Big Banks.............. If you want the details would be happy to bury you in them....
ok I would like that since you know...just keep in mind one point, before Clinton,under George Bush Sr.. the highest tax bracket was for those earning 86,500 at 31.% tax bracket,making them the "wealthy" Clinton came in saying ,with NO economic basis at all just making up a number raised that tax bracket to 39.6% for people earning over 250,000 now making them the "wealthy" (NTW thast joint income not individual)...so yes please do bury me in stuff that republicans did FOR the "criminals" on wall street....and please remember I do not say its either republican or democrats fault is say its all PARTIES FAULTS,corprate greeds fault,americans greed and prides fault.
MitchK...Okay here it comes.............. Oh if this isn't enough I have more.... .Edward Wolff is a professor of economics at New York University. He is the author of Top Heavy: The Increasing Inequality of Wealth in America.............. How do economists measure levels of equality and inequality? Wolff: The most common measure used, and the most understandable is: what share of total wealth is owned by the richest households, typically the top 1 percent. In the United States, in the last survey year, 1998, the richest 1 percent of households owned 38 percent of all wealth.
This is the most easily understood measure.
There is also another measure called the Gini coefficient. It measures the concentration of wealth at different percentile levels, and does an overall computation. It is an index that goes from zero to one, one being the most unequal. Wealth inequality in the United States has a Gini coefficient of .82, which is pretty close to the maximum level of inequality you can have......................................According to the Congressional Budget Office, between 1979 and 2007 incomes of the top 1% of Americans grew by an average of 275%. During the same time period, the 60% of Americans in the middle of the income scale saw their income rise by 40%. Since 1979 the average pre-tax income for the bottom 90% of households has decreased by $900, while that of the top 1% increased by over $700,000, as federal taxation became less progressive. From 1992-2007 the top 400 income earners in the U.S. saw their income increase 392% and their average tax rate reduced by 37%.........
Chuck...thank you for clearifying that the republicans ,as you put it " set the table for the Criminals on Wall Street/Big Banks.............. If you want the details would be happy to bury you in them....Now can I ask you a question since you want to copy and paste ideas of another can YOU answer anything for your self with out powerphrasing or just spewing others words?
Mitchk...I didn't copy and paste Ideas...I copied and pasted ..the reports from official sources or authority......If you find these facts not to your liking please refute them.......... Poisoning the well is an old trick, used by the uniformed or losers in a debate.
Well chuck up to your old childish wasy trying to insult or be rude ( Mitchk...I didn't copy and paste Ideas...I copied and pasted .. ) when you can make a logical,intelligent point ,of your own,have a good life chuck
MitchK...Glad to see you know when your bested....LOL..you didn't earn your Troll pay today..
Another example showing zero intelligence and insults typical of a 16 year old.
Rico...I see no rebuttal to the points I made....
yup... and feel free to use it because i ain't got no copyrights!
lol..well thank you kind sir
Huge Koch money and corporate interests buying up Congress to keep this.
"There's also a movement underway to amend the Constitution on this point."
There better be.
there is WOLF PAC.com and i saw something about a meeting in Philly July 4, 2012.
Why did it take 2 months to come up with those demands?
Gosh
See we've just hinted at it and now the government is going nuts.
It hits them where it hurts.
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The Guardian is the worst example of press in the UK. If your going to quote something atleast quote something credible. Choosing the Guardian is like choosing the Enquierer as your choice for legit evening news.
It should be quite evident by now to every sane person that the nationwide Occupy movement will only be tolerated by local governments until public opinion turns against the squaller and foolishness of a rudderless movement. This time has arrived, and complain as you will, this is no "Arab Spring", and is over.. You were told many times to conduct a full scale Occupation of the White House which is not only the source of the national problems we face, but is not a State, and is governed by different rules that would have allowed you to stay forever in Tents with Generators. The current administration has no back bone to stop you, and the Capitol Police support OWH. But you have failed, and failed miserably . You can thank the DNC backed OWS group and a coerced General Assembly. LA, Oakland, New York, etc.. you have been used!! Wake up.. Go against The GA/ OWS bias and support of the corrupt DNC, and " the White House" Now!!
admit it...your a Nut Job, Hunh?
This is already moving forward. Maybe you looking in the wrong place for nuts... :-0
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Faux guardian news.
Yeah-ya. I read that. She posted it Friday. Nice article. I especially like the notion she raised - that specter of Civil War.
What I find unfortunate is that she makes allegations against the President, allegations that I do not believe are accurate.
In any case, I left her a comment on the article, and you can read it
here
z
Our official Obama apologist rants on for yet another day.... Endlessly, aimlessly....
Yeah, he ignores FACTS rendering himself a joke and irrelevant.
bklynsboy.............Enlighten Me just what facts is he ignoring........You stupid Motherfucker..
I don't apologize for the man. He has a difficult job to do. As we march toward victory, you will see divisions develop within Congress, where those opposed to us and the necessary reforms we demand, will become more vocal, more vitriolic, more desperate, frantic even in their efforts to put out the fires all around them.
You will see who is in our corner and who is not.
I'm doing it again; I actually think information will help Obama supporters. It won't.
CIA asset: 'Libyan opposition is al-Qaeda' http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u03Xiz4i26w
rosewood....are you and bklynsboy...Fuck buddies?...You sure take the same party line...all Tea Party.
Still no signs of intelligence.
Rico....How well are trolls paid.?
I have no idea, but it probably relates to intelligence. Don't bother applying.
HELLo HELlo HEllo Hello hello, is anyone in there... in there.. in ther...
No buddies on here....tea party won't accept me, because I support OWS, and other things.
rosewood...Nobody here thinks your sincere.
Too bad - I'm on dial-up.
It would be interesting to see what this bit of spin is all about - sometimes you get certain cues that help point the way . . . .
o wait - what am I saying - that's how you got here . . .
In any event - if what you are saying is true, then obviously we have turned a corner in our war on Terror - for now it appears al-qaida likes America . . . I saw them on CNN, praising Allah - and the U.S. - for the NATO bombing campaign . . .
I mean, those were the rebels . . .
and if al-qaida is the rebels . . .
it just stands to reason - the war on terror has just been won
check out infowars dot com...and the Alex Jones YT channel. you'll get information that you can research, and analysis which you need. AJ is far from perfect, often problematic, but he gathers intel that you can research, and much of his analysis is spot on. He has his own self invested agenda which does not impair one from doing one's own research. You'll benefit from the intell, but try not to become a Alex Jones sycophant as you are with Obama.
You still here?
analysis - Libya -
the rebels resisted, Gadhafi responded with mass murder - consequence: a wave of immigration headed toward France and Italy
Result: Nato would likely have gotten involved whether the U.S. did or not
Repelican response: Of course Nato will act, and the U.S. will be in the Lead! Never was there discussion about by whom and with what means our involvement would be paid
Obama Response: sure, we'll join the Nato effort - but we will not take the lead, instead France and England will assume most of the burden
Can anyone say with certainty, that had we maintained a completely hands off approach, fewer Libyans would have died as a result of their movement to overthrow Gadhafi?
Maybe, but I doubt it.
rosewood...why don't you take your Troll Republican ass out of here.
He sounds a lot more balanced than you. YOU'RE an Obama apologist, and you NEVER accept anything even hinting the object of your affection may have one fault.
Rico........Balanced and Fair........now where have I heard that statement before........I think it was on cable.........oh that's right it's the "Faux News slogan", how appropriate.
Now you're going even lower that ad hominem. Do you ever actually discuss facts or are these political hatchet-man methods all you've got ?
Rico...It has as much fact as your post...
Not a republican/no longer a democrat....pro constitution, pro bill of rights; anti-nwo, anti-globalist; anti-bush/anti-obama; pro-ows; pro-2nd ammendment. my ass stays here lol
rosewood....anti-99%
The 99% are not blind faith Obama supporters. That's only you, and you are not the 99%.
Rico........Your trying to put words in my mouth, I stated that I think the stands you are taking are anti the 99%.
Al-qaeda is a CIA, 1% asset, at the top; although in it's ranks, there are those who are unaware. They are used, as in libya, to advance the Anglo-American empire, through it's war on terror; which seeks global financial dictatorship. Nations that resist the banker world dictatorship are attacked and destroyed; a puppet government implanted that will advance the central banking dictatorship. Obama is a puppet of the 1%. Nothing personal...just the truth.
wow, that's deep. and it gives an awful lot of credit to the bankers - to organize and maintain a conspiracy of this magnitude must require a lot of resources -
no wonder they had to get bailed out.
I wonder how they manage to keep all ah them towel heads in line . . .
I guess you haven't noticed it's not just the towel heads being kept in line. We now have a hardcore police state continuing and expanding under Obama. duh again
A great Conspiracy theory for the unintelligent.
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I found this for you although it won't activate your fluoridated under mind control grey matter... No a constitutional lawyer, and president should not be assassinating American citizens without due process...duh duh and duh
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8Pk88A8a8EM USA vs. USA: Killing Americans abroad
well no one has assassinated me yet
I've given you some links, which should help you to orient towards truth and reality. Unfortunately they won't; many people whom are given the information label it as spin, regardless of the many high quality sources it's coming from.
Sometimes this isn't about dissociation, but one of moral turpitude; and both states of consciousness, one cannot control in the other person. It's entirely up to them to embrace the truth, or deny it. Your choice...your path.
Rosewood...where's the link to the John Birch society.
chucky I'll leave you on the play ground with Zendog. I'm watching Americans being taken apart, and slow killed in my profession, so I'm not up for mindless play. But you have fun...take care
rosewood...That's right don't answer the serious question about your conspiracy theories......You try to "poison the well" and put up a "strawman". Sorry to inform you but I'm onto you......... Your a Republican Hack, passing misinformation.
Wow ..I've never been called a republican hack before ....kinda funny as the republicans call me a commie hahaha...and the commies call me a socialist, and the socialists call me a capitalist; as the capitalists call me a commie/socialist. lol..true.
Using the old divide and conquer psyops tactic because I'm focusing on Obama; and your duty is to protect the image of the president ?
rosewood....Is the pay good for being a republican Troll?
http://www.prisonplanet.com/30-signs-that-the-united-states-of-america-is-being-turned-into-a-giant-prison.html
http://www.prisonplanet.com/rand-paul-aims-to-kill-indefinite-detention-provision-of-controversial-bill.html
rosewood...Most of the prison population is related to the "Failed war on drugs".................. Where the various police departments concentrate their manpower on arresting drug users, to boast their drug arrests records so they can get more federal funds to buy more equipment...................In this process police are negligent in following up on violent criminals....The Chicago Police Department is a classic example.
Based on your comment about prison populations, it seems you read the title of the link, but didn't open it. It has nothing to do with drugs and prisons., but thanks for responding.
The Real Reason for NATO Attacking Libya EXPOSED http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O35_Ai6EsMU&feature=related
rosewood.......Tell me in your own words what you think the reason was to attack Libya..............I love a good conspiracy theory.
Nice - I'm sure there will be someone coming along to refute your spin - I mean, I naturally assume that somehow it serves right wingnut intersts . . ..
By the way the clinical psychologist was invited on, by a panel of constitutional lawyers, from both the left and right of the political spectrum; who united in a town hall meeting; attempting to mobilize the American public. The lawyers couldn't understand the bizarre lack of response from the American people, considering the constitutional crisis that was occuring. I attended this event some 5 years ago; and the people just now with OWS began a mass response.
Dissociation was the psychologist's diagnosis on, we the people...and it's sadly not cured with more information, as we can see here. History also shows us that much of the population will follow their leader no matter what...period; and history repeats . So we're justing repeating, and the 1% know that.
yeah-ya. what is it with shrinks these days? yer head not small enough yet?
fuck
Do you realize the DSM IV has so thoroughly quantified the human condition that there is not one person on the planet who will escape whatever label they care to hand out?
And how do most of them end up in that occupation? ha They're batshit and can't figure out why! The field gives them hope, and the illusion of self understanding . . .
when they really should have just hid out in a cave for a year and contemplated the lint in their bellybutton . . .
ZenDOG....you're not in a state of Zen....use you're inner eye, which is all but closed; commune with your soul, the higher self, it will allow you to see and discern. If none of these interest you, try alternative media; and use judeochristain ethics; if these failure you then try humanistic values...but do somethng other than wonder about in the world of lies and deceit.
This guy's a troll, paid to disrupt. He's hopeless. A time waste.
Thanks, truly time wasted...goodness couldn't they at least have intelligent paid trolls lol
Like you are.
so that's your answer? ad hominem?
I don't mind, Whatever.
Here, want something shiny to go with that mesmerizing tone of jibberish? Go ahead, it won't help, but hey.
So no more due process; no arrest, charge; judge, trials, jury ? Now we just go in and kill sovereign leaders...also citizens. You know about Obama's assassination policy on US citizens abroad who threaten the interests of America...they can be killed without due process...and you support this president ? He's had citizens killed without due process, and it's okay with you ? Listen as one of my family members is prone to say; there is a level of stupidity, where you should die. I'm done...the people get the government they deserve; you deserve a police state. nuff said . I'm done.
well i dunno - I keep sayin'
the chief justice of the supreme court would look mighty nice attired with a hand axe planted smack dab in the middle of his forehead . . .
I haven't been arrested yet.
haven't had a car accident or heart attack either . . .
and that measure in the defense appropriations will get stripped - hopefully today - we'll see - but I'm confident it will not pass.
so - you're done now? good, because really you are getting kinda boring
You've made it clear, that my expectations are too high. bye bye
rosewood...are you sure is wasn't the fluoride in our water?
America Being Dumbed Down http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fKfIw5xN4Pg
rosewood...your a troll, go back to the Republicans where you belong.
Well so you decided it's all spin; whether it's coming from both left and right. The 1% use both left and right ideologies and parties; because they're psychopathic...but very smart....smarter than the 99% I suspect. Well as we can see the psychologist is correct...there is no information that you can give people to help...none.
She said only culture, healing through the culture can help; and the 1% control the culture right now...but we knew this would go no where. Narrow is the path and few there be who find it...peace .
i always asked my self about american life: who really drinks the poison, and who really reaps the rewards? i'd say me because my working class ass reaps a nutritionally sustaining life with my friends and loved ones. now, to honestly believe that neither spin is totally applicable, is to allow your life to be governed by all, but least by you. not believing either side pretty much puts you on the fence.
Oh..are you saying that if I don't believe in the Republicans or Democrats, so I'm sitting on the fence ? If so not true....there is something called truth and justice, which is now violated by both parties, and a chess master can play both black and white peices as the 1% do using divide and conquer. Its a tactic that NEVER fails them in their control over us the 99%.
what about global warming, war profiteering, resource contamination and all the other left talking points coupled with lost of rights, more market intervention, higher insurance premiums and failing infrastructure. they are good thing to disregard if you are frolicking through life with out a rhyme nor reason, but they can be detrimental to the prospect of family formation if just one of those spinning tails happens to be true. no?
As far as I'm concerned no one party at this point is right. I signed off of the democrat party when Pelosi said there will be no impeachment, for Bush. The Republicans are equally repugnant. We need a third, fourth, fifth and sixth political party. Both parties, and congress are NOW treasonous entities.
that's a way of looking at it.
I'm sorry that was so deep I lost the meaning...could you spell it out for me so I could respond.
spinning and lying are not the same.
if you don't get it, how can it be deep? spinning and lying are not the same.
I elaborated in another post...spoke of multiple parties. No need for me to re-post right ? I've never been on the fence. Remember this forum cannot reveal the entirety of though and experience of whomever we are engaging .
yes, i know and i do act pretentious some times. i apologise. I do believe that proportional representation is a good idea. most people who study history fear that such a scheme could allow a radical like Mussolini or Hitler, both nations were PRD during their day. I'd love to see direct democracy but that is just because i'm a political junkie. :)
yeah-ya. the shrink again . . .
I don't know what is wrong with people - why is the center so hard to stick to? Once you get out of the center, the centrifugal force of the lies and the spin become overwhelming -
and what happens?
everything collects on one side of the pan, till it flips.
If you said the vacuum in Libya would create opportunities for opportunists - I wouldn't argue. It always does. And some of the worst offenders are American corporations. And they have ties to intelligence and defense agencies. I wouldn't dispute any of that.
None of which makes any argument in favor of ditching the people of Libya and leaving them on their own to deal with Gadhafi.
Not in the face of mass murder.
Maybe I could provide you with a tour of Gadhafi's caverns of death. I'm sure there is no end of images available.
WITNESS TESTIMONY
But the fact is you too, will not be convinced, and thus, by the words of your own lips, you are psychotic - and no information will help you.
You could try medication . . . not my suggestion, mind you, but you could . . .
Do you need medication to know that we should not have attacked libya; and that this president is responsible for the coordinated attacks against OWS and the present police state which is advancing on his watch ? You are entitled to your beliefs and devoted loyalty to to Obama. I know I cannot alter even one belief of yours.
You know in my life I have people who I have warned and advised for years. None of them ever took action on anything I've said...why should you be different lol ?
Right now I'm watching a good honest associate be ripped off, and several others. I advised them years before, and even now they discount my advise as they go broke. People have to follow their own path, it's just sad because in society the blind pull down the sighted with them. I have to be molested and violated by the TSA because my fellow American can't connect the dots. Oh well...collective karma.
Obama attacked Libya for the oil. But the entire petroleum scenario (air and naval force projection throughout the arc of instability from S. America to Indonesia to ensure oil for the West) is a windfall for the MIC. It's all extraneous because the Western Hemisphere has enough natural gas to get off oil. Imagine, by doing that, we'd finally bankrupt the Middle East. All they'd have is their sand. But there's too much invested in Big Oil and PAC money from them, as well as from the MIC to get off oil. They want the dollars to keep pouring in. That's why we're in Africa: oil fields.
Thanks, I get it...zendog refuses. Also because Libya refused to go along with the Anglo-American central banking and financial global dictatorship which is now being set up. They wanted a currency and financial system for Africa, independent of the western empire.
rosewood...You preferred Libya under Gaddafi ?...Please explain yourself, or are you totally out of your mind.
but you secretly like it, I know, I can tell. You fly every chance you get.
Sorry I'm not interested in petty trite insults. My concern is the magnitude of death and suffering caused by people who are seemingly incapable of discerning; but looking at history it seems they're eventually removed as are their civilizations. I guess whatever contains and removes them is the arbiter and answer. I'll have to trust in whatever that is.
well like I keep sayin -
we could just ask the Libyans how they feel
Oh we're going by feelings...not international and constitutional laws ?
A Libyan girl's message to Obama and Sarkozy http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v5gNS75RpOc
another you-tube and since I'm on dial-up, a fact you have already been made aware of - I cannot comment on her message for I have no idea what it is . . .
let alone who owns the camera, or where her inspiration comes from . . .
I spent several hours providing an Obama supporter with 28 points of links and sources, which indicated the contradictions, lies, and manipulations of this president; and the only response from the person was to say I'm obviously fixated on Obama. They had absolutely nothing to say about the information and links provided.
So reason, logic, information, validative links and sources, will not alter a person's perception or emotional need to believe in a leader, if this is how they are psychologically structured. I've experienced the same thing with Bush supporters.
I'm sure this incapacity to discern, or engage reality is why we no longer have a constitutional republic, nor a functioning citizenry. A clinical psychologist stated the American people are in a state of dissociation; a state beyond denial, wherein the mind separates from it's own awareness. The psychologist stated if this isn't treated, it leads to mental illness.
I believe the psychologist, in her assessment of the American people, a populace, who have separated their awareness away from reality. She also indicated that loading people up with information as I did, won't work; indeed it can make the condition even worse.
We'll just have to hope that those who aren't in a state of dissociation; separated from reality; have enough numbers to stand up and come forward.
The statement he has a difficult job to do, is reflective of that dissociative state, and it wouldn't matter if you had all the links and sources. So I've learned, not to waste two hours on collecting the information for the Bush/Obama zombies, who are unable to respond to it in what is essentially a mental condition...a separation of the consciousness to protect itself against reality.
that's nice. I see you claim to have provided links to sources - which I have no doubt do exist, after all, we can find links ad nauseum to prove there is no global warming
which is of course precisely your point behind the obvious reluctance of some to engage in information overload.
and yet there is no proof you have done so - not even a link to the page where such other links might be found.
YOu can wave that DSM IV over our heads all you like. I'm not gonna buy it. Maybe I am crazy as a shit house rat - it has been suggested.
who cares?
What are the facts?
campaigns of lies, smear, and sophisticated disinformation are rampant - evidenced by everyone from cigarette producers to the fossil fuel industry - to say nothing of Carl with a K rove . . . or swiftboat campaigns
based on above, a healthy skepticism is most certainly in order, regardless of debate matter - it's a fact, one we all must grapple with
The President, as candidate forced the administration full of bushite to alter its stated U.S. international policy re: Iraq with a simple statement: if elected I'll get us out of there in 16 months - this was in line with both the aspirations of the Iraqi people and the American public.
further, the President has fired several within various levels of government whose judgment has proven to be far less than stellar - and this despite the potential political cost, most especially where it relates to the Pentagon . . .
so you keep a tight grip on that DSM IV you're wavin' around while I go look for some . . . stimulus . . . designed to make you sweat . . .
maybe that heavy tomb will slide right out of your fingers and break your nose . . .
Break my nose ...haven't the president and his supporters broken enough things, with the humanitarian bombs and DU ?
CHILDREN IN SIRTE GETTING KILLED BY our NATO ALLIED FORCES US-EU MURDER http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3EAyivxtQSo
WARNING GRAPHIC See How Children are Protected by NATO in Libya (Sirte 25.9.2011) - YouTube.wmv http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SGxcPLVbBR0&feature=related
no doubt - war sucks. I won't deny that.
I'll stand with the people of Libya, now they are free of a tyrant, one who would have killed, one who did kill, civilians by the score, and pile their bodies in mass graves.
And I can't help but point out:
Gadhafi was a one percenter
his end should prove instructive
The issue is not whether war sucks; but the fact that this president launched a unconstitutional NATO gang attack on a sovereign nation posing no threat to America. However, as the psychologist stated, engaging those who are in a state of dissociation, will prove all but futile.
Gadhafi opposed the central banking system of the 1%, which is why he and his nation were attacked, destroyed and turned over to Al-Qaeda, to further brutalize the population; steal it's resources, and exterminate black Libyans.
It is the people of Libya who are now suffering, clearly of no concern to Obama supporters.
Wow, that's some really nice spin.
Did you make that up all by yourself?
Or did the bircher think tank hand you your talking points with a pat on the back to send you on your way . . . .
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wow, i remember reading history books where no matter the political leaning of the citizenry, they supported their president, until they voted him out. maybe, those history books were lying, or maybe we all need to take a deep breath and breath.
In American history and constitutional law we also have impeachment that directly refutes your blind allegiance brainwashing.
if your view of the President is the majority view, then why is he not impeached?
Because in reality the right-wing Democrats and Republicans like him.
It has nothing to do with majority. It has everything to do with Wall Street corruption that owns the Congress and White House.
but a majority of people voted for those officials. no? we are begrudgingly a Republic.
No. A majority of Americans has not voted. Only a majority of those permitted to vote by the right-wing authoritarian controlled government voted for this Congress and president. A difference of several million Americans.
Then, as one of those disenfranchised citizens, i'd suggest you protest and boycott. or live with the 'Quo.
Go fuck yourself!
Organizing democracy loving Americans to liberate America from your authoritarian mockery of a democracy is more productive.
well, if you make us into a democracy run federal system, then I'll be a demos. I only role with the rules in front of me, and not the ones i wish were guiding my life.
That my kemosabe is real spit you need to recognize. peace.
Obama demonstrates he's basically Republican with a different wrapper: extends tax breaks to rich, rolls back pollution regulations, de-funds Wall St. Regulators, expands and starts new wars, cuts aid to vets, poor and social safety net. All are indisputably republican goals.
Well he's not entirely bad. At least he stopped the keystone pipeline. That would have been a disaster.
Let's see how long that lasts.
yeah, all those jobs and all that economic activity. how awful!
You better believe its awful.
Be thankful that there are still people out there that don't want the earth to turn into a hellish furnace.
drama queenism...the last refuge of the over-exaggerating lunatic.
also, think of all the union jobs you want flushed down the toilet. why do you hate unions so much, plutocrat water-carrier?
When did objective scientific research become drama queenism?
"When did objective scientific research become drama queenism?"
when a relatively tiny portion of land being used for industrial purposes was labeled a "hellish furnace"
btw, "objective"!!! LMAO!
slizzo, you should really look into the consequences of degrading the environment. your health and your children's health will be directly affected by any reckless decisions made for short term gains. most civilizations in the past fell because they were weakened by a degraded environment.
"you should really look into the consequences of degrading the environment"
I have. it isn't an all-or-nothing binary, no matter how much you want it to be so you can oppose everything that radical environmentalists tell you to oppose. there can be balance. or is that too much nuance for robots stuck in binary mode?
"most civilizations in the past fell because they were weakened by a degraded environment."
hilarious!
get a grip (on reality, not that tree!)
btw, I love trees. I love nature. I hike a lot, camp once in a while. but this is not an all or nothing and not every single fucking last thing like this needs to be opposed and painted with such dramatic exaggeration. it really kills the credibility of those of us who do oppose some bad ideas that spoil the environment.
wow, slizzo i guess you really know your stuff. no sense in discussing anything with a superior intellect such as yours. have a nice day
ok, you go on living in your black-and-white, all-or-nothing, binary world of perfect simplicity and the adults will continue noticing and addressing the details you can't wrap your little boy head around. good idea. it's not like you can back up your ridiculous claims or anything.
"most civilizations in the past fell because they were weakened by a degraded environment."
I'm still laughing at that one!
here's a link about problems rome had, other civilizations had them also (google?). we are having are own too. you can ignore it but it won't go away, it's called reality.
http://www.eh-resources.org/timeline/timeline_roman.
btw i was born in the 50's (little boy, i wish!)
bklynsboy....Rolls back funds for regulators..that's not true...Tea Party Republicans have prevented a vote on the consumer watch dog commission head since it was founded...............Ended war in Iraq...............Downsizing Afghanistan, ....................new bill for employers to get tax breaks for vets..................cuts safety net? .............................................................Just where did you get your information.
Still in Afghanistan, out of Iraq only because Iraq kicked us out (over Obama's public objection), attacked Libya, basing troops in Australia, Guantanamo still open. Now I see just how balanced your view of the world really is.
The Heavy Cost of the Bush-Obama War Machine June 1, 2011 Anthony Gregory Independence institute
Defense spending: Slaying the sacred cow CNNMoney.com
Wall St. oversight cuts: http://dealbook.nytimes.com/2011/05/04/on-capitol-hill-regulators-plead-for-more-money/?scp=1&sq=cut%20budget%20wall%20st.%20oversight%20gensler&st=cse
bklynsboy....Hey Everybody here's where the asshole gets his information......................... Independence Institute.............. The Institute holds an annual Alcohol, Tobacco and Firearms (ATF) party, to promote drinking, smoking, and shooting as a "fundamental right". Independent Institute President Jon Caldara is quoted as saying: “Now remember, a year from now President [Barack] Obama might make all three activities of smoking, drinking and shooting completely illegal. This might be our very, very last opportunity.” In 2008, the event drew a crowd of around 200 supporters.
The Institute has been accused of promoting misinformation on global warming by Media Matters for America. The Institute provided several media platforms to James Taylor of the Heartland Institute. Taylor's claims about global warming were disputed by Media Matters, including that there is No scientific consensus on man-made global warming. The article also notes donations of $561,500 from 1998 to 2005 to Taylor's Heartland Institute
Pure argumentum ad hominem that does not address the fact we have EXANDED the number and breadth of war-like behaviors under Obama.
We only got out of Iraq because the Iraqis booted us out (over Obama's objections). We are still in Afghanistan, we attacked Libya, and are now basing troops in Australia.
Rico...You've proved one thing, by saying the Iraqis booted the US out........Is that your not above telling the big lie and hoping its not challenged...........Tell me how a motley group like the Iraq army could possibly kick out the mightiest force the world has every seen..............If Big Oil wanted the US to stay in Iraq we would stay..... Afghanistan is in a draw down with Republican objections......In Libya NATO with the French and British accomplished the transition form Gaddafi to the rebels, or would you rather that Libya had remained the way it was?.........Australian bases for rapid deployment to the South Asia area is important symbolic move to contain China.......or would you rather China expand its influence over the disputed claims in the area......You seem to not want Obama to defend American Interests, why is that?................So you see you have no argument only your personal opinion which is anti-Obama for ideological reasons.
You're such a cynic. Sure, we could have forced Iraq to let us stay, but that's not how we operate. As for the other moves in Libya, Australia, and potentially Syria and Iran, I support them. I was simply pointing out that you were pointing out Bush's "war crimes" without even mentioning those of his successor. Ironically, you sound like you're even DEFENDING the military Obama has made... yet more proof that you are an Obama apologist.. you judge Republicans by one standard and your own man by another.
Rico...Your reply is foolish....and devoid of facts..
Your points are so true!!
There won't be much difference if a Dem or republican become president.
bklynsboy...............Your talking out your asshole on that one...........If you really believe it your a stupid motherfucker..................I think your a republican from the out right lies you've been posting..
It's become pretty clear from your OWN posts that you're a blind faith Democrat. You have yet to counter any argument with facts. You insult and name call, and at your very best employ ad hominem techniques. There's zero sign of critical thought in any of your posts. You're clearly an Obama shill. Do they pay you ?
Rico...you want facts okay you asked from them.............The deference between Republican and Democrats being Elected.........If Republicans are elected......1. Repeal the Affordable Care Act (Health Insurance Reform)....................2. Privatize Social Security or phase it out altogether..........................3. End Medicare as it presently exists....................................4. Extend the Bush tax breaks for the wealthy and big oil................................5. Repeal Wall Street Reform...................................6. Protect those responsible for the oil spill and future environmental catastrophes...............................7. Abolish the Department of Education............................8. Abolish the Department of Energy.....................9. Abolish the Environmental Protection Agency..................10. Repeal the 17th Amendment..........
1) All signs are the Supreme Court will overturn the health care act and Obama has already defunded another aspect already in place (did you know that). 2) Don't confuse the Libertarians with the Republicans. The Republicans do not advocate radical change to Social Security or Medicare. 3) Again, don't confuse the Libertarians with the Republicans. 4) Not likely. Tax reform is likely, and the Bush cust become irrelevant. 5) Not sure there's much difference between parties here. Obama gets more money from financial interests than the Republicans at this point. 6) I have never heard any republicans advocate letting BP off the hook. 7) LIbertarian not Republican 8) Libertarian not Republican 9) Libertarian not Republican 10) Libertarian not Republican
You DO know the only serious candidates in the GOP primaries right now are Mitt Romney and Gingrich. The Libertarian wing doesn't have a chance of winning. I could, by the way, point to the views of the radical left in the Democratic party as representative of all Democrats, but fortunately, the extremists don't run THAT party either.
Rico.....Your entire post was absent any facts,........Your quote.."Republicans do not advocate radical change to Social Security or Medicare"......Your words again....."I have never heard any republicans advocate letting BP off the hook"......... The Republican, Tea Party Contract with America, ....Item 2. in the contract is...2. Privatize Social Security or phase it out altogether......Item 3 is...3. End Medicare as it presently exists.........Bush the 1st capped oil spill damages at 25 million......which I think helps BP enormously..............As far as you being a Libertarian...........here is the platform of the Libertarian party....The preamble outlines the party's goal: "As Libertarians, we seek a world of liberty; a world in which all individuals are sovereign over their own lives and no one is forced to sacrifice his or her values for the benefit of others." Its Statement of Principles begins: "We, the members of the Libertarian Party, challenge the cult of the omnipotent state and defend the rights of the individual." The platform emphasizes individual liberty in personal and economic affairs, avoidance of "foreign entanglements" and military and economic intervention in other nations' affairs and free trade and migration. It calls for Constitutional limitations on government as well as the elimination of most state functions. It includes a "Self-determination" section which quotes from the Declaration of Independence and reads: "Whenever any form of government becomes destructive of individual liberty, it is the right of the people to alter or to abolish it, and to agree to such new governance as to them shall seem most likely to protect their liberty." It also includes an "Omissions" section which reads: "Our silence about any other particular government law, regulation, ordinance, directive, edict, control, regulatory agency, activity, or machination should not be construed to imply approval."
That point is also true!
That us such utter horseshit. It barely merits reply.
If the people forming OWS continues to use it constitutional rights guaranteed by the constitution; without demanding an article 5 convention, so demands can be legally met in what will be a fully lawful and peaceful rebellion; and do not use their specticale and sensation to defend the constitution by showing exactly how it is being usurped, which provides a an EXTRA right to assemble (law enforcement) and petititon grievance. But, in this case not well articulated, not citing laws violated by congress itself actually causing all of the problems that brought OWS into being by NOT calling an article 5 convention for the last 100 years when their oath of office and duty calls for it, I'd have to say that OWS might not just shoot itself in the foot, it might shut the door on effective protests under the constitution. john mccain seems to be triggered into action from OWS with SOPA and the imprisionment issue while being the chariman of the board of IRI having white house affiliations and support for the concepts of gene sharp.
Seems difficult to reshape OWS, many divergent viewpoints.
Since the only reshaping is the method of gaining authority to meed demands, without disturbing the demands, it would be an empowerment of the existing shape more than anything else.
sounds reasonable.
First action is Occupy Congress and deliver Notification that the 99% consider congress to be acting unconstitutionally and in violation of laws. Specifically these.
Federal law regulating oath of office by government officials is divided into four parts along with an executive order which further defines the law for purposes of enforcement. 5 U.S.C. 3331, provides the text of the actual oath of office congressional members were required to take before assuming office.
5 U.S.C. 3333 required you to sign an affidavit that you took the oath of office required by 5 U.S.C. 3331 and have not nor will violate that oath during your tenure of office as defined by the third part of the law,
5 U.S.C. 7311, which explicitly makes it a federal criminal offense for anyone employed in the United States Government to “advocate the overthrow of our constitutional form of government.”,
18 U.S.C. 1918 provides penalties for violation of oath office described in 5 U.S.C. 7311 which include: removal from office, imprisonment, and a fine.
The definition of “advocate” is further specified in Executive Order 10450 which for purposes of enforcement supplements 5 U.S.C. 7311.
Executive Order 10450 specifies a violation of 5 U.S.C. 7311 for any person taking the oath of office to advocate “the alteration…of the form of the government of the United States by unconstitutional means"
According to Executive Order 10450 (and therefore 5 U.S. 7311) any act taken by government officials who have taken the oath of office prescribed by 5 U.S.C. 3331 which alters the form of government other than by amendment, is a criminal violation of the 5 U.S.C. 7311. Such alteration without amendment is criminal violation of 5 U.S.C. 7311 and 18 U.S.C. 1918.
In 1939 the supreme court violated Executive Order 10450 specifiing a violation of 5 U.S.C. 7311
http://www.foa5c.org/file.php/1/Articles/Coleman.htm
Acts relating to campaign finance are also unconstitutional and comprise “the alteration…of the form of the government of the United States by unconstitutional means"
Interesting, never knew!
That is the most viable action for meeting demand you will find. Occupy congress. Then go to the states capitols. Find who understands that protests need to be organized upon states legislatures. Understand some legal aspects too. Here is a letter template, resolution form that can be sent to state legislatures asking them to work for an article V convention.
http://articlevconvention.org/showthread.php?10-Templates-Letter-to-State-Representatives-request-for-house-resolution
Article 5 is our first and last constitutional right. If we don't use it now, we will not have any rights. Freedom is not free. Unity is cheap compared to the demise of the nwo default with confused sheep, not free.
My only issue is the call for a biennial budget review instead of annual. Is that needed?
An article 5 conventionis only an opportunity to amend, nothing specific for an amendment. I know that there are proposals for biannual review. It seems the economy is so thrashed something might be needed there. Not an economist.