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Forum Post: Gun Violence, Anatomy of Killing, Honest Look at killing, 8 Factors

Posted 5 years ago on Dec. 21, 2012, 9:50 p.m. EST by Middleaged (5140)
This content is user submitted and not an official statement

Just thinking about this gun ban issue and the killing in the world. Let me look deeper at the different elements:

1) Was kind of simplifying to the position that perhaps prescription drugs are pushed on kids, plus of course there are peer pressure drug cultures of secret drug use that separates kids from family and adults that can help them. But too simplistic.
2) Bad Seed theory, bad genes, nature or nurture kind of argument, not really against mental illness, but perhaps a person who is almost proud of their anger or enables their anger or has an overly confident sense of their own worth and importance of their feelings. Not the common view that spoiled people have too much self esteem. Something deeper than narcissistic, could be a strong person, a worker, but who perhaps rages or has a strong ego of some type.
3) Honor Killing, Religious Killing, ...not sure this is a big factor in what we see. Honor killing is patriachical and terrible if we are talking about killing a daughter or sister.
4) Cultural Killing is not something I have seen studies or reports on (brain dead media). I think of cultural killing as a man killing another man for being gay or looking gay or just looking weak or effeminate. The other side of the coin is perhaps someone is ostracized, marginalized, and disenfranchised - they might kill as a backlash. Think of kids that feel bullied - seemed to be a factor in Columbine Killing.
5) Domestic Violence Killing, drugs and alcohol can always be a factor. Killing someone you know is very common. Hard to generalize, but obviously stress, confusion, power struggles are factors. narcissism or being self obsorbed certainly could be a view that makes a person feel boxed in. The anti-dote would seem to be service to fellow people, teaching, AA and 12 step programs.
6) Drug Gang Killing. Education, access to the education system, adult supervison and guidance, awareness of the socio-economic problems, the power that money from selling drugs or a commodity brings to people, lack of jobs or training opportunities for jobs or vocation, are many of the basis behind killing over drugs. Prisoner on Prisoner killing often.
7) Government Experiment-Project Killing, Covert Activities, War, Military, Prisoners/Detained by Officials, & Police/Security State Institutional Killing.

Started with only 6 Factors. Feedback below provided #7. I am adding #8 since other feed back has brought up.

8) Socio-Economic Stress Killing: Going Postal, being under stress and harsh treatment at work as defined by the person who takes a gun to the work place and kills or kills at home or perhaps in a church/temple. Defined by pressure of paying bills and not getting ahead, not getting raises, being asked to perform better/perform harder, being harrassed at work, being threatened by supervisor, being Disrespected, Not being appreciated, Being de-humanized, being in an authoritarian type work environment, having a boss that doesn't treat you like person, like you have feeling, like you are an equal, like you are worthy of respect.

The good News I feel is that OWS & OWS Forum are trying to address the issues that can reduce disenfranchisement



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[-] 2 points by Middleaged (5140) 5 years ago

Patriarchs think One Size Fits all. Looking at Gun Ban on Semi-Autos.

1) First of all living off a lonely highway is different from living in a high density populated area with driveby shootings, gang activity, drug lord dealers and wanna bes, ...there must be a lot of social factors that are so different across the country. What about the guy that drives around in a tow truck. What about homesteaders 5o miles from anywhere. What if you live near a prison. What if you are handicaped, ill, elderly?

2) Patriarchs sit in Washington and think they are important. But their Ego is out of balance. They are taking money and gifts from almost anyone. And they think they are smart to be sitting there, but if they don't study the issue, look at the history of the laws, and talk to people ...they are mostly serving their own ego by deciding for everyone.

3) The law will never effect them if they chose total ban of Semi-Automatic guns. They are rich enough to have limo drivers, and body guards. In fact, body guards and private security men are a fact of life for many middle class in third world countries. So of course Congressmen have private security. How do you like that people making decisons about how you live, but it doesn't apply to them??

4) If ever an Issue should be on National ballet/Referendum it would be the complete National ban of Handguns or Semi-Auto Rifles. It effects the common man, not the Rich Executive or the people sitting in Congress. Remeber Alaska is still bear country and we have bears, wolfs, cougars/mountain lions, rabid pests in more than a few states. Costs money to call animal control.

[-] 1 points by Nevada1 (5843) 5 years ago

Good post. Also those citizens living near S border, especially since 'Fast And Furious'.

[-] 2 points by Middleaged (5140) 5 years ago

Yes, lot of people have to help themselves when it comes down to it. If I go camping I'm pretty sure there won't be any cops around to help me. I might need a phone or a radio for help, but it's gonna be a while 'afore it comes.

[-] 1 points by Nevada1 (5843) 5 years ago

Good Points

[-] 1 points by Middleaged (5140) 5 years ago

Reposting from other post to put this in one place on my own post.

Free, Voluntary, Socialized Mental Disease Testing and Evaluation & Treatment. Make it affordable to get mental illness treatment... even treatment for drug & alcohol. What, the first Question should be did this Mass Shooting Suspect have proper Health care? And the Next thing would be for US Congress and President Obama ...LOOK AT US HEALTH CARE, and mental health care, and US Evaluations of Mental Disease, and is it Accessible to the Users 3rd thing would, 'Why no accessibility is a problem, treatment and evaluation is expensive, and Ronald Reagan ran many people out of mental institutions. wow.

Brain Dead Politics see above 1-3.

Look at Work Place Shootings. Is there any doubt that the stresses on people are all four 1) Social 2) Economic 3) Mental illness 4) Drugs & Alcohol.

The problem is Mental Health Testing can take up to like a year. It is very expensive. Many people will not seek treatment, evaluations, advice, or even pay for drugs for a mental illness. This is way beyond any stigma from having a mental illness. There are many factors in why people don't take care of themselves or get advice or go find medical evaluations.

[-] 1 points by Middleaged (5140) 5 years ago

Trying to put info in one place on gun ban issue.


Ask Mexico where gun ownership is prohibited. Oh wait . . . how could 60,000 people have died down there from gun violence in the last six years if was illegal to own guns? Did criminals somehow get their hands on guns in Mexico?


It is strange that as Conceal Carry Laws have gained acceptance we see these killings and the push for bans. The Conceal Carry people clain that they cause the crime to go down. I suppose killing is one kind of crime and burglary and mugging is another kind

  • A 1996 University of Chicago study concluded that states which passed concealed carry laws reduced their murder rates by 8.5 percent, rapes by 5 percent, aggravated assaults by 7 percent, and robbery by 3 percent.
[-] 1 points by Middleaged (5140) 5 years ago

Posting article that applies:

Gun Bans Won't Work, by Elliott Morss, Morss Global Finance, December 20th, 2012, in Op Ed

Gun Restrictions: Lessons from Efforts to Curb Smoking, Drinking, Drugs, and Sex



What are the lessons from this review for new gun restrictions? In the US, if there is a market for a product, it will be served. Bans don’t work. Banning any type of gun will result in the market being served by criminals. Approximately 10 million guns are sold legally in the US every year[1] – a big business.

But maybe the market for guns is different than the market for addictive products discussed above. I don’t know. When I hear people say they need their guns so they can take back the country from a bad government, I worry.

Editors recommendation: don’t ban any guns (assault weapons, whatever). Instead, levy a Federal 100% sales tax on “bad guns”, and use the proceeds to do a better job on background checks. Will this remedy the problem? No. But it is a reasonable place to start. Bans are expensive and most are unenforceable.

[-] 1 points by Nevada1 (5843) 5 years ago

And then there is the 'Gladio' type events. The most difficult for the population to cope with or acknowledge. Like WTC 7 reported down, while still standing. Makes justice difficult to achieve.

[-] 2 points by Middleaged (5140) 5 years ago

Thanks. I'll add that to the list above. I just have some computer issue that prevents me from accessing the website correctly.

7) Government Project-Experimental Killing, Covert Activities, War, Military, Prisoners/Detained by Officials, & Police/Security State Institutional Killing.