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Forum Post: Global Warming and the BIG Oooooops

Posted 9 months ago on Nov. 27, 2013, 6:51 p.m. EST by shoozTroll (17632)
This content is user submitted and not an official statement

Here's the start.

http://www.wunderground.com/blog/angelafritz/comment.html?entrynum=57

Wait? What? I've known about and warned about this for at least 20years, yet somehow, in the climate models they forget??

Willfully perhaps?

I don't believe that, but here it is.

http://www.alternet.org/environment/ticking-time-bomb-could-cause-such-rapid-global-warming-wed-be-unable-prevent-extinction

On the other hand, they did, but they missed calculated by a LARGE margin.

http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2013/11/131125172113.htm

Our time to react, has just gotten exponentially shorter.

Still want that KXL?

54 Comments

54 Comments


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[-] 0 points by shoozTroll (17632) 9 months ago

A link in the Science Daily article, says they suspected 3 years ago that their figures on the region were off.

http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2010/03/100304142240.htm

Hindsight, really is 20/20, but at this point, that doesn't say much about our future.

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[-] 0 points by shoozTroll (17632) 9 months ago

http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2013/11/29/florida-mans-10-billion-plan-to-build-floating-city-for-the-wealthy-is-a-live-project-again/

Welcome to New Miami.................................:)

I hope they forgot about the iceberg early warning system.

[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (28261) from Coon Rapids, MN 9 months ago

I hope they forgot about the iceberg early warning system.

Help! An Iceberg the Size of Singapore Just Broke Off in Antarctica

[-] 0 points by shoozTroll (17632) 9 months ago

Where are they going to anchor it once Miami begins to sink below the waves?

It's going to make for a hell of shoal/reef, or whatever they decide to name sunken cities of the new millennium.

[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (28261) from Coon Rapids, MN 9 months ago

sunken cities??? Sunken States!!!

[-] 0 points by shoozTroll (17632) 9 months ago

Out in the open oceans, there will be sunken Countries.

[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (28261) from Coon Rapids, MN 9 months ago

shades of water world.

[-] 0 points by shoozTroll (17632) 9 months ago

Many of our own coastal cities should already be instituting lessons learned from Denmark.

Denial is cheap in the moment, yet very expensive in the long run.

[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (28261) from Coon Rapids, MN 9 months ago

Eventually much of the coast will be lost to rising waters - as this society is not geared towards co-operation to build the necessary sea-walls - that's just to begin with - then this society is not geared to constantly improve them and raise their height as the water will continue to rise to overcome all of the halfhearted efforts.

[-] 0 points by shoozTroll (17632) 9 months ago

What?

They already have a plan.

Blame it on liburls and gays in particular.

Taxed

Enough

Already

Glug, glug.

[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (28261) from Coon Rapids, MN 9 months ago

No no no - their plan is denial - not much of a plan - but it's cheap - at least until they all drown - "THAT" would seem pretty expensive to me.

Anyone see the new age Noah running around looking for help? Geeze they are bible thumpers after all.

[-] 0 points by shoozTroll (17632) 9 months ago

No,no.

They will all be moving to the Great Lakes region.

The Bible thumpers are disposable to them.

Why do you think they are softening it up for their arrival as we speak?

Ohio, Michigan, Wisconsin, Minnesota.

Look at what they are doing there.

[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (28261) from Coon Rapids, MN 9 months ago

The idiots can't even accept the fact of fracking as poisoning the water land and air - so of course that wouldn't be a consideration of moving.

[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (28261) from Coon Rapids, MN 9 months ago

They do seem to have trouble understanding ( accepting ) the history of geology and evidence of past inland seas - salt not fresh.

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[-] 0 points by shoozTroll (17632) 9 months ago

Don't worry, the crew doesn't get any sick days. so at least they won't have to pay for any time off.

Aaaaaaachooo!

Excuse me sir, may I brush that off for you?

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[-] -3 points by darmand (-15) from Williamsport, PA 9 months ago

I named my dog teragram! Truth. My cat is called origami.

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[+] -4 points by darmand (-15) from Williamsport, PA 9 months ago

Truth man! I swear. My neighbour's dog is named telegram so I named mine teragram as a joke. Was looking for the closest sounding name.

[-] 0 points by shoozTroll (17632) 9 months ago

You like to confuse and torture dogs??

I suppose for you it might be better than reality.

I'll stick to the OP, for now though.

[-] -3 points by darmand (-15) from Williamsport, PA 9 months ago

I love dogs. I love all animals. Not sure why you had that strange thought.

[-] 0 points by shoozTroll (17632) 9 months ago

"My neighbour's dog is named telegram so I named mine teragram as a joke."

Why else would you do that, if not for the confusion it will cause?

Let alone bring it up in a thread on Global Warming.

That would be all about the confusion.

[+] -4 points by darmand (-15) from Williamsport, PA 9 months ago

Zendog asked a question regarding the word teragram. I hear that word so rarely that I had to comment about my dog having that same name. Our dogs don't interact much. I live on a farm. My neighbour is half a mile up the road. There's no confusion. There's no reason to make a big deal about it. Just a comment in passing. Just ignore it. It was meant for zendog, not you. Not sure why you came up with a strange assumption that I mistreat animals. Not a very nice thing to say.

[-] 0 points by shoozTroll (17632) 9 months ago

Why not comment on the actual definition of teragram?

Or better yet.

Actually read the link............

Perhaps confusing your neighbors dog wasn't your only attempt to confuse?

[-] -2 points by darmand (-15) from Williamsport, PA 9 months ago

He knows the definition. And, you can check it up if you don't know it. He was asking what comes after it. I answered petagram. Not sure what your intervention is all about. Seems you're only here to try to start a fight or something. I'll leave you with that. If you do want to engage in serious discussion it would be my pleasure. But please, don't do it with an accusative attacking tone. That doesn't interest me. I didn't come here to fight. I'm only here to exchange ideas.

[-] 0 points by shoozTroll (17632) 9 months ago

Really?

What does the confusing name of your dog have to do with global warming?

And who's this Mike you're asking ZD about?

Looks to me like all you came here for is to drum up concern.

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[-] -2 points by darmand (-15) from Williamsport, PA 9 months ago

Petagram comes after teragram.

[-] -1 points by darmand (-15) from Williamsport, PA 9 months ago

We already know what is happening and why it's happening. There's a pretty strong consensus amongst scientists. Global warming is understood. To pretend it isn't is ignorance at best and evil at worst. We also know why it isn't being dealt with. People with power don't want to lose power. They act for their short term benefit. Capitalism has created big companies that drill for oil and they don't want to change the status quo. There's absolutely nothing which isn't well understood here. Anarchy and socialism is what can help us, not those in power.

[-] 0 points by beautifulworld (20534) 9 months ago

"Arctic sea ice coverage is now at the lowest level it’s been for a million years. It will likely disappear in the summer by 2015. The loss of summer sea ice is linked to the accelerating melt of permafrost, releasing the vast underground stores of methane – about 30 times more potent as a greenhouse gas than carbon. The process is happening much faster than anticipated. Methane concentrations in the Arctic now average about 1.85 parts per million, the highest in 400,000 years.

If this reaches a tipping point, we could trigger a process of unstoppable runaway warming, and we could see a rise of 8-10 degrees Celsius, by the end of this century."

Nafeez Mosadeqq Ahmed

http://crisisofcivilization.com/from-endless-growth-to-a-new-model-of-democracy-nafeez-mosadeqq-ahmed-at-tedxhornstull/

[-] 1 points by shoozTroll (17632) 9 months ago

ZD and I have been discussing this with our local trolls for over 2 years now. To us, this in nothing new.

My point of view is this.

We live in a universe of unlimited growth.

WE are just outgrowing our locality far too fast, because of ignorance and greed.

[-] -1 points by beautifulworld (20534) 9 months ago

Exactly right. And, Nafeez Mosadeqq Ahmed gets to some good solutions in his Ted talk. We need to start making changes now before it is too late.

[-] 1 points by shoozTroll (17632) 9 months ago

Tell it to the GOP and the Worldwide network of sympathetic libe(R)topians, of many political persuasions.

Acceptance and education is the first step.

Thanks to them, we can't even get that here in the US, how do we inform the third World?

[-] 0 points by beautifulworld (20534) 9 months ago

Problem with this, is, slowly, that is how, because it's not going to happen overnight unless it is felt directly by the contributing parties ie. their own house gets swept away. And, we may not have the time, but, for the sake of real solutions, here is what Ahmed says:

"This new paradigm of distributed clean energy production, decentralised farming, and participatory economic cooperation, offers a model of development free from the imperative of endless growth for its own sake; and it leads us directly to a new model of democracy, based not on large-scale, hierarchical-control, but on the wholesale decentralisation of power, towards smaller, local ownership and decision-making.

In the new paradigm, households and communities become owners of capital, in their increasing appropriation of the means to produce energy, food and water at a local level. Economic democratisation drives political empowerment, by ensuring that critical decisions about production and distribution of wealth take place in communities, by communities."

"... the very notions of growth, progress, and happiness will be redefined. We now know, thanks to research by the likes of psychologist Oliver James and epidemiologist Richard Wilkinson, that material prosperity in the West has not only failed to make us happy, it has proliferated mental illnesses, and widened social inequalities, which are scientifically linked to a prevalence of crime, violence, drug abuse, teenage births, obesity, and other symptoms of social malaise. This doesn’t mean that material progress is irrelevant – but that when it becomes the overriding force of society, it is dysfunctional. So we must accept that the old paradigm of unlimited material acquisition is in its death throes – and that the new paradigm of community cooperation is far more in tune with both human nature, and the natural order. This new paradigm may well still be nascent, like small seeds, planted in disparate places."

[-] 1 points by shoozTroll (17632) 9 months ago

That doesn't tell the GOP, nor the libe(R)topians a darn thing.

http://www.desmogblog.com/2013/01/31/three-states-pushing-alec-bill-climate-change-denial-schools

http://www.prwatch.org/news/2013/08/12207/side-climate-change-denial-your-coffee-alec-dishes-some-hard-swallow-spin-heartla

Oooops, there they are again.

http://www.greenpeace.org/usa/en/campaigns/global-warming-and-energy/polluterwatch/koch-industries/american-legislative-exchange/

What no one seems to understand, is that this IS the new paradigm, and it's being written by the very industries that created the issue in the first place.

If he doesn't mention them by name, he has done us a disservice.

[-] 0 points by beautifulworld (20534) 9 months ago

Done a disservice? By laying out solutions. Give me a break.

[-] 1 points by shoozTroll (17632) 9 months ago

I don't actually see a solution there. Just aimless blaming.

I showed who's actually doing it and preventing solutions.

We're all at fault for the Koch's??

Give me a break.

[-] -1 points by beautifulworld (20534) 9 months ago

Absolutely ridiculous. It is not just the Kochs and libertarians causing global warming.

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[-] 2 points by shadz66 (19985) 9 months ago

Well as you'll no doubt be able to see yourself , the ''up votes'' and down votes speak for themselves here on this thread. Furthermore, if you subject yourself to the 17m video lecture, I think you'd find that bw and shooz are not exactly poles apart. Here you go grumpy :

No one is covering The Kochs here dude - they're fully exposed already to those with eyes to see and who know to ignore the Corporate Controlled MSM :

ad iudicium ...

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[-] 1 points by MattLHolck (16833) from San Diego, CA 9 months ago

no one is talking talking about cars

[-] 1 points by shoozTroll (17632) 9 months ago

Do I really need to post the links again?

I can find a lot more too.

I though you respected Greenpeace? I guess I was wrong.

The Koch's, as is their wont, represent a much larger faction, which I did abbreviate by using their name..

You can deny it all you like, but I have fully explained how "libe(R)topians" are Worldwide.

What's absolutely ridiculous here, is your insistence that we are all resposable for their actions.

We are not.

[-] 0 points by beautifulworld (20534) 9 months ago

I'm sorry now that I responded on your thread. I'm not going to apologize to you for not seeing the world the way you do. There are issues facing the world today that are far broader than the Kochs and libertarians, who are certainly contributors and perpetuators to many problems, but who are not the original cause. When a scholar like Ahmed is looking at an issue such as global warming, he's looking at scientific data and ways to provide solutions, not simply pointing the finger at certain people. He has his fist up at ALL people who contribute to global warming and that list goes far beyond the Kochs and libertarians. Does it include them? Yes, of course it does. Does he need to list them out to be effective? I'd say likely, not, because if that is all he has on his list then he'd be lacking.

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[-] 1 points by shoozTroll (17632) 9 months ago

I provided information on the actual science.

I've been doing that for while now. In many threads besides this one.

I then posted links to a FEW of the men and organizations that are obfuscating the truth.

Now you complain.

What solution did Ahmed actually offer?

I already said I didn't see one, he simply blames us for the actions of those men and organizations.

Objectivism truly IS to blame, whether they admit they are objectivsts or not....

Why confuse the issue by saying we are all to blame for their actions?

And yep.

Naming names has NEVER been more important.

Avoiding doing that..IS....a disservice.

Kinda chickenshit really.

[-] 2 points by shadz66 (19985) 9 months ago

''What solution did Ahmed actually offer? I already said I didn't see one, he simply blames us for the actions of those men and organizations.'' Errrr ... did you actually watch the same video as bw ? Ahmed was not evening out the blame or ''avoiding'' anything but was rather quite clear without being specific to anyone's particular 'bette noirs' and as you'll no doubt have noticed from his accent, he's not American.

Of course Randian, Objectivist Psychopathy is at fault for much of what ails The U$A but internationally - although the same 'pseudo-philosophy' prevails, there are other forces at play. The Abject Venality of Banksters & the Greedy, Short-Termism of Corporations, Dynastic Despots, Oligarchs, Kleptocrats & Plutocrats and I care not what terms you may use to describe them and tho' insidious in the extreme - The Kochs are part of the problem but the whole picture is bigger, as you yourself allude to with your reference ''to a FEW'' etc.

Picking fights, alienating people & insisting on particular narratives is all very well but like like concerted stinkling and removing or dismissing 'honest clearly heart centred' comments and posts - it is a tad self-defeating. Almost as much self-defeating as just ignoring the corporate control of 'both sides' of modern western democracies and that could also easily be described as ''chickenshit'' too, as it is Democracy itself which is actually under threat.

''A stunning new report compiles extensive evidence showing how some of the world's largest corporations have partnered with private intelligence firms and government intelligence agencies to spy on activist and nonprofit groups. Environmental activism is a prominent though not exclusive focus of these activities.''

''Many of the same companies spearheading the war on democracy are also at war with planet earth - just last week The Guardian revealed that 90 of some of the biggest corporations generate nearly two-thirds of greenhouse gas emissions and are thus overwhelmingly responsible for climate change.''

e tenebris, lux ...

[-] 1 points by shoozTroll (17632) 9 months ago

"Oh Lord, please don't let me be misunderstood."

---Eric Burdon---

Read the first comment, from BWs link to begin to understand what I'm getting at.

http://crisisofcivilization.com/from-endless-growth-to-a-new-model-of-democracy-nafeez-mosadeqq-ahmed-at-tedxhornstull/

Existing structures are NOT going to just melt away.

Masses will NOT be educated by osmosis.

Pretending it's just a problem of "west" is also pretty naive.

Although that denial is obvious to me, when threads like this are ignored.

http://occupywallst.org/forum/fighting-unions-out-in-india/

I'm well aware of that article on the 90, and another that was put out that narrowed it even more. I don't post everything I find you know.

What this actually felt like to me, was that the response was filtered through the soap opera of the banned. Who are still quite busy trying to discredit me, in any way that they can.

So yeah, I'll say it again, since the focus is always placed on the US. (It should be incumbent on you to show who in the UK is responsible, beyond the obvious, BP.)

NOT calling out the actions of the Koch's in ANY inclusive information on global warming, is chickenshit.

They lead the charge of the denialists, along with their other dastardly deeds..

[-] 2 points by shadz66 (19985) 9 months ago

''Existing structures are NOT going to just melt away. - Masses will NOT be educated by osmosis. - Pretending it's just a problem of "west" is also pretty naive.'' I agree with all that and your thread re. India is only a couple of hours old and frankly alienated peeps don't tend to reply and you ought not be too surprised at that.

Indian Plutocrats, Chinese Kleptocrats, Russian Oligarchs, Saudi / Arab Despots, European Landed Aristocrats et al may never have heard of or met The Kochs or read Ayn 'Fkn Lunatic' Rand but their behaviour will be no less against best interests of The Global 99%.

Frankly, as you bring it up explicitly yourself here - ''the soap opera of the banned'' is perhaps a really necessary aspect of any creative tension and agon here. I mean no one can deny that Odin and hchc have been, are and will continue to be dedicated Occupiers. They may push buttons in some of us but their comments, replies and posts add to this forum much more than anyone may imagine that they may detract because they can push us to more, better and clearer arguments and positions, imo, but ''Oh Lord, please don't let me be misunderstood'' - and I've always preferred Nina Simone's rendition :

Thanksgiving is over (thank goodness!), we're in Hanukkah, Xmas, Solstice and Yule await ... days get shorter, colder and darker & no we aren't all obliged to get on famously and agree but magnanimity trumps enmity .. 'cause in our own way, you, me, our respective friends and comrades here AND 'the soap opera' are here because we give a shit about a bit more than the contents of our fridge, wallet and pants !!!

Dastardly deeds of denial or duplicitous, deceptive double talk ... it'll all come out in the wash & should I expect a 'pat pat pat' on the head for steering clear of that other 'D' word here now, lolol ?! Also fyi, see :

I'll assume that you've seen Robert Greenwald's doc. re The Kochs (link in reply to ZD here) but just in case not, I'm recommending it, as I am this link :

Soften your heart, harden your head, open your mind and connect the three and as often as possible - as I shall try to do too but even if we can't forget, forgiveness has value but don't tell Trashy I said so ;-)

pacem in terris ...

[-] 0 points by shoozTroll (17632) 9 months ago

Rush checks in.

It's just like affirmative action..........What???

http://www.motherjones.com/blue-marble/2013/09/video-limbaugh-climate-change-affirmative-action

Millions of people still listen to this guy.

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[-] 0 points by shoozTroll (17632) 9 months ago

A "deal" struck in Tampa.

It figures.

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