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Forum Post: For those who want their children to inherit their guns, make sure they have not inherited your gun nuttery

Posted 1 year ago on March 28, 2013, 4:57 p.m. EST by mideast (506)
This content is user submitted and not an official statement

28 March 2013 Last updated at 12:59 ET

Newtown gunman Adam Lanza 'had weapons arsenal' Adam LAnza undated picture Adam Lanza killed his mother at home before driving to the school

The young man who killed 27 people in a massacre in Newtown, Connecticut, owned an arsenal of weapons and ammunition, court papers show.

More than 1,000 rounds of ammunition, a bayonet, several swords and knives were among the items found in a search of Adam Lanza's home.

Details of the searches were publicised after a court seal lapsed on Wednesday.

The 20-year-old first shot his mother, before killing 26 people at Sandy Hook elementary school in December.

The mass shooting - which ended when Lanza shot himself - shocked the United States and revived debate over how to curb gun violence.

President Barack Obama, who called the day of the shootings the worst of his presidency, launched a campaign to tighten gun laws in the wake of the attack.

On Thursday he stood alongside parents of Newtown's young victims and urged senators to approve gun control measures in votes due next month. Mother's gun gift

Lanza managed to shoot all his victims and kill himself within five minutes of making his way into the school, said state prosecutor Stephen Sedensky, in a statement accompanying Thursday's release of the search warrants.

The 20 children and six staff members were all killed with a Bushmaster .223-calibre rifle.

The gun Lanza turned on himself was a Glock 10mm handgun, Mr Sedensky said.

Lanza also had a loaded 9mm Sig Sauer handgun with him in the school and three 30-round magazines for the rifle.

Obama: Shame on us if we've forgotten Newtown

At the scene, investigators found 154 used .223 casings.

One more weapon - a 12-gauge shotgun with 70 rounds - was discovered in the Honda Civic that Lanza drove to the school.

Although the description of the gunman in search warrants suggests he was found wearing military-style clothing and a bullet-proof vest, prosecutors said on Wednesday Lanza was not wearing such a vest.

In the gunman's two-storey family home, investigators found a bayonet, a gun safe in Lanza's bedroom, three samurai swords and about 10 knives, according to search warrants.

Several guns were retrieved: a .323-calibre Enfield Albian bolt-action rifle, a .22-calibre Savage Mark II rifle, a BB gun and a .22-calibre Volcanic starter pistol, according to the papers.

The documents showed the gunman's mother, 52-year-old Nancy Lanza, had written a cheque for her son to buy a weapon and placed it in a holiday card.

Police found her body in bed with a fatal gunshot wound to the forehead, and a rifle on the floor nearby.

Investigators also discovered a news clipping about a 2008 school shooting at Northern Illinois University.

In that attack a formerly successful student, 27-year-old Steven Kazmierczak, killed five people and injured 21 others before turning the gun on himself. Police outside the home of Nancy Lanza in Newtown, Connecticut on 18 December 2012 The Lanza family home in Newtown, Connecticut, pictured in December 2012

Among the items listed by investigators in the Lanza home were two books, "Look me in the eye: My life with Asperger's" and "Born on a blue day: Inside the extraordinary mind of an autistic savant".

Friends of the Lanza family had described the gunman as having Asperger's syndrome, which is a form of autism.

National Rifle Association certificates and a guide to pistol shooting by the gun lobby group, together with a smashed computer hard drive and gaming console were among the other items police found at the home.

One witness reportedly told police Lanza was a keen gamer who regularly played games, such as Call of Duty, and rarely left his home.

Some details, such as the name of a witness, telephone numbers and serial numbers, were redacted from the cache of documents.

The papers were made public at the request of Connecticut Governor Dannel Malloy, who expressed concern about information that had been leaked to the press.


And for those who are afraid gun control will "punish" law abiding citizens -
law abiding citizen Nancy Lanza has been punished

8 Comments

8 Comments


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[-] 2 points by bensdad (8977) 1 year ago

GUNS – Facts & numbers & opinion & solution


FACTS: There is little difference between a gun owner and a gun buyer
There is no difference between a gun owned and a gun bought
The constitution does give some people the right to “bear some arms”
More Americans ( in absolute numbers & per capita ) are killed by guns than in almost any other country ( USA 11,000+; England 35 )
Almost no hunters hunt with semi-automatic weapons

“Assault weapon” is a term well defined in law but not well understood
Legislatures & courts ( including SCOTUS ) have set numerous limits on the 2nd amendment’s right to “bear arms”
Just like legislatures & courts ( including SCOTUS ) have set numerous limits on the 1st amendment’s right to “free speech” [ no “fire in a crowded theatre” ]

You can buy a revolver arm but not a grenade launcher arm
A 9 year old cannot buy a shotgun
Australia & England both passed strict new gun control laws –
………and drastically cut their gun deaths
The nra uses its members to sell guns for the gun manufacturers
It is illegal to drive an un-registered car
It is illegal to drive if you are un-licensed
It is illegal to drive an un-insured car

The 1994 “assault weapons ban” did not work because it did NOT ban assault weapons – it only banned their sale or manufacture.


OPINIONS
The real problem never discussed:
It is not the gun sellers or the gun buyers – or even the guns - it is the gun OWNERS

I would divide most gun deaths into five categories:
the Sandy Hook mass murderers,
drug related street crime,
non-drug related street crime,
“personal” crimes of anger,
suicide.
Consider each one - all would be reduced if we reduced the number of guns ( and legalized drugs ). The complex, conflicting state laws and the huge number of guns owned by Americans makes confiscation ( that no one is advocating ) totally unfeasible

We need a uniform federal gun law
The “mental health” issue is an nra stall – unless they agree that everyone who OWNS a gun must be psychoanalyzed and certified “safe to own guns”.
The nra’s “American culture is different” is another stall – most countries have hunters, violent movies, citizen owned guns, violent video games, drugs.

Background checks & closing the gun show loophole will help –
but ONLY with new sales –
it does nothing about OWNERS – and there are 100,000,000 of them. If just 1/10 of 1% of them are crazy, that’s 10,000 crazy gun OWNERS!


SOLUTION: Based on reducing guns, not confiscation

1►
learn as much as you can about the numbers that prove what the solutions are

2►
demand a plan:

http://www.youtube.com/user/maigcoalition
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2Za8SOVuGHs&list=UUu4Q7iE0z1Jw7yUjs56dvXA&index=1

alex jones – without his straight jacket!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_XZvMwcluEg&feature=endscreen&NR=1

multi-millionaire gun manufacturer wayne lapierre who works for koch brothers & gets paid over $1,000,000 / year
to get his army of lemmings to keep buying guns.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dar6K2STVVQ

3►
DO: WRITE CONGRESS:

find your congresspeople

house:
http://www.house.gov/representatives/find/
senate:
http://www.senate.gov/reference/common/faq/How_to_contact_senators.htm
VP Joe Biden, Gun Panel, 1600 Pennsylvania Av, Washington DC 20006


╬═╬═╬═╬═╬═╬═╬═╬═╬═╬═╬═╬═╬═╬═╬═╬═╬═╬═╬═╬═╬═╬═╬


Dear ............................:

[ _ Y.O.U.R...I.N.T.R.O...H.E.R.E_ ]

While some people may want to confiscate guns, I don’t.
Here is a much more feasible approach.
It will not solve all gun problems, but it will
reduce the number of guns
and that will reduce the number of dangerous people who have access to guns -
and isn't THAT our real goal?

My proposal - for a NATIONAL gun law for all guns & owners:
My four points are SIMPLY based on seeing a logical parallel between cars & guns.

Please consider advocating these four steps below to help America with our 11,000+ gun disasters:


1►
all gun owners must be licensed & tested with all guns they own and pass a written test.

If you own a motor cycle, a dump truck, and a car - you are tested in each.
Require a written gun test - to guarantee the owner's understanding of gun laws
thus being forced to know the law - via the test – also means the police know who you are -
and you may be less likely to commit a crime or be careless when storing your guns

2►
every year, you must prove that you have gun liability insurance &
be background checked and prove that your gun is properly locked when not used.

Insurance should be at least as high as car insurance [ I would like at least $1,000,000 ]
You must prove your car insurance.
Require an annual back ground check ( with fee ) to verify your suitability to own guns.
Every gun must be locked in a gun case or have a trigger lock.

3►
as the owner of a gun, you are legally responsible for what is done with it.

You are required to report if your gun is missing within 48 hours,
The owner will be much less likely to leave a gun accessible to a family member or thief.

4►
every gun must be registered and tested & a sample fired bullet stored by the police

Knowing that your gun & its bullets are so easily traced will make you think before using it.

additionally -

Over ten bullet magazines are illegal to own { 2nd amendment has no relevance }

Gun fees [ licenses fees & registration fees & fines ] should be
high enough to create a very substantial gun buy-back program ($100-$500 / year)

Penalties must be very high in money ( equal to ten years fees ) & jail time -
especially after the first offense

No citizens ( except dealers & collectors ) need more than a small number of guns

Gun fees should be higher for more guns & for bigger guns.

But the nra may be in favor of this when the gun companies understand that gun owners
can get paid to turn in their old gun and will be able to buy a new gun -
with an INTEGRATED lock .

If we legalize drugs, we will clear out jail cells to fill with gun law breakers and
free up police "time" for real crime investigation

We WILL get higher compliance and lower opposition if we use high fees & buyback.

Take a position of reducing guns, like assault weapons such as semi-automatic rifles -
rather than punishing a gun nut who spent $10,000 on an armory.

LBJ proposed a gun plan similar to the above 4 point plan


Some real 2011 / 2012 gun statistics:

Americans own almost half of all civilian owned guns in the world.
Per 100,000: America: 88,880 guns owned ; 2.97 homicides Per 100,000
Per 100,000: England.…: 6,200 guns owned ; 0.07 homicides Per 100,000
Per 100,000: Austrailia: 15,000 guns owned ; 0.14 homicides Per 100,000
Per 100,000: Canada…: 30,800 guns owned ; 0.51 homicides Per 100,000
Per 100,000: France….: 31,000 guns owned ; 0.06 homicides Per 100,000
Per 100,000: Japan……..: 1,000 guns owned ; 0.08 homicides Per 100,000
Per 100,000: Israel……..: 7,300 guns owned ; 0.90 homicides Per 100,000


http://www.ons.gov.uk/ons/rel/crime-stats/crime-statistics/period-ending-march-2012/rft-annual-trend-and-demographic-tables-2011-12.xls
The above link is to England police statistics - see table D19

The nra & its trolls are claiming that we will fail, where England & Australia succeeded in reducing gun deaths substantially by legislation.


Statistics clearly prove that the number of guns in a state or in a country adds to the risk of homicides.

More complex is the effect of gun laws and restrictions.

When Australia had a massacre in 1996 when 35 people were killed, gun laws were substantially strengthened and a major buy-back was instituted.
There has not been an incident in Australia since then.
Of course, they did not have the benefit of the nra.

In 2011, there were 11,000+ gun homicides in America
In 2011, there were 35 gun deaths in England

For 2011, the average Murder Rate in Death Penalty States was 4.7,
while the average Murder Rate of States without the Death Penalty was 3.1

For 2011, the murder rates were highest in red state regions:
Per 100,000: South 5.5 Midwest 4.5 West 4.2 Northeast 3.9

VERY IMPORTANT:
▬► The 1994 gun "ban" did NOT ban assault weapons.
▬►It banned the MANUFACTURE of assault weapons.
▬►For $300 you can buy a legal accessory to make an AR15 fully automatic (800rpm)

Supreme Court Justice Antonin Scalia said that there are "undoubtedly" limits to a person's right to bear arms under the Second Amendment, but that future court cases will have to decide where to draw the line. That line could be between you and an AR15.


And of course if we stopped money going from advocacy groups & corporations to buy politicians, this would be a very big step in the right direction
Watch our videos: Hedges, Kucinich, Warren, Chomsky , Sanders ,
Romney, Reich, Hartmann, Maddow, Nader, Feingold, Jefferson
And read our analysis of Corporate Personhood & Citizens United & evaluate the national polls that prove the truth. See the new HJR29


http://corporaionsarenotpeople.webuda.com

[-] 0 points by Stormcrow1 (-25) 1 year ago

So with the 300 million or so firearms out there along with those owners who have thousands upon thousands of ammo in their possession - why aren't we having more "mass murderers"?

The way you make it sound is as if everyone who owns multiple firearms along with thousands of rounds of ammo are going to go out and kill people.

What you fail to mention is that those who committed the mass murders were loners. losers and had a mental problem.

Lets address those issues first -

lets look at "family values".

Lets look at eliminating drugs

Lets look at parents being responsible for their children

I will put a $1,000 up against anyone who thinks that "universal background" checks will stop this from happening again or reducing the murder rate in large cities ( which by the way is where the problem is).

At present it's all about "emotions" - get everyone to make their decisons based on "emotions" not on practicality.

Lets enforce the laws we already have on the books.

Just a couple weeks ago there was a shooting in one of Atlantas public schools. I will assure that that juvinile will not be charged with any federal crime which does not allow a 18 year old to own a firearm along with possession of a fiream on school property.

I will also assure you that this juviniles parents wont be charged with any federal crime either even though they broke the law by allowing their son access to a firearm.

It is what it is and more laws won't solve the problem.

[-] -1 points by Narley (-629) 1 year ago

Couldn’t have said it better myself. I own several guns and my son owns several guns. Both of us a law abiding citizens, never been arrested and productive members of community. I sleep a little better knowing he can protect his family if the need arises.

To demonize honest and caring people just because you don’t like guns is part of the problem with the anti-gun folks have. When anti-gunners single out and start calling good people bad people then you have lost your credibility. Is it any wonder people don’t believe the anti-gun nuts.

[-] 5 points by bensdad (8977) 1 year ago

no one is demonizing any one - but it sounds like a good talking point for the lemmings.

I know it is hard to defend a position that is wrong is difficult-
without lies such as:
"Is it any wonder people don’t believe the anti-gun nuts"

FYI- 91% of Americans support new gun control laws

[-] 0 points by justiceforzim (-17) 1 year ago

Newtown, Aurora and Clackamas were false flag. Holmes is pleading guilty because a trial might let info out that tptb wouldn't like. He wasn't supposed to survive the attack. No doubt the fact there were 2 cops at the mall by accident messed up the timing. Clackamas was too, but thankfully an armed citizen intervened before it got out of hand. Funny, you don't hear much about that one, huh?

Oh, as far as the OP? Yes, Nancy has been punished most unjustly, especially when her hometown did not mourn her loss , so quit blaiming the gunowners of America for her son. He was a patsy anyway.

[-] 1 points by inclusionman (7064) 1 year ago

You are clearly out of touch with reality.

Next you'll say Pres Obama is a sleeper manchurian secret muslim born in Kenya.

LMFAO

[-] 0 points by mideast (506) 1 year ago

Ask your doctor to up your meds or lossen your straight jacket

[-] -2 points by highlander10 (-16) 1 year ago

Pass on gun education along with the gun arsenal