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Forum Post: Capitalism has a built in design Flaw

Posted 3 years ago on Dec. 5, 2011, 3:02 p.m. EST by FriendlyObserverA (610)
This content is user submitted and not an official statement

the rich keep getting richer ..and there will always be poor .. unless we remove the flaw in the system.

80 Comments

80 Comments


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[-] 2 points by BarbaraNH (35) 3 years ago

How many people know that Kucinich has introduced a bill in the House that would fundamentally change the nature of capitalism here in the U.S.? It's HR 2990. Here it is, read it for yourself:

http://www.monetary.org/wp-content/uploads/2011/10/HR-2990.pdf

This would change EVERYTHING.

[-] 1 points by ThunderclapNewman (1083) from Nanty Glo, PA 3 years ago

Hi BarbaraNH! Thanks for the link. Hopefully the Kucinich/Conyers bill (HR 2990) will become law. A very informative read. ~ Thunderclap

[-] 2 points by BarbaraNH (35) 3 years ago

Thank you for reading it. Don't know if you already know this site, but it's a convenient way to contact government representatives:

http://www.opencongress.org/contact_congress_letters/13787-H-R-2990-National-Emergency-Employment-Defense-Act-of-2011

[-] 0 points by FriendlyObserverA (610) 3 years ago

it looks like they are restructuring control over banking and money creation ?

there is also a provision in there to fully fund 2 and 4 yr university

[-] 2 points by BarbaraNH (35) 3 years ago

Right. It would mean that banks could no longer decide all by themselves when, where, and how to create money (as debt). Loans would still be available, of course, but not from private interests, which means that interest rates would be low or non-existent. It also means that private banking corporations couldn't make the kinds of reckless decisions that caused the financial crash. The government -- we -- would have a say in the direction of the economy. Ordinary people would have access to money without having to incur crippling debt.

Think of the possibilities!

[-] 0 points by FriendlyObserverA (610) 3 years ago

the lobbyists must be pulling their hair out !

[-] 2 points by MonetizingDiscontent (1257) 3 years ago

::::Banks Make $13 Billion on $7.7 Trillion in Secret Fed Loans; SEC Stands by Does Nothing::::

http://globaleconomicanalysis.blogspot.com/2011/12/banks-make-13-billion-on-77-trillion-in.html


the rich will continue to get richer ..and poor will get poorer until the proper agencies grow a pair, do the right thing, indict the criminal class wallstreet frauds and bankers by bringing federal RICO charges down on them. Until that happens things will become more and more ridiculous.

...I would also like to note that the 'flaw' was not built in, by the way. The flaw is that congress and senate have been infiltrated by bought-out crony collectivists in government who sold us out to corporate white collar criminals and fraudulent bankers. Enforce the laws and we might come to realize what a free market actually looks like.

The flaw is that criminals have over-run our government with campaign contributions (adults call them bribes and payoffs), they have got to be exposed then brought to justice. But until the proper agencies uphold their oath to the people and to the constitution... (and I know that word is very offensive to many here) ...justice will be spelled as follows. J. u. s. t. U. s.

We will be fleeced by bailouts, taxes, ponzi schemes, fraud, austerity measures, inflation, and a devaluing dollar while the department of justice turns a blind eye on it all. That is the flaw, but it wasn't written into the system. The system is being rewritten to accommodate these insiders. So cheer those criminals on if you really want an end to capitalism, because that is what these bankers are doing when they threaten martial law if we don't give them all the money.

Besides, Its not even our debt. We don't owe it. They should suffer their own losses in a 'free-market' capitalist system. Letting banks and corporations fail when they are insolvent IS capitalism, for goodness sake, not bailing them out. Bailouts destroy capitalism and free-markets.

Anyway... just try not to go over the speed-limit, get caught talking on the cell phone when you're driving, or let your kid have a lemonade stand without a permit, because those laws ARE enforced, and its J. u. s. t. U. s.

[-] 1 points by ThunderclapNewman (1083) from Nanty Glo, PA 3 years ago

What's the mantra of big business? Privatize gain, socialize loss? ~ Thunderclap

[-] 0 points by Odin (583) 3 years ago

Very well said.

[-] 0 points by FriendlyObserverA (610) 3 years ago

Capitalism was built into the constitution.. thats where the flaw began .. when governments were not allowed to regulate state commerce. and free markets took over like the old monarchy system where the owner becomes absolute rule ..without any democracy ..

[-] 0 points by MonetizingDiscontent (1257) 3 years ago

the exchange of goods for services is bad? lets doink around with banishing the idea of exchanging a good for a service then, while we are being raped by lawless marauding pillagers.

[-] -1 points by tedscrat (-96) 3 years ago

The less regulation the better. The first century after the Industrial Revolution brought about new, unheard-of situations and conflicts. With the knowledge we have under our belts as a nation, we could perhaps relax some of the regulations.

[-] 0 points by FriendlyObserverA (610) 3 years ago

"The less regulation the better."

your going to have a tough sell on that .. people won't even accept equal pay !

and your idea is in the opposite direction..heading straight back into greed and coruption.

[-] 1 points by Apercentage (81) 3 years ago

its not a design flaw. some win some lose, and in one way or another chose to stay there.

[-] 0 points by FriendlyObserverA (610) 3 years ago

Yes it is a design flaw. Built right into the constitution. With deliberate malice.

[-] 1 points by JesseHeffran (3903) 3 years ago

i often believe that corporatism is just the logical progression of capitalism. but we must remember that capitalism was something that evolved out of the constitution. putting this in perspective. we would not be here if corporatism never existed. so can you envision what comes next, maybe humanism?

[-] 1 points by FriendlyObserverA (610) 3 years ago

Fairness and equality comes next.

And it's been a long time coming.

[-] 1 points by ZenDogTroll (13032) from South Burlington, VT 3 years ago

so you have specified a pair of symptoms illustrating that a flaw exists, but have not specified with specificity the nature of the flaw nor it's solution.

I would have specificity. In specific - let us be explicit.

Explicitly specific.

Specifically explicit.

Specifically, explicitly, specific.

I hope that is clear in every detail.

[-] 0 points by FriendlyObserverA (610) 3 years ago

here's a hint - constitution

[-] 1 points by ZenDogTroll (13032) from South Burlington, VT 3 years ago

Ah . ...

perhaps -

http://occupywallst.org/forum/rep-deutch-introduces-constitutional-amendment-to-/

Outlawing Corporate Cash Undermining the Public Interest in our Elections and Democracy (OCCUPIED)

You can find more on this resolution:

You can find the PDF of the resolution at Rep. Deutch website.

and you can read repelican reaction here.

[-] 1 points by nrama (18) 3 years ago

The inbuilt flaw is GREED. Nothing more, nothing less.. Unfortunately many people subscribed to this.On both sides of the divide.

[-] 1 points by ronimacarroni (1089) 3 years ago

Here's how capitalism comes to be.

1.There's people living in a community and working together for their own benefit

2.a group of people take over by force

3.They need a way to quantify labor and goods

4.Money is created

Karl Marx said that you should follow the steps backwards.

Anarchists said to just undermine this system and pretend we're in step 1.

Thomas Jefferson said it was okay as long as we're vigilant.

[-] 1 points by MonetizingDiscontent (1257) 3 years ago

numbers 1 and 2 sound more like how dollars being made the only 'legal tender' came to be.

3 just sounds like people who haven't learned how to add or subtract yet.

4 shouldve been included with #2

[-] 1 points by ronimacarroni (1089) 3 years ago

At the same time there was a branch of anarchists who cliamed that money was not a bad thing. According to them monopolies can not exist without assistance of the government, so if we were to get rid of the government it would lead to more competitive and fair society.

This branch became known as anarcho-capitalists. Today its known as Austrian Economics.

[-] 0 points by FriendlyObserverA (610) 3 years ago

Metapolitik, you have a beautiful website..

with all your focus and research on the subject .. have you entered a goal to aim for and if so what is that goal?

[-] 1 points by metapolitik (1110) 3 years ago

Thanks for the praise.

I have a pretty long list but I would probably start with campaign finance reform, getting money out of politics, ending the influence of special interests. Anything that moves us toward democracy and away from authoritarian statism and corporatism is a good thing.

http://metapolitik.org/sites/default/files/metapol-newleft.png

Oh... And if we can get everyone who's unemployed, underemployed or sick of congress, sick of Democrats and sick of Republicans (a lot of people) to vote for Green Party Candidate: Jill Stein in 2012...

Our species just might survive the 21st Century.

[-] 0 points by FriendlyObserverA (610) 3 years ago

I would like to see a woman president.. perhaps Jill Stein will be the first ..

[-] 2 points by metapolitik (1110) 3 years ago

As long as it's an intelligent woman like Jill Stein... Not some ditz like Palin and certainly not some crypofascist tool for the corrupt establishment like Pelosi or Clinton.

If we don't get a Green President, I think I just might self immolate in protest like those Buddhist Monks.

[-] 0 points by FriendlyObserverA (610) 3 years ago

Jill will get her day in the sun .. what do you think she should do on her platform .. that she hasn't already ?

[-] 1 points by nrama (18) 3 years ago

I cannot overstate this. The fixes must start with the human heart.No amount of legislation can bring that about.The methods are given in Conversations with God,books I & II.Laws are the last thing we need.Motivation can take one of three forms;threats,incentive and attitude.The first two have failed dismally.Attitudes are moulded thru education. The methods, once again, are given in the books above.

[-] 0 points by FriendlyObserverA (610) 3 years ago

does greed not come from the human heart?

[-] 1 points by nrama (18) 3 years ago

Indeed.And that is where the work must be done.

[-] 1 points by metapolitik (1110) 3 years ago

Jill Stein!

Taxing Wall Street Speculation
Stopping Off Shore Tax-Havens
Taxing Multimillion Dollar Estates
Reducing Defense Spending
A Green New Deal
Employ Every American
Address Climate Change
Sustainable Energy Infrastructure
Sustainable Transportation Infrastructure
Sustainable Production Infrastructure
Mass Transit
Regional Food Distribution
Organic Agriculture
Clean Manufacturing

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jill_Stein

http://www.jillstein.org/

[-] 0 points by FriendlyObserverA (610) 3 years ago

you know she just may turn some heads

[-] 1 points by kingscrossection (1203) 3 years ago

Why would you like a woman president?

[Deleted]

[-] 1 points by kingscrossection (1203) 3 years ago

Speaking from experience? I can make the same argument. Everyone is different from everyone else. Therefore, their ideas can be different.

[Deleted]

[-] 1 points by kingscrossection (1203) 3 years ago

Didn't the Amazons do it? And the cut one of their breasts of so thy could shoot a bow and arrow better.

[Deleted]

[-] 1 points by kingscrossection (1203) 3 years ago

Why would I do that? Also why is the only thing you can think to call me is a cross dresser? Its not really that derogatory because I know I'm not

[-] 0 points by chestRockwell (-4) 3 years ago

Yeah but whats the Flaw?

[-] 0 points by FriendlyObserverA (610) 3 years ago

the constitution does not allow government to intervene in commerce. and since the government .. we the people " for the people by the people " .. kinda keeps the people out of the rules of the game giving capitalism free reign and terror ..

[-] 0 points by chestRockwell (-4) 3 years ago

The jews did it, those motherfuckers keep trying to make me watch Schindlers list, fuck them no way man. The Jew is using the black man to steal my money and build Wal Marts. Those bastards.

[-] 0 points by FriendlyObserverA (610) 3 years ago

I love the Jewish nation ..

[-] 0 points by chestRockwell (-4) 3 years ago

Corporations are evil man, they make profits and work with banks. Something must be wrong, its the Jews I tell you they did it.

[-] 0 points by fandango (241) 3 years ago

captitalism gives you opportunity . drive , ambiton, and a solid work ethic are up to you.

[-] 1 points by demcapitalist (977) 3 years ago

And what does crony capitalism give you ?

[-] 0 points by fandango (241) 3 years ago

I don't like it. But crony capitalism isn't capitalism.

[-] 1 points by demcapitalist (977) 3 years ago

Communism is "we all work hard and then we all share what we made" that like capitalism has never existed on the planet in any pure form either.

[-] 1 points by Frizzle (520) 3 years ago

That's the theory at least. Doesn't quite hold up in reality though.

[-] 0 points by fandango (241) 3 years ago

Look at the Forbes 400 list . MOST are self made . Yes I know there are people on it that inherited family money, but go back and see that the family money was originally earned by self made people.

[-] 0 points by Frizzle (520) 3 years ago

I find that such a misleading word. 'self made' No one is self made. They all lift on the work of others in one way or an other. I'm more impressed with people (rich or poor) who do real work then with people who get rich over the back or others and then pretend they are self made.

Either way, the Forbes 400 list is not the place to look if your interested in seeing the flaws of the system.

[-] 0 points by fandango (241) 3 years ago

are you an elizabeth warren disciple?

[-] 1 points by Frizzle (520) 3 years ago

Nope, I had to look her up to even know who she is. I don't support any politician. They tend to be to locked into the system to really see things clearly.

But why did you ask? Did she say something similar?

[-] 0 points by fandango (241) 3 years ago

if you looked her up than you would know.

[-] 0 points by hidden (430) from Los Angeles, CA 3 years ago

Capitalism gives you none of those. Opportunities are everywhere, capitalism opportunities are to exploit others. Drive and ambition are common to all living beings and capitalism only cripple them for the benefit of the few.

[-] 0 points by fandango (241) 3 years ago

Drive and ambittion are not common. There is no sucess without failure. Many stick with failure and never go beyond it. They give up.That's where drive and ambition come into play. Edison did not invent the incandescent light bulb on his first try. Neither did Mestral , Colt , Marie Curie or John Deere. It goes on and on.

[-] 1 points by Apercentage (81) 3 years ago

Some win, some lose, and of course the losers aren't okay with that, tough, its how it works, and is the best system out there. Its only a tool. People need to quit bitching about capitalism, its a wonderful system.

[-] 0 points by fandango (241) 3 years ago

Yes it is !!

[-] 1 points by hidden (430) from Los Angeles, CA 3 years ago

None of that is a merit of capitalism, the majority of inventors do not think of monetary gains when designing their most valuable inventions.

There is no sucess without failure

Why not?

Edison did not invent the incandescent light bulb on his first try.

I have not failed. I've just found 10,000 ways that won't work. ~ Thomas Edison

[-] 0 points by fandango (241) 3 years ago

failure by any other euphamism is failure.

[-] 0 points by FriendlyObserverA (610) 3 years ago

and a pat on the back from my employer don't forget.. with a big smile such a good worker I am .. my boss is very happy with me .. oh boy oh boy .. I am going home now .. I will be back tomorrow and I will work really really hard for my boss .. my boss drives a nice car ... and has a big house .. he is so happy and nice to me .. and only once was he mad at me .. I don't know why .. he was just mad .. for a while .. and I did not say anything to him .. I was kinda scared .. maybe he was mad at me .. I don't know .. but he drove his car home that day and tomorrow we worked hard again trying to make our boss happy so he could be with his wife .. and they are going on a big vacation .. they always go away on vacations ... they always smile and are happy my boss is so happy when I work hard .. I hope I am not late again tomorrow ..

[-] 0 points by fandango (241) 3 years ago

whiner

[-] 0 points by gforz (-43) 3 years ago

You pretty dumb keep going back to work for da' boss. Maybe try 'nuther job, or 'nuther boss, maybe be yo' own boss...maybe.

[Deleted]

[-] 0 points by FriendlyObserverA (610) 3 years ago

you didn't have a penny !

[-] 1 points by simplesimon (121) 3 years ago

I didn't buy my first pair of pants either.

[-] 0 points by FriendlyObserverA (610) 3 years ago

can I borrow twenty $ ?

[-] 1 points by simplesimon (121) 3 years ago

Oh hell no. I look at it this way. Somehow I ended up with sixty dollars. I got it by pressing a few buttons on the machine at the 7-11. I bought me some tea at the 7-11 for 1.17 because I have a cup I can refill cheap. I will spend the rest of it on tea, or I might buy a pack of smokes with it. If I give you any money then I can't have sweet tea to drink. I'll leave that money rolling around in my pocket until I want more tea. Get your own goddam sixty dollars you greedy bastard.

[-] 0 points by FriendlyObserverA (610) 3 years ago

thats not .. fair ..I don't have any money .. and thats way too much tea .. you will feel sick if you drink so much tea .. it would be better if you borrow me the money and not feel sick ..

[-] 1 points by simplesimon (121) 3 years ago

Well, tell ya what buddy. You go out there and ask everybody you see for 1 dollar for about a week, and then you'll have your sixty dollars. You don't even have to work for it. Just start asking people and you'll get a dollar. I already told you no, so keep on asking. You have about as much of a chance getting 20 dollars out of me as I have a chance of being on Jeopardy.

[-] 0 points by FriendlyObserverA (610) 3 years ago

can I have a dollar .. ? just one dollar .. I am thirsty.. I would like to buy some tea..

[-] 1 points by simplesimon (121) 3 years ago

Keep on shufflin brother. You gotta learn how to ask more than one person. Ask everybody you see man. Besides, I don't see any coin slot on this computer. It's free here at the library. Couldn't give it to you even if I wanted to, which I don't.

But I have a Jeopardy question for you. The category is Bumming, and you chose the $1 panel. The answer is "up your butt and around the corner". What's the question?

[-] 0 points by FriendlyObserverA (610) 3 years ago

haha alex .. for five dollars .. where did all the money go?

[-] 1 points by simplesimon (121) 3 years ago

That was the wrong answer. You now owe me one dollar. The correct question is "where is the shelter?"

You have one more chance for twenty damn dollars.

The answer, "Get over here right now"

What is the question?

[-] 0 points by FriendlyObserverA (610) 3 years ago

I owe you a dollar ! .. I don't have a dollar .. I was going to borrow a dollar from you but you were very mean and told me to shuffleoff .. kid .. and now I went away and don't have a dollar .. nothing no drink of tea even .. and I am cold too ther is no shelter .. and no more tea .. and thanksgiving is over .. and no one is bringing any food ... and now your yelling at me and asking ..dumb questions .. I don't have your dollar you never gave me a dollar remember.. you are troublemaking .. I am going to tell the mayor next time he comes out here .. that you would not let me have tea .. and they will arrest you and take all your money .. and you won't have tea in jail ..where you will go .. you will have to shuffle around the corner or get it up the butt .. so watch your ass ..and keep shufflin butty

[-] 1 points by simplesimon (121) 3 years ago

That was also wrong. The question is "But what did I do?"

Dam man. I have my sixty, and you're still asking the same guy over and over for 1 dollar.

No wonder you say capitalism has a design flaw.

You lost in the barter, yet you come back to the same well to continue to barter, when you know that nil is coming to you. This is a personal design flaw, and not a flaw in capitalism.

You provided nothing of value in return for my dollar, so you got what you deserved out of capitalism. Nothing. You also showed me no effort, no business plan, nothing, for the $20 you wanted to borrow. Where's the collateral?

The flaw, Friendly, is how you approach Capitalism. Obtaining something of value for goods or services offered is normal.

Of course, you could just ask people for charity too. And you will get the expected result. Lots of nos, and a pittance when you get a yes.

[-] 0 points by FriendlyObserverA (610) 3 years ago

thanks for the lesson . can I have a dollar please ..

[-] -1 points by GeorgeCarlinRules (482) 3 years ago

The Capitalist system isn't "broken" - it is working perfectly; this is how it functions.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4Z9WVZddH9w

[-] -1 points by FrogWithWings (1367) 3 years ago

Have you ever helped others get what they wanted and needed? Did you make even one thin dime in the process? Guess what? If you did, that makes you a capitalist like everyone else who has, or even those went to school, to get some degree, in order to do the exact same thing.

Our nation does not have captialism at this point in history. If we did, there would be no such thing as "too big to fail", and it would extend over to even our government which has been in debt since 1865 and never even caught up the interest payments on all the debt it's borrowed since.