Forum Post: Assange on Obama's Win - Wolf in Sheep's Clothing
Posted 12 years ago on Nov. 10, 2012, 5:26 p.m. EST by john23
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Agree.
Yep.
"I'm not disgusted at President Obama personally. It's President Obama's policies on civil liberties and national security issues I'm disgusted by." Executive director of the ACLU, Anthony Romero
Yep
Interesting these are the same extreme comments the Tea Party makes. Are you of the same mindset? Calm down already!
What comment did i make? These aren't my words.
Sorry, I'm not interested in anything a rapist has to say. Lock his ass up.
Inform yourself, gramps.
http://www.abc.net.au/4corners/stories/2012/07/19/3549280.htm
tldl
He also put Nakoula Basseley Nakoula back in jail to appease the Muslim Brotherhood for what was essentially political speech in the form of artistic comedic exploration.
and how did Obama do that exactly? Seems like you're making this up.
No, believe me, Nakoula really has been returned to jail.
I was questioning your accusation that it was due to Obama.
I think youtube has a clip of Obama escorting him to his cell and locking the door too.
Obama did it. Obama did it!
Wait... are you saying Bush is responsible for this one, too? Whoa... who woulda guessed.
Didn't Nakoula violate his probation? Maybe Nakoula got himself re arrested. He did seek out police protection, and the police found out he used tech which he was told he couldn't because his previous conviction/sentence included a prohibition to use internet.
Wasn't Bush or Obama. It was his own ignorant criminal ass. You support him?
Yea, can't believe they actually hunted the guy down. And then shot him.
Did he get shot?
Couldn't have happened to a nicer guy!
Didn't he work with American right wing wacko religious fundamental cases to incite violence against Americans in a weak, disgusting attempt to create an October surprise to affect the US elections.
Maybe that is against the law.
The video went viral; we all watched it. It was relatively benign. The Feds hunted this guy down like a dog but they won't lift a finger to rein in the looters who steal from people during a storm. You are some really sick people.
So you are against hunting down this criminal?
And you don't believe we capture, arrest looters.?
What are you talkin about? You're not making sense!
Saesneg seems to be saying that higher priority should be given to rein in the looters who are stealing from people in the recent storm-ravaged New York/New Jersey areas than to chase after the freedom-of-speech-protected inflammatory video of Nakoula. Saesneg is supposedly from Linwood, NJ so the looting may well have touched a raw nerve.
In my opinion, the Islamic world overreacted to some not-so-smart segment of our U.S. population (Nakoula) but yes that is STILL protected under our first amendment to our Constitution. It was our own government's using Nakoula's video as a fig leaf for the Benghazi attack on the U.S. diplomatic mission (that killed Ambassador Chris Stevens) that had whipped up more the follow-on commotions of the Islamic world.
Our government cast itself in the shadow of responding to overseas extreme reactions. That perception is very bad because there are irreconcilable differences between us and them. I understand that they have their own not-so-smart segment of their population but responding to that or appearing to do so should not be on our government's agenda -- we have our freedom of speech and we will defend it, here, there, and everywhere, past, now, and future till kingdom come, against all enemies, foreign and domestic.
We now have Marines stationed in Libya, with more to come. Mission accomplished. Another occupation well under way.
We need our own troops on the ground to protect our national interests (remember how long it took us to take down Osama bin Laden because we had "outsourced" the task and trusted our "allies"). Diplomatic missions are certainly well within our rights to protect anywhere the host country extends to us the courtesy and privilege of diplomatic relation. In fact, the host country has well-recognized international obligations to protect our diplomatic missions but we had better shore up our missions in Libya. The Obama administration did not shore it up before the Benghazi attack and that was a failure that some were trying to cover up. Yes, it WAS a failure so own up to it.
I’m a veteran and agree 100%. Bring our troops home. Stop trying to be the world’s policeman. For good or bad, other nations should be able to what they wish without the US sticking it’s nose in their business. I also believe we need to our southern border and try to stem the flow of drugs and illegal’s.
The U.S. is not beating the drum of full withdrawal from the world but we have been doing too much of the policing, bleeding our own troops' red blood dry (in places whose names most Americans could not even pronounce correctly, not to mention the intricacies of religious nuances, factions, feuds, historical oppressions, alliances, animosities, conflicts, persecutions, tribal allegiances, familial antagonisms, etc.) while flooding our treasury with red ink.
If we send our troops and diplomats abroad, we should send them with the best protections we can provide. The U.S. has the responsibility to play a proper role in shoring up the global commons but let the others who have grown up holding on to the apron string take their rightful places as nations among equals and shoulder the burden.
One important attribute of a nation is its border, geographical, political, or otherwise. Without that, it becomes rather meaningless.
Protest all pols against military intervention.
Protest for peace.
No more war!
Our Marines in Libya are highly unlikely to become an occupation force or get involved in military intervention. In fact, the Benghazi attack succeeded because of our RELUCTANCE to inject forward-deployed military force there or near there. It was a now-classic 9/11 syndrome. No, it won't happen. No, it won't happen. No, it won't happen. Oh, my God, it does happen!
We can't protect every diplomat, in every consulate. And we do not! This is a once in 3 decades event that occured as an attempt to affect our election.
Our brave diplomats know that they are risking their lives for freedom.
This tragedy should be bringing us together.
And there is NO HONOR in those who are besmirching these great Americans by playing politics with it.
Peace.
We have an obligation to protect every one of our diplomats wherever they are conducting our affairs of state. Low occurrence rate does not remove the obligation. It is not "playing politics" because we really need to own up to it so that rather than mowing down all of the grass around but NOT next to the pile of dog poop with buzzing flies, we should pick up the dog poop and dispose of it properly. Hillary Clinton was gutsy to own up to it but there are apparently others who do not want to and are still engaging in the artsy grass mowing.
"We have an obligation to protect every one of our diplomats..."
No we dont. Our "obligations" are nothing more than corporate raiders looking for loot. Too many damn obligations already.
One that didnt want to was Petraeus, hence his no longer testifying.
Nah. That ain't happening.
We took responsibility just fine immediately. Most people understand that an investigation takes a few weeks and have enough respect for our courageous diplomats that they do not attempt to use this tragedy in a dishonorable effort to affect the election.
Those who have used it so are not honorable, & unamerican.
But thats ok. They lost. They failed.
Peace
The religious extremists in the Muslim world have created an "industry of outrage" to incite violence over ridiculous issues (cartoons, novels, youtube clips).
The religious extremists (right wing wackos) here created the film purposely to tap into that and create "an October surprise" to affect the US election.
Our government did nothing wrong in dealing with this right wing created attempt (that resulted in the death of American diplomats) to affect the election.
In fact after the right wing religious extremists in the US succeeded at creating the "incident" (that resulted in the death of Americans) our govt successfully minimized the affects with deft diplomatic strategy.
The Looting is unrelated! It is horrible. But it is a responsibility of local/state authorities. To connect the 2 betrays either a clear lack of understanding of how things work, or simply desperate partisanship.
Peace.
You are still under the impression that the attack on the U.S. diplomatic mission in Benghazi, Libya originated from the inflammatory video of Nakoula. I do not believe so. It was a well-orchestrated attack with many attackers and heavy arms. It was more like a militia or al-Qaeda-planned attack masquerading in the Muslim street rage.
Assange was right -- our government will continue to succeed to dole out to us doggie doodads from under its clothing.
I never said I thought that! You don't speak for me!
It was a terrorist attack on the anniversary of 9/11
The religious extremist muslims DID use the video to incite violence all over the muslim world. But I didn't say the benghazi attack was simply a result of the film/youtube clip. That is you twisting my beliefs.
So try again.
I could have misunderstood you as this medium has its limits. Perhaps we are arguing about the before or after. I believe that much of the violence following the attack might not have happened if our government did not tuck at the fig leaf of the video.
NO president has been disrespected during the state ofthe union like repubs disrespected Pres Obama! No party has misused/abused the filibuster like the repubs have in the last 4 years.
Please. "Both sides"? You must be joking.
You can easily find out from the opposite side what tricks were used. In any case, the ancient Romans used the procedure of the "decimation" of the legion that had lost a battle. They killed one of every ten (ergo, "decimate") members of the legion, regardless of the finger-pointing or who was truly at fault. Roman legions gained legendary fame as warriors. What can serve as a more humane and modernized version of this that can get our political system working right again?
Republicans would call Pres Obama "the Mighty O" and continue the disrespectful, traitorous, racist behavior.
Thats what they do. It's what they have done. They got nothing but hate, fear, & disrespect.
No?
The sport is really played by BOTH sides. The rules of the sport are enshrined in the Congressional procedures. As long as the paymasters of Congress, the American people, do not pay attention and accept finger-pointing, gridlock shall reign and we shall continue to languish as a stinky rotting whale on the beach, dreaming of our past glory as the biggest animal ever ruling the deep blue oceans.
The republican treasonous behavior will end when they give Pres Obama the respect he deserves by virtue of the fact he was elected by the people!
Once the repubs get beyond their partisanship & racism we will get something done!
What would the Republicans say? Same old, same old!
Our domestic impasse has more to do with treasonous repubs who obstruct and filibuster every effort to improve the economy. (most recently filibustered 1 million vet jobs bill)
It is the repubs disrespect that leads them to not take his calls after the election, scream out you lie at state of the union, call him name like "mighty O'
That is where a bit of diplomacy must be applied.
Obstructionism is a bipartisan sport with wide participation on Capitol Hill. It will only end when the constituents watch the sport up close and with ears perked up.
Pres Obama is not responsible for spreading the video.
The American right wing wackos who colluded in the films creation, utilized their christian connections in egypt spread it around. They did this to affect the election.
Pres Obama is responsible for deftly ending the threat & danger, with diplomatic finesse & intelligence.
Peace
Well, obviously there is a fair amount of easily "motivated" tinder folks in Egypt and Libya available for violence and supporting the imposition of global Shar'ia.
Our "Mighty O" could use much of that "diplomatic finesse & intelligence" domestically to move us out of our domestic impasse in the last few years.
Our govt did not create the protests/violence around the muslim world after the Benghazi attack by denouncing (rightfully) the extremist video.
That violence/protests against American embassies were incited by religious muslim extremists who employed their "outrage machine" with the US right wing created anti muslim film.
I agree with you that there are overseas religious extremists engaging in their outrage/dogma practices detrimental to international peace and prosperity in service to their own interests. However, knowing how slowly and how ridiculously some of their "motivated" folks responded to the utterance of our "Mighty O," we stood a good chance to have these folks kept inside of the drum if the video were not brought into their consciousness at all by our "Mighty O et al."
Actually it was probably just an assasination.
We cant start labeling everything a terrorist attack, it plays right into the medias hands.
I don't care about Benghazi anymore. It has been turned into a political football by the dishonorable republicans.
Yea, I was against hunting down this criminal. Absolutely. And I am for hunting down the looters - which I have heard even African Americans state - should be shot on the spot.
We ARE going after looters!. One has nothing to do with the other!
One has everything to do with the other; we hunt down those who poke fun at Allah but we ignore looters - call it the new "social justice."
We've added what, 200,000 to Homeland Security since 2002, but they fail to secure a single home? This is bureaucracy; it's our government on drugs - marijuana, I suspect, specifically.
We ARE going after looters.
You are simply a desperate anti Obama partisan trying to blame local problems on Pres Obama.
Sorry. unrelated. Put your hatred aside. We need all good people to help the victims of Sandy.
Peace
You should perhaps mention that to the Federal government? Because here in New York we are definitively anti-Obama, definitely, as the recent election surely proves. Sure, our demands for federal aid are definitely partisan, no doubt fueled by our hatred of Obama.
When are you going to stop spinning the spin here?
"Forced to follow"? What does that mean.?
And the Media have NOT covered the minorities affected. I only see, staten Island, Long beach, breezy point, Gerritsen beach. Jersey shore.
you don't know what you are talkin about.
New york is anti Obama? NY re elected Pres Obama 63% to 34%.
New Jersey re elected Pres Obama 60% to 40%.
You don't know what you are talkin about.
Pres Obama and the Fed govt is not responsible for police service. Local/state authorities ARE.
Blaming Pres Obama just betrays your desperate partisanship.
Sorry.
Peace.
Haha... you know I suspect New York would have blamed almighty God if he was currently the President of the US; but while we're here - many have begun to wonder if it is because we are white waterfront dwellers. Just as those of Katrina wondered if the lack of response was because they were black waterfront dwellers. Do you hear me now?
What are you talkin about.? God? White waterfront dwellers?
What does color have to do with anything?
Were there minorities in far rockaway affected.? What about Coney Island?. Have you followed the numerous zone A high rise public housing residence who still don't have electricity & heat.
And Many white people near the water are just working class people. nothing exceptional.
Please explain. Your comments are not understandable.
There are many blacks in the Rockaways and Coney Island; I have been forced to follow these public housing residences because the white waterfront of other areas has been entirely ignored by our media. How 'bout now, do you hear me now?
Didn't Nakoula violate his probation? Maybe Nakoula got himself re arrested. He did seek out police protection, and the police found out he used tech which he was told he couldn't because his previous conviction/sentence included a prohibition to use internet.
Wasn't Bush or Obama. It was his own ignorant criminal ass. You support him?
This is what happens when diaper heads come to our Country. The increased security at the airports is all because of the rag heads
"diaper heads", "spics", "niggers", "retarded", You are despicable..
And you hate turban wearing people along with Spanish, black, mentally ill, & unions
hopeless. Please refrain from responding to my comments.
You have obviously been out of touch with reality for a long time now, ows has never amounted to nothing. This site is all it has left to cling to. Get a life bud
It seems you have only come here to spew.
If you're going to spew.... spew into this.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ouDDj6kr1qo
Please go away.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EZGVmzPHD7M
By time obummer gets done, millions will be losing their jobs and I hope the ones that lose their jobs is the ones that voted for the village idiot
But we have added almost 6 million jobs since the Bush great recession.
And if Repubs get out ofthe way & pass the jobs bills we will have millions more jobs.
We also need to rehire the million public workers fired by republican state govt.
That'll do it.
Its easy to put people to work when you pump trillions into the economy. This is all fake...the stock market.....the timid recovery. It's built on a foundation like a house of cards. It's all propped up with phony money and manipulated interest rates which causes malinvestment and sets the stage for a bigger crisis.
Just to make myself clear so i don't sound partisan....bush did the same thing....and Romney wouldn't have done anything different. But this is an impossible system to keep propped up....its like a drug addict getting their fix with more injections of credit into the market....it's building up a tolerance to it and eventually the market will overpower it just like in 2008. Lookout below when it does because the foundation is even more unstable.
So then hiring people won't help?
What can we do?
Hiring people helps...if the jobs are sustainable. If they are real foundational jobs, that absolutely helps.
We can start by getting the jackasses out of government who caused the crisis. Geithner would be a great start.
An understanding of how we got into this mess is necessary to change it...studying the information provided by the people who predicted the crisis up to 5 years before it happened would also be beneficial. Have we listened to them? No...all of the ones who predicted this mess are screaming about what is happening saying that you're setting the stage for an even bigger catastrophe. Great few paragraphs from Peter Bernholz:
"“In a democracy parties compete to gain and maintain government power. As a consequency the party or parties in power have to try to gain as many votes as possible in the next election to secure at least a majority in parliament. However, voters are rationally uninformed about matters which are not very important to them, since the negligible chance that their individual vote would make a difference to the outcome of the election does not warrant more than very little effort and quences. It follows that they are only reasonably well informed about what is important to them, usually their and their relatives’ job security, their wages and incomes, and the availability of not too expensive housing. They are thus usually ignorant about monetary policies and their future consequences. Moreover, these matters are complex and not easily understood without specific education. On top of this, the positive though usually short-lived consequences of an expansionary monetary policy, namely an upturn of the economy and a decrease in unemployment, follow more quickly than its negative consequences in the form of higher prices. As a consequence, because of the complexity of the problems and of their rational ignorance voters will judge the performance of the government mostly by the results of former policies and even events which have not been caused by measures of the government.”
So much of this great paragraph discusses the ignorance of the people.
Certainly I have looked at the policy of QE/devaluing the dollar and I understand the danger.
What is your alternative proposal? Can we step back gradually? What would be the affect of your proposal? Geithner will probably go but this is a fed/bernanke thing no?
I've heard people here simply state, "the crash is coming, buy hard assets".
Is that where you are? Because I try to avoid the fear mongering thing. Isn't that how conservatives get people to support their anti 99% agenda?
Peace. What should we DO?
Hope for the best and prepare for the worst. Build your ark, insulate, waterproof, isolate, hedge, hedge, hedge, and keep your eyes peeled for the sign. Schizophrenic protections are actually a rather realistic and successful financial survival strategy -- limit your losses.
Good One : Hope for the best and prepare for the worst.
Definitely do not hope for the best and so do nothing to prepare for the worst.
Planning failures due to expense issues?
What does it cost to make advance preparations for the worst?
What does it cost to try to catch-up recover after the worst having made no preparations?
There is only one rule to success to remember -- never lose big and let random chance rip.
Seems kind of selfish. Nothing you mentioned included helping others.
Is this one of those "everyman for himself" "you're on your own" kinda situation?
When the worst comes, every one has their own Messiah of One, in themself and for themself. Helping others is to tell them in advance and do the best to help if possible later but "Man's got to know his limitations." Have you tried to reach out before and found out how convincing you can be? Ask victims of Sandy and the Nor'easter while the experience is fresh on their memories. Did we not have Irene before them that threatened with flooding? Frankly, we just have far too many dates with these stormy female personalities! What Christian name is "Nor'easter"? Some woman trying to preserve her anonymity in sadism?
Your not makin much sense.
OWS is doing great work helping the victims of Sandy. I'll be going back again today.
To retreat into the mentality of desperation and every man for himself is too inhuman. Sorry.
Humanity is strongest when we come together. It is howwe survived for millenium.
And I assure you when people are scared they become more conservative, repubs bank on that, it is their main tool to get support for their agenda.
So I cannot submit to the fear you suggest. It is the wrong path. We must find confidence & strength through togetherness. Strength in numbers.
We are all in this together. There is nothing the people united can't accomplish.
No retreat.
Remember the Titanic. Remember New Orleans. Remember 9/11/2001. Je me souviens. There are limits and there are differences that can be made. Cohesion requires shared beliefs and that just cannot happen for some people because they are content and not paying attention.
Here in NYC on 9/11 we came together, & came back stronger. The titanic would have had a great many more survivors had they come together. You make my point.
We are always better off/stronger when we come together. If we retreat in fear from each other we will be weakening ourselves, & creating the recipe for failure.
The policy is a bernanke/fed issue.....but there are the minds in congress who actively support this nonsense and were blatantly wrong about the impending collapse and they need to go (why i mentioned geithner).
My alternative proposal. No artificial manipulation of interest rates, period. This sets the stage for disaster, but a postponed disaster that is hidden by an artifiical initial boom. Manipulating the time value of money throws off everything in the economy. Businesses take on projects to produce things that the citizens havent saved for (as in a normal economy interest rates would drop if citizens savings expand - the expansion in their savings suggests to businesses that the people in the future would have the money to invest in projects business is thinking about pursuing). Interest rates affect many more things in an economy and it would take a 50 page paper to go over them all.
No debt pyramiding (leveraging, fractional reserves, derivatives). This would create a sound money base - one in which economic ripples would be minized. For example in our current system things can be extremely leveraged - a 15 billion dollar business that goes down built on this faulty system could spell a 150 billion loss in the market because of this debt pyramiding process (in some areas of the economy the leveraging is as high as 30 to 1). Why should the people have to undergo massive booms and busts because of increased leverage allowed by this faulty system?
No expansion of the money supply, or printing of money. This steals wealth unproportionally more from the middle and lower class than it does the wealthy. If the government wants more revenue to fund what it wants to do - raise tax rates (so be it if the people decide they want to do it to the rich only...at least this would be a directed through representatives in congress) - taxing directly is taxation with representation - printing money is taxation without representation. This printed money is also insidious in the economy - as it gets funneled to certain areas more than others causing a boom in prices and cheap credit that comes crashing down (housing crisis).
No bailing out of financial institutions because of their ridiculous mistakes.
This obviously isn't all inclusive - but a start.
I'm very much in favor of legalizing competing currencies with the US dollar....but that's an argument for much later down the road.
I can't say I understand what you are proposing, but I think it is very unlikely that it will come to pass. So I guess we will have an economic/crash/recession? When? How can I prepare my family for this?
In any event good luck in all your good efforts.
lol, i think ur right...i think it's very unlikely to come to pass.
Yeah i don't claim to know where to invest your money. Lots of people talk about gold or other commodities which have held up extremely well, and the argument that its price will continue to increase with the devaluing dollar is a legitamate one but not full proof. Not sure i would put all my eggs into something like that though....that's for each person to figure out i think.
To me the safest bet is self sufficiency. When it comes down to it you can't eat gold or paper. Doesn't mean you have to build a bunker out in your backyard and stockpile rations to feed people for years and become a doomsdayer. But knowing how to grow your own food, how it stores for winter etc. seems pretty logical. Thinking things out to prepare for these types of situations makes a lot of sense in my mind....pretty sure the few in NY who had planned ahead are happy they did right now.
Yeah I'm in NYC & just finished a run delivering supplies to Staten island for Occupy Sandy but that is NOT what you are talking about.
If your talkin growing food and storing it for the winter then you're talkin about the break down of civilization.
That is pretty scary. I can't believe that. That falls into the fear mongering catagory. Thats usually the right wing tactic to get people to support some wacky adenda.
Sorry. Good luck with yout farmin and all your good efforts. I have no opportunity to do that in NYC.
what we really need to do is get the unions out of the public and federal sectors
That would help the corp 1% plutocrats.
So you hate latino, black, mentally ill, & unions.
Sounds like you hate the 99%
You do not support OWS!
Are you a republican plant?
You have obviously been out of touch with reality for a long time now, ows has never amounted to nothing. This site is all it has left to cling to. Get a life bud
I'll be working with Occupy Sandy again today, You are just wrong as you are with all your racist opinions.
http://www.laprogressive.com/occupy-queens/#sthash.yaLVjaSF.dpbs
http://www.thelmagazine.com/TheMeasure/archives/2012/09/13/artists-scholars-help-revitalize-ows
http://www.washingtonpost.com/national/occupy-sandy-wall-street-protest-group-finds-new-cause-delivering-aid-to-storm-victims/2012/11/10/d63fe388-2b0a-11e2-aaa5-ac786110c486_story.html
We are also working on the rolling jubilee and support for the 99% being foreclosed on by corrupt, greedy corp 1% banksters.
And many other projects.
You must be working for ows off your pc then because you are always on here
NOT!
Wrong, & wrong again.
As always! You are only ever wrong!
LOL. It is comical how consistence your wrongness occurs.