Forum Post: Are You In Favor of War Against Iran?
Posted 12 years ago on Oct. 12, 2011, 9:45 p.m. EST by RutherfordBHayes
(18)
from Buckhannon, WV
This content is user submitted and not an official statement
People are now saying that terrorist plot devised by Iran is a cause for war. Do you agree?
No, we should infiltrate them with McDonalds and Kentucky Fried Chicken--destroy them from within. That, and bomb them with condoms and trial subscriptions to Netflix. They'll go down grinning like cats.
cmoylanc,
This is an excellent strategy for subduing Iran and should be provided to commanding general Elizabeth Warren for her immediate review.
With Netflix subscriptions the Iranians will soon become couch potatoes. This will in time result in afflictions like diabetes and obesity from the MickeyD's and KFC garbage causing health care costs to go through the roof. After that the options for the US would be limitless. For example they could then be offered participation in the US healthcare system which if they were to accept would result in their immediate enslavement (and given the scenario how could they refuse) to the insurance and drug companies.
Yeah you have a great idea there
Just like us...
Now that's the only laugh I've had all night . . THANKS
WE will wait for them to attack israel iran is the home of the antichrist its in the bible end of days
Nooooooo! That would constitute "cruel and unusual punishment" under the Geneva Convention. :)
I think this is off topic. We should concentrate on the issues that unite the 99%. This is an issue that will divide us.
Let's see, a potential WW3 is off-topic. Also, and an 8th war front to kill people (our own and those in the middle east) and transfer still more wealth to the military-industrial complex (i.e., corporate-government collusion) is off-topic to OWS. That is curious. Quite curious, indeed.
How can any of us take anything in the mainstream American media seriously? It really is nothing but a propaganda machine that serves the interests of the U.S. Imperialist regime. This is nothing more than another hoax devised to justify attacking another sovereign nation whom allegedly is plotting to attack the U.S. How many times will we as a republic continue to buy these lies? I really do not understand why the “Board of Directors” of America even tries to cook this stuff up anymore; it is not like they need anyone’s approval to invade any sovereign nation they chose… More lies...
I think the reason they keep 'cooking it up' is because people are either not paying attention, they are apathetic, or as the people below said, they deem it unimportant enough for OWS to address as a grievance. I actually think it is one of the most important issues we should be addressing.
Dramatic. We need to focus. You want to fix government or our financial system or do you want to debate the end of the world?
Do you doubt they will use this as an excuse to attack Iran?
No. What I doubt is that this movement can solve all of the worlds problems all at once. Yes I'm worried that evil conspires to lay the framework for yet another military confrontation - but part of me thinks that surely this President is not so stupid as to drag our tired ass into another conflict we can't afford. Now if all they are going to do is go in and bomb the hell out of their nuclear arms facilities, well them maybe I'm not so opposed. But as I said before, off topic . . . this is Occupy Wall Street, not Occupy the Middle East.
True, but I see the wars as not only common ground between the liberty minded-and progressive folk, but vital to our efforts here and abroad. The money being spent, the illegality of the wars - our executive branch has all but taken war powers away from Congress, the divisive lies around which this whole complex has been initiated and supported.
By the way, our own CIA has said Iran doesn't yet have nuclear arms. But even if they do, I fail to see how any of these conflicts are our business, especially when they're bankrupting us, and making still more enemies in the world.
Consider this: as long as we're allowing (i.e., paying) our troops to be in the middle east and drop depleted uranium bombs on civilians and kill people with drones, maybe OWS doesn't have a leg to stand on. By comparison, our problems seem pretty petty.
you're forgetting that the companies that make all of the bombs, weapons, tanks, aircraft, are all financed by Wall Street.
Without this financing, the wars could not exist.
Thus, this is an OWS issue.
This is bigger than money. This is a moral issue that we are supporting our government being violent towards 10s of 1000s of people in other countries. If we do not protest the wars, then we are supporting the neocons and an aggressive foreign policy.
Not to mention that if we disagree with them - weapons will be used against us - like in Oakland - where they used flares, rubber bullets, etc against peaceful unarmed protestors.
totally agree, buddy.
totally agree.
My position is more pragmatic than moral. On the moral argument, I am easily and happily defeated.
It's probably nothing more then political posturing... I hope. lol
I hope so, too. But given their track record over the last 10 years, I am very concerned about the saber-rattling.
When the MSM starts supporting the bombing of Iran, that's when you head for Canada. Until that happens, i wouldn't worry to much. =)
Hillary condemns and describes it as 'dangerous escalation' http://www.reuters.com/article/2011/10/12/us-usa-security-iran-clinton-idUSTRE79B4Z820111012
As does Biden - Iran to be held accountable http://www.activistpost.com/2011/10/iran-to-be-held-accountable-for-murder.html
In light of events Panetta claims military needs more money: http://www.activistpost.com/2011/10/with-new-threats-us-army-must-reinvent.html
They always have to talk about how horrible it is and how the other people are so bad and need to die, yada yada yad ... They still have to convince the public first before they go to war... At least they use to... Were Doomed ! lol
I'm going to say categorically if the 6 wars that the us is involved in now is not enough for you, you're an absolute fuckwit.
war is never a solution. It's the ultimate failure in communication between people. Funny how violence only tends to occur between small children, drunk adults, and large countries, isn't it?
no l dont agree. terrorist are not supported by iran, terrorist affairs are the reaction of the west policy in the world and some are plots to influense the world
But we will wait for them to attack Israel this is in the bible Iran is the home of the antichrist
no it's not! It's at 1600 pennsylvania avenue nw washington dc 20500
iran is the anitchrist home we have no choice now they were caught trying to kill us
How can any of us take anything in the mainstream American media seriously? It really is nothing but a propaganda machine that serves the interests of the U.S. Imperialist regime. This is nothing more than another hoax devised to justify attacking another sovereign nation whom allegedly is plotting to attack the U.S. How many times will we as a republic continue to buy these lies? I really do not understand why the “Board of Directors” of America even tries to cook this stuff up anymore; it is not like they need anyone’s approval to invade any sovereign nation they chose… More lies...
No. First of all, I dont think this was devised by Iran. There are a couple of things that dont match. One is that this was very sloppy and that is not Iran, generally. The other is that the drug cartel supposedly involved does not do murder for hire, or never has in the past and really has no reason to do it in this case. Something does not match and I think perhaps they misread this as a state sponsored plot when it was really some outside actors.....or loose associates.
But this is the more important thing. Suppose Iran really did have everything to do with this. It seems designed to inspire aggressive action and one has to ask why that is. If we learned one thing from Iraq it is to question our intel and question what is behind things before we act. Playing into the hands of the leadership in Iran does not make sense and there is no reason for them to do this unless it was set up to fail in the first place.
Okay, so what you're saying is that you don't think Iran was behind this because it was "too sloppy."
Mm hmm. Just one question. Ahmadidijad goes on television and calls for the destruction of Israel. And the next week. And the next week. And in front of the UN. How sloppy is that?
...Still think it's too sloppy?
Not if he is looking to provoke an attack. You left out that part of my post. Nevertheless, it makes no sense for any drug cartel to team up with an Iranian guy on this....they are most certainly not looking to provoke anything......like an invasion of Mexico. Something is missing. Something smells funny about the whole thing. If it is Iran, as I said above (and you ignored), it is because they are looking to poke us into a strike. What would unite the Iranian people behind the leadership more than that?
It's fairly obvious what the Iranians were trying to do. Assassinate two ambassadors in Washington DC and make it look like America is unable to defend even its own ambassadors.
That is not obvious at all. Iran is not in it for propaganda. It is more practical than that. They are aware of our intel capabilities. They have more capability to blow up an ambassador in the Middle East than here. No, they were either not really involved in a serious way or else they were doing this to provoke. Their goal is provocation because they have a domestic agenda. Dont think America is the only country with a domestic agenda. They dont want to make America look anything other than aggressive. They want their own people to consider it a threat. It is the same reason they, despite being separated from Israel by a thousand miles, continue to make statements about Israel. They know it resonates with a portion of their own population. Their reasons are more practical and close at hand than the average American would recognize. It is the same in China. You dont think they took Tibet just because they wanted mountain property do you? Well, no, it is more practical and close at hand. They wanted a buffer between themselves and India. Why do they continue to allow North Korea to exist? Because they want a buffer between them and US forces or a very pro US regime in Korea. So these things are not as simple as that.
Dude, are you for real? First off, you can't believe any of this. The Govt. is infamous for manufacturing consent for War (remember the WMD? Remember the Gulf of Tonkin Resolution?). Here's my take for what it is worth: the U.S. may be laying the groundwork for another military action in the Middle East, either bombing of Iran (which Israel is arguing for) or perhaps an invasion of Yemen which is in the midst of a Civil War and is harboring so called terrorists. This is the goal of the Neo-cons and it looks like with support of the Military Industrial complex, they are having a lot of success. Be very suspicious of unfounded accusations. The govt. can declare this shit but can't prove it. It relies on the media to parrot conclusions that can not be verified.
you forgot: remember 9/11?
Exactly. Also it unites people behind a different common enemy. People will forget the corruption in the government for a while. War with Iran would be huge stupid mistake. Of course it will help the MIC so they would go for it.
Look where Afghanistan and Iraq are and then look in the middle. Some military strategists during the early Bush years thought that by "nation building" Afghanistan and Iraq into democratic nations they could isolate Iran and allow for the invasion of Iran from two fronts if military action ever became necessary. After both wars went to hell, what they accomplished was the destruction of a major regional rival of Iran (Iraq), a marked increase in our national debt, and engendering war weariness among the American electorate. All of which ultimately ended up empowering Iran in the region. The point is people may have been beating the war drums back then, but not anymore considering the realities on the ground.
Anyway this one terrorist plot is not a cause for war anymore than Iran's prolonged state sponsorship of terrorism has been. This isn't new. There is no way the government can sell the American people on starting another war, one that will surely turn out worse than the other two we couldn't manage. Besides, our issue is with the Iranian government, not the people of Iran. Not all Iranians are evil or agree with their government. Research the Green Movement. Starting a war will only help the Iranian government in convincing the region that we are the monsters they say we are.
In five or seven years, we could have troops in Yemen, Kuwait, etc. The American Empire has troops, supposedly, in 175 nations. We are protecting our corporate interests, seeking hegemony in the Middle East is crucial to the West with China and India growing exponentially. India's Middle Class (not exactly comparable to the U.S.) is about the same size of the whole population of the U.S. (some 300+ million) and so is China's. Russia is a major player here as well and has deep ties to Iran. All these countries want we have (consumer goods and all the status and prestige this shit brings...you can not stop it now). China and India need oil and resources. China is everywhere, even deeply in Africa. SO the strategy of the U.S. , England, et al is to be the dominate player in the Middle East and the easiest way to assure Western Control is by a military presence. Iran is a wild card because they border the Persian Gulf and are a threat to Saudi Arabia and the Gulf States. The War would not be a ground war. It would be very selective. Already, we are supporting groups inside Iran but the American public does not know it. You can only imagine what Israel has plans for. This is a war of attrition. I believe the economy here and in parts of the world may collapse next year and then we will have to see what happens. Going to get very nasty and we will be having a very different conversation then.
Why would Iran kill a Saudi diplomat? Really? Diplomats don't make any decisions, and they don't have any power. The whole plot sounds like any one of the bad spam emails I find in my inbox every morning...
Three words
Wag The Dog.
http://warincontext.org/2011/10/12/the-%E2%80%9Cvery-scary%E2%80%9D-iranian-terror-plot/
The “very scary” Iranian terror plot
by News Source on October 12, 2011
Glenn Greenwald writes: The most difficult challenge in writing about the Iranian Terror Plot unveiled yesterday is to take it seriously enough to analyze it. Iranian Muslims in the Quds forces sending maurading bands of Mexican drug cartel assassins onto sacred American soil to commit Terrorism — against Saudi Arabia and possibly Israel — is what Bill Kristol and John Bolton would feverishly dream up while dropping acid and madly cackling at the possibility that they could get someone to believe it. But since the U.S. Government rolled out its Most Serious Officials with Very Serious Faces to make these accusations, many people (therefore) do believe it; after all, U.S. government accusations = Truth. All Serious people know that. And in the ensuing discussion one finds virtually every dynamic typically shaping discussions of Terrorism and U.S. foreign policy.
What I find most hilarious is sending mexican gangbangers, who spray bullets, to do sniper work, which takes military training, to kill... messenger boys.
The government is part of the 99% too. Why can't they Occupy Iran?
No to war with Iran.
If you're a republican or a democrat, you have to answer yes.
Republican, democrat or moron....
People say all kinds of things.
Next they'll say "that's where the weapons of mass destruction have been this whole time!!!!!"
No, no, NO. War with Iran will be chaos in every single way known to man. Let's not get started on the causalities that it will involve, for Iranians and Americans both. Iran is a populated country, there WILL be civilian causalities and Iranian and American soldiers will die.
Now let's say you do the complete option, ground troops and all. Then God help us. The Iranian army is not as weak as Iraq's or the Army the Taliban had in Afghanistan - it will go down but it will not do so lightly and I can see a vicious guerrilla warfare afterwards. And I guarantee, if the Imams believe they're going to be overthrown by America they're going all-out, against Israel as well. Maybe they'll organize f Hamas and Hezbollah to battle Israel. And if you say "Free Iran!" then I say that Iranians will rally to the Imams than be complicit with the invader; Iranians are not known for being collaborators. Look at geography as well, Iran is 3 times the size of Iraq. How do you hold all those areas, with our resources, 2 ongoing wars including one that is causing large problems (Afghanistan)? If Iran decides to unleash the floodgates of hell by creating havoc through opening the borders (they border Iraq and Afghanistan after all) then God have mercy. How about an Iraqi insurgency bolstered by Iranian arms, stolen or given, as well as a Taliban insurgency that has sanctuary in both Pakistan and Iran? An insurgency going from Iraq all the way to Afghanistan will never be controlled, and let's not start on the regional aspects of instability and chaos throughout the world as Muslims become furious seeing a third invasion of a Muslim country, even if Shi'ite.
If you're going for the limited option of airstrikes, then this will still be dangerous. Civilian causalities are large in a country as populated as Iran. Like the ground troop option, they will launch attacks via proxies in Europe, America and Israel and they'll probably help the Taliban (even more if they already do as alleged) to attack America.
Also, oil is going to go up like crazy. War in Iran and fear and instability in the Mid-East will jack up oil prices to probably unprecedented levels (notice how it goes up when Libya is in trouble, a country which provides relatively little amount of oil to the world, or when there were "fears" of protests in Saudi Arabia back in March)
Google Judge Napolitano Fox business. He exposes this as a lie for war and another 17 FBI terror plots
http://www.activistpost.com/2011/10/judge-napolitano-accuses-ag-holder-of.html
Google Judge Napolitano Fox business. He exposes this as a lie for war and another 17 FBI terror plots
http://www.activistpost.com/2011/10/judge-napolitano-accuses-ag-holder-of.html
ALL THAT I ASK IS THAT OWS HAVE A "PLAN" just in case the Obama administration begins to bomb Iran - a plan so as not to be caught "off guard" by an obvious attempt to deflect attention from the crisis at home.
We must think STRATEGICALLY.
silly little rabbit. anyone who has ever played a game of Risk knew the moment we went into iraq, the goal was really iran from the beginning. our path has been predetermined, hold on to your seats!
What scares me is that you might be right.
Do you know what brought the British Empire down? TWO OVERLY COSTLY WARS!!!
And the Roman Empire? Multiple wars ON ALL FRONTS.
Could history be repeating itself?
this is needed actually. many people do not realize but obama cut off funding to dictators in the middle east as soon as he took office. funds that have been setup from the right wing used to take power under the radar and getting them very profitable contracts in those countries. obama cut the money and corruption off. why do you think the right wing power really hates him? they only use race and religion to garner support from suckers.
If you read this http://www.amazon.com/Family-Civilization-Prof-Carle-Zimmerman/dp/1933859377/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1318474099&sr=8-1
You'll see that history is repeating itself.
No thanks, I just had one. Or was it two? Three? Really? Well, no thanks anyway.
Offtopic, people. I know everyone's got an opinion, but there's not a lot to be said from an OWS standpoint on this.
Nope
Cant we just let them kill the Jews and be done with it?
much better idea!
After yesterday's news, I feel that the United States would be justified to launch a strike against the nuclear facility in Iran.
Mind blowing that people with these views still exist.
You were recently identified as a troll.
Another war for Israel. No thanks. Could this be war be used to divide the protest movement? Well, the corporate media has been trying to find a way to fracture and divide it. On the other hand, this war would financially benefit Wall street banks and some corporations at the expense of our soldiers, money, and national honor. After our government lied us into the last war, we the American people lost so much respect and good will in the world.
NO, hell no!
Why wouldn't you want to go war? Helps grow the economy.
The government spending aspect grows the economy. I'd rather our government spend on something productive rather than destructive.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2011/oct/12/unanswered-questions-iranian-assassination-plot
Are you kidding? The sale of weapons should be banned internationally. Dictators would have a lot less control over a population if their aging weapon supply was unable to be repaired.
That takes too long let occupy Iran.
source/link to what you're talking about?
Obama and his corporate cronies will attack Iran! Obama has sold the 99% out! No more! We are not going to accept his lies anymore! Vote him out.
RutherfordBHayes you must be a Zionist
The CIA devised the plot not Iran. The USA plans to over throw all of the middle east and make it like the USA.
LOL! Yeah, like we want that mess.
Not the mess just the oil and control over the people to pump the oil as slave like you who are the OWS slaves.
you've got it