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Forum Post: Anyone notice the trend

Posted 2 years ago on May 20, 2012, 4:25 p.m. EST by dan1984 (108) from Cumberland, MD
This content is user submitted and not an official statement

once again, on the eve of a big event for occupy and the people in general, the police and the FBI find domestic terrorists within the movement. And once again the whole event reeks of entrapment. It's bush-league, psyche-out shit. Laughable man.

28 Comments

28 Comments


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[-] 3 points by TechJunkie (3029) from Miami Beach, FL 2 years ago

The reason that the media tends to focus on the sensational accounts of domestic terrorists instead of Occupy's message during these protest events is that Occupy does not have a coherent message to send, whereas the law enforcement agencies who are investigating the suspected terrorists have spokespeople and media contact points and professional press release writers who can articulate a clear and focused message. A professional PR person's message is going to beat no message any day.

The result is that a simple meme is being repeated nearly daily in the news: Occupy harbors domestic terrorists. Since Occupy would rather defend those accused domestic terrorists than ostracize them, and since there is no other competing message frm Occupy, that becomes Occupy's message: "We support domestic terrorism, because... Why not?"

If you don't send a clear message and define yourself coherently, then other people will do it for you.

[-] 2 points by writerconsidered123 (344) 2 years ago

that's what I ment to say thank you

[-] 2 points by Endgame (535) 2 years ago

TechJunkie you speak so much damn truth with what you just said.

The more people in Occupy that starts to realize this the sooner they get their act together.

WE are part of the problem with the media coverage we receive. Of course there are a lot of lies spread about the movement. But part of the problem is exactly what you just laid out. We need a coherent message and we need to articulate better what we're about and call out the extremists so everyone know they do not represent Occupy.

[-] 1 points by MattLHolck (16833) from San Diego, CA 2 years ago

i'm fine with the frontpage coherency

except that bus trip that dis me

[-] -1 points by VQkag (930) 2 years ago

OWS repudiates violence of all kind especially that which is perpetrated against peaceful protesting 99%'rs. we are a peaceful movement.

[+] -5 points by danzer (-51) 2 years ago

You're a bowel movement.

[-] -2 points by VQkag (930) 2 years ago

thats not really a clear sentence. wanna try again?

[-] 1 points by MattLHolck (16833) from San Diego, CA 2 years ago

just a subject no doubt referencing the blockage in the government to become peaceful

sometime adjective directions make a difference

[-] -1 points by danzer (-51) 2 years ago

you and your group of useful idiots are a stinking pile.

[-] -3 points by VQkag (930) 2 years ago

I suppose being useful is something anyway. Do you support NDAA?

[-] 1 points by Nevada1 (4835) 2 years ago

Agree.

[-] 1 points by fiftyfourforty (1077) from New York, NY 2 years ago

http://www.upstatefilms.org/weather/main.html

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LV7GSff4fIA

In October 1969 hundreds of young people, clad in football helmets and wielding lead pipes, marched through an upscale Chicago shopping district, pummeling parked cars and smashing shop windows in their path.

This was the first demonstration of the Weather Underground's "Days of Rage." Outraged by the Vietnam War and racism in America, the organization waged a low-level war against the U.S. government through much of the 1970s, bombing the Capitol building, breaking Timothy Leary out of prison, and evading one of the largest FBI manhunts in history.

The Weather Underground is a feature-length documentary that explores the rise and fall of this radical movement, as former members speak candidly about the idealistic passion that drove them to "bring the war home" and the trajectory that placed them on the FBI's most wanted list.

"Hello, I'm going to read a declaration of a state of war...within the next 14 days we will attack a symbol or institution of American injustice." ~ Bernardine Dohrn

Thirty years ago, with those words, a group of young American radicals announced their intention to overthrow the U.S. government. In THE WEATHER UNDERGROUND, former Underground members, including Bernardine Dohrn, Bill Ayers, Mark Rudd, David Gilbert and Brian Flanagan, speak publicly about the idealistic passion that drove them to "bring the war home" and the trajectory that placed them on the FBI's most wanted list.

Fueled by outrage over racism and the Vietnam War, the Weather Underground waged a low-level war against the U.S. government through much of the 1970s--bombing targets across the country that they considered emblematic of the real violence that the U.S. was wreaking throughout the world. Ultimately, the group's carefully organized clandestine network managed to successfully evade one of the largest manhunts in FBI history, yet the group's members would reemerge to life in a country that was dramatically different than the one they had hoped their efforts would inspire. Extensive archival material, including, photographs, film footage and FBI documents are interwoven with modern-day interviews to trace the group's path, from its pitched battles with police on Chicago's streets, to its bombing of the U.S. Capitol, to its successful endeavor breaking acid-guru Timothy Leary out of prison. The film explores the Weathermen in the context of other social movements of the time and features interviews with former members of the Students for a Democratic Society (SDS) and the Black Panthers. It also examines the U.S. government's suppression of dissent in the 1960s and 1970s.

Looking back at their years underground, the former members paint a compelling portrait of troubled times, revolutionary times, and the forces that drove their resistance.

THE WEATHER UNDERGROUND is a production of the Free History Project, produced in association with KQED Public Television/San Francisco and ITVS.

+++++++++++++++++++

When all was said and done the Weather Underground was a movement of symbolic protest that never threatened to overthrow any government. I don't know the legal story of how several of them ended up not in jail at all, and in fact as respectable citizens. a conspiracist just might speculate on that...

[-] 0 points by penguento (362) 2 years ago

Everyone should go here and have a read. Mark Rudd is former member of the Weather Underground. He's been there and done it, and had a long time to think about it. OWS -- particularly anyone that condones or excuses the violence -- can learn a lot from him:

http://www.markrudd.com/

[-] 0 points by penguento (362) 2 years ago

Or, it could be that the movement is attracting people who like to blow things up. That happened during the 60's and 70's. Some folks thought the protest movement was a great excuse to try and blow up a few things and kill a few people. That sort of person's still around, and OWS isn't immune.

[-] 1 points by dan1984 (108) from Cumberland, MD 2 years ago

The only people blowing things up in the sixties and seventies were the kkk. And it was mostly rural, African American churches. The police were pretty violent then too.

[-] 1 points by penguento (362) 2 years ago

Not hardly, friend. Bombings and bank robberies by leftist activists were a commonplace. Remember Patty Hearst and the SLA?

[-] 1 points by dan1984 (108) from Cumberland, MD 2 years ago

I don't remember because I wasn't alive yet. And I see your point. No one side is ever completely blameless. But the role of the police in this particular instance is far from innocent.

[-] 2 points by penguento (362) 2 years ago

Over-reaction by the cops is another matter. They've got folks on their side that are also just looking for an excuse to kick a little ass. OWS will do nicely.

The problem for both sides is that any sort of confrontational social scene attracts a certain sort of person who's not interested in the values of the movement (or in law enforcement, or whatever), they're looking for a vehicle that justifies their own violent tendencies and offers them an excuse to act out on them. As convenient, they become thug cops, or thug revolutionaries or thug whatever group happens to be available. So, in the 30's the Soviets had the NKVD. In the 40's Germany had the SS. in the early 60's you had thug cops beating up civil rights demonstrators. In the late 60's and early 70's you had violent leftists planting bombs, robbing banks and shooting people. In the 90's you had violent anti-abortionists planting bombs and murdering people. And now you've got some violent folks trying to infiltrate OWS and use the protest movement as a justification for assaulting people, planting bombs and killing innocent people.

In all of these cases, whatever movement or group they're associated with is nothing more to them than a vehicle for committing violence. If it had been convenient to them, they'd be on the other side committing violence, or in some other group committing violence. For them, the violence is the point, not the movement's goals.

In all cases, the group that they are infiltrating has a vested interest in cleansing itself of them. Thug cops discredit the moral authority of government. Thug protesters discredit the protest movement to which they attach themselves. And in both cases, the innocent and ethical people of the group have their own reputation besmirched by the activities of the thugs. And when that happens, the movement itself runs the risk of being marginalized and discredited.

[-] 1 points by dan1984 (108) from Cumberland, MD 2 years ago

Real terrorists or not, they have already discredited the movement because of the media's willingness to soak it up. And that was my original point. The majority of people will never support the movement because they're afraid of it. And that is exactly what the people that OWS are protesting want. Fear is their biggest weapon.

[-] 2 points by MattLHolck (16833) from San Diego, CA 2 years ago

humans are successful because they help each other

[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (22358) from Coon Rapids, MN 2 years ago

I like that.

Human = biped mammal helpful and supportive in small numbers ( 2 ) or large groups ( infinite )

Monster = biped mammal greedy selfish only looking out for self destructive to those around it ( harmful in numbers starting at 1 ).

[-] 1 points by penguento (362) 2 years ago

I agree. The taint from that sort of thing can be fatal, now more than ever, what with 24 hour news, too many talking heads on cable with too much time to kill and nothing to say, and all the rest.

[-] 0 points by writerconsidered123 (344) 2 years ago

Thank you, one sane person around here. the evidence with these 3 men is not good. Is it possible that evidence was planted? yes but not likely.

If OWS wants to support these 3 men then they are going to take hit from public perception. In fact what OWS needs to do is distance themselves from these men. And reiterate to the media there commitment to non-violence. Otherwise the whole movment could be lost.

[-] 1 points by penguento (362) 2 years ago

Were it me, I'd publicly denounce them and their tactics, and offer to cooperate with the investigation. The message needs to go both to the public and to others like these guys that OWS is not a refuge for them.

[-] 0 points by jimmycrackerson (940) from Blackfoot, ID 2 years ago

Yeah fuck fighting for change. We should all just sit around holding hands in a drum circle singing kumbaya. That will produce real results.

But seriously, If I'm going to get arrested and charged regardless, I might as well make a serious effort in fight or flight. Not playing dead and having the popo drag my limp body to his car.

"When governments fear the people, there is liberty. When the people fear the government, there is tyranny." -Barney the Dinosaur

[-] 0 points by VQkag (930) 2 years ago

Non violence is our most potent weapon. violence is what the 1% wants us to do. They know how to deal with it. Its in their manual. In fact whichever side gets the other to perpetrate violence (on camera) first will win the sympathy of the masses. Find a way to get the police to beat us on camera without clear, provable provocation of police. Its the only way. We have to get beaten. Maybe even die!

[-] 1 points by MattLHolck (16833) from San Diego, CA 2 years ago