Answering Egypt's Call for Solidarity
Posted 12 years ago on Nov. 26, 2011, 9:56 a.m. EST by OccupyWallSt
On November 22, occupiers of Tahrir Square issued an urgent call for global solidarity, asking the world to:
Occupy / shut-down Egyptian embassies worldwide. Now they represent the junta ; reclaim them for the Egyptian people.
Shut down the arms dealers. Do not let them make it, ship it.
- Shut down the part of your government dealing with the Egyptian junta.
The Occupy movement is answering their call. Yesterday, hundreds marched on the Egyptian consulate in New York City.
In NYC today (Saturday, Nov 26), an Egyptian solidarity rally will begin at 1 PM at the Egypt Mission (East 44th St & 2nd Ave), with a march at 4PM.
An action is also being planned for Thursday, December 1st in front of a tear gas plant in Jamestown, Pennsylvania that has been supplying the Egyptian military junta. Participants from Occupy camps across the Northeast region will gather outside of the plant, which is owned by Combined Systems International.
As put by one call to action:
"[CSI] tear gas canisters have littered the streets of Cairo. CSI and their allies in the U.S. State Department, who must approve the sales of their weapons to foreign governments, are complicit in crimes against humanity. ... "They are sponsoring terror against the egyptian people," says a comrade in Cairo. "...the US is partly responsible for this."
We will make sure the people of Egypt hear our message; We are with you, our government's actions to not represent the desires of our people, and we will take action against businesses and institutions that aid in the repression of our movements; We will defend the Egyptian revolution!
For more information about the Dec. 1st action, including information on carpooling from other locations in the area, visit this Facebook event page.
a US-made tear gas canister used in Egypt
To emphasize the critical need for action to support our Egyptian comrades (whose bravery in the face of oppression was one of the key inspirations for the Occupy movement), here is more from their statement:
The future of the revolution hangs in the balance; those of us in the square are ready to die for freedom and social justice. The butchers attacking us are willing to kill us to stay in control.
This is not about elections or a constitution, neither of which will change the authoritarianism and violence coming down around us. Neither is this is about a so-called “transition” to democracy that has seen the consolidation of a military junta and the betrayal of the revolution by political forces. This is about a revolution, a complete revolution. The people demand the fall of the regime, and will stop at nothing short of that to achieve their freedom.
Egyptian military defector: ‘I saw people dying and the army gave the orders for us to stand and watch’ – video
Speaking next to an open window that looks out on to Tahrir Square, Major Tamer Samir Badr says he now feels it is his duty to protect ‘these people who are fighting for our rights’. The 37-year-old claims many officers have been attending the protests secretly in civilian clothes.
More @ http://beyondrevolution.wordpress.com/2011/11/26/egyptian-military-officers-defecting-to-protesters/
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Mr. Grown Up, I have a job, I have an education and I don't bathe, I shower. Too much bacteria in the tub and if u dump a ton of Clorox in there first and rinse it, you still run a chance of having ur skin dried out. Maybe your ass is chapped and that's why your so bitter. You should reconsider your methods of hygiene. This country is a democracy and just as you said, there are laws that need to be obided by, within the last...oh I dunno since reagan was president, the govement decided who would and would not have to obide by those laws. Did you know that the last generation that was prepared, education wise, to become doctors and lawyers, the kind of people who change the world was born between 1980 and 1985. That's per the new England journal of medicine. Isnt that scary? Would YOU say that the united states in the last 30 years have followed what our founding fathers, great leaders and men and women who have made the ultimate sacrifice set forth and tried to build? If you really thought about it...people like you would say that was "socialism." if we were a CAPITOLIST country by initial intent when Boston went crazy because the king increased taxes on their tea, we would still be paying taxes to England. CAPITOLISM: every man for themselves right? Then why in gods name do we have a military and tell them they're fighting for our ideals? CAPITOLISM.... So when I go in to see my patients Monday morning, I should change their medications so that they won't respond to them or even better,make them more ill this way they have to come back more often, generates more office visits, I'll figure out what patients have the worst insurances and make sure I fill their spots with the ones who have insurance tht pays and I'll be BANKING! Wow I dont know why I didn't think of this before! Oh! That's right! Because my mother was a single mother who didn't have an education and went back to school at 35 to set an example for me, all while she worked 3 jobs and u know what else? We were on Medicaid and welfare and food stamps! GASP! Did u just grab ur chest? She made sure I got the best education I could and went to sleep hungry most nights.
For "thegrownup" you have a lot of growing up to do. I'm sure a lot of people will read your posts and it will anger them, but it doesn't anger me. I feel sorry for you. Your obviously ignorant and your mind is a tiny box. You never saw struggle or were dealt a bad hand. You never looked up an said "what's next? What else is gunna happen" while u wait for the next shoe to drop. You probably don't appreciate all that you have. I would rather smell and homeless and in a park with hundreds of other people and be beaten by nypd than have your mentality. I came from nothing. My mother and I had nothing. While I was in college, going to nyu full time and then spending the rest of the day doing clinical internship, my husband and I had nothing. My husband came from nothing, took out student loans because his school promised him job placement. He completed his degree, graduated did externship and no job placement. He can't use his degree anywhere and has 45k in student loans.
We work hard, we always have. We've been paying taxes since I was 15 years old. My mothers degree in psychology, she can't use it. 10k student loan is now $70k. And I'm sure someone like you is thinking "well...that's her own fault, she should have paid the 10k" 10k to a single mom who is getting no help other than public assistance is impossible, her parents were uneducated, but street smart, no one ever taught her. All the struggle I've gone through and things I've seen... Being judged and labeled when you know nothing of that struggle shows ur ignorance. So do us all a favor and grow up.
dispariaging protester
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OWS is now proving the power of unity around the world in support of this issue! The proof shown on this page and the link provided by bmxusa showing the Israeli flag flown in front of the company manufacturing tear gas in PA, shipped overseas and used against protestors, should be front page news! But it won't be thanks to all the media owned and controlled by international bankers who are the root of the problem!
All of you are creating history and I honor you for your continued dedication!
Here's a link from 11/23/11 addressing the financial game, the lies, and fraud, are coming to an end: http://market-ticker.org/akcs-www?post=198023
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Check out the flags flown by CSI (Combined Tactical) Headquarters in Jamestown Pennsylvania:
http://adalahny.org/press-releases-other/1-21-11-update-tear-gas-death-triggers-mobilization-against-israel-s-lethal-tear-gas
Let demand the USA goverement frezee all egypcian assest and suspend all finacial assitant to the military junta.
There is a web page at http://teargasid.wordpress.com/ which displays a picture of a tear gas canister labeled
Federal Laboratories, Inc. Saltsburg, Pennyslvania 15681, U.S.A. MADE IN U.S.A. ? MFG. 1987 MK II
This is a different manufacturer, also located in the far western part of Pennsylvania.
So far, I haven't seen specific evidence that either Pennsylvania manufacturer produced the CR gas described in news reports ( http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2011/nov/23/egyptian-military-teargas-tahrir-square?newsfeed=true ). Production only of CS gas accepted (however wrongly) for use in "crowd control" in the U.S. and other countries may merit a more measured response than the outraged call for international justice which should rightly fall on anyone producing CR, CN, or other peculiar and more dangerous gas weapons that stray further into the realm of chemical weaponry. Accumulating and disseminating hard evidence and technical facts on these issues is vital. One thing that is all too clear is that very old CS gas is being used in Egypt - better documentation of this toxicity is also needed.
Que se vayan todos!- Slogan from Argentina's revolution meaning all of them must go. Watch Naomi Klein's documentary on the revolution calle La Toma (the take) @ http://beyondrevolution.wordpress.com/2011/10/27/la-toma-the-take-by-naomi-klein/
Perhaps the Egyptians should follow suit and reclaim the factories (and the other businesses there)
If you guys really want to be in solidarity with the Egyptians, you should first learn to protest like them. They protest on the streets, not sidewalks. They don't only shout slogans, they take actions. They fight with the police, instead of getting pushed about by the police. They are prepared to fight anyone, including the army. They are prepared to die for what they believe in.
We should try to outsmart the police, not play their game. Non-violent tactics work in our favor. Violence and escalation do not.
We should be looking into using technology more on the ground. Swarming, flash mobs, etc. coordinated through SMS or foursquare to regroup quickly away from the police density. Let them keep following us, and when they catch up, we go to another location. Think of the (first) American Revolutionaries using retreat and camouflage to their advantage. Let's try to invent new tactics and strategies. We have to be aware, however, that the way we are set up, we are an open book to the anyone that wants to read it. There are advantages to that, but there are also disadvantages. Personally I think the advantages outweigh the disadvantages, but we should always be cognizant of this.
The game must be reasonable. A goal must be true. And the rules should be legal. Then, and not need will cheat.
How?
And it - base of pre-election program.
Brilliant suggestion. Has been used by guerilla fighters and revolutionaries all over the world. Leveraging ones power.
We can argue tactics forever. But the root of the problem is not with this or that political system. The problem is with people, the way we think, what we value and how we treat each other- and it seems to make little difference if we are rich or poor, the fundamental flaw is still there.
One writer explains that we have to see the human condition for what it is before we can even begin to think of real change. But, he says, few wish to see this.
Read: "The Seekers Who Will Not See" at www.josephcouture.com
Okay, soooooo... we are generally a flawed bunch. Is there anything that can be done to make things better. I think so, I hope so, and does it do any harm to try? Well there is a risk that in so doing things will get worse. And there is a risk that things will get worse if you, me and/or others try to make some changes.
That things have been better in my memory than they are now provides some hope that they could get better. I am willing to take the risk of trying. But you may or you may not. It is up to you I have been making suggestions of tactics and strategies that I believe will work and reading others, as well. Many people seem to have a sincere interest. I would settle for that right now.
All true and even more reason to blaze a new trail. People don't wake up when the choices before them don't change.
Yes. It seems to me that sincerity and new ideas are exactly what we need right now.
I am Egyptian and thank you very much to the American's who are supporting us and in solidarity with us. As for Revrevrev I do not think the fights will help anyone God Bless all the soul that have died in these protest and I wish to thank the little kids in the US also trying to support us. It is not good to tell them to fight with the police or the army we are not thugs. are you revrevrev? Anyway I feel Egypt will feel peace and get what they want. Freedom and without suffering even through all this we would just like to let the people in this picture know we also are in Solidarity with your Freedoms there and your suffering Great Picture with Love to you all and God Bless you from me Islam Mohamed from Alexandria Abosolemen Egypt.
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"I wish to thank the little kids in the US". So that's how the Egyptians look upon the US protesters. "It is not good to tell them to fight with the police or the army we are not thugs. are you revrevrev?" Are you saying those protesters in Tunisia, Libya, Egypt and now Syria are all nothing but thugs because they fight back? If you want to bring about changes, you have to be prepared to deal forcefully with the forces which are maintaining and defending the status quo.
OWS has done all of these things, albeit with less frequency and on a much smaller scale.
The heroes in Tahrir have numbered in the millions at one time.
We can't hold a candle to them. Yet.
Not while nearly half of our adult population is made up of compulsive and depraved shoppers. 152 million of them on this Black Friday throwing their money at the corporations that have outsourced entire industries robbing millions of Americans of the opportunity to make a living wage and in that process decimated entire towns and cities while enriching the sweat shop owners in China, India and other countries around the world.
They, like all revolutionaries in history, did not start off in millions. They grow from a few to millions. They attract supporters because people can see that they are committed to their cause, are even willing to sacrifice their lives to it. Look what happened to those who stood up for you, the authoress and the retired police officer. While they were being arrested, all you folks did was to shout at the police with "Shame on you". Actually, the shame is on you guys. You did nothing for people who stood up for you.
The demonstrations in Tahrir reached millions of people within a couple weeks, and they greatly outnumbered the police during the clashes with them.
The circumstances and social forces at work in these two cases are not the same.
The NYPD outnumbers us by a few ten thousand and (unlike Egypt's riot police) are always equipped with firearms.
We have used the tactic of "unarresting" people before, in situations when it was actually possible to succeed.
I was there when Captain Lewis was arrested. If any one had attempted to unarrest him he would have condemned them for doing such a silly futile thing. We actually talked to him at length and it was his purpose to engage in civil disobedience and understood that doing so meant he was likely going to be arrested. He wanted us to be sure it was filmed and circulated to the media.
I understand that total non-violence is a dead end. But to employ force foolishly and in cases where it cannot result in victory, works against our goals. It's just as unrealistic as absolute pacifism.
Please try not to jump to conclusions when you don't know that reality of the situation on the ground.
Another hothead glamorizing VIOLENCE???
OWS is committed to NON-VIOLENCE.
I hope that the Egyptian revolution that Occupy is supporting is pushing for a secular and non-oppressive government. A government that is aligned with any religion will be as, if not more, restrictive on the rights of its citizens. I urge you to offer your support with that caveat.
Support also calls for you to exercise some skepticism when confronted with propaganda coming from Israeli diplomats/corporate shills who seek to smear the revolution.
A democratic Egypt doesn't serve the Geo-strategic interests of the empire. This is why the US supported Mubarak's criminal dictatorship with money/weapons (and continues to bribe the ruling military council.)
Are you saying that there is not a Muslim Brotherhood political party in Egypt that is expected to do very well in the upcoming election?
From what I understand, most of the protesters are separate from the Brotherhood. Just be careful who you are supporting. That is all.
I'm saying support for the Muslim Brotherhood is greatly exaggerated. Israel is producing doctored poll results on the subject. My roommate is Egyptian (and an atheist) who was in Tahrir square. He translates real sources for me, and is perfectly aware of what is going on back home. The youth movement and others are dead set against letting the MB take over. They do not represent the revolution.
Furthermore, as insane as the MB are, and as awful as it would be for them to get any real power, some of the things being said are just hysteria.
They are not the same thing as Al-Qaeda.
That'd be like comparing the Republican party to the KKK---neither are good, and they do have some overlap, but they are not exactly the same thing.
dispariaging half of americans as depraved
Just posted a new song and video about the Occupy Movement, the Arab Spring, and all struggles against colonization and oppression. Interwoven are images of OWS, Oakland, and Egypt. Please share: http://youtu.be/XYjP8Fgn1Js
Over the entire world people are rising up against tyranny - concentration of wealth and power. Amazing to see all this engagement and activism. From The Middle East, to the Occupy Movement now spreading all over the world.
Occupy Earth
The Transition Phase: The Road to Freedom
The Society We Should Strive For
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YftlB3AxBws
yours struggleforfreedom
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When the American revolutionaries went to battle for their independence from British rule they did not have a clear idea of the kind of government they would create. This did not stop them from their fight for liberation so that they could exercise their self determination. Self determination is an ongoing process. It is never complete. Your statement reflects a deeply bigoted mindset. Our country was founded by Christians and to this day Christianity is the religion of the majority. There are many hateful sects in the Christian denominations. Christians throughout their history have justified mass murder in their crusades, witch hunts, the destructive elimination of all native religions to make way for the expansion of the western empires. Could it be your Christian guilt that colors your lens. There are vile individuals all over the world. They are not exclusive members of any one religion.
All people have a right to self determination within their own borders. Due to our irresponsible permission of private campaign donations to legislative candidates our US government from its inception has been an indentured servant of the elite: the millionaires and billionaires in our country. Our Constitution protects their rights but not the rights of working individuals, the overwhelming majority of our population. As a consequence our government has been and is continuously pursuing the interests of these super rich on a global scale. The history of the past 150 years portrays a country with a huge military complex ready to go to war on behalf of this elite. Our military is continuously engaged in waging a war, over or covert on behalf of this 1%.
Stop spreading your imperialistic perspective as well as your overt hatred of Muslims!
The dilemma--IMHO--is about creating a society based on co operation, sustainability, and equal access of opportunity across the board. The ruling class can only be restrained so far...regulation will always be fought against by the parasitic class. So what is to be done? I don't know, but history has shown that the elites have to be disarmed or eliminated; they will fight tooth and nail to maintain their power and privilege. Anyone care to weigh in?
To your point: Agree on all counts! It is noteworthy and reflective of the Western mindset that even a scientific theory like the theory of evolution is explained in terms of survival of the fittest, i..e. competition for domination. What if the fundamental of evolution were to be examined from the perspective of cooperation both within species and across species?
Cooperatives are the most democratic business model. All members are owners of the cooperative. There are no shares and every member has an equal access to the elected governing body as well as an equal voice in determining fundamental positions within the cooperative. The cooperative movement was big in Eastern Europe before the Russians moved in and imposed Communism to confiscate the wealth of the local communities and their cooperatives.
In corporations the number of shares determines if one has a voice in the fundamental decisions and choices made by the Board, CEO and top level executives as well as having direct access to the Chairman and CEO. The corporate model breeds elitism and a top down hierarchical order. .
You make many assumptions without having any information. I'm sure I am not the first to point that out to your throughout your life.
Christian guilt? deeply bigoted mindset? imperialistic perspective? hatred of Muslims? You must be the life of a party, that is if anyone ever invites you to one.
the Muslim Brotherhood is a strong force in Egypt. They have already announced they will set aside the peace treaty between Egypt and Israel and begin the process of having Sharia law become the law of Egypt. Sharia law is not really a strong proponent of minority rights and equal rights for women, but you don't really care do you?
Questioning the change of government for a major force in the Middle East is not hatred, bigotry or racism. It is common sense, something you seem to lack.
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Agree with the first part.
Just because you show solidarity with people in Egypt fighting tyranny, doesnt mean you have to agree with them on everything.
Yet if anyone disagrees on ANY point with OWS, they are branded a troll and a one-percenter etc etc. Do as I say, not as I do, right?
This has not been my experience!
Of course you wouldn't. You are the one hurling the insults.
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For the People of Egypt.
Details (in Russian):
http://www.rb.ru/blog/peretyatkov/showentry=1534744
At least the tear gas wasn't made in China, it would probably be over the minimum required amount of lead
In Egypt it is really Wall Street, through their owned CIA, Pentagon and Department of State, who are calling the shots. Literally.
They will not settle for a No Thank You to the IMF. Too much at stake for the global Central Bank to let Egypt determine it's own course. Iceland hurt, because they showed the world that you don't have to cow tow to the IMF.
Suppor you,warriors!
Some good points made here. One thing to note: check your spelling on Capitalism. Otherwise, some interesting points, well made.
The most important division of Wall Street is the war division, the first generator of profit, the industrial-military complex, the pentagon contractors. The fight will be long and hard, but the 99 % will win. It is just a matter of time until Americans wake up. They will not sleep forever. Best wishes from Alicante, Spain.
For Americans to wake up may take an unprecedented tragedy or a miracle. My call is for Miracles! With a 152 million compulsive shoppers trampling each other to surrender their money to the very people who are enriching themselves at their expense does not paint a portrait of hope.
Egypt Revolt at the center of wide social chaos
http://www.quinterna.org/lingue/english/articles_en/egypt_revolt.htm
This is a bit off-track but isn't there something inherently wrong with the way we, the U.S., demands that the military industrial complex continues to grow? Should increases in manufacturing and profits for the primary corporations manufacturing weapons, fighter planes, etc...be viewed as a positive? In the U.S. the growth of this industry has been held as a republican sacred cow. Hawkish democrats are likewise not shy about advocating for the growth of the military industrial complex.
For companies like Lockheed Martin over 100k Iraqi's killed and over 4k American killed equaled out to about $25 billion strictly in profits and over $100 billion in revenues over the course of the last 10 years of war. That is mostly coming from American tax dollars. Like any other capitalistic corporation Lockheed is under extreme pressure to maintain a state of perpetual growth. I don't know what the stats are for Lockheed in particular but generally speaking a growth rate of 1-2 % is their minimum goal. The Boeing Company, for example, the third largest military manufacturer, has seen sales go up steadily over the past decade even in middle of the recession.
The point of the matter is obviously war should not be measure in dollars and cents. There is something inherently evil about a society that has made the growth of the war industry an essential element of a healthy economy. Perpetual growth for the complex means perpetual growth of the category of people labeled by the mainstream media as our "enemies". Do we have a large enough supply of enemies to keep up with the demand that the growth of the military industrial complex dictates? Has the mainstream media demonized enough races and nations to keep up with the demand? Occupy itself is quickly being labeled as a possible new source of "enemies" to keep up with their demand. Where does it end? Are there enough enemies to maintain perpetual growth of our military?
Perpetual growth is something that can occur only on the spiritual platform. It seems like a realistic idea, something to shoot for, because it does exist in spiritual reality but it is nothing but a fantasy in the material world.
Anyhow, in the coming months they are going to debate fiercely in congress over how much they are going to cut from the defense budget. The republicans will fight tooth and nail to avoid any cuts at all. Shrinking the complex for them would be a form of impotence. The military industrial complex is in fact a direct extension of the hawk's penis. So he/she won't let it be shrunk without a huge fight.
Occupy does have the power to bring this issue to the forefront and it belongs there. A majority of Americans are tired of the hawks always getting there way. The growth of the military industry should not be seen as an essential component for a healthy American economy. It is an essential component for a healthy 1% and the destruction of the middle class. The American people have got to take a stand against the hawks. It is time for them to be declawed and debeaked.
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@thegrownup republican capitolst; apparently you have been out of school for some time and must have forgotten basic American history. We the people of the UNITED states of America; in order to form a more perfect union establish justice, insure a domestic tranquility, provide common defense and promote the general welfare and secure Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our posterity do ordain this constitution for the united states of America....we hold these truths to be self evident that all men are created equal. They are endowed by their creator with certain unalianable rights. That amount these are life liberty and the pursuit of happiness. With that said..Give us your tired, your poor, your huddled masses yearning to breath free. The wretched refuse of your teeming shore. Send these, the homeless, the tempest-toast to me. I lift my lamp beside the golden door.
Welcome to the United States of America Mr. TheGrownUp
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About the violence .... Ghandi freed a whole country from the British Empire with the power of his own example , Marthin Luther King did the same . They were assasinated by interests that pursue ..... money and power . So they pepper sprayed us , clubbed us and so on .... there are things far worse than this . A dream is born .... and history follows.
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Combined Tactical Systems
388 Kinsman Road
Jamestown, PA 16134
Phone # 724-932-2177
FAX # 724-932-2166
Flood em with 'no more tears'
Great resource Jimmy, I'll get right on it Monday morning...sick bastards.
Yeah, I thought it might be funny to flood their faxes with this picture:
http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_UVPacgpIQLc/TJ6NohCxmEI/AAAAAAAACSI/wUqUNojQNPI/s1600/no-more-tears.jpg
And maybe their mail boxes with the physical product
a solid smart meaningfull demonstration. this is a crucial action, weve been letting our government support death and violence in the middle east for too long, in this internet day and age the people are informed enough to prevent it
Suggestion for flag, banner, slogan for Tahrir square, as message for the generals: "Generals should fight Wall Street, not Egypians"
what about violence against property? there is a great potential for low level sabotage. if it moves jam it, if its a wire cut it, if wireless jam it! what can we learn from the heroic french resistance fighting a fascist army!? if its electrical flood it. if its computer equipment pour paint on it! sugar in petrol, sand in moving parts. we are not trained in violence and brainwashed into inhumanity to be able to fight the army and police. just make sure you cost money for the system. CHANT DOWN BABYLON!! be of good cheer, babylon will fall and we will win. welcome the increasing homeless and unemployed and train them in RESISTANCE.
The world is in the mist of a revolution. 2011 will go down as the year of revolutions.The young people and many others are madder than hell and aren't going to take it anymore. However it's important to conduct your revolution in a manner that will yield the desireable results. As much as the Middle East revolutions have really changed things in their country's politics the America revolution is turning into nothing more than a sit-in. We need to change this revolution to get results. We can't just shout at those that are financially abusing us. They will just ignore us and our demands. But what are our demands? So far this is a revolution without direction. Read my web page at www.mybetteramericaplan.com because on my Current Events section are ideas on how to make this revolution a success. We are going to have to legally shut down the Wall Street Stock Exchange until laws, regulations and policies are initiated that will end the financial abuse that the rich do to us. The Republicans have been stealing from us for 30 years and now we MUST steal the next election. We MUST move registered voters from states that we are sure to win and from states that we are sure to lose and move them into states where it will be a tight race. Don't be mad at the Democrats for the condition of our country. The Republicans have messed up America and will mess it up more if they completly control our government. If the RepubliCONS win the next election they will extend the Bush tax cuts forever, make abortions illegal forever, end many safety and environmental regulations forever and cause more misery than they have already for us all. Is that what YOU want! VOTE the Republicans out of office because it is the only way for your lives to get better.
On the subject of psychotic military regimes: It was reported a few hours ago that "Israel warned on Saturday that it would cut the supply of water and electricity to the Gaza Strip if rival Palestinian movements Fatah and Hamas form a unity government."
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Please join and save the world
http://gce5.org/
OWS makes the good case that the drug war should be called quits because enforcement does not stop the illegal drug trade. How do you figure that the world can come together to stop the flow of arms if it cannot stop the flow of drugs?
That amoung these* damn auto correct
@thegr
Spring should be interesting ....
By spring we'll be foraging for grubs and shoots.
I sure as hell hope not.
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global solidarity against the global fascist tyranny! global solidarity against the christian muslim war. global solidarity against the male leadership of both religions. global solidarity in the global village of OUR ETERNAL COMMUNITY. global solidarity against the fascist media propaganda. against the perpetual war on terror! against the evil brutality of the freemason uniformed thugs the HATED POLICE. both the bible and the koran end with cannabis growing everywhere. cannabis growing everywhere is the end of the bible and the koran. the end of mind control of the men and suppression of the women. FIND JOY IN THE ETERNAL. now that we've found love what are we going to do with it?
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The root of the problem is the governments & politicians that enable the greed of corporates. If legislation were in place that made this kind of exploitation illegal - or at least limited it (since capitalism is based on exploitation), then we might all be a little happier. No point blaming Wall St or big Corporates - they will not change as long as they are keeping within the law. Who makes the law - the government. THAT is where OWS should focus their efforts, not on Wall St or subway users or people who can not effect change. It is so simple, yet OWS members seem so blind to what is right in front of them. Very frustrating.
Jimmy, when our government is made up of puppets, it only makes sense to shed light on the puppeteers first.
Our government has been bought by the very people who destroyed our economy, and flushed our prosperity down the toilet.
When we can only donate $2,500 to a political campaign, and multinational corporations can donate endless millions, we have no voice.
Our laws are not written by our puppet legislators. They are dictated by lobbyists and corporate giants, for their own selfish gains.
Continue to expose government corruption, and continue to shine bright lights on those who are corrupting it.
Shining lights on Wall St and Corporates will not change that. It's perfectly legal. Point the spotlight at them and they'll say, "So what? I'm not doing anything illegal." Which is why protesting them achieves nothing. other than creating awareness. You create awareness and people will grumble about the rich, but nothing will change - they're not doing anything wrong. You spotlight the politicians enabling this behavior and you do it to an extent that they get voted out of office, THEN you might start affecting change - the next guy in line for the job will think twice about abusing his or her position, and maybe, just maybe, we'll start to see fairness.
That's my opinion, and to me it seems the more logical approach with the greater chance of success. Beating the drum over someone operating within the law will achieve little. It's the laws that need to change (and that includes the donation limits etc as you mentioned).
You both are right. You can't focus on one side of this mess and leave the other alone. It takes two to tango. The best way to go about this is to focus on both sides and find the connections between the two. Cut the cords between the two and then go after both our corrupt government and the people corrupting it. They feed on one another. That's how both sides have gotten so powerful. In less you cut the ties that bind one side will support the other and the cycle continue.
That works too :) Thanks for the comment.
Changing the law is a very slow process even for those who are already in government. How long do you think it will take to have the numbers in the Senate and Congress to change enough laws to bring about systemic change?
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I do find it ironic that I get negative votes on here for expressing the same goal but with what I think is clearly a more proactive approach. Again - so many here are just like sheep - if you don't follow the OWS line to the letter, you are a troll etc., and my experience on this website has proven that to be true over and over. If you want change, you need to be willing to listen, otherwise you are no better then those you rage against. This is a lesson most OWS members appear to be unable to understand, sadly.
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Much Love to my very brave Egyptian Brothers and Sisters. I send you my Love, Light, prayers and Peace. I admire you ALL so very greatly for standing up for your freedoms and rights. Thank you for inspiring us here in the US to come together, like you guys, and Occupy. Together we can change the world; peseverance and Unity will do wonderous things. It's now or never, we will win, we will have true freedom. <3
A song for OWS... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4FM3KR9dEOk
The world is waking up! What a wonderful time to be alive. We have the power of numbers. Please visit this site. It is such a timely message. www.thrivemovement.com. This embodies everhtying that the Occupy movement is about. All the facts are here so you can follow the money. We have the power to change the world! Let us unite and bring real lasting important change. I love you all.
GA.
This is the second time, I wrote this message regarding the strategy of Occupy Wallstreet. This movement is something very important in the history of the United States and probably in the history of the World. If you want to reach some change you have to remain fitted to your initial statements, and stop creating articles about geopolitics.
Yes, we all support what is happening in the Middle East. But, here and now, the issue is about the United States, Wallstree Bailouts, lack of democracy and corporate greed. We all are worried about Chinese workers, but here and now, the issue is about the working people in the US, the 99%, who is experiencing police brutality and being ignored by Washington polititians.
It is very important to Stop talking about global politics and to Remain fitted to your demands.
Stop US corporate greed. Stop US inequality. Stop corporate wars.
The people from Germany, Finland, and the world is aware of your future strategies.
I think, it is important to occupy Fox News. Bests.
S. R.
Wow, I couldn't disagree more. The system that has created the mess in the U.S. is an INTERNATIONAL system. They fight their battles internationally, they move capital around internationally, and they set policy internationally. You are asking that our movement ignore that reality. Without deeper analysis of the system that we are fighting, the movement will stagnate and eventually wither.
Global solidarity!!!
GDG.
Thank you for your reply. However honest, your approach is wrong, both strategically and factually. It is reasonable to consider the neccesity for solidarity, however it is not truth to say that the "global mess" is equal for all countries, since the situations in Spain, Middle East, France, Greece and the US, differ between them.
Yes, there are common patterns but the situations are extremily different. In this moment, the case of Egipt is a case for the egiptian population, who is uprising against more than 20 years of dictatorship, and eventhough they feel themselves identifies with OWS, they are not in the capacity of offering solidarities until they reach their goal. OWS was an expontaneous uprising of the US population, it has to be focused on its foundational grounds, instead of becoming another discourse.
It is very difficult to know, what is happening with the OWS movement. But the number of comments, on these last posts have strongly decreased the support.
OWS, has to be focused. S.R.
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GrownUp, your a fucking idiot. Read a book or two. You take a bath, your drenched with ignorance, smeared with "dumb, dumb" cow dung, your ass is crusty with a dildo idiocy clown shoved up in it. Go on, keep believing Big Brother, grow up you fool.
Occupy really has to stop associating itself with other protests.
I don't believe this will happen. Instead we will see more of this. A good example was the anti-fur rally that took place on Black Friday in front of Macy's whereby OWS protesters joined with animal rights activists.
I believe that the US government (backed by the 1% and unlimited expertise backed by unlimited tax dollars) has infiltrated the movement at the top ranks. They have every incentive to infiltrate and it would explain a lot of the nonsense that is going on and why the more I look into the organization of OWS, the more I see that it is being run along the same lines as our current government whereby a few at the top of the OWS chain are making all the decisions.
One of these decisions included a proposal by Maria Dayton with high level US Dept. of State connections. (She was introduced by OWS big wig Kobi Skolnick.) Her proposal was that 20 OWS delegates be sent to Egypt to monitor elections. This created an uproar within OWS with many opposed to the trip because they did not want to spend the $29,000 allocated by the General Assembly for it. And although Maria Dayton insisted the Egyptian protest groups had invited OWS to monitor elections, legitimate Egyptian protest groups actually asked the Americans not to come -- that although elections may be fair, the government they would vote in was not going to be -- that it would be another US Government puppet dictator government and that OWS presence would lend legitimacy to the elections. No matter. Those in charge of the OWS Movement Building group insisted on the trip going forward. It was only stopped after Maria Dayton's US Government connections were revealed. Despite this, those at the top of the OWS leaderhip have closed ranks. They do not want to investigate how it is that Maria Dayton infiltrated the ranks and who else in the OWS ranks are US Government infiltrators. That is because they all are.
You draw a lot of conclusions on what appears to be one fact: Maria Dayton's high level US Dept. of State connections. Connections in and of themselves don't tell me much. Your assumptions and conclusions would have more credibility if you named who those connections are and why this raises red flags for you. There are all manner of individuals working in our government because of their area of expertise. Just because an individual is a member of the US State Department does not make them an adversary. According to your conclusion it does. So without further information I am dismissing your accusatory conclusion to be due to black and white thinking: paranoid and biased. There is not a single movement in the US that has not been infiltrated by government agents. This is the corrupt nature of our government. To expect otherwise is to be naive and ignorant. This should not discourage the members and the movement from growing and neither should the members run a witch hunt for infiltrators. These witch hunts destroy a movement faster than you can blink an eye. The government plants want to create an internal witch hunt. In any movement there will be fruitful decisions and choices and then there will be those that could bring the movement down. If the backbone of a movement is the commitment of it's members and not just it's leaders then the movement will survive and thrive. It is up is up to each member to pay attention to what is threatening their personal commitment to the movement and work it our with those they trust. To blame the "leadership" is just the set up the gov. agents want members to do. If each member holds on to their power and does not surrender it to a 'LEADER" OR CLIQUE then the movement has a real chance.
I spent days researching this. I am a stickler for facts. Maria Dayton's entire resume consists of working for and with organizations who receive funding from NED -- National Endowment for Democracy a group that co-opts grassroots movements internationally If you follow the money, you will see who is working for who.
LinkedIn Profile of Maria Dayton dated October 14, 2011: Contract Author for the U.S. Dept of State (led by Hillary Clinton); Regional Program Manager of Vital Voices Global Partnership (grew out of the U.S. government's Vital Voices Democracy Initiative established in 1997 Hillary Clinton and then U.S. Secretary of State Madeleine Albright. Besides Clinton, honorary chairs include current and former U.S. Senators Kay Bailey Hutchison and Nancy Kassebaum Baker. Funding has come from a variety of sources, including individual donations, corporate sponsorships such as from ExxonMobil, and the efforts of the Clinton Global Initiative.
As a project manager for the Ibn Khaldun Center for Development studies in Cairo she worked closely with the director Saad Eddin Ibrahim, in the development of many civil society programs including: the 2005 Election Monitoring project, the Egyptian Democracy Support Network.
Read this article that explains who Saad Eddin Ibrahim is: The Violence of Nonviolence
http://www.stateofnature.org/violenceOfNonviolence.html
Thank you for your response! You are opening up a vital and significant discussion that needs to take place by all current, past and future participants of OWS. What you have shared sheds more light on the fact that any movement that is from it's core challenging the established order, now a global order, is going to be assaulted and undermined in every possible way by the existing systems of control. The corporotacracy controls all the levers of State power and the Central Banks /all privately owned/ control the economic levers of power. Every country where the economic crisis precipitated in the financial meltdown has its monetary system controlled by the privately run Central Banks.
The current crisis in Europe is due to the IMF (a government subsidized privately run corporation) now seeking to consolidate it's control of every economy in Europe for the purpose of extracting more of the wealth into the hands of the few. The working people of Europe know this. They remember what the Central Banks did to Europe before WWII. The Central Banks of European countries created a level of economic misery unmatched to this day. The unemployment rate in Germany was near 40%. Hitler and the Nazis came into power because they promised to dissolve the strangle hold of the Central Bank on Germany's government and economy. This is why the people of Iceland unseated their government and refused to bailout the tentacle banks of the Central Banking system as well as refused any intervention by the IMF. The battle in Egypt today is also about insuring that the IMF stays out of Egypt.
Today the same octopus of privately owned and run Central Banks, including our own Federal Reserve, are moving to consolidate their control of local governments and workers wages and the peoples social safety net. These are under assault in every country. Much easier to control a population that lives a subsistence life, then one that abounds in a large and powerful middle class of people. Their tactic: Austerity measures on the population, in creasing the taxes on the working population and the sale to private corporations of government assets. All this to insure a total takeover. The American corporate media is just reporting the drama of this violent onslaught not the horrific impact and deformation of working peoples lives.
Seeing the bigger picture in it's historic depth demonstrates how daunting the undertaking of OWS is. They are challenging the grip of the titans who control the government, the media and thus the message; the titans who control the resources of our world. The push for electoral governments to be established around the world has always been pushed by Central Bank Holding Companies and their children the corporations. The electoral system of government is the easiest to purchase and control, especially when they get to buy and control the mass media and the electorate is too busy living life to see what is happening to their country and their wealth until it is too late. Just look at what happened in America on Black Friday: 150 million Americans flooding retailers and trampling and assaulting on another to purchase good manufactured in foreign sweat shops at the cost of outsourced US jobs and the benefit and reward goes to corporations that decimated entire industry sectors and cities and towns across America for profit. The indifferent 150 million! Any movement that challenges this will be polluted with infiltrators and opportunists! In spite of this fact it is still a most worthwhile undertaking, even though the house cleaning will be a challenge.
I appreciate the introduction to: http://www.stateofnature.org/violenceOfNonviolence.html
Perfectly stated. Well written paragraph.
House cleaning will be a challenge indeed. I am not sure that most OWS supporters realize that the movement is in its infancy -- that if it is to go forward, there is a lot of hardship ahead. Pepper spray will be the least of their worries.
Just read the notice of the hunger strikers to claim space. In reading it I had an AHA moment where I recognized the obvious: the 1% own the government officials @ every level. The violent and brutal nature of the police crackdowns suddenly fell into an unexpected perspective. The 1% dictate the laws to control the use and function of space. They own 99% of the space in our country and thus they own 99% of the resources of our country. What this configures into is 99% of the people are under the control of the 1% because of the need for space and resources. So OWS occupations hit bulls eye!
Yes. The 99% can only occupy space allowed by the 1%,
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Thats a great 5th column strategy. Maybe next you can advise that the best occupation is the occupation of your couch.
So is the complaint against CTS is that they sold tear gas canisters to the U.S. government or they sold tear gas canisters to the Egyptian government? If the former, why protest at CTS?
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The Occupy movement is good one, but it has been beat down to smoldering hot embers by the powers to be,, . The slogan is that it's a leaderless movement. If the movement is to continue there must be charismatic selfless leaders or a leader. An army of people cannot accomplish their mission unless there is strategic planning and a just leader. This is a war of strategy, but nonetheless it is a a war. We in america are instilled with a politically correct mindset that those in other countries tend to bypass quickly! All the great books on strategy should be handbooks for the leaders. Books such as Sun Tzu's Art of war, Musashi's Book of five rings and others. About the non-violence thing; This is all well and good, but factors should be considered. The other side will use brutal force and torture such as pepper spray directly into the face, (Can cause death) like the incident at UC Davis, beatings with clubs, dragging people around by their necks while in a headlock, punching, sound wave crowd control (can cause permanent hearing loss), tear gas, and the list goes on. People on the front lines should not only be informed of the potential for this to kill or harm them, but know how to take appropriate action to 'Ward Off" and repel such brutal attacks. It's going to be interesting to see how this plays out. With a little leadership that inspires people and some strategic planning a phoenix could rise from the ashes! If you throw in the towel now you will have regrets down the road. -Thunderhands
A blazing fire can burn itself out very quickly and the raging flames can be blinding rather than illuminating. I remind myself how deeply embedded in our consciousness this dependence on leaders is. Written human history is all about leaders rather than communities or societies. Yet it is this very structure of hierarchy that guarantees both the formation and entrenchment of a "leading" elite. I applaud OWS for their exploration of a leaderless revolution. Historically the elite have always called such movements mobs. When power born of consensus is vilified and derided, it is a testament to it's inherent threat to the established order. The power of consensus is fluid and dynamic and cannot be controlled. Analogy: the drops of water that make up the ocean moved by the wind and current (consensus and spontaneous cooperation) become waves! Hierarchy is an artificial construct; A wave is a force of nature,
Nice word; however, reality is different. OWS has leaders who make all the decisions. The OWS voting system is a sham. If you take a close look at and attempt to join the OWS elite ruling class, you will know exactly what I mean. Those who are now in charge have infiltrated and co-opted OWS. They do not share the same ideals as those who started and those who support the movement.
There are certainly various leeches trying to co-opt OWS and establish themselves into a position of power (particularly a few people in finance), however there is nothing to support monjon22 contention that there is an "elite ruling class."
Proposals have to pass the General Assembly and receive consensus to become decisions. It looks like people didn't like Monjon22's ideas and he is bitter about it.
The typical charge of people who are opposed to organizations without formal hierarchies or leaders is that they must all secretly have hierarchy and leaders. To them domination and control is an inevitable consequence of human nature and thus any functioning group or institution
musthave some kind of bosses--- and if none can be found, they must be invisible.The OWS donations are held by 3 people -- Victoria Sobel, Bre Lembitz and Pete Dutro -- the ladies are 21-year old college students and Pete Dutro is a tattoo artist.
No one has ever seen a bank statement. No one has ever seen a donor list. No one has ever seen a receipt for monies spent. The OWS bankers have taken in at least $800,000 in donations. They are accountable to no person. If that isn't the 1%, what is?
I have never presented a proposal to the General Assembly (GA) nor do I pay much attention to it when I am in the park. I believe in democracy and the GA voting system is not democratic. Why? To vote one must be physically present in the Park in downtown Manhattan, 4 nights a week at 7 pm. What a burden! That leaves out the poor, the old, those who work second shift, those who live too far too travel, families with children. An online voting system is being worked on, and should that be implemented I would vote, but until then, untill all OWS supporters can vote, I will abstain.
There are leaders of the OWS movement that will not allow there to be "official leaders". If you take a look into the organization of OWS, you will see that it is being run along the same lines as our current government whereby a few at the top of the OWS chain are making all the decisions. And many of these decisions are intentionally bad, because the leadership has been infiltrated and taken over by those who do not share the OWS ideals.
Do you have anything to back up these accusations? What are the ideals of the infiltrators?
Go into the NYCGA website by clicking on the "NYCGA" button above (2 buttons to the left of "Donate").
Go into the Finance Working Group and try to get any information at all about the OWS funds. Any information. You will get nothing. There is zero transparency there.
One of the bankers in FINANCE actually responded to my request for transparency by saying they would have to figure out by discussions what "transparent" should mean to the OWS community. ???? Transparency means showing us where the money is going. No discussion needed. And I only got that response after repeated requests. You will see my posts in there.
Go into any working group forum and you will see all sorts of posts by people asking for a democratic voting sytem and transparency. All ignored.
I had no idea and was shocked with my experience.
Scary.
Occupy deserves praise for standing with the people of Egypt. Thunderhands, you make a lot of sense. What's next?
Like the ancient Chinese oracle the I-ching says " Be like water." Water although perceived as soft has the ability to FILL UP all the low places until it overcomes or overflows. Water has the ability to wear down great mountains with time. Also,,, an army without a leader is lost. Another classic on war and strategy, (this is a war!!) Sun Tzu's art of war. In the chapter laying plans..."The commander must stand for the virtues of wisdom, sincerity, benevolence, courage and strictness. The highest form of generalship is to balk the enemies plans; the next best is to prevent the junction of the enemies forces; the next in order is to attack the enemies forces in the field; and the worst policy all is to besiege walled cities. Follow the THUNDER!!!!! Don't just Occupy,,,take over!!!! Seep in quietly under cover of darkness to the low places,,, meaning easily accessible,, balk the enemies plans by showing up in unexpected areas. Some say this is not a war,,, how untrue! It's a a war against complacency,and it's a real war in the sense that our brothers an sisters are being injured physically, detained and thrown in jail! Don't just be a movement,,,,to politically correct!! Be a force to be reckoned with!
You are all idoits! Take a bath and go home, what your doing is a folly and hopeless, we are Capitolists and we are a Republic, not your little communist party or whatever your entitlement thinking is! GO HOME!
You don't speak like a grown up. Your tone and words are those of a panic stricken adolescent.
Capitalist, not Capitolist.
Hello stupid, hope what little thinking you do doesnt cause a headache. Now, as a grownup, you should know how to have an intelligent critique of what you oppose, which judging by your comment, your unable to. Let me give you a couple of tips, first, fox news political commentary will cause cranial rectumitis, which makes thinking hard to do considering your heads up your butt. Second, use the internet to educate what this movements about which can be documented instead of porn, gaming, or or commenting on things that show how much intelligence you dont have. You sir i declare " Fox News Stupid ".
I'll tell you what; if you take a grammar and spelling course, re-write your message in a coherent manner, and offer even a single rational point besides ad hominem remarks, I will begin to think about "going home."
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So if we go home and still don't like what's going on, we should do what; Wait 'till next voting day to see the same results ? Maybe get a union going where we work and see the doors shut ! Or maybe we should just shut our eyes to the injustices and go to a ball game! You need to read the American constitution , especially the 1st amendment ! America has a moral business problem that can't be legislated, but can be voiced, which is what is happening!
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Get a job and live. Stop this folly, you havent even read the rest of the Constitution, which gives us responsibility for our own actions. What you decide to do with your life is your decision, but live with the consequences. There are laws and if you break them u go to jail. Please first take a bath!
I'll tell you what; if you take a grammar and spelling course, re-write your message in a coherent manner, and offer even a single rational point besides ad hominem remarks, I will begin to think about "taking a bath."
We are obeying the laws such as free speech and the right to assemble ! If you don't like what we are saying, you can turn to another channel ! I have a good paying job , but if I were to lose it I see possible jobs out there that don't pay the cost of living . This is the immoral business practice that I am against . You sound like your name " grown up " retired and don't care!